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who would win if this were a straight up h2h fight...they are in an abondond warehouse that has empty wooden crates all over the place...

Frank is a very good fighter and has a lot of military experience, but he can't compete with Nightwing's skills and speed.

Most of all, not with Nightwing's speed and agility. Nightwing also has better skills, but Frank has more experience, durability and he's one mean S.O.B.. I would say Nightwing takes the majority, but it's no landslide.

Nightwings not as good as Daredevil, and Frank fights on even terms with him, so I say Frank wins 6 or 7/10

Frank is a freaking monster! The guys durability and damage soak are superhuman with out a doubt. He takes damage that Dick couldn't even dream of dishing out. He'd beat Nightwing 10 times out of 10 by simple out lasting him and ontop of that I would seriously argue that he is at least as skilled a fight as Nightwing. Big mismatch.

I think this will be a close fight, but Frank will come out on top. As others have said Frank can fight the likes of Daredevil, Batman etc. On fairly even terms.

When Punisher takes on Blockbuster or Slade without weapons and can walk away then he can talk about being tough.Nightwing too good and fast plus he has massive durability and stamina.Nw 9/10

Originally posted by superbatman86
When Punisher takes on Blockbuster or Slade without weapons and can walk away then he can talk about being tough.Nightwing too good and fast plus he has massive durability and stamina.Nw 9/10

Frank took three rubber bullets point black to the face before he was knocked out budy. He once had a shotgun blast out one of his ribs was stabbed a few times he still fought one and then after he beat the guy he was fighting he tossed his body out a second story clear a cross a parking lot... then he jumped out the window himself cleared the parking lot himself and landed on the body.

Read some Punisher so you know what you're talking about.

Originally posted by superbatman86
When Punisher takes on Blockbuster or Slade without weapons and can walk away then he can talk about being tough.Nightwing too good and fast plus he has massive durability and stamina.Nw 9/10

Not saying he hasn't, but has Nightwing ever faced Slade or Blockbuster with no gadgets, weapons, or foreign objects?

Originally posted by Nightstick
Not saying he hasn't, but has Nightwing ever faced Slade or Blockbuster with no gadgets, weapons, or foreign objects?

He did recently. He was dancing around Slade pretty well. However, I would more think that Frank would grab his leg and swing him around like a baseball bat like he did to the Mongolian.

Frank 6/10

for some reason I don't image that this would be much different that DD's fights with castle which basically consist of DD kicking punisher around panal after panal...

Originally posted by Dayscribe
He did recently. He was dancing around Slade pretty well. However, I would more think that Frank would grab his leg and swing him around like a baseball bat like he did to the Mongolian.

Frank 6/10

You wouldn't happen to have scans or links for the Slade fight would you?

Originally posted by Nightstick
You wouldn't happen to have scans or links for the Slade fight would you?

I saw it in the Ins and Outs of Slade Wilson thread. Willrules posted it.

Originally posted by jinzin
for some reason I don't image that this would be much different that DD's fights with castle which basically consist of DD kicking punisher around panal after panal...

The most recent DD/Pun fight I can think of is in Means and Ends(Punisher vs Daredevil) in which the Punisher more or less gave as good as he got.

Originally posted by jinzin
for some reason I don't image that this would be much different that DD's fights with castle which basically consist of DD kicking punisher around panal after panal...

Daredevil is what NW would be if he had a) superhuman senses b) had peak human strength and c) was a much better fighter. Matt has way more going for him then Dick does and Frank still holds his own.

Originally posted by Nightstick
The most recent DD/Pun fight I can think of is in Means and Ends(Punisher vs Daredevil) in which the Punisher more or less gave as good as he got. Yup...frank and dd were pretty much even and frank was even on top for a while...i will have to disagree with u jin, but frank has taken on dd and held his own for quite some time now...granted frank has taken a few beatings and dd has come out on top, but lets go back to when they first fought...the only shot dd got on frank was a cheap one with a billy club and a follow up kick, frank kicked his ass from there on...and even in the next iss...dd had to shoot frank just to keep him down...and they have fought since then and frank has put up a good fight every time, only time when he doesn't is when he is luring dd into a trap...nightwing cant put up nearly as good of fight as frank does against dd...

Originally posted by jgiant
Yup...frank and dd were pretty much even and frank was even on top for a while...i will have to disagree with u jin, but frank has taken on dd and held his own for quite some time now...granted frank has taken a few beatings and dd has come out on top, but lets go back to when they first fought...the only shot dd got on frank was a cheap one with a billy club and a follow up kick, frank kicked his ass from there on...and even in the next iss...dd had to shoot frank just to keep him down...and they have fought since then and frank has put up a good fight every time, only time when he doesn't is when he is luring dd into a trap...nightwing cant put up nearly as good of fight as frank does against dd...

to my knowledge dd has a winning record.. not to mention the fact that frank has admitted on at least two occasions that he doesn't stand as chance against dd...

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Daredevil is what NW would be if he had a) superhuman senses b) had peak human strength and c) was a much better fighter. Matt has way more going for him then Dick does and Frank still holds his own.
does he not have peak human strength?
fighting ability I'd say is debatable as well...

Nightwing win's this.

Originally posted by jinzin
to my knowledge dd has a winning record.. not to mention the fact that frank has admitted on at least two occasions that he doesn't stand as chance against dd...


does he not have peak human strength?
fighting ability I'd say is debatable as well... I said dd has the majority, but u fail to mention how punisher has kicked dd's ass before and how he is able to hang with him and even give dd an ass whoopin...so what u are saying is that nightwing can beat dd, or give dd more of a beating than frank does...

Originally posted by jinzin
does he not have peak human strength?
fighting ability I'd say is debatable as well...

No he doesn't have peak human strength. He has peak human speed and agility. Batman has peak human strength while he doesn't have peak human speed or agility. You would need to combine Batman and Nightwing into one package to get one Daredevil.

And if Daredevil isn't as skilled as Batman (which he is) he is defiantly close which means he is better then Nightwing.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Frank took three rubber bullets point black to the face before he was knocked out budy. He once had a shotgun blast out one of his ribs was stabbed a few times he still fought one and then after he beat the guy he was fighting he tossed his body out a second story clear a cross a parking lot... then he jumped out the window himself cleared the parking lot himself and landed on the body.

Read some Punisher so you know what you're talking about.
Well seeing as as both Slade and Blockbuster hit harder than rubber bullets that feat means nothing.Nightwing doesn't get as hurt as much as Punisher because he's better than him.He needs that toughness because he doesn't have the skill not to get hurt.And fighting slade is more immpressive than surving getting shot.

This fight is 50/50 IMO

the guy impresses DS on a daily basis. They're like archfoes. and DD doesn't have peak strength he is strong but not peak.

bump.

Originally posted by Superherovandal
the guy impresses DS on a daily basis. They're like archfoes. and DD doesn't have peak strength he is strong but not peak.

DD can deadlift > 800lbs. he's peak human in strength, don't confuse peak human with Captain America who can deadlift in excess of 1000lbs, Cap is super human, DD is Prolly one of the top unenhanced peak humas in marvel along with Elektra and to a slightly lesser extent Punisher.

Punisher.

My vote goes for the guy who fights Deathstroke h2h like every weekend, also ive never seen Punisher, say beat the crap outta 5-6 armed men with his bare hands after getting ambushed and without getting shot once. NW definitely's got a speed and agility advantage, strength probably, and definitely skills. Frank's got durability and experience. I say NW 6-7/10.

Originally posted by SamZED
My votwe goes for a guy who fights Deathstroke h2h, also ive never seen Punisher, say beat the crap outta 5-6 armed men with his bare hands after getting ambushed and without getting shot once.

Hes been attacked by 9 people beat up 6 and the last three decided to back off. He then got rushed by 7 guys and beat them up. Punisher also fought Daken with a broken leg and Kraven both are superhuman martial artists.

Originally posted by SamZED

NW definitely's got a speed and agility advantage, strength probably, and definitely skills. Frank's got durability and experience. I say NW 6-7/10.

Its not enough to make a difference.

Originally posted by Deadline
Punisher also fought Daken with a broken leg

To be fair on that he fought Daken with a gun and blew him up with a bomb

Originally posted by Parmaniac
To be fair on that he fought Daken with a gun and blew him up with a bomb

So you think the fact that his leg was broken and was already wounded and tired from fighting The Hood might level things out a bit?

Originally posted by Deadline
So you think the fact that his leg was broken and was already wounded and tired from fighting The Hood might level things out a bit?

It was still impressive BUT I don't think that it could be used as an argument in a H2H encounter, too much circumstances IMO like you said Pun was exhausted and injured but then again he was armed

Originally posted by Parmaniac
It was still impressive BUT I don't think that it could be used as an argument in a H2H encounter,

Then why was there a significant amount of h2h then?

Originally posted by Parmaniac

too much circumstances IMO like you said Pun was exhausted and injured but then again he was armed

The bomb and the guns made it a fair fight and did not give Punisher an unfair advantage. He was fighting a fully fit Daken who has superhuman stats and a HF that heals from gunshots and bombs and supersharp claws.

To point out that he had a gun and a bomb when he had a broken leg and bleeding wounds that he had to bandage up before the fight is ridicluous. Not only that he looked physically and mentally ****ed before the fight (he had just burnt his family alive). Punisher was a mess.

Originally posted by Deadline
Hes been attacked by 9 people beat up 6 and the last three decided to back off. He then got rushed by 7 guys and beat them up. Punisher also fought Daken with a broken leg and Kraven both are superhuman martial artists. They all had guns and he didn't get tagged once or hurt? Also, lets be honest Daken wasn't exactly going all out, he was enjoying himself, I know who Frank fought, whom he beat, but overall NW has got more advantages over him where it matters the most. So I say he takes majority.

Nightwing.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Nightwing.

6/10 either way, if Frank can throw down with Murdock, he can certainly hang here

NW

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
No he doesn't have peak human strength. He has peak human speed and agility. Batman has peak human strength while he doesn't have peak human speed or agility. You would need to combine Batman and Nightwing into one package to get one Daredevil.

And if Daredevil isn't as skilled as Batman (which he is) he is defiantly close which means he is better then Nightwing.
I don't remember Daredevil being peak human..
He does, however, have superhuman speed and agility.

And no, Daredevil is NOT as skilled as Batman. Never was, never will be.


As for the fight, as skilled(?) as Punisher is, he's not getting the better of NW.
NW fights Deathstroke on a consistent basis, and even has some wins..
Are we to say that Punisher stands a chance against Deathstroke, in a MELEE encounter? I don't think so.

only when pun pulls a hidden knife from his boot in close combat while NW has the dominating position

Originally posted by -Pr-
Nightwing.

Grayson for the majority, though Castle can probably get some wins here and there.

NW wins.

Originally posted by SamZED
They all had guns and he didn't get tagged once or hurt?


No when he got attacked by 9 guys but they didnt have guns. However its a moot point because

Originally posted by SamZED

Also, lets be honest Daken wasn't exactly going all out, he was enjoying himself,

That excuse could be applied to when he fought Wolverine as well. When you're enjoying yourself you tend not to swear and scream in agony.

rraaaagggrghhh = not enjoying yourself.


Originally posted by SamZED

I know who Frank fought, whom he beat, but overall NW has got more advantages over him where it matters the most. So I say he takes majority.

No you dont, except you havent proven that these advantages would help.

nightwing

Originally posted by Deadline


That excuse could be applied to when he fought Wolverine as well. When you're enjoying yourself you tend not to swear and scream in agony.

rraaaagggrghhh = not enjoying yourself.




Not so true, for one sabre-tooth makes noises like that all the time and enjoys him self in most every battle. Also Daken made a niose like once for a second and was mocking Punisher the entire time.....mocking does not scream trying nor does he not using his pheramones......


Also why does this one encounter equal>>>>over NW? I mean he was stabbed within seconds of the fight while being mocked, but his crazy ass damage soak allowed him to keep it up, not to mention it was his death. I mean anyone else realize that of course during ones death there going to make him look the best he can? I mean they don't normally let hero's go out on low notes you know?

This part below is more to the general thread as a whole.

but asside from this that was aveyr impressive showing for Punisher. Nothing should be taken away from him. He put up one hell of a fight. Now Punisher damage soak is insane. NW will be battering him, but will it matter when some one has insane damage soak? Can NW advantages in fighting skill off set Punisher willingness to do anything and fight dirty? Can his speed of set Punisher strength? Can his agility counter his damage soak? I dont know to be honest.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Not so true, for one sabre-tooth makes noises like that all the time and enjoys him self in most every battle.


Hes an exception to the rule. Daken isn't Sabretooth and you can could clearly see that Punisher was pissing off Daken.

Pissed off = not enjoying yourself.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Also Daken made a niose like once for a second

Please read the issue and im having to constantly correct you about what happened in Punisher fights.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

and was mocking Punisher the entire time.....mocking does not scream trying nor does he not using his pheramones......


He does that often, doesn't mean that somehow Daken was easier to fight. The writer might have forgotten about the pheremones but its actually possible he could resist them see the Punisher annual.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Also why does this one encounter equal>>>>over NW? I mean he was stabbed within seconds of the fight while being mocked, but his crazy ass damage soak allowed him to keep it up, not to mention it was his death. I mean anyone else realize that of course during ones death there going to make him look the best he can? I mean they don't normally let hero's go out on low notes you know?

I already gave other examples.

Please stop making excuses hes got enough showings to indicate he can pull that shit off.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

but asside from this that was aveyr impressive showing for Punisher. Nothing should be taken away from him. He put up one hell of a fight. Now Punisher damage soak is insane. NW will be battering him, but will it matter when some one has insane damage soak? Can NW advantages in fighting skill off set Punisher willingness to do anything and fight dirty? Can his speed of set Punisher strength? Can his agility counter his damage soak? I dont know to be honest.

NW isn't going to be able to put him down. NWs speed isn't enough to give him an advantage. See Punishers fights with Daken, Deadpool, Kraven and his fight with Spiderman in his annual (not h2h but Punisher showed good reflexes).

Originally posted by AsbestosFlaygon


And no, Daredevil is NOT as skilled as Batman. Never was, never will be.

Care to prove it. Certainly enough proof to say he would beat NW.

Originally posted by AsbestosFlaygon


As for the fight, as skilled(?) as Punisher is, he's not getting the better of NW.

Could you care to bring any evidence instead of making points without backing them up?

Originally posted by AsbestosFlaygon

NW fights Deathstroke on a consistent basis, and even has some wins..
Are we to say that Punisher stands a chance against Deathstroke, in a MELEE encounter? I don't think so.

I dont even think thats true. Punisher has stalemated people that could either beat or stalemate DS. So yes he most certainly does.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
He was enjoying him self in the beginning of the fight, he got pissed after he got his lipp ripped off, and then shot. He then start again enjoying himself near the end of the fight.


Exactly your picking and choosing what happened to the MIDDLE.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

I have read it many times and just read it again. He only made that nioise once when he got his lip bitten off and then made a little niose when he got shoot (weirdly enough far far far far less of a niose go figure it always the small places that hurt the most).

Im pretty sure he said rarrrrggghh when he got punched in the eye. Either way your trying to downplay the feat.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

It does make him easier to fight, his pheramones make him far more dangerous though you are right they have been leaving them out in team matches.

Hes still very dangerous, it would be like fighting Wolverine.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

No it not possible I read that issue. Seem to be more will power then anything, which Punisher has in spades. He won’t be able to resist chemical changes in his body unless now he has a new superpower lol.


Im not saying its a foregone conclusion but its possible. He resisted mind control and yes he can resist chemical changes in his body and has done so.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

find this statement odd given the fact you been saying DR Punisher is some new beast physically.

No the statement not odd it seems you misunderstand the point im making.



Originally posted by Battlehammer

NW could put him down will he? I don’t know. You may be right about the speed he be landing more but will it be enough? Seen them except Kraven one, what issue is that?


Thats the one where he fought Tiger Shark, Mandrill and ran from Swarm and Gargoyle before fighting Kraven.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Annual fight you mean when spiderman mind all messed up and he BFR Punisher?

His mind wasn't messed mindcontrol made him bloodlusted. Thats one example he showed good agility and speed in other examples.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Deadpool? You mean whena rep Punisher gets beat and then ambush DP at his house with a sword?

Nope they fight h2h later on in the series.

Originally posted by Deadline
Exactly your picking and choosing what happened to the MIDDLE.


Not at all I fully admit he was mad in the middle of the fight right after his he gott shot.

Originally posted by Deadline

Im pretty sure he said rarrrrggghh when he got punched in the eye. Either way your trying to downplay the feat.


No I was just proving I read the issue.

Originally posted by Deadline

Hes still very dangerous, it would be like fighting Wolverine.


Be like fighting a Wolverine light, but still very dangerous to say the least.

Originally posted by Deadline


Im not saying its a foregone conclusion but its possible. He resisted mind control and yes he can resist chemical changes in his body and has done so.


Wolverine done the same yet could do nothing against it, hell Skaar could tell he was beign effected but could do nothing to stop it, it strech and a large one to assume he could resist them.

Originally posted by Deadline

No the statement not odd it seems you didnt understand the point im making.

Originally posted by Deadline


Thats the one where he fought Tiger Shark, Mandrill and ran from Swarm and Gargoyle before fighting Kraven.

Do you remember the issue number? I like to give it a read. Though it must not be the same issue as the tiger shark one I have read it.



His mind wasn't messed mindcontrol made him bloodlusted. Thats one example he should good agility and speed in other examples.


Originally posted by Deadline


Nope they fight h2h later on in the series.
Do you recall the issue number?

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Not at all I fully admit he was mad in the middle of the fight right after his he gott shot.


No I was just proving I read the issue.


Ok fair enough. Its was also impressive that Pun was able to defend himself somewhat against Daken when he jumped him when you think of the conidtion he was in.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Be like fighting a Wolverine light, but still very dangerous to say the least.

..ok.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Wolverine done the same yet could do nothing against it, hell Skaar could tell he was beign effected but could do nothing to stop it, it strech and a large one to assume he could resist them.

Yeah except the mindcontrol worked on Spiderman just fine, not sure if Wolverines willpower is vastly better than Spidermans.



Originally posted by Battlehammer

Do you remember the issue number? I like to give it a read. Though it must not be the same issue as the tiger shark one I have read it.

Yeah it is, if not its the one after.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

Do you recall the issue number?

Heres the fight.

http://h.imagehost.org/view/0089/suicide8
http://h.imagehost.org/view/0494/suicide9
http://h.imagehost.org/view/0901/suicide10
http://h.imagehost.org/view/0701/suicide11

Originally posted by Deadline
No when he got attacked by 9 guys but they didnt have guns. However its a moot point because
because what? How's it a moot point 9 unarmed guys does NOT = 6 guys armed with guns. Eddie Brock beat the crap outta 6-7 guys with knives and chains and im not ready to put him on NW's level in fighting skills or speed.

Originally posted by Deadline

That excuse could be applied to when he fought Wolverine as well. When you're enjoying yourself you tend not to swear and scream in agony.

rraaaagggrghhh = not enjoying yourself.
No it can't. He didn't even use pheromones, he used them when he fought Wolverine like 3 times, when he fought Deadpool, when he fought Spider-man etc but not with Frank so yeah he wasn't going all out not even close and getting stabbed or shot is a joke for a guy with such HF even if he screams "aargh", also Frank didn't match him in h2h fight he simply lasted long enough, so bringing this up doesn't prove your point.


Originally posted by Deadline

No you dont That's a lame responce. Yes, I do, and btw i have read the Kraven fight as well.

Originally posted by Deadline

except you havent proven that these advantages would help. Didn't know I have to, the guy is faster, stronger, more agile, has better reflexes and a more skilled fighter and this is a h2h fight, how these advantages would be of no help in this particular scenario?

Close fight, but I'm leaning towards Nightwing.

Originally posted by SamZED
because what? How's it a moot point 9 unarmed guys does NOT = 6 guys armed with guns. Eddie Brock beat the crap outta 6-7 guys with knives and chains and im not ready to put him on NW's level in fighting skills or speed .

Its moot because Daken, Deadpool, and Kraven all have genuine superhuman speed and Punisher didn't have trouble hitting them.

Originally posted by SamZED

No it can't. He didn't even use pheromones, he used them when he fought Wolverine like 3 times, when he fought Deadpool, when he fought Spider-man etc but not with Frank so yeah he wasn't going all out not even close and getting stabbed or shot is a joke for a guy with such HF even if he screams "aargh", also Frank didn't match him in h2h fight he simply lasted long enough, so bringing this up doesn't prove your point.

Um some writers actually forget that he has pehermones. Daken was also clearly pissed off.

Of course it doesn't Punisher had a broken leg and had bandaged wounds that were bleeding before the fight. The previous day he had burnt his family to death and was that had scarred him emotionally as well.



Originally posted by SamZED

That's a lame responce. Yes, I do, and btw i have read the Kraven fight as well.

Yeah so what?

Originally posted by SamZED

Didn't know I have to, the guy is faster, stronger, more agile, has better reflexes and a more skilled fighter and this is a h2h fight, how these advantages would be of no help in this particular scenario?

Its moot because Daken, Deadpool, and Kraven all have genuine superhuman speed and Punisher didn't have trouble hitting them. Prove hes a better fighter, hes more agile done mean hes better at h2h.

Originally posted by Deadline
Its moot because Daken, Deadpool, and Kraven all have genuine superhuman speed and Punisher didn't have trouble hitting them.
ABC logic, not the best one. Deathstroke has fought Flash many times before, doesn't put him on his speed level, if we talk speed we go by speed feats and NW's > Frank's, so ill concider him to be faster and he's definitely A LOT better at dodging. Either way, I do not care about this fight enough to turn it into a long debate with huge posts. IMHO - NW 6-7/10 in a h2h fight. Frank 7-8/10 if he's allowed to use guns. With prep Punisher in a stomp. Feel free to agree or disagree.

Originally posted by SamZED
ABC logic, not the best one. Deathstroke has fought Flash many times before, doesn't put him on his speed level, if we talk speed we go by speed feats and NW's > Frank's, so ill concider him to be faster and he's definitely A LOT better at dodging. Either way, I do not care about this fight enough to turn it into a long debate with huge posts. IMHO - NW 6-7/10 in a h2h fight. Frank 7-8/10 if he's allowed to use guns. With prep Punisher in a stomp. Feel free to agree or disagree.

You're using ABC logic yourself and then telling me ABC logic is not the best to use. facepalm

Frank has battled refined (or more refined) opponents like Nightwing. And it still is NEVER a sure thing.

Don't underestimate Dick Grayson. But it's easier and more ignorant to underestimate Frank Castle.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Frank has battled refined (or more refined) opponents like Nightwing. And it still is NEVER a sure thing.

Yeah but thats ABC logic.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

Don't underestimate Dick Grayson. But it's easier and more ignorant to underestimate Frank Castle.

Seriously though I see NW much like DD but the way Remenders written Frank NW just won't be able to put him down.

I shoiuld just hurry up and finish the respect thread.

Originally posted by Deadline
Yeah but thats ABC logic.

Seriously though I see NW much like DD but the way Remenders written Frank NW just won't be able to put him down.

I shoiuld just hurry up and finish the respect thread. No, it's not just ABC logic. It's just dispelling that Punisher is merely a brawler and can't hang with highly skilled/refined opponents.

Really? Because that's one that I was working on along with the Guy Gardner thread. I won't try to step on your toes, if you're in a highly developed stage...

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
No, it's not just ABC logic. It's just dispelling that Punisher is merely a brawler and can't hang with highly skilled/refined opponents.

I was joking.


Originally posted by OneDumbG0

Really?

For real.

Originally posted by Deadline
For real. How far along are you with the Respect Thread?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Because that's one that I was working on along with the Guy Gardner thread.

I look forward to that one

Originally posted by AsbestosFlaygon

And no, Daredevil is NOT as skilled as Batman. Never was, never will be.



grow up!

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
How far along are you with the Respect Thread?

I've done alot. The annoying thing is that I had alot of scans saved on a flash drive and the ****ing thing stopped working. So I've had to start from scratch again.. I still got alot to do but if I really knuckle down I could finish it next week.

^ Good luck, dude. Let us know how we can contribute.

In the meantime, don't underestimate Frank Castle.

Originally posted by Deadline
You're using ABC logic yourself and then telling me ABC logic is not the best to use. facepalm i brought up bullet dodging feats and random display of speed and that doesnt = abc logic. Bringing up daredevil and kraven who had like 3 appearances to prove a point does.

Originally posted by SamZED
i brought up bullet dodging feats and random display of speed and that doesnt = abc logic. Bringing up daredevil and kraven who had like 3 appearances to prove a point does.

You brought up DS thats blantant ABC logic. NW fights DS therefore NW wins. ABC Fing logic.

Originally posted by SamZED
My vote goes for the guy who fights Deathstroke h2h like every weekend,.

Nightwing

Originally posted by Deadline
You brought up DS thats blantant ABC logic. NW fights DS therefore NW wins. ABC Fing logic. except i didnt use it as an argument in a debate to prove a point about speed, simply mentioned it before you quoted me and started the actual debate, after u did that i brought up a random display of speed that frank cant match to prove a point thats how its done in a vs forum, while u said it somehow proves nothing and brought an abc example as your only argument.

nightwing