Phoenix Force vs a Multiversal Power......Phoenix get's Crushed!

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Mr Master
I made this thread as a clear message..

Phoenix is not what you all thought she was.

Phoenix is in fact nothing more than a Universal Force, and beyond that...she's nothing.

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
From what i can see you have horribly misinterpreted the scans and are presenting them falsely.

Oh we're going to see who is presenting scans falsely my friend. I'm going to make you swallow that accusation.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
LT offered SS a moment of godhood he said he was going to connect him to the infinite. Thats all he said. Your analysis is pure supposition. He gave him temporary omniscience.( look it up

I did look it up.
And with on panel proof we're going to see what is considered "Godhood"?
To YOU...Godhood is temporary omniscience, nothing more.

To Marvel Godhood is this:
Godhood means to have power over all that is in the universe-Thanos(IG)
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/3171/igequalgodhood3vc.th.jpg
If you won't take Thanos's word for it, perhaps UATU's will suffice.
http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/536/igisgodhood28rv.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
As for how LT fares against the IG the argument. You are completely unsupported in saying LT is greater than the IG. You have brought nothing new to the table to make the counter-argument

Evidently I did, as I always knew I had.
Finally the New Living Tribunal bio is here and there it clarifies for us that indeed, "LT's power serpassed that of Gems."
Ofcourse I already said this but you bone heads were to stubborn to except this.

LT said he represents power that dwarfs the IG
Warlock acknowledge that LT serves someone beyond the IG
And the bio say's it too. -------- Now what!

LT said it.
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/7993/ltisaboveig5ez.th.jpg
Warlock said it.
http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/7757/ltorderswl0iy.th.jpg
Living Tirbunal's bio says it.
http://img102.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ltbio6iy.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
As for your positioning of the Scarlet Witch, please can you find for me a reference in any house of m related comic that states that the Scarlet Witch directly created and/or maintained the chaos wave?
Because unless you can prove otherwise as stated by Roma in Uncanny X-men issue 462, the chaos wave was not something created by Wanda, it was a side effect of Wandas tamperings with the 616 reality. Its the equivalent of someone yodelling in the alps setting off an avalanche. The avalanche itself and the resultant destruction arent things generated or maintained by the person involved..

"Wanda's tamperings were flat out stated to have breached causality. You are warping that which caused the Chaos wave and making a false analogy. Her tamperings breached causality and sent out that wave.

Roma actually states that it is a, and let me allcaps it for you, since apparently you like to ignore things when they prove you wrong

TRANSTEMPORAL TSUNAMI, ORIGINATING FROM EARTH 616

That is what Wanda, caused from the sheer power she was hurling around like a crazy person.

once again, note the word ORIGINATING

That's the Chaos Wave that breached causality. Congrats on yet again warping evidence." anonymous cameo...

Mr Master
This should of looked like this:

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Which is irrelevant when Thanos never applied his power to Death directly as Beyonder did.

It's not the first time Death survives when the most powerful beings in the universe are being killed.
Here Death protects herself and Starfox and Nebula from utter destruction.
And THIS TIME his power with the IG, was applied to her(because she attacked him with the others)and the rest that were there.
Only Death survived, along with those she rescued.
http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/5355/deathsurvivesig2xf.th.jpg
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/8666/deathsurvuvesig22ul.th.jpg
thank you...

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Completely different case. The fact of the matter is that Thanos had the power to destroy Eternity who by canon is greater than Death.

Interesting...
In the Korvac What if issue that you so proudly always brought up, Death and her machinations resulted in the death of Eternity(the single universe version)and she screamed in joy at the end.

Here the Watcher nor Eternity(single universe)himself could perceive the "Goddess's intentions.
Only Death was able, don't underestimate Death.
http://img472.imageshack.us/img472/904/deathperceivesall1vp.th.jpg

Death will always be last, for as long as there is life there must be death.

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thanos merely absorbed the 616 reality, not ALL THAT IS. In Marvel terms that would be the multiverse.

I will prove this to be WRONG!
This phrase, "All THAT IS"... is thrown around quite a bit, especially when refering to JUST Universes. Like most of your Phoenix feats, I'll get to that in a minute.

Now,
You say Thanos merely absorbed 616 reality, first, I don't know where you got that from, but according to Thanos he was Omni-Reality with THOU.
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/8962/thoumakesyouomniall7do.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The IG as stated is a conduit for the energies which make up the fabric of 616. As stated in the Fallen Ones bio

Whatever.
Magus takes possession of the IG many universes away(outside 616)
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/2580/magusfaraway4qk.th.jpg
Magus remakes the universe in his image from universes away(outside 616)
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/2999/igcontrolsall63pf.th.jpg
Warlock remakes the universe back to it's original form, from universes away(outside 616)http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/6499/igremakesverse8li.th.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
the IG just like the Power Primordial is powered by the Big Bang. Guess who's the power behind the Big Bang.

So many Big Bangs!
Do you mean this one?
Infinity Being created Mephisto and Every demon
http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/2889/igcreatedmephisto8bo.th.jpg
Infinity being was the big bang of creation
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1120/igisuniverse13km.th.jpg
Yes, Infinity being was the big bang of the universe
http://img290.imageshack.us/img290/2485/igisuniverse25yu.th.jpg
And Mephisto seems to agree
http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/7976/igmadeall1kd.th.jpg
Heck even Richards can generate a Big Bang explosion:
Reed makes a Bomb that contains a big bang from a universe
http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/9524/reedmakesbigbang8ty.th.jpg
http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/1517/reedmakesbigbang25ji.th.jpg
http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/6476/reedmakesbigbang38sm.th.jpg
http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/7981/reedmakesbigbang43pu.th.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
As for the Reed Richards thing. Please dont be ridiculous. Would you care to portray your understanding of that whole affair just so i know how to progress. smile

The Reed Richards "thing" your referring to, is when he Destroyed and Remade the TRUE Mulitverse in a split second with the Ultimate Nullifier.

Ok this is to prove it was the Multiverse that was Remade.
Here Abraxas kills Every Galactus in every universe.
http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/8695/0unabraxaskillsallg3ps.th.jpg
Abraxas kills every Reed Richards in every universe
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/3452/0unabraxaskillsallotherselves8.th.jpg
Reed uses the Ultimate Nullifier to kill Abraxas & remake the Multiverse
http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/6069/1unisusedbyreedtodestroyabraxa.th.jpg
UN destroys the Multiverse
http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/932/2undestroysmultieternityinfini.th.jpg
UN remakes the Multiverse
http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/893/3unremakesthemultiverse9jq.th.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thanos merely absorbed the 616 reality, not ALL THAT IS. In Marvel terms that would be the multiverse

Ok mr know it all let's disprove this too.

Galactus say's Eternity(single universe)is the Entire universe
http://img279.imageshack.us/img279/65/eternityaspectisallreality11md.th.jpg
Galactus say's about that same Eternity(single universe)he's All reality
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1326/eternityaspectisallreality24ke.th.jpg
LT say's Eternity(single universe)is All there is
http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/6199/eternityaspectisallreality32ro.th.jpg
Eternity(single universe)say's he's All that is to Doctor Strange
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/2856/eternityaspectisall41qn.th.jpg
Thanos said IG gave him power over All that is.
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/6369/igoverallthatis4oe.th.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
In X-men Forever it was revealed that each creation cycle a race was created with the potential to herald the end of reality. In 616 at least humanity and more specifically mutants are this race. Omega (the end) mutants. This race would evolve to the point where they would transcend the physical and supplant the fundamental forces of reality, the abstracts and as depicted LT:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=5/13615340764.jpg&s=f5

This is a bunch of gibberish!

This never happened and has never happened, this is some story being told,
about events that Supposedly will take place in the future.

It's funny how you disregard LT saying he represents forces that dwarf the IG, but this...some story being told about a scenario that has never played out, you except.

What you need to do is, show me WHEN and WHERE did Phoenix EVER destroy a Multiverse?
I'll go easy on you...show WHEN and WHERE did she ever Create a Universe?
NOT remake a Universe...I know she can do that....show me anytime she's actually made a Universe from scratch?

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Strangers programming had laid down but which also allowed him to warn his friends. He sent a selection of mutants through various stages in time in order to show them the potential that lies within them and to get across the threat they potentially faced from the cosmic forces they would eventually replace.

This is hilarious...
The Stranger is an infamous LIAR across the cosmos, for all we know he could have made those mutants see illusions.
Look at this wisdom from Silver Surfer:
http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/6997/strangerlies28ks.th.jpg
http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/169/strangerlies39np.th.jpg
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1193/strangerlies43ya.th.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Jean travels back in time to when she as Phoenix conversed with Death after she had killed herself in the DP Saga:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/7508345098.jpg&s=x11
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/7508374934.jpg&s=x11

Now you showing us scans of Jean conversing with the most treacherous entity across the cosmos, and I'm supposed to take it's word. Everything here could be lies to for-fill Death's nightmarish desires, look what happened to Korvac. But really all these scans are doing is telling us that humans will evolve to be cosmic in THIS universe that they're talking about.

This crap isn't even Multi-versal.....AHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/7508393059.jpg&s=x11

Ouch....this is a real "what have I done moment"...
This Scan actually puts to rest the whole Mkraan Crystal event issue,
once thought to be the greatest feat for ol' GS in Marvel, LOL...but in fact...it was just a Universe that Phoenix saved. Here's the close up: from your own scan:
http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/1361/mkraancrystalevent8lt.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/7508420942.jpg&s=x11

Again not saying anything special.
Phoenix still can't destroy or remake a Multi-verse AND Phoenix still can't even create a Universe from scratch. These scans continue to drill me with the Fact that Phoenix at best, can destroy A Universe and Remake A Universe...nothing more.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Visualising various cosmic threats such as the Infinity Gauntlet, Death and later the Celestial ship Prosh dismiss them and such acts as the destruction of universes as trivial and cite the involvement of the Phoenix Force as the only legitimate threat to the fabric of existence.
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=5/13615475542.jpg&s=f5
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=5/12205244920.jpg&s=x402
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=5/13615543084.jpg&s=f5

Ok.. I was wondering when you were going to start lying.
You been off and just wrong about most of your points, and now.. the lies begin.

No where in those scans does it say anywhere that, AHAHAHAHAHA, Phoenix is the only legitimate threat to existence, still LOL!
The only thing that's trivial here is Phoenix being able to destroy and remake A Single Universe, more than a few can do that.

from your own scans:
The forces of the "Universe", Not Multiverse! A single Universe.
http://img119.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pfoneuni6fh.jpg
To usurp the forces of the "Universe" again ONE Universe.
http://img439.imageshack.us/img439/3417/pfoneuni20ea.th.jpg
She sees the expanding Universe(One Universe)mankind's role as the Universe's destroyer and savior, yes you know it...just one Universe.
http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/5113/pfoneuni32dl.th.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The Phoenix Force was the key to this potential being realised, among many things it is the driving force behind evolution and as such the Stranger sought to access it through Jean Grey in order to control this process and become supreme over all beings in reality (including LT):
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=5/12205252584.jpg&s=x402
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/7511343068.jpg&s=x11

Gibberish.. Supreme Power...you wish.
No where on those scan does it say anyone would be the Supreme Being because of Phoenix.
Amazing how you just MADE that up. HAHAHAHA!

Not to mention that never even happened, that's what SUPPOSEDLY would happen if...what a deceiving little picture, when this Phoenix can't even create a Universe let alone pass on dominion over "All that is", LOL... this is comedy...
From all your scans(including these two last ones)all I saw was Phoenix being a Universal threat...no more..and if this story were true, it's only ONE Universe they are talking about...A Single Universe that Phoenix begins and ends...she has nothing to do with the rest of Multi-verse.

I proved that Big Bangs occurred through the Infinity Being and THAT truly created "ALL that is"
Reed harnessing Big Bangs from Universes where it hasn't even happened yet.
Even the Mkraan Crystal event, when Phoenix repaired it, that was just a Universal feat.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The Phoenix can render someone the supreme power in reality, its power is that which drives evolution and the creation cycle. It spawns the abstracts.

Spawned abstracts? ------ In her Single Universe maybe.
Dude...you don't really know what a supreme being is do you.
Your own scans showed you that Phoenix can only destroy and repair a Universe!

Here are some REAL Supreme figures:
Cosmic Cubes make you GOD/Supreme
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/1613/cosmiccubemakesyougod5st.th.jpg
Thanos w/THOU was considered Supreme
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/6374/eternityaspectcallsthousupreme.th.jpg
Eternity(single universe)is Supreme of each of his realities
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/1880/eternityaspectisallreality41tl.th.jpg
Infinity Gauntlet makes you Supreme
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/192/igissupremewatcher1pq.th.jpg
Actually bump that...Infinity Gauntlet makes you God
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/1825/igmakesyougod7zf.th.jpg
Yep...Infinity Gauntlet makes you God for sure
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/4705/igmakesyougod23un.th.jpg
Infinity Gauntlet wielder is considered God by everyone
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/2835/igmakesyougod58va.th.jpg
Let's push the bar way up now...IG Thanos said he was Supreme over All Universes
http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/1135/igmakesyousupremeinallrealitie.th.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Erasing Death does not place anyone at the top of the hierarchy. Death is a facet of reality which Phoenixes manifestation spawns. The simple fact is that the Beyonders feats are beaten by both the Phoenix and by Thanos with HOTI.

Where does it say that Phoenix created the Multi-versal abstract Death please?
Don't come in here making statements demeaning other character's feats, when you can't even prove what you demeaning it with.

And now we know for sure just how limited Phoenix's power is, You and I both proved that well. pre-retcon Beyonder would have been a God to Phoenix.

AHAHAHAAHA!!!
What has Phoenix done dude?
Remake 616 Universe? Repair the Mkraan Crystal which was only A Universal threat...wooh...big time. Oh..she's the big bang for HER universe, and her Universe alone.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Phoenix is the power which spawns creation, as stated on panel it is the power which spawned such beings as the abstracts and Galactus:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/7509330349.jpg&s=x11

Reed wasn't even sure what he was talking about.
In Any case...Not according to the issue of his origin...Eternity made Galactus
http://img434.imageshack.us/img434/6023/eternitymadeg6zv.th.jpg
And Eternity made the Celestials too apparently:
Eternity created Celestials through meditation
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/4910/eternitymadecelestials1oh.th.jpg
Celestial manifesting due to Eternity
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/119/eternitymadecelestials29sv.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The creation cycle is ushered in and controlled by its power, with it being the Big Bang that sparks off creation and the power that brings it to an end:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=5/13616261699.jpg&s=f5

I definitely agree that the Phoenix Force is the beginning and the end...but of ONE Universe only, every scan continues to express a Universal scale at best.
Here the highlight of your scan: Not one has mentioned anything, more...than A Single Universe
http://img305.imageshack.us/img305/4672/wonpf5hu.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=2/3909345924.jpg&s=x7

http://img420.imageshack.us/img420/659/pfisall7yg.th.jpg
This scan says "the end of all that is", but I showed you many times up top that Eternity, the Single Universe NOT the Multi-verse, is always referred to as eternal, forever, "all that is."

I think it's time for a history lesson.
What is truly ALL THAT IS...or in other words, the Multi-verse?

Eternity(the single universe)controls all reality is his individual Universe but he's nothing compared to the whole, he's JUST an Aspect of Multi-Eternity the True Eternity, the Multi-verse!
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/5273/eternityaspectcontrolsall5yw.th.jpg
Lord Chaos & Master Order are run by the Eternity & Infinity of every Universe.
http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/816/eterninfinruletheuniverse3ib.th.jpg

Mr Master
Ok...I showed how Eternity(the Single Universe)is known as "All that is."
Let's look at his relationship with Warlock, they know each other well, even bicker at each other like children sometimes.

Warlock & Eternity(the single universe)know each other well
http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/9330/eternityaspectwarlock8jz.th.jpg
As you can see..they treat each other with confidence
http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/204/eternityaspectwarlock24oy.th.jpg
This is called the Eternal Orb...Eternity(single universe)gave it to Warlock to contact him when the universe is in danger
http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/935/eternityaspectisall14jf.th.jpg
Warlock contacts Eternity(single universe)anytime he wishes with it.
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/8608/eternityaspectisall25yw.th.jpg

Ok...Let's look at the True Monster of it all,
This is Multi-Eternity's creation(no mention of the Phoenix Force by the way)and Reed Richards was there, what a coincidence.
http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/7421/multieternity16do.th.jpg
Now that you saw that...remember Warlock and his coolness with Eternity.
Observe when he travels to find the Embodiment of ALL THAT IS! the Multi-verse!
First...he can't just summon the Multi-verse like he can with Eternity(single Universe)through the orb...that's what he thought until...
http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/5025/warlockcontactsthemultiverse3i.th.jpg
Warlock journeys to the Multiverse, notice Warlock's expression when he finds...
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/2743/warlockfindsthemultiverse7ma.th.jpg

Mr Master
This.... is.... the Multi-verse.... Embodied-.....Eternity(A Single Universe)means nothing to them.
http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/1623/multiverse2co.th.jpg
http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/5109/multiverse28yb.th.jpg
Warlock is sent away
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/253/warlocksentaway7oq.th.jpg
Warlock is dumbfounded by the experience
http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/6889/warlockisinawe9mo.th.jpg
Roma is the Multi-versal overseer
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/5787/roma15ur.th.jpg
Opal Luna Saturnyne, looks over the entire Ominiverse
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/7519/roma20kd.th.jpg

Now you see the difference between Eternity, which is A Single Universe that the Phoenix Force can destroy and Multi-Eternity which Warlock after having been "God" twice, and spanning through the Cosmic Vortex was awestruck when he experienced such magnificence.

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Phoenix has saved existence from eternal damnation, linking with all life in reality to grant them a peaceful death in the face of the M'kraan crystal:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=2/5307094756.jpg&s=x402
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=2/5307212334.jpg&s=x402

Nice feat...too bad it just a Universal One though, no mention of Multi-verse anywhere.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
After the crystal brought about the previous multiverses end the Phoenix re-ignited creation by manifesting as the Big Bang:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/7509292924.jpg&s=x11

Nice try, but it's just... A Single Universe...Here, I'll highlight your own scan where it says it clearly. NO Multi-verse!
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/2293/pfbirth1uni0xs.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
In the early days of creation, Phoenix linked the multiverse together in an energy matrix:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/5913134015.jpg&s=x402

Finally the word Multi-verse appears.
Nice feat...She created an energy matrix that projected the tower through the Multi-verse,
so that it existed in every reality simultaneously. Impressive..but no where near creating a Universe or destroying and creating a Multi-verse.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Perceiving the Here Comes Tomorrow future to be undesirable the White Crown Phoenix casually amputated 616's entire future timeline, effectively dooming it:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/5913213385.jpg&s=x402

She's very powerful...in Her Single Universe...616 is just ONE universe.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
She then proceeded to re-create the entire universe atom by atom in the palm of her hand telekinetically from the higher dimension that is the White Hot Room:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/17712590170.jpg&s=f5

Without question her most impressive feat ever. I always said this is the limit of her power.

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
With that done she creates a new future for the 616 universe, the future youre reading everytime you read a marvel comic.
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/17713015190.jpg&s=f5

Remember the Doctor Doom that was in Secret Wars the first series,

that wasn't really Doom,(well technically it was but read)that was a Future self of Doom plucked from the timestream courtesy of the Beyonder,

This is incredible,
Not only does Beyonder use a Doom from the future to fight in the Secret Wars saga, which now explains how DOOM was able to manipulate Galactus's vast technology, but the funny thing is Doom was already dead, he had been dead since FF #260, when the FF, Doom and Silver Surfer took on Terrax.

The insane part is,
He plucked him from a future that he himself was going to create for Doom way after the Secret Wars series, simply amazing.
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/4381/beyondercontrolovertimelife15b.th.jpg
This is well into the Secret Wars II series,

Now Beyonder sends Doom back in time to the Secret Wars drama that was already played out, just to re-install Doom's mind/spirit with his original body,
he speeds up that seperate event in time(Secret Wars I)and ends up in the now, with a fully revived and renewd DOOM.
Unbelievable.
http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/8707/beyondercontrolstime21cu.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
As the M'kraan crystals energies spewed out and proceeded to momentarily blink out all existence, the Phoenix manifested as Jean Grey with the moral support of her friends re-energised the energy matrix which held this multiversal power in place and then re-weaved it to shut the power off:http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/17713032135.jpg&s=f5

Multi-versal power my foot.
You keep throwing that word around...but all we get from your scans is a Universal threat...no more. Again the highlight from your own scan:
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/9039/pfunithreat9tf.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
A feat Phoenix pulled off to safeguard the previous multiverse as well:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/8808171532.jpg&s=x11

Sorry dude...NO Multi-verse here neither..again a Universal feat.

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Hey hey!! And i bet you thought this was gonna be easy

By the time you reach this I've spread my knowledge across the kmc world.
I bet you thought you was the man when you wrote that.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Could you please tell me anywhere where it is stated or conclusively depicted that LT creates a new reality or that LT transforms Silver Surfer into a universe?
That is complete supposition. The only statement pertaining to what LT does is when he offers to give Silver Surfer a connection to the infinite. Still not seeing anything mentioned with regards to what your claiming.

After Lts description of his offer you later see a flash of light, a constellation like visual and then you see a closeup of Silver Surfers head with stars and planets reflected on his skin.

I can see how things have to be beyond obvious for your eyes gs, you respond with your sarcasm and snyde stupidity thinking you hot kaka..but I always get the last laugh.

There was a page I didn't include because it was obvious to me, and after I posted it it was obvious to everyone else...that in fact LT made the Silver Surfer into a Universe. "Godhood"...Which I proved way in the beginning, is a title given to Thanos with IG, who essentialy became the Universe in Infinity Gauntlet #5.
Here's the LT transforming the Silver Surfer into a Universe(with the extra page)SS#31 v3.
http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/7592/ltmakesss13fz.th.jpg
http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/2751/ltmakesss21ek.th.jpg
http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/3725/ltmakesss31te.th.jpg
http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/3281/ltmakesss43ro.th.jpg
http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/3169/ltmakesss53se.th.jpg
SEE...Silver Surfer EXPANDING into a Universe, you phony.
http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/3707/ltmakesss80mn.th.jpg
http://img279.imageshack.us/img279/4882/ltmakesss66ed.th.jpg

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I would offer my two cents but by the looks of things Lord S has gone and dropped a wad of notes on you!!

You thought you were the man again..

Pride cometh before destruction.

Mr. Universe
Has the Phoenix myth finally been dispelled?????

Yay!

sexyking
I am loving this thread keep up the good work, I wouldnt be surprised if galactic storm now vanished for a while and if he doesnt and he reads this give it up mate its over you LOSE LOSE LOSE.

Avalonofthewind
In a word.....WOW.

Acrosurge
*applauds Mr Master*

That was a lot of hard work there, mister.

Sixth_Winged
Damnnn....This is gonna get ugly soon. Anyway, thumb up thumb up thumb up thumb up thumb up to mr. master.

Mr Master
Ey wuts up fellas...

thanx for the heads up yall...

If anyone didn't know what I meant by Warlock spanning the Cosmic Vortex, I'll tell and show.

The Cosmic Vortex is where Universes are floating around in a vast Infinity.

Inside this infinity all Universes are being pulled into something called "the Void".

If the anchor of a Universe(like Atleza)is not there to hold it from being sucked in...then that's exactly what will happen, hence the Infinity Abyss series.

Warlock navigated this realm without the IG, but with the soul Gem though, after an Eternity/Infinity(single Universe)allowed him access outside their reality completely into the Cosmic Vortex.

check it out..

Ok here he exits:
http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/3198/adamgoesbtwnuniverses15yh.th.jpg
Here he's out there:
http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/7376/adamgoesbtwnuniverses26zw.th.jpg

Takion
So all this time we have been fooled.



Mr. Master = albert

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
So all this time we have been fooled.

LOL!!!

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
LOL!!!
We have been living in a lie.

Mr Master
I forgot to add this Thanos with the HOTU calling the Living Tribunal "the Top of the Food Chain"

http://img290.imageshack.us/img290/9199/ltisthetop5of.th.jpg

H. S. 6
Awesome job, Mr Master!

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
We have been living in a lie.

You know what part amazed me the most in my research, Reed being able to harness the energy of a Big Bang. Actually taking the energy from a Universe.

Reed rules.

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
I forgot to add this Thanos with the HOTU calling the Living Tribunal "the Top of the Food Chain"

http://img290.imageshack.us/img290/9199/ltisthetop5of.th.jpg
Do you have the scans where Thanos defeats the Celestials in one shot?

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
You know what part amazed me the most in my research, Reed being able to harness the energy of a Big Bang. Actually taking the energy from a Universe.

Reed rules.

Reed is turning into Wolverine. jockey

Mr Master
Originally posted by H. S. 6
Awesome job, Mr Master!

thanx...

outarddwarf
This is crazy cool! Awsome job Mr. Master!

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
Do you have the scans where Thanos defeats the Celestials in one shot?

http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8084/thoublowscelestial7cn.th.jpg

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8084/thoublowscelestial7cn.th.jpg
OMG!!!! THANKS DUDE!!!!!!!!

Mr Master
Originally posted by outarddwarf
This is crazy cool! Awsome job Mr. Master!

thanx...

It was a dirty job...but, you know the rest.

Takion
Phoneix got nailed............hilton_video

Apolloknight
Originally posted by Mr Master
http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8084/thoublowscelestial7cn.th.jpg


I just had an E-gasum. OMG

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
Phoneix got nailed............hilton_video

Did you know that Cosmic Cubes can make you "God" or atleast supreme...in a reality if you have the will power.

Only Thanos ofcourse has accomplished this feat.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/3929/cosmiccubesareallpowerful1wc.th.jpg


The so called "Goddess" wanted to gain this power, but failed during the Crusade series.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Apolloknight
I just had an E-gasum. OMG

AHAAHAAHAA!!!

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
Did you know that Cosmic Cubes can make you "God" or atleast supreme...in a reality if you have the will power.

Only Thanos ofcourse has accomplished this feat.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/3929/cosmiccubesareallpowerful1wc.th.jpg


The so called "Goddess" wanted to gain this power, but failed during the Crusade series.
OMG!!!!! But does it give you nigh omnipotence?

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
OMG!!!!! But does it give you nigh omnipotence?

Thanos became "God"!

They don't even say A...God.

But just Thanos becomes GOD.

The Cubes apparently limit themselves on purpose..only a will and mind strong enough can truly exploit them.

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/1613/cosmiccubemakesyougod5st.th.jpg

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
Thanos became "God"!

They don't even say A...God.

But just Thanos becomes GOD.

The Cubes apparently limit themselves on purpose..only a will and mind strong enough can truly exploit them.

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/1613/cosmiccubemakesyougod5st.th.jpg
So how did he loose the Cube?

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
So how did he loose the Cube?

First Marvel found the unprotected Cube and destroyed it.
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/7453/cosmiccubemakesyouauniverse1dn.th.jpg


Then Thanos, who had become the size of the Universe..shrunk down and fell unconscious.
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/5301/cosmiccubemakesyouauniverse22l.th.jpg

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
First Marvel found the unprotected Cube and destroyed it.
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/7453/cosmiccubemakesyouauniverse1dn.th.jpg


Then Thanos, who had become the size of the Universe..shrunk down and fell unconscious.
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/5301/cosmiccubemakesyouauniverse22l.th.jpg
Nice. Never knew Thanos is so careless.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
Nice. Never knew Thanos is so careless.

That was his first acquisition of true power, he learned as he went.

Mr Master
testing..

Mr Master
testing...

illadelph12
I consider GS a friend (though I disagree with him about 98-100% of the time), but I have to say, this is looking like a massacre for my homie.

Props Mr. Master.

I've said a lot of the things you're conveying in this thread before to GS, but I didn't have the scans to substantiate my claims, and as we all know in the online debate game, it's all about show and prove. Now seeing all of my statements supported on panel I am quite satisfied and I can take an extended vacation from the cosmic level debate game.

If I know my friend, there's a giant rebuttal on the horizon, so I'm gonna grab some popcorn.

This is good sh*t.

Takion
KMC started getting awesome Debators again.

Mr. Master

Lord Urizen

Milkie

Takion shifty nah just kidding

and so on.

Mr Master
Originally posted by illadelph12
I consider GS a friend (though I disagree with him about 98-100% of the time), but I have to say, this is looking like a massacre for my homie.

Props Mr. Master.

I've said a lot of the things you're conveying in this thread before to GS, but I didn't have the scans to substantiate my claims, and as we all know in the online debate game, it's all about show and prove. Now seeing all of my statements supported on panel I am quite satisfied and I can take an extended vacation from the cosmic level debate game.

If I know my friend, there's a giant rebuttal on the horizon, so I'm gonna grab some popcorn.

This is good sh*t.

lol,

thanx man...

I was pondering that shortly after I finished this...and it came to me..what can he possibly say?

Every corner has been sealed.

newjak86
Hey my friend Mr. Master i see one of two fates in your future one is where GS disappears for a couple of months and waits for the Phoenix book to come and hope something new is in there or

GS aill post every single scan and post and reply to every single one of your posts while your not on so you have to read everything from start to finish.

DigiMark007
Yeah, this is impressive, but I want to see what happens when GS finds this. Until he weighs in here, I don't consider either side to be right or wrong. It'll be one helluva fight. cool

Mr Master
Originally posted by newjak86
Hey my friend Mr. Master i see one of two fates in your future one is where GS disappears for a couple of months and waits for the Phoenix book to come and hope something new is in there or

GS aill post every single scan and post and reply to every single one of your posts while your not on so you have to read everything from start to finish.

Nah dude...

I've had a few debates with the man,
if this doesn't convince him, what more is there to say.


I was telling that other dude, I was most amazed to see Reed could harness the Big Bang of a Universe in order to make his own bomb with the same destructive power.

Reed still rules.

Mr Master
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Yeah, this is impressive, but I want to see what happens when GS finds this. Until he weighs in here, I don't consider either side to be right or wrong. It'll be one helluva fight. cool

thanx...

How can we defy the on panel proof?

DigiMark007
Originally posted by Mr Master
How can we defy the on panel proof?

Because most of the time in comics, there's on panel proof of completely contrary arguments. That's the nature of the beast, and since I'm far from an expert on Pheonix (and I've read a few of GS's dissertations) I'd rather see both sides.

Right now, it's like breaking a home run record in little leauge baseball. No one with any real pitching skills (or in this case, pheonix knowledge) has challenged you in this thread.

But you're probably right. And yes, it'll be hard as balls to argue all of your scans. But it's always best to hear both sides.

Mr Master
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Because most of the time in comics, there's on panel proof of completely contrary arguments. That's the nature of the beast, and since I'm far from an expert on Pheonix (and I've read a few of GS's dissertations) I'd rather see both sides.

Right now, it's like breaking a home run record in little leauge baseball. No one with any real pitching skills (or in this case, pheonix knowledge) has challenged you in this thread.

But you're probably right. And yes, it'll be hard as balls to argue all of your scans. But it's always best to hear both sides.

I hear what your saying, and it makes sense.

But remember this entire thread is answering his posts and his scans which I include.

unknowable
this is probably the greatest thread i have ever come by to learn about the hierarchy
hey mr masters this made my jaw drop
do you have a top list
i would love to know that

Mr Master
Originally posted by unknowable
this is probably the greatest thread i have ever come by to learn about the hierarchy
hey mr masters this made my jaw drop
do you have a top list
i would love to know that

If you mean a hierarchy...I have my opinion.

My hierarchy without counting pre-retcon Beyonder & pre-retcon Molecule Man:

1. TOAA
:Obviously:

2. Multi-Death
;Because she transcends the Multi-verse...and beyond, everyone owes Death. When the Multiverse goes, there are still some Universes outside it which Death has claim over. Only Death survived Thanos(THOU)and a direct assault from the IG:

3. HOTU
:Absorbed LT: nuff said...

4. Living Tribunal
:Because he's above the IG(like I proved in this thread)

5. IG
:Because it controlled the energies of the Ultimate Nullifier:

6. Ultimate Nullifier
:Obliterated and Remade the Multiverse in the blink of an eye.

7. Abraxas(he can only manifest...if one of the Galactus's in Multi-verse die).
:Because only the UN can kill him:

8. Multi-Eternity/Multi-Infinity(embodiments of the Multiverse/Time&Space)
:Because it's their Multiverse, Because they are the Multiverse, because they make up an infinite number of Universes(as you saw in the Cosmic Vortex)without them there's nothing, Because a Single Big Bang takes place in their immensity all the time. An entire Universe is infinitesimal in comparison to them.

9. Phoenix Force/Wanda/and any other who can rearrange atoms on a Universal scale

Takion
Originally posted by Mr Master
If you mean a hierarchy...I have my opinion.

My hierarchy without counting pre-retcon Beyonder & pre-retcon Molecule Man:

1. TOAA
:Obviously:

2. Multi-Death
;Because she transcends the Multi-verse...and beyond, everyone owes Death. When the Multiverse goes, there are still some Universes outside it which Death has claim over. Only Death survived Thanos(THOU)and a direct assault from the IG:

3. HOTU
:Absorbed LT: nuff said...

4. Living Tribunal
:Because he's above the IG(like I proved in this thread)

5. IG
:Because it controlled the energies of the Ultimate Nullifier:

6. Ultimate Nullifier
:Obliterated and Remade the Multiverse in the blink of an eye.

7. Abraxas(he can only manifest...if one of the Galactus's in Multi-verse die).
:Because only the UN can kill him:

8. Multi-Eternity/Multi-Infinity(embodiments of the Multiverse/Time&Space)
:Because it's their Multiverse, Because they are the Multiverse, because they make up an infinite number of Universes(as you saw in the Cosmic Vortex)without them there's nothing, Because a Single Big Bang takes place in their immensity all the time. An entire Universe is infinitesimal in comparison to them.

9. Phoenix Force/Wanda/and any other who can rearrange atoms on a Universal scale
Ahem. Where's Wolverine? jockey

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion
Ahem. Where's Wolverine? jockey

You got jokes...lol

Lord Urizen
Mr. MASTER you ARE THE MAN !


It's OFFICIAL: INFINITY GAUNTLET IS MULTIVERSAL IN POWER....not UNIVERSAL...get it ?

So all you DC fanboys, all you Pheonix Worshippers....GIVE IT UP ALREADY !!!!!!!

Mr Master
Reed made a comment about Phoenix & Galactus that was pointed out...this is the comment he made about pre-retcon Beyonder

Beyonder is the Living Embodiment of Supreme Power
http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/9875/beyonderisthelivingsupreme4cq.th.jpg

http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/8738/beyonderisthelivingsupreme24gz.th.jpg

Draco69
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Mr. MASTER you ARE THE MAN !


It's OFFICIAL: INFINITY GAUNTLET IS MULTIVERSAL IN POWER....not UNIVERSAL...get it ?

So all you DC fanboys, all you Pheonix Worshippers....GIVE IT UP ALREADY !!!!!!!

Well that's why it's called the INFINITY Gauntlet....

What's the use of a IG that can only affect one universe?

It would have to be named the FINITE Gauntlet....

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by Takion
KMC started getting awesome Debators again.

Mr. Master

Lord Urizen

Milkie

Takion shifty nah just kidding

and so on.

Thanks man....but Mr.Master takes first place definately ! He had everything he needed to back up his claims. AWESOME JOB !

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by Draco69
Well that's why it's called the INFINITY Gauntlet....

What's the use of a IG that can only affect one universe?

It would have to be named the FINITE Gauntlet....

I know, but there are many debators especially GALACTICSTORM and many other DC fanboys who claim things like:


"Infinity Gauntlet is below the Anti Life Equation, because ALE is multiversal and IG is only universal"...


FINALLY that MYTH has been put to rest. Hopefully all will stop claiming that by now.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Mr. MASTER you ARE THE MAN !


It's OFFICIAL: INFINITY GAUNTLET IS MULTIVERSAL IN POWER....not UNIVERSAL...get it ?

So all you DC fanboys, all you Pheonix Worshippers....GIVE IT UP ALREADY !!!!!!!

Wut up Lord Urizen,

enjoyed that?

Mr Master
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Thanks man....but Mr.Master takes first place definately ! He had everything he needed to back up his claims. AWESOME JOB !

thanx friend...

Draco69
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I know, but there are many debators especially GALACTICSTORM and many other DC fanboys who claim things like:


"Infinity Gauntlet is below the Anti Life Equation, because ALE is multiversal and IG is only universal"...


FINALLY that MYTH has been put to rest. Hopefully all will stop claiming that by now.

The Anti-Life Equation IS multiversal in some aspects but it is certainly not on the level of the IG. What the f**k?

It exists in Hypertime and such.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I know, but there are many debators especially GALACTICSTORM and many other DC fanboys who claim things like:
"Infinity Gauntlet is below the Anti Life Equation, because ALE is multiversal and IG is only universal"...
FINALLY that MYTH has been put to rest. Hopefully all will stop claiming that by now.

Many just came out of...a great...illusion.

Others always knew what hid behind the curtain.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Draco69
The Anti-Life Equation IS multiversal in some aspects but it is certainly not on the level of the IG. What the f**k?

It exists in Hypertime and such.

I have the 4 part series where the real Anti-Life Equation pops up(the sentient life-from that is the ALE). Metron found it.

Metron said when he found the ALE, "we of New Genesis have the effrontary to call ourselves "gods"...now I know what a "god" trully is...next to this deity...I am...nothing"

Darkseid said of it, "only a fraction of this nightmare's power will be enough to bring my reality to it's knees"

Mr Master
Great Evil Beast in feminine yet eerie form...appears to some royal female warriors that worship it.
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/5899/geb15hl.th.jpg

http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/800/geb28qo.th.jpg

http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/7220/geb35el.th.jpg

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/2306/geb40mk.th.jpg

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/2543/geb51zs.th.jpg

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/7540/geb68ol.th.jpg

Great Evil Beast other form
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8871/geb73sd.th.jpg

Mr Master
Again the GEB
It succeeds in tempting the Spectre, realize how the GEB could care less for God or Lucifer(refers to him as the Devil)it has it's own agenda seperate from iether.
With unimaginable power, the GEB gives the Spectre a glimpse of REAL HEAVEN.
Even the Spectre is transfixed from the experience.

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/8382/gebspectre18ln.th.jpg

http://img421.imageshack.us/img421/4614/gebspectre20na.th.jpg

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/5638/gebspectre38xz.th.jpg

http://img278.imageshack.us/img278/8496/gebspectre41kp.th.jpg

http://img278.imageshack.us/img278/9439/gebspectre51nv.th.jpg

BlaqChaos
Hope this helps some:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f95/t410657.html

Takion
No Beyonder. sad

Mr Master
This is ill...

http://img308.imageshack.us/img308/7329/w13kq.th.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/6445/w28jg.th.jpg
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/8638/w30lg.th.jpg
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/296/w41am.th.jpg
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4937/w56ah.th.jpg
http://img308.imageshack.us/img308/4689/w67sl.th.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/6131/w79ny.th.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/2527/w97gh.th.jpg
A little bit of trivia, who is this mighty being.?
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/9818/w109xs.th.jpg

BlaqChaos
Originally posted by Takion
No Beyonder. sad Compared to the Beyonders, the Beyonder doesn't amount to much.

kevdude
Originally posted by Mr Master
Again the GEB
It succeeds in tempting the Spectre, realize how the GEB could care less for God or Lucifer(refers to him as the Devil)it has it's own agenda seperate from iether.
With unimaginable power, the GEB gives the Spectre a glimpse of REAL HEAVEN.
Even the Spectre is transfixed from the experience.

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/8382/gebspectre18ln.th.jpg

http://img421.imageshack.us/img421/4614/gebspectre20na.th.jpg

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/5638/gebspectre38xz.th.jpg

http://img278.imageshack.us/img278/8496/gebspectre41kp.th.jpg

http://img278.imageshack.us/img278/9439/gebspectre51nv.th.jpg

I don't think thats TGEB. Thats more likely to be The First of the Fallen or Lucifer (Lucifer probably).

Takion
Man, I feel so ashamed what GS has been doing.

WhiteWitchKing
Originally posted by Takion
Man, I feel so ashamed what GS has been doing.

What has GS been doing? Care to fill in the holes for a fellow poster?

Mr Master
Originally posted by kevdude
I don't think thats TGEB. Thats more likely to be The First of the Fallen or Lucifer (Lucifer probably).

I don't think so.

Does Lucifer have the power to give the Spectre a taste of actual heaven?

That thing actually sent Spectre to Heaven and back.

batdude123
Galactic Storm....................



















































































IS A LIAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mr Master
Originally posted by BlaqChaos
Compared to the Beyonders, the Beyonder doesn't amount to much.

Not if your talking about pre-retcon Beyonder

Mr Master
Originally posted by batdude123
Galactic Storm....................

Batdude..you've made your appearance..welcome.

Takion
Originally posted by batdude123
Galactic Storm....................



















































































IS A LIAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.laughnet.net/archive/toons/liar.gif

batdude123
Originally posted by Mr Master
Batdude..you've made your appearance..welcome.

THANKS. cry

Mr Master
Originally posted by Takion


LOL...

This is really funny.

Soleran
Wow, just wow, it makes a tear of joy form.

illadelph12
If I know my friend like I think I do, I sense a massive Shock and Essay attack brewing from the Phoenix camp.

This is far from over.

If anything, this does bring some much needed clarity to the place of Living Tribunal and the Infinity Gauntlet.

The Phoenix Force is still a bit of an anomaly.

Jesse7
I agree that the phoenix is over rated on these forums and possibly else where too, the phoenix force is not the most powerful force in existence nor is it on level with the Source or the top level of marvel, all of the phoenix force on panel feats have been universal at best.

Go Mr. M go go!

UniOmni
In all honesty, i can see where GS may have gone wrong. In Marvel, there seems to be the Marvel universe, and then the X universe.
Many times, continuity is probed, nutted on and then shat upon to finish. The Xmen universe is closed off, alot, and its hierarchy isn't always mainlined to the rest of the Marvel universe power ranking.
So when cosmic gods show up in the X verse, sometimes other writers change up the scale. And so on. I mean, if the rest of the cosmic gods show up for annihilation, but Phoenix doesn't, thats the proof of my point. The X editors have a stranglehold on the PF and the Shiar at times. So when big events happen, and they don't show up, its noticeable, specially when you have a PF fanboy who is constantly reiterating the place of the PF in the cosmos.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Soleran
Wow, just wow, it makes a tear of joy form.

lol...

Mr. Universe
GS, where you at son? Defend thy name.

Mr Master
Originally posted by UniOmni
Marvel universe, and then the X universe.
Many times, continuity is probed, nutted on and then shat upon to finish. The Xmen universe is closed off, alot, and its hierarchy isn't always mainlined to the rest of the Marvel universe power ranking.
So when cosmic gods show up in the X verse, sometimes other writers change up the scale. And so on. I mean, if the rest of the cosmic gods show up for annihilation, but Phoenix doesn't, thats the proof of my point. The X editors have a stranglehold on the PF and the Shiar at times. So when big events happen, and they don't show up,

Makes sense.

I discovered that Phoenix definitely is the Beginning and End of A single Universe. We cannot refute this. Now that this is known, we have to discover which Universe exactly is it, 616? or which?

Can it be this X Universe?

Mr Master
Originally posted by Jesse7
Go Mr. M go go!

yiaahooo...

WhiteWitchKing
Originally posted by UniOmni
In all honesty, i can see where GS may have gone wrong. In Marvel, there seems to be the Marvel universe, and then the X universe.

This guy Galacticstorm has not gotten things "wrong" he's nothing but a liar and biased. I've been looking through some threads and he constently ignores perfectly powerful showings of the cosmic cube, the IG, and the Living Tribunal. Then turns around and touts about the Phoenix being the creator of the MU. WTF? I don't know where this came from but it's not even true. Then he provides scans that fit his vision while leaving others out.



I aggree with this. Continuity is a bit messy.

BlaqChaos
So, there's the Marvel Universe (Typically known as 616), the Marvel Multiverse (which covers every alternate reality anchored to the 616 universe), and the Marvel Megaverse (which covers all of Marvel Publications), then there is the Omniverse.

We all know what 616 is, thus no explanation is needed.

The Marvel Multiverse is basically every parallel universe of the 616 universe. All of these the Living Tribunal has authority over and can act within them as he sees fit. These are all realities that were rocked by the Scarlet Witches manipulations.

The Marvel Megaverse includes not only the 616 universe and it's counterparts, but also the realities like Squadron Supreme's or the Shadowline realities. According to the handbooks these realies "lacks the universal structure and heirachy of Earth-616 or similar worlds, and thus it would be outside of the mainstream Multiverse but within the greater Omniverse. It has been suggested that there may be one more division, the Megaverse, present between Multiverse and Omniverse, to link worlds more closly associated to the mainstream Multiverse than to more distant realities."

Darksaint
Great job, Mr Master.

Wow, I can't wait for GS to reply.

BTW, iyo, is the IG multiversal or not? I don't know if you covered it in the first page. I didn't read all of it. It's too damn much.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Darksaint
Great job, Mr Master.

Wow, I can't wait for GS to reply.

BTW, iyo, is the IG multiversal or not? I don't know if you covered it in the first page. I didn't read all of it. It's too damn much.

thanx dude...

Yes.. the IG is Multiversal and I did cover that in the first page, I didn't want to drown everyone with too many scans of IG affecting a Multiversal range but I added three seperate occasions, where the IG proved to be on a Multiversal scale.

:reference:
Infinity War #4 - 6

This is also where the IG proves to be mightier than the Ultimate Nullifier AND...it was an Incomplete Gauntlet I'll remind you. It was missing one of the Infinity Gems.

Private Pion
Oh my. Someone got major leagued owned.

WhiteWitchKing
Originally posted by Mr Master
Makes sense.

I discovered that Phoenix definitely is the Beginning and End of A single Universe. We cannot refute this. Now that this is known, we have to discover which Universe exactly is it, 616? or which?

Can it be this X Universe?

She's just part of the circle of life for a universe. When Genis killed Entropy, it caused a big bang that created the universe and Entropy became Eternity. But that was unnatural.

The natural cause of a big bang, IMO, is when a universe dies (the end of Eternity) and Entropy is killed by the Phoenix Force causing a big bang that creates the new universe (Entropy becoming the new Eternity). Every time the universe dies Phoenix creates another big bang (the beginning) to continue the cycle.

What I'm not sure of is when Eternity actually dies?

Private Pion
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
She's just part of the circle of life for a universe. When Genis killed Entropy, it caused a big bang that created the universe and Entropy became Eternity. But that was unnatural.

The natural cause of a big bang, IMO, is when a universe dies (old Eternity) and Entropy is killed by the Phoenix Force causing a big bang that creates the new universe (Entropy becoming the new Eternity). Every time the universe dies Phoenix creates another big bang to continue the cycle.

Which kinda makes sense considering it's the 'Phoenix force' and all.

Mr Master
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
The natural cause of a big bang, IMO, is when a universe dies (old Eternity) and Entropy is killed by the Phoenix Force causing a big bang that creates the new universe (Entropy becoming the new Eternity). Every time the universe dies Phoenix creates another big bang to continue the cycle.

There I must disagree..

What I got from my research is that Phoenix is that creation and destruction force in One Universe alone.

Big Bangs happen everywhere, Phoenix does not control all big bangs that's for certain.

The first 15 posts on the first page describe everything, all you'l ever need to know and it's all backed by on panel proof.

Mr Master
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
She's just part of the circle of life for a universe. When Genis killed Entropy, it caused a big bang that created the universe and Entropy became Eternity. But that was unnatural.

The natural cause of a big bang, IMO, is when a universe dies (the end of Eternity) and Entropy is killed by the Phoenix Force causing a big bang that creates the new universe (Entropy becoming the new Eternity). Every time the universe dies Phoenix creates another big bang (the beginning) to continue the cycle.
What I'm not sure of is when Eternity actually dies?

Universes are being taken over, destroyed and remade without the Phoenix Force.

heck, the Multiverse has been destroyed and remade and it had Nothing to do wth the Phoenix Force.

PF scope of power extends to ONE Universe. No more.

WhiteWitchKing
Originally posted by Mr Master
There I must disagree..

What I got from my research is that Phoenix is that creation and destruction force in One Universe alone.

She is neither the creator nor the destroyer any universe. Haven't seen her destroy one or create one.



I never said she controlled them. She starts the big bang but that doesn't mean she's more powerful than Eternity or other abstracts. A universe die and a new universe is formed when a big bang happens, Phoenix sparks that process. By no means does she control a big bang.

As for other times, which ones are you talking about? If it's the Infinity Being, I'm not sure if that's the same as TOAA himself.

The are natural big bangs and unnatural ones created by characters like Reed.



I've read most of it. The IG is above the Phoenix Force, there's no doubt about that.

Here's my hierarchy:

1. TOAA
2. The Living Tribunal
3. The Infinity Gauntlet
4. UN
5. Abraxas
6. Multiverse Eternity
7. Eternity (616)/Death/Infinity/Entropy/Oblivion/Phoenix Force

WhiteWitchKing
Originally posted by Mr Master
Universes are being taken over, destroyed and remade without the Phoenix Force.

This is what I said:






Thanos has also become one with the universe during IG. Surfer like you said became the universe by LT. No one is saying that can't happen.

Mr Master
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
She is neither the creator nor the destroyer any universe. Haven't seen her destroy one or create one.

Well I'm a straight shooter, and this isn't a hate the Phoenix thread, so we should speak fairly.

Phoenix can re-create a Universe, she did warp 616.

Phoenix can NOT create a Universe, which is to make a Universe from nothing.

On panel proof tells us she can atleast destroy a Universe...an Eternity(single Universe)

Phoenix repaired the Mkraan Crystal...which had the power to destroy A Universe

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
A universe die and a new universe is formed when a big bang happens, Phoenix sparks that process.

That's what I'm saying though...Phoenix does not even spark that process up, not across the Multiverse, in A Single Universe she's the spark. It may be the X-universe.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing


Here's my hierarchy:

1. TOAA
2. The Living Tribunal
3. The Infinity Gauntlet
4. UN
5. Abraxas
6. Multiverse Eternity
7. Eternity (616)/Death/Infinity/Entropy/Oblivion/Phoenix Force

I feel about the same, but I put THOU above the Living Tribunal...and I put Multi-Death above THOU...then the TOAA.

Mr Master
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Thanos has also become one with the universe during IG. Surfer like you said became the universe by LT. No one is saying that can't happen.

Actually Thanos never destroyed or remade the Multi-verse...is that what your saying? Cause that's what I was referring to.

Thanos became the Universe Twice...with the IG and also with a Cosmic Cube.

Sorry I'm not sure what you meant.

sexyking
I dont think GS has any way to come back all his arguments have been countered and i believe he is now KO. The next logical move for him to make is either run away or create a new name thats if he doesnt already have a second name. Mr M you have won this battle and opened a lot of eyes to the truth but in doing so you have gained an enemy lol watch your back.

Mr Master
Originally posted by sexyking
Mr M you have won this battle and opened a lot of eyes to the truth but in doing so you have gained an enemy lol watch your back.

lol...

Broly92
no I still think Phenoix wins because I just want to go with the underdog who seems right GS
mr.m loses stick out tongue

batdude123
GS= OWNED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Broly92
Batdude123=Owned!!! times two stick out tongue

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
Batdude123=Owned!!! times two stick out tongue

Broly92=OWNED TIMES INFINITY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Broly92
Broly92=owned times negative infinity is what you meant

Mr Master
I did this already but...just in case anyone missed it.
:The Korvac vs Living Tribunal event:

This ought to settle the Korvac and Living Tribunal dispute once and for all.

What was it that really happened?
How powerful was Korvac?
How did he become so powerful?
Was he more powerful than LT?
If LT attacked him, how did he survive?

These questions will ALL be answered now, and yes, ya know me, with ON PANEL proof as always.

Ok, after thoroughly researching the issue I found out several interesting facts.
To begin with What if's suck.
I will prove myself.
Secondly Korvac was not the mastermind of this issue, machinations far beyond even his scope were at work in helping him survive LT's assault, this is the big moment of surprise and disappointment for all who thought Korvac was more powerful than LT.

Let's do it.

First ALL the positive showings of the issue, then I'll post the rediculousness of a What if comic.

First:
Korvac Absorbs ALL the power of these SIX cosmics, he had already absorbed Galactus's world ship, that gave him instant near-omnipotent power.
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/9373/korvacabsorb60dp.th.jpg
Korvac absorbs Galactus's world ship.
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/1017/korvacabsorbsg9uo.th.jpg
Korvac seals off his universe
http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/9540/korvacblockszeusandall7ga.th.jpg
LT penetrates Korvacs barrier to blow up the sun in this universe.
http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/2340/korvacvslt19lb.th.jpg
LT vaporizes a quarter of that solar system and Korvac survives, LT caught by surprise by this, decides to leave this universe and seal Korvac in it.
http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/9204/korvacvslt21rj.th.jpg
It would seem from that last scan that LT couldn't handle Korvac, so he fled, sealed the universe behind him and left that universe to wahtever fate awaited it.

The Surprise:
It was Death that protected Korvac from LT, from annihilation, how? Death simply didn't permit Korvac to die. How? It's Death, just like Thanos isn't fazed by mortality because of Death, so she did the same for Korvac.
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/1210/korvacdeath2ox.th.jpg

Death was Korvac's unbidden ally-Death was Korvac's unwanted master.
Death manipulated all this, no wonder Korvac survived LT's punishment, Death who is the master of mortality and immortality, did not allow Korvac to die along with the earth, because Death wanted to kill Eternity and Death knew it could get Korvac to retrieve the Ultimate Nullifier to destroy Eternity, this was Death's plan all along. Apparently even Death was unable to help Korvac withstand the UN though.
http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/249/korvacdeath21ns.th.jpg

courtesy of Mr Master

Mr Master
Now the reasons why we shouldn't use What If's in debates even if it includes LT:

Korvac with ALL his power, can't read a Celestial mind,
http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/7317/korvaccantreadcelestial1bc.th.jpg
Korvac CANNOT resurrect just anyone, only someone he kills. Yet he's "omnipotent", LOL.
http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/6895/tressurect2ch.th.jpg
Korvac fears an Armada of beings that are coming to battle him from all over this universe, but he can kill and absorb some of the most powerful beings in the universe. This is crap, with all his power he should be able to wipe this army out of existence.
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/5641/korvacfearsarmada8wj.th.jpg
Korvac absorbs every being on this earth to battle this armada. He becomes so powerful he can sit on planet earth, like if it's a workout ball, but he's still going to rely on the Ultimate Nullifier to destroy this armada along with the universe.
http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/9558/korvacabsorbsearth3do.th.jpg
Watcher breaks through Korvac's barrier like nothing, and this is after he absorbed every being on earth, even the visiting Celestials.
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/565/korvacwatcherslipsin7sj.th.jpg
Korvac needs Ultimate Nullifier to destroy armada, nonsense, but it's a What If, so why complain.
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/6039/korvacneedsuntokillarmada1io.th.jpg

courtesy of Mr Master

Mr Master
LOL

http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/4065/coollineaboutrunningaway1wn.th.jpg

batdude123
I've said it once and I'll say it again:

Galactic Storm=OWNED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Broly92
I'll say it again
Batdude123=Owned times two laughing out loud

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
I'll say it again
Broly92 is a DUMBASS!!!!!! laughing out loud

Broly92
Thats not true I'm only half embarrasment of one

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
Thats true I'm a whole dumbass. embarrasment

Broly92
I know you are stick out tongue

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
I know you are awesome batdude

Broly92
Originally posted by batdude123

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
You kick ass batdude!!!!!! rock

Broly92
Originally posted by batdude123

spam spam_laser

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
Broly92=LOSER!!!!!!!

Broly92
stupid

Broly92=Sucky loser dummy head

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
stupid

Broly92=Sucky loser dummy head

^^^ What he said.

Broly92
Indeed what he said thumb up

batdude123
Originally posted by Broly92
batdude123=king of awesomeness thumb up

Broly92
Shutup=Shutup=Shutup=Shutup+Shut up =

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
TTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUPPPPPP
PPPPPPPPPP

Mider
is this the entire PF or just an avatar.

illadelph12
According to GS, Jean IS the entire Phoenix Force.

This is going to get ugly.

WhiteWitchKing
Originally posted by Mr Master
Well I'm a straight shooter, and this isn't a hate the Phoenix thread, so we should speak fairly.

Phoenix can re-create a Universe, she did warp 616.

Phoenix can NOT create a Universe, which is to make a Universe from nothing.

On panel proof tells us she can atleast destroy a Universe...an Eternity(single Universe)

I know all that except here destroying a universe. When was that?



The same Crystal she guards? I don't know whether to say that it's a big feat or that it was in her to be fix what she guards.




Nope. I just see the Phoenix Force as having counter parts similar to Galactus having counter parts in other realities. It's just that the Phoenix Force of 616 is more powerful than other PF from alternate realities.



big grin I agree (forgot about those). Except Multiverse Death is a bit uncertain. Thanos has done things without even knowing. I don't think MU Death is above the Living Tribunal who was absorbed by HOTU. Thanos has unconsciously allowed for his own defeat during the Infinity Gauntlet.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Mider
is this the entire PF or just an avatar.

Phoenix Force ofcourse.

The only one worthy...

Mr Master
Originally posted by illadelph12
According to GS, Jean IS the entire Phoenix Force.

This is going to get ugly.

That's correct.

The thing is though, I still consider her very powerful...(come on remaking a universe in your hands)but we've been desensitized to the scopes of power in this day & age, the industry is supersaturated with characters that can do anything.

So obliterating a galaxies is a walk in the park now, when before superman in metropolis could hear a mosquito sneeze in central africa...and that was something to bend a knee at.

Things change...it's the way..I guess...

Cosmic Cube
Nice job Mr. Master.

But I'm confused. Isn't the Phoenix supposed to be the sum of all life in the multiverse?

It is also said to be "the nexus of all psionic energy which does, has, and ever will, exist in all realities of the multiverse."

Wouldn't that make it a multiversal entity?

Mr Master
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
I know all that except here destroying a universe. When was that?

On the first page it's pretty much evident that she can destroy atleast...A Universe...yep..I'll give her that.
She rearranged the 616 Universe atom by atom in her hands(very impressive feat)she had full control of that Universe...she can...destroy a Universe.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
The same Crystal she guards? I don't know whether to say that it's a big feat or that it was in her to be fix what she guards.

You know it's funny you say that...I thought that once.
But it makes no difference...it still keeps he at a Universal level.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Nope. I just see the Phoenix Force as having counter parts similar to Galactus having counter parts in other realities. It's just that the Phoenix Force of 616 is more powerful than other PF from alternate realities.

That's an interesting theory...pardon me...am I right by saying theory?
I'm saying..you read this in what issues?
You have scans?

This is what I know about the Phoenix Force:

The Phoenix accidentally met Galactus and tried to stop him from consuming a planet's life energy, but the battle ended when Galactus told the Phoenix force what pain it caused the Universe... In its natural state the Phoenix force was sustained by the warmth of life's fiery cycle -- but when the Phoenix gained its own consciousness, and became aware of its own existence, it wanted to enter our plane of reality. To exist here it took power from life yet to be born, and had thus become a parasite on the Universe...
http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/2949/pfsuckslife10qp.th.jpg
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/640/pfsuckslife3ey.th.jpg

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
I agree (forgot about those). Except Multiverse Death is a bit uncertain. Thanos has done things without even knowing. I don't think MU Death is above the Living Tribunal who was absorbed by HOTU. Thanos has unconsciously allowed for his own defeat during the Infinity Gauntlet.

I hear that but Death survived a direct assault by Thanos with the Full power of the IG. everyone was Thanos's puppet...Death survived and even escaped...besides that she obviously keeps on ticking while Living Tribunal is absorbed and gone along with the most powerful beings in the reality.

Death's domain truly spans ALL creation...every Universe that Marvel has created, Death is there and will be the last there...until there is no more life to consume...and then Death it's self...wiil become non-existent.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
Nice job Mr. Master.

thanx...

Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
But I'm confused. Isn't the Phoenix supposed to be the sum of all life in the multiverse?

Obviously not.

There were alot of supposed to be's...no more of that.

Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
It is also said to be "the nexus of all psionic energy which does, has, and ever will, exist in all realities of the multiverse."
Wouldn't that make it a multiversal entity?

If you can iether show me or tell me where to see and read that in a comic book...I'll believe it.
And then you'l have to show me her using "all the psionic energy" of the multiverse..otherwise it's hyperbole. GS would be the first to say this.

As you can tell from page one...all her greatest feats came out..and non-were Multiversal.
Not even projecting the essence of the Lighthouse across all realities..which at first I gave her full credit...yes, GS had me on that one two...after flipping some pages found out this:

Necrom, and his two pupils Feron and Merlyn, discovered energy fields. They realized that these energy fields were doorways between worlds -- all worlds existed as reflections of each other in the so called Multiverse.

Everytime the parallel worlds were aligned they created an extremely powerful energy matrix. Necrom wanted the power of this energy matrix for himself...

Necrom, Feron, and Merlyn traveled to the prime world of all these parallel worlds -- that was of course "our" world, also known as 616...

On our earth they discovered a tower that functioned as a doorway to the other worlds... Necrom & Co. wanted to have this tower (this doorway) at all earths in all parallel realities, but to do this they needed something stronger than themselves...

Through meditation Feron had come in contact with a powerful force in the universe... This force was power without awareness, but when Feron's mind touched it, it became aware of its own existence...

At a moment when all the parallel worlds were aligned, Feron made the Phoenix force project the tower throughout the Multiverse, and now each world had a doorway to the other parallel worlds.

Necrom who wanted the power of the energy matrix, wanted the worlds to collide and become one -- this would give him the power of a god.

Why research is a good thing...

Cosmic Cube
Originally posted by Mr Master
thanx...



Obviously not.

There were alot of supposed to be's...no more of that.



If you can iether show me or tell me where to see and read that in a comic book...I'll believe it.
And then you'l have to show me her using "all the psionic energy" of the multiverse..otherwise it's hyperbole. GS would be the first to say this.

As you can tell from page one...all her greatest feats came out..and non-were Multiversal.
Not even projecting the essence of the Lighthouse across all realities..which at first I gave her full credit...yes, GS had me on that one two...after flipping some pages found out this:

Necrom, and his two pupils Feron and Merlyn, discovered energy fields. They realized that these energy fields were doorways between worlds -- all worlds existed as reflections of each other in the so called Multiverse.

Everytime the parallel worlds were aligned they created an extremely powerful energy matrix. Necrom wanted the power of this energy matrix for himself...

Necrom, Feron, and Merlyn traveled to the prime world of all these parallel worlds -- that was of course "our" world, also known as 616...

On our earth they discovered a tower that functioned as a doorway to the other worlds... Necrom & Co. wanted to have this tower (this doorway) at all earths in all parallel realities, but to do this they needed something stronger than themselves...

Through meditation Feron had come in contact with a powerful force in the universe... This force was power without awareness, but when Feron's mind touched it, it became aware of its own existence...

At a moment when all the parallel worlds were aligned, Feron made the Phoenix force project the tower throughout the Multiverse, and now each world had a doorway to the other parallel worlds.

Necrom who wanted the power of the energy matrix, wanted the worlds to collide and become one -- this would give him the power of a god.

Why research is a good thing...
You're good.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
You're good.

smokin'

superbatman86
Originally posted by Mr Master
This is ill...

http://img308.imageshack.us/img308/7329/w13kq.th.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/6445/w28jg.th.jpg
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/8638/w30lg.th.jpg
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/296/w41am.th.jpg
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4937/w56ah.th.jpg
http://img308.imageshack.us/img308/4689/w67sl.th.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/6131/w79ny.th.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/2527/w97gh.th.jpg
A little bit of trivia, who is this mighty being.?
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/9818/w109xs.th.jpg The watcher that first spotted Galactus.

Cosmic Cube
Question: was there a Phoenix Force in the previous universe?

The Marvel.com bio confuses me.

It says that the Phoenix allowed Eternity to create Galactus.

xmarksthespot
My oh my there is indeed a great deal of ownage in here.

Question though where do those charged with watching over the Omniverse, which is said to encompass the multiple multiverses, i.e. Roma and Merlyn although they may not necessarily be very powerful in the grand scheme, fit in?

Mr Master
Originally posted by superbatman86
The watcher that first spotted Galactus.

Nice.

WhiteWitchKing
Originally posted by Mr Master
On the first page it's pretty much evident that she can destroy atleast...A Universe...yep..I'll give her that.
She rearranged the 616 Universe atom by atom in her hands(very impressive feat)she had full control of that Universe...she can...destroy a Universe.

stick out tongue



Was there any doubt that she was anything but universal?



http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/17712590170.jpg&s=f5

There's also that What If where LT runs into the alternate reality Phoenix Force but What If's aren't canon.




I've read that. It just fits in with the Phoenix Force being part of creation like Galactus, Eternity, Death, Order, Chaos, etc.

The big bang occurred and "This is how I came into being" said the Phoenix Force. The PF actually remembers it's birth:
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=3/75...4.jpg&s=x11




Thanos wasn't trying to kill her. You and I know that. Throughout the whole affair, she was angry and displeased that he was now more powerful than her. When she attempted to fight him, she lost along with every other cosmic being. Against, Nebula with the Infinity Gauntlet, she also lost. She's not above the IG or HOTU. The Infinity Gauntlet has yet to even hurt LT. The HOTU pwned LT like no other.

Death is not above the IG or HOTU.

However, her realm is up for debate. Her realm is powerful. Where it is in the MU is unknown. When the Cosmic Egg of the Goddess caused a rapture that cleansed the cosmos and breaching even the fourth wall, Death in her realm knew this all along and was waiting as, you've provided:
http://img472.imageshack.us/my.php?image=deathperceivesall1vp.jpg



Warlock remarked "there was another you overlooked in your made frenzy of absorption Titan. For she too, exists in a plane actuality outside this poor reality. Sometimes you trying too hard is the problem. Sometimes surrendering is the only path to victory."

He overlooked it. Warlock also safe. Does that mean Warlock is more powerful than LT?

celestialdemon
I'm not going to comment on the Phoenix vs LT debate because I am ignorant on the subject. I don't follow Phoenix, so I have no right to comment on it. I'll leave that to GS.

Originally posted by Mr Master

Evidently I did, as I always knew I had.
Finally the New Living Tribunal bio is here and there it clarifies for us that indeed, "LT's power serpassed that of Gems."
Ofcourse I already said this but you bone heads were to stubborn to except this.

LT said he represents power that dwarfs the IG
Warlock acknowledge that LT serves someone beyond the IG
And the bio say's it too. -------- Now what!

LT said it.
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/7993/ltisaboveig5ez.th.jpg

LT was referring to the being he serves, not his own power. We know whomever he serves is above the IG. However, it's questionable if the LT is.

http://img151.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ltrulesig37jm.jpg

If the LT was so sure of his superior power, he would not have doubted himself in fighting Warlock. And if you want to use your "determining" explanation, it still means that the LT had to calculate his power against Warlock's. Not at all an indication of the LT dwarfing the IG.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Warlock said it.
http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/7757/ltorderswl0iy.th.jpg

True, but he never acknowledges the LT's superiority.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Living Tirbunal's bio says it.
http://img102.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ltbio6iy.jpg


Since you are putting stock in the Marvel handbook, let's expand on this link.

http://img515.imageshack.us/my.php?image=livingtribunal26bz.jpg

If you read everything, it acknowledges the Korvac saga, meaning LT was unable to kill Korvac and had to seal him away; it does not acknowledge the retcon of the Beyonder, which we all know happened; it states that the LT allowed the Surfer to become one with the universe for a moment, not turned him into a universe as you stated; it also mentions that the LT's position was nearly usurped by Protege, and it was Scathan the Celestial who saved the day. So, if you want to accept this bio, you have to accept all of it.


Originally posted by Mr Master

It's not the first time Death survives when the most powerful beings in the universe are being killed.
Here Death protects herself and Starfox and Nebula from utter destruction.
And THIS TIME his power with the IG, was applied to her(because she attacked him with the others)and the rest that were there.
Only Death survived, along with those she rescued.
http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/5355/deathsurvivesig2xf.th.jpg
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/8666/deathsurvuvesig22ul.th.jpg
thank you...

Thanos was not directly attacking Death at this point. He was fighting everyone else. Once Death attacked him, he took her and everyone else down at the same time.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Here the Watcher nor Eternity(single universe)himself could perceive the "Goddess's intentions.
Only Death was able, don't underestimate Death.
http://img472.imageshack.us/img472/904/deathperceivesall1vp.th.jpg

Lets go again to the handbook please.

http://img502.imageshack.us/my.php?image=eternity21rt.jpg

It says "Dr. Strange won, but although Eternity made him aware of the Goddess' plans, Strange was not allowed to retain that knowledge."

Mr Master
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
Question: was there a Phoenix Force in the previous universe?

The Marvel.com bio confuses me.

It says that the Phoenix allowed Eternity to create Galactus.

This is Galactus's origin...on panel, no Phoenix or any indication of it.

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5297/glive9uq.th.jpg
http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/9779/glive15zv.th.jpg
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/4595/glive24gt.th.jpg
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/497/glive32cx.th.jpg
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/203/glive43ba.th.jpg
http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/2025/glive50fp.th.jpg
http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/5825/glives64ga.th.jpg
http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/4945/glive75fi.th.jpg
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/4936/glive80yb.th.jpg

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