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Pure unarmed combat. Sadow and Kun versus Mace and Kar. Setting: Telos training academy.

Someone want to detail Kar's physical strength?

Shatterpoint covers it pretty well. He could beat the crap out of Mace.

Sadow probably has them all beat in physical strength, if only because he had a weighted weapon to swing around his entire life.

The problem with Kun is that we never really see him exert himself, but his strength is considerable from what we have seen.

*shrug* I say the Sith take it.

I do too, but it would be interesting to see how they fare against Kar with his bestial strength and Mace with his shatterpoint ability.

Oh, they get the Force?

Sith definitely win, man.

Kar is described as "twice in size" to Mace Windu. He also posseses immense physical strength. I'd guess he's 8 feet -> 400 lbs at the least.

Mace might be the weak link here; Sadow being of the Sith species and Kun having the ability to crush people's skulls with his palms. I say the Sith take it after a tough fight.

Originally posted by IKC
Oh, they get the Force?

Sith definitely win, man.

Pure unarmed combat.

I dunno. Kar was described as being as large as a Wookie, and I'd say he's a good bit stronger than one. Mace is fekkin' fast, and is no lightweight himself, considering Nick Rostu thought that his casual grip was going to shatter his arm. I'd say that either have Kun beat out in unarmed capability, especially Vastor. How they take Sadow is the question.

Originally posted by Faunus
Pure unarmed combat.



...

You were saying?

I completely disagree, Kun can definitely take Mace. After Sylvar scratched his face (breaking his metal helmet) as a padawan, he got pissed and grabbed her face and shoved her to the ground.

That and he was casually lifting the chancellor over his own shoulder with arm extended while digging his fingers into his skull for a grip. Kun's strength is pretty up there.

Let me get this straight. An Ancient Sith and Kun vs. 2 black men? Remind me how Kun isn't the first to go?

Depends. Is this pre-KFC Mace?

Because that's a stupid argument?

You don't seriously believe that, do you? You were stating it to be "funny" despite the fact that it's unbearably hackneyed, right?

Sorta, it was in response to your unfounded assumption that Kun could take Mace.

Yeah. Despite all my argumentation, it's "unfounded" because tdtd says so.

Naga Sadow uses an illusion to make himself black, then he goes and beats the crap out of the otha team!

Oh I forgot. IKC's arguments=conclusive and irrefutable.

Originally posted by tdtd
Oh I forgot. IKC's arguments=conclusive and irrefutable.

If you're going to refute it, at least bring in your own support instead of running around and crying "unsupported!!"

You can refute them, but you sorta need to actually address my points, not just say "I refute this" and run around as if you've won something.

Double-pwnt!

*high-fives Illustrious*

ok

Originally posted by Illustrious
Naga Sadow uses an illusion to make himself black, then he goes and beats the crap out of the otha team!

Originally posted by IKC
Double-pwnt!

*high-fives Illustrious*

LOL!

Originally posted by Illustrious



So in conclusion you have 3 black men and Kun.. Nice. That should be an interesting and entirely new scenario for Kun.

Originally posted by tdtd
So in conclusion you have 3 black men and Kun.. Nice. That should be an interesting and entirely new scenario for Kun.

Who said anything about Kar and Mace being men after Sadow gets done with them?

That's operating under the assumption that Kun hasn't yet killed Windu by the time Sadow slaps Kar around.

Which is also operating under the assumption that Kun would kill Mace quicker than Sadow dispose of Kar.

That's essentially what I said except you just used the other possibility. Any point to it?

No, just making sure we're in agreement

Eh. Whatever.

Lol.. Calm down IKC.. Have a cosmopolitan.

Originally posted by tdtd
Lol.. Calm down IKC.. Have a cosmopolitan.

*gasp*

Originally posted by IKC
...

You were saying?

I completely disagree, Kun can definitely take Mace. After Sylvar scratched his face (breaking his metal helmet) as a padawan, he got pissed and grabbed her face and shoved her to the ground.

That and he was casually lifting the chancellor over his own shoulder with arm extended while digging his fingers into his skull for a grip. Kun's strength is pretty up there.

Force attacks: I thought you were referring to offensive use of the Force.

He pushed Sylvar to the ground. . . erm, Mace literally sent Vastor flying with a backhand and made a fairly hardened Korun believe his arm was about to be shattered by a casual grip. He also landed six varying blows on Kar before the man could blink, then floored him again. At best, Kun's physical strength may surpass Windu's. But he hasn't shown a fraction of the unarmed martial capability that Mace has displayed.

On a side note, Luke picked Han Solo off of the ground with one arm, too.

Touche, was that in ROTJ?

Dark Empire I.

1.. Which part, very beginning, want to take a look at it.

I believe it's comic #4.

Originally posted by tdtd
1.. Which part, very beginning, want to take a look at it.

http://intern.darklegion.de/eddie/hanpwned.jpg

Originally posted by Borbarad
http://intern.darklegion.de/eddie/hanpwned.jpg

This is why I hate DE... it totally contradicts the movies. Luke would never had fallen, he passed the test when he refrained from killing Vader.

Actually DE doesn't contradict anything, and Luke falling has nothing to do with anything, he wanted to defeat the dark side from within while learning its secrets, I suggest you read the comics, they're good.

Originally posted by tdtd
Actually DE doesn't contradict anything, and Luke falling has nothing to do with anything, he wanted to defeat the dark side from within while learning its secrets, I suggest you read the comics, they're good.

Actually like the majority of Post-ROTJ material... the DE comics fekking suck.

1. Palpatine should have stayed dead... none of the this clone bullshit.

2. Luke should have never fallen to the Dark Side, that completely contradicts the movies.

3. The Storyline was horrid.

Really the DE comics suck.

Originally posted by Jonathan Mark
Actually like the majority of Post-ROTJ material... the DE comics fekking suck.

1. Palpatine should have stayed dead... none of the this clone bullshit.

2. Luke should have never fallen to the Dark Side, that completely contradicts the movies.

3. The Storyline was horrid.

Really the DE comics suck.


How do the comics contradict the movies? They are after the movies, they really have little to do with the movies... I understand you don't like it but it's your opinion, doesn't mean they contradict anything.

Indeed, considering Anakin was the Chosen One, said to destroy the Sith once and for all, and he did in ROTJ, yet DE contradicts it by bringing the Sith back, that was supposedly "destroyed" as a result of Vader.

tdtd it contradicts the prophesy.

It's not that severe, though. DE Palpatine can be considered a "fake Sith" since he was just a clone.

I do not approve what they're doing with Legacy. Bull ****ing ****. They're bringing back entirely new Sith. Not Dark Jedi, but Sith.

So much for the prophecy, eh?

Originally posted by tdtd
Let me get this straight. An Ancient Sith and Kun vs. 2 black men? Remind me how Kun isn't the first to go?

If this reason is not enough though...

Sadow seems stronger than all of them. Mace and Kar are physical beasts, and Exar Kun is no chump. However I think in brute strength I think he is the weakest link.

Tough call here. I still think the Sith will take it. It would be a funny battle though.

Originally posted by tdtd
How do the comics contradict the movies? They are after the movies, they really have little to do with the movies... I understand you don't like it but it's your opinion, doesn't mean they contradict anything.

I personally feel that DE contradicts Luke's persona when he fell. And I mean, he fell within seconds. He held out much longer in ROTJ, when he was a hell of a lot weaker than Sidious.

And at the same time DE Sidious was a hell of a lot stronger and Luke felt that he was fighting an immortal enemy did he not?

Which he shouldn't have... it's not the same body and the midi-chlorian theory totally blows away the idea of making clone bodies unless one can replicate midi-chlorians. If Sidious could do that, he didn't NEED Anakin or Luke.

Right but what's to say that Sidious didn't finally learn the technique that he talked about Darth Plagueis having? Actually we see that he DID develop the technique, whether the same one or not, to cheat death effectively, but not until somewhere in between ESB and ROTJ, when he was on Korriban first.. But of course that's an assumption of where he developed it, we just know he developed it before ROTJ.

No, there's nothing to suggest Sidious has the knowledge and again, why would he need or want Luke or Anakin if he has control over midi-chlorians and has clone bodies?

And what if the clone turned against him? Thats maybe what he might have feared. I know I would rather have a secondary leader weaker than myself, so that I wouldent have to worry about something like that.

I'm pretty sure he could make a clone obediant to him. The Kaminoans did a fine job on their own.

Yes, but the clones were programmed to follow orders from a leader I believe. I dont think Sids could make a clone obediant to him when his clone is equally as powerful as he is.

Originally posted by Janus Marius
No, there's nothing to suggest Sidious has the knowledge and again, why would he need or want Luke or Anakin if he has control over midi-chlorians and has clone bodies?

What do you mean there is nothing to suggest? He told Anakin that there was a way to cheat death, you're saying that him transferring his spirit into clones isn't that technique? Or even logically possible? And again he must have learned this technique before ROTJ and after ESB.

Originally posted by tdtd
What do you mean there is nothing to suggest? He told Anakin that there was a way to cheat death, you're saying that him transferring his spirit into clones isn't that technique? Or even logically possible? And again he must have learned this technique before ROTJ and after ESB.

Yeah, I guess a sith lord wouldn't lie to manipulate a potential recruit... cuz, he only did that with Dooku. Sidious was likely lying out of his ass.

Originally posted by Janus Marius
Yeah, I guess a sith lord wouldn't lie to manipulate a potential recruit... cuz, he only did that with Dooku. Sidious was likely lying out of his ass.
LMAO!

I like how Darth Sidious, master manipulator, is suddenly not kidding when he is speaking to Anakin and trying to convert him.

Originally posted by tdtd
Let me get this straight. An Ancient Sith and Kun vs. 2 black men? Remind me how Kun isn't the first to go?


I WAS THINKIGN THE SAME THING

Assuming that Naga's strength is in the same ballpark as Ludo's, he's got this. Ludo broke a Sith Sword with his bare hands. Probably the single most impressive display of physical strength in the SW Universe.

He smashed it on a table, yeah. I'd say Chewie literally tearing the limbs off of several Trandoshans is equally impressive.

Originally posted by Janus Marius
I like how Darth Sidious, master manipulator, is suddenly not kidding when he is speaking to Anakin and trying to convert him.

You're not understanding what I'm saying. I'm saying and this is a logical assumption, that he did not learn the technique until somewhere between ESB and ROTJ, maybe on Korriban or maybe not, but he obviously had A technique of cheating death, unless of course the DE series isn't canon.

These swords were able to withstand repeated hits from lightsabers though. I'd say that's damn hard metal.

Or enchanted by Sith alchemy.

Which made the metal really hard...

Cortosis isn't unbreakable. . .

I don't think they were made of cortosis. I think it was a regular metal that was enhanced to an extreme level of hardness by Sith Magic.

Not saying they can't, but just out of curiosity, where have the sith swords shown to be able to withstand lightsabers?

And did the Sith support their swords with their own power? Cause if they did then they could most likley disable it too...

Swords powered by Sith Alchemy were shown to withstand lightsabers, especially in Jedi Academy. Swords with Cortosis were able to with lightsabers..

I didn't see anyone with a sith sword parry a lightsaber in JA. Are you sure the swords were made of cortosis?

A cortosis blade would shut a lightsaber down on contact.

Shadday Potkin uses a cortosis blade against Vader in "Purge" and it immediatly shuts down Vader's blade.

Good thing KOTOR lightsabers are so strong then...

how would they differ from other ones, or how would they be any more effective against Cortosis than normal lightsabers. In fact, what makes them so special?

Originally posted by tdtd
how would they differ from other ones, or how would they be any more effective against Cortosis than normal lightsabers. In fact, what makes them so special?

I believe he is being sarcastic.

In KOTOR despite the fact the melee weapons are all made from cortosis somehow they never seem to short out any lightsabers.

Originally posted by kamikz
Not saying they can't, but just out of curiosity, where have the sith swords shown to be able to withstand lightsabers?

And did the Sith support their swords with their own power? Cause if they did then they could most likley disable it too...

Fall of the Sith Empire shows sith blades in the hands of Massassi and minor sith lords fighting melee with lightsabers. There's one scene I had (But I'm at work- no pics) where a sith blade repels a lightsaber directly.

Originally posted by kamikz
Not saying they can't, but just out of curiosity, where have the sith swords shown to be able to withstand lightsabers?

And did the Sith support their swords with their own power? Cause if they did then they could most likley disable it too...

It seems more than likely they supported their sith swords with more sith magic, though it's possible they may have supported it with their various trinkets. Naga Sadow's blade was empowered by some kind of lightning that was shown to flow through his gauntlets as well. I don't believe there's an "on" switch like a lightsaber.

Considering there are other scenes where the sith sword is used without any visible energy, it's very likely they can turn it off at will.

Which would explain why Ludo broke what previously went through a wall.

Originally posted by Janus Marius
Which would explain why Ludo broke what previously went through a wall.

Yeah, he shattered the material of the sword with a swing of his arm. I sure as hell wouldn't want to arm wrestle that guy.

Awesome, thanks guys.

Originally posted by Illustrious
Yeah, he shattered the material of the sword with a swing of his arm. I sure as hell wouldn't want to arm wrestle that guy.

It'd be like the Fly remake where he snaps the guy's arm, only less Goldblumish.