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I saw this on youtube.com, and it totally blew me away.

Kind of took a whole different approach to the character of Anakin/Darth Vader.

It's edited well, and timed to fit the words in the music.

If you've seen it before, then just keep on walking.

If you haven't what did you think?

I got all misty-eyed, maybe because my mom used to listen to the song when I was young.

Anywayz:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_zRFru27LA

I was skeptical at first, but I must say this is actually pretty damned good. Wasn't quite sure what it was trying to do at the beginning but it all came together... Nice find.

its was okay... song got on my nerves a little, tho

Originally posted by DeVi| D0do
I was skeptical at first, but I must say this is actually pretty damned good. Wasn't quite sure what it was trying to do at the beginning but it all came together... Nice find.


At first it was like an ROTS highlight(lowlight ) reel, but it did get good.

It actually kinda fits the role of Anakin somewhat, but, Anakin isn't really a child in heart. Anakin is just corrupted, so should have replaced the term 'child' with like 'lost soul' or something.

well, i was going to watch it, but once i heard the singing i began dry heaving and eventually vomited up some chunks of my dinner. so i guess ill pass

It was pretty good to start with. But once I was forced to relive the beheading of the Count I turned it off. That bit totally ruined it.

didnt fit the music at all. the video splicing however is superb. pity its not synced to a better song.

Originally posted by Rampant ox
It was pretty good to start with. But once I was forced to relive the beheading of the Count I turned it off. That bit totally ruined it.


Best part of the video.

ok, it syncs perfectly with anthrax-black lodge. timing and lyrics to the point its spooky. now i can enjoy the video

p.s. if you want to see, the video of the film has to sync with 0:21 of the song.

My point was missed I think...

that was creepy....

what is the song 'WArrior is a Child' doing there??

i know why, but IMO, it would've totally wrecked the dark side touch of ani for me if i finished it.

my point of view... *shrugs*

It was ok

Almost made me cry.Almost.

whats the song?

Guess.

And the first part was annoying, got better as it went along.

Originally posted by Rampant ox
It was pretty good to start with. But once I was forced to relive the beheading of the Count I turned it off. That bit totally ruined it.

Dude you seriously need another hobby besides Christopher Lee.

damnit shoot me now, double post

Originally posted by Jedi Priestess
Dude you seriously need another hobby besides Christopher Lee.


Glad someone said something, because im too nice.

Edited well, the song choice... meh

Very good. Very good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Scf3mcopTrM&mode=related&search=

this is so bad that its kinda funny...the head nod is the best...just watch and see...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlDghohXXFg&mode=related&search=

this one, the song sucks, but i think it fits how they edited it. not bad if you count out the music.

PVS, you might like this one...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UTlOhuZ4vA&mode=related&search=

better type sond, pic quality isnt the best, but better than some others...

this one also...(sorry keep finding them)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAQT2My2nsg&mode=related&search=

I hate those bloody song edits... LAME!!!

The song was pretty cheesy, but I thought the montage of the Anakin Dooku scenes was well timed and meaningful.

well like i said, the songs suck, but the way they try to place the scenes with the music is what i was pointing out.

yeah, those rockin ones were kinda lame. that first one almost triggered an epileptic seizure

LOL....yea, i just figured you might like the video meshing and just the fact that it was a rock song rather than some Dionne Warwick type shit.

All of it sucks because it is too out of place.

Originally posted by sithsaber408
I saw this on youtube.com, and it totally blew me away.

Kind of took a whole different approach to the character of Anakin/Darth Vader.

It's edited well, and timed to fit the words in the music.

If you've seen it before, then just keep on walking.

If you haven't what did you think?

I got all misty-eyed, maybe because my mom used to listen to the song when I was young.

Anywayz:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_zRFru27LA

God, it's very good. The lyrics suit the images. I actually felt touched. The warrior is a child..

Originally posted by Cybervader
God, it's very good. The lyrics suit the images. I actually felt touched. The warrior is a child..

I'm sure you feel real attached to that clones then...

If only Lucas would have taken that approach, it may have been better.

Instead, we get flashes here and there that he was a scared kid who was thrust into this life style he wasn't ready for, but lucas lets that all go away for a pissy teenager type.

True. I like the idea, but I don't feel it with Anakin. I instead fear Lucas' demonic/rabid inner child coming out and taking over Anakin's character Jar Jar Binks style.

The idea of child warrirors is much better expressed through the clones. They barely mention that they're 10 in the films, but Traviss/EU does an excellent job of covering them.

The clones rock.

Go clones... go clones... go clones...

Alliance and me agree again!

Its the clones...they're just perfect (almost...the only thing screwed up about them is GL's fault)

What's screwed up about them?

I dunno. I just thought I'd cover my ass. Traviss didn't srcrew anything up.

GL ignored NullARCs, ARCs, and RCs?

Oookay...

HE DID

I bet he did.

HE DID

I bet he did.

HE DID

I bet he did.

HE DID

I bet he did.

http://www.picpop.com/gallery/albums/userpics/HiJacked/hijacklive.jpg

Originally posted by sithsaber408
http://www.picpop.com/gallery/albums/userpics/HiJacked/hijacklive.jpg




Which one is me?

I would venture that you are the one giving the guy a chokehold.

I have the gun.

Queeq's the guy in the purple shirt.

haha...purple...

Queeq Windu... the guy with the bad morals, eh alliance?

We'll morals are lacking in the SW Universe all around.

Queeq Windu....*shuders*

I need to continue writing my story so I can show Lucas what the f*ck a hero is.

When are you gonna write him?

I'm nto going to...my concept of the force is different than his and I'm not written in a phony black and white. I write in greys. Not to mention, my characters defy your typical Jedi.

So it's all non-SW essentially.

No. its just altered. Its much more militaristic, but....

...its more of a cross between the Karen Traviss/Republic Commando Star Wars and Lucas' Star Wars.

Its gritty and dirty, there aren't clear morals and its about war.

However, the main characters are jedi and it has heavy political and philisophical commentary.

Its in many ways true to Lucas' vision and its CLEARLY SW, just intelligent .

But I thought your whole point about Mace was that there ARE no clear morals in the PT.... So what's the difference?

Well...

I mean more that Lucas has this code set up. He has a defined role for the Jedi. Its clearly obvious in the Saga whcih characters are good and which are bad.

Especially when it comes to the Clone Wars, both sides are right.

In my story, there is little distinction between the light and dark sides. If the Force had a blue side I'd study that one too. This disticntion is something contrived by the Jedi and the sith. The Republic is not always the right side, and loyalty is not garunteed.

Also, war is gritty as it should be...no fancy G-Rated Lucas wars. I try to keep good Military Science Fiction in mind while writing combat. Having friends in the army helps.

Friends in the army stationed abroad? They'd know...

I don't care much for a grey approach to the Force. I like it simple the way it is in SW.

To quote Jessica Atreides "Nothing about religion is simple"

To quote Ushgarak: "SW is simple"

Ushgarak's opinon about the force is in my opinon wrong.

No, it is the same as Lucas's. He always said very clearly: balance of the Force is when there is only a light side. There is light and tehre is dark, nothing in between.

Yes. So? I knwo what Lucas' opinon is, but he didn't do a good job in my opinon and I believe you can interpret the force in different ways.

The Creator of the Force differs with you. Why enter this argument? Oh wait, you can actually.... in EU FORUM!!!!

So, because a guy invents the wheel it can't be changed? You can't think of your own variation?

Do dichotmies adequately describe any concept in the world?

No.

This is not THE world, it is A fictional world. In that, the Creator of the story defines all its ins and outs because he OWNS it.

Are you implying that fiction has no connection to the real world?

Are you implying that there is only one way to interpret fiction?

No and no. But the rules are set by the Creator.

The real world influences the world of fiction, is inspired by it but only thourgh the channel of the creator of fiction.
You can interpret all you want but to change fact in someone else's fiction is either being deaf/blind (intentional or not) or stealing other people's material for your own variation.

Um...thats why what I write is EU? I'm reinterpreting and analyzing, not reinventing. If Lucas can't follow his own rules...why should I? Besides, Lucas left major gaps in his work?

Heres a perfect example.

QuiGon: "Nothing happens by accident"

Therefore, everything that happens in the movies is predetermined. Therefore, the force shifts from light to dark and back again. The force would not decide to be "unbalanced" and men (Palpatine) do not control the force, the force controls them. THerefore, everything that happens in the movies is the will of the force, including the rise of the darkside.

Lucas attributes this to personal evil (Palpatine), but really, the force has ordained this transition.

Yoda is constantly b*tching that (the darkside clouds everything), but this is the darkside of the force. This is not ANOTHER force, it is THE force. And since Yoda constantly claims that the darkside is not stronger than the lightside, the Jedi's powers were taken away from them. (Mace: "Our ability to use the force has become diminished". Clearly the force chooses what it does and where it goes, not people. Therefore, darksiders are just as much the will of the force as Jedi.

Even pushing that aside, Lucas presents ONE view of a TWO sided god through ONE religion. The darkside is barely touched on at all, we simply get a corrupted version of the true nature of the force through Yoda...and ANYONE who tells me "Do not question" (As yoda did to Luke in ESB) is not worthy of my respect as a living being. Not only has the true nature of the force been unexplored we only get the perspective of the force from the dogmatic Jedi (and a little Sith). There is a lot to be explored and a perspective from people outside these stupid dogmas hasn't been given. The real nature of god/the force can be found in open-minded people outside dogma.

THAT is the point.
__________________

Errr... no. That's what you make out of it. And EU goes in another forum.

Unless you can refute my claims which are TOTALLY based on the movies themselves, I don't see any reason why my interpretation is less valid than yours.

I know your interpretations are based on the films. But they are your interpretations. Lucas says it's either good or bad, nothing in between. I am not saying he thought things through very well when he wrote the PT, that goes for many things. Nonetheless, the Force-users are either good or bad.

So you're saying that I'm not alowed to re-interpret art because the artist has a contrived "definition" of his art?

Yes you are.... *sigh* of course you can but then it is considered EU and we don't discuss EU in this forum. *sigh*

So basically, the system we have here is that if you don't like something, it becomes EU?

This doesn't make sense because we constantly discuss hypothetical situations in this forum.

And "Canon includes the screenplays, the films, the radio dramas and the novelisations." - Lucasfilm and Ush's beloved sticky at the top of the thread.

It would seem you're wrong.

Why am I wrong? We hypothise but we use canon to see it hypotheses work. You just disagree with a lot of canon, call it interpretation, and then we automatically go to the Eu section. Which is fine... no problem, just not in this forum.

And where in the canon that includes the screenplays, the films, the radio dramas and the novelisations, do you read grey areas?????

Originally posted by queeq
And where in the canon that includes the screenplays, the films, the radio dramas and the novelisations, do you read grey areas?????
I never know SW was on radio, but I've read all the Prequel novelizations and they are clearly grey areas there.

No, there aren't. That's interpretation.

As is your interpretation that their isn't.

No, because Lucas say tehre aren't and he's boss in these canonical matters.

No. Who are you? If he can't substantiate his claim...its wrong.

He doesn't have to. In fact, he contradicts himself. in ROTS he lets OB1 say: only a Sith deals in absolutes. Lucas deals in absolutes, so that would make him a Sith right. And maybe he is, he's got this evil plot for making six movies that people start arguing about. And we don't see it, the Dark Side of the Lucas clouds everything.

L L!


My two cents:

The Force is black and white, with a Light and Dark side to it.

Users can choose either, or a combination, making them the grey area.


After all, it's about choice.

Originally posted by queeq
He doesn't have to. In fact, he contradicts himself. in ROTS he lets OB1 say: only a Sith deals in absolutes. Lucas deals in absolutes, so that would make him a Sith right. And maybe he is, he's got this evil plot for making six movies that people start arguing about. And we don't see it, the Dark Side of the Lucas clouds everything.

Lucas said in one of the ROTS documentaries that (essentiall, not a direct quote) "When anakin began to question what he'd been taught and what was good, that is when he became evil"

This echoes what Yoda said "Do not question" and "there is no why." The Jedi are screwd up and dogmatic. They blindly follow their own propoganda (Lucas among them). Questioning leads to truth. If questioning the status quo make you a darksider in Lucas book....Im proud to be one.

The Force should be all about achieving balance. YOu should do good in the world, but you can use all your emotions and skills to achieve that goal better than in you become a Jedi drone.

Originally posted by Alliance
Um...thats why what I write is EU? I'm reinterpreting and analyzing, not reinventing. If Lucas can't follow his own rules...why should I? Besides, Lucas left major gaps in his work?

Heres a perfect example.

QuiGon: "Nothing happens by accident"

Therefore, everything that happens in the movies is predetermined. Therefore, the force shifts from light to dark and back again. The force would not decide to be "unbalanced" and men (Palpatine) do not control the force, the force controls them. THerefore, everything that happens in the movies is the will of the force, including the rise of the darkside.

Lucas attributes this to personal evil (Palpatine), but really, the force has ordained this transition.

Yoda is constantly b*tching that (the darkside clouds everything), but this is the darkside of the force. This is not ANOTHER force, it is THE force. And since Yoda constantly claims that the darkside is not stronger than the lightside, the Jedi's powers were taken away from them. (Mace: "Our ability to use the force has become diminished". Clearly the force chooses what it does and where it goes, not people. Therefore, darksiders are just as much the will of the force as Jedi.

Even pushing that aside, Lucas presents ONE view of a TWO sided god through ONE religion. The darkside is barely touched on at all, we simply get a corrupted version of the true nature of the force through Yoda...and ANYONE who tells me "Do not question" (As yoda did to Luke in ESB) is not worthy of my respect as a living being. Not only has the true nature of the force been unexplored we only get the perspective of the force from the dogmatic Jedi (and a little Sith). There is a lot to be explored and a perspective from people outside these stupid dogmas hasn't been given. The real nature of god/the force can be found in open-minded people outside dogma.

THAT is the point.
__________________

I have to say, this actually makes sense. As a history student i have been taught to look at two sides of the issue, and the movies do not set room for the 'dark side' of the Force to be explored. Im not siding with anyone, but i guess when we discuss something not explicitly mentioned in the movies it becomes EU (for instance how the dark side view the Force, do they use it as an ally, or make use of it as a power source?). We can always argue that Anakin/Vader had always been in a grey area, if not how would he have redeem himself from the dark side?

Plus if we choose to see the Force as a religion, yoda's words actually holds true. True believers do not question religion, they seek to understand it, and rationalise the dogma. There's a difference. Christians believe in Jesus as the Messiah and Son of God, Muslims too believe him as a Messiah and prophet, but NOT a son of God, hence do not worship him. Depending on which side you are on, the jedi would definitely say 'the dark side of the Force' is but a corrupted version of the Force, and theirs is the true one. A Protestant would insist on their beliefs as much as a Catholic with theirs.

Ultimately, like i said before, the Force, like God, is what you make out of it, be it black, white or grey.

Okay peeps... reality check. SW is not reality, it's fiction... Lucas's fiction! And the SW approach is simple: you are good or bad. So yes, we see Anakin make a transition from light to dark, taht still doesn't mean there are grey areas all over the place in SW... because there are not. Lucas meant to tell this story how someone (ONE) who is good CHOOSES to take the evil path.

Ok. Have you ever taken a literature class? Lucas failed to present a logical argument about how one is either all good or all evil. He also fails to associated why Sith are always evil and Jedi are always good.

LUCAS has needs a reality check.

How is Lucas supposed to tell an accurate story if he can't properly define concepts.

Fiction Parallels real life. Inescapable.

Lucas failed at many things, but fiction is usually a simplicifcation and/or enlargement of reality. It never IS reality and it shouldn't be. Fiction should bring out the ESSENCE of reality in its fictional form. And Lucas's essence is that there is right and there is wrong. Reality usually gets clouded by sooooo much that we hide behind saying that there are grey areas. Grey areas allow you to refrain from thinking things through to the core, but exercise indifference which is then called tolerance.

No. Grey areas allow you to grasp the reality of the sitation. There is no "us-them" mentality. There is the force.

If you get to teh core of the issue, but lose sight of the issue itself, is ti worth it? I think not.

Grey areas are boring.

You're boring. Is this what your defense has been reduced to?

Now you're getting personal, I was not.

It's no defence... B&W is how Lucas made SW (not always flawless, agreed) and grey areas are boring. And if tehre is one thing a movie should never be is boring.

Originally posted by Alliance
Ok. Have you ever taken a literature class? Lucas failed to present a logical argument about how one is either all good or all evil. He also fails to associated why Sith are always evil and Jedi are always good.



He DID associate why the Sith are always evil and the Jedi are always good. If you had watched ROTS, the Sith have shown their evilness when they staged wars that consumed the entire galaxy and Palpatine used his disfigured face to incriminate the Jedi just so he would be allowed to massacre the entire order which led to the events of the OT. TPM showed 2 Jedi Knights displaying their goodness by helping a queen free her home planet from the Trade Federation's clutches while ROTS showed 4 Jedi attempt to bring down the last Sith Lord who is one step away from ruling the universe only to no avail due to Anakin's betrayal.

Lucas has showed us that our actions will determine if other people view us as good or evil.

Exactly.

Lucas defines good and evil in SW. And it's only between Jedi and Sith.

Yhy should we listen to his narrow and not well substantiated POV?

You don't have to of course.... but that is how SW was meant to be taken.

Ok. I'll give you that.

YAAAAYYYY!!! We finally agree.

And on that note of reconciliation we can close this thread.