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Okay, here's the deal...
God says, "Well the Flood didn't work, so I'm gonna cast upon the Earth a Golden Rule Spell. Any kind of harm or injustice one person or group of people tries to visit upon another will have it happen to them instead."

In other words...
You fire a gun at someone, the bullet hits you.
You try to suicide bomb someone, the bomb goes off while you are among your peers/family.
You try to embezzle, it is your $$$ which disappears.

You get the idea.
How will this play out with Human"kind?"

God says in the bible after he floods the earth he will never again punish man.

and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake, for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth, neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done.

Originally posted by T.M
God says in the bible after he floods the earth he will never again punish man.

...neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done.

Smite, shmite. If anything, it's just the opposite. The Big G sets it up where we can't hurt each other, because if we try we just hurt ourselves. Will the greedy and violent-prone self-destruct, or will they have to grow-up and act like honest and mature adults?

How would this effect street crime? White-collar crime? Terrorism? You wanna bring change, you do it in a truly fair and civilized fashion...for your own sake.

Well, it kinda sounds like the Karma thing.......Or as the bible put it "Reaping and Sowing"....What you do in this life will affect you in the next possibly...........Hey, sounds like good rules too me...

Uhmmm but where do practical jokes come into play....Wouldn't it ruin them??...Hence my life would no long be worth living....

Did you get this idea from Red Dwarf by any chance ?

DJ: Practical jokes? May need a PJ clause.

TM: No, I thunk this up meself.

Originally posted by Mindship
DJ: Practical jokes? May need a PJ clause.

. Ok....you be god and I'll vote for you........Sounds like a good plan.

Would be a more peaceful world. Or, you can convince people that the Karma thing is real and it might have the same affect.

Originally posted by Mindship
DJ: Practical jokes? May need a PJ clause.

TM: No, I thunk this up meself.

Thunk

Originally posted by Mindship
DJ: Practical jokes? May need a PJ clause.

TM: No, I thunk this up meself.

just wondering 'cause on an episode of Red Dwarf there was a prison that caused the effect of something to happen to the person who done it.

Originally posted by Mindship
You try to suicide bomb someone, the bomb goes off while you are among your peers/family.

The rule is good, be people shouldn't have to follow it out of fear. That's what makes a trustworthy, well structured society. Not that every one is afraid of the consequence of breaking a rule, but rather for the sheer freedom of following it. We should not make examples out of people for others to follow, we should let them become examples.

Oh yes and the quote, why should the innocent be punished for the inequities of the guilty?

Originally posted by AOR
Oh yes and the quote, why should the innocent be punished for the inequities of the guilty?

Exactly.

Originally posted by AOR
...why should the innocent be punished for the inequities of the guilty?

It's just a thought experiment. Basically, I'm curious as to how those inclined toward misdeeds would cope if their way of getting things done was rendered useless.

For example, what if suicide bombing no longer worked (ie, the bomb went off before the bomber reached target--let's just leave it at that)? What if any kind of violence backfired against the terrorists? Would they keep trying to find a loophole (there is none), only to keep on destroying themselves to their own disadvantage? Would they eventually realize violence is not an option and start to behave in a more civilized fashion? Would they become so angry and frustrated, so crazed, that they then deliberately start to destroy themselves (kinda like a hunger striker)?

What would a school bully do if everytime he went to punch someone in the nose, he tripped and broke his own nose?

What would a street thug do if everytime he tried to shoot/stab someone, the bullet/blade went into him?

Basically, it is impossible for one human being to harm another. Those who rely on harming others: now what do they do?

So If I need surgery It won't work cause the Doctor will get cut insted... While I die....

Originally posted by Mindship
Okay, here's the deal...
God says, "Well the Flood didn't work, so I'm gonna cast upon the Earth a Golden Rule Spell. Any kind of harm or injustice one person or group of people tries to visit upon another will have it happen to them instead."

In other words...
You fire a gun at someone, the bullet hits you.
You try to suicide bomb someone, the bomb goes off while you are among your peers/family.
You try to embezzle, it is your $$$ which disappears.

You get the idea.
How will this play out with Human"kind?"


So you point the gun at yourself to shoot someone else.
You blow up your friends to kill your enemy.
You give money to your company to embezzle.

Human greed and ego will find a way.

So If I need surgery It won't work cause the Doctor will get cut insted... While I die....
doh
This Golden Rule Spell is intelligent and infinitely discriminating.
The Doctor is performing surgery with benevolent intent. You live.
Intent is the key.

So you point the gun at yourself to shoot someone else.
You blow up your friends to kill your enemy.
You give money to your company to embezzle.
Human greed and ego will find a way.

Again, intent is the key. There are No Loopholes (c'mon, give the Good Lord some credit for craftiness).

frusty ---> cuz he know who's really gonna get the bump.

so basically what it comes down to is god takes away our freewill, where by if we do anything bad we get punished...

While its a nice closed solution to many problems, it has all of the finesse of racial cleansing to solve racism...

Originally posted by T.M
Did you get this idea from Red Dwarf by any chance ? I was thinking that

Originally posted by Mindship
doh
This Golden Rule Spell is intelligent and infinitely discriminating.
The Doctor is performing surgery with benevolent intent. You live.
Intent is the key.

So you point the gun at yourself to shoot someone else.
You blow up your friends to kill your enemy.
You give money to your company to embezzle.
Human greed and ego will find a way.

Again, intent is the key. There are No Loopholes (c'mon, give the Good Lord some credit for craftiness).

frusty ---> cuz he know who's really gonna get the bump.

We would, given enough time, still find a way.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
We would, given enough time, still find a way.

This is what I'm curious about. This has nothing to do with divine punishment (if you're uncomfortable with God, substitute alien intelligence or government-created virus); nor racial cleansing (all people are subject); nor loss of free will (you can still do anything you want--you just can't hurt another person); nor surgery; nor moral stance; etc, etc, etc.

I dunno; maybe I asked a question that is difficult to just take at face value. Forget the details: if by some Whatever Unknown Force, people could no longer harm one another (No Loopholes--none, zip, zero, nada, nyet), how would this change the human condition? Period. Just go wit da flow here.

If it helps, I'll put in my 2 cents worth.
I think our civilization, overall, would undergo a massive upheavel. With violence now impossible, people would have to find another way of getting their point across. Many, perhaps most, I think, would be thankful and breathe a sigh of relief that now humanity will have to act truly civilized and solve conflict with intelligence and compromise. Others I think would spend the rest of their natural lives looking for loopholes. Still others, I think, would simply self-destruct in some fashion, turning their anger and negativity upon themselves.

beer
Lord, I needed that.

Originally posted by Mindship
This is what I'm curious about. This has nothing to do with divine punishment (if you're uncomfortable with God, substitute alien intelligence or government-created virus); nor racial cleansing (all people are subject); nor loss of free will (you can still do anything you want--you just can't hurt another person); nor surgery; nor moral stance; etc, etc, etc.

I think you have missed the point I made...

With your law in place you have basically stripped us of the choice to do wrong... thus forcing people to be good... at face value this appears to be a good thing.

But... Your forcing people to be good... people should do this of there own accord, Not because if they don't there doomed... Anyone (by anyone I mean super powerful god/alien/goku) can create a race without free will that will do exactly what its programmed to Or be smited from the heavens...

But "god" gave us free will so that we could create our own utopia... Least thats what I believe...

Yes, It would solve alot of problems, But we would be sacrificing our freedom to do it!

Originally posted by Hit_and_Miss
I think you have missed the point I made...

With your law in place you have basically stripped us of the choice to do wrong... thus forcing people to be good... at face value this appears to be a good thing.

But... Your forcing people to be good... people should do this of there own accord, Not because if they don't there doomed... Anyone (by anyone I mean super powerful god/alien/goku) can create a race without free will that will do exactly what its programmed to Or be smited from the heavens...

But "god" gave us free will so that we could create our own utopia... Least thats what I believe...

Yes, It would solve alot of problems, But we would be sacrificing our freedom to do it!

I understand what you're saying, and you make a good point. I even agree with you: a true test, so to speak, of an omnipotent God might even be to create beings which could choose whether or not to believe in their creator, given at best ambiguous clues as to whether or not the creator even exists; or, in choosing not to believe, decide for themselves whether or not to behave honorably anyway.

But I'm posing a thought experiment. If Violence were no longer a "productive" option (people could still choose to pull a trigger; just beware the new consequences), how might this change things? Would the violent-prone acquiesce, or would most keep trying, even to the point of their own self-destruction? Human beings can be remarkably adaptive and remarkably stubborn. Maybe this would be another way to pose the question: which tendency would prove stronger?

You ask the average person if they would do something to intentionaly harm themselves? what would they say?? (baring emo kids and those with mental illness...)

No one would harm anyone else not for fear of getting caught by the law or cause it was wrong but cause they know they are harming themselves....

It would work, I'm not denying that you would cut out nearly all crime... But its a little extreme and it would cause the colapse of all free will, and scare people into believing...

It would ruin the world... Our entire social system would collapse.

The loss of power would destroy entire nations and governments and the thing is nobody could keep control because there wouldn't be any way to keep control, at the same time nobody could take control either. What we would most likely achieve is a world where everybody just kinda lives. Some would do things perhaps others would not. They would just die or try to work, in the end the lack of power for certain people and or nations would destroy the entire world and human society. It would be impossible for us to function.

Why would people still follow the government if they had no reason to? If nobody could punish them if they didn't and there would be no real reward if they did? So what they would have more money, they would try to buy a better car with that, but the problem is if stealing isn't allowed then every car would be worth about 10 to 20.000 dollars. I don't think humanity could survive without violence and crimes.

Originally posted by Fishy
It would ruin the world... Our entire social system would collapse.

The loss of power would destroy entire nations and governments and the thing is nobody could keep control because there wouldn't be any way to keep control, at the same time nobody could take control either. What we would most likely achieve is a world where everybody just kinda lives. Some would do things perhaps others would not. They would just die or try to work, in the end the lack of power for certain people and or nations would destroy the entire world and human society. It would be impossible for us to function.

Why would people still follow the government if they had no reason to? If nobody could punish them if they didn't and there would be no real reward if they did? So what they would have more money, they would try to buy a better car with that, but the problem is if stealing isn't allowed then every car would be worth about 10 to 20.000 dollars. I don't think humanity could survive without violence and crimes.

Without getting into the details, overall I tend to agree. It would likely mean a massive restructuring of our civilization, probably into something which would, in the end, be quite alien to how we manage our affairs now.

Originally posted by Hit_and_Miss
I think you have missed the point I made...

With your law in place you have basically stripped us of the choice to do wrong... thus forcing people to be good... at face value this appears to be a good thing.

But... Your forcing people to be good... people should do this of there own accord, Not because if they don't there doomed... Anyone (by anyone I mean super powerful god/alien/goku) can create a race without free will that will do exactly what its programmed to Or be smited from the heavens...

But "god" gave us free will so that we could create our own utopia... Least thats what I believe...

Yes, It would solve alot of problems, But we would be sacrificing our freedom to do it!

Originally posted by AOR
The rule is good, be people shouldn't have to follow it out of fear. That's what makes a trustworthy, well structured society. Not that every one is afraid of the consequence of breaking a rule, but rather for the sheer freedom of following it. We should not make examples out of people for others to follow, we should let them become examples.

that scenario was played out in red dwarf a cult sitcom in the uk it us a comedy but was really cool

I gotta see that episode. For that matter, I've never seen any RD episode. Have a feelin I'm missing something.

RD?

cool thanks

Originally posted by Mindship
Okay, here's the deal...
God says, "Well the Flood didn't work, so I'm gonna cast upon the Earth a Golden Rule Spell. Any kind of harm or injustice one person or group of people tries to visit upon another will have it happen to them instead."

In other words...
You fire a gun at someone, the bullet hits you.
You try to suicide bomb someone, the bomb goes off while you are among your peers/family.
You try to embezzle, it is your $$$ which disappears.

You get the idea.
How will this play out with Human"kind?"

Originally posted by charlie chuckle
that scenario was played out in red dwarf a cult sitcom in the uk it us a comedy but was really cool

*whispers* I think I said that already..

BIG G= IMPOTENT OMNIPOTENT