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Who wins?

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h171/golem370/hulk.jpg
or

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h171/golem370/blankWW.jpg

I say gotta say WW(stronger at first, faster, more skilled).

Well I believe Hulks fight ability has Professor Hulk would counter that problem he is a smart fighter and has tons of experience. I believe it would be a close fight.

unless WW could end it very quickly then prof. hulk takes it

Hulk is not slow he can jump and catch jets and was able to hit Quicksilver at full speed

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h171/golem370/norvell1c7fj.jpg

Originally posted by golem370
Well I believe Hulks fight ability has Professor Hulk would counter that problem he is a smart fighter and has tons of experience. I believe it would be a close fight.
It could be a close fight, but only if you take away some of her speed advantage too. I know that he would surpass her in strength eventually, and his healing factor could make it difficult, but if she still has her speed, would mean taking 100 hits from someone stronger, in the first SECOND of the fight.

Well Hulk I believe he more hits he receives the madder he will get. Also when I say fist fight I mean toe to toe to one falls

I also think that he can get mad faster since he has better control his emotions

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h171/golem370/Hulk12.jpg

if can't beat Supes w/speed hand to hand what makes you guys think he'll beat WW who has at least Batman level skills and killer instinct

Wonder Woman. Strength is relatively even, but she's faster and far more skilled. Hulk throws a punch and she responds with a judo toss.

Although, I'd say it would take some time. I used to seriously doubt Prof. Hulk's durability since Juggernaut knocked him out and he was afraid of a city-destroying bomb, but looking back, I'd say he's tough enough to take her punishment for a while.

ww wins

i still say that WW can win if she ends the fight VERY quickly, but if she gives hulk enough time to get angry and stronger then hulk wins

Diana rips Hulk in half

Not really. He's made of tougher stuff than that, but she can still knock him around like Maestro did with the Destroyer Armor.

Is this the same type of Hulk whom Superman said, "He took everything I had, and almost stood up to it." ?

Diana better end this fast, or she's Amazon goo.

Originally posted by Mindship
Is this the same type of Hulk whom Superman said, "He took everything I had, and almost stood up to it." ?

Diana better end this fast, or she's Amazon goo.

He only fought Savage Hulk in official crossovers.

He won against the Hulk in DC vs. Marvel but we all know that was written by a Middle Eastern jackass with Down Syndrome.....


Diana wins. Far too fast. Most of Hulks' blows will miss Diana by a mile. Far too skilled. She breaks his arm in a complicated flurry of judo moves. Far too strong (initially).

Not to mention she has a lasso that would end the battle instantly....

Savage Hulk as a chance. But Prof. Hulk goes down.

Originally posted by Draco69
He only fought Savage Hulk in official crossovers.

He won against the Hulk in DC vs. Marvel but we all know that was written by a Middle Eastern jackass with Down Syndrome.....


Diana wins. Far too fast. Most of Hulks' blows will miss Diana by a mile. Far too skilled. She breaks his arm in a complicated flurry of judo moves. Far too strong (initially).

Not to mention she has a lasso that would end the battle instantly....

Agreed. WW wins.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Savage Hulk as a chance. But Prof. Hulk goes down.
A while ago, I would have agreed with this, but I think Professor's chances are about as good as Savage's. His strength and durability are underrated by some (including me).

Actually I always thought of Prof. Hulk as the most dangerous version.

WW in a pure fist fight had better win it quick I think. I believe she can but if it went to long she may not be able to hurt him.

Hulk ends up getting downplayed a lot because of ranting fanboys and jokes. That almost limitless str thing is for real though. Sooner or later he can get so strong no ones gonna be able to withstand his punches and str based attacks.

Rather easily. Speedblitz. When a enormous force has enormous momentum behind it...ouch. Several hundred blows every nanosecond will put Hulk down.

Originally posted by Draco69
Rather easily. Speedblitz. When a enormous force has enormous momentum behind it...ouch. Several hundred blows every nanosecond will put Hulk down.
I agree, Im just saying shes not gonna be able to stand there and trade blows with him for long. In fact no ones going to be able to for very long.

Originally posted by Draco69
Rather easily. Speedblitz. When a enormous force has enormous momentum behind it...ouch. Several hundred blows every nanosecond will put Hulk down.

100's of blows every NANOsecond??? eer Draco..... disgust

Originally posted by batdude123
100's of blows every NANOsecond??? eer Draco..... disgust

What? Nanosecond is my favorite word....

She conceivably could. She has reached speeds close to light and has surpassed light by reaching the Speed Force Barrier (albeit she followed Jesse Quick and Savatar) so several hundred blows, up close, per nanosecond isn't completely outside of her abilities....

Originally posted by Draco69
What? Nanosecond is my favorite word....

She conceivably could. She has reached speeds close to light and has surpassed light by reaching the Speed Force Barrier (albeit she followed Jesse Quick and Savatar) so several hundred blows, up close, per nanosecond isn't completely outside of her abilities....

Draco.... disgust

Originally posted by batdude123
Draco.... disgust

Doesn't matter anyway. 100's of punches per second would right kill Hulk.

Originally posted by batdude123
Draco.... disgust

Batdude disgust

anyways I'd give Diana the majority here she way to skilled and fast for Hulk as others have said and she can end the fight with the lasso .

Yes Wonderwoman could infact land a 100 blows in a nanosecond, if northstar and Aurora can do something similar and hurt Savage Hulk, yeah Professor is done for

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF29.jpg

Northstar even landed a thousand blows in a second against the Ravanger

nanosecond?? *insert the peoples eyebrow ala the Rock here*

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Yes Wonderwoman could infact land a 100 blows in a nanosecond, if northstar and Aurora can do something similar and hurt Savage Hulk, yeah Professor is done for

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF29.jpg

Northstar even landed a thousand blows in a second against the Ravanger

Which is not the same as a nanosecond...

Originally posted by batdude123
Which is not the same as a nanosecond...

I never said it was the same, "northstar and Aurora can do something similar"

Originally posted by batdude123
Which is not the same as a nanosecond...
Ahemmm. I clearly pointed that out with the peoples eyebrow ala the Rock

Originally posted by Draco69
He only fought Savage Hulk in official crossovers.

He won against the Hulk in DC vs. Marvel but we all know that was written by a Middle Eastern jackass with Down Syndrome.....




.... why must it be a middle eastern jackass...

sounds like a prejudicial comment to me....


in any case.. professor doesn't really get stronger like savage does.. I don't remember him amping up his strength by getting stronger.. He's like base hulk... but with the mind of banner.. and lefthanded... Dianna is gonna start off stronger and faster.. and more fighting skills... Her durability isn't anything to scoff at either...

Maestro I see beating Diana. Prof Hulk dies. turns into a pile of goo.. .and comes back to life.. but technically loses. :P

Originally posted by King_Mungi
I never said it was the same, "northstar and Aurora can do something similar"

Bah!!! You and your.... WORDS!!!

Originally posted by batdude123
Bah!!! You and your.... WORDS!!!

2ghh5wh 546hthert ty456y45ysdf

is that better

What'd you say about his momma!!!!

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Savage Hulk as a chance. But Prof. Hulk goes down.

Savage Hulk's chance...


















































. 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000001%

Hundreds of blows a second?

Hundreds per NANOsecond?

Rip Hulk in half?

*Shakes head*

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Hundreds of blows a second?

Hundreds per NANOsecond?

Rip Hulk in half?

*Shakes head* Now run Forrest run back to SHC and tell your friends.

Hulk is definite able to get up there in strength. But WW's base strength is far ahead that she only needs a couple blows to knock him out. And he would be fighting someone who is like Batman with Superman lvl strength. WW 8/10 On skill and base strength. And the fact that she can amp her strength as well.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Now run Forrest run back to SHC and tell your friends.

You seem to have roles reversed here.

Though if I were inclined to tell SHC about the silliness I see on this thread, you could be assured that my account of it would be accurate.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Hundreds of blows a second?

Hundreds per NANOsecond?

Rip Hulk in half?

*Shakes head*

Ah the last of a dieing bread

Originally posted by Jonathanos
You seem to have roles reversed here.

Though if I were inclined to tell SHC about the silliness I see on this thread, you could be assured that my account of it would be accurate. Well don't talk. Let's see the results.

Originally posted by Grimm22
Ah the last of a dieing bread

Reason is a dying bread?

I'll call the baker.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
You seem to have roles reversed here.

Though if I were inclined to tell SHC about the silliness I see on this thread, you could be assured that my account of it would be accurate.

SuperHeroChat?

Oh yes. The "Black Panther could defeat Wonder Woman in combat" Forum.

WW there is like the worst-written Wolverine over there. Lotta hate in SHC....

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Well don't talk. Let's see the results.

If you want to see this thread at SHC, post it.

Originally posted by Draco69
SuperHeroChat?

Oh yes. The "Black Panther could defeat Wonder Woman in combat" Forum.

WW there is like the worst-written Wolverine over there. Lotta hate in SHC....

Where did that ever get said? Seriously.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Hulk is definite able to get up there in strength. But WW's base strength is far ahead that she only needs a couple blows to knock him out.
I wouldn't say she's that far ahead. At the very least, Hulk seems to start out just a little below her in strength.
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
And the fact that she can amp her strength as well.
Que?

Originally posted by Jonathanos
If you want to see this thread at SHC, post it. Putting that aside. Who wins in your opinion?

Originally posted by Jonathanos
If you want to see this thread at SHC, post it.

SHC has some really good respect threads (Ironically WW has the largest respect thread but she still gets no respect over there...) but alot of the threads over there don't make any sense.

I personally prefer Comicbookresources.com. They're most reasonable rumblers on the web.

Originally posted by Draco69
SHC has some really good respect threads (Ironically WW has the largest respect thread but she still gets no respect over there...) but alot of the threads over there don't make any sense.

I personally prefer Comicbookresources.com. They're most reasonable rumblers on the web.
not really

the people over at CBR think Sentry can take out the Big 7 JLA

By himself

Originally posted by Accel


Que?

By drawing more power from the Earth or rather Gaea.

Originally posted by Draco69
By drawing more power from the Earth or rather Gaea.
Ah, I see. That's a new one to me.

I find CBR less than reasonable with their method of debating power sets-- and not always the power sets shown in the comics-- rather than battles between characters.

Plus they have mad hate for Captain America and Spider-Man.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
I find CBR less than reasonable with their method of debating power sets-- and not always the power sets shown in the comics-- rather than battles between characters.

Plus they have mad hate for Captain America and Spider-Man.
and half of their threads aren't even about comics

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Putting that aside. Who wins in your opinion?

Hulk would probably win, though Wonder Woman would certainly give him a tough fight and could definitely take it.

Originally posted by Devil Lance
and half of their threads aren't even about comics Neither is SHC. They have rapper vs. threads, T.V. stars etc.

It's kinda wierd.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
I find CBR less than reasonable with their method of debating power sets-- and not always the power sets shown in the comics-- rather than battles between characters.

Plus they have mad hate for Captain America and Spider-Man.

CBR debates logically using science, high-end feats and common sense.

The hate for Captain America is not apparent from what I've seen. Biggest threads usually include him. One popular one I remember is Cap vs. Cassandra Cain.

Spider-Man? No, not really. They know who he can win against.

I like logical forums using high-end feats rather than the "A beat B so he can beat C" logic with SHC....

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Reason is a dying bread?

I'll call the baker.

Fine glare

BREED rather

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Hulk would probably win, though Wonder Woman would certainly give him a tough fight and could definitely take it.

Since he can't amp himself up that fast, how is he gonna out punch her? He isn't as fast as her. Or as skilled a fighter? And with the Punishment I saw her take when she fought superman, and when she fought decay and used the earth to amp her healing factor, I don't think Hulk get's more than 2/10. He might get lucky and hit her with a sharp Rock or something. She doesn't do to well with sharp objects with major force behind them.

Bah CBR banned me for having a political opinion glare

Hate them

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Hulk would probably win, though Wonder Woman would certainly give him a tough fight and could definitely take it.

Professor Hulk?

Too slow. Not skilled and his patented "The angrier I get, the stronger I get!" ability isn't apparent in Professor Hulk.

Diana also has a lasso that can instantly end the battle with a good speedblitz.

But people in SHC believe that Namor or Colossus can break it so....

Originally posted by Grimm22
Bah CBR banned me for having a political opinion glare

Hate them
Thing is a Democrat right? That is a blue state

Originally posted by Draco69
Professor Hulk?

Too slow. Not skilled and his patented "The angrier I get, the stronger I get!" ability isn't apparent in Professor Hulk.

Diana also has a lasso that can instantly end the battle with a good speedblitz.

But people in SHC believe that Namor or Colossus can break it so....



Can break it?

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Thing is a Democrat right? That is a blue state

Bah Ben isnt a democrat or a republican.

He's like me, a free thinker

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Thing is a Democrat right? That is a blue state

I'd say he's more of a facist now since he's Pro-Reg.

Originally posted by Draco69
I'd say he's more of a facist now since he's Pro-Reg.

Bah

First, Pro-Reg's arent facists.

Second, Ben isnt pro-reg

He's Anti-Reg, but he refuses to take part in the war

Originally posted by Grimm22
Bah

First, Pro-Reg's arent facists.

Second, Ben isnt pro-reg

He's Anti-Reg, but he refuses to take part in the war

Then why'd he beat the crap out of Hulkling and say "Do as you're told!"

Sounds like a facist to me.

Out of all the people in Marvel, I would have seen Ben on the Anti-Reg. He doesn't belong in the Pro-Reg camp....

Originally posted by Grimm22
Bah CBR banned me for having a political opinion glare

Hate them

CBR temp banned me for posting a little over 3 scans frrom one issue.

Originally posted by Draco69
Then why'd he beat the crap out of Hulkling and say "Do as you're told!"

Sounds like a facist to me.

Out of all the people in Marvel, I would have seen Ben on the Anti-Reg. He doesn't belong in the Pro-Reg camp....


Maybe Ben had another mssg to deliver in beating up Hulkling

Originally posted by Draco69
Then why'd he beat the crap out of Hulkling and say "Do as you're told!"

Sounds like a facist to me.

Out of all the people in Marvel, I would have seen Ben on the Anti-Reg. He doesn't belong in the Pro-Reg camp....

I have a feeling that Sue is gonna turn on the Pro Reg camp and defect to the other side.

Originally posted by Draco69
Then why'd he beat the crap out of Hulkling and say "Do as you're told!"

Sounds like a facist to me.

Out of all the people in Marvel, I would have seen Ben on the Anti-Reg. He doesn't belong in the Pro-Reg camp....

Ben will be changing sides if he is going to choose a side.

I donno why Ben was on that side in CW #3. Then again why was Sue on that side?!?

That was only the first battle of the war.

Ben will be Anti-Reg in the last battle, gurranteed

Also, that isnt facist. Makes Ben sound like a tool? Yes. Facist though? No

Originally posted by Soleran
Maybe Ben had another mssg to deliver in beating up Hulkling

Yeah

Like "Change your name you dumbass it sucks!"

Poor WW: Doesn't Get ANY respect on SHC....

http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=118473&highlight=wonder+woman

Apparently they believe that Iron Man can defeat WW with one punch...

http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=117825&highlight=wonder+woman

Class 10 Valkerie can beat WW...

http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=117642&highlight=wonder+woman

Actual Quote: "WW certainly isn't a good deal stronger than Wonder Man. She's barely stronger than the Thing. Perez's wankfest aside, WW at best is a teeny weeny bit stronger than Simon.

And Thor is way stronger than Wonder Man."



http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=117574&highlight=wonder+woman

Actual Quote: "He is on par with Wonder Woman in strength."



Good Lord these people are stupid....

Originally posted by Draco69
CBR debates logically using science, high-end feats and common sense.

The hate for Captain America is not apparent from what I've seen. Biggest threads usually include him. One popular one I remember is Cap vs. Cassandra Cain.

Spider-Man? No, not really. They know who he can win against.

I like logical forums using high-end feats rather than the "A beat B so he can beat C" logic with SHC....

Comparing high-end feats is not logical. Very rarely do they indicate the true relative power level of the characters.

Thing doesn't have lifting feats that approach the high-end feats of many of the top tier yet he IS able to hold his own in battle with them so clearly they're not as far beyond him as a comparison of feats suggests.

Spider-Man has put a hurting on or even beaten many characters who are near top tier yet CBR will not accept that Spider-Man is able to do it. There's a rule named after him for the express purpose of ignoring that he has done it many times.

Captain America has dodged bullets but they will not accept it.

ABC isn't concrete logic on SHC because ABC can mislead a person by not taking into account character. Using ABC logic, one (who hasn't seen Hulk vs. Surfer fights) might think:

A. Thor has beaten Surfer.
B. Hulk fights Thor to a standstill.
C. Hulk beats Surfer.

Nope. Thor fights Hulk on his terms due to Thor's pride. Thor tosses in some lightning and ranged hammer shots but little else. Thor is able to beat Surfer because he has the versatility to do so. OTOH, Surfer doesn't fight Hulk the way Thor fights.

Stupid? No

Little to no knowledge of Diana? Yes

Still they have a great Thing respect thread so I cant insult them

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Since he can't amp himself up that fast, how is he gonna out punch her? He isn't as fast as her. Or as skilled a fighter? And with the Punishment I saw her take when she fought superman, and when she fought decay and used the earth to amp her healing factor, I don't think Hulk get's more than 2/10. He might get lucky and hit her with a sharp Rock or something. She doen't do to well with sharp objects with major force behind them.

He can amp himself that fast and she's not as much stronger than his base level as some of you seem to think, if she is at all. Personally, I'm not sure which of the two is stronger when Hulk's calm and I don't know how you could determine it. If I had to say, I'd give Wonder Woman perhaps a small edge in strength. She'd be low to middle tier Class 100 while Hulk is lower Class 100.

She's a better fighter than he is, but so are a lot of the guys he fights. She's a better fighter than Superman, too, but Superman will beat her.

Superman vs. Diana was a good fight but Superman didn't do THAT much damage to her. He broke her wrist and burned her cheek. And he hit her really hard. Except for the heat vision, Hulk could duplicate that damage.

When has she ever speedblitzed an opponent like is being suggested? I grant that she's faster than Hulk but she is not going to hit Hulk a hundred times a second.

The Merged Hulk should win at least 7-8/10

he owns hulk's powers and Banner's mind

Originally posted by DevilGoblin
The Merged Hulk should win at least 7-8/10

he owns hulk's powers and Banner's mind

Keep dreaming pal...

Originally posted by Draco69
Professor Hulk?

Too slow. Not skilled and his patented "The angrier I get, the stronger I get!" ability isn't apparent in Professor Hulk.

Diana also has a lasso that can instantly end the battle with a good speedblitz.

But people in SHC believe that Namor or Colossus can break it so....



Uh, what Hulk comics are you reading? Professor Hulk had zero problem getting angry. His real problem between IH #425 and 437 was to keep his anger in control because he would revert to human form when he got too angry.

I don't recall anyone saying Namor or Colossus can break the lasso.

Originally posted by Draco69
Poor WW: Doesn't Get ANY respect on SHC....

http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=118473&highlight=wonder+woman

Apparently they believe that Iron Man can defeat WW with one punch...

A fully amped Iron Man in an older armor kayoed Hulk with one shot. I don't see a problem with Iron Man doing it, especially in a more powerful armor.

Just because he CAN doesn't mean he's LIKELY to do it. I think Wonder Woman CAN kayo Hulk with one punch. It's just not likely.

Originally posted by Draco69
http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=117825&highlight=wonder+woman

Class 10 Valkerie can beat WW...

One person said he guesses that maybe Val wins if she has Aragorn and her sword. And I bet that X was considering Valkyrie kayoing Hulk with a nerve pinch.

I believe Val's Class 35, though.

Originally posted by Draco69
http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=117642&highlight=wonder+woman

Actual Quote: "WW certainly isn't a good deal stronger than Wonder Man. She's barely stronger than the Thing. Perez's wankfest aside, WW at best is a teeny weeny bit stronger than Simon.

And Thor is way stronger than Wonder Man."



So? I don't really agree that she's barely stronger than Thing or that Thor is "way stronger" than Wonder Man but I do agree that it's probably close between her and Wonder Man.

Most people that I saw agreed that she's stronger than Wonder Man.

Originally posted by Draco69
http://herochat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=117574&highlight=wonder+woman

Actual Quote: "He is on par with Wonder Woman in strength."



That's not the consensus.

Originally posted by Draco69
Good Lord these people are stupid....

Could be worse. They could be saying Wonder Woman hits someone hundreds of times per nanosecond or rips Hulk in half.

Originally posted by DevilGoblin
The Merged Hulk should win at least 7-8/10

he owns hulk's powers and Banner's mind

dude i don't dream, i only speak the truth

Originally posted by Jonathanos
He can amp himself that fast and she's not as much stronger than his base level as some of you seem to think, if she is at all.

Again, Professor Hulk can't amp. He doesn't have the "stronger by anger" power when he merged together...

His "base power level" is the lower-level Class 100 at or about 2000 tons as demostrated in the past.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Personally, I'm not sure which of the two is stronger when Hulk's calm and I don't know how you could determine it.

Pulling a third of the Earth against the Sun's gravity and holding meteorites the size of cities isn't a determinent of who's stronger with Hulk at base?




Originally posted by Jonathanos
If I had to say, I'd give Wonder Woman perhaps a small edge in strength. She'd be low to middle tier Class 100 while Hulk is lower Class 100.

As I can see, you've spent far too much time in SHC. WW is a "LOW" Class 100?! She can lift about 100 to 2000 tons in your mind?

Hell no....



She's high-level Class 100 on Superman and Captain Marvel's level.


Originally posted by Jonathanos
She's a better fighter than he is, but so are a lot of the guys he fights. She's a better fighter than Superman, too, but Superman will beat her.

Mainly because of his dozen abilities like heat vision, T-Vo, freeze breath, slightly superior strength, slightly superior speed and greater durability.

Oh and the editorial team is backing him up as always.

Hulk is a pure brick. He's slow. He's rather poor at fighting. And he's very durable. You HONESTLY believe that WW can counter that rather limited set of things he can do...?



Originally posted by Jonathanos
Superman vs. Diana was a good fight but Superman didn't do THAT much damage to her. He broke her wrist and burned her cheek.

WW cracked his kneecap and broke a couple of his ribs...

Oh and she nearly tore his throat out with her tiara.


Originally posted by Jonathanos
And he hit her really hard. Except for the heat vision, Hulk could duplicate that damage.

Hard? Um NO. Hulk would have to be INCREDIBLY pissed off to replicate that damage. Sundipped Superman hit Wonder Woman from the Sun to the Earth and the force of the blow was so strong that she traveled back to the Earth in under two minutes. That's faster than light. And she only blacked out for a couple of seconds at most timegauging the fight as whole....

Please. And how the heck is Hulk gonna hit her? She's too damn fast and too damned skilled to allow such a blow. Hulk SMASH! That's it. Diana will counter his clumsy moves as if he were a child...

Originally posted by Jonathanos
When has she ever speedblitzed an opponent like is being suggested? I grant that she's faster than Hulk but she is not going to hit Hulk a hundred times a second.

Like so:

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Uh, what Hulk comics are you reading? Professor Hulk had zero problem getting angry. His real problem between IH #425 and 437 was to keep his anger in control because he would revert to human form when he got too angry.

I don't recall anyone saying Namor or Colossus can break the lasso.

Professor Hulk didn't possess the "Savage Hulk" ability to get stronger as he got angrier. Because his Bruce Banner persona prevented it.

Seriously, Jean Grey had to unlock "Savage Hulk" so he could breach Onslaught's armour....

Originally posted by Draco69
Professor Hulk didn't possess the "Savage Hulk" ability to get stronger as he got angrier. Because his Bruce Banner persona prevented it.

Seriously, Jean Grey had to unlock "Savage Hulk" so he could breach Onslaught's armour....

Guy, you're wrong.

Right before Onslaught, Merged Hulk fought Thor to a standstill and late in the fight Thor even went into warrior madness.

Hulk was insanely angry at that point and Samson remarked that he'd never seen the Hulk angrier.

Onslaught: MU ignored that.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Guy, you're wrong.

Right before Onslaught, Merged Hulk fought Thor to a standstill and late in the fight Thor even went into warrior madness.

Hulk was insanely angry at that point and Samson remarked that he'd never seen the Hulk angrier.

Onslaught: MU ignored that.

You're ignoring the fact that Merged Hulk got retconned as Professor Hulk being a fourth distinct personality rather than the three including Banner, Savage and Grey.

Professor Hulk didn't possess the "stronger by anger" ability because his personality didn't allow it.

Merged Hulk used to be Professor Hulk but it got retconned as a complete almagram of the four personalites that Banner possessed in his crazy little head. The ultimate fantasy of what he wished he were to be: Powerful as the Hulk, Cunning as Grey Hulk, and still possessing intellect. However it turned out it was just a seperate personality...

Merged Hulk was a crazy, schizophrenic mess that couldn't handle all four personalites....

Originally posted by Draco69
Again, Professor Hulk can't amp. He doesn't have the "stronger by anger" power when he merged together...

His "base power level" is the lower-level Class 100 at or about 2000 tons as demostrated in the past.


Yes, he does. And show me where his power level was demonstrated to be that low.

Originally posted by Draco69
Pulling a third of the Earth against the Sun's gravity and holding meteorites the size of cities isn't a determinent of who's stronger with Hulk at base?



Not any more than Fixit shattering an asteroid twice the size of Earth demonstrates that he's billions of times stronger than the Thing.

Originally posted by Draco69
As I can see, you've spent far too much time in SHC. WW is a "LOW" Class 100?! She can lift about 100 to 2000 tons in your mind?

Hell no....



She's high-level Class 100 on Superman and Captain Marvel's level.

I see that you don't understand that the Handbook's Class 100 doesn't mean 100 tons in continuity.

Originally posted by Draco69
Mainly because of his dozen abilities like heat vision, T-Vo, freeze breath, slightly superior strength, slightly superior speed and greater durability.

Oh and the editorial team is backing him up as always.

He didn't use anything but strength and speed and a blast of heat vision. If her skill really meant as much as you want it to, she should have beaten his butt. A skilled fighter who's not as strong as I am can kick my butt.

So either she's not as powerful as you think or skill doesn't mean as much in comics as you think it does.

Originally posted by Draco69
Hulk is a pure brick. He's slow. He's rather poor at fighting. And he's very durable. You HONESTLY believe that WW can counter that rather limited set of things he can do...?



Hulk whipped Hyperion. Yes she can counter him and she'll even take her share.

Originally posted by Draco69
WW cracked his kneecap and broke a couple of his ribs...

Oh and she nearly tore his throat out with her tiara.

Are these injuries supposed to mean much to Hulk?

Originally posted by Draco69
Hard? Um NO. Hulk would have to be INCREDIBLY pissed off to replicate that damage. Sundipped Superman hit Wonder Woman from the Sun to the Earth and the force of the blow was so strong that she traveled back to the Earth in under two minutes. That's faster than light. And she only blacked out for a couple of seconds at most timegauging the fight as whole....

I don't think he sundipped. He was taking her towards the sun but never made it.

Speed works funny in comics. Hulk can leap fast enough to overtake ICBMs and the reasoning isn't because he moves his legs that fast but he's so strong he can jump fast.

Superman punched her really hard. So she flew really fast.

Originally posted by Draco69
Please. And how the heck is Hulk gonna hit her? She's too damn fast and too damned skilled to allow such a blow. Hulk SMASH! That's it. Diana will counter his clumsy moves as if he were a child...

Hulk will hit her the same way everyone else hits her. The same way he hits people with similar powers.

Because speed isn't used the way we think it should be used.

Originally posted by Draco69
Like so:

That's it? She gets blitzed by Flash and manages to grab him and that's supposed to be her hitting someone hundreds of times a second or nanosecond?

How fast was Flash going? And did Wonder Woman zip over there and take the blade from Hawkman?

Originally posted by Draco69
You're ignoring the fact that Merged Hulk got retconned as Professor Hulk being a fourth distinct personality rather than the three including Banner, Savage and Grey.

Professor Hulk didn't possess the "stronger by anger" ability because his personality didn't allow it.

Merged Hulk used to be Professor Hulk but it got retconned as a complete almagram of the four personalites that Banner possessed in his crazy little head. The ultimate fantasy of what he wished he were to be: Powerful as the Hulk, Cunning as Grey Hulk, and still possessing intellect. However it turned out it was just a seperate personality...

Merged Hulk was a crazy, schizophrenic mess that couldn't handle all four personalites....

Professor Hulk is the name that incarnation took when Jurgens revealed that he was not a true merger. He is STILL the same incarnation and still has the same power. Professor has traits of all three personalities, even though he isn't a merger of the three.

He always had the ability to get stronger and never had a problem with getting angrier. He said it from the beginning:

IH #379: "Let's get one thing straight right now: The old Bruce Banner, when he had the Hulk's body, couldn't get madder and stronger. But this is the new Bruce Banner. And the new Hulk. Getting madder isn't a problem with me. Neither is getting stronger."

what?? Wonder Woman a match for the Hulk? No way, As much as i like Wonder Woman, she is outclassed here!

Jesus cant believe the comments I read here in the first pages.


Hulk and Juggernaut stalemate each other and both can beat Wonder Woman.
Superman ofcourse is a different story.

Originally posted by x_danny_x
what?? Wonder Woman a match for the Hulk? No way, As much as i like Wonder Woman, she is outclassed here!

Jesus cant believe the comments I read here in the first pages.


Hulk and Juggernaut stalemate each other and both can beat Wonder Woman.
Superman ofcourse is a different story.

Have you ever seen Wonder Woman fight Superman?

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Yes, he does. And show me where his power level was demonstrated to be that low.

No he doesn't. Read prior post.

His power level at "calm" (or rather with Professor Hulk is constant) is shown numerous times. He once hauled a truckload of redwood trees that weighed about 2000 tons.




Originally posted by Jonathanos
Not any more than Fixit shattering an asteroid twice the size of Earth demonstrates that he's billions of times stronger than the Thing.

And the Thing has kicked the crap out of Grey Hulk more times than I can count.

Grey Hulk somehow destroyed the asteroid after being propelled by a anti-gravatational device that allowed him to reach the asteroid. I'm giving more credit to the scientist and his device and his suggestion on where to hit the meteorite....



Originally posted by Jonathanos
I see that you don't understand that the Handbook's Class 100 doesn't mean 100 tons in continuity.

I see you don't understand that hauling planetary bodies and things the size of cities doesn't not constitute "low" Class 100. If Diana is low to mid, than Captain Marvel and Superman are around the same arena and Thor is around low to mid Class 100 as well. Where is this elusive high-level Class 100 anyway?



Originally posted by Jonathanos
He didn't use anything but strength and speed and a blast of heat vision.

And his ice breath. And sundipping.....



Originally posted by Jonathanos
If her skill really meant as much as you want it to, she should have beaten his butt.

I find it immensely ironic that Batman with Kryptonite Ring can tag Superman everyday of the week but Wonder Woman with Kryptonite Ring misses....

Originally posted by Jonathanos
A skilled fighter who's not as strong as I am can kick my butt.

Gee, since you consider Hulk to be stronger than WW, than by your logic....



Originally posted by Jonathanos
So either she's not as powerful as you think or skill doesn't mean as much in comics as you think it does.

Skill means alot in comics....as long as your street-level. If you're street-level and you possess alot of skill you can stalemate or beat people several hundred times stronger than you.

If you're superstrong and skilled like Thor, Wonder Woman, Big Barda or Hercules, than your skill is instantly forgotten and you fight like grandpa on Red Bull.

In KMC Forums, we don't make that mistake...



Originally posted by Jonathanos
Hulk whipped Hyperion. Yes she can counter him and she'll even take her share.

Wonder Woman whipped Cronos and the Shattered God. Both are Skyfather-level beings. Hyperion in true fight without PIS/CIS and the Marvel Editorial team hellbent on every Marvel Superman clone losing to the Hulk, would own Hulk. He would beat Hulk much like Superman would. Except he would take a little while longer...



Originally posted by Jonathanos
Are these injuries supposed to mean much to Hulk?

Yes. It's Superman after all....

What you consider Professor Hulk more durable and hardy than Superman....?

After a brief Sundipp...?




Originally posted by Jonathanos
I don't think he sundipped. He was taking her towards the sun but never made it.

He and WW were practically bathing in solar flares. He wasn't IN the Sun but he sure as hell was wading in it. It doesn't matter. He was practically on the Sun so his solar batteries were being pumped to the max. That's how he beat light from the Earth to the Sun in under two minutes. The closer he gets to the Sun, the more powerful he gets...

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Speed works funny in comics. Hulk can leap fast enough to overtake ICBMs and the reasoning isn't because he moves his legs that fast but he's so strong he can jump fast.

Yes. Speed works funny in comics. The Flash can operate at lightspeeds on one leg but 20 mph boomerang always manages to hit him.

In this rule-regulated forum, speed works perfectly fine and logically so. That means no boomerangs are hitting the Flash... EVER.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Superman punched her really hard. So she flew really fast.



Did you fail physics? Can you imagine the amount of sheer force it would take to launch an object at faster than lightspeeds in under two minutes? The battle as a whole was under two minutes. Superman must have taken at least 30 seconds to fly their asses to the Sun. The battle as per dialogue must have last at least a minute. So the force of the punch was so strong she was knocked from the Earth to the Sun with a psi that allowed her to be thrust at speeds much greater than light from 10 to 30 seconds maximum. The entire battle lasted 1:54 seconds....

A space shuttle utilizes several million tons of force to propel them into space and go at Mach speeds several times higher than sound.

So Superman must have.....



Originally posted by Jonathanos
Hulk will hit her the same way everyone else hits her. The same way he hits people with similar powers.

Originally posted by Jonathanos
Because speed isn't used the way we think it should be used.

No. It's your biased opinion that WW's speed should be completely ignored because it doesn't suit your arguement.

Uh-Uh. We don't allow PIS/CIS to cloud our judgement. That means Flash, Superman, Captain Marvel, Quicksilver and yes Wonder Woman will be using their speed to the very best of their abilities as per the rules set down by the moderators.

Because if we don't, anyone could argue that Wolverine could tag the Flash and win at least 4 out of 10....

Hulk won't hit WW. He may land a lucky blow, but Diana's just too damn fast. And she has far more manueverability. And she has this nifty Skyfather-level deflecting blast vambraces that would deflect any blow that gets remotely near her. After all, Hulk is brute and WW is highly skilled Amazon....




Originally posted by Jonathanos
hat's it? She gets blitzed by Flash and manages to grab him and that's supposed to be her hitting someone hundreds of times a second or nanosecond?

Oh for heaven's sake.

She could do this:



http://img122.exs.cx/img122/9987/JLA02616.jpg

or this:

http://img49.imageshack.us/img49/7514/jla43pg095ou.jpg

or this:

http://img122.exs.cx/img122/7572/JLA2pg07.jpg

Originally posted by x_danny_x
what?? Wonder Woman a match for the Hulk? No way, As much as i like Wonder Woman, she is outclassed here!

Jesus cant believe the comments I read here in the first pages.


Hulk and Juggernaut stalemate each other and both can beat Wonder Woman.
Superman ofcourse is a different story.

Here's two simple ways Diana can win:

She throws the lasso on Hulk. He instantly reverts back to Banner. WW breaks his neck.

She taps on Hulk on the head with the Morpheus Touch, a magical ability given to her by the Morpheus himself that allows her to instantly put anyone (even gods) into a coma or sleep. And they can't awaken until she wants them to....



However these are very cheap and Diana won't cop out like that.

I wish Hulk luck fighting a faster than sound; approaching light, nearly strong as Superman, nearly as skilled as Lady Shiva, opponent while his hands and feet are bound in a unbreakable tangle-wire called the Lasso of Truth.

What's funny, is that the Hulkbuster, Hulk fought, called himself a 125 tonner.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Have you ever seen Wonder Woman fight Superman?


yes, about that issue with the President you mean? I hated that issue, Superman is much stronger than that and they were stalling and talking at the sametime. It wasnt like a villian fighting a hero.

Wonder Woman weaker Superman. She has 75% of his strenght and nowhere near his speed, etc. There were numerous threads about Superman using his full extent of his powers such as going almost at the speed of light but how much fun will that be if he does that? You want a battle so you can keep the reader interested.


If you look at what some of the characters powers and what they can do, you realize that the writers dont show all their potential in a fight cause there wont be much of fight. Superman going the speed of light can go in hit anybody mulitple times hundreths of a second.

Originally posted by x_danny_x
yes, about that issue with the President you mean? I hated that issue, Superman is much stronger than that and they were stalling and talking at the sametime. It wasnt like a villian fighting a hero.

Wonder Woman weaker Superman. She has 75% of his strenght and nowhere near his speed, etc. There were numerous threads about Superman using his full extent of his powers such as going almost at the speed of light but how much fun will that be if he does that? You want a battle so you can keep the reader interested.


If you look at what some of the characters powers and what they can do, you realize that the writers dont show all their potential in a fight cause there wont be much of fight. Superman going the speed of light can go in hit anybody mulitple times hundreths of a second.

Please go to the WW Respect Thread.....

I never understand why WW feats of where she is clearly holding back is considered her best, whereas Superman feats where is clearly holding back is recognized as it should be.

People harp about bloodlust, all-out Superman.

Is it THAT hard to imagine a bloodlusted, all-out Wonder Woman?

Let's take Goku from DragonBall Z. Take away his energy attacks. And you get an all-out Wonder Woman only using her strength, speed and some skill.

It's not that hard....

Originally posted by x_danny_x
yes, about that issue with the President you mean? I hated that issue, Superman is much stronger than that and they were stalling and talking at the sametime. It wasnt like a villian fighting a hero.

Wonder Woman weaker Superman. She has 75% of his strenght and nowhere near his speed, etc. There were numerous threads about Superman using his full extent of his powers such as going almost at the speed of light but how much fun will that be if he does that? You want a battle so you can keep the reader interested.


If you look at what some of the characters powers and what they can do, you realize that the writers dont show all their potential in a fight cause there wont be much of fight. Superman going the speed of light can go in hit anybody mulitple times hundreths of a second.


HMM. So when Superman says that Captain Marvel and Diana hit the same, that means nothing? Or when the Omac files have WW and Superman's Strength and Speed as identicle, that means nothing? Or how WW is shown lifting Rocks the size of islands, that means nothing? Or the fact that she can if she wishes, amp her strength ALL the way up to the full power of the earth. Where are you getting this magical 75% figure from?

Originally posted by Jonathanos

Not any more than Fixit shattering an asteroid twice the size of Earth demonstrates that he's billions of times stronger than the Thing.


dontgetit

jawdrop

hystericalhystericalhysterical

Originally posted by Draco69

And the Thing has kicked the crap out of Grey Hulk more times than I can count.

Grey Hulk somehow destroyed the asteroid after being propelled by a anti-gravatational device that allowed him to reach the asteroid. I'm giving more credit to the scientist and his device and his suggestion on where to hit the meteorite....



thumbsup

Diana is in another leauge than any Hulk

Originally posted by Grimm22
dontgetit

jawdrop

hystericalhystericalhysterical

Come on, Grimm22.

Post a scan showing the Thing kicking the crap out of Grey Hulk.

You know you want to....

I recall the Omac files having them in different speed categories but I read that a long time ago. My recollection could be wrong.

Originally posted by Draco69
I see you don't understand that hauling planetary bodies and things the size of cities doesn't not constitute "low" Class 100. If Diana is low to mid, than Captain Marvel and Superman are around the same arena and Thor is around low to mid Class 100 as well. Where is this elusive high-level Class 100 anyway?
Thanos is High Class 100. Superman and Captain Marvel are mid level. Wonder Woman is low level. Maybe even Class 90-ish.
Originally posted by Draco69
I find it immensely ironic that Batman with Kryptonite Ring can tag Superman everyday of the week but Wonder Woman with Kryptonite Ring misses....
Batman is more skilled.
Originally posted by Draco69
Wonder Woman whipped Cronos and the Shattered God. Both are Skyfather-level beings. Hyperion in true fight without PIS/CIS and the Marvel Editorial team hellbent on every Marvel Superman clone losing to the Hulk, would own Hulk. He would beat Hulk much like Superman would. Except he would take a little while longer...
But comics show otherwise.
Originally posted by Draco69
What you consider Professor Hulk more durable and hardy than Superman....?

After a brief Sundipp...?
Hulk has better beats.

Originally posted by Draco69
Yes. Speed works funny in comics. The Flash can operate at lightspeeds on one leg but 20 mph boomerang always manages to hit him.

In this rule-regulated forum, speed works perfectly fine and logically so. That means no boomerangs are hitting the Flash... EVER.
Flash gets hit all the time. He's street level like his villains.
Originally posted by Draco69
No. It's your biased opinion that WW's speed should be completely ignored because it doesn't suit your arguement.

Uh-Uh. We don't allow PIS/CIS to cloud our judgement. That means Flash, Superman, Captain Marvel, Quicksilver and yes Wonder Woman will be using their speed to the very best of their abilities as per the rules set down by the moderators.

Because if we don't, anyone could argue that Wolverine could tag the Flash and win at least 4 out of 10....
All those guys get hit by slow guys. Savage Hulk takes 5/10 from any of them. Professor loses majority though.

Originally posted by Draco69
Hulk won't hit WW.
Yeah he will.
Originally posted by Draco69
He may land a lucky blow, but Diana's just too damn fast. And she has far more manueverability. And she has this nifty Skyfather-level deflecting blast vambraces that would deflect any blow that gets remotely near her. After all, Hulk is brute and WW is highly skilled Amazon....
Diana never crosses her bracelets in a fist fight. She won't do it here either.

Originally posted by Validus
You light up my life.

Originally posted by Draco69
Here's two simple ways Diana can win:

She throws the lasso on Hulk. He instantly reverts back to Banner. WW breaks his neck.

She taps on Hulk on the head with the Morpheus Touch, a magical ability given to her by the Morpheus himself that allows her to instantly put anyone (even gods) into a coma or sleep. And they can't awaken until she wants them to....



However these are very cheap and Diana won't cop out like that.

I wish Hulk luck fighting a faster than sound; approaching light, nearly strong as Superman, nearly as skilled as Lady Shiva, opponent while his hands and feet are bound in a unbreakable tangle-wire called the Lasso of Truth.


hey man no weapons, that is cheating since the Hulk doesnt have the luxery.

im going to bed, too tired to argue for now

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I recall the Omac files having them in different speed categories but I read that a long time ago. My recollection could be wrong.

Superman was A-2

Wonder Woman was A-3

Flash was A-1

Captain Marvel's file was blocked off by Maxwell Lord's ugly mug....

Originally posted by Draco69
Here's two simple ways Diana can win:

She throws the lasso on Hulk. He instantly reverts back to Banner. WW breaks his neck.

She taps on Hulk on the head with the Morpheus Touch, a magical ability given to her by the Morpheus himself that allows her to instantly put anyone (even gods) into a coma or sleep. And they can't awaken until she wants them to....
Bullshits.



Originally posted by Draco69
However these are very cheap and Diana won't cop out like that.

I wish Hulk luck fighting a faster than sound; approaching light, nearly strong as Superman, nearly as skilled as Lady Shiva, opponent while his hands and feet are bound in a unbreakable tangle-wire called the Lasso of Truth.
I wish Diana luck against the awesome power of Hulk.

Validus, you sneaky bastard!

I'm too tired to rebut....



This isn't over!

Draco fears Hulk.

Originally posted by Draco69
Superman was A-2

Wonder Woman was A-3

Flash was A-1

Captain Marvel's file was blocked off by Maxwell Lord's ugly mug.... Max wasn't my cup of tea, I mean he's no Validus, but he wasn't ugly ugly; maybe TV ugly.

So I was right about the speed. For someone as obsessive about DC as nvereasrwhatever you'd expect accuracy in statement.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
HMM. So when Superman says that Captain Marvel and Diana hit the same, that means nothing? Or when the Omac files have WW and Superman's Strength and Speed as identicle, that means nothing? Or how WW is shown lifting Rocks the size of islands, that means nothing? Or the fact that she can if she wishes, amp her strength ALL the way up to the full power of the earth. Where are you getting this magical 75% figure from?


it has bee talked about here that she has 75% of Superman's strenght and I dont even understand where you are coming with all this stuff that she has accomplished because your question was simply comparing her with Superman and I replied that Superman will defeat her plain and simple.

All characters have feats and strenght and certainly someone can match up WW respect thread with a version of the Hulk! It is that simple!

Originally posted by Draco69
Come on, Grimm22.

Post a scan showing the Thing kicking the crap out of Grey Hulk.

You know you want to....



True

But its late and im about to go to bed

That and the crushing the hulk fanboy's dreams arent worth the effort

Originally posted by Validus
Draco fears Hulk.

Child molestor!

Valdius is selling Jesus Juice on Ebay! I didn't want to say anything, but Validus crossed the line!

It's too tangy by the way....

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Max wasn't my cup of tea, I mean he's no Validus, but he wasn't ugly ugly; maybe TV ugly.

So I was right about the speed. For someone as obsessive about DC as nvereasrwhatever you'd expect accuracy in statement.

IF I remember correctly, her speed was the same as superman's but her flight was less than supermans. I'll have to look it up. But her strength was definitely the same as his. as was her invulnerability.

Originally posted by Draco69
Child molestor!

Valdius is selling Jesus Juice on Ebay! I didn't want to say anything, but Validus crossed the line!

It's too tangy by the way....

http://img247.imageshack.us/my.php?image=countdowntoinfinitecrisis12013.jpg


her speed is aA2 and her flight is A2



http://img247.imageshack.us/my.php?image=countdowntoinfinitecrisis01200.jpg
Superman's Speed is also A2 and his flight is A1

So they are almost dead evenly matched in every area but one.

Thier strength and Invulnerability is dead on.

I'm not seeing how WW is higher than A3 is any category.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
http://img247.imageshack.us/my.php?image=countdowntoinfinitecrisis12013.jpg


her speed is aA2 and her flight is A2



http://img247.imageshack.us/my.php?image=countdowntoinfinitecrisis01200.jpg
Superman's Speed is also A2 and his flight is A1

So they are almost dead evenly matched in every area but one.

Thier strength and Invulnerability is dead on.

Probably because Diana fly in space like he can. Space and Diana don't mix well....

Originally posted by Validus
I'm not seeing how WW is higher than A3 is any category.

Kyle Rayner has the willpower of Oprah Winfrey in a Krispy Kreme Doughnut Restaurant.

Originally posted by Draco69
Probably because Diana fly in space like he can. Space and Diana don't mix well....

She did well enough in space when she beat the white martian's ass. Primaid didn't know what hit her.

Originally posted by Draco69
And the Thing has kicked the crap out of Grey Hulk more times than I can count.
You can't count past one?

HTH? Hulk wins. Professor Hulk started at angry Hulk levels, enough so to evenly match Drax the Destroyer. Wonder Woman's combat "speed" never shows up when she faces, like, anyone (all she ever uses her speed for is deflecting projectiles and flying -- no one has much trouble tagging her and she doesn't speedblitz) As for skill, even with it, she's been physically dominated by Superman before. I see Professor Hulk as being at least equal to Kal in strength. IMO he's a level above her in strength and the durability gap is even greater. Her skill will allow her to hold her own, but she's not taking a majority.

Originally posted by Jimmy-Chan
I see Professor Hulk as being at least equal to Kal in strength.

Originally posted by Jimmy-Chan
HTH? Hulk wins. Professor Hulk started at angry Hulk levels, enough so to evenly match Drax the Destroyer. Wonder Woman's combat "speed" never shows up when she faces, like, anyone (all she ever uses her speed for is deflecting projectiles and flying -- no one has much trouble tagging her and she doesn't speedblitz) As for skill, even with it, she's been physically dominated by Superman before. I see Professor Hulk as being at least equal to Kal in strength. IMO he's a level above her in strength and the durability gap is even greater. Her skill will allow her to hold her own, but she's not taking a majority.


Forum rules dictate that characters will fight to the best of their ability and use their powers to the maximum and efficently.

That means WW's speedblitzing the poor bastard and Professor Hulk will be fighting a blur.

Flash is slowpoke in comics who can get tagged by boomerangs and thrown darts but in the forums, he's an nearly unbeatable speed god that would beat Hulk and Wonder Woman by himself at the same time because forum rules dicate that he fights to the very best of his ability.

And Professor Hulk is NOT equal to Superman in strength....

Not anywhere NEAR his level of strength. Prof. Hulk will have to get very angry to match Superman...and unfortunately he takes a hell of lot more time using his "angrier I get, stronger I get" ability due to his intellect...

Originally posted by bigbran


Something wrong with that? Assuming we agree that Superman is marginally stronger than Thor ... Or does this board beleive DC's top tiers >>> Marvel's? I know some boards do, but most places I've been at regard the average top tier Marvel strongman as equal to people occupying the same hiearchal spot in DC.

Originally posted by Draco69
Forum rules dictate that characters will fight to the best of their ability and use their powers to the maximum and efficently.

That means WW's speedblitzing the poor bastard and Professor Hulk will be fighting a blur.

Flash is slowpoke in comics who can get tagged by boomerangs and thrown darts but in the forums, he's an nearly unbeatable speed god that would beat Hulk and Wonder Woman by himself at the same time because forum rules dicate that he fights to the very best of his ability.



But the difference between WW and Flash is that WW's combat speed like never surfaces. She even got wrapped up in her lasso by Mr. Miracle before she could react. I've seen her fly, run straight, and deflect stuff at super speed, but I have never seen her display clear "combat speed" in any context. Her lack of it in actual combat is pretty consistent so far as I've seen.


But if you're going by bios with the "Speed of Hermes", extrapolating that to combat speed, I guess you're right. I just prefer not to debate things like that, personally.



Anyway, I'm answering how I think things would turn out in the comics. I'll just remove myself from the speculative bio-based part, as that's not really my cup of tea ...



Originally posted by Draco69

Not anywhere NEAR his level of strength. Prof. Hulk will have to get very angry to match Superman...and unfortunately he takes a hell of lot more time using his "angrier I get, stronger I get" ability due to his intellect...




Do you also think Superman dwarfs Thor in strength? Prof. was IMO a bit stronger than Thor at his base.

Originally posted by Jimmy-Chan



But the difference between WW and Flash is that WW's combat speed like never surfaces. She even got wrapped up in her lasso by Mr. Miracle before she could react. I've seen her fly, run straight, and deflect stuff at super speed, but I have never seen her display clear "combat speed" in any context. Her lack of it in actual combat is pretty consistent so far as I've seen.

She's speedblitzed many opponents in her own comic. If people would read them....

The "I've never seen happen in comics" arguement is not gonna work.

I've never seen Thor use anti-matter attacks nor stop time any time in the last two decades...however I don't discount he can do it.




Originally posted by Jimmy-Chan
But if you're going by bios with the "Speed of Hermes", extrapolating that to combat speed, I guess you're right. I just prefer not to debate things like that, personally.

Well yeah, If you can run at superspeed or fly at superspeed and manage not to hit anything on the way and perceive things well enough not to run over a poor grandmother or through a 747, then obviously she can hit things and avoid things at combat speed. Any speedster is capable of this.

I mean what's the difference between moving your legs and feet really fast and swinging your arms really fast at an opponent? What's the difference between deflecting gunfire at point blank range from all angles than a simple punch thrown by a much slower opponent?






Originally posted by Jimmy-Chan
Do you also think Superman dwarfs Thor in strength? Prof. was IMO a bit stronger than Thor at his base.

I put Thor, Superman, Immortal Hercules, Captain Marvel and Wonder Woman all around the same level or grade of strength. Some may be stronger than others or weaker than others but to me it's really no different from a man who can benchpress 200 pounds maximum and a man who can bench press 230 pounds maximum.

Originally posted by Draco69
She's speedblitzed many opponents in her own comic. If people would read them....


I've read quite a few WW comics (for guest stars or The Greek Gods ) and the closest thing to a speed-blitz I'm aware of is her running fast in a straight line, knocking some soldiers aside in a Rucka issue.

Mind you, by speed-blitz I mean attacking from all angles in a single panel or unloading a flurry of blows on an opponent too quickly for them to retaliate against. I've never seen this happen or heard it referenced by WW fans.




The "I've never seen happen in comics" arguement is not gonna work.

I've never seen Thor use anti-matter attacks nor stop time any time in the last two decades...however I don't discount he can do it.


The difference being he's actually done it. I've yet to see WW speed-blitz or look unhittable to people lacking super-speed a single time. But given that she realistically should have that speed as an extrapolation of her flight/deflections, go ahead an use it per the rules.


As I've said, I really only care to give my opinion on how I see something going down in actual comics. But to each his own.








Well yeah, If you can run at superspeed or fly at superspeed and manage not to hit anything on the way and perceive things well enough not to run over a poor grandmother or through a 747, then obviously she can hit things and avoid things at combat speed. Any speedster is capable of this.


Yeah but even She-Hulk and Rogue have this argument to a degree. Most mid level people with flight are also speedsters using this logic. Mind you, again I realize you have the "board rules" trump, which I'm not arguing against, but just giving my opinion on it.




I mean what's the difference between moving your legs and feet really fast and swinging your arms really fast at an opponent? What's the difference between deflecting gunfire at point blank range from all angles than a simple punch thrown by a much slower opponent?


Technically, there shouldn't be a difference. But in comics, there is. There are times when uber speed in the form of spinning an object or flying at FTL speed have been shown in a comic, yet the same comic shows the character accomplishing these things being blited by minor speedsters.






I put Thor, Superman, Immortal Hercules, Captain Marvel and Wonder Woman all around the same level or grade of strength. Some may be stronger than others or weaker than others but to me it's really no different from a man who can benchpress 200 pounds maximum and a man who can bench press 230 pounds maximum.



I put Professor Hulk above Thor. He seemed at least equal to Red Norvell, who is himself Thor's equal. In any event, Wonder Woman IMO comes off in relation to Superman roughly as strong as a human man is to a similar human woman. IOW she's strong enough to hurt him and she could hold him off grappling for a brief time, but there's never any question who would win a slug out. As such, she's forced to try and use skill to work around that. I think Supes#211, WW#175, WW#219, and JLA: A League of One illustrate this well enough.

Originally posted by Draco69
Again, Professor Hulk can't amp. He doesn't have the "stronger by anger" power when he merged together...

His "base power level" is the lower-level Class 100 at or about 2000 tons as demostrated in the past.



Pulling a third of the Earth against the Sun's gravity and holding meteorites the size of cities isn't a determinent of who's stronger with Hulk at base?






As I can see, you've spent far too much time in SHC. WW is a "LOW" Class 100?! She can lift about 100 to 2000 tons in your mind?

Hell no....



She's high-level Class 100 on Superman and Captain Marvel's level.




Mainly because of his dozen abilities like heat vision, T-Vo, freeze breath, slightly superior strength, slightly superior speed and greater durability.

Oh and the editorial team is backing him up as always.

Hulk is a pure brick. He's slow. He's rather poor at fighting. And he's very durable. You HONESTLY believe that WW can counter that rather limited set of things he can do...?





WW cracked his kneecap and broke a couple of his ribs...

Oh and she nearly tore his throat out with her tiara.




Hard? Um NO. Hulk would have to be INCREDIBLY pissed off to replicate that damage. Sundipped Superman hit Wonder Woman from the Sun to the Earth and the force of the blow was so strong that she traveled back to the Earth in under two minutes. That's faster than light. And she only blacked out for a couple of seconds at most timegauging the fight as whole....

Please. And how the heck is Hulk gonna hit her? She's too damn fast and too damned skilled to allow such a blow. Hulk SMASH! That's it. Diana will counter his clumsy moves as if he were a child...



Like so:


That pic shows what would happen to Wonder Woman.

Occurence: Incredible Hulk :Furture Imperfect #1

To help keep resistance down in an alternative future, the Maestro has created mechanical dogs called Dogs o' War whose jaws can crush adamtinum( the strongest metal in the Marvel Universe) in 7.3 seconds. The Hulk battles one and the dog gets the Hulk's head in it's jaws and is not even able to pierce the Hulk's skin before being defeated.

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h171/golem370/meddogowarstrength.jpg

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h171/golem370/professor10.gif

Professor Hulk is no weakling he has 40 years of fighting experience and he has fought better fighter then himself like Thor,Hercules,Namor and alot other people. I also have a book where Thanos shrinks the Hulk Professor Hulk in a sewer and he runs into Abomination 6foot8 980pounds and he plays a trick on Abom and he acts like is minds voice and at one point Hulk falls to the ground and tell Abom to lean down and with one punch hits so hard he is knocked into a standing position.

Some points here.

Prof Hulk was indeed a high class brick. Saying hes not "anywhere near" SM level is saying Thor and others that opperate on the same range arent as well. And thats faulty. The matches with Red Norvell (Thor`s equal) Immortal Herc (Thor`s equal) and Thor himself, show it.

Diana`s invulnerability being at the same level of Superman doesnt ring true. Unless shes constantly crossing her arms, shes not that high. In my opinion shes among the lowest "cl 100" in that regard, regulary speaking. Even tho like everyone else she has better feats outside that norm.

And Draco:

- The reason you havent seen Thor stop time in the last two decades was because that specific ability was removed from him in continuity. We know however before that event - that he could, since he has used it in the past.

- How will Hulk hit her? The same way lots of folks hit Flash, SM, Quicksilver and the like. With good enougth reflexes for the job. Plus, everyone knows, that fliers have a tendency to slug out, no matter the advantages they have.

Are we forgetting that Superman is waaaay faster than Hulk? And WW is able to deflect a good many of Superman's Blow's. The HUlk wouldn't land one single hit if Diana didn't want him to. PERIOD.

Originally posted by olympian
.- How will Hulk hit her? The same way lots of folks hit Flash, SM, Quicksilver and the like. With good enougth reflexes for the job. Plus, everyone knows that fliers have a tendency to slug out no matter the advantages they have.

and

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Are we forgetting that Superman is waaaay faster than Hulk? And WW is able to deflect a good many of Superman's Blow's. The HUlk wouldn't land one single hit if Diana didn't want him to. PERIOD.

But Diana will have to come close to punch him.

Unless she uses the lasso rigth in the beginning of every figth and thats not going to happen.

Originally posted by olympian


This is KMC buddy. We don't go for that comic book PIS crap . WW's strength and skill put on her on another lvl than professor Hulk. He might as well be fighting Batman with Superman's strength. He's gonna loose. One good judo chop with Planet moving fist, and it's over.

He would crush Batman with Super Strength

This is a fight no speedblitzing straight up fight

It's was Superman and Wonder Woman moving the Planet

He's too slow. And she's too fast. Need I bump Hulk vs Zoom again.

She's also extremely skilled. He is not. He's a professor. She's the best damn warrior AMAZON EVER. Do the math.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
This is KMC buddy. We don't go for that comic book PIS crap . WW's strength and skill put on her on another lvl than professor Hulk. He might as well be fighting Batman with Superman's strength. He's gonna loose. One good judo chop with Planet moving fist, and it's over.

If we use that defination, almost every writer in the industry must be full of PIS because they dont write comic battles like you want to. That defination should be used as bad writting category, but is it so in this case?

Lets see it, then:

Who did Professor Hulk constantly fougth, that was a high brick and either: a) didnt lose. b) he lost one and won another.

- Immortal Hercules? Check.

- Thor? Check.

- Classic Juggernaut? check.

- Red Norvell? Check. (for those who dont know, RN was another who stopped a swing of Mjolnir from Thor as well iirc).

How many of these is WW superior of, in the strength department?

Other points:

- Batman is regulary more skilled than WW. DC/Marvel comics usually go with the streeth level guys like Cap constantly showing better skill. You can call it a slant to the high skilled guys, i dont like it either. But in these two specific comicbook universes, its how it is.

- Altho she is in the same ballpark of SM, read this. So is Hulk. Including this incarnation.

Those "shes way stronger" are off basis, unless you want to claim shes stronger than those listed here whom he fougth.

Originally posted by olympian
If we use that defination, almost every writer in the industry must be full of PIS because they dont write comic battles like you want to. That defination should be used as bad writting category, but is it so in this case?

Lets see it, then:

Who did Professor Hulk constantly fougth, that was a high brick and either: a) didnt lose. b) he lost one and won another.

- Immortal Hercules? Check.

- Thor? Check.

- Classic Juggernaut? check.

- Red Norvell? Check. (for those who dont know, RN was another who stopped a swing of Mjolnir from Thor as well iirc).

How many of these is WW superior of, in the strength department?

Other points:

- Batman is regulary more skilled than WW. DC/Marvel comics usually go with the streeth level guys like Cap constantly showing better skill. You can call it a slant to the high skilled guys, i dont like it either. But in these two specific comicbook universes, its how it is.

- Altho she is in the same ballpark of SM, read this. So is Hulk. Including this incarnation.

Those "shes way stronger" are off basis, unless you want to claim shes stronger than those listed here whom he fougth.

All of her strength Feats put her at or above every one you've listed. Wether or not people choose to accept that is up to them. She's displayed as much strength as the hulk if not more. The biggest thing I've seen the hulk lift is a mountain. She's lifted much bigger. She is also as skilled as Batman is in Hand to hand. And if you think the Hulk can dish out punishment like Superman Can, then your mistaken. Not only does Superman Hit harder, he hits faster. SO Superman would rain down many blows, that WW has been able to take and keep up with. The hulk can't possibly keep up the onslaught of punishment it would take to put WW down. He's not fast enough, not skilled enough, and his base strength isn't high enough.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
All of her strength Feats put her at or above every one you've listed. Wether or not people choose to accept that is up to them. She's displayed as much strength as the hulk if not more. The biggest thing I've seen the hulk lift is a mountain. She's lifted much bigger. She is also as skilled as Batman is in Hand to hand. And if you think the Hulk can dish out punishment like Superman Can, then your mistaken. Not only does Superman Hit harder, he hits faster. SO Superman would rain down many blows, that WW has been able to take and keep up with. The hulk can't possibly keep up the onslaught of punishment it would take to put WW down. He's not fast enough, not skilled enough, and his base strength isn't high enough.

1- Wich strength feats put her above the ones listed?

2- What weight did she lifted on her own that makes her stronger than those?

2- Examples showing her being the equal to Batman purely in hand to hand?

3- You can say it all you want. Comics= slower people with fast enough reflexes not only can, but have tagged speedesters. Fact.

3- Yes, i surely can see Hulk being able to dish as much punishment, strengthwise as Superman. Writers seem to think so too, since all theyr encounters save the fan vote one, showed them going back and forth. Surely you can get the WHY.

4- How long you think Hulk takes to raise his base strength level, by any chance? Heres a tip. You just need to see his matches with Thor and the like.

hello

Originally posted by olympian
3- You can say it all you want. Comics= slower people with fast enough reflexes not only can, but have tagged speedesters. Fact. Forum = PIS disregarded. Characters fight to the best of their abilities.

How its PIS an ability that has been showed more than once?

If characters figth to the best of theyr abilities, and Hulk has showed that he can sometimes tag a speedester wouldnt that be, oh say, something he can use?

Or we use PIS for everything we dont like?

Originally posted by harri
hello

Aloha

Straight up fist fight, the proffesor takes it.

Originally posted by olympian
How its PIS an ability that has been showed more than once?

If characters figth to the best of theyr abilities, and Hulk has showed that he can sometimes tag a speedester wouldnt that be, oh say, something he can use?

Or we use PIS for everything we dont like? PIS has no regard for multiplicity, when a character's abilities are lowered to make characters appear equal it is PIS. This happening multiple times, still PIS. PIS is always PIS.

If current Northstar who can move at or near lightspeed is tagged by Captain America once. It's PIS. If he's tagged by Captain America twice. It's still PIS. Ten times. On the forums, still PIS.