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Sephiroth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Soh_2RYa9OA

vs.

Weiss
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cZdWz35ebw

Who wins?

Weiss looks like a rip off of Sephiroth

Sephiroth he's faster, more skilled judging by what i have seen of Weiss, and his magic capabilities are vastly superior

Bump

Sephiroth most likely.

Yeah Sephiroth wins this. Maybe Weiss versus Genesis or Angeith.

Sephiroth wins in a curbstomp

Okay, what about Sephiroth VS Chaos Vinny & Wiess.

Merely asking before starting a thread on it. Might not be worth it after all

That'd be a good fight.

It would indeed..

Sephiroth would win, as he fought Genesis.

Seph is directly stated to be the strongest FF7 character, tho Weiss will put up a fight.

It depends on which versions we're talking about. Base Weiss and Pre Nibelheim Sephiroth are about even, with Sephiroth being slightly stronger and Weiss being a tad faster. I would be a very, very close battle in which either could win.

It has been said of Advent Children Sephiroth that nothing is stronger than him, but Omega Weiss is around his level, and while AC Sephiroth would have the edge Omega Weiss could still win.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
It depends on which versions we're talking about. Base Weiss and Pre Nibelheim Sephiroth are about even, with Sephiroth being slightly stronger and Weiss being a tad faster. I would be a very, very close battle in which either could win.

It has been said of Advent Children Sephiroth that nothing is stronger than him, but Omega Weiss is around his level, and while AC Sephiroth would have the edge Omega Weiss could still win.

Wait... Wait a minute. "It has been said of Advent Children Sephiroth that nothing is stronger than him", and you have to stop right there. Because it was never stated Omega Weiss is equal to AC Sephiroth.


But why we are talking about FFVII Sephiroth? It was his KH version in the video.

Care to point out where I said Omega Weiss is equal to AC Sephiroth? I said Base Weiss is about equal to Pre Nibelheim Sephiroth.

Then I said that Omega Weiss is on the same tier as AC Sephiroth, though AC Sephiroth is probably stronger. Though there is a slight possibility OW is equal to ACS, because the quote only says no one is stronger, not no one is equal to him. I still think AC Seph has the edge though.



I figured that we were talking about FFVII Sephiroth because he is the one that exists in the same universe as Weiss, and that the OP just posted that particular vid because he liked it more than any FFVII/compilation Sephiroth vid.

Its a more epic battle any how, the best of SOLDIER against Deepground's finest.

That make Weiss seem god like in speed but keep in mind Sephiroth was stated to beable to teleport and be faster than light (the advent children fight was severly slowed down for our comprehension) Weiss puts up a good fight being with Omega, but he wouldnt beat sephiroth nor would chaos vincent with omega weiss

Weiss is faster than Sephiroth. If AC was slowed down for us then why does Loz still teleport around?

Look at this video, while Sephiroth can teleport, Weiss in his base form moves fast enough to fight Bloodburst Rosso(who is faster than normal Rosso, and normal Rosso is constantly teleporting around), and Arch Azul, one of the strongest things on the planet. He not only beats them, he does it effortlessly only using one hand.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QfjkzLK3Cw

He uses less effort in this fight than Sephiroth uses in his fight with Genesis in Crisis Core, and Rosso is faster than Genesis, and Azul is stronger than him. Base Weiss is equal with Pre Nibelheim Sephiroth.

Then consider that Omega Weiss has the power of nearly all the lifestream in him, he is quite a powerful opponent, and ould be one hell of a match for AC Sephiroth.

How you know Omega Weiss has the power of nearly all the lifestream in him? From all we know, Omega could have been using Weiss' body as a mechanism of defense to protect itself from Chaos Vincent. And a mere mechanism of defense wouldn't have all the power of Omega.

The only things on Omega that are "mere defense mechanisms" are the flying geometric things that die with one shot. Omega Weiss was at the core of Omega, drawing strength from all of Omega.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
The only things on Omega that are "mere defense mechanisms" are the flying geometric things that die with one shot. Omega Weiss was at the core of Omega, drawing strength from all of Omega.

That's speculation. We don't have a clear explanation about Omega Weiss in the game.

If it was Weiss, then why he would fight Vincent? Weiss didn't know him. Why he would draw power from Omega, if he didn't even know what Omega is, or what she/it can do?

If you think it was Weiss using Omega, the entire fight don't make any sense. But if you believe it was Omega using his body as a mechanism of defense to stop Chaos Vincent from destroying her/it, then everything makes sense.

Omega was using Weiss. The thing is that Omega used him as the ultimate offensive weapon. Omega had no reason to not give its power to its last resort at fighting off Chaos.

The fact is though, that if Omega Weiss fought with AC Sephiroth of his own will and not just a tool of Omega, that he stands a pretty good chance of winning.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Omega was using Weiss. The thing is that Omega used him as the ultimate offensive weapon. Omega had no reason to not give its power to its last resort at fighting off Chaos.

The fact is though, that if Omega Weiss fought with AC Sephiroth of his own will and not just a tool of Omega, that he stands a pretty good chance of winning.

He'd put up a good fight but not have a chance of winning.... Omega is a planetary force similar to chaos but better, i dont think Omega was "using" weiss any more than Chaos with vincent. After all, isnt omega purely instintual and with weiss, gives a more refined form of control

How does Weiss, with all his original power and skill, then charged up by the power of all the lifestream, not have a chance of winning?



Vincent had the proto materia, thats how he kept Chaos in control. When Nero merged with Weiss after you defeat Weiss empowered, it kicked Hojo out, and then Omega took over his body because it was now just an uncontrolled body connected to Omega.

IMO the fact that Sephiroth have controll over all the Lifestream too, AND all the abilities of Jenova, makes him better than Omega Weiss.

I think he wins.

What are you talking about? Sephiroth only has control over his negative lifestream, not the whole thing. He can only control the spirit energy of thos killed by Geostigma.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
What are you talking about? Sephiroth only has control over his negative lifestream, not the whole thing. He can only control the spirit energy of thos killed by Geostigma.

We know the Lifestream is the source of power in FFVII. By what you said, Weiss is more powerful, because he has controll over "all" of it, and Seph don't. But there is nothing above Sephiroth, so how that works?
Simple, Seph has controll over all the Lifestream too. He probably used his Negative one to directly corrupt the pure one. This is why it was so powerful that it could "transform the planet in a vessel".

Control over the lifestream isn't the only way to be powerful. Fighting prowess and raw strength have a lot to do with it.



Nope, Sephiroth only controls the negative lifestream. Think about it, if he controlled all the lifestream already, he wouldn't need to corrupt it with geostigma, because he would already be able to make it bend to his will. Also, the creators said that he only controls the negative lifestream.

Weiss does not have control over all of the life stream, what an absurd statement.

Have you ever even played Dirge? Omega's entire purpose is to suck up all the lifestream, therefore Omega Weiss is being powered by all the lifestream, its simple fact.

What's absurd is people arguing in ignorance of the compilation.

Yes, control over the Lifestream is the only way to be really powerful.

Everything in FFVII is connected with the Lifestream, and that includes physical strength and speed. This is why Weiss was so fast(in his fight against Chaos Vincent) and so strong(blocking bullets with his arms) after merging with it. And it's one of the reasons why SOLDIERs are so strong and fast.
And IIRC, some of the Limit Breaks are caused by a burst of adrenaline, where the person can use his/her spirit energy(the "Lifestream" that everyone have inside themselves, like Vincent explained in AC) to boost his/her abilities.

Everything in FFVII is connected to spirit energy and the Lifestream. It's the source of life, for god's sake! It's impossible to be as strong and/or fast as someone who have controll over all of it.

And it's pretty obvious Sephiroth have controll over "all" the Lifestream(or most of it, because Aerith was still there). There is nothing above him, and that includes Minerva, the living will of the planet. Or you will say now, that the consciousness of Gaia don't have control over the Lifestream?


This is why he can control "all" of it. And IMO, power of the Lifestream, and power of Jenova, give the victory to him.

Note: Weiss DIDN'T have control over all the Lifestream, because Omega was formed of only PURE spirit energy. Stagnant spirit energy is part of the Lifestream too.
And don't tell me she/it has stagnant energy, because of Nero's fusion with Weiss. Nero's stagnance is probably a fraction of all the stagnant spirit energy in the world.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Have you ever even played Dirge? Omega's entire purpose is to suck up all the lifestream, therefore Omega Weiss is being powered by all the lifestream, its simple fact.

What's absurd is people arguing in ignorance of the compilation.

If he sucked up all the lifestream the planet would die you fool.

He planet would die if he sucked up more than 10% of it after what Shinra done.

You are the ignorant one, forgetting the basic plot details on FF7, and you can yourself a fan tsk tsk tsk.....

Originally posted by SHM
Yes, control over the Lifestream is the only way to be really powerful.

Everything in FFVII is connected with the Lifestream, and that includes physical strength and speed. This is why Weiss was so fast(in his fight against Chaos Vincent) and so strong(blocking bullets with his arms) after merging with it. And it's one of the reasons why SOLDIERs are so strong and fast.
And IIRC, some of the Limit Breaks are caused by a burst of adrenaline, where the person can use his/her spirit energy(the "Lifestream" that everyone have inside themselves, like Vincent explained in AC) to boost his/her abilities.

Everything in FFVII is connected to spirit energy and the Lifestream. It's the source of life, for god's sake! It's impossible to be as strong and/or fast as someone who have controll over all of it.

And it's pretty obvious Sephiroth have controll over "all" the Lifestream(or most of it, because Aerith was still there). There is nothing above him, and that includes Minerva, the living will of the planet. Or you will say now, that the consciousness of Gaia don't have control over the Lifestream?


This is why he can control "all" of it. And IMO, power of the Lifestream, and power of Jenova, give the victory to him.

Note: Weiss DIDN'T have control over all the Lifestream, because Omega was formed of only PURE spirit energy. Stagnant spirit energy is part of the Lifestream too.
And don't tell me she/it has stagnant energy, because of Nero's fusion with Weiss. Nero's stagnance is probably a fraction of all the stagnant spirit energy in the world.

Sephiroth certain has absorbed alot more of the lifestream, but the amount his control is limited IMO

You really don't know what you're talking about. Jenova cells are what gave Sephiroth his extreme powers, not the lifestream. In the beginning Sephiroth was powerful because he is the perfect hybrid of Jenova and human, not because of anything to do with mako, play Crisis Core. In FF VII he planned to become a god by merging with the lifestream, but he never managed to fully do it. In AC Sephiroth is powerful because he has no human weakness left in him, he is made up entirely of Jenova matter. Jenova cells are also injected into SOLDIERs to give them enhanced strength and regeneration.

The lifestream isn't the only way to become powerful, there is also Jenova cells, stagnant mako, having your own DNA infused with a powerful beass(Azul was given behemoth DNA), etc.

And once again, according to the creators themselves, Sephiroth only controls the negative lifestream, he has no control whatsoever on the regular lifestream.

Wrong again. Maybe if you actually played Dirge you would understand this. The whole reason they did not want Omega o show up was because Omega woas going to leave with all the lifestream, thus letting the planet die off. Omega's only purpose is to absorb the entirity of the lifestream, and that's what it did.

Please, don't argue unless you know what you're talking about.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Wrong again. Maybe if you actually played Dirge you would understand this. The whole reason they did not want Omega o show up was because Omega woas going to leave with all the lifestream, thus letting the planet die off. Omega's only purpose is to absorb the entirity of the lifestream, and that's what it did.

Vincent stops it before he sucks up loads, if it had sucked up the lifestream, this would happen..... (0:08 - 0:03)

zRyKqG7YYZE

No, Omega took off because it had sucked up enormous quantities of lifestream. It would not leave the planet without accomplishing its goal, Vincent stopped it from getting away with all the lifestream.

If it didn't take very much as you seem to think, why was everyone concerned when it took off, and why did Vincent need to stop it? The answer, because it took the lifestream.

Fascist, the Lifestream is not the only source of power in FFVII, BUT is the ultimate one, because is connected with EVERYTHING. This is just a fact.

Control over the Lifestream = ultimate power, this is another fact. And Sephiroth have the ultimate power(AKA, control over the Lifestream) because nothing is above him. deal with it.

And yes, the creators said he can only control the Negative Lifestream. But in the end of AC, Seph already "transformed" most of the Lifestream in the planet, in Negative Lifestream. This is why nothing is above him, and it's why he can use it to kill the planet and travel the universe.

Ah, and stop being a troll, okay? Bashing and insulting others will not help your argument.

Nothing is greater than Sephiroth =/= he is in control of the entire lifestream. The creators even said he wasn't, deal with it.



Geostigma did not kill more than half the planet, it hadn't even been around that long in AC. There is literally nothing usggesting that most of the lifestream was negative in AC. If it were, Sephiroth could have just fulfilled his plan and killed off the planet right then.

You have no base for your theories, please only argue with the facts, not silly things that only exist in your head.



Isn't hypocrisy fun? Before you edited your post there was an insult directed towards me where this was.

So he decided to take it back, realizing that it was wrong to insult so in actuality he's not a hypocrite. But why insult, I don't want to have to report this sweet topic.

Omega weapon is OVERATED, each WEAPON in FFVII had a purpose to defend, omega's purpose was "evacuation" to take the lifestream and set off to space to avoid a huge calamity, of course weiss will become strong joining with omega weapon, but he did not have the whole lifestream under his control.

It has been stated that there is nothing above Sephiroth, base weiss would still lose to pre-nibelheim Sephiroth, and probably lose to Genesis and Angeal too, Sephiroth was known as the strongest SOLDIER and the original, he did not have any of the injections like the other SOLDIERs, he was born with it, Weiss is just a wannabe, and he would never become another Sephiroth.

Sapphire WEAPON was the coolest ^-^

XsYlxEywO6w

Originally posted by Remindme
Sapphire WEAPON was the coolest ^-^

XsYlxEywO6w

That is beyond question.

Also, guys, how about some actual quotes? The quote saying Seph only had control over the Negative Lifestream be nice to finally shut down SHM's theories on Seph controlling most of the Lifestream once and for all.

Originally posted by Shin_Nikkolas
That is beyond question.

Also, guys, how about some actual quotes? The quote saying Seph only had control over the Negative Lifestream be nice to finally shut down SHM's theories on Seph controlling most of the Lifestream once and for all.

you mean beyond doubt?

geez i dunno, sounds like work ^^'

fine fine fine

Interveiw *Q: What were those dark clouds that Sephiroth called forth before his battle with Cloud began? Some of them even had tendrils.
*A: It was something of a negative Lifestream, composed of the Spirit Energy of those who had died with Geostigma. Their Spirit Energy became corrupted by the influence of JENOVA's Cells and was, thus, under Sephiroth's control.

As you see, the number of people and creatures that died of geostigma was limited, as is the amount of negative lifestream he controls

Indeed.

So, Seph never had anything close to the full power of the Lifestream.

Originally posted by Remindme
you mean beyond doubt?

geez i dunno, sounds like work ^^'

fine fine fine



As you see, the number of people and creatures that died of geostigma was limited, as is the amount of negative lifestream he controls

Then for some reason, his "little" Lifestream has the same level of power than most of the normal one.
The fact we have two characters(Omega and Minerva) with control over most of the Lifestream, and the fact that nothing is above Sephiroth and he have power enough to transform the entire planet in a "space-ship", is proof of that.

Ah, and remember that Avalanche destroyed the Mako Reactors of Midgar in DoC. Omega didn't absorb all of the pure Lifestream.

My opinion still stands. Seph and Weiss can be "equal" in many things, but Jenova's abilities give the advantage to Seph.

Sephiroth twaats Weiss, is that even a debate here?

To make something clear to everyone who is reading this thread, and don't have good knowledge about FFVII's universe: Omega Weiss being equal to Sephiroth is pure speculation. It was never stated in any official source, that a specific character in FFVII is equal to him. They just said that nothing is above him.

Originally posted by SHM
To make something clear to everyone who is reading this thread, and don't have good knowledge about FFVII's universe: Omega Weiss being equal to Sephiroth is pure speculation. It was never stated in any official source, that a specific character in FFVII is equal to him. They just said that nothing is above him.

They said he was the strongest character in the FFVII Universe

Originally posted by Remindme
They said he was the strongest character in the FFVII Universe

Read that:





No one is stronger than him, but they didn't say anything about being equal.

The problem is that we never saw his true power. Because of that, we don't have how to know if Weiss or anyone else, is equal to him or not.

Originally posted by SHM
Read that:





No one is stronger than him, but they didn't say anything about being equal.

The problem is that we never saw his true power. Because of that, we don't have how to know if Weiss or anyone else, is equal to him or not.

Lol, so if Weiss fought Sephiroth, Sephiroth by that quote would not lose, or Weiss would be stronger.

Yes, i am curse with the power to do the math, poor me

Originally posted by Remindme
Lol, so if Weiss fought Sephiroth, Sephiroth by that quote would not lose, or Weiss would be stronger.

Yes, i am curse with the power to do the math, poor me

What do you mean with "or Weiss would be stronger"? He isn't stronger than Sephiroth. No one in FFVII can be, that's the point.

From my POV that quote is saying.

"Sephiroth is the strongest FFVII character we have created, anyone else in power is either equal or below'

Originally posted by grey fox
From my POV that quote is saying.

"Sephiroth is the strongest FFVII character we have created, anyone else in power is either equal or below'

Yeah, this is exactly what the two quotes are saying.

Shame those quotes came out before DoC and are worthless to anything that comes after them.

Originally posted by SHM
What do you mean with "or Weiss would be stronger"? He isn't stronger than Sephiroth. No one in FFVII can be, that's the point.

Fine I'll break it down so those more simple minded can understand.

The statement:
Sephiroth's existence and will is extremely powerful. There is nothing stronger, nothing above him.
We know is true

Therefore, Weiss cannot defeat Sephiroth or that statement would be false

If Sephiroth defeats Weiss, that statement remains true.

Thus it is common logic, Sephiroth > Weiss

Originally posted by Remindme
Fine I'll break it down so those more simple minded can understand.

The statement:
Sephiroth's existence and will is extremely powerful. There is nothing stronger, nothing above him.
We know is true

Therefore, Weiss cannot defeat Sephiroth or that statement would be false

If Sephiroth defeats Weiss, that statement remains true.

Thus it is common logic, Sephiroth > Weiss

Ahh... That's what you meant. By the way you talked, I had the impression you gave two diferent scenarios of how the battle would end. The way I understood was "Sephiroth by that quote would not lose. Or Weiss by that quote would be stronger".

But now I understand.

Originally posted by SHM
Ahh... That's what you meant. By the way you talked, I had the impression you gave two diferent scenarios of how the battle would end. The way I understood was "Sephiroth by that quote would not lose. Or Weiss by that quote would be stronger".

But now I understand. Glad to Help

My bad, anyone else that that thing where, it's crystal clear in your head, but some of it gets lost when you trying to write it down?

Originally posted by Shin_Nikkolas
Shame those quotes came out before DoC and are worthless to anything that comes after them.

No those quotes are during the creation of Crisis Core which was made AFTER DoC.

WEISS FTW!!!

So i noticed. I was thinking of the American release date for DOC and the Japanese release date for the Files. Sorry about that.

It still means nothing though. We go by facts and feats here.

Gotta love the Sephiroth wank in here.

Shame the only thing people can rely on is a quote. You'd think the strongest FF7er's battles would speak for him.

Nope. According to the (senile) creators of FF7, Sephiroth had tons of power in AC. They just...um...never showed it. Or alluded to it.

Yeah.

Originally posted by Keollyn
Gotta love the Sephiroth wank in here.

Shame the only thing people can rely on is a quote. You'd think the strongest FF7er's battles would speak for him.

These two quotes are still cannon.

Strength isn't the only thing involved in fighting. Cloud is far weaker than Sephiroth, and he still beat Sephiroth. That doesn't change the fact that Sephiroth is stronger than Cloud though, just as Weiss beating Sephiroth wouldn't mean Weiss is stronger.



Do you even know the meaning of the word senile?

Septh would win

Losing your mental faculties with age?

And Kitase and Nomura are only 42 and 37 respectively. That's hardly getting old and senile.