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What is this world comming to.

Your right, what is the world coming too.

cap is to technical and intelligent

But Thing is a great fighter plus he is stronger and tougher

Thing takes this 10/10. The only way Cap wins is if he can get hold of Thor's hammer.

Originally posted by lilnutta12
cap is to technical and intelligent
Ben is smart and a good fighter. Ben wins.

Ben wins. Does anyone here have the scan where Colossus knocked Cap through a wall? Thats how I see this fight going. (I know it wasn't the real Colossus but it still porves a point)

Originally posted by nimbus006
Thing takes this 10/10. The only way Cap wins is if he can get hold of Thor's hammer.

cosign......Give Steve thors' hammer and games over

I have the book where it's a Skrull looking like Colossus and he hit Captain from behind and Capt says that if he hadn't rolled foward in time that he would have lost his head

But is Captain America worth?

Cap get's torn apart....

Thing 10/10.

Originally posted by golem370
But is Captain America worth?

Captain America is worthy enough to hold the hammer. He's picked it up before.

Back on topic, Ben wins this fight. 9.9 times out of 10

Originally posted by Adam Warlock
Captain America is worthy enough to hold the hammer. He's picked it up before.

Back on topic, Ben wins this fight. 9.9 times out of 10 Ha, and every one said Doom couldn't lift it and here Cap can Ha This is crazy.

I would say that I gave Captain America would lose 9/10 times because in the off chance he gets to throw is Shield and then distract Thing from the returning shield he could K.O Thing plus Captain America is faster and possibly smarter

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Ha, and every one said Doom couldn't lift it and here Cap can Ha This is crazy.



It's not a strength it's a worthy thing. Superman,Hulk and I believe Hercules tried to lift it and no dice... Because they weren't truly worthy for the honor.

Let's see.

Ben:

is stronger
is tougher
has way more stamina


Yeah, America's got the shield, but Ben is a skilled fighter too.

thing 10/10

ben isnt near Caps skill level in the least bit, ben aint nothing but a n ex boxer, not a world champ just an ex boxer, cap made bantam look like a noob in the hands.

and as for cap winning, Do pressure points work on Thing??? if they dont i cant see thing being hurt too bad, so this fight would just be cap running and dodging.

Well he had army training and wrestling training and as you said boxing training. http://spider-bob.com/heroes/marvel/ThingII.htm

Pressure points aren't working on the thing. Cap has every chance of winning if he gets lucky, but he is NOT pulling a majority. Most brutes cap goes toe to toe with aren't experienced great fighters like ben. Caps only taking 3/10

Thing has the mits and reaction time to grab the shield out of the air. Once that happens cap is doomed.

Originally posted by golem370
Well he had army training and wrestling training and as you said boxing training. http://spider-bob.com/heroes/marvel/ThingII.htm people in the army cant fight, and i doubt his wrestling is anything near as impressive as the caps, this fight comes down to who can run faster, because if cap gets hit a few times hes out like a light.

People in the Army can't fight? Explain...
Thing wins...

Originally posted by King KAM
people in the army cant fight, and i doubt his wrestling is anything near as impressive as the caps, this fight comes down to who can run faster, because if cap gets hit a few times hes out like a light.


Why don't you go and try and fight army spacial forces, then answer me later.

Originally posted by King KAM
people in the army cant fight, and i doubt his wrestling is anything near as impressive as the caps, this fight comes down to who can run faster, because if cap gets hit a few times hes out like a light.

Not sure where you fabricated that from. Army, Marines etc all can fight. Each even usually has their own typically fighting style. Even some other Marvel characters like Moon Knight and Punisher got their starts fighting in the Special Forces

http://www.marveldirectory.com/teams/ucwf.htm

Well personally I don't think everyone can fight. Nowadays most train to use guns, explosives, recon, drive tanks, use artillery. How many actually train to box. fight. I'm just saying that the army gives you what 6 months of boot camp? How can that possibly turn you into a fighter...

What I am saying is that most guys that go into the army, are agressive to begin with, and probably have already had some training in boxing or other fields.

The idea that the army/marines/etc. makes you some kind of super-fighter is ridiculous. They have nothing on actual martial artists. Why?

Simple.

The government wants you shooting, not thinking you are superman, and trying to beat someone with your bare hands. True, they teach basic combatives, some close quarters combat, but all in all....there isn't a single military man (who doesn't practice some other style on the side, or some such) who could go up against a trained and/or professional fighter.

Versus the average joe, or even the average street fighter, military training is a lot. But the hand to hand portion lasts about two weeks of the thirteen week bootcamp. Two weeks compared to years and years? Meh.

Military combatives are over-rated. I'll take years of training in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Sambo, and Thai Boxing over a career in the marines any day.

EDIT: Rotiart slightly beat me to it.

DAMMIT PEOPLE!!! IS THIS WHAT BEN IS REDUCED TO ON THESE FORUMS????!!! THING FOR THE WIN.

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Why don't you go and try and fight army spacial forces, then answer me later. how about i do train with guys from the army and the marines and i kick the shit out of them with ease, they dont teach you anything in the army but a bunch of bullshit so you arent scared to go and die.

And my cousin IS a Marine Drill Sergeant, and my other one was in the army, and both of them agreed when i talked to them about it.

And yeah, i said it, people in the army cant fight.

Originally posted by Soljer
The idea that the army/marines/etc. makes you some kind of super-fighter is ridiculous. They have nothing on actual martial artists. Why?

Simple.

The government wants you shooting, not thinking you are superman, and trying to beat someone with your bare hands. True, they teach basic combatives, some close quarters combat, but all in all....there isn't a single military man (who doesn't practice some other style on the side, or some such) who could go up against a trained and/or professional fighter.

Versus the average joe, or even the average street fighter, military training is a lot. But the hand to hand portion lasts about two weeks of the thirteen week bootcamp. Two weeks compared to years and years? Meh.

Military combatives are over-rated. I'll take years of training in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Sambo, and Thai Boxing over a career in the marines any day.

EDIT: Rotiart slightly beat me to it. Actually i do Brazilian jiu-jitsu and Thai boxing, along with western boxing, they have military guys come in to train with us all day, and we TOOL them.

Originally posted by King KAM
how about i do train with guys from the army and the marines and i kick the shit out of them with ease, they don't teach you anything in the army but a bunch of bullshit so you arent scared to go and die.

And my cousin IS a Marine Drill Sergeant, and my other one was in the army, and both of them agreed when i talked to them about it.

And yeah, i said it, people in the army cant fight.


You know King kam, for once you are right, my step-father, who was in Marine Recon By the way, learned to disable or kill a man the fastest way possible. He said they taught him various strikes and grapples, but most of it was just to kill, breaking bones, pressure point strikes, quick judo tosses, fastest way to snap a mans neck, ya know, the important stuff. Everything else, all the fancy backflips and stances, thats just for show, killing your opponent is all that matters to true special forces.

So yeah, you are right, They don't know how to fight, just kill.

And I do Martial Arts Also, and I competed in Tournements, all the fancy shit goes out the door in a real fight, and whatever works, works.

Originally posted by Soljer
The idea that the army/marines/etc. makes you some kind of super-fighter is ridiculous. They have nothing on actual martial artists. Why?
Its true that people in the Army/Marines think highly about yourself, but thats part of the pride of serving your country. I think its bull to say they have nothing on martial artists, and its funny too because people who do martial arts are often the ones who think they are superman.

And I've delved into both, so I'm not being biased, but I disagree with what you say below.


Originally posted by Soljer
The government wants you shooting, not thinking you are superman, and trying to beat someone with your bare hands. True, they teach basic combatives, some close quarters combat, but all in all....there isn't a single military man (who doesn't practice some other style on the side, or some such) who could go up against a trained and/or professional fighter. It is true that people in the army practice basic principles, and that's all that is needed in a fight, all of the styles and flashiness is overrated, simple. When you have superior execution, knowing 7 styles won't really save you. You need a style for range, a style for up close, a ground style, and preferrably a grab style. Military utilizes all of those into one, and they also focus on a core defense and offense, being in supreme shape is demanded, most people cannot handle the training they do there that they do in "dojo's". Especially when it comes to doing stuff underwater.

The last part is bs. Ton's of these "trained martial artists" nowadays (particularly in America), come straight out of soccer mom dojo's and have a black belt in two years. WTF?

I respect more "real" martial arts and not ones that are solely "about the belt".

Originally posted by Soljer
Versus the average joe, or even the average street fighter, military training is a lot. But the hand to hand portion lasts about two weeks of the thirteen week bootcamp. Two weeks compared to years and years? Meh. That's to utuilitze them as quickly and as effectively as possible, and it is more concentrated and FAR more demanding than other styles would delve into in a few short weeks. But you are correct, years of combat "experience" (no matter how you get it), is vastly more important. Because most of these so called "fighters" have never even been in a real fight where "honor" and "respect" are useless, what will they do then in a real tense situation? This is why experienced street fighters often beat someone who has only trained and nothing else.

Originally posted by Soljer
Military combatives are over-rated. I'll take years of training in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Sambo, and Thai Boxing over a career in the marines any day.

1. Shooting, firing grenades, is all combat and is alot more dangerous. (Though I recognize that you are emphasizing hand to hand in a majority of this.)

I'd like to see these other styles defend our country. And like I said there's nothing WRONG with other styles, but fighting is constantly evolving all of the time, and to simply divide something into silly "styles" is absurd, they all have their purposes. They're different.

I'm looking up now and I'm starting to see bs, it reminds me of the batman thread where everyone is a trained martial artist master or some shit.

Originally posted by Apolloknight
You know King kam, for once you are right, my step-father, who was in Marine Recon By the way, learned to disable or kill a man the fastest way possible. He said they taught him various strikes and grapples, but most of it was just to kill, breaking bones, pressure point strikes, quick judo tosses, fastest way to snap a mans neck, ya know, the important stuff. Everything else, all the fancy backflips and stances, thats just for show, killing your opponent is all that matters to true special forces.

So yeah, you are right, They don't know how to fight, just kill.

And I do Martial Arts Also, and I competed in Tournements, all the fancy shit goes out the door in a real fight, and whatever works, works. Thank you, its about efficiency and not flashiness. About killing someone the quickest way possible, when a man is on you with a gun, all the flashiness in the world won't save you.

Originally posted by King KAM
people in the army cant fight, and i doubt his wrestling is anything near as impressive as the caps, this fight comes down to who can run faster, because if cap gets hit a few times hes out like a light.

Soldiers can't fight?!?!

Well considering Cap is a soldier I guess he cant fight

Good logic.

Originally posted by King KAM
people in the army cant fight, and i doubt his wrestling is anything near as impressive as the caps, this fight comes down to who can run faster, because if cap gets hit a few times hes out like a light. that is one of the stupidest thing's I've heard in a while.

Pressure points worked for Thing in Infinity crusade. Gamora was able to knock him out by using just one pressure point attack. Look for yourself if you don't belive me.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Its true that people in the Army/Marines think highly about yourself, but thats part of the pride of serving your country. I think its bull to say they have nothing on martial artists, and its funny too because people who do martial arts are often the ones who think they are superman.

And I've delved into both, so I'm not being biased, but I disagree with what you say below.


It is true that people in the army practice basic principles, and that's all that is needed in a fight, all of the styles and flashiness is overrated, simple. When you have superior execution, knowing 7 styles won't really save you. You need a style for range, a style for up close, a ground style, and preferrably a grab style. Military utilizes all of those into one, and they also focus on a core defense and offense, being in supreme shape is demanded, most people cannot handle the training they do there that they do in "dojo's". Especially when it comes to doing stuff underwater.

The last part is bs. Ton's of these "trained martial artists" nowadays (particularly in America), come straight out of soccer mom dojo's and have a black belt in two years. WTF?

I respect more "real" martial arts and not ones that are solely "about the belt".

That's to utuilitze them as quickly and as effectively as possible, and it is more concentrated and FAR more demanding than other styles would delve into in a few short weeks. But you are correct, years of combat "experience" (no matter how you get it), is vastly more important. Because most of these so called "fighters" have never even been in a real fight where "honor" and "respect" are useless, what will they do then in a real tense situation? This is why experienced street fighters often beat someone who has only trained and nothing else.



1. Shooting, firing grenades, is all combat and is alot more dangerous. (Though I recognize that you are emphasizing hand to hand in a majority of this.)

I'd like to see these other styles defend our country. And like I said there's nothing WRONG with other styles, but fighting is constantly evolving all of the time, and to simply divide something into silly "styles" is absurd, they all have their purposes. They're different.

well said man

I agree on the part that some dojo's give belts to quick, wenn I was still busy with judo a few years back, I also went to some tournements, so had to grapple or fight guy's with the same weight and same belt, some where way to good for me but others I could beat very easy.

When I was in a martial arts class, there were 3 things you had to do to move up, know your stances, be able to spar against others in your division well. It was more important to our master that you knew how to fight (him having been in the korean army) than knowing stances that meant nothing. I agree though.. I was only 1 belt up in our martial arts, my friends was 1 belt down from black belt in his, and yet when we sparred, I still kicked his but. :P he was real showy with his moves. Guess that counts for something.