thanos /w/ THOU v.s. pre-ret beyonder..who could win?

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galan7777777
this is not so much a v.s. as it is a personal question of mine.......pre-retcon was stated as the most powerful being ever created by marvel having the power of millions of multiverses combined, but did thanos not have the same power? he had so much power that it took TOAA himself to talk thanos out of destroying everything that exists......but the beyonder was so powerful that neither LT nor the other abstract cosmics did anything to try and stop him, but they did try 2 stop thanos (to no avail)....so who do u think is more powerful?

bigbran
already been done.

Thanos_THOTU
In DC vs. Marvel #1 (not the following issues) the Amalgam Brothers (pre-retcon) was basicly TOAA and the Presence teamworking.
They was said to be the sum of evreything in their Multi-verse.

Beyonder was millions of times of the entire Multi-verse combinded.
Beyonder would win.

bigbran
i think the hotu was.

galan7777777
Originally posted by bigbran
already been done. has it? im just personally curious who would win and y

bigbran
just the fact that we actually seen what happens when a whole universe, including all abstacts attacts hotu.

Thanos_THOTU
Beyonder would just destroy the Marvel Multi-verse (where Thanos is God) making him powerless... And probobly dead.

galan7777777
Originally posted by bigbran
just the fact that we actually seen what happens when a whole universe, including all abstacts attacts hotu. yeah but in the same sense the abstracts were too scared to even attack beyonder, thats my only arguement

Thanos_THOTU

galan7777777

Thanos_THOTU

galan7777777
theres a difference between TOAA and god, after all its TOAA that writes and draws "god" lol

Thanos_THOTU

galan7777777
exactly, and the writer can do whatever he wants.......he controls what happens

Thanos_THOTU

Thanos_THOTU
Besides, they can not go back in time making the old Beyonder comics go away.

galan7777777

galan7777777
they control everything that happens

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by galan7777777
absolutley, thats how there are v.s. comics between d.c. and marvel, and thats how they retcon beings which means the deliberate changing of previously stated facts
I put it wrong, let say... can they say that Living Tribunal can enter the Dragonball Multi-verse and destroy it, can they state that? -leagal*

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by galan7777777
they control everything that happens
They can retcon characters but that doesnt mean we forget them.

galan7777777
mot unless both of TOAA's agreed 2 it, but that wouldnt happen

soxfn89
werent the beyonders powers stolen from him once in a secret wars issue? Can Thanos' powers be stolen

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by galan7777777
mot unless both of TOAA's agreed 2 it, but that wouldnt happen
Beyonder could enter whichever multi-verse he wanted in the entire omni-verse.
If he wasent retconned by now Marvel would be sued.

galan7777777
Originally posted by soxfn89
werent the beyonders powers stolen from him once in a secret wars issue? Can Thanos' powers be stolen only because he allowed them 2 be stolen

galan7777777
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Beyonder could enter whichever multi-verse he wanted in the entire omni-verse.
If he wasent retconned by now Marvel would be sued. yes he could but the db universe isnt part of the marvel/dc omniverse

Thanos_1971
Hmmm.Beyonder.

galan7777777
Originally posted by Thanos_1971
Hmmm.Beyonder. i agree

Lord Urizen
Classic Beyonder takes this, cuz he'd beat anybody......period.

galan7777777
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Classic Beyonder takes this, cuz he'd beat anybody......period. but thanos beat every1 too, i think it might be a good fight.......but beyonder wins

doomsday49
thanos. He basically wiped out existence.

galan7777777
Originally posted by doomsday49
thanos. He basically wiped out existence. yes, but beyonder could have done the same

doomsday49
Originally posted by galan7777777
yes, but beyonder could have done the same

But he never did. You can't assume anything.

galan7777777
Originally posted by doomsday49
But he never did. You can't assume anything. true, but if LT and all the other abstracts could have beaten him they would have at least tried, but they didnt........however they did try 2 beat thanos HOTU, so thats where im getting my info lol

thedude1948
Originally posted by galan7777777
true, but if LT and all the other abstracts could have beaten him they would have at least tried, but they didnt........however they did try 2 beat thanos HOTU, so thats where im getting my info lol
They never did because they knew he was only an incomplete cosmic cube and was no threat to them.

galan7777777
Originally posted by thedude1948
They never did because they knew he was only an incomplete cosmic cube and was no threat to them. again heres the thread.....it clearly shows the abstracts fearing beyonder http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f95/t412978.html

galan7777777
Originally posted by galan7777777
again heres the thread.....it clearly shows the abstracts fearing beyonder http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f95/t412978.html 1ce again u cant debate fact

doomsday49
Originally posted by galan7777777
true, but if LT and all the other abstracts could have beaten him they would have at least tried, but they didnt........however they did try 2 beat thanos HOTU, so thats where im getting my info lol

o.k. i see what you're saying. But you can look at that in two ways:
1. They were too scared to do anything(you interpretation of the situation)
2. It wasn't worth going to war with an unknown being. (which is possible)

You can look at h.o.t.u situation in the same manner as well:

1. They(the abstract) don't feel he is that much of a threat
2. Or, they feel that this is a necessary struggle.

galan7777777
Originally posted by doomsday49
o.k. i see what you're saying. But you can look at that in two ways:
1. They were too scared to do anything(you interpretation of the situation)
2. It wasn't worth going to war with an unknown being. (which is possible)

You can look at h.o.t.u situation in the same manner as well:

1. They(the abstract) don't feel he is that much of a threat
2. Or, they feel that this is a necessary struggle. but as stated they did try 2 beat THOU, but not beyonder, instead they only plead with beyonder not to destroy the multiverse

doomsday49
Originally posted by galan7777777
but as stated they did try 2 beat THOU, but not beyonder, instead they only plead with beyonder not to destroy the multiverse

I don't think you understand my point. You can't assume that they were too scared to fight. It could very well be that they don't feel it's as necessary to fight, as you would like to think.

doomsday49
Originally posted by galan7777777
but as stated they did try 2 beat THOU

Isn't it possible that they had no other alternative but to fight; that it was, indeed, a necessary struggle. I don't see how this logic contribute to beyonder being more powerful than hotu.

doomsday49
Originally posted by galan7777777
1ce again u cant debate fact

What fact are those, panels after panels of lesser beings claiming the beyonder "omnipotence". You don't think thanos with hotu can fit those claims and descriptions?


There's only one difference between the two: Thanos shown to wiped out existence.

galan7777777
Originally posted by doomsday49
I don't think you understand my point. You can't assume that they were too scared to fight. It could very well be that they don't feel it's as necessary to fight, as you would like to think. its their job to at least interfere if the multiverse is at risk as it was when the beyonder threatened that he would destroy it,.......as was the balance of the multiverse in danger when beyonder destroyed death itself..when thanos made the same threats they at least tried to stop him

galan7777777
Originally posted by doomsday49
What fact are those, panels after panels of lesser beings claiming the beyonder "omnipotence". You don't think thanos with hotu can fit those claims and descriptions? actually one of those pannels shown dr .doom merged with galactus and his ship which = complete universal power......beyonder swated him away like a fly thats a pretty impressive feat

doomsday49
Originally posted by galan7777777
its their job to at least interfere if the multiverse is at risk as it was when the beyonder threatened that he would destroy it,.......as was the balance of the multiverse in danger when beyonder destroyed death itself..when thanos made the same threats they at least tried to stop him

lol.....dude, dude, beyonder threaten to destroy death, thanos threaten to destroy existence as a whole. That include, death, eternity, galactus, living tribunal and the rest of the cosmic conflagration. What other choice are there but to fight back.

doomsday49
Originally posted by galan7777777
actually one of those pannels shown dr .doom merged with galactus and his ship which = complete universal power......beyonder swated him away like a fly thats a pretty impressive feat

lol..again, you don't think thanos is capable of doing the same thing. Of course i said don't ever assume anything, so, i'll let your own logic take over from here on.

You wanna talk feat, lol, how about thanos wiping out existence with a smile on his face.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
In DC vs. Marvel #1 (not the following issues) the Amalgam Brothers (pre-retcon) was basicly TOAA and the Presence teamworking.
They was said to be the sum of evreything in their Multi-verse.

The Brothers being the supreme beings of their respective multiverses was an idea that got scrapped before it went to print. Therefore even though we have knowledge of this unrealised concept it doesnt mean we can treat it as fact within debate, as its not canon.

The Brothers were later retconned into servants of LT and Spectre:


http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21617512723.jpg&s=f10


Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Beyonder was millions of times of the entire Multi-verse combinded.
Beyonder would win.

Nope. It was claimed that Beyonder had such a level of power. However his showings on panel never verified these claims and often contradicted them,therefore that statement cant be treated as fact.

Certain posters would like us to take this unsupported statement pertaining to him having a million times the power of the multiverse combined as fact and yet:

Beyonder had his power forcibly taken from him by Dr Doom using Galactus' tech which he'd only just acquired

Beyonder apparently used half of his power to kill the abstract Death and yet didnt have the power required to bring her back into existence.

The Beyonder planned to end his physical existence by using the power of the M'kraan crystal, the nexus of Marvels multiverse.

Those are just a few of the examples i can think of at this point in time. However the statement is contradicted on panel and yet there is no display from Beyonder that verifies the statement. Other powers have since been written pulling off bigger and better feats. Heart Of The Infinite is one of them. With all that in mind, whilst PR Beyonder was certainly presented as more powerful, in terms of on panel displays he has nothing to make the point conclusive.

Cubicks
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The Brothers being the supreme beings of their respective multiverses was an idea that got scrapped before it went to print. Therefore even though we have knowledge of this unrealised concept it doesnt mean we can treat it as fact within debate, as its not canon.

The Brothers were later retconned into servants of LT and Spectre:


http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21617512723.jpg&s=f10




Nope. It was claimed that Beyonder had such a level of power. However his showings on panel never verified these claims and often contradicted them,therefore that statement cant be treated as fact.

Certain posters would like us to take this unsupported statement pertaining to him having a million times the power of the multiverse combined as fact and yet:

Beyonder had his power forcibly taken from him by Dr Doom using Galactus' tech which he'd only just acquired

Beyonder apparently used half of his power to kill the abstract Death and yet didnt have the power required to bring her back into existence.

The Beyonder planned to end his physical existence by using the power of the M'kraan crystal, the nexus of Marvels multiverse.

Those are just a few of the examples i can think of at this point in time. However the statement is contradicted on panel and yet there is no display from Beyonder that verifies the statement. Other powers have since been written pulling off bigger and better feats. Heart Of The Infinite is one of them. With all that in mind, whilst PR Beyonder was certainly presented as more powerful, in terms of on panel displays he has nothing to make the point conclusive.

This has already been done and explained here http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=414252&highlight=beyonder+thanos

GalacticStorm likes to dismiss what is stated in comics to support his opinion. He is under the impression that anything written in a comic, and not actually displayed in high-quality ink, can be discarded as hyperbole.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Cubicks
This has already been done and explained here http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=414252&highlight=beyonder+thanos

GalacticStorm likes to dismiss what is stated in comics to support his opinion. He is under the impression that anything written in a comic, and not actually displayed in high-quality ink, can be discarded as hyperbole.

A statement that is contradicted on panel is not a fact.

By your faulty logic when it was stated on panel that Galactus was the most powerful being in Marvel back in the 60's even though the point has since been contradicted many a time on panel as it has been stated then we as readers have no choice but to accept it as true.

Me and MrMaster have a debate going on, a debate that he has decided to get personal on and so i have responded in kind. Do not get involved on a personal level with matters that do not concern yourself.

Cubicks
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
A statement that is contradicted on panel is not a fact.

By your faulty logic when it was stated on panel that Galactus was the most powerful being in Marvel back in the 60's even though the point has since been contradicted many time on panel as it has been stated then we as readers have no choice but to accept it as true.

Me and MrMaster have a debate going on, a debate that he has decided to get personal on and so i have responded in kind. Do not get involved on a personal level with matters that do not concern yourself.

Your reaching GS and you know it. In the 60's how many beings in the MU were more powerful than Galactus?

It is not "faulty logic" to assume that what the writers write is true at the time it is written. You just throw it all out the window.

As far as "not getting involved" well you can take that statement and eat it. This is not the GS and Mr. Master forum. Furthermore, I just don't like you. You are insulting and your snide comments towards anyone not sharing your viewpoint show you have no capacity for reason. You claim you do but, you have yet to show it.

Anyway, I bumped the original thread concerning this.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Cubicks
Your reaching GS and you know it. In the 60's how many beings in the MU were more powerful than Galactus?

It is not "faulty logic" to assume that what the writers write is true at the time it is written. You just throw it all out the window.

And in Beyonders appearances how many times were there incidents which disputed the comment about him possessing a million times more power than that contained within the multiverse? confused

Precisely my point. And yet the logic highlighted by your previous post suggests we should ignore those various contradictions in favour of blindly accepting a caption. What the f**k?



Originally posted by Cubicks
As far as "not getting involved" well you can take that statement and eat it. This is not the GS and Mr. Master forum. Furthermore, I just don't like you. You are insulting and your snide comments towards anyone not sharing your viewpoint show you have no capacity for reason. You claim you do but, you have yet to show it.

Anyway, I bumped the original thread concerning this.

I am never the first to throw insults, however if i am insulted then i will and do respond in kind. That is where youre very mistaken. You have previously intruded on a situation which has been going on for months before your registration and taken sides without knowing the whole picture. If as a result of that you've taken a tongue lashing and decided you're not going to like me then boo hoo. I think i'll get over it. wink


The very fact that you can take a dislike to another forum member is beyond belief to me. My life in the real world is much too fulfilling for me to get caught up on an avatar and a sig on my pc screen. sad


Its flattering to think im that important to you. laughing out loud

Cubicks
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
And in Beyonders appearances how many times were there incidents which disputed the comment about him possessing a million times more power than that contained within the multiverse? confused

Precisely my point. And yet the logic highlighted by your previous post suggests we should ignore those various contradictions in favour of blindly accepting a caption. What the f**k?

I don't know GalaticStorm, how many are there? Why don't you point them out? I know you are dying to. Let's go through them.

Where did I state that we should blindly accept a caption? I do not recall saying that. I recall saying that you ignored all captions altogether. Seems like you are trying to put words in my mouth GalacticStorm. Why?

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I am never the first to throw insults, however if i am insulted then i will and do respond in kind. That is where youre very mistaken. You have previously intruded on a situation which has been going on for months before your registration and taken sides without knowing the whole picture. If as a result of that you've taken a tongue lashing and decided you're not going to like me then boo hoo. I think i'll get over it. wink

In this case you are correct, I never gave you the option, I insulted you first. However, your remarks about responding in kind are rather misleading. You lace your responses with taunts, rudeness, and genuinely condescending statements.

And I did not "choose a side", I read all of the relevant posts (even yours) and made my own decision. My opinions do differ from yours and I am glad that you can get over that.


Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The very fact that you can take a dislike to another forum member is beyond belief to me. My life in the real world is much too fulfilling for me to get caught up on an avatar and a sig on my pc screen. sad


It should not be beyond belief to you, you set yourself up for it. If your life has soo much more meaning then why waste it here? BTW, this quote from you shows that condescending nature you have, I would work on that in the real world.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Its flattering to think im that important to you. laughing out loud

Well your ego knows no bounds, I can't argue with ignorance.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Cubicks
I don't know GalaticStorm, how many are there? Why don't you point them out? I know you are dying to. Let's go through them.

Ive already listed a few in this very thread amongst others. Please have the courtesy to properly read and comprehend posts prior to attempting a rebuttal. smile



Originally posted by Cubicks
Where did I state that we should blindly accept a caption? I do not recall saying that. I recall saying that you ignored all captions altogether. Seems like you are trying to put words in my mouth GalacticStorm. Why?

Well what exactly are you saying? All comments posted are pertaining to the same point, the comparative level of the Beyonders power, therefore if this level being referred to has been disputed on panel many a time then all comments relating to the same point are contradicted. Capeesh? eek!

With the comments contradicted and no on panel performances to verify the scale those comments depict then said comments cannot be taken as fact. Game over. thumb down



Originally posted by Cubicks
In this case you are correct, I never gave you the option, I insulted you first. However, your remarks about responding in kind are rather misleading. You lace your responses with taunts, rudeness, and genuinely condescending statements.

Well if you insulted me first then how can you criticise me for responding to said insults?

If you insulted me first and it wasnt until then i conversed with you in a negative tone then how can you argue with my remarks pertaining to me responding in kind when the point has been illustrated right before your eyes?

Like i said youre a new registrant and you intruded on a situation you had little to no knowledge of. If you saw me being insulting then its because theres history between myself and said debater. You nosedived in clueless. embarrasment


Originally posted by Cubicks
And I did not "choose a side", I read all of the relevant posts (even yours) and made my own decision. My opinions do differ from yours and I am glad that you can get over that.

Im not referring to on topic sides, im referring to on a personal level with regards to what certain other posters felt the need to kick off because i disagreed with the religion of Beyonder. You saw me being insulting and obvously gaining the upperhand so you chose to unite with the underdog. Its cool son, way of the world laughing out loud



Originally posted by Cubicks
It should not be beyond belief to you, you set yourself up for it. If your life has soo much more meaning then why waste it here? BTW, this quote from you shows that condescending nature you have, I would work on that in the real world.

How i choose to spend part of my spare time is none of your concern sonny. Occasionally coming on to a forum and conversing with likeminded people is something i certainly wouldnt consider time wasted. Hating on text and smilies however is another matter entirely. Whatever gives your life purpose mate.



Originally posted by Cubicks
I can't argue with ignorance.

Ive read your mildly amusing posts my friend and i assure you, you most certainly can. laughing

Cubicks

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Certain posters would like us to take this unsupported statement pertaining to him having a million times the power of the multiverse combined as fact and yet:

Well let's see how supported your claims are.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Beyonder had his power forcibly taken from him by Dr Doom using Galactus' tech which he'd only just acquired

"forcibly"?
http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/6462/doombeatsbeyonderia9.th.jpg
I think not.

meh...not to mention he was being KEPT ALIVE by Beyonder during this crucial time.
http://img456.imageshack.us/img456/8105/doomvsbeyonder3pd6.th.jpg
Do you know why?

Because Beyonder coerced that entire event.

This Doctor Doom, that was in Secret Wars the first series,

that wasn't really Doom,(well technically it was but read)that was a Future self of Doom plucked from a point in the Timestream that DID NOT EXIST YET, courtesy of the Beyonder,

Not only does Beyonder use a Doom from the a NON-Existent future to fight in the Secret Wars saga, which now explains HOW Doom was able to Manipulate Galactus's vast technology, but the funny thing is Doom was already dead, he had been dead since FF #260, when the FF, Doom and Silver Surfer took on Terrax.

The insane part is,
He plucked him from a future that HE himself was going to CREATE for Doom FAR AFTER the Secret Wars series.
http://img485.imageshack.us/img485/6926/b1qw4.th.jpg
This is well into the Secret Wars II series by the way,

Now Beyonder sends Doom back in time to the Secret Wars drama that was already played out, just to re-install Doom's mind/spirit with his original body,
he speeds up that seperate event in time(Secret Wars I)and ends up in the now, with a fully revived and renewd DOOM.
http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/3189/b2pe0.th.jpg
Beyonder enjoyed setting up humans, with the notion of control and power, just to see what they would do with it....it happened several times.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Beyonder apparently used half of his power to kill the abstract Death

I corrected you about this before and now you pump this LIE again.

NOWHERE in any issue of the Secret Wars series does it mention Beyonder using HALF, or ANY SPECIFIC amount of power to ERASE Multi-Death from existence.
http://img319.imageshack.us/img319/3695/bkilldqn1.th.jpg
"A LOT of MY Power is in that CUP"

AND

he was STILL MORE Powerful than Living Tribunal, Eternity and the rest of the Abstracts....lol

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
and yet didnt have the power required to bring her back into existence.

Not the Original....since the Abstract was nothing before it became the concept of Death.

So he just Re-created a NEW Death instead out of an ordinary man.
http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/5594/beyonderressurectsdeath2nm2.th.jpg
"it begins ANEW"
ANEW means(in a new or different, way)

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The Beyonder planned to end his physical existence by using the power of the M'kraan crystal, the nexus of Marvels multiverse.

hysterical2

Let's continue to LEAVE OUT the FACT that Beyonder GAVE Rachel Summers enough Power to KILL him when he SAID THIS.
http://img330.imageshack.us/img330/9738/rachelcankillbdi2.th.jpg
"I offer you a choice, Phoenix...you may SLAY me"
"I herewith grant YOU SUFFICIENT Power to do so"

Rachel Summers WAS ABLE TO KILL HIM!!!!!
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/6452/beyondermakesphoenixgodlike2lb1.th.jpg

And yet:

All the Power of the M'kraan crystal, the nexus of the Marvels multiverse
could do to him is "merely recreate his state of primal unbeing"(the UNIVERSE he was Originally)
http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/8325/beyondermkraanuh7.th.jpg
Meanwhile Rachel Summers was ABLE to KILL HIM.

Mr Master
Originally posted by doomsday49
o.k. i see what you're saying. But you can look at that in two ways:
1. They were too scared to do anything(you interpretation of the situation)

Actually the only plausible interpretation.

By erasing Death from the entire Multi-verse Beyonder upset the Multiversal balance between Eternity and Death in EVERY single Universe.
http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/3518/beyondernodeathut5.th.jpg
The catastrophic side-effects of no Death in the Multi-verse is beyond imagining.

How would they ALLOW this if it were not FEAR?

Originally posted by doomsday49
2. It wasn't worth going to war with an unknown being. (which is possible)

It wasn't worth trying to stop an "unknown being" that's about to collapse the Multi-verse?

Originally posted by doomsday49
You can look at h.o.t.u situation in the same manner as well:
1. They(the abstract) don't feel he is that much of a threat

Well the ENTIRE RACE of Watchers did..a THREAT to the entire Multi-verse to be exact.
http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/913/watchercouncilzr9.th.jpg
This has never happened before.

Originally posted by doomsday49
2. Or, they feel that this is a necessary struggle.

The Watcher's(the Entire Race)thought it was so "necessary" thet they sent UATU literally BEGGING to the Molecule Man, to stop the Beyonder.
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/7054/uatubeggingmmbo6.th.jpg

galan7777777
and though molecule man was "triumphant", and i use that word very lightly, if u think about it, he was a part of the beoynder himself, because it was residual energy from the "beyond realm" which gave molecule man his power

Mr Master
Originally posted by galan7777777
and though molecule man was "triumphant", and i use that word very lightly, if u think about it, he was a part of the beoynder himself, because it was residual energy from the "beyond realm" which gave molecule man his power

"triumphant"?

galan7777777
Originally posted by Mr Master
"triumphant"? well it took him 2 revert the beyonder, but only because the beyonder put limits on himself

Mr Master
Originally posted by galan7777777
well it took him 2 revert the beyonder, but only because the beyonder put limits on himself

Actually Beyonder became a baby, literally, with a machine he created.

That was the last issue of the Secret Wars II series.

The heroes including Molecule Man found him there, as a new born baby.

Then Molecule Man blasted the baby, and his energy was released, then MM directed the energy back into the beyond realm, where it became a new born Universe.

That's the Beyonder's ending. I'm at my girl's so I can't post the scans.


My point is Molecule Man never defeated Beyonder, infact he nearly died when he battled the Beyonder.

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Mr Master
Well let's see how supported your claims are.

How ironic that you should direct that at me shifty



Originally posted by Mr Master
http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/6462/doombeatsbeyonderia9.th.jpg



Thats a rather selective scan my friend, but id expect no less from you, its all we've seen since this Beyonder campaign began. That scan doesnt prove your point nor disprove my point that Beyonder had his powers taken forcibly. All that scan shows is that when Doom launched an assault on the Beyonder he was initially battered to the brink of death.

However the rest of the story youre hiding from readers is:

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21912445297.jpg&s=f10

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21912461633.jpg&s=f10




Doom on the brink of Death managed to pull it together and utilise Galactus' tech to take the "omnipotent" Beyonders power from himself.

As we all know, after that the omnipotent Beyonder with a million times more power than the multiverse, who had his power taken from him by Doom using newly acquired Galactus tech, was forced to resort to subterfuge and underhand tactics (possessing Black Panthers enemy Klaw lol) to gain his power back.

Forcibly? Most certainly. yes

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Certain posters would like us to take this unsupported statement pertaining to him having a million times the power of the multiverse combined as fact


Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Me and MrMaster have a debate going on, a debate that he has decided to get personal on and so i have responded in kind.


Originally posted by GalacticStorm
If you saw me being insulting then its because theres history between myself and said debater


Originally posted by GalacticStorm
im referring to on a personal level with regards to what certain other posters felt the need to kick off because i disagreed with the religion of Beyonder


Originally posted by GalacticStorm
You saw me being insulting and obvously gaining the upperhand so you chose to unite with the underdog


Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I was clearly referring to your knowledge on the off topic issues raging between members of the Church of The Beyonder and myself


herbfu

Your not worth it...a gesture is suffice.

If your going to lick my nuts during your arguements with other posters, we might have some problems.

Lick my nuts....when you "debate" with me, not others.

Thank you.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Mr Master
herbfu

Your not worth it...a gesture is suffice.

If your going to lick my nuts during your arguements with other posters, we might have some problems.

Lick my nuts....when you "debate" with me, not others.

Thank you.

Please sonny roll eyes (sarcastic)

The amount of times ive been away for days on end, even a week or two and come back and seen you mentionining my name in my absence. Leonidas at one point even waded through the spam to make a point of it. Hypocrite!! thumb down

All flash talk and devoid of substance. You have nothing to offer so youre bailing out.

Your posts were mildly amusing at times but for the most part were a waste of time yes

Good day to you kid bye

Thanos_THOTU

sexyking

rotiart
Agreed. PreRetcon Power of a million multiverses wins.

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by rotiart
Agreed. PreRetcon Power of a million multiverses wins.
Not "a million", millions (in plural) besides that was under limmitations.
He could be billions time the omni-verse if he wanted, he could do anything.

galan7777777
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Not "a million", millions (in plural) besides that was under limmitations.
He could be billions time the omni-verse if he wanted, he could do anything. exactly his powers are as great as he wants them to be

bigbran
Originally posted by Mr Master
herbfu

Your not worth it...a gesture is suffice.

If your going to lick my nuts during your arguements with other posters, we might have some problems.

Lick my nuts....when you "debate" with me, not others.

Thank you. laughing laughing

bigbran
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Not "a million", millions (in plural) besides that was under limmitations.
He could be billions time the omni-verse if he wanted, he could do anything. yes mr ms power could be that great!
but what about beyonder?

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thats a rather selective scan my friend. That scan doesnt prove your point nor disprove my point that Beyonder had his powers taken forcibly.

You said Doom took Beyonder's power "forcibly"...

This is what it looked like when Doom tried to TAKE Beyonder's power "Forcibly".

He first got amped up, and became Galactus at FULL POWER!
http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/8286/doomabsorbsbiggshipki1.th.jpg
"Perhaps the greatest Energy Source in the Universe"

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/930/doomabsorbsbiggship3yh7.th.jpg
This is Dr. Doom....after Absorbing Galactus's power...and Galactus's Ship.
http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/2152/doomfullgalactusrr7.th.jpg

http://img464.imageshack.us/img464/4957/doomfullgalactus1cx6.th.jpg

http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/9328/doomfullgalactus2db9.th.jpg

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/2672/doomuniversalawarenessiy7.th.jpg
I think Doom is ready to attempt to "forcibly" take Beyonder's power now.

Next post it continues..

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
All that scan shows is that when Doom launched an assault on the Beyonder he was initially battered to the brink of death.

Well it was Galactus's technology that Doom used to absorb Beyonder's power.
Here he is pushing buttons on his breastplate, or as you put it..

"when Doom pointandlaughlaunched an assault on the Beyonder"
http://img55.imageshack.us/img55/2289/doomvsbeyonder4ld2.th.jpg

This is more of an "assault on the Beyonder"...even the scan says it.
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/3961/doomvsbeyonderoe2.th.jpg

This is what happened when he tried to take Beyonder's power "forcibly".
http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/3227/doctordoomvsbeyonderxh5.th.jpg
http://img320.imageshack.us/img320/3104/doomvsbzy3.th.jpg
As you can see, he was better off pushing sneaky buttons instead taking the "forcibly" road.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Doom on the brink of Death managed to pull it together and utilise Galactus' tech to take the "omnipotent" Beyonders power from himself.

"brink of death" my ass.

Beyonder was studying Doom.
http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/2135/doomkeptaliveyv9.th.jpg
Beyonder was going to heal Doom afterwards, he was never going to die.
Realize he's missing a foot, a leg and an arm...not to mention half his body has been skinned alive.

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
however what do you mean a point in the timestream that did not exist?

What do you mean by courtesy of Beyonder?

Where on earth are you getting that he used Doom from a non existent future?

Finally where did you get that he got Doom from a future he was going to create for Doom?




Beyonder plucks Doom from the Future to place him in the Secret Wars series version 1.
http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/5411/bpluckedd1uf6.th.jpg
When Beyonder plucked Doom from the future...it was a future that had not taken place yet(NON-EXISTENT)
http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/6317/bkillstimelr9.th.jpg
This created a Time-Loop that could shatter the entire TimeStream and ALL that came before it.
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/8726/bkillstime2ah6.th.jpg

So Beyonder had to re-create Doom's original body.
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/1633/bpluckedd2cj3.th.jpg

Beyonder Merged Doom's body with his Doom's mind.
Then he sent Doom back to the FIRST Secret Wars to allow that to play out thus repairing that Time-Loop
http://img506.imageshack.us/img506/1701/bpluckedd3nw6.th.jpg

"clear the area before the Loop is closed, and Doom Re-appears"
http://img506.imageshack.us/img506/1128/bpluckedd4pa2.th.jpg

"Beyonder created a Self-Perpetuating Circle in Time"...
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/1434/bpluckedd5es7.th.jpg
To fill in the space in time that NEVER existed.
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/7867/bpluckedd6iv2.th.jpg

Had Beyonder killed Doom without re-introducing him to the past, the TimeStream as we know it would have SHATTERED.

Because Beyonder took him from a Future that did NOT EXIST.

Mr Master

Mr Master

Mr Master

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
That all suggests that this instance was just a ploy and his real intentions behind giving her the power were so that she could travel to the crystal site and unleash the crystals power. If his intentions were for her to kill him in the previous incident, why not take her power after she chose to save her friends instead? Why admit that he wanted to be returned to his original form and then angrily take away his power after she chose not to fact according to his plan?

Gibberish.

Beyonder gave Phoenix the power of the Force, and beyond.
http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/5571/pfvy1.th.jpg
"She has become ALL she EVER dreamed of...and FAR, FAR more.

"When my mom came to this place to SAVE the universe"
http://img313.imageshack.us/img313/6237/pf2kc3.th.jpg

"It's only fair you be with me...when I DESTROY it"
http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/1898/pf3bx2.th.jpg

Rachel blows JAHF(protector of the Crystal)out the way like if he wasn't even there.
http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/913/pf4hb5.th.jpg

Rachel was about to Unleash the Neutron Galaxy by shattering it's protective Energy Sphere
http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/7703/pf5rx0.th.jpg
This Energy Sphere holds back the Neutron Galaxy from collapsing the Universe and eventually the Multiverse.

Rachel was going to crack it open...with the power Beyonder gave her, that turned her into Phoenix(exactly like Jean Grey according to the Watcher)and more.

rotiart
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Not "a million", millions (in plural) besides that was under limmitations.
He could be billions time the omni-verse if he wanted, he could do anything.

i'm not sure what the exact quote was... but it was akin to when all of his power was returned to him it was like a million (or millions) of multiverses... it never stated billions...

but still god, is god, is god. stick out tongue

Thanos_THOTU

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by rotiart
i'm not sure what the exact quote was... but it was akin to when all of his power was returned to him it was like a million (or millions) of multiverses... it never stated billions...

but still god, is god, is god. stick out tongue

He lmmited his powers so he wouldent destroy everything.
He decided how powerful he should be.
If he wanted to be millions than he was millions, he put limmitations on himself.

rotiart
I'm pretty sure the scan shows that he took back all of his power. and it related to it being the equivalent of million(s) of multiverses.

Mr Master
Originally posted by rotiart
i'm not sure what the exact quote was... but it was akin to when all of his power was returned to him it was like a million (or millions) of multiverses... it never stated billions...

but still god, is god, is god. stick out tongue

For the record, it was Millions.

http://img431.imageshack.us/img431/7524/beyondermillionsofxmorepowerfu.th.jpg

Thanos_THOTU

Mr Master
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
He lmmited his powers so he wouldent destroy everything.
He decided how powerful he should be.
If he wanted to be millions than he was millions, he put limmitations on himself.

This is true.

http://img93.imageshack.us/img93/1025/beyonderimposeslimitations3gg5.th.jpg

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/5818/blimtsyq8.th.jpg

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/6775/beyonderimposinglimitskq0.th.jpg

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/579/beyonderimposeslimits4vn4.th.jpg

But on panel he had millions of times more power than the rest of Multi-verse combined.

We can't speculate furthur, unless something on panel hints us to.

Mr Master

rotiart

Thanos_THOTU

Cubicks

Cubicks

Cubicks

rotiart

Mordum
Toaa is below death now. ThanosHOTU put down the herbs and back away slowly.

bigbran
Originally posted by rotiart
NOTHING is beyond TOAA's control... what about that thing in his pants...

Mordum
Could the TOAA cook a burrito so hot that he himself could not eat it.

celestialdemon
Originally posted by Mordum
Could the TOAA cook a burrito so hot that he himself could not eat it.

That sure is a melon-scratcher.

rotiart
He chooses NOT to eat the burrito. Not because he can't eat it.. he just doesn't want to. Cause he knows a burrito that hot tastes like charcoal, sulfur, and brimstone!!!

doomsday49
Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually the only plausible interpretation.

By erasing Death from the entire Multi-verse Beyonder upset the Multiversal balance between Eternity and Death in EVERY single Universe.
http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/3518/beyondernodeathut5.th.jpg
The catastrophic side-effects of no Death in the Multi-verse is beyond imagining.

How would they ALLOW this if it were not FEAR?



It wasn't worth trying to stop an "unknown being" that's about to collapse the Multi-verse?



Well the ENTIRE RACE of Watchers did..a THREAT to the entire Multi-verse to be exact.
http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/913/watchercouncilzr9.th.jpg
This has never happened before.



The Watcher's(the Entire Race)thought it was so "necessary" thet they sent UATU literally BEGGING to the Molecule Man, to stop the Beyonder.
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/7054/uatubeggingmmbo6.th.jpg

LOL....logically speaking, which would be the bigger scope of threat:

1. A man approach a snake and initiates attack and the snake gave out a warning.

2. Same as the situation above, however, this time there were no warning, the snake attacked.

If you were the snake which of the two responses demonstrated the bigger threat towards YOU? the one where you felt you had to warn or the one you felt you had to attack?

doomsday49
I also question the reputation of this pre-retconned beyonder

1. Is he really omnipresent: Did he not know that dooms was ultimately going to steal his power in the near future?

2. Is he really omnipotent: He needed a catalyst to bring back death; not to mention in doing so, some of his power were DRAINEd, "omnipotent" "All Powerful".......lol only if 2 plus 2 is 5.

3. Is he really omnisicience: He felt that something was incomplete in the universe, meaning he is not sure. lol....does uncertainty equals to knowledge?
furthermore he was completely oblivious to the fact that killing death would disrupt the multi-verse. Molecule man had to point that fact out to him. "All knowing?" of course i mean he is a million times that of the multiverse, right? wink

"Actually Beyonder didn't "initially sense that Dooms consciousness was in McArthurs body" because Beyonder looks at a person's Aura in order to sense who they are." -mr. master......LOL.....that was the funnies part. Maybe it's just me but geesh you figure someone so all powerful and all knowing and everpresent can distinguished between auras.

doomsday49
I notice everybody's attacking galacticstorm. He must be quite a threat to y'all huh? LOL!!!! You know they say that attacking is the result of fear; remember the snakes?

Cubicks
Originally posted by doomsday49
LOL....logically speaking, which would be the bigger scope of threat:

1. A man approach a snake and initiates attack and the snake gave out a warning.

2. Same as the situation above, however, this time there were no warning, the snake attacked.

If you were the snake which of the two responses demonstrated the bigger threat towards YOU? the one where you felt you had to warn or the one you felt you had to attack?

I am not following your examples.....

Do you mean this?

1. A man approaches a snake and attacks it even though the snake gave a warning to the man.
2. A man approaches a snake and the snake attacks the man.

Mr Master
Originally posted by doomsday49
LOL....logically speaking, which would be the bigger scope of threat:

1. A man approach a snake and initiates attack and the snake gave out a warning.

2. Same as the situation above, however, this time there were no warning, the snake attacked.

If you were the snake which of the two responses demonstrated the bigger threat towards YOU? the one where you felt you had to warn or the one you felt you had to attack?

What does any of this have to do with Death being ERASED from the Multi-verse?
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/6859/beyonderkillsdeath3tq0.th.jpg
And Living Tribunal, Eternity the the rest of the Abstracts doing NOTHING about it?

Thanos wanted to conquer ONE Universe and ALL the Cosmics came at him.
http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/691/tvscah6.th.jpg
Including the Universe itself.
http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/1287/tvsc2zp7.th.jpg
This is how that turned out.
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/541/thanosbecomeunilx9.th.jpg

Beyonder erased a Multiversal Abstract, and the Cosmics did...nothing....but beg.
http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/8895/abstractsbegbeyonder2wr7.th.jpg
Eternity himself.

Finally, the ENTIRE race of Watchers decide to interfere since the Cosmics are afraid to do so.
http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/7403/watchercouncilti2.th.jpg
They send UATU begging to the Molecule Man(the second most powerful being in the Multi-verse).
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/7054/uatubeggingmmbo6.th.jpg
They begged a human being(Molecule Man)cause they couldn't do anything about it.
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/3302/mmshowsuput8.th.jpg
"the Molecule Man"...."stand aside, let him pass"...
http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/48/mmtalkstobed4.th.jpg
In an instant LT, Eternity and the Cosmics are sent away...then Molecule Man proceeds to talk Beyonder into bringing Death back to the Multi-verse.

doomsday49
Originally posted by Cubicks
I am not following your examples.....

Do you mean this?

1. A man approaches a snake and attacks it even though the snake gave a warning to the man.
2. A man approaches a snake and the snake attacks the man.

i thought i was clear, sorry about that. The man breached the snake comfort zone in both scenario. He doesn't necessarily attack but to the snake, it's just as good as an attack. In a nutshell, a warning vs an attack from the snake. Which reaction constitutes greater fear.

Thanos_THOTU

Cubicks
Originally posted by doomsday49
i thought i was clear, sorry about that. The man breached the snake comfort zone in both scenario. He doesn't necessarily attack but to the snake, it's just as good as an attack. In a nutshell, a warning vs an attack from the snake. Which reaction constitutes greater fear.

The warning carries more fear, that is what warnings are for. The warning is a prelude to something bad happening, once it happens your fear of said event is lessened by the fact that it already happened.

I am fearful of getting a bee sting, I am not fearful of having been stung (unless I was allergic!).

Thanos_THOTU
He isnt Omni-present, neither is TOAA.
TOAA is just everything in his multi-verse, even though Beyonder wasent Omni-present he could choose to be.
He had all the power the writers could give him, pluss he was Omni-versal (TOAA, the Presence ect. isnt)



No, when it comes to infnity it worsk in an other scale.
Example;
Presence = Infinite power
100% Spectre = Presence = Infinite power
0,00001% Spectre = Infinite x 0,0000001 = Infinite

So if the Presence was just a lite irritated the Spectre would be able to take down every being in the DC multi-verse, however he have been beaten.

Beyonder could choose his power, he limmited them on purpose so he wouldent destroy the multi-/omni-verse with a nightmare or something.




As stated he could chose to be it or not, sometimes he was, somtimes he wasent:
Here he was http://img122.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyondervscelestials2bq9.jpg




He limmited himself all the time, sometimes (when he felt like it) he could.
Once even Stephen Strange had a chanse of taking the Beyonder down.

Mr Master

Mr Master
Originally posted by doomsday49
furthermore he was completely oblivious to the fact that killing death would disrupt the multi-verse.

Actually he wasn't completely oblivious.

He knew he would have to make changes to the Multi-verse in order to keep it running smoothly without Death.
http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/256/deathdeaduj6.th.jpg

Originally posted by doomsday49
Molecule man had to point that fact out to him. "All knowing?" of course i mean he is a million times that of the multiverse, right?

What Beyonder did not realize is that even if the Multi-verse could be balanced by him without the Concept Death, life would still be meaningless without Death.

Originally posted by doomsday49
"Actually Beyonder didn't "initially sense that Dooms consciousness was in McArthurs body" because Beyonder looks at a person's Aura in order to sense who they are." -mr. master......LOL.....that was the funnies part. Maybe it's just me but geesh you figure someone so all powerful and all knowing and everpresent can distinguished between auras.

Like I explained before...

Go to the post above this post.

Thanos_THOTU

doomsday49
Originally posted by Mr Master
What does any of this have to do with Death being ERASED from the Multi-verse?
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/6859/beyonderkillsdeath3tq0.th.jpg
And Living Tribunal, Eternity the the rest of the Abstracts doing NOTHING about it?

Thanos wanted to conquer ONE Universe and ALL the Cosmics came at him.
http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/691/tvscah6.th.jpg
Including the Universe itself.
http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/1287/tvsc2zp7.th.jpg
This is how that turned out.
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/541/thanosbecomeunilx9.th.jpg

Beyonder erased a Multiversal Abstract, and the Cosmics did...nothing....but beg.
http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/8895/abstractsbegbeyonder2wr7.th.jpg
Eternity himself.

Finally, the ENTIRE race of Watchers decide to interfere since the Cosmics are afraid to do so.
http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/7403/watchercouncilti2.th.jpg
They send UATU begging to the Molecule Man(the second most powerful being in the Multi-verse).
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/7054/uatubeggingmmbo6.th.jpg
They begged a human being(Molecule Man)cause they couldn't do anything about it.
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/3302/mmshowsuput8.th.jpg
"the Molecule Man"...."stand aside, let him pass"...
http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/48/mmtalkstobed4.th.jpg
In an instant LT, Eternity and the Cosmics are sent away...then Molecule Man proceeds to talk Beyonder into bringing Death back to the Multi-verse.

Dude, they have no choice but to attack thanos on a universal scale multiversal scale. With beyonder it was different, the cosmic had the option of using a medium to work things out with him. Beyonder was a slave to his own views and perspectives, cause despite his vast power he still had some human qualities. major differnece between the two is that beyonder thought he was doing right, but thanos knew he was doing wrong. Was it wrong to use a medium to play on beyonder emotions and logic? Were they scared, of course but was it manditor to attack, probably not. Why risk the bloodshed in a battle that they probably would lose anyway.

But with thanos, who is going to mediate. His motives are almost always "consciously" evil. There are no options of pleaing. when there are no options for warning the snake will strike.

I can't speak on the integrity of the cosmics but what other options did they have with thanos?

doomsday49
Originally posted by Cubicks
The warning carries more fear, that is what warnings are for. The warning is a prelude to something bad happening, once it happens your fear of said event is lessened by the fact that it already happened.

I am fearful of getting a bee sting, I am not fearful of having been stung (unless I was allergic!).

lol....bees sting once and die. Try acting on something that is able to inflict multiple strikes like a snake or say......thanos. When you're in the act of battle, it's fear that drive one to strike back at an opponent. Don't underestimate the fear of defeat, or worse yet death.

Mr Master

doomsday49
Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually he wasn't completely oblivious.

He knew he would have to make changes to the Multi-verse in order to keep it running smoothly without Death.
http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/256/deathdeaduj6.th.jpg



What Beyonder did not realize is that even if the Multi-verse could be balanced by him without the Concept Death, life would still be meaningless without Death.



Like I explained before...

Go to the post above this post.

1. Omnipresent means at all plane and at all time. Thanos demonstrated this in "The End" when he was one with the past present and future. "

2. Time traveling is not a new concept in marvel. "The future that is non existent"?.....huh....even beyonder stated time as a continuum.

3. Beyonder not killing doctor doom plays no effect to doom actually(on panel) taking his power.

4. What that flower analogy? LOL...GalacticStorm never claimed he was all powerful. LOL That analogy wouldn't even hold true in a relative comparison.
GS would have to be a wizard to Beyonder's (i guess i'll say it) "Omnipotent"
It is contradicting to say an all powerful being can be drain of power. Here's an analoy for ya: Think of a car with endless supplies of gas running on empty. laughing

5. Beyonder did not "understanding" meaning he couldn't comprehend. Yet his is call by many to be omniscient; Thanos at his hotu level was one with everything: matter, emotion, thoughts and subsequently "Desire". Who says being omnipotent void you of anything, if anything, it should all be of you.

doomsday49
sorry guys i responded to the wrong quote on my last post. It should've been for this one.



Originally posted by Mr Master
Tht would be Omniscient.

Omnipresent is to be everywhere at once.

Doom, during the Secret Wars 1 series was unpredictable even to the Beyonder.
Because Doom's Future NEVER EXISTED.

Beyonder plucks Doom from the Future to place him in the Secret Wars series version 1.
http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/5411/bpluckedd1uf6.th.jpg
When Beyonder plucked Doom from the future...it was a future that had not taken place yet(NON-EXISTENT)
http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/6317/bkillstimelr9.th.jpg
This created a Time-Loop that could shatter the entire TimeStream and ALL that came before it.
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/8726/bkillstime2ah6.th.jpg

So Beyonder had to re-create Doom's original body.
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/1633/bpluckedd2cj3.th.jpg

Beyonder Merged Doom's body with his Doom's mind.
Then he sent Doom back to the FIRST Secret Wars to allow that to play out thus repairing that Time-Loop
http://img506.imageshack.us/img506/1701/bpluckedd3nw6.th.jpg

"clear the area before the Loop is closed, and Doom Re-appears"
http://img506.imageshack.us/img506/1128/bpluckedd4pa2.th.jpg

"Beyonder created a Self-Perpetuating Circle in Time"...
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/1434/bpluckedd5es7.th.jpg
To fill in the space in time that NEVER existed.
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/7867/bpluckedd6iv2.th.jpg

Had Beyonder killed Doom without re-introducing him to the past, the TimeStream as we know it would have SHATTERED.

Because Beyonder took him from a Future that did NOT EXIST.






I think Cubiks gave the best analogy that referenced this.



Well put Cubiks.



He never felt that something was Incomplete in the Universe.

Beyonder did not understand desire.

he did everything possible to feel this, but how can you when your OMNIPOTENT!

That's why in the last issues his aim was to become Human, in order to feel desire.

He ultimately became a new born baby, which is when Molecule Man destroyed his human form.

Mr Master
Originally posted by doomsday49
5. Beyonder did not "understanding" meaning he couldn't comprehend. Yet his is call by many to be omniscient; Thanos at his hotu level was one with everything: matter, emotion, thoughts and subsequently "Desire". Who says being omnipotent void you of anything, if anything, it should all be of you.

I can see you have an agenda.

you will not be entertained.

I'll leave you with this.

Beyonder didn't know desire because he was ALL.

Beyonder was REALITY in our Multi-verse.

This is for serious onlookers only.
http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/8379/beyonderisrealitydw2.th.jpg

galan7777777
Originally posted by Mr Master
I agreed with your other points except these two.



Death survived because Death encompasses the Concept inside and outside the Multi-verse....I touched this before.

There are other realms outside the Multi-verse, though they may belong to said Multi-verse.

"For she, too, Exists in a Plane of Actuality Outside this poor Reality"
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/8569/deathsurvivesks0.th.jpg

Though this may be the Multi-verse(embodiment of Actuality)from an outside perspective.
http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/1623/multiverse2co.th.jpg
http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/5109/multiverse28yb.th.jpg

Down below you see what it looks like from the inside.



The reason Warlock survived is because he was in Atleza's(the Cosmic Anchor of the Universe)domain, baby sitting Atleza with Gamora.
http://img421.imageshack.us/img421/3264/warlocksurvives1jv7.th.jpg
http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/1875/warlocksurvives2yk7.th.jpg

This is the way it works.

See those little purple balls, thats where Atleza is (the Cosmic Anchor of the Universe)...and every little purple ball is the Domain of the Anchor...Yes...very much outside the Multiverse...untouched by space or time....the Multiverse are the Bigger balls obviously...
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/8021/unilook17qj.th.jpg
http://img280.imageshack.us/img280/9715/unilook21qc.th.jpg

First Warlock is allowed to enter this place...the Cosmic Vortex.
http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/3198/adamgoesbtwnuniverses15yh.th.jpg
Now observe Warlock navigating this realm in--between Universes.
http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/7376/adamgoesbtwnuniverses26zw.th.jpg
the 1st pic on this thread shows 3 beings- thanos, mistress death, but who is the 3rd? is it warlock?

galan7777777
Originally posted by Mr Master
I can see you have an agenda.

you will not be entertained.

I'll leave you with this.

Beyonder didn't know desire because he was ALL.

Beyonder was REALITY in our Multi-verse.

This is for serious onlookers only.
http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/8379/beyonderisrealitydw2.th.jpg there should be no debating beyonders power after reading this!

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by galan7777777
the 1st pic on this thread shows 3 beings- thanos, mistress death, but who is the 3rd? is it warlock?
yes the blonde one with the soulgem in his forehead is adam.

galan7777777
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
yes the blonde one with the soulgem in his forehead is adam. thats what i thought at first, but sum1 tried 2 tell me it was TOAA.......but its still impressive that warlock speaks to thanos how he does

Thanos_THOTU

Cubicks
Originally posted by doomsday49
lol....bees sting once and die. Try acting on something that is able to inflict multiple strikes like a snake or say......thanos. When you're in the act of battle, it's fear that drive one to strike back at an opponent. Don't underestimate the fear of defeat, or worse yet death.

It does not matter that the bees sting once and die. The analogy holds true in relation to fear. You fear that which COULD happen not what HAS happened. And it is not fear that drives one to strike back, it is usually anger or self preservation or a combination of the two.

galan7777777

rotiart
Personally, my take on the cosmic vortex was that it was the sinkhole.. the cosmic crush significance of each universe. Atleza holds the universe steady if I read it right, not the multiverse. Therefore each ball is a universe.

The entirety of ALL the balls, is the multiverse. Eternity tends to refer to him as all that is. As far as warlock is concerned, his universe should be all that is. Personally I think of MultiEternity as the sum of all those spheres combined.

I may be remembering wrong. But thats how I intrepreted Marvel The Abyss.

As far as this whole debate about Beyonder. Intelligence is not wisdom. Intelligence comes from knowing facts. Wisdom comes from experience. Beyonder has not had experiences to compare against. He knew that intellectually speaking what would happen to the physical aspects of a person, but not the individual mental ramifications as he himself would never had had to go through anything remotely like that.

Mr Master
Originally posted by rotiart
Personally, my take on the cosmic vortex was that it was the sinkhole.. the cosmic crush significance of each universe. Atleza holds the universe steady if I read it right, not the multiverse. Therefore each ball is a universe.

The entirety of ALL the balls, is the multiverse. Eternity tends to refer to him as all that is. As far as warlock is concerned, his universe should be all that is. Personally I think of MultiEternity as the sum of all those spheres combined.

I may be remembering wrong. But thats how I intrepreted Marvel The Abyss.

That's exactly what I was saying.

The scans following the Atleza scans show Warlock travelling in-between Universes.

The larger Balls(individually are Universes)and do indeed make up the Multi-verse as a sum.

Originally posted by rotiart
As far as this whole debate about Beyonder. Intelligence is not wisdom. Intelligence comes from knowing facts. Wisdom comes from experience. Beyonder has not had experiences to compare against. He knew that intellectually speaking what would happen to the physical aspects of a person, but not the individual mental ramifications as he himself would never had had to go through anything remotely like that.

cool

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by galan7777777
in a sense ure right but most consider god=jack kirby......TOAA=stan lee
That really sucks.
Reason:
Writer = Human
TOAA = writer = human >> Hulk >> TOAA = writer = human >> Hulk ect.


Makes no sence.

galan7777777
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
That really sucks.
Reason:
Writer = Human
TOAA = writer = human >> Hulk >> TOAA = writer = human >> Hulk ect.

Makes no sence. i know but its true, i mean after all those 2 r the ones that decide everything that happens in the multiverse lol

rotiart
I feel honored to get the coolie glasses from Mr. Master! hug

galan7777777
Originally posted by rotiart
I feel honored to get the coolie glasses from Mr. Master! hug lol!

Thanos_THOTU

galan7777777

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by galan7777777
ure right, but by most he is still considered to be TOAA, because if he wanted to change something that the writer wrote i guess he could lol!
I see him more like Classic Beyonder.

Reason: He was the one that stated that Beyonder had all the powers the writer could give him.
Back than he was the most powerful source in the Omni-verse.
(He have semi-retired like Beyonder :P)
ect.

galan7777777
lol, thats true.......but even so most say he's TOAA

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by galan7777777
lol, thats true.......but even so most say he's TOAA

TOAA = all the power of the multiverse, bond to it.

Pre-retcon Beyonder = much more than that.

galan7777777
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
TOAA = all the power of the multiverse, bond to it.

Pre-retcon Beyonder = much more than that. ure right, beyonder isnt part of the multiverse he isnt bound by any of its rules

Mr Master
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
That really sucks.
Reason:
Writer = Human
TOAA = writer = human >> Hulk >> TOAA = writer = human >> Hulk ect.

Just a pathetic atempt of Jack to become God.
Anyhow it´s not Jack that is God, it´s the writer. (acording to his view)

God = TOAA

Makes no sence.

The Artist(presumably Jack Kirby)was portrayed as the "God" of Marvel in a Fantastic Four issue. Yes...as in Heaven..Angels...God.

I have the scans but I'm not home.

God even said, it's funny that the most powerful weapon in all creation is a pencil.

Jack(God) receives a phone call while being visited by the FF,
the person he's speaking to gives him some ideas,
and God then say's, "ok I'll get right on it, I'll draw up some paper and a pen" yada yada yada.

When he's done with the call, one of the FF asked God, "who was that on the phone"

God replied, "my collaborator"...

Who else could that possibly be besides Stan Lee(the writer).

Marvel, and most of it's characters and stories, were created by Jack Kirby drawing them and Stan Lee writing the stories.

TOAA(presumably Stan Lee or the Writer), imagines the concept of Marvel and sets the laws to every Universe in Marvel.

God(presumably Jack Kirby or the Artist), wills those concepts and laws into reality with his power(pen).

galan7777777
Originally posted by Mr Master
The Artist(presumably Jack Kirby)was portrayed as the "God" of Marvel in a Fantastic Four issue. Yes...as in Heaven..Angels...God.

I have the scans but I'm not home.

God even said, it's funny that the most powerful weapon in all creation is a pencil.

Jack(God) receives a phone call while being visited by the FF,
the person he's speaking to gives him some ideas,
and God then say's, "ok I'll get right on it, I'll draw some paper and a pen" yada yada yada.

When he's done with the call, one of the FF asked God, "who was that on the phone"

God replied, "my collaborator"...

Who else could that possibly be besides Stan Lee(the writer).

Marvel, and most of it's characters and stories, were created by Jack Kirby drawing them and Stan Lee writing the stories.

TOAA(presumably Stan Lee or the Writer), imagines the concept of Marvel and sets the laws to every Universe in Marvel.

God(presumably Jack Kirby or the Artist), wills those concepts and laws into reality with his power(pen). thats what i was saying, just not as detailed lol

Thanos_THOTU
Good though.

Thanos_THOTU

galan7777777

Mr Master

rotiart
Ignoring Starlin, Kirby, or Lee. TOAA is whoever is the current CEO of Marvel Inc. I still don't see how you think TOAA is only multiversal. They don't call him The one above all for nothing...

As for Marvel: The End and Thanos being used to bring back deaths in the marvel universe. Personally I think of that as hyperbole. As in Starlin had to use his favorite character to "take the fall" in order that the universe could be set right. Because the corporate bigwigs had made an error when allowing characters after characters to come back. In a sense it looked like Starlin felt used to bring about that change.

Mr Master
Originally posted by galan7777777
i think that god/TOAA go by the original creators- jack kirby/stan lee

It's possible, but the issue never specified a certain person representing God, just that he was the Artist.

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by rotiart
Ignoring Starlin, Kirby, or Lee. TOAA is whoever is the current CEO of Marvel Inc. I still don't see how you think TOAA is only multiversal. They don't call him The one above all for nothing...

As for Marvel: The End and Thanos being used to bring back deaths in the marvel universe. Personally I think of that as hyperbole. As in Starlin had to use his favorite character to "take the fall" in order that the universe could be set right. Because the corporate bigwigs had made an error when allowing characters after characters to come back. In a sense it looked like Starlin felt used to bring about that change.
No Marvel (retconned) character can have power outside the Multi-verse.

galan7777777
Originally posted by Mr Master
It's possible, but the issue never specified a certain person representing God, just that he was the Artist. yeah, im just going by the fantastic 4 thread that i have seen, where they visit jack kirby, and have a run in with stan lee.......this is the only time that possibly god and TOAA were ever shown in marvel comics, so i presumed thats who they are

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