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3 hours rest after each fight

1) ROTS Obi-Wan Kenobi
2) Kit Fisto and Ki-Adi-Mundi
3) 2x Darth Mauls
4) Count Dooku and Assaj Ventress
5) Yoda
6) Darth Revan
7) Darth Malak, Darth Bandon and Darth Bastila
8) They reclaim the galaxy and acheive UNLIMITED POWEEEEEEEERRRRR!!!!!

IMO if they squeak past 6 they probably lose at 7.

I say they either get stopped at 7, or if theyre having a good day, they make it.

They could make it.

7 might be hard, I don't know if Vader can keep up with both Bandon and Bastila while Sidious takes care of Malak, which might take a while.

6 or 7

If one of them dies will he return the next fight or will he stay down?

If they don't return the team would be dead a hell of a lot faster then if they do.

they get curberstomped at Darth Revan.

What are you talking about zephiel? I'm not saying I disagree with you but what makes you think Revan could take both of them at the same time?

Well OT refers to the time of New Hope-Return of the Jedi right?

If so then my answer speaks for itself, easily. Palpatine lived a good ol life without much dueling or exerting his power. Vader would be killed by storm quite easily.

Oh, so you're going with the choreography logic? Excellent..

What? You know how easily Vader was killed by a force lightning. Revan could replicate that.

In a lightsaber/force fight, Palpatine would be owned so silly it wouldn't be funny.

This is OT Vader AND OT Sidious together. Yes Revan could take them 1 one but you're saying it'll be just as easy for him to take them together.

Originally posted by tdtd
This is OT Vader AND OT Sidious together. Yes Revan could take them 1 one but you're saying it'll be just as easy for him to take them together.

Ok this would be how its goes. Revan force storms them both, Vader dies swiftly. Sidious attempts to use some feeble form of lightning that he has at this point, but Revan blocks it and slices Sids in two.

Revan also kills himself in the process with his beloved force storm. YOu know you need a lot of space to conjure one up

When was space a concern, for the purpose of this argument? Even if it was, Revan would blast Vader with lightning.

Really? While Sidious just watched?

And since when can Revan use a force storm, lightning yes. In a powerful form yes... It would probably fry Vader but that is of course assuming Sidious isn't there to cut Revan in half while he tries to break Vader his defence.

The Rakatans described his storm as lightning from the sky. Force lightning does come from the sky, it comes from the wielders hand. It was definately force storm they were describing.

What can Sidious do anyways. Revan uses storm kills them both. If Sids manages to survive, Revan cuts him in two afterwards.

Originally posted by zephiel7
The Rakatans described his storm as lightning from the sky. Force lightning does come from the sky, it comes from the wielders hand. It was definately force storm they were describing.

What can Sidious do anyways. Revan uses storm kills them both. If Sids manages to survive, Revan cuts him in two afterwards.

Actually if you would play the game you would see that level three lightning goes up into the air from Revan his hands and then comes crushing down on the enemy's around him. So that probably the technique Revan used...

Originally posted by Fishy
Actually if you would play the game you would see that level three lightning goes up into the air from Revan his hands and then comes crushing down on the enemy's around him. So that probably the technique Revan used...

Level three lightning is called storm though...

Its radius of effect is huge. Enough to take out OT Sids and Vader no prob.

Zeph, even if Revan CAN use a force storm he would need distance regardless, unless he wants himself dead. And if he uses force lightning on Vader, Sidious isn't going to sit there and watch.

Yoda manages to injure Vader before dying and then Revan manages to finish the duo off.

I dont know where you are getting this issue of distance from. If they are powerful enough to use the technique, then I am pretty damn certain they are able to manipulate into not effecting themselves. Otherwise, they would not be considered masters of what they do.

Even if distance WERE an issue and Revan risked the chance of hurting himself (which I do not believe) he would shock Vader and fight of Sids at the same time. We saw Malak punk two Jedi knights, (using two different techniques and while they were both choked to boot) EASILY. Revan could do the same to Vader and Sidious.

Vader didn't have a lightsaber to block lightning with.

Also, Force Storm is on a massive scale, even Revan's level 3 lightning is not large enough for a true Force Storm. Darth Bane was going to force storm the ENTIRE planet, Sidious' storm shot across space and took out an entire fleet. Revan's force storm, based upon some ambiguous quote by the Rakatans, even if you were to take it as 100% canon, does not indicate the same level as a full blow force storm.

Even if he does manage to force storm, Sidious and Vader will not simply sit there. They will be all up in Revan's grill immediately.

Zeph, you need distance to conjure up a force storm unless you plan on dying too.

Originally posted by zephiel7
I dont know where you are getting this issue of distance from. If they are powerful enough to use the technique, then I am pretty damn certain they are able to manipulate into not effecting themselves. Otherwise, they would not be considered masters of what they do.

Even if distance WERE an issue and Revan risked the chance of hurting himself (which I do not believe) he would shock Vader and fight of Sids at the same time. We saw Malak punk two Jedi knights, (using two different techniques and while they were both choked to boot) EASILY. Revan could do the same to Vader and Sidious.

Really, this is the same if it works on A, it must work on B logic again. What caliber were the jedi that Malak tooled?

Let me guess, if I can force lightning Vader to death, I can force lightning Ragnos to death too, right? We can just make that assumption.

Originally posted by Illustrious
Vader didn't have a lightsaber to block lightning with.

Also, Force Storm is on a massive scale, even Revan's level 3 lightning is not large enough for a true Force Storm. Darth Bane was going to force storm the ENTIRE planet, Sidious' storm shot across space and took out an entire fleet. Revan's force storm, based upon some ambiguous quote by the Rakatans, even if you were to take it as 100% canon, does not indicate the same level as a full blow force storm.

Even if he does manage to force storm, Sidious and Vader will not simply sit there. They will be all up in Revan's grill immediately.

Wasn't Vader's life support system sensitive to any form of electrical interference. He would be down for the count rather quickly. I also think the "lightsaber blocking lightning" was just a way to show that Windu and Obi Wan were using a technique in the force to resist lightning.

Palpatine would not be able to do much other than take the beating like the b**ch he is.

Ok now youre just throwing in your biased opinions. What makes you think ROTJ Sidious is going to watch Vader get fried, without cutting Revan in half or blasting him with his own force lightning.

Originally posted by zephiel7
Vader's life support system is sensitive to any form of electrical interference. He would be down for the count rather quickly. I also think the "lightsaber blocking lightning" was just a way to show that Windu and Obi Wan were using a technique in the force to resist lightning.

Palpatine would not be able to do much other than take the beating like the b**ch he is.

No, the lightsaber is a tool that you can use to block lightning. Obi Wan and MAce Windu both didn't know how to block lightning like Mace did, they just did it with their lightsaber, obviously it isn't easy as Mace still struggled with his, so it can be argued that Revan would overcome Vader his defence, in fact I wouldn't be the least bit surprised and it seems logical, but he could never overcome Vader with Palpatine hacking at him, and we can't be sure if he could overcome Vader his defence while also attacking Palpatine in fact it seems unlikely.

So he wouldn't be able to use lightning tokill Vader, he would need to use his lightsaber to kill these two.

The fact that force lightning literally takes two seconds to use. And the fact that Vader is sensitive to the move.

Revan has precognition, enough to pwn Sids in a lightsaber duel. Revan has also demonstrated a far stronger connection to the force than Palp. He could nullify Palp's lightning rather easily, no?

Precognition isn't god's gift to the world my friend. Now if you're talking pure lightsaber duels then I agree, Revan can hack these two easily. But in anything goes Revan wouldn't be able to keep both of them at bay at the same time.

Originally posted by zephiel7
The fact that force lightning literally takes two seconds to use. And the fact that Vader is sensitive to the move.

Revan has precognition, enough to pwn Sids in a lightsaber duel. Revan has also demonstrated a far stronger connection to the force than Palp. He could nullify Palp's lightning rather easily, no?

He's fighting two people... He could not conjure up that lightning and overcome Vader his defence without getting cut down in two seconds its as simple as that. He simply could not.

If Malak could use three consecutive techniques against two Jedi Knights while talking to Revan, than it is possible Revan can do two consecutive moves at the same time, seeing as Vader is vulnerable to force lightning.

Yea but Malak did it against some unknown Jedi, Revan would be doing it against two powerful sith.

Originally posted by zephiel7
If Malak could use three consecutive techniques against two Jedi Knights while talking to Revan, than it is possible Revan can do two consecutive moves at the same time, seeing as Vader is vulnerable to force lightning.

And how would these Jedi compare to Sidious or Vader? Do you know? No you don't. Perhaps they are far more powerful perhaps they are weaker you don't know.

And using force lightning on that scale and fighting not just talking with but fighting another force user is a hell of a lot harder then doing what Malak did.

These Sith were not so great as evidenced ROTJ.

Vader was outpowered by a barely trained padawan Luke. I don't know maybe Luke got angry, but it still does not look good on his resume.

Palpatine maybe a bit more difficult to take down, but his lightning was the only thing he had going for him. In a lightsaber duel as evidenced in ROTS he was taken down quickly by Mace.

The fact remains you have no idea how powerful the jedi were compared to vader and palpatine who were considered very powerful.

Originally posted by Fishy
And how would these Jedi compare to Sidious or Vader? Do you know? No you don't. Perhaps they are far more powerful perhaps they are weaker you don't know.

And using force lightning on that scale and fighting not just talking with but fighting another force user is a hell of a lot harder then doing what Malak did.

There IS substanial proof that Vader's life support system is vulnerable to lightning. It would be over quickly, enough for Revan to devote full concentration on a half decent Sith Lord.

Originally posted by zephiel7
There IS substanial proof that Vader's life support system is vulnerable to lightning. It would be over quickly, enough for Revan to fight a half decent Sith Lord.

How could Revan overcome Vader his defence and keep Sidious away at the same time? Really he might be powerful enough to do that, but we don't know.

Again, you have no evidence Vader can't stop lightning with his saber. In fact I would assume Sidious taught him a lot in those 20 years including that, considering it was done to him. And even if Vader was getting fried, Palpatine would slice Revan or fry him himself.

Malak was seen doing the same. Revan is stronger than Malak. Vader is weaker to lightning than any of the Jedi Malak was fighting. Revan also battle precognition, an advantage Sidious does not have. He can pull it off.

Originally posted by zephiel7
Malak was seen doing the same. Revan is stronger than Malak. Vader is weaker to lightning than any of the Jedi Malak was fighting. Revan also battle precognition, an advantage Sidious does not have. He can pull it off.

Malak was seen choking two Jedi who could have been weaker then TPM Anakin or more powerful then Yoda.

What he did also does not compare to launching a full scale lightning attack towards somebody and fighting off another Jedi at the same time.

For a skilled Sith Lord lightning is not a difficult technique to pull off. It's fast and effective. Add to the fact Vader is vulnerable and its even faster. Its possible Palpatine will get on Revan after Vader is already dead, in which case the battle is already decided. Revan wins.

What? This is a 2 on 1 fight zephiel. Meaning if Vader is getting fried Palpatine would slice Revan in the process... What if Revan attacks Sidious with force lightning? Then Vader with slice Revan.

Thats why Revan would consecutively defend against Palpatine's saber strikes.

So Revan is going to overpower Vader his defence with a powerful lightning attack and at the same time block Sidious his attacks? Thats bullshit he would never be able to pull that off.

Zephiel Revan wouldn't be able to pull it off.

Revan's lightning dissolves off Vader's saber. Revan's lightning is not visibly superior to Palpatine's. Next.

Originally posted by Revolver Ocelot
Revan's lightning dissolves off Vader's saber. Revan's lightning is not visibly superior to Palpatine's. Next.

I wouldn't really say that, Lightning that kills Rancors and several people at the same time does seem superior to what Sidious unleashes, but Revan his lightning does not give him victory so its irrelevant.

Where has it shown to be able to kill people and rancors instantly?

He killed the Rakatan scout party's with his lightning, the Rakatan scout party's had rancors with them...

Revan fanboys. Gotta hate them.

I don't see them getting past 4.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
I don't see them getting past 4.

Oh please, Glentract.
Dooku tooled Asajj with force lightning and tooled her in matter of seconds in a lightsaber duel. Anakin before ROTS had some trouble with her but Vader is Anakin who can use his anger at will and has more than 2 decades of additional force and lightsaber training + some nice lightsaber duelling experience (since he proceeded to kill Jedi after ROTS).

Asajj will be gone in the matter of seconds and Dooku isn't enough to defeat Sidious and Vader at once.

If the'll go down they'll go down at 7 but even there Sidious could take down Bastilla with force lightning rather fast and they would possibly be able to take down Malak and Bandon.

They would make it to 7 or go all the way. Bastila hasn't shown anything impressive beyond battle meditation. Vader could hold his own with Malak while Sidious would fry Bandon and/or Bastila. Again if they make it past 7 it would be with great difficulty.

I don't see how...

Malak would face Sidious Bandon and Bastila would face Vader... Or maybe Bandon and Malak would face Sidious, well doesn't matter. Whoever has two against him is going to die, as long as Malak fights Sidious that is. Bandon can hold off Vader long enough for Malak and Bastila to kill Sidious, and Bastila can do the same.

Malak is greater with a lightsaber then Sidious anyways and I don't see Sidious destroying Malak with his force powers.

He killed the Rakatan scout party's with his lightning, the Rakatan scout party's had rancors with them...

Those little baby ones? Meh, not all of their scout parties had Rancors, did they? Of the few you encounter, not all do. Anyways, OT Sidious is a step up from ROTS Sidious, and arguably equal to DE Sidious, considering we've never seen him exert himself... And Vader is 80% of that...

IMO, ROTS Sidious was around Malak's level, below in saber ability, but this one has 20 years more of experience. Whether he practised his saber is uncertain, but the man has insane force abilities.

They make it through, but are hard pressed in the last fight.

Vader repeatedly throws Bandon away with the force and hacks away at Bastilla while Sidious uses his force powers to overcome Malak.

Or if Bastilla uses battle meditation then Vader chokes Bandon, then cuts down Bastilla who is off sitting in the back. He then helps Sidious finish off Malak.

No, not all of them but he killed several of them, so he must have met one with Rancors, and yeah they were baby's, but Rancors are still pretty tough and he killed several of them along with other people at once... Not saying his lighting is the uber shit but its pretty nice anyways



Sidious undoubtly had practice since ROTS, but how much? He didn't have any Jedi to fear and he was greatly protected. The 80% quote is also somewhat vague as it does not mention in what, and we have no real way of telling how powerful Vader was compared to Sidious. And Sidious himself we don't know how much more powerful he became, we know he never showed the skills he showed in DE though. So its safe to assume he wasn't that powerful. I wouldn't rank him higher then ROTS sidious at least not by a lot, simply because we don't know... So saying he's more powerful is kinda hard to do...

Yeah, but DE takes place 7 years after ROTJ. DE Palpatine only really has 7 years plus of experience and a younger body. Given 27 years od experience he increased greatly. 20 years he would have likely increased greatly too.

However, in DE it's presumed he "studied harder" considering he didn't have to worry about his Empire as much by then. But Palpatine did write three large encyclopedias on the Dark Side in those 20 years, so I think it's safe to assume he did improve.

Well, the 80% quote was about power. I believe George Lucas went on to explain something about how the better fighter is the "Master" in Sith ways, so I think he was referring to combat abilities. I think it's a valid number, in both saber ability and force powers.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Oh please, Glentract.
Dooku tooled Asajj with force lightning and tooled her in matter of seconds in a lightsaber duel. Anakin before ROTS had some trouble with her but Vader is Anakin who can use his anger at will and has more than 2 decades of additional force and lightsaber training + some nice lightsaber duelling experience (since he proceeded to kill Jedi after ROTS).

Asajj will be gone in the matter of seconds and Dooku isn't enough to defeat Sidious and Vader at once.

If the'll go down they'll go down at 7 but even there Sidious could take down Bastilla with force lightning rather fast and they would possibly be able to take down Malak and Bandon.

Dooku could do the same to Vader in this case. If Vader fights Asajj in lightsaber combat he'll lose as he's to slow. Just look at how Vader fights in ROTS, it's much better then what we see from him in the OT. I think you seriously underestimate Asajj.

Sidious will lose to Dooku. Dooku has better lightsaber skills and his force powers are enough to protect him from Sidious.

C'mon, he's not slow slow, just a bit clunky. His strength can make up for that.

Yeah, Vader would choke Asaaj, with the force or physically. Whichever presents itself sooner. To do it physically, though, he would have to snap her little Betty Spaghetti arms in a saber lock first.

XD

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Dooku could do the same to Vader in this case. If Vader fights Asajj in lightsaber combat he'll lose as he's to slow. Just look at how Vader fights in ROTS, it's much better then what we see from him in the OT. I think you seriously underestimate Asajj.

Yet he defeated a notable swordsmaster, a pair of experienced Jedi Knights, three Padawans, and five Jedi Masters in Dark Lord and Purge. I can see him taking Asajj after a grueling battle.



Sidious will not lose to Dooku, not by a long shot. Weren't you the one telling off about half a dozen skeptics a few days ago in regards to Sidious's power? That he'd been busy training Vader and a host of other Dark Side acolytes and warriors? That he'd been studying the lore looted from the Jedi Temple for two decades? That because of the above, he was far stronger than he was in RotJ? No, I'd say Sidious takes Dooku with Force powers alone, albeit with - again - notable difficulty.

Sidious is superior to Dooku in the force, this is true. However Dooku is the superior swordsman.

That won't matter if Sidious brings him to his knees from afar. And at the very least, he can stave off Dooku long enough for Vader to come to his aid.

Yeah, and Vader is 80% of that... Dooku would be completely overwhelmed by the duo.

They make it.

Originally posted by Lord Mader
They make it.

Riiiiiiiight

Revan will easily take them down.

Wrong again