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The Bible teaches that Jesus created all things. What do you say?


"He (God the Father) has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son (Jesus) of His love, in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. He (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. FOR BY HIM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, AND IN HIM ALL THINGS CONSIST."

Colossians 1:13-17

I say no.

Originally posted by Alliance
I say no.

Come on, give us a quote from your "holy" book.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Come on, give us a quote from your "holy" book.
Is there a book of logic?

Originally posted by Alliance
Is there a book of logic?

No wonder you are so... you. You don't have a holy book. You had better get to the library.

Library=Temple...but the closes one has 3 million volumes and I cant read them all.

Originally posted by Alliance
Library=Temple...but the closes one has 3 million volumes and I cant read them all.

Buddhists have that same problem. I have about 20 books on my to read list.

I have a bookshelf full...I just try to plow though them!

what problems we have...

The term translated into God for the creation in Genesis is "'elohiym"

'elohiym

Definition
(plural)
rulers, judges
divine ones
angels
gods
(plural intensive - singular meaning)
god, goddess
godlike one
works or special possessions of God
the (true) God
God

eyhl) is the plural form of hhwl) which definition is simply

1. God
or
2. False God

Imo it is possible that the term in Genesis refers to more than one God, thus Jesus Christ, and we believe other beings, assisted God the Father in the creation.

We also believe that God the Father directed or managed creation, and Christ did the actual creating with aid from angels.

There is a problem that Hebrew speakers will, at times, use the plural to designate greatness or majesty. So it is entirely possible that the Genesis account is referring to one entity.

or Genesis could refer to a pantheon

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
The Bible teaches that Jesus created all things. What do you say?


"He (God the Father) has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son (Jesus) of His love, in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. He (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. FOR BY HIM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, AND IN HIM ALL THINGS CONSIST."

Colossians 1:13-17 Well first you have to have some concrete proof that he was the creator..........If there was, then I'd believe it............Just because of the verse that says "And the Word was god, and became flesh" doesn't mean that we should worship him........He could of been a messenger for all we know (which is possible)...........As for someone or something creating the invisible.......yes, I do believe there are things, or what ever you want to call it in the invisible.............Quantum physics says so............and in knowing this?????????????????? Does this prove there is SOMETHING??

^ or it could be a reflection of people's beliefs, at the time, and have nothing to do with what really happened. The truth in the bible is not literal.

Sciences need to be blended.

religion needs to submit

resistance is futile

Originally posted by Regret
resistance is futile

resistance to what?

the Borg of course ....science

ick...startrek

lol, yeah I know, couldn't help it though your:

Originally posted by Alliance
religion needs to submit

seemed to beg for it.

when people change their sigs I temporarily get confused who they are...didn't even relaize it was you.

Originally posted by Alliance
when people change their sigs I temporarily get confused who they are...didn't even relaize it was you.

I have the same problem.

Originally posted by Alliance
when people change their sigs I temporarily get confused who they are...didn't even relaize it was you.

Sorry a friend of mine is looking them over, going to settle on one soon. She wants to decide on one that she thinks'll suit me.

edit: lol, went through all that, and she liked this one the best

Borg!!! Cool!!

Originally posted by Alliance
Is there a book of logic? No..................that is what our minds is for.

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
The Bible teaches that Jesus created all things. What do you say?


"He (God the Father) has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son (Jesus) of His love, in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. He (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. FOR BY HIM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, AND IN HIM ALL THINGS CONSIST."

Colossians 1:13-17

Who created the bible then and gave it to us?

The church TA DA!!

Originally posted by TheSpinner
Who created the bible then and gave it to us?

Man did.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Man did.

Wow!

44 Authors with some spaning 1000s of years apart and yet as if all 66 books contained in the bible were written by 1 Author? Purpose, sequence and meaning.

Man is more incredible than I could ever imagine!! The odds of this is a simple miracle! Incredible genious of human nature!!!

Congrats Constantine..................* he takes a bow*

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
Wow!

44 Authors with some spaning 1000s of years apart and yet as if all 66 books contained in the bible were written by 1 Author? Purpose, sequence and meaning.

Man is more incredible than I could ever imagine!! The odds of this is a simple miracle! Incredible genious of human nature!!!

You are making an assumption. You assume that the meaning that you place in the bible is the same meaning as the people who wrote it. Also, there should only be one type of Christian church if that was the case. The facts are that there are more interpretations of the bible then there are people who wrote it.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You are making an assumption. You assume that the meaning that you place in the bible is the same meaning as the people who wrote it. Also, there should only be one type of Christian church if that was the case. The facts are that there are more interpretations of the bible then there are people who wrote it.

Common Shaky, you appeared to be a sharper crayon in the box.
The point had nothing to do with interpretation but unity in it's overall context.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Man did.

And how much does man know about the real creator? to write a book about him? or is it 44?

Originally posted by Regret
The term translated into God for the creation in Genesis is "'elohiym"

'elohiym

Definition
(plural)
rulers, judges
divine ones
angels
gods
(plural intensive - singular meaning)
god, goddess
godlike one
works or special possessions of God
the (true) God
God

eyhl) is the plural form of hhwl) which definition is simply

1. God
or
2. False God

Imo it is possible that the term in Genesis refers to more than one God, thus Jesus Christ, and we believe other beings, assisted God the Father in the creation.

We also believe that God the Father directed or managed creation, and Christ did the actual creating with aid from angels.

There is a problem that Hebrew speakers will, at times, use the plural to designate greatness or majesty. So it is entirely possible that the Genesis account is referring to one entity. Or that maybe we are all part of the living creation but told as in a mythical story....We are always becoming, just as "I AM's" better translation mean "I am becoming"..

Originally posted by debbiejo
Congrats Constantine..................* he takes a bow*

clapping

Too bad you f*cked over my Empire!!!!!11111

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
The Bible teaches that Jesus created all things. What do you say?

"He (God the Father) has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son (Jesus) of His love, in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. He (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. FOR BY HIM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, AND IN HIM ALL THINGS CONSIST."

Colossians 1:13-17

* common misinterpretation...

"For in him were all things created , in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him , and unto him;
and he is before all things, and in him all things consist."
Colossians 1:16-17

* all things are created through Christ and in Christ...

"Yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things , and we unto him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things , and we through him."
I Corinthians 8:6

* it was the Father who created all things, and upon creation, all things are created through Christ...

"All things were made through him ; and without him was not anything made that hath been made."
John 1:3

* see?

"The God that made the world and all things therein , he, being Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;"
The Acts 17:24

* the Father is the Creator of all things...

Originally posted by debbiejo
Well first you have to have some concrete proof that he was the creator..........If there was, then I'd believe it............Just because of the verse that says "And the Word was god, and became flesh" doesn't mean that we should worship him........He could of been a messenger for all we know (which is possible)...........As for someone or something creating the invisible.......yes, I do believe there are things, or what ever you want to call it in the invisible.............Quantum physics says so............and in knowing this?????????????????? Does this prove there is SOMETHING??

"Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
Jesus saith unto him, Because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed ."
John 20:28-29

* seems appropriate...

Originally posted by TheSpinner
Who created the bible then and gave it to us?

1st. Century Apostles: Peter wrote/

" For we did not follow cunningly devised fables when we made know to you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Chrsit, but were eyewitnesses of His majesty."

2 Peter 1:16


"For prophesy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit."

2 Peter 1:21

Have you ever found the bible hypocritical? Like someone saying "They make stuff up...I speak the truth" (As "I" is making stuff up)

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
The Bible teaches that Jesus created all things. What do you say?


"He (God the Father) has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son (Jesus) of His love, in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. He (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. FOR BY HIM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, AND IN HIM ALL THINGS CONSIST."

Colossians 1:13-17 jesus is a part of God, and God created the earth.

Originally posted by peejayd
* common misinterpretation...

"For in him were all things created , in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him , and unto him;
and he is before all things, and in him all things consist."
Colossians 1:16-17

* all things are created through Christ and in Christ...

"Yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things , and we unto him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things , and we through him."
I Corinthians 8:6

* it was the Father who created all things, and upon creation, all things are created through Christ...

"All things were made through him ; and without him was not anything made that hath been made."
John 1:3

* see?

"The God that made the world and all things therein , he, being Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;"
The Acts 17:24

* the Father is the Creator of all things...



"Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
Jesus saith unto him, Because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed ."
John 20:28-29

* seems appropriate...

Good point, but all the same when we have a trinitarian God.


Jesus said, "I and My Father are one."

John 10:30


Philip said to him, "Show us the Father and it is sufficient for us".

And Jesus said to Him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not KNOW ME, Philip? he who has seen me HAS SEEN THE FATHER; so how can you say, Show us the Father?"

John 14:8-9

Originally posted by Regret

Are we to say that we are God, since this verse states that Man is also the image of God?

No, we are not to say that we are God or can become God. This was the first and greatest deception:


Then the serpent (Satan) said to the woman, "You will not surey die.
For God knows that in the day that you eat of it your eyes will be opened and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

Genesis 3:4-5

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
No, we are not to say that we are God or can become God. This was the first and greatest deception:


Then the serpent (Satan) said to the woman, "You will not surey die.
For God knows that in the day that you eat of it your eyes will be opened and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

Genesis 3:4-5


Was it a deception? If Adam and Eve did not know good and evil before they ate the fruit, then they did become like God, and knew good and evil. Temptation doesn't have to be a lie to get men to do evil. The sin wasn't in wanting to be like God, the sin was in doing what God had told them not to do.

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
Good point, but all the same when we have a trinitarian God.

Jesus said, "I and My Father are one."

John 10:30

* one in what?

"And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are ."
John 17:11

* united as one... here's another point...

"The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God ."
John 10:33

* They are one because the Father is God, and Christ as His Son, is also a God...

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
Philip said to him, "Show us the Father and it is sufficient for us".

And Jesus said to Him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not KNOW ME, Philip? he who has seen me HAS SEEN THE FATHER; so how can you say, Show us the Father?"

John 14:8-9

* "... he that hath seen me hath seen the Father...", yes...

"Who is the image of the invisible God , the firstborn of every creature:"
Colossians 1:15

* Christ is the image of the invisible God... because no human being can see God...

"No man hath seen God at any time ; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him."
John 1:18

"Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see : to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen."
I Timothy 6:16

"And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live ."
Exodus 33:20

* being that, it completely destroys the Trinitarian doctrine...

"Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I ."
John 14:28

* Christ said, the Father is greater than Him...

Originally posted by peejayd

* They are one because the Father is God, and Christ as His Son, is also a God...




So the Father is a God and His Son Christ is another God? Is this a typo peejayd?

Originally posted by Regret
Was it a deception? If Adam and Eve did not know good and evil before they ate the fruit, then they did become like God, and knew good and evil. Temptation doesn't have to be a lie to get men to do evil. The sin wasn't in wanting to be like God, the sin was in doing what God had told them not to do. How is one to know what is not right?

Does one kill their children and all of there children's children for eternity because of one child's disobedience...........I seems people are more compassionate than god....

Originally posted by Regret
Was it a deception? If Adam and Eve did not know good and evil before they ate the fruit, then they did become like God, and knew good and evil. Temptation doesn't have to be a lie to get men to do evil. The sin wasn't in wanting to be like God, the sin was in doing what God had told them not to do.

So where are you going here? If you are saying they are "gods" then I will get back to you in a day or two. Is that what your saying here?

w00t WOOT CLONES! w00t

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
So the Father is a God and His Son Christ is another God? Is this a typo peejayd?

* nope... the Only Begotten Son of God is a God... it would be somewhat ridiculous for a God to have a human as an offspring... the offspring of a God is also a God; the offspring of a human is also a human; the offspring of an animal is also an animal... am i right?

then how come when a god and a mortal get together...their offspring is a mortal.

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
So Jesus isn't God? Hello is anybody out there?

Christ is God. Christ is not God the father. God the Father is not Christ.

If Christ is God the Father then he was, at best misleading when he taught about the Father, at worst he was lying. I do not believe be was either. Thus Christ and God the Father are not a single entity, but two distinct beings. What, in the Bible, suggests otherwise?

Originally posted by Regret
Christ is God. Christ is not God the father. God the Father is not Christ.

If Christ is God the Father then he was, at best misleading when he taught about the Father, at worst he was lying. I do not believe be was either. Thus Christ and God the Father are not a single entity, but two distinct beings. (What, in the Bible, suggests otherwise?)

Jesus said, " Have I been with you so long and yet you have not known Me Philip? (He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, "Show us the Father?"

John 14:9

"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given; and the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called, Wonderful, Councelor, (Mighty God), (Everlasting Father), Prince of Peace."

Isaiah 9:6-7

Any questions?

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
Jesus said, " Have I been with you so long and yet you have not known Me Philip? (He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, "Show us the Father?"

John 14:9

"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given; and the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called, Wonderful, Councelor, (Mighty God), (Everlasting Father), Prince of Peace."

Isaiah 9:6-7

Any questions?

Sorry about the length of those two. I am not knowldegable to properly rebut, as such I have quoted a response to your references.

Originally posted by Alliance
then how come when a god and a mortal get together...their offspring is a mortal.

* Biblically, there are no instance such as you stated... in Greek/Roman myth, yes but they are called demi-gods, right?

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
Jesus said, " Have I been with you so long and yet you have not known Me Philip? (He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, "Show us the Father?"

John 14:9

* it is because Christ is the image of God, i've given the verses... also, a bunch of verses was given by mr.regret...

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given; and the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called, Wonderful, Councelor, (Mighty God), (Everlasting Father), Prince of Peace."

Isaiah 9:6-7

Any questions?

* Christ is a Mighty God and an Everlasting Father, but that does not mean Christ is also the Father... it would imply that the Father is also Christ...

"Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning ."
James 1:17

* the Father cannot change, and guess what? Christ changed! John 1:14 says the Word was manifested in the flesh...

"While we wait for the blessed hope - the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ ,"
Titus 2:13

"Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours:"
II Peter 1:1

* Saint Paul and Saint Peter addressed Christ as our God and Savior...

"But thou, Beth-lehem Ephrathah, which art little to be among the thousands of Judah, out of thee shall one come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth are from of old, from everlasting ."
Micah 5:2

"I was set up from everlasting , from the beginning, Before the earth was."
Proverbs 8:23

* Christ was from everlasting...

* and Christ's father figure was depicted here:

"Jesus therefore saith unto them, Children , have ye aught to eat? They answered him, No."
John 21:5

* so, the prophecy of Isaiah was really fulfilled by Christ... every single bit of prophecies concerning Christ...

Does anything kill a thread faster than endless bible quotes?

lol, sorry.

That is why I had that other thread started to attack Joseph Smith. That one will probably be filled with long posts.

Originally posted by Alliance
then how come when a god and a mortal get together...their offspring is a mortal. Good question!!

I'm so scholarly...