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Yep, you are about to read another of WD's fictional moral choice dilema thread. (this is a heads up for you newbies)

You guys helped me in the past with the "Discovery of a New Culture" and "The manifesto of Doom" polls. Now, I ask you all to provide your opinion and vote on this scenerio. This is one is bit more fictional with a touch of realism.

(The Scenerio)
A D'othu is a fictional creature. It's similar in shape to a human being with two legs, two arms, one head, etc...but it's NOT a human being and is not an animal...and is not an insect...and it's not a mutant. It's just some a creature with human apperances. Anyways, what is not important it's their origin...what's important is the effect the D'othus are causing for the people of a certain industrial nation (which is also fictional)

See, the problem is that D'othus are not a productive creature. In fact they're not very smart...actually they're basically consider certified idiots. They only reproduce, eat, sleep, crap, and do nothing else. However they have a very distinctive feature in their bodies. They have very sharp claws. When a D'othu feels threaten they don't reason they just attack viciously and aggresive. Which makes them rather dangerous for the local residents of the industrial nation. Even worse when they're strong in numbers they could practically kill anyone near them. Including defenseless children or elders.

You cannot consume a D'othu because their flesh is disguting terrible. Not even rats would eat them.

They're multiplying in population. Eventually they will become an imminent disaster for the people of the industrial nation.

(The dilema)
You are one of the main council members of the Industrial nation. The other members have decided on 5 choices with D'othu issue. It's a stalemate and you have the final vote. Your decision will have an impact on the people of your nation and the D'othu.

What is your vote?

Discuss.

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
(The dilema)
You are one of the main council members of the Industrial nation. The other members have decided on 5 choices with D'othu issue. It's a stalemate and you have the final vote. Your decision will have an impact on the people of your nation and the D'othu.

What is your vote?

Discuss.

Either exterminate them, or throw them in a zoo/some form of containment compound.

Hey WD, you know I DO LIKE YOU....hahaha.........but the hay.....this?? you almost sound like me..........lol

I suppose you would have to treat them on their own level and intelligence. Counselling might help,,hehe, but not likely since they are very different....I would suppose that there would be a tribunal of the masters to make this defect a productive part of society........lol

First you have to think of the education of your children on these different people, kind of like today..........

Yet if they are lower in IQ, and what is meant by that, cause there are many here that are..............then what????.........What should we do with ignorant people???..................IMO you love them, and give them a space................OH TAY........I'm done now.............*creeps off now*

I would try to educate them to have some sort of use, or at least to control the threat they present, that will depend on their intelligence too, and if they are such a big deal to the nation, then there should be large investiments in research about them and people working on that matter. No need to exterminate them, there are ways to solve the situation by investing in ecology, and scientific research.

WD........what movie did you just see???

Did the industrialized people live there first? Or were the D'othus there first and the other people just kinda moved in and set up shop?

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Either exterminate them, or throw them in a zoo/some form of containment compound.


Greatest post ever...


As Morgoths said...Who was there first?

Originally posted by Morgoths_Wrath
Did the industrialized people live there first? Or were the D'othus there first and the other people just kinda moved in and set up shop?

That's a good question. However I don't have an aswer for it. Sorry...you basically work the decision based on the information provided.

Deb...this scenerio is based on a science fiction project. I can't tell you more for now. But do take this poll seriously. It would really help for the purposes of discussion.

Seems like it's based on any number of society's that have moved or made changes to "lesser" societies that cannot adapt to the new "master" society.

It depends...........haha.........."Depends"........

I really cannot make a defninite decision, But if it seems that they are playing NO part in the local ecosystem,
Eg. They don't control a specific population, they don't provide food for another species, If they truly are abandoned by nature, as you make it seem, they they really have no right to exist...

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
Yep, you are about to read another of WD's fictional moral choice dilema thread. (this is a heads up for you newbies)

You guys helped me in the past with the "Discovery of a New Culture" and "The manifesto of Doom" polls. Now, I ask you all to provide your opinion and vote on this scenerio. This is one is bit more fictional with a touch of realism.

(The Scenerio)
A D'othu is a fictional creature. It's similar in shape to a human being with two legs, two arms, one head, etc...but it's NOT a human being and is not an animal...and is not an insect...and it's not a mutant. It's just some a creature with human apperances. Anyways, what is not important it's their origin...what's important is the effect the D'othus are causing for the people of a certain industrial nation (which is also fictional)

See, the problem is that D'othus are not a productive creature. In fact they're not very smart...actually they're basically consider certified idiots. They only reproduce, eat, sleep, crap, and do nothing else. However they have a very distinctive feature in their bodies. They have very sharp claws. When a D'othu feels threaten they don't reason they just attack viciously and aggresive. Which makes them rather dangerous for the local residents of the industrial nation. Even worse when they're strong in numbers they could practically kill anyone near them. Including defenseless children or elders.

You cannot consume a D'othu because their flesh is disguting terrible. Not even rats would eat them.

They're multiplying in population. Eventually they will become an imminent disaster for the people of the industrial nation.

(The dilema)
You are one of the main council members of the Industrial nation. The other members have decided on 5 choices with D'othu issue. It's a stalemate and you have the final vote. Your decision will have an impact on the people of your nation and the D'othu.

What is your vote?

Discuss.

what's your question?

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
what's your question?
Whether you'd choose:

A. Extermination
B. Relocation of the D'othus in another land (this will cause foreign conflict)
B. Educate the D'othu to be productive (this will take a century to accomplish)
C. Sterilize the D'othus females
D. Adapt to the D'othus lifestyle

Anyway, I think I'd choose B.

No need to be fictional - there's enough real life problems.

First I will deal with the ones that I would not support -

Extermination - Down right no. It sounds as if they are a sentient (or on the way to being sentient) species, even if not particularly smart. Regardless, humans have always, in one way or another, had to handle living in a world where there a many things that could kill us. It usually isn't the fault of the animal, but rather a by product of population growth and human necessity. As a species it appears we are almost beyond the point where we intentionally drive an animal species to extinction, and I see no way it could be the right solution here, especially when the D'othus sound similar at this stage to the ancestors of homo sapians. I would hope that as people we had moved beyond "extermination" as an answer to a problem.

Relocation of the D'othus in another land (this will cause foreign conflict) - No. For all intents and purposes this would be the D'othus natural habitat. That, and I think the world would be a better place if politicians made the hard decisions for the greater good in the long run. Making the D'othus the problem of another nation, and risking international conflict reeks of weak politicians trying to avoid making a real decision and hoping someone else will make the hard decision.

Sterilize the D'othus females - A softer, more PC way of extermination, or perhaps it would only be a way of controlling D'othus population. Regardless it would be labour intensive, and have few tangible benefits, and plenty of moral conundrums. A short term plan at best, once again failing to really make a solid decision on the matter - after all, if it wasn't geared towards extermination, how long would a government happily do it for? As long as the nation existed?

Adapt to the D'othus lifestyle - Another short term solution I would believe. It is perhaps the most acceptable of the unsuitable options in my opinion - that is learning to live with the D'othus and their peculiarities. However that wont stop problems arising, and it would be disastrous to go to far one way, that is making people adopt the D'othus lifestyle. It might sound cynical, but while the D'othus sound basically sentient, it does not appear they have a real culture or society - thus, it would be difficult to adopt or adapt to for an advanced human society. But we, as a species, have learned to co-exist with plenty of dangerous species, so it might be possible.

The one I would support.

Educate the D'othu to be productive (this will take a century to accomplish) - But only if it is done right. I don't believe it would be correct to turn them into a form of cheap labour or disposable force. And while it might sound cynical, the humans aren't going anywhere, and for the D'othus to persist in this directionless state will cause increasing conflict as their population grows. Thus it is practical. I do not believe the human culture has the right to exterminate them, but I do believe they have a duty to attempt to make the situation as peaceful as possible. Ultimately co-existence should be the goal. Now the D'othus don't have to be assimilated or anything like that, but raised above the level they are at the moment - that is allowed to make use of the sentience that they appear to have the early stages of. Once they began to understand and utilise higher cognitive functions and social constructs I believe that the D'othus would have the potential to grow as a species, and perhaps curb the aspects of their species that are a threat to humans. And I believe there would be benefits to this for the D'othus - medicine, history, science. Now I am not saying the human nation addict them to human society, but rather lay the ground work for the D'othus to consciously begin their own culture, so that the gap between our species and theirs is reduced, and so we can better formulate a peaceful co-existance based upon reason and understanding that is productive for all concerned. I believe that 100 years would be a small price to pay to achieve such an end.

Oh just nuke em and get it over with....

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura

The one I would support.

Educate the D'othu to be productive (this will take a century to accomplish) - But only if it is done right. I don't believe it would be correct to turn them into a form of cheap labour or disposable force. And while it might sound cynical, the humans aren't going anywhere, and for the D'othus to persist in this directionless state will cause increasing conflict as their population grows. Thus it is practical. I do not believe the human culture has the right to exterminate them, but I do believe they have a duty to attempt to make the situation as peaceful as possible. Ultimately co-existence should be the goal. Now the D'othus don't have to be assimilated or anything like that, but raised above the level they are at the moment - that is allowed to make use of the sentience that they appear to have the early stages of. Once they began to understand and utilise higher cognitive functions and social constructs I believe that the D'othus would have the potential to grow as a species, and perhaps curb the aspects of their species that are a threat to humans. And I believe there would be benefits to this for the D'othus - medicine, history, science. Now I am not saying the human nation addict them to human society, but rather lay the ground work for the D'othus to consciously begin their own culture, so that the gap between our species and theirs is reduced, and so we can better formulate a peaceful co-existance based upon reason and understanding that is productive for all concerned. I believe that 100 years would be a small price to pay to achieve such an end.

What happens if they don't want to change and learn and grow, this isn't something people can force on others. There not only needs to be a willingness to learn but also a drive behind the willingness as well. So your idea could be successful if the DO whatever race is willing to accept this "growth."

Originally posted by debbiejo
Oh just nuke em and get it over with....

Ba-Hah! It is a good thing mine was the deciding vote. In my imaginery world after an intensive scientific/educational program lasting 100 years the D'othus and human species learned to live together with two virbant and unique cultures that, through cultural interation, has benifited both species.

I was awarded the highest medel of the nation, and wrote a best selling novel.

I appreciate the responses so far everyone. Thank you for contributing. Let me touch on something my friend and I were discussing about this scenerio last night. He mentions why can't the D'othus be domesticate? Turn them into pets. We do it with dogs, cats, snakes...etc...why can't it be done with these creatures. Even thought is not an option on the poll it's an interesting point and a posibility. What do you think?

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
I appreciate the responses so far everyone. Thank you for contributing. Let me touch on something my friend and I were discussing about this scenerio last night. He mentions why can't the D'othus be domesticate? Turn them into pets. We do it with dogs, cats, snakes...etc...why can't it be done with these creatures. Even thought is not an option on the poll it's an interesting point and a posibility. What do you think?
Well if they have the ability to be productive, it'd be bit of a waste to limit them to be simply house pets.

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
Let me touch on something my friend and I were discussing about this scenerio last night. He mentions why can't the D'othus be domesticate? Turn them into pets. We do it with dogs, cats, snakes...etc...why can't it be done with these creatures. Even thought is not an option on the poll it's an interesting point and a posibility. What do you think?

...

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
They have very sharp claws. When a D'othu feels threaten they don't reason they just attack viciously and aggresive. Which makes them rather dangerous for the local residents of the industrial nation. Even worse when they're strong in numbers they could practically kill anyone near them. Including defenseless children or elders.

I think that would be a bad idea. It sounds to me like trying to turn a panther or a bear into a household pet.

btw...I think education is the only real moral and civilized way to handle the problem.

That's not true, anything will taste good with the right seasonings....

Though if you can educate them enough and they are not wild evil things why not have them around for company, playmates, pets sorta....If they can fetch, then they could get your paper, answer your phone, feel productive...maybe even make dinner........hmmm

*wants one*

Though they might be used in some underground prostitution rings...

Originally posted by Soleran
What happens if they don't want to change and learn and grow, this isn't something people can force on others. There not only needs to be a willingness to learn but also a drive behind the willingness as well. So your idea could be successful if the DO whatever race is willing to accept this "growth."

That was something I considered, but the scenario pretty much says that they can be made productive with 100 years of work- so it is a moot point. The industrial nation has the ability to change them - and ultimatly it seems to me that is the correct path out of the choices here, because something needs to be done.

Wasn't there a movie called "Troglodytes" or something. They ended up living underground and forming their own society because they weren't accepted by other humans.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Wasn't there a movie called "Troglodytes" or something. They ended up living underground and forming their own society because they weren't accepted by other humans.

If they did the Morlocs and the Mole people would eat them.

Out of the options, I'd educate them.

However, isolation would be my preferred solution. Give them half of the country or whatever, wall it off, and leave them be. If they advance, they'll become productive on their own to ensure their own survival, at which point they could be reintegrated into the other half. If they don't advance, they'll be extinct. Very little work necessary.

Originally posted by crazylozer
Out of the options, I'd educate them.

However, isolation would be my preferred solution. Give them half of the country or whatever, wall it off, and leave them be. If they advance, they'll become productive on their own to ensure their own survival, at which point they could be reintegrated into the other half. If they don't advance, they'll be extinct. Very little work necessary.


How true indeed..................man loves to stick his hand in everything thinking that in his infinite wisdom we will solve the problems for those that don't realize how much of a problem they are.

Answer is, wrong it all boils down to natural selection over a long enough period of time anyway. If you decide to educate the creatures for 100 years whose to say the process, the pain etc. Whose to say the creatures want it and its more "humane" to their understanding of life?

So in essence you are in effect forcing your will on these creatures no matter what..........................has anyone asked these creatures or presented some ideas for them to assist in what might work best for them?

Originally posted by Soleran
How true indeed..................man loves to stick his hand in everything thinking that in his infinite wisdom we will solve the problems for those that don't realize how much of a problem they are.

Answer is, wrong it all boils down to natural selection over a long enough period of time anyway. If you decide to educate the creatures for 100 years whose to say the process, the pain etc. Whose to say the creatures want it and its more "humane" to their understanding of life?

So in essence you are in effect forcing your will on these creatures no matter what..........................has anyone asked these creatures or presented some ideas for them to assist in what might work best for them?

I don't think it should be seen as a "Manifest destiny" situation, or anything of that nature. The scenario states that the D'othus population is booming, and they could come into conflict with people. For all intents and purposes, if you wish to use natural selection, then they are doing great, and with out human interference will continue to do great - but the fact is that isn't going to happen - one way of another humans are in control of their destiny, good or bad.

And that is practical and unavoidable. Now humans have been fortunate enough to mostly remove ourselves from the pros and cons of natural selection, and to effect any number of species outside of normal evolutionary progress. Every animal we have sent extinct or domesticated was faced with a situation that was outside the realms of normal evolution. The same, it seem, applies here. There is no choice for just leaving them alone (beyond adapting to them) - thus it becomes the lessor of the evils - and I would say using our intelligence and understanding to educate them is infinitely more just and preferable then exterminating them. Somehow I imagine that is more humane, and that since any species has a biological imperative to survive they would choose to live.

And once again - as cynical as it sounds - they don't really have a choice. The humans in this scenario are essentially holding all the cards - the D'othus, if you wished to give them a choice, and hoped they understood would be presented with "you can all die, you can go away but we don't know what will happen then, you can be sterilised and die out anyway, or you can be educated so that you can control you instincts and have a safer, more beneficial relationship with people."

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
If they did the Morlocs and the Mole people would eat them. See? Anything tastes good with a little spice... eat


They should have a spokes man and a council...Can they comprehends that???

I notice the exterminate option is winning in the polls, but it seems that no one has really made a post to state why extermination would be the correct way to go....

I think they choose extermination because is the quickest way to dispose of the problem. However, something it was point out is that Sterilization (sp?) is also a form of extermination. A little slower but also effective.

On the issue of who was there first. I ask that question to the person who help me create the scenerio (yes, this isn't entirely my project) and we pretty much agree that it is important. We decided that the history records of the industrial society are under review becuase they're inconclusive as to which one was there first. So, at this point in time there is no solid evidence as to who was there first. Unfortunally the problem with the D'othus is still at hand. It requires a solution ASAP. As I said earlier... we will work with the information provided and the final vote belongs to the last member of the council (i.e. You)

I say they should be sterilized.

Why should we not make use of the peaceful alternative, if success is highly probable? Not only will it save the lives of innocents--assuming that extermination is a favored choice--but it will, in turn, aid the industrial nation with labor and commerce.

I cannot explain it, but I would be more in favor of extermination of the D'othus than sterilization.

I dont know where you are coming from with this D'othu......

The most simple solution (other than the annihilation of their race) would be the re-education of them under the nation's laws and productivity. Any one of them who threatens or attacks without due cause should be arrested and jailed like any human (or whatever fictional punishment) until they as a whole get the picture. Becuase they are easily the aggrevators of the situation and the one's causing instability, yet it is unfair to treat them all based off the actions of a few of them. So my answer is education and enhanced security/laws/enforcement until they can either integrate into the society, or if all else fails, be relocated as a race.

Just wondering, does this scenario have anything to do with the increasing muslim population/problem in Europe? because it seems to be quite a comparison.

Originally posted by The Black Ghost


Just wondering, does this scenario have anything to do with the increasing muslim population/problem in Europe? because it seems to be quite a comparison.

Negative, but good observation. The scenerio may seen to have similiraties with the Jewish Holocaust when you see the final solution on the title. I assure is not to be taken in that sense. It's not intentional or a satire of any holocaust. These creatures are consider more like a pest problem rather than semantics or racist issues.