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today, the city of newport beach enforced the no smoking policy in public beaches. newport beach is the third city (san clemente and huntington beach) to enforce such law.

i think this is bullsh!t. first you can't smoke in a bar... that one's a bit understandable. it's an eclosure, the smoke builds up. but if you don't like smoke in a bar, maybe you shouldn't go there... go to a club or something. but the beach..? it's open air! you don't like the smell, move to another spot. they say the cigarette butts pollute the sand. what will they ban next? sodas? marshmallows?

I have to agree with the ban. Theres nothing worse than walking barefoot along the beach and standing on a cigarette butt. Yuk! It's been in someones mouth and smells fkn nasty!

A beach is an open area. Therefore, you should be able to smoke at a beach, seeing that it's allowed elsewhere in open areas.

exactly. and i think there's more disgusting things in the beach other than a cigarette butt. people are litter bugs... or just to f*ckin' lazy to get up and walk to a trash can. i just can't get the concept of it being illegal in an open space. america, the land of the free my a$$...

I'm glad this law was taken into place.

All of the beach north of Newport Harbor is lined with housing with exception to one elementary school and the boardwalk. Aside from that there is nothing but houses that have sand for a backyard.

Of course, no one likes the rich pricks that get to call that area their home, but I personally have a lot of respect for them. I want to be a rich prick with a nice house on the beach one day myself...and I wouldn't want any little snot nosed punks leaving cigarette butts in my "backyard"

Even if it is a good 50 yards to the water, I know there isn't adequate ash trays to keep the beaches clean.

Crap like that in such a popular beach area is part of the reason why the water down there is so crappy. Well that and it doesn't hurt that the Talbert Channel is right their either.

You should be allowed to smaoke where ever you damn well please. This is the "Land of the Free" isnt it?

that means it might come over to canada.

I think is great to ban cigarrete smoking. I wish that law was more enforce in the L.A. county. I can't stand the smoke coming from some puffing smoker anywhere near me. Smoking sucks! Period!

I used to smoke, and I have absolutely nothing against smokers. I do think that they should be aloud to smoke outside...just not on the beach. There is a board walk right next to it throughout most of Newport. And on the other side of those houses there are streets lined with sidewalks to smoke on.

Seriously, who the hell goes to the beach to smoke anyways?

that was going to be my point, actually, that last part

Have ya ever noticed there is no middle ground on this subject? Its all or nothing......I personally am SICK to death of non smokers treating me like Im a damn criminal if I light up. Look I know its an ugly addiction, but damn! I am not inconsiderate about this. I dont blow smoke in other peoples faces, or smoke in their houses or cars but banning this OUTDOORS???? come ON now....thats just stupid...IMHO. And it should be allowed in a bar.....if I got to put up with some drunk grabbing my ass then he can put up with my smoke.

Well, i for one hate cigarettes. I hate the smoke smell, so i'm for one am glad for the banning. I do thk it makes the beaches look bad, cuz smokers just toss them on the ground. I live on a Ranch w/cabins and Rv sites and they toss them everywhere, i'm like excuse me, PUT IN THE TRASH CAN.

I agree partly with Link and partly with JP... Smoking in bars should be legal, smoking on beaches shouldn't. I don't mind smokers in general, but it's just nasty to be walking along barefoot and step on somebody's cigarette butt... Here in Oregon they banned smoking in all public buildings

Personally I hate cigarettes so Im all about the bans.. My dad smoked a lot when I was growing up, and I always smelled like smoke because he smoked to much, and because he smoked in the house... I hate the smell, and plus its not that good for you. My grandma died of lung cancer about 2years ago.. and she smoked a lot.. and the doctors said smoking was one of the main causes ... so that only made me hate smoking more ..

amen! i mean it's not a crime. and if people don't like the smoke, MOVE! but there is really nothing you can do about the smell. i'm not a chain smoker or anything, but i hate this sh!t especially when you're in the smoking lounge of a bar and some stuck up bottle blonde beach bum gives dirty looks, it kinda irks me... it's a f*ckin' SMOKERS' LOUNGE... they don't just call it that for no reason.you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen...

They only ban cigarettes because it's much easier to patrol looking for people who smoke, than it is for people to just throw their butts in the sand and then cover it with a handful just for someone to step on in the future. They have an adequate number of lifeguards and cops patrolling to stop smoking. However, they don't have the resources to provide adequate facilities for cigarette butts.

I'm no green peace hippy, but I'm not an idiot either. Sh*t like that will trash that beach in no more than 20 years. It's one of the most popular areas of beach in Southern California, and there's no reason to destroy it.

ok, I can SEE the beach thing.....but I have to say I have stepped on broken beer bottles and god knows what ELSE at the beach. SO then we should ban that stuff too right? Come to think of it I have seen dirty diapers as well. Lets face it most peeps are slobs for the most part no matter what it comes to.

You can't drink alcoholic beverages on the beach in Newport either. It's just one of those places...it should be no big deal.


It's the beach!

I am for the ban. Wow so they banned smoking on the beach dont give that "land of the free" BS. Its people like you who give America a bad name. Get up and walk the 25 feet to the end of the beach do what you have to do then go back on the beach..

I'm all for this ban. I mean I'm in japan right now and smoking is legal on the beaches and it's disgusting! I mean people who have children do not want them to be walking or in my daughters case, crawling around on a beach that has hundreds of cigarette butts everywhere.

But Now i do believe that smoking should be allowed in bars.

I actually really like how you can't smoke inside of bars right now in California.

Almost every single establishment has outside areas to smoke cigarettes, and those outside areas have an atmosphere all their own. Sometimes it's nice just to get a breath of fresh air...

yeah, very true. But most bars I've been in have those....ummm....smoke eater things. Otherwise there's no way i could go into them, my ashtma would act up.

This smoking ban is just utter HORSE SHIT. you cant smoke in any establishment in new york, cali and a few other cities. This is a trend spreading to virtually every city. Smoking is a free choice. It is somthing that only hurts the person smoking.The dangers of Second hand smoke is a bunch of shit and has been proven time and time again to be a myth. I personally dont smoke, but i still recognize it as a freedom that is being taken away. If the smoke bothers you, then move. I mean what if your shitty perfume or cologn bother me, i can't complain and create a law for you to not be allowed to wear it (not yet) i have to move.

Actually second hand smoke is real. My little brother has a spot on his lung from smoke. He's 8 years old and has never touched a cigarette. But My mother smokes.

Originally posted by ragesRemorse
This smoking ban is just utter HORSE SHIT. you cant smoke in any establishment in new york, cali and a few other cities. This is a trend spreading to virtually every city. Smoking is a free choice. It is somthing that only hurts the person smoking.The dangers of Second hand smoke is a bunch of shit and has been proven time and time again to be a myth. I personally dont smoke, but i still recognize it as a freedom that is being taken away. If the smoke bothers you, then move. I mean what if your shitty perfume or cologn bother me, i can't complain and create a law for you to not be allowed to wear it (not yet) i have to move.

All claims in a discussion should be subjectable to a certain amount of proof. State your sources please.

www.thetruth.com

I imagine they would state otherwise...they hate cigarettes.

Heck, if a smoker wants to burn their lungs just becuase they crave a puffer in their mouths, that's their choice. Me, I don't want any of that 2nd smoke near me. So the ban is perfectly fine. Smoking cigarretes sucks!

here you go link. After watching this episode i did research on this myself, and found that there claims are infact true. Do some research yourself. http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=Penn_and_Teller%3A_Bullshit!

i think bush is doing an adequate enough job of giving america a bad name. the only thing i can not comprehend is they banned smoking not for it's health hazards but the fact that smokers just throw their butts everywhere. so isn't it justifiable to ban sodas, marshmallows and everything that has a wrapper from the beach? no, it isn't. so why ban cigarette smoking? as i said before, people are litter bugs... or just plain a$$ lazy.

www.thetruth.com = Satans website. I hate the truth people more then anything on earth.

Like already said, second hand smoke is a real deal, so im all for the ban. There is nothing worse than sitting in a coffee shop and bunch of weirdo's poluting the air in the 6 mile radius arround them!

If you wanna smoke, do it in your own house!

Of course, smoking in a inclosed coffee shop isn't the same as an open beach. Second hand smoke isn't even an issue on a beach, unless someones blowing it right in your face. In which case it's time to drown some mofo's.

I just hate their annoying commercials.

Propoghanda is what they push. Nothing more. Their website is equally patronizing and dumbfounding.

There is always someone whos gonna complain about it...you just know it.
This woman was having a go at my mom for smoking at the beach and her kids were arround, we warent even close to them or anything, but apperantly its ''polutting the enviroment'' or some shit like that...that was a year ago...

As long as there are people to complain about it and moan, there will be bans on places where there shouldnt really be one...i guess.

I never understood why people listen to idiotic complaints. You're mom should have just put the cigarette out in the womans eye ball and then wrapped her children in seaweed.

in my opinion, eshtablishments like coffee houses and restaurants shouldn't allow smoking inside the building. they could provide a seperate area for smokers to congregate and have a cloud session (that term is copy righted ). how much smoke can you inhale when you're in an open space? especially on abeach when most of the time it's breezy.

But when you look at the big picture everyone that has an agenda uses propaganda for their own cause. Folks at the Truth.com are agains't the tobacco industry so they use their propaganda agaisn't the industry. Unfortunally, their propaganda is getting annoying. Too much of that MTV generation BS kill the message.

Yes but there are few people out there that shove their agenda down the throats of the public as much as the Truth people do. I can't turn on my tv without seeing them preaching their lies and bullshit.

"people die of smoking". Holy shit, really?! You mean smoking is dangerous!? Who'd of thunk it!? God damn douche bags.

The one thing that puzzles me about thetruth.com is that WHO is founding them? Someone has to flip the bill from all those commercials and ads on TV, Billboards, Magazines. I mean, where do they get their money from?

Here there's been a ban on smoking in public places from I believe from June 1st of this year.
You can't smoke in bars, bingo halls, casinos, and race tracks.
Only allowed to smoke in well ventilated areas, and that too will be illegal in the coming years

Does the government not give them something?

Absolutely!

I think they are banning smoking here in public plces, although im not sure. I dont really see why forbid it in the open spaces...

Yes, but the government gives them a certain amount of money. The guys at the truth.com uses so much advertesing that it is amazing! Maybe they also depend on donations from families affected by smoking. I gotta get into more on them. Now, I'm interested.....

I'm sure that donations are a big contributer

Also I'm for banning it in open spaces myself, like for example at an amusement park, there's no need for it there
Specially not in line like some people do

You touch a good point on that silver tears. When ppl are in line waiting in some theme park or a concert it is consider open space. And of course there are ppl who smoke in line. That's just not right! I can't get out of line becuase I will lose my spot. So it is very unfair for someone to be smoking next to you and making the rest breath all that smoke!

I totally agree. At a couple of amusement parks i've been to the allowed you to smoke the whole time! I mean how gross is it to be sitting on a ride with cigarette butts in your car

Smoking is a dirty habbit altogether, but...hmm...banning it complitely on public places...i dont know.

The Nazis banned smoking from the public. Hmmmm....

I think you'll find that Nazis did many good things in Germany as well as bad

Banning smoking is somthing that the goverment shouldnt, and oh yeah isnt allowed to do. However, they are doing it. Just because some people dont like the idea of smoking, or like having to be around people smoking is an absurd reason to ban smoking. these people are little minded and think they know what's best for other people. These are the same people tearing down america within. If you would do some research, you then find that second hand smoke has never been proven to cause damage to another person. It has never been proven using sciene.

Why not ban alchohol? This is far more dangerous, and does cause more deaths a year. No matter what the truth commercials tell you. smoking a ciggarete is not going to influence you to beat your kids, crash your car and kill a family, it is not going to influence you to do the other hundreds of dumbass things that alchohol does. Comparing these two substances is the same thing, however one is not as dangerous as the other. Just because you dont like it, doesnt give you a reason to protest other people who do. You know why they dont ban alchohol? because they tried that alreday. It diddnt work, it enraged many many Americans. America lost money, tons of it. the reason smoking isnt being banned right away is because it would cause the same uproar prohibition did. They are doing it slowly. Alchohol and red meat will be the next thing to go.

was that nazi remark a joke lil?

No,

I think you'll find Hitler did some good things for Germany in time of his rule, it wasnt all shitty.
Banning smoking in public places was one of them.

i dont know man. Everything hitler did was to gain the approval of the german people, so he could ultimately brainwash the entire country. Everything was done in his view of a better germany, not the peoples view of a better germany.

stupid...this law is just f*cking stupid......im sick of all these people b*itching about 2nd hand smoke....do you know how much 2nd hand smoke you have to inhale for it to do some damage?...alot....kids whos parents smoke get affected by 2nd hand smoke coz of the years ..i said YEARS....there parents light up...why isnt anyone more worried about these kids there the ones who should be b*tching not someone whos not around smoke and is annoyed coz someone lights up in amusement park line or the beach...tough sh*t...cry me a river.....i dont smoke but next time i go to an amusement park i'll be sure to... just to piss everyone off..2 minutes of dealing with smoke in a line isnt gonna do jack sh*t to you or your health...thats a FACT...ask any nutrienest or scientist......if someone starts smoking for a year...and than quits for a year...that smoke is out of of their system.....so two minutes isnt gonna do jack

im sure people are gonna question what i say but like i said...you dont beleive..any scientist will back me up on this.....and for all thetruth.com people...they get some of there funding from tobacco companies...those types of compaigns were started by tobacco companies...people are always gonna smoke..and theres no such thing as bad press...press is press....so why these new age hippies are spreading "the truth" at the same time there advertising for the companies there against....put that in your pipe and smoke it

You sir are an idiot
First I don't give a damn about the amount of smoke it takes to harm someone, the fact remains the line is public, and any decent human being should have the common courtesy for fellow human beings not to smoke there since others are present, and especially children, want a smoke, find a secluded area and light up there.

Unless they go to everyone in line and ask for their permission then don't do it because even if it bothers only a few people it does bother them. Not to mention the fact that some people are allergic, I don't go around shoving peanut butter in people's faces just because I can

And for the beaches issue, I wouldn't wanna be setting foot on a beach littered with cigarette butts, I'm all for designated areas to smoke, but have some courtesy for others around you.

And a minute of second hand smoke may not kill you, but it can irritate you, or cause and allergy attack or whatever. People should have the right not to be subjected to second hand smoke, therefore people shouldn't do it in public.

the beach is a dirty place to begin with. the birds poop in it, people pee in it, they leave tampons, dirty diapers, soiled whatever, no to mention the sea water. i said it before and i'll say it again... there are far grosser things in a beach other than a cigarette butt.

It is an American right to not have to care how other people feel. I am much more bothered by people, by merely walking down the street of my city and having to put up with all there shit. How about the bums on the street who are to lazy to get a friggin job and harrass me for money? How about people who drive in the streets and dont care about the person who has the right of way? How about the person who had a bad day so they think there entitled to be a dick to everyone else? How about the daily dose of every human being that makes your day a shitty day? these people dont care about there fellow man. I am much more bothered by all these jerk offs than i am by a little cigarete smoke. Besides, most people who smoke are very considreate of other people, if you just ask nicely, and tell them the smoke is bothering you, most times they will quit or move. Some times they dont, but you forget one thing THEY DONT HAVE TO> It isnt harming anyone but them. It may annoy you, but cant you put up with somthing so insignificant so that the day can go on peacefully. Maybe your being the inconsiderate one, buy thinking there the ones who have to stop utilizing a right of theirs.

are you done crying?.....im sure you dont give a damn about how much smoke it takes to harm someone....why would you care right?..its just an inconveince to you..its not gonna kill you...most smokers dont blow smoke into peoples faces but im sure they make exceptions for people like you and i'd like to see you try and throw peanut butter in someones face even if there not allergic...getting permissinon from people in line?...thats funny...i dont see any woman askin my permission to breast feed in public...but than again...i'm not gonna b*tch and moan coz they have that right to do it either

if your allegergic to smoke...let the person know it and like rage said im sure they'll be more than happy to put it out...but since it is public place and public line with no nonsmoking signs that smoker has every god given right to light up... but smokers have to put up with whiney b*tchy crybabies like you everytime they light up....why dont you b*tch and moan at the amusement park for not have having desinginatd areas to smoke instead of the smokers...even when there is desginating smoking nonsmokers are gonna b*tch and cry......


and for the beach....like already stated....stepping on a ciggarette butt is the last thing anyone should be worried about when there at the beach.....you know people have sex there right?..why dont you look out for the condoms, diapers, and broken beer bottles instead of a lousy ciggarett but

You can't prove for a fact cigarette smoke doesn't harm right away, and it may be their right, but apparently people are agreeing on this ban or else it wouldn't pass or whatnot, so apparently smoking is more bothersome than any of the afore mentioned things.

And I didn't say that people should stop altogether, yes it is a right, and they decide how to spend their time, but in public areas everyone has to deal with it, and not everyone wants to inhale it.

And yes some beaches are disgusting, but do you really need a cigarette that bad when you're there, can you not wait a few hours, and enjoy a smoke somewhere where it won't bother anyone?

^ ignore him...he's from Detroit, the best beach he has pulls up 3 eyed fish like in the Simpsons...thanks to Lake Erie.

Newport Beach gets A LOT of beach going traffic. And although most people who go on the beach don't smoke, it's just another way to ensure that the beaches stay beautiful.

Smokers sounds like the ones that are doing the b!tching and moaning in this case. It's funny watching them ge the stiff end on this.

Yes I'm done crying as you put it
And yes, I not only care but I know people who are allergic to it, it may not be a long term harm, but its a nuisance to deal with it, and be forced to get allergy shots and etc. just because someone decides, 'Oh I have 20 minutes to wait in this line, why not light a cigarette?!?!"

Yes and how many mothers do you see breastfeeding in a public line or whatever? Not like I'm for that either, but really one social problem at a time

And for your information, there are areas for people to smoke in, which are clearly marked, and please enlighten me where I acted like a whiney bitchy crybaby

And whatever beach you go to, I suggest you stop going there, I'm pretty sure that's one of the many things that's responsible for your low I.Q

since july, huntington beach and san clemente has implemented this law. they handed out two (2) tickets. i say the stiff end is kinda soft...

Oh to correst your remark that people are agreeing on the smoking ban, which is why it is in effect. there is no vote on this subject. Some insane protestor who believes there views on how the world should live, start an organization of equally insane extremist nut jobs. These people submit complaints and a suggestion for there state govener to change the laws of smoking. It is then voted on behind closed doors. There is no public ballet on the subject. This is a crude example of how easily things can be changed from state to state.


If you seriously believe that smokers are the one's bit*ching and moaning about this, pick up a newspaper. Read all this bullshit of nut jobs complaining about somthing they have no knowledge on. I am not a smoker, but i value the peopls right to smoke. All of these damn protesters against smoking have no scientific knowledge on what they are preaching against. It is simply a bandwagon for small minded people take action in and feel like there insignicant lives have meaning. I am telling you from factual evidence that there is no proof that second hand smoke causes any kind of lung or health damage (excluding people with breathing problems) If you want proof on this look it up do some research, i have. smokers are not the one's moaning, how do you think this smoking ban got started? by a bunch of bit*ching whiners.

Again there is no proof that second hand smoke causes lung or health damage. That being said again. If you are in a situation where someone is smoking and you have bad allergies, why not try and reason with the person smoking and simply tell them your case. If this doesnt work, MOVE. As for the beaches and cigarette butt's poluting our so called beautifull beaches Well a smokers cig butt is the last thing that is making our beaches less beautifull. Using this as a an argument is just a ridiculous reason for pro smoking ban.

The fact is, this country has been smokers since it's birth. smoking has not caused any problems that change this country or the lives of the people in the country. Yeah a death contributed to smoking may effect someones life, but again this freedom of choice, these people smoke through the holes in there throats. It is not the tobacco industries forcing that smoke in there lungs. It is peoples choice. taking away this freedom of choice is disgusting. If you ban smoking , you have to ban alchohol. It a thousand times more deadly, and has far more severe long term effects than smoking, it polutes far more than smoking, I mean this list goes on and on. you know what it will be the next freedom to go, because people are so god damn self righteous.

i made that comments based soley on the reaction of the smokers that have posted their opinion in this thread. The people that didn't want to allow smoking on their beach did their b!tching the right way, and it got results.

Now all the non-smokers get the chance to sit back and hear the smokers do some bitching for once...

well i am sorry i blasted on forth with a mis-interperted rant. It still has substance though.

well... since I think smoking is a vile and stomach turning habbit, Im all for such things. Hell I wish they'd charge more for them . I'm sure the cig smokers wanna smoke where they want and throw thier ash in everyones face where ever they sit, and thus will disagree with me. Theres really no tactful way to smoke a cigarette. I also think they should charge more for 6 packs of beer to sober some people up

yeah just keep taking those freedoms away ay? No, smokers do not want to smoke anywhere near you or put there ash in your face. They just want to be able to endulge in their rights and have a cigarette without being barraded by people for doing so. you make smokers out to look like villians of society. I mean really. How would you feel if someone tried to take somthing you like or endulge in away, just because they dont like it? you act like people follow you around blowing smoke in your face. How often do you interact with a smoker? is it when your walking into the mall and pass them by at the entrance? (shit most malls you cant smoke at the entrance)
I means eriously, what ever happen to live and let live. I am sure people put up witht hings from you that they percieve as bullshit, why not just let the feather drop and let people enjoy their rights.

well, they're killing themselves off, let them do that nonsense in the street. I dont wanna go to the beach and see garbage all over the sand. This isnt just about cigarettes

Stopping smoking on the beach will not clean up the beach. It will just add more crud on the board walk.

not a smoker myself so I can;t really offer a passionate response....I actually think smokings bad for you so any place banning it is prob doing you a favor, but then again, well no one like being told what they can and can't do *shrug*

i dont care wot they do i dislike smoking ...but its up tot te people who smoke if they want to be conciderate enogh to not smoke around the people that dont

my low i.q?....i base my opionions off science and facts when it comes to smoking...you base yours off 2nd hand information...im sure your trying to look like a smartass and get a few laughs but your lack of intellect makes you look more like a dumbass...i dont smoke but i'm not naive enough to think by getting rid of smoking is gonna clean up the beaches....its just an inconvinience (spelling?) to non smokers...yea there are cases where people are allergic to smoking which isnt as common as you make it out to be...in that case its more than an inconviniece but other than that the non smokers in this thread complaining in this thread remind me rob reiner in the south park episode where he tries outlaw smoking for good

and to enlighten you when i said how 2nd hand smoke is not harmful to people who arent allergic you went off on a crybaby rant saying how you dont care

Last night I was very pissed of to find that the uk is banning smoking in just about any public place, this includes in the pub. I think this is wrong once again we are denyed free will, where will this madness end? and what will be band next?

Personally I think this is a great idea. I hate it when I go to a pub and people are just blowing smoke into your face.. being an ex smoker myself I get quite ill when this happens I almost throw up infact.

There we have it an person who shares an opinion with the fools that fun our cuntrie, but what if you wanted to smoke? yo could face a big fine for doing so, surley the will to do so should be left alone.

Originally posted by Filth
Last night I was very pissed of to find that the uk is banning smoking in just about any public place, this includes in the pub. I think this is wrong once again we are denyed free will, where will this madness end? and what will be band next?

I think smoking areas should be kept and that they should be ventilated properly to minimise passive smoking in the non smoking areas giving people the choice. If people want to kill themselves it's up to them, with one exception, my taxes pay for the medical treatment of smokers, this I resent and feel if they have a choice then I have a choice not to pay towards their treatment!

I resent that people feel this ban will stop people smoking.

Originally posted by Filth
I resent that people feel this ban will stop people smoking.

It's stupid prohibition never works, however the UK is very class driven and it will make for many smokers even more socially unaceptable.

Originally posted by Filth
There we have it an person who shares an opinion with the fools that fun our cuntrie, but what if you wanted to smoke? yo could face a big fine for doing so, surley the will to do so should be left alone.

I also personally think that a total ban is a bit harsh. IMO it would be a lot easier for there just to be a law that all pubs, restaurants etc. to have a separate room for smokers and non smokers. But non of this thing that restaurants do where they have smoking and non smoking right next to each other only smoking is slightly higher up with a rail in between them. I'm talking separate rooms all together.

...

Originally posted by Filth
Last night I was very pissed of to find that the uk is banning smoking in just about any public place, this includes in the pub. I think this is wrong once again we are denyed free will, where will this madness end? and what will be band next?

Your free will? What about the will of others who want to breathe easily?

Originally posted by ragesRemorse
They just want to be able to endulge in their rights and have a cigarette without being barraded by people for doing so. you make smokers out to look like villians of society.

Smokers contribute to the deaths of thousands each year from passive smoking. All smokers are potential killers.

As for rights, so they smoke themselves half to death, get lung cancer then think it's their RIGHT to have the tax payer pay for the chemotherapy to save their lives? Hahaha, rights my arse.

Finally the government had the balls to go through with an all over ban in England. It will be so good to go out to a resturant and not smell of smoke. Plus there's the added bonus of not having an asthma attack every time I go out

((slight exaggeration there but it makes it a hell of a lot worse.))

Originally posted by Makedde
Your free will? What about the will of others who want to breathe easily?


well then they made a choice to go to a place of smokers................see they made a choice...................if you ban smoking you are taking away freedoms of choice and it will bite you later down the road.

Originally posted by soleran30
well then they made a choice to go to a place of smokers................see they made a choice...................if you ban smoking you are taking away freedoms of choice and it will bite you later down the road.

I don't chose to go where smokers are. They are everywhere, the only way to get away from smokers is to lock yourself in your house and not venture outside.

That's a bullshit argument. It's not an unjust restriction of freedom banning smoking in places where the smoke bothers, and causes health problems to, other people.

No-one is saying you can't smoke, just don't blow that disgusting foul breath-laced smoke over every available surface in places where people aren't keen on inhaling the remnants of someone else's tar-infested lungs.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
That's a bullshit argument. It's not an unjust restriction of freedom banning smoking in places where the smoke bothers, and causes health problems to, other people.

No-one is saying you can't smoke, just don't blow that disgusting foul breath-laced smoke over every available surface in places where people aren't keen on inhaling the remnants of someone else's tar-infested lungs.

*applauds laudly*

Hmm yeah think so.................like banning smoking from sidewalks? How about if establishments place smoking signs on all facilities so you know non-smokers beware. At least in the USA it is identified if an establishment has smoking and you can shoose to go there or not.

Whats next no verbal abuse establishments because it hurts your ears?

Originally posted by soleran30
Hmm yeah think so.................like banning smoking from sidewalks? How about if establishments place smoking signs on all facilities so you know non-smokers beware. At least in the USA it is identified if an establishment has smoking and you can shoose to go there or not.

That would also be fair enough, but there are public health policy reasons behind the move, as well as reducing some of the burden on the health service of treating smoke-related illness.

Banning smoking outdoors is silly, I agree.

Originally posted by soleran30

Whats next no verbal abuse establishments because it hurts your ears?

It's not quite the same level, as well you know...

Not really and this really really bothers me.

The Govt placing ban like this shoots itself in the foot! First off now there are more rules for business owners to follow. If you want a smoke free establishment petition the owner and make it happen. If your business means enough they will change. The Govt issueing this means we have now opened up a HUGE can of worms on what they can say is right and wrong.

Believe me when I say smoking today what red meat, bad language and anything thing else in the future.

Please also educate me in the publis health issues involved in public smoking.................................ESPECIALLY when a consumer makes a choice to go to a smoking establishment.

Originally posted by soleran30
Hmm yeah think so.................like banning smoking from sidewalks? How about if establishments place smoking signs on all facilities so you know non-smokers beware. At least in the USA it is identified if an establishment has smoking and you can shoose to go there or not.

Whats next no verbal abuse establishments because it hurts your ears?

People want to smoke fine. But people want to breathe fresh air, and not smoke. So whose rights are more important? The rights of those to kill themselves and pollute the air, or the rights of those to stay healthy and breath easily?

Originally posted by soleran30
Not really and this really really bothers me.

The Govt placing ban like this shoots itself in the foot! First off now there are more rules for business owners to follow. If you want a smoke free establishment petition the owner and make it happen. If your business means enough they will change. The Govt issueing this means we have now opened up a HUGE can of worms on what they can say is right and wrong.

Believe me when I say smoking today what red meat, bad language and anything thing else in the future.

Perhaps. Going this far is a good step though. Any further will be dealt with when it comes.

Originally posted by soleran30

Please also educate me in the publis health issues involved in public smoking.................................ESPECIALLY when a consumer makes a choice to go to a smoking establishment.

Quite simple, less smoking leads to less smoking-related illness (both logically, and factually shown by study). This reduces the amount spent in hospitals upon these illnesses. Regardless of whether the people deliberately put themselves in harm's way, their treatment is still potentially tax-funded, and therein lies the crux of the matter.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Quite simple, less smoking leads to less smoking-related illness (both logically, and factually shown by study). This reduces the amount spent in hospitals upon these illnesses. Regardless of whether the people deliberately put themselves in harm's way, their treatment is still potentially tax-funded, and therein lies the crux of the matter.

No smoking means more chemo for people who deserve it, and no shortage of hospital beds, less asthma attacks etc...

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Perhaps. Going this far is a good step though. Any further will be dealt with when it comes.



Quite simple, less smoking leads to less smoking-related illness (both logically, and factually shown by study). This reduces the amount spent in hospitals upon these illnesses. Regardless of whether the people deliberately put themselves in harm's way, their treatment is still potentially tax-funded, and therein lies the crux of the matter.


Yeah now logically persuade all the smokers that its bad and costs us money then send me the results

Issuing a smoking ban is a HUGE mistake. We should in-cent the healthy and nonsmokers and not punish smokers. We have all seen what resentment does to programs, govt, business you name. Good intentions bad implementation.

Originally posted by soleran30
Yeah now logically persuade all the smokers that its bad and costs us money then send me the results
Ah. What are they gonna do.

Originally posted by soleran30

Issuing a smoking ban is a HUGE mistake. We should in-cent the healthy and nonsmokers and not punish smokers. We have all seen what resentment does to programs, govt, business you name. Good intentions bad implementation.

It's been very successful in most cases thus far, bar the odd smoker moaning about having to go out in the cold to smoke. Boo hoo.

Yup but the biggest issue is when does the govt address individual rights and take preference over others...........

There are a TON of solutions over banning yet this is where it falls which is very weak and suck ass so many people will just accept it without thinking of further repercussions.

Originally posted by soleran30
Yup but the biggest issue is when does the govt address individual rights and take preference over others...........

There are a TON of solutions over banning yet this is where it falls which is very weak and suck ass so many people will just accept it without thinking of further repercussions.

Ok, but this all remains to be seen. If some manner of Orwellian dystopia is the net product of this smoking ban, I will return to this thread with a pac-man to eat my electronic words.

Until then, I say this.

Hahahaha. Cold out?

I am not sure what Cold out means.

When has the govt taken rights then given them back? I am sure it has happened however not the majority and if health is the biggest concern brother that s kind of a, wash whats next you drink no help for you sorry aspirin after 50 years causes cancer now if you take it sorry for you.

There are alot bigger things here then the simple cough and hack of a second hand smoker. By the way what are the proven side affects of second hand smoke?

Originally posted by soleran30
I am not sure what Cold out means.

When has the govt taken rights then given them back? I am sure it has happened however not the majority and if health is the biggest concern brother that s kind of a, wash whats next you drink no help for you sorry aspirin after 50 years causes cancer now if you take it sorry for you.

There are alot bigger things here then the simple cough and hack of a second hand smoker. By the way what are the proven side affects of second hand smoke?

To be honest I'm not that interested in debating it beyond the simple fact that I hate smoking, and I laugh in the faces of those who blow smoke in the faces of others.

That's good enough for me.

Life choices, life chooses; you are welcome to smoke, but don't do it in a manner that has a physical affect on other people.

I think any initiative to cut the number of people smoking is an excellent idea. It's a fact that many people smoke only when they drink, so if it becomes more inconvenient to smoke when people are drinking, then obviously it will cut the number of people smoking. People, smoking, drinking, smoking, people, drinking.

Fair enough,

that still doesn't take away from the absolute ludicrious law!


Who MAKES you go to a "smokers" hang out?

Originally posted by Ya Krunk'd Floo
Life choices, life chooses; you are welcome to smoke, but don't do it in a manner that has a physical affect on other people.

I think any initiative to cut the number of people smoking is an excellent idea. It's a fact that many people smoke only when they drink, so if it becomes more inconvenient to smoke when people are drinking, then obviously it will cut the number of people smoking. People, smoking, drinking, smoking, people, drinking.

Certainment.


Sol- let's agree to disagree.

Originally posted by soleran30
Fair enough,

that still doesn't take away from the absolute ludicrious law!


Who MAKES you go to a "smokers" hang out?

Non smokers don't go to smokers hang outs, smokers go to non smoking hang outs. They have no respect, they think it is their God given right to smoke wherever and whenever they like, they don't care about the rights of others, just about their right to kill themselves, and the right to contribute to the deaths of others.

it is their God given right to smoke whenever, where ever... as much as it is your God given to disagree about it. the only thing preventing smokers smoking anywhere, anytime is the constrictions implied by NON-SMOKERS. ain't it peachy...

Originally posted by super pr*xy
it is their God given right to smoke whenever, where ever... as much as it is your God given to disagree about it. the only thing preventing smokers smoking anywhere, anytime is the constrictions implied by NON-SMOKERS. ain't it peachy...

Ever had to stand in a packed concert venue with no way of avoiding the smoke, while some obnoxious moron lights up next to you and fills the air (and your lungs) with poison, just because they couldn't go without one for a few hours?

I'm gonna assume no. Because anyone that has endured that would laugh at that comment.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Ever had to stand in a packed concert venue with no way of avoiding the smoke, while some obnoxious moron lights up next to you and fills the air (and your lungs) with poison, just because they couldn't go without one for a few hours?

I'm gonna assume no. Because anyone that has endured that would laugh at that comment.

-AC


I have and just because I dislike something shouldn't mean we need to take away the rights of others...............when choices are made to stand in that concert

Originally posted by soleran30
I have and just because I dislike something shouldn't mean we need to take away the rights of others...............when choices are made to stand in that concert

Factually incorrect.

I've been to many concerts with no smoking signs, no smoking warnings, it has still happened. Choices are also made to attend a no smoking concert. If you can't hack that, then don't show up.

One person smokes and the whole front row are being negatively affected by it, no way you can defend that. No logical way anyway. If you wanna destroy your lungs, fine. I'm not trying to make you quit, I'm trying not to get lung cancer.

-AC

Originally posted by super pr*xy
it is their God given right to smoke whenever, where ever... as much as it is your God given to disagree about it. the only thing preventing smokers smoking anywhere, anytime is the constrictions implied by NON-SMOKERS. ain't it peachy...

What exactly is preventing people from killing another?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Factually incorrect.

I've been to many concerts with no smoking signs, no smoking warnings, it has still happened. Choices are also made to attend a no smoking concert. If you can't hack that, then don't show up.

One person smokes and the whole front row are being negatively affected by it, no way you can defend that. No logical way anyway. If you wanna destroy your lungs, fine. I'm not trying to make you quit, I'm trying not to get lung cancer.

-AC

you are making an assumption that the whole front row is being negatively affected.

There has been no reported cases of second hand smoke causing lung cancer none zero.

if you didn't like the smoke and it was against policy there you should have informed someone to handle that. Banning smoking is ridiculous and starts taking away rights the govt shouldn't have to begin with.

Originally posted by super pr*xy
today, the city of newport beach enforced the no smoking policy in public beaches. newport beach is the third city (san clemente and huntington beach) to enforce such law.

i think this is bullsh!t. first you can't smoke in a bar... that one's a bit understandable. it's an eclosure, the smoke builds up. but if you don't like smoke in a bar, maybe you shouldn't go there... go to a club or something. but the beach..? it's open air! you don't like the smell, move to another spot. they say the cigarette butts pollute the sand. what will they ban next? sodas? marshmallows?

Um, cig butts DO pollute the sand and the near shore waters. There is research to back it up. If you want to smoke outside , hey that's fine. Just don't flick the butts into the sand, water, street, etc. Try to find a trashcan to put it in.

Originally posted by soleran30
you are making an assumption that the whole front row is being negatively affected.

There has been no reported cases of second hand smoke causing lung cancer none zero.

if you didn't like the smoke and it was against policy there you should have informed someone to handle that. Banning smoking is ridiculous and starts taking away rights the govt shouldn't have to begin with.

So now because they ignored the rules and showed up to selfishly smoke in a non-smoking venue, causing me to breathe in, smell and deal with that shit, it's MY fault for not dealing with it?

Whether I got them to put it out or not, they showed up and selfishly ignored the rules just to get their negligible fix. No debate for that.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
So now because they ignored the rules and showed up to selfishly smoke in a non-smoking venue, causing me to breathe in, smell and deal with that shit, it's MY fault for not dealing with it?

Whether I got them to put it out or not, they showed up and selfishly ignored the rules just to get their negligible fix. No debate for that.

-AC


Yup and I am certainly not debating that point. However to have the govt issue a ban on smoking is assinine and giving them way to much control. The minute you give up one freedom rest assured there will be others that follow.

Also banning smoking is now saying that nonsmokers have more rights then nonsmokers and once again the govt has overstepped its power unless its voted on by the people like you and I and majority rules (which I sincerely doubt they did.)

I am not so selfish as to say everyone should quit smoking. If you wanna smoke, I don't care if you smoke 1 a year or 50 a day. The point is, I chose not to. If you want to smoke, fine, but I don't want to have to breathe it in, smell it, taste it and have it in my lungs.

I don't have a choice if you do it in an enclosed public space. It's all very well and good saying "I have the right to smoke anywhere" and I have the right to say "I don't wanna breathe it in." However, you had the choice to smoke or not, if you choose TO smoke in that kind of area, I have no choice. You've taken my choice away as to whether I want to breathe it in or not.

Fair? No.

-AC

First time ever I have to agree with AC impossible.

Originally posted by soleran30
Yup and I am certainly not debating that point. However to have the govt issue a ban on smoking is assinine and giving them way to much control. The minute you give up one freedom rest assured there will be others that follow.

Also banning smoking is now saying that nonsmokers have more rights then nonsmokers and once again the govt has overstepped its power unless its voted on by the people like you and I and majority rules (which I sincerely doubt they did.)

So would you suggest that every business just "take it upon themselves" to put a ban in place? Some people who need to smoke are only going to follow smoking bans when they know they will be confronted on the matter. Most public venues aren't going to just willingly say "don't smoke here" when they know that it's good for profit. They can make money from selling cigs, money from cig companies who want to put up their billboards and posters and from the smoker consumers themselves. In our system that says "make a buck anyway you can so long as it's 'legal'" I'd be skeptical to rely on the venues or the individuals to willingly make that decision themselves. You have to look at the whole systematic freedom for us all and not just the individualistic perception of freedom.

You can't debate "The government are taking away my right to choose!" when you are taking away mine by smoking in enclosed public spaces.

Everyone is born a non-smoker, you CHOSE to pick the habit so you are going to be treated differently from those who did not choose to pick it, especially when your choice infringes upon others.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I am not so selfish as to say everyone should quit smoking. If you wanna smoke, I don't care if you smoke 1 a year or 50 a day. The point is, I chose not to. If you want to smoke, fine, but I don't want to have to breathe it in, smell it, taste it and have it in my lungs.

I don't have a choice if you do it in an enclosed public space. It's all very well and good saying "I have the right to smoke anywhere" and I have the right to say "I don't wanna breathe it in." However, you had the choice to smoke or not, if you choose TO smoke in that kind of area, I have no choice. You've taken my choice away as to whether I want to breathe it in or not.

Fair? No.

-AC

Yeah well lets get to the more significant point did anyone take away your rights? Did you chose to dine/drink/party in an establishment that allows smoking? Cuz if you CHOSE to go to a smoking establishment then don't whine about the smoke.

There are many smoke free places where I live and its enforced by owners of the establishment and believe me no one would allow smoking to occur. To make it a LAW is retarded was there a vote on this for the people to decide their laws?

Originally posted by soleran30
Yeah well lets get to the more significant point did anyone take away your rights? Did you chose to dine/drink/party in an establishment that allows smoking? Cuz if you CHOSE to go to a smoking establishment then don't whine about the smoke.

If you're shoulder to shoulder with someone at a barrier, you should at least show the damn courtesy enough to ask them if they mind. It's the most vile thing ever having to breathe in smoke if you're not a smoker.

Originally posted by soleran30
There are many smoke free places where I live and its enforced by owners of the establishment and believe me no one would allow smoking to occur. To make it a LAW is retarded was there a vote on this for the people to decide their laws?

As Meep said, how many business are going to turn away the vast amounts of smoking customers?

Not many.

-Ac

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You can't debate "The government are taking away my right to choose!" when you are taking away mine by smoking in enclosed public spaces.

Everyone is born a non-smoker, you CHOSE to pick the habit so you are going to be treated differently from those who did not choose to pick it, especially when your choice infringes upon others.

-AC

I think you can debate it but maybe not the way you think. Anyway, I do agree with you when you say that smokers take away your right to not be around smoke when they light up where ever they feel.

Yeah and thats the right of the business owner not the govt. There is a huge difference do you see it?

tell that to roy castle

Originally posted by soleran30
Yeah and thats the right of the business owner not the govt. There is a huge difference do you see it?
Yes but can you trust the business owner to do what's in the best interest for the people?

Originally posted by jaden101
tell that to roy castle


LOL oh yeah thats certainly one for the books cuz you can certainly trace that back to years and years ago of playing music in jazz clubs..........derrr no.


"Yes but can you trust the business owner to do what's in the best interest for the people?"

Ask yourself can you trust the Govt to do whats best for the "people." Realistically you have a better shot with business owners becuase you can affect them today by not supporting their business and your friends not supporting their business.

Originally posted by soleran30
LOL oh yeah thats certainly one for the books cuz you can certainly trace that back to years and years ago of playing music in jazz clubs..........derrr no.


"Yes but can you trust the business owner to do what's in the best interest for the people?"

Ask yourself can you trust the Govt to do whats best for the "people." Realistically you have a better shot with business owners becuase you can affect them today by not supporting their business and your friends not supporting their business.

Point well taken. How very populist. But Do all your friends not smoke? Would all of you agree on not going to a particular venue? Would it even matter to the venue? I don't mean to trivilize what you're saying. I agree with you. But do we ALL care about this issue enoughto boycott a place? The thing is I think we are a very disconnected society. If we are really going to change anythign like banning smoking in public places than we ALL need to be on the same page, but not neccesarily in the same sentance.

Originally posted by Clovie
First time ever I have to agree with AC impossible.

First time I've ever agreed with AC, too.