Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

K, saw this in another thread. Wondered what everyone else thought.

Standard equipment for everyone (Spider-Man has Iron Spidey costume, Frank has twin assault rifles and hidden handguns and knives, and Wolverine...has the brown costume).

Fight takes place in an urban (city) setting, no civilians and none of the combatants are holding back. No PIS/CIS.

Spider-Man 6/10. Very close match.

Alone, I'd probably give them better odds (not majority, just better), but Spidey will use their teamwork to his advantage.

i say Spidey wins seeing as he has the Iron suit. if it was just regular spidey, id say Big Pun and Wolvie take the majority though. 6-7/10

but. for this fight, Iron Spidey 9/10 IMO

Originally posted by braz
i say Spidey wins seeing as he has the Iron suit. if it was just regular spidey, id say Big Pun and Wolvie take the majority though. 6-7/10

but. for this fight, Iron Spidey 9/10 IMO

Oh, man. I totally forgot about the Iron costume. I was giving my vote based on current Spider-Man in his normal costume.

Current Spidey in normal costume wins it 6/10.
Iron Spidey wins it 9/10.

Wolverine and Castle win 10 times out of 10 so long as they use their heads and cooperate. This fight would last a whole... 4 seconds... maybe. Wolverine lunges in as per usual, Spider-man flips over him as per usual... where Frank (who anticipated this obvious move) hoses Petey down with gun fire. Spider-man's fighting still is horribly suited for this type of combat. He spends far to much time in the air where is speed is moot. Gun fire aimed at center mass will leave Spider-man with no options of avoidance as he can't change his momentum in mid air and can't contort his body to the point that a barrage of bullets aimed at center mass would miss him. Someone with Franks skill, someone who can put a full round through a quarter and still have change for the parking meter (and who has shot the web shooters of Spider-man), will have no problem tagging Spider-man if he is presented with the opportunity, and that is something that Wolverine can easily provide. Spider-man can't compete with Wolverine in melee combat in any sort of capacity which leaves him with avoidance and webs for ranged option... but forces him to the air, where Frank takes him out.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Wolverine and Castle win 10 times out of 10 so long as they use their heads and cooperate. This fight would last a whole... 4 seconds... maybe. Wolverine lunges in as per usual, Spider-man flips over him as per usual... where Frank (who anticipated this obvious move) hoses Petey down with gun fire. Spider-man's fighting still is horribly suited for this type of combat. He spends far to much time in the air where is speed is moot. Gun fire aimed at center mass will leave Spider-man with no options of avoidance as he can't change his momentum in mid air and can't contort his body to the point that a barrage of bullets aimed at center mass would miss him. Someone with Franks skill, someone who can put a full round through a quarter and still have change for the parking meter (and who has shot the web shooters of Spider-man), will have no problem tagging Spider-man if he is presented with the opportunity, and that is something that Wolverine can easily provide. Spider-man can't compete with Wolverine in melee combat in any sort of capacity which leaves him with avoidance and webs for ranged option... but forces him to the air, where Frank takes him out.

true however your forgetting about his spidersense he would know what they have planned and do something else. i still think wolverine and punisher will still win but it will take longer than that

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Wolverine and Castle win 10 times out of 10 so long as they use their heads and cooperate. This fight would last a whole... 4 seconds... maybe. Wolverine lunges in as per usual, Spider-man flips over him as per usual... where Frank (who anticipated this obvious move) hoses Petey down with gun fire. Spider-man's fighting still is horribly suited for this type of combat. He spends far to much time in the air where is speed is moot. Gun fire aimed at center mass will leave Spider-man with no options of avoidance as he can't change his momentum in mid air and can't contort his body to the point that a barrage of bullets aimed at center mass would miss him. Someone with Franks skill, someone who can put a full round through a quarter and still have change for the parking meter (and who has shot the web shooters of Spider-man), will have no problem tagging Spider-man if he is presented with the opportunity, and that is something that Wolverine can easily provide. Spider-man can't compete with Wolverine in melee combat in any sort of capacity which leaves him with avoidance and webs for ranged option... but forces him to the air, where Frank takes him out.

So, is this a Spider-Man who is completely obvlivious as to who he's fighting? I think that's too damn obvious strategy for Spider-Man NOT to figure out.

"Okay, Wolverine's lunging at me. I should move away. Hm...I wonder what Frank is gonna do with that gun pointed at me. Spider-sense tingling! Frank's going to shoot at me if I move that way! I think I'll try something else. I'll move this way instead, web away, dodge the gun shots, web up Wolverine at the same time, close the distance to Frank while dodging, web him up or punch him, and then return to the freed Wolverine (since I webbed him up only half-assed). Then I'll hand him his ass one-on-one, like I know I can do."

Yea. That's just one way really. I didn't even take the environment into consideration.

Originally posted by marvelprince
K, saw this in another thread. Wondered what everyone else thought.

Standard equipment for everyone (Spider-Man has Iron Spidey costume, Frank has twin assault rifles and hidden handguns and knives, and Wolverine...has the brown costume).

Fight takes place in an urban (city) setting, no civilians and none of the combatants are holding back. No PIS/CIS. No CIS? Frank's hitting him is now that much harder then. Especially with invisibility. Frank dies first, then it's Spiderman vs. Wolverine. Srank brought up a good point about Spiderman, but he can hang with Wolverine in melee, but is disadvantaged and best suited to the environment around him.

For the win percentage, I cannot say.

Originally posted by air beardey
true however your forgetting about his spidersense he would know what they have planned and do something else. i still think wolverine and punisher will still win but it will take longer than that

Spider-sense means little until Frank has mounted his attack by which point it will be too late. Gravity is gravity, it doesn't matter how fast Spider-man is his decent will be the same speed and he can't change his momentum in mid air. His fighting style is a huge disability.

In order for Spider-man to avoid being tagged by Frank he needs to stay grounded where is speed actually means something... but that hinders his ability to hang with Wolverine in melee combat (and those odds aren't good to begin with). IMO this fight is a huge mismatch.

Why is Spidey unable to contend with Wolverine in melee combat again?

Someone who's faster, stronger, faster reflexes, far more agile, more durable (while Wolverine is more resiliant due to healing factor), and has a precognitive ability...well, would win in melee. Wolverine's better martial arts ability is pretty futile in this situation.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Spider-sense means little until Frank has mounted his attack by which point it will be too late. Gravity is gravity, it doesn't matter how fast Spider-man is his decent will be the same speed and he can't change his momentum in mid air. His fighting style is a huge disability.


Are you assuming SM is just going to fall through the air, calmly waiting to either be shot or hit the ground?

He can jump off of something, use his web to pull him towards something or the ground, use his webs to attack Frank, dodge in mid-air, etc.

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
Are you assuming SM is just going to fall through the air, calmly waiting to either be shot or hit the ground?

He can jump off of something, use his web to pull him towards something or the ground, use his webs to attack Frank, dodge in mid-air, etc.

I'm not assuming anything, of course Spider-man will attempt to get out of the way but it will all be for not. Do you think his webs move faster then a bullet? Even though Spider-man is faster on the trigger then Frank you are seriously selling Castle short (but that is what his forum is good at after all) if you think that Spider-man's webs will get from point A to point B with Spider-man have enough time to yank himself out of the path of the bullet(s). He can't dodge a bullet mid air. It can't be argued. He can't change his momentum and their is no way in hell he could contort his body to avoid a shot aimed at center mass.

Spider-man jumps around. That is how he fights. In mid-air his speed means nothing and he is at the mercy of gravity. Frank Castle won't miss a mid-air Spider-man.

This is a pretty easy concept. I'm surprised it needs to be explained.

Except that Spiderman has been dodging bullets for years now... and yes, even in mid-air, twisting his body out of the way. He's too fast. When he moves at top speed he is little more than a blur. Sure, Frank is a great shot, so he is going to try and anticipate where Spidey is gonna be next... except, he's not gonna be there, because his Spider sense will warn him. And no, he doesn't have to wait for Frank to start aimimg at him before he gets warned - his spider sense has been known to warn him long before, as soon as he might walk into a trap. So does he walk into the trap...?

Spiderman takes this, easy.

Some people on this board think Spiderman is pretty much unhittable by anyone not superman, quicksilver, or flash despite the fact that he gets hit by everyone from lowly goons to venom. Also, his spidersense is way overhyped on this board. People think he can avoid any attack with his spidersense when in fact it only alerts him that he is in danger and not the source of that danger.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Why is Spidey unable to contend with Wolverine in melee combat again?

Someone who's faster, stronger, faster reflexes, far more agile, more durable (while Wolverine is more resiliant due to healing factor), and has a precognitive ability...well, would win in melee. Wolverine's better martial arts ability is pretty futile in this situation.

Spider-mans speed advantage is negateable as Wolverine's combat speed is compare and as far combat skill goes Wolverine is the superior by four orders of magnitude on a logarithmic scale. Wolverine is just a much better combatant.

In melee combat Spider-man can't a) parry and b)block, his only option is to dodge everything coming at him. He can't win a a fight be dodging and he can't engage Wolverine in melee with out being ripped to shreds. He would need to trade a hit with Wolverine to land one of his own and whos do you think will do more damage? There is also the fact that Wolverine has the reach advantage while still being a much smaller target with a lower center of gravity.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Except that Spiderman has been dodging bullets for years now... and yes, even in mid-air, twisting his body out of the way. He's too fast. When he moves at top speed he is little more than a blur. Sure, Frank is a great shot, so he is going to try and anticipate where Spidey is gonna be next... except, he's not gonna be there, because his Spider sense will warn him. And no, he doesn't have to wait for Frank to start aimimg at him before he gets warned - his spider sense has been known to warn him long before, as soon as he might walk into a trap. So does he walk into the trap...?

Spiderman takes this, easy.

1. He may be dodging bullets for years, but usually the guys wielding those guns are dumb goons, not the Punisher.

2. His spidersense can only warn him that danger is close, it can't tell him what the danger is. So assume wolverine lunges at him while Punisher aims his gun, Spiderman will realize he is in danger but he will think that wolverine is the source of the spidersense and not realize until too late that Frank fired a bullet as spiderman jumped to dodge wolverine's claws.

Punisher and Wolverine: 8/10

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Except that Spiderman has been dodging bullets for years now... and yes, even in mid-air, twisting his body out of the way. He's too fast. When he moves at top speed he is little more than a blur. Sure, Frank is a great shot, so he is going to try and anticipate where Spidey is gonna be next... except, he's not gonna be there, because his Spider sense will warn him. And no, he doesn't have to wait for Frank to start aimimg at him before he gets warned - his spider sense has been known to warn him long before, as soon as he might walk into a trap. So does he walk into the trap...?

Spiderman takes this, easy.


Go back and read my posts again before I get frustrated and say mean things about questioning you intelligence.

For the record: his spider sense DOES warn him exactly what and where the danger is, and how to best avoid it.

Spidey's blind-fought before, relying solely on his spider sense.

Originally posted by Soljer
For the record: his spider sense DOES warn him exactly what and where the danger is, and how to best avoid it.

Spidey's blind-fought before, relying solely on his spider sense.

Is that true? I always assumed his spidersense only warned him of impending danger and nothing more, which is why he could be hit by his foes.

If his spidersense is as omnipotent as you make it seem, then he should NEVER get hit, EVER, at least by his normal cast of villains.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Spider-mans speed advantage is negateable as Wolverine's combat speed is compare and as far combat skill goes Wolverine is the superior by four orders of magnitude on a logarithmic scale. Wolverine is just a much better combatant.

In melee combat Spider-man can't a) parry and b)block, his only option is to dodge everything coming at him. He can't win a a fight be dodging and he can't engage Wolverine in melee with out being ripped to shreds. He would need to trade a hit with Wolverine to land one of his own and whos do you think will do more damage? There is also the fact that Wolverine has the reach advantage while still being a much smaller target with a lower center of gravity. Spiderman dodges and hits quite frequently. Wolverine can't take hits and hit at the same time, we've seen this in their last encounter.

Spiderman's body is still leaner and more powerful, therefore more suited for fast bursts of speed. If Wolverine used this "combat skill" ever so often I would be more inclined to believe it. Spiderman's speed advantage is never negateable, because he relies on being strong and fast like Logan does. However he is much stronger and much faster, so what does Logan fall back on? His resilience in every case they fight in. Which would be a big deal if he couldn't turn invisible in this match.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Is that true? I always assumed his spidersense only warned him of impending danger and nothing more, which is why he could be hit by his foes.

If his spidersense is as omnipotent as you make it seem, then he should NEVER get hit, EVER, at least by his normal cast of villains. It's like flash's getting hit by crap stuff, the comic must look good to sell.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Is that true? I always assumed his spidersense only warned him of impending danger and nothing more, which is why he could be hit by his foes.

If his spidersense is as omnipotent as you make it seem, then he should NEVER get hit, EVER, at least by his normal cast of villains.

Would you, or anyone you know go out and regularly buy comics in which the main character was completely untouchable?

I'd get bored.

.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Spider-mans speed advantage is negateable as Wolverine's combat speed is compare and as far combat skill goes Wolverine is the superior by four orders of magnitude on a logarithmic scale. Wolverine is just a much better combatant.

In melee combat Spider-man can't a) parry and b)block, his only option is to dodge everything coming at him. He can't win a a fight be dodging and he can't engage Wolverine in melee with out being ripped to shreds. He would need to trade a hit with Wolverine to land one of his own and whos do you think will do more damage? There is also the fact that Wolverine has the reach advantage while still being a much smaller target with a lower center of gravity.

Umm, Spiderman is

a) Stronger
b) Faster
c) More agile
d) He has spidersense

He can punch Wolverine so hard he will only land next Tuesday (remember, Spiderman is ALWAYS holding back). Wolverine is NOT a better combatant, the only thing keeping him alive is his healing factor. He gets stabbed, shot and punched the whole time - Deadpool made him look ridiculous. Spiderman has to rely on his speed, agility and strength, to survive WITHOUT getting shot, stabbed or punched - and he has been doing this for years. So - who do YOU think is a better fighter?

Spiderman has made Wolverine look like a fool before as well, plenty of times. Webbing him up with his claws pointing to his brains, so if he extends them he gives himself a lobotomy was quite a funny one, actually.

But never mind that - let's talk about Spidey being unable to dodge Frank's bullets. Why has he suddenly lost the power to dodge bullets, when he's been doing it for years? He's dodged bullets in mid-air, he's even dodge guys spraying him with machine guns - and yet every time he comes through unscathed?

Coincidence? Sure, if coincidence means having the ability to do it over, and over, and over, and over again...

Look, I like Frank. And I like Logan too. But Frank is a man with a gun. Nothing more. A great shot, sure - but so what? Spidey has been doging bullets since he got his powers, please demonstrate to me why he has suddenly lost the ability to do so now?

As for Wolverine, he's not even in this fight. Spiderman can ignore him until he feels like dealing with him, which he can do any time he feels like it. And why can he not block or parry?

As I've stated before, he is:

a) Stronger
b) Faster
c) More agile
d) He has spidersense

He can simply grab his wists and use his own claws to stab Wolverine through anything he feels like stabbing him. Spidey will make Wolverine look like a hairy child.

As for stating: "Go back and read my posts again before I get frustrated and say mean things about questioning you intelligence."

May I suggest the same to you? Spend some time on the Spiderman respect thread, and learn what he is actually capable of.

To be fair the functionality of Spider-man's spider sense varies more often the the abilities of the Powerpuff Girls. It is a vague warning sign just as often as it is a precise targeting system.

Originally posted by Soljer
Would you, or anyone you know go out and regularly buy comics in which the main character was completely untouchable?

I'd get bored.

.

No, I wouldn't, which is exactly why I would think writers wouldn't want his spidersense to be so powerful. I mean, why would they make it so that his spidersense is omnipotent and then don't show him using it as it should be used? Wouldnt it make more sense to just tone down his spidersense so writers won't be accused of PIS all the time?

True, but most times it is written so poorly or used infrequently to the point where it isn't doing what it's supposed to do, especially since it's upgraded.

Originally posted by masterbruce
No, I wouldn't, which is exactly why I would think writers wouldn't want his spidersense to be so powerful. I mean, why would they make it so that his spidersense is omnipotent and then don't show him using it as it should be used? Wouldnt it make more sense to just tone down his spidersense so writers won't be accused of PIS all the time?

Meh, fact is, by best showings, Spiderman's spider sense can detect the slightest danger, pinpoint it, and INSTANTLY cause Spiderman's (incredibly fast) body to take him out of the way. It's an instinct.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Umm, Spiderman is

a) Stronger
b) Faster
c) More agile
d) He has spidersense

He can punch Wolverine so hard he will only land next Tuesday (remember, Spiderman is ALWAYS holding back). Wolverine is NOT a better combatant, the only thing keeping him alive is his healing factor. He gets stabbed, shot and punched the whole time - Deadpool made him look ridiculous. Spiderman has to rely on his speed, agility and strength, to survive WITHOUT getting shot, stabbed or punched - and he has been doing this for years. So - who do YOU think is a better fighter?

Spiderman has made Wolverine look like a fool before as well, plenty of times. Webbing him up with his claws pointing to his brains, so if he extends them he gives himself a lobotomy was quite a funny one, actually.

But never mind that - let's talk about Spidey being unable to dodge Frank's bullets. Why has he suddenly lost the power to dodge bullets, when he's been doing it for years? He's dodged bullets in mid-air, he's even dodge guys spraying him with machine guns - and yet every time he comes through unscathed?

Coincidence? Sure, if coincidence means having the ability to do it over, and over, and over, and over again...

Look, I like Frank. And I like Logan too. But Frank is a man with a gun. Nothing more. A great shot, sure - but so what? Spidey has been doging bullets since he got his powers, please demonstrate to me why he has suddenly lost the ability to do so now?

As for Wolverine, he's not even in this fight. Spiderman can ignore him until he feels like dealing with him, which he can do any time he feels like it. And why can he not block or parry?

As I've stated before, he is:

a) Stronger
b) Faster
c) More agile
d) He has spidersense

He can simply grab his wists and use his own claws to stab Wolverine through anything he feels like stabbing him. Spidey will make Wolverine look like a hairy child.

As for stating: "Go back and read my posts again before I get frustrated and say mean things about questioning you intelligence."

May I suggest the same to you? Spend some time on the Spiderman respect thread, and learn what he is actually capable of.

Alot of people say spiderman gets hit so often in comics because of PIS, because if he actually used his powers he really should almost never be hit by anyone short of a speedster. And the main reason that he does get hit is because otherwise no one would read his comics. Well that logic goes bothways. He dodges bullets so often ALSO because of PIS, if he got killed, Marvel would lose massive profit so of course he will never die from a gunshot or anything, that is the nature of comics.

Remember, Spiderman cannot fly. Once he's in the air, he's at the mercy of gravity. He may contort his body to avoid a handgun's bullets, but a machine gun spraying bullets in the air would be impossible for spiderman to avoid while midair...its just common sense.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I'm not assuming anything, of course Spider-man will attempt to get out of the way but it will all be for not. Do you think his webs move faster then a bullet? Even though Spider-man is faster on the trigger then Frank you are seriously selling Castle short (but that is what his forum is good at after all) if you think that Spider-man's webs will get from point A to point B with Spider-man have enough time to yank himself out of the path of the bullet(s). He can't dodge a bullet mid air. It can't be argued. He can't change his momentum and their is no way in hell he could contort his body to avoid a shot aimed at center mass.

Spider-man jumps around. That is how he fights. In mid-air his speed means nothing and he is at the mercy of gravity. Frank Castle won't miss a mid-air Spider-man.

This is a pretty easy concept. I'm surprised it needs to be explained.

Is he himself faster than a bullet? You tell me.

Look where that bullet is when he finally starts to move.

Originally posted by masterbruce
1. He may be dodging bullets for years, but usually the guys wielding those guns are dumb goons, not the Punisher.

2. His spidersense can only warn him that danger is close, it can't tell him what the danger is. So assume wolverine lunges at him while Punisher aims his gun, Spiderman will realize he is in danger but he will think that wolverine is the source of the spidersense and not realize until too late that Frank fired a bullet as spiderman jumped to dodge wolverine's claws.

Punisher and Wolverine: 8/10

It tells him where the danger is just fine actually.

And just for added measure.

Originally posted by Soljer
Meh, fact is, by best showings, Spiderman's spider sense can detect the slightest danger, pinpoint it, and INSTANTLY cause Spiderman's (incredibly fast) body to take him out of the way. It's an instinct.

Well if we are going by best showings, then Wolverine can survive a nuclear blast at pointblank. Spiderman's hardest punch direct on isn't even 1/1,000,000th the power of a nuclear bomb. So there isn't a thing Spiderman can do to phase wolverine. It'll be like punching an adamantium wall as hard as he can, his fist will be injured before wolverine will be.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Alot of people say spiderman gets hit so often in comics because of PIS, because if he actually used his powers he really should almost never be hit by anyone short of a speedster. And the main reason that he does get hit is because otherwise no one would read his comics. Well that logic goes bothways. He dodges bullets so often ALSO because of PIS, if he got killed, Marvel would lose massive profit so of course he will never die from a gunshot or anything, that is the nature of comics.

Remember, Spiderman cannot fly. Once he's in the air, he's at the mercy of gravity. He may contort his body to avoid a handgun's bullets, but a machine gun spraying bullets in the air would be impossible for spiderman to avoid while midair...its just common sense. 1. Spiderman has been hit by a bullet before.

2. By the logic of this forum he can still die but that doesn't put others at a massive disadvantage.

3. Spiderman has webbing, what was that about being simply at the mercy of gravity again?

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Spider-mans speed advantage is negateable as Wolverine's combat speed is compare and as far combat skill goes Wolverine is the superior by four orders of magnitude on a logarithmic scale. Wolverine is just a much better combatant.

In melee combat Spider-man can't a) parry and b)block, his only option is to dodge everything coming at him. He can't win a a fight be dodging and he can't engage Wolverine in melee with out being ripped to shreds. He would need to trade a hit with Wolverine to land one of his own and whos do you think will do more damage? There is also the fact that Wolverine has the reach advantage while still being a much smaller target with a lower center of gravity.

Have you ever heard of a wrist? Or an arm? Why is Spider-Man all of a sudden an idiot who decides to block or parry a set of razor-sharp claws? All he has to do is stop his arm or hand from moving at all. Are you denying that Spider-Man is NOT fast enough to catch Wolverine's wrist? When the Wrecker was able to do it pretty easily?

Goddamn. Just because Wolverine is an expert martial artist doesn't make Spider-Man a wheelchair-bound retard when it comes to fighting.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Is he himself faster than a bullet? You tell me.

Look where that bullet is when he finally starts to move.

so I guess we've now established that spiderman is as fast as quicksilver, since he is faster than a bullet. wow, spiderman just keeps on amazing me.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
1. Spiderman has been hit by a bullet before.

2. By the logic of this forum he can still die but that doesn't put others at a massive disadvantage.

3. Spiderman has webbing, what was that about being simply at the mercy of gravity again?

his webbing doesn't move faster than a bullet right?

Originally posted by masterbruce
Is that true? I always assumed his spidersense only warned him of impending danger and nothing more, which is why he could be hit by his foes.

If his spidersense is as omnipotent as you make it seem, then he should NEVER get hit, EVER, at least by his normal cast of villains.

Well that would make a boring comic, now wouldn't it? The Flash gets hit by people that Squid Boy could dodge, I don't see you losing sleep over that.

It's true though. His spider-sense warns of:

1. When the attack will start
2. When the attack will potentially connect
3. What kind of attack it is
4. Where on his person the attack will potentially connect

It also warns of other surrounding things, painting him an instant 360 degree picture of what's going on around him.

Originally posted by masterbruce
his webbing doesn't move faster than a bullet right? You simply said he was at the mercy of gravity. Spiderman can launch himself 15 stories right in the air, and clear a small parking lot in a short burst.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
To be fair the functionality of Spider-man's spider sense varies more often the the abilities of the Powerpuff Girls. It is a vague warning sign just as often as it is a precise targeting system.

And yet it still doesn't vary anywhere near as much as the effectiveness of Wolvie's healing factor.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Alot of people say spiderman gets hit so often in comics because of PIS, because if he actually used his powers he really should almost never be hit by anyone short of a speedster. And the main reason that he does get hit is because otherwise no one would read his comics. Well that logic goes bothways. He dodges bullets so often ALSO because of PIS, if he got killed, Marvel would lose massive profit so of course he will never die from a gunshot or anything, that is the nature of comics.

Remember, Spiderman cannot fly. Once he's in the air, he's at the mercy of gravity. He may contort his body to avoid a handgun's bullets, but a machine gun spraying bullets in the air would be impossible for spiderman to avoid while midair...its just common sense.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Well that would make a boring comic, now wouldn't it? The Flash gets hit by people that Squid Boy could dodge, I don't see you losing sleep over that.

It's true though. His spider-sense warns of:

1. When the attack will start
2. When the attack will potentially connect
3. What kind of attack it is
4. Where on his person the attack will potentially connect

It also warns of other surrounding things, painting him an instant 360 degree picture of what's going on around him.

I'm not losing sleep over Flash because

1) we're not talking about Flash
2) his sole attribute IS speed
3) if he gets hit by lowlevel goons, then it OBVIOUSLY is PIS since he can react at speed of light
4) I know very little about flash

Originally posted by masterbruce
Well if we are going by best showings, then Wolverine can survive a nuclear blast at pointblank. Spiderman's hardest punch direct on isn't even 1/1,000,000th the power of a nuclear bomb. So there isn't a thing Spiderman can do to phase wolverine. It'll be like punching an adamantium wall as hard as he can, his fist will be injured before wolverine will be.

To my knowledge, Wolverine has only done that once. If it becomes an established thing (him surviving nuclear blasts at point-blank range), then I'll believe it.

Spider-Man has been doing this all of his career. With a powerful spider-sense, uncanny reflexes, and unmatched agility. It's very much established.

so are we taking the best feats of both characters (in which case wolverine would win eventually just by tiring out spidey) or are we only taking the best of spidey and dismissing the best of wolverine ( in which case spidey is omnipotent and can never be hit and wolverine is a worthless sack of potatoes that will never even touch spidey)?

Originally posted by masterbruce
so are we taking the best feats of both characters (in which case wolverine would win eventually just by tiring out spidey) or are we only taking the best of spidey and dismissing the best of wolverine ( in which case spidey is omnipotent and can never be hit and wolverine is a worthless sack of potatoes that will never even touch spidey)? Best of both would be Spideman dodging Wolverine and webbing him up, not having to fight him.

Originally posted by masterbruce
I'm not losing sleep over Flash because

1) we're not talking about Flash
2) his sole attribute IS speed
3) if he gets hit by lowlevel goons, then it OBVIOUSLY is PIS since he can react at speed of light
4) I know very little about flash

I apologize for the sleep comment.

Lemme put it this way. Flash can literally pluck bullets out of the air. Myriads of them. Thousands of them. At the same time. He's also out-raced INSTANTANEOUS TRAVEL.

And yet he still gets hit by Captain Boomerang or whatever the hell he's called.

My point is, Spider-Man should not be hit by anyone slower than him unless he's either:

A. Completely surrounded
B. Outnumbered by limbs (Doc Ock, Venom, Carnage, etc.)
C. Some other plot device

Originally posted by masterbruce
I'm not losing sleep over Flash because

1) we're not talking about Flash
2) his sole attribute IS speed
3) if he gets hit by lowlevel goons, then it OBVIOUSLY is PIS since he can react at speed of light
4) I know very little about flash Still the same concept however. Even if at a lesser degree.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Best of both would be Spideman dodging Wolverine and webbing him up, not having to fight him.

Pretty much.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
To my knowledge, Wolverine has only done that once. If it becomes an established thing (him surviving nuclear blasts at point-blank range), then I'll believe it.

Spider-Man has been doing this all of his career. With a powerful spider-sense, uncanny reflexes, and unmatched agility. It's very much established.

ummm, last time i checked, nuclear bombs aren't in the arsenal of just everyday crooks. So I doubt Wolverine will have the fortune of eating another nuke blast straight in the face, although im sure he would love to just to prove to you his healing abilities.

man, how many nuclear blasts does a man need to survive before he proves his worth these days?

Originally posted by masterbruce
ummm, last time i checked, nuclear bombs aren't in the arsenal of just everyday crooks. So I doubt Wolverine will have the fortune of eating another nuke blast straight in the face, although im sure he would love to just to prove to you his healing abilities.

man, how many nuclear blasts does a man need to survive before he proves his worth these days?

17.

Edit: Really, I start believing a new feat after 2-3 times.

damn, that's rough. guess wolvie has a long ways to go to prove himself then.

1 nuke blast down, 16 to go.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
17.

Edit: Really, I start believing a new feat after 2-3 times.

you do realize that nuclear blasts is not a common occurrence, even in comics. so its very unlikely that wolverine will be anywhere near the vicinity of another nuke, unfortunately.

*sigh*

Why is it that after more then three years as a member of this forum I'm still posting the same things? That is almost six years if I count my time on CBR and other forums.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Umm, Spiderman is

a) Stronger
b) Faster
c) More agile
d) He has spidersense


... how insightful

Originally posted by Dreampanther
He can punch Wolverine so hard he will only land next Tuesday (remember, Spiderman is ALWAYS holding back). Wolverine is NOT a better combatant, the only thing keeping him alive is his healing factor. He gets stabbed, shot and punched the whole time - Deadpool made him look ridiculous. Spiderman has to rely on his speed, agility and strength, to survive WITHOUT getting shot, stabbed or punched - and he has been doing this for years. So - who do YOU think is a better fighter?


Do you know anything about fighting? No? Wow... shocker. People avoid things because it is a necessity. Thats it, thats the only reason. If you got in a fight with someone and they started shooting spit balls at you would you bust out your gold medal gymnastic routine or would you stride straight through the spit balls towards your enemy? Wolverine doesn't even bat an eye lash at machine gun fire... why on earth would he over exert himself to avoid it? It only prolongs the battle.

Imagine for a moment you are in a sword duel against an opponent who is your equal, or even you better in martial skill. Now imagine that instead of wasting time going back in forth with blocks, parries and ripostes you allowed your opponent to land a fatal attack for the sol purpose of exposing an opening in your enemy for you to exploit. Now imagine that same wound would heal in an instance while your enemies would not. Why prolong the battle? For an arrogant showing of martial prowess? Wolverine's efficiency in combat and fluidity of motion is enough of an example of that.

Deadpool beat Wolverine who was with out a healing factor. Should I organize the parade or just mail him his medal? Seriously did you even read the issue? Wolverine is standing in the ruins of what was once a door way and Deadpool fires on him. Wolverine dodges the blast, prison rushes DP and lands not one, not two but three fatal attacks on Wade before Wade lands one of his own. And do you want to know why DP landed that hit? The same reason Punisher would riddle Spider-man with bullets. The same reason Wolverine stabbed Spider-man in the New Avengers training season. BECAUSE THERE IS NOTHING THAT CAN BE DONE TO AVOID AN ATTACK IN MIDAIR. You can't change your momentum and you body can only contort so much.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Spiderman has made Wolverine look like a fool before as well, plenty of times. Webbing him up with his claws pointing to his brains, so if he extends them he gives himself a lobotomy was quite a funny one, actually.


Spider-man is gifted with the ability to over power people who... you know... are not fighting him. Wolverine was talking to Spider-man, trying to avoid a needless fight, and Spider-man being rash and impulsive came out of left field and webbed him up. I'm sure I could blind side Mike Tyson with a baseball bat... I must really be impressive.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
But never mind that - let's talk about Spidey being unable to dodge Frank's bullets. Why has he suddenly lost the power to dodge bullets, when he's been doing it for years? He's dodged bullets in mid-air, he's even dodge guys spraying him with machine guns - and yet every time he comes through unscathed?


Spider-man doesn't dodge bullets. He avoids them by anticipating the directory of the bullet and getting out of the way before the bullet is fired. That's all there is to it. Spider-man avoids gun fire from random cannon who couldn't hit the brood side of a barn. Who hasn't? When Wolverine lost his healing factor from a nano tech virus he weaved between Gatling gun fire.

The fact of the matter is that Spider-man has never dodged bullets mid air, those bullets simple missed him. A bullet aimed a center mass on a suspended target is unavoidable no matter how fast you are.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Coincidence? Sure, if coincidence means having the ability to do it over, and over, and over, and over again...


Nothing to do with coincidence, just your inability to interpret comic evidence.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Look, I like Frank. And I like Logan too. But Frank is a man with a gun. Nothing more. A great shot, sure - but so what? Spidey has been doging bullets since he got his powers, please demonstrate to me why he has suddenly lost the ability to do so now?


Spider-man can't fly and he can't propel himself threw the air of his own volition. If Spider-man jumped in the air and someone fired his chest there is nothing he could do about it. He couldn't contort his body to avoid it. His webbing isn't faster then a bullet and even if it was he'd still need to use it to change his moment. Spider-man's fighting style is poorly suited for this type of combat and it doesn't make to best use of his attributes in general.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
As for Wolverine, he's not even in this fight. Spiderman can ignore him until he feels like dealing with him, which he can do any time he feels like it. And why can he not block or parry?


If Spider-man is avoiding Wolverine it means he is in the air (as Wolverine would make short work of Spider-man in melee) in which case Punisher shots him dead center.

He can't parry or block because he would lose which ever extremity he decided to use for the deed.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
He can simply grab his wists and use his own claws to stab Wolverine through anything he feels like stabbing him. Spidey will make Wolverine look like a hairy child.


If Spider-man tries to grab Wolverine's wrist he will lose a hand... seems like a risky strategy to me. Why do you think that would pay off.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
May I suggest the same to you? Spend some time on the Spiderman respect thread, and learn what he is actually capable of.

I don't need to go to respect thread, I (unlike you I suspect) have many long boxes filled entirely with Spider-man appearances giving me a much larger spectrum of Spider-man's abilities to work with not just the fan-boy favorites in the respect thread.


Spider-man's fighting style leaves him at the mercy of gravity, plain and simple. Explain to me how he would avoid Frank's bullets.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Spider-man doesn't dodge bullets. He avoids them by anticipating the directory of the bullet and getting out of the way before the bullet is fired. That's all there is to it. Spider-man avoids gun fire from random cannon who couldn't hit the brood side of a barn. Who hasn't? When Wolverine lost his healing factor from a nano tech virus he weaved between Gatling gun fire.

The fact of the matter is that Spider-man has never dodged bullets mid air, those bullets simple missed him. A bullet aimed a center mass on a suspended target is unavoidable no matter how fast you are.

Spider-man can't fly and he can't propel himself threw the air of his own volition. If Spider-man jumped in the air and someone fired his chest there is nothing he could do about it. He couldn't contort his body to avoid it. His webbing isn't faster then a bullet and even if it was he'd still need to use it to change his moment. Spider-man's fighting style is poorly suited for this type of combat and it doesn't make to best use of his attributes in general.

If Spider-man is avoiding Wolverine it means he is in the air (as Wolverine would make short work of Spider-man in melee) in which case Punisher shots him dead center.

He can't parry or block because he would lose which ever extremity he decided to use for the deed.

If Spider-man tries to grab Wolverine's wrist he will lose a hand... seems like a risky strategy to me. Why do you think that would pay off.

Spider-man's fighting style leaves him at the mercy of gravity, plain and simple. Explain to me how he would avoid Frank's bullets.

Alright. Let's see. I guess I'll work my way up.

How will he avoid Frank's bullets? By knowing where he will shoot way ahead of time and avoiding the paths the bullets will take. Simple as that.

Did Wolverine recently grow a set of claws from his wrists now that I was not aware of? I didn't realize grabbing his wrist (a la Wrecker) would result in a loss of extremity. Hm. Go figure.

Seriously though, srank. Why do you feel that it is impossible to grab the NON-BLADED part of Wolverine's arm during mid-swipe? Wrecker did it pretty easily. Spider-Man could do it even easier.

And yet Spider-Man dodges bullets--in the air--all the time. He's been doing that basically since his introduction.

And clearly Spider-man can dodge bullets.

Spidey can't take the majority against Wolverine alone. With Frank sniping at him keeping his Spidey Sense occupied it's Wolvy/Frank 10/10.

Originally posted by riceroost
Spidey can't take the majority against Wolverine alone. With Frank sniping at him keeping his Spidey Sense occupied it's Wolvy/Frank 10/10.

Since when can't Spider-Man take the majority over Wolverine?

Spidey can ignore Wolvie, for as long as he wants to. Except if Frank and Wolvie brought a ladder with, all Spidey has to do (once his Spider sense has warned him there's an ambush waiting for him) is dodge back behind a corner, and climb up onto a rooftop and wait until he has spotted Frank (which he will do with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed it - his Spider sense!).

Then he gets behind Frank (which he does with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed is - enhanced speed!) and drops him from the roof. Or webs him up and plays bounce the ball from the wall until he gets tired.

All the while he is standing on a ledge, 2 meters above the ground, and Wolvey is running around frantically trying to get a stepladder, so he can get his deadly, razor-sharp, utterly useless adamantium claws into action.

When Spidey gets bored playing with the Frankball, he decided to web lasso up Wolvey and starts practising his hammer-throw. Every time Wolvey puts his claws into action, cutting himself free, he drops about thirty stories, and pick up a (LOT) of internal damage. Leave us not forget - Wolverine has a H-E-A-L-I-N-G factor. Which means he picks up D-A-M-A-G-E. He is not I-N-V-U-L-N-E-R-A-B-L-E.

So while he is healing, (very rapidly, I will be the first to admit, (as stated before - I am actually a fan of Wolvey, and of Frank, I am, however, also able to see when people are TOTALLY outclassed)), so while he is healing, Spidey has lassoed him again, and is hoisting him up again. And then he drops him again.

And he does this for a while, until he gets bored, and goes home to bang Mary Jane.

I don't see a thing either Wolvey, or Frank, can do to Spidey. Meanwhile, I can think of more than a dozen things he can do to them. I just think he will be as bored with this fight as I am, and simply choose to leave them, waiting futilely in ambush, and go home to bang Mary Jane rather. I know I would. And Peter Parker is about ten times smarter than I am.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Spidey can ignore Wolvie, for as long as he wants to. Except if Frank and Wolvie brought a ladder with, all Spidey has to do (once his Spider sense has warned him there's an ambush waiting for him) is dodge back behind a corner, and climb up onto a rooftop and wait until he has spotted Frank (which he will do with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed it - his Spider sense!).

Then he gets behind Frank (which he does with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed is - enhanced speed!) and drops him from the roof. Or webs him up and plays bounce the ball from the wall until he gets tired.

All the while he is standing on a ledge, 2 meters above the ground, and Wolvey is running around frantically trying to get a stepladder, so he can get his dealy, razor-sharp, utterly useless adamantium claws into action.

When Spidey gets bored playing with the Frankball, he decided to web lasso up Wolvey and starts practising his hammer-throw. Every time Wolvey puts his claws into action, cutting himself free, he drops about thirty stories, and pick up a (LOT) of internal damage. Leave us not forget - Wolverine has a H-E-A-L-I-N-G factor. Which means he picks up D-A-M-A-G-E. He is not I-N-V-U-L-N-E-R-A-B-L-E.

So while he is healing, (very rapidly, I will be the first to admit, (as stated before - I am actually a fan of Wolvey, and of Frank, I am, however, also able to see when people are TOTALLY outclassed)), so while he is healing, Spidey has lassoed him again, and is hoisting him up again. And then he drops him again.

And he does this for a while, until he gets bored, and goes home to bang Mary Jane.

I don't see a thing either Wolvey, or Frank, can do to Spidey. Meanwhile, I can think of more than a dozen things he can do to them. I just think he will be as bored with this fight as I am, and simply choose to leave them, waiting futilely in ambush, and go home to bang Mary Jane rather. I know I would. And Peter Parker is about ten times smarter than I am.

As usual, good points all around.

Mary Jane for the win!

Originally posted by Dreampanther

Wolverine is NOT a better combatant

Muhahahahaha good one... Wolverines fighting skills are so far beyond spideys it's not even funny.. Spidey can't engage wolverine in H2H combat, he would get ripped to shreds.

However, Spidey will most likely defeat Logan since he is a more versatile character. He has more options. In a fight to the death Wolverine WOULD kill spidey.

How? By standing on a stepladder? And waving his arms and jumping up and down and yelling "I am the best at what I do!" until Spiderman dies laughing, or from boredom?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Alright. Let's see. I guess I'll work my way up.

How will he avoid Frank's bullets? By knowing where he will shoot way ahead of time and avoiding the paths the bullets will take. Simple as that.

Did Wolverine recently grow a set of claws from his wrists now that I was not aware of? I didn't realize grabbing his wrist (a la Wrecker) would result in a loss of extremity. Hm. Go figure.

Seriously though, srank. Why do you feel that it is impossible to grab the NON-BLADED part of Wolverine's arm during mid-swipe? Wrecker did it pretty easily. Spider-Man could do it even easier.

And yet Spider-Man dodges bullets--in the air--all the time. He's been doing that basically since his introduction.

And clearly Spider-man can dodge bullets. Didn't he argue that all Street Levelers could dodge bullets? I guess he had a change of heart. I'd say Spiderman can dodge them, but not 100% no worry dodge, he has a chance to get hit depending on the distance.

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Spidey can ignore Wolvie, for as long as he wants to. Except if Frank and Wolvie brought a ladder with, all Spidey has to do (once his Spider sense has warned him there's an ambush waiting for him) is dodge back behind a corner, and climb up onto a rooftop and wait until he has spotted Frank (which he will do with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed it - his Spider sense!).

Then he gets behind Frank (which he does with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed is - enhanced speed!) and drops him from the roof. Or webs him up and plays bounce the ball from the wall until he gets tired.

All the while he is standing on a ledge, 2 meters above the ground, and Wolvey is running around frantically trying to get a stepladder, so he can get his deadly, razor-sharp, utterly useless adamantium claws into action.

When Spidey gets bored playing with the Frankball, he decided to web lasso up Wolvey and starts practising his hammer-throw. Every time Wolvey puts his claws into action, cutting himself free, he drops about thirty stories, and pick up a (LOT) of internal damage. Leave us not forget - Wolverine has a H-E-A-L-I-N-G factor. Which means he picks up D-A-M-A-G-E. He is not I-N-V-U-L-N-E-R-A-B-L-E.

So while he is healing, (very rapidly, I will be the first to admit, (as stated before - I am actually a fan of Wolvey, and of Frank, I am, however, also able to see when people are TOTALLY outclassed)), so while he is healing, Spidey has lassoed him again, and is hoisting him up again. And then he drops him again.

And he does this for a while, until he gets bored, and goes home to bang Mary Jane.

I don't see a thing either Wolvey, or Frank, can do to Spidey. Meanwhile, I can think of more than a dozen things he can do to them. I just think he will be as bored with this fight as I am, and simply choose to leave them, waiting futilely in ambush, and go home to bang Mary Jane rather. I know I would. And Peter Parker is about ten times smarter than I am.


So are Frank and Wolverine now idiots on Rhino's level? They are just going to walk up and let Spidey ambush them without doing anything? These are two of the smartest fighters in the world who try to get every advantage in battle and you make them seem like everyday dumb crooks.

Also, when has Spiderman ever just webbed a formidable foe such as wolverine and started to toss him over and over without wolverine fighting back?

There is so much spiderman fanboyism on this board.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Well if we are going by best showings, then Wolverine can survive a nuclear blast at pointblank. Spiderman's hardest punch direct on isn't even 1/1,000,000th the power of a nuclear bomb. So there isn't a thing Spiderman can do to phase wolverine. It'll be like punching an adamantium wall as hard as he can, his fist will be injured before wolverine will be.

Well if you want to use best single showings then Spider-Man beat a herald of Galactus.

Besides, the argument isn't can Spider-Man kill Punisher and Wolverine. Its can he beat them. A simple backhand slap over a few buildings will take Wolverine out of this one.

Originally posted by masterbruce
So are Frank and Wolverine now idiots on Rhino's level? They are just going to walk up and let Spidey ambush them without doing anything? These are two of the smartest fighters in the world who try to get every advantage in battle and you make them seem like everyday dumb crooks.

Also, when has Spiderman ever just webbed a formidable foe such as wolverine and started to toss him over and over without wolverine fighting back?

There is so much spiderman fanboyism on this board.

They are smart, yes. Don't think anyones saying they aren't. But they can't match Spider-Man.

Please. Spider-Man has swatted away Logan like he was nothing, has webbed him up and placed him in a helpless position and been on the verge of killing him and yet Wolverine fans always have an excuse. Oh, he wasn't ready, oh he trying to reason, oh he had to pee.

Just because things aren't going your way don't cry fanboy. Arguements have been been presented here to show Spider-Man's abilities, even scans to back them up, yet all you can say is "No, he can't do that". Yea, I can see how totally unfair this is.

Tell me this how does Frank and Logan win is Spider-Man goes invisible and speed blitzes the two of them. Logan will still be able sense Peter, but Frank will have no way of knowing where he is and no defence agaisnt a spider-punch (which WILL KO him). Then its just Logan vs Peter (who's not holding back). SM can then proceed to

a) just web him up
b) punch/kick him over the horizon
c) suffocate him with the liquid metal in his suit

Sure there are others, but I don't feel like being creative right now. I'm sure you get the point though

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Didn't he argue that all Street Levelers could dodge bullets? I guess he had a change of heart. I'd say Spiderman can dodge them, but not 100% no worry dodge, he has a chance to get hit depending on the distance.

Well, yea. Of course there's ALWAYS the chance depending on certain circumstances. It's just more probable that he will be able to dodge 95% of their attacks.

Originally posted by marvelprince
They are smart, yes. Don't think anyones saying they aren't. But they can't match Spider-Man.

Please. Spider-Man has swatted away Logan like he was nothing, has webbed him up and placed him in a helpless position and been on the verge of killing him and yet Wolverine fans always have an excuse. Oh, he wasn't ready, oh he trying to reason, oh he had to pee.

Just because things aren't going your way don't cry fanboy. Arguements have been been presented here to show Spider-Man's abilities, even scans to back them up, yet all you can say is "No, he can't do that". Yea, I can see how totally unfair this is.

Tell me this how does Frank and Logan win is Spider-Man goes invisible and speed blitzes the two of them. Logan will still be able sense Peter, but Frank will have no way of knowing where he is and no defence agaisnt a spider-punch (which WILL KO him). Then its just Logan vs Peter (who's not holding back). SM can then proceed to

a) just web him up
b) punch/kick him over the horizon
c) suffocate him with the liquid metal in his suit

Sure there are others, but I don't feel like being creative right now. I'm sure you get the point though

...Damn. I KEEP forgetting that Spidey has his Iron Costume when making my arguments.

Spidey wins easier than I previously said.

Originally posted by masterbruce
So are Frank and Wolverine now idiots on Rhino's level? They are just going to walk up and let Spidey ambush them without doing anything? These are two of the smartest fighters in the world who try to get every advantage in battle and you make them seem like everyday dumb crooks. That seems like what you're trying to do.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Also, when has Spiderman ever just webbed a formidable foe such as wolverine and started to toss him over and over without wolverine fighting back? Plenty of times, of course he wouldn't do it to guys like he and DD because they are icons and the match would be boring, not a factor here. Plus like I mentioned earlier he can turn invisible.

Originally posted by masterbruce
There is so much spiderman fanboyism on this board. No, there are people like you who hate characters that win because of their vast superiority in other areas, so you go out on a limb to make him lose to your MA heroes because you believe that they can "take anything" with enough training. It get's annoying, no matter how much training you have, a normal human with Peak reflexes should never catch a bullet or flip a car over. Period. It's wrong plain and simple, thus the argument is absurd. I didn't even say Spiderman would curbstomp at all, my point was addressing something else. You have no proof, you have no facts, and no solid argument but to complain that people are overrating Spiderman in areas he's good in. I agree that some other members might give him the benefit of the doubt often, but there are 10x that many people putting im up in stupid matches and underestimating him, ESPECIALLY in a thread where he's not holding back at all.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Oh, man. I totally forgot about the Iron costume. I was giving my vote based on current Spider-Man in his normal costume.

Current Spidey in normal costume wins it 6/10.
Iron Spidey wins it 9/10.
Exactly.

In fact,Wolverine could take spiderman by himself..

It's a possibility, I just wouldn't put my money on it in a bet.

Originally posted by X-Logan
Exactly.

In fact,Wolverine could take spiderman by himself..

Err...are you quoting the right person?

I disagree with your statement.

Spider-Man definitely takes the majority over Wolverine.

And then an even higher majority in his Iron Spidey outfit.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Didn't he argue that all Street Levelers could dodge bullets? I guess he had a change of heart. I'd say Spiderman can dodge them, but not 100% no worry dodge, he has a chance to get hit depending on the distance.

I'm not saying that Spider-man can't dodge bullets, I'm saying he can't dodge bullets in the air. It's impossible and speed has nothing to do with it. Even if Spider-man was as fast as the Flash he still couldn't dodge a bullet while suspended in the air. Spider-man's fighting style has him air born the majority of the time and Frank is more the capable of shooting him out of the air.

Ok people are forgetting a very important fact here....Spider-man is in his iron Suit, thats right people his iron suit, and what does that grant him duh duh duuuuhhh Invisibilty, but not only that wait for...yes its coming....hold onto your hats...here it is....the suit is BULLET PROOF...Whats castle going to do to someone who is now almost imperviouse to his primary form of attack?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
That seems like what you're trying to do.

Plenty of times, of course he wouldn't do it to guys like he and DD because they are icons and the match would be boring, not a factor here. Plus like I mentioned earlier he can turn invisible.

No, there are people like you who hate characters that win because of their vast superiority in other areas, so you go out on a limb to make him lose to your MA heroes because you believe that they can "take anything" with enough training. It get's annoying, no matter how much training you have, a normal human with Peak reflexes should never catch a bullet or flip a car over. Period. It's wrong plain and simple, thus the argument is absurd. I didn't even say Spiderman would curbstomp at all, my point was addressing something else. You have no proof, you have no facts, and no solid argument but to complain that people are overrating Spiderman in areas he's good in. I agree that some other members might give him the benefit of the doubt often, but there are 10x that many people putting im up in stupid matches and underestimating him, ESPECIALLY in a thread where he's not holding back at all.

the last accusation is pretty funny. I actually really dislike wolverine and like spiderman a lot more. However, that doesn't mean Im going to stick up for spidey just becuase i think he's a cooler character.

Im pretty sure I made arguments in wolverine and punisher's favor, as well as other people, if you choose to dismiss them, that's fine.

And since this is iron costume spidey, I give it to spidey since Frank becomes much less of a threat.

Spidey 7/10 (SEE, unlike some people on this board, im open to new arguments and I WILL change my opinion if I think Im wrong)

Originally posted by masterbruce
the last accusation is pretty funny. I actually really dislike wolverine and like spiderman a lot more. However, that doesn't mean Im going to stick up for spidey just becuase i think he's a cooler character.

Im pretty sure I made arguments in wolverine and punisher's favor, as well as other people, if you choose to dismiss them, that's fine.

And since this is iron costume spidey, I give it to spidey since Frank becomes much less of a threat.

Spidey 7/10 (SEE, unlike some people on this board, im open to new arguments and I WILL change my opinion if I think Im wrong) That's fair enough but it's no funnier than your accusations of fanboys. Trust me there are more threads I say Spiderman loses than wins, I think he does well against peaks, but not certain flying characters and energy projection ones.

I brought up Iron Spiderman tons of times before as well as other members, not that it's important anymore though.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Spider-Man 6/10. Very close match.

Alone, I'd probably give them better odds (not majority, just better), but Spidey will use their teamwork to his advantage. that's probably true.... with cis on in this fight logan and frank would most likely be getting in eachother's way while butting heads as well.. and in the iron spidey costume it doesn't look like pete has much to fear from frank as it is....

Originally posted by marvelprince
Well if you want to use best single showings then Spider-Man beat a herald of Galactus.

Besides, the argument isn't can Spider-Man kill Punisher and Wolverine. Its can he beat them. A simple backhand slap over a few buildings will take Wolverine out of this one.

meh... he beat an admittedly holding back herald in a close-up confrontation which isn't his strong point anyways... the guy's been floored by one hit from hercules and humiliated by black knight....
he's a tough guy, but spiderman also had loads of plot devices in his favor.. not QUITE the feat people build it up to be.

Originally posted by jinzin
meh... he beat an admittedly holding back herald in a close-up confrontation which isn't his strong point anyways... the guy's been floored by one hit from hercules and humiliated by black knight....
he's a tough guy, but spiderman also had loads of plot devices in his favor.. not QUITE the feat people build it up to be.

Thats my point. I personally shy away from using that feat, just used it to counter the argument that Wolverine can't be beat beat because he survived a nuke. Basically the agrument was kinda like Spider-Man can't stop him cause he isn't a fraction as strong as a nuke which failed to stop Wolverine so I countered with Spider-Man beating a herald. Just using one high end feat to counter another

Originally posted by masterbruce
the last accusation is pretty funny. I actually really dislike wolverine and like spiderman a lot more. However, that doesn't mean Im going to stick up for spidey just becuase i think he's a cooler character

Shouldn't have to do with cool. It should involve taking scope of a characters stats and abilities and discerning what they can accomplish.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Im pretty sure I made arguments in wolverine and punisher's favor, as well as other people, if you choose to dismiss them, that's fine.

You and Srank made some good arguments. But unfortunately most of it relied on saying Spider-Man can't do things he's been shown to do since his inception

Originally posted by masterbruce
And since this is iron costume spidey, I give it to spidey since Frank becomes much less of a threat.

I had forgotten that the costume is bulletproof.

Originally posted by masterbruce
Spidey 7/10 (SEE, unlike some people on this board, im open to new arguments and I WILL change my opinion if I think Im wrong)

Glad to see you aren't stubborn. You can admit when your wrong, thats good seeing as how rare that is on these boards.

Originally posted by marvelprince
Thats my point. I personally shy away from using that feat, just used it to counter the argument that Wolverine can't be beat beat because he survived a nuke. Basically the agrument was kinda like Spider-Man can't stop him cause he isn't a fraction as strong as a nuke which failed to stop Wolverine so I countered with Spider-Man beating a herald. Just using one high end feat to counter another except wolverine survived a nuke without plot devices.... it's an actual high end feat...
the spiderman beating fl is somewhat fabricated in that spiderman needed those plot devices just to stay competative.. their not comparible because one has outside circumstances to allow it to take place.. the other does not.

Originally posted by jinzin
except wolverine survived a nuke without plot devices.... it's an actual high end feat...
the spiderman beating fl is somewhat fabricated in that spiderman needed those plot devices just to stay competative.. their not comparible because one has outside circumstances to allow it to take place.. the other does not.

So the fact that Wolverine shouldn't have been able to survive a blast due to the very nature of a nuclear blast and how his hf works does serve at all to damper this feat? Wow

How about Spider-Man beating Grey Hulk then. Can we take that as a high end feat?

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Spidey can ignore Wolvie, for as long as he wants to. Except if Frank and Wolvie brought a ladder with, all Spidey has to do (once his Spider sense has warned him there's an ambush waiting for him) is dodge back behind a corner, and climb up onto a rooftop and wait until he has spotted Frank (which he will do with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed it - his Spider sense!).

Then he gets behind Frank (which he does with - wait for it - yes, you've guessed is - enhanced speed!) and drops him from the roof. Or webs him up and plays bounce the ball from the wall until he gets tired.

All the while he is standing on a ledge, 2 meters above the ground, and Wolvey is running around frantically trying to get a stepladder, so he can get his deadly, razor-sharp, utterly useless adamantium claws into action.

When Spidey gets bored playing with the Frankball, he decided to web lasso up Wolvey and starts practising his hammer-throw. Every time Wolvey puts his claws into action, cutting himself free, he drops about thirty stories, and pick up a (LOT) of internal damage. Leave us not forget - Wolverine has a H-E-A-L-I-N-G factor. Which means he picks up D-A-M-A-G-E. He is not I-N-V-U-L-N-E-R-A-B-L-E.

So while he is healing, (very rapidly, I will be the first to admit, (as stated before - I am actually a fan of Wolvey, and of Frank, I am, however, also able to see when people are TOTALLY outclassed)), so while he is healing, Spidey has lassoed him again, and is hoisting him up again. And then he drops him again.

And he does this for a while, until he gets bored, and goes home to bang Mary Jane.

I don't see a thing either Wolvey, or Frank, can do to Spidey. Meanwhile, I can think of more than a dozen things he can do to them. I just think he will be as bored with this fight as I am, and simply choose to leave them, waiting futilely in ambush, and go home to bang Mary Jane rather. I know I would. And Peter Parker is about ten times smarter than I am. i like this scenerio....droolio MJ

Originally posted by marvelprince
So the fact that Wolverine shouldn't have been able to survive a blast due to the very nature of a nuclear blast and how his hf works does serve at all to damper this feat? Wow

How about Spider-Man beating Grey Hulk then. Can we take that as a high end feat?

no it doesn't dampen the feat....

don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the feat is ok to use as a typical reference for what wolverine can take, I'm not saying it's ok to use a typical feat to support wolverine, I'm not even saying it's rationale... what I'm saying is that it wasn't induced through plot devices like the firelord one is, it's not tainted...

when did spidey everbeat gery hulk? sans captain universe powers.

Originally posted by jinzin
no it doesn't dampen the feat....

don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the feat is ok to use as a typical reference for what wolverine can take, I'm not saying it's ok to use a typical feat to support wolverine, I'm not even saying it's rationale... what I'm saying is that it wasn't induced through plot devices like the firelord one is, it's not tainted...

when did spidey everbeat gery hulk? sans captain universe powers.

Oh, I gotta. Cool

When the Avengers sent him after him as his "test" to join the team. I believe at the end he discovers Hulk is Bruce Banner and they part ways

what issue is this?

I'll look it up for you, its an ish of Spider-Man. Or maybe you can search for it online. I know its the ish (or arc) where Spider-Man needs money (like he always does) and decides to try and join the Avengers. Hulk has gone rogue again so to test him the team sends him to bring Bruce back in

Originally posted by marvelprince
So the fact that Wolverine shouldn't have been able to survive a blast due to the very nature of a nuclear blast and how his hf works does serve at all to damper this feat? Wow

How about Spider-Man beating Grey Hulk then. Can we take that as a high end feat? Wolverine's healing factor is as big a plot device a Superman's "finding a way". It's just not as direct.

Amazing Spider-man King Size Special 3 is the issue you are looking for

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Amazing Spider-man King Size Special 3 is the issue you are looking for

Thanks alot man. Hadn't seen the ish yet but I intend to look it up now

Originally posted by marvelprince
Thanks alot man. Hadn't seen the ish yet but I intend to look it up now

Not a problem

I just thumbed through the issue real quick and Spider-man didn't win that fight. Hulk handled Spider-man pretty easily, punched a gamma ray testing device, turned in to Banner briefly then swatted Spider-man to the side like a bug and left.

He wasn't Grey Hulk either... are you thinking of another issue? I figured it was the same issue because it is the only one I could think of where the Avengers told Spider-man to beat the Hulk to become a member.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I just thumbed through the issue real quick and Spider-man didn't win that fight. Hulk handled Spider-man pretty easily, punched a gamma ray testing device, turned in to Banner briefly then swatted Spider-man to the side like a bug and left.

He wasn't Grey Hulk either... are you thinking of another issue? I figured it was the same issue because it is the only one I could think of where the Avengers told Spider-man to beat the Hulk to become a member.

No. I'm thinking Grey Hulk for this one. I know the one where he punches a shield and reverts. I guess it wasn't the one where he trying out for the Avengers. My bad

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
*sigh*

Why is it that after more then three years as a member of this forum I'm still posting the same things? That is almost six years if I count my time on CBR and other forums.



... how insightful



Do you know anything about fighting? No? Wow... shocker. People avoid things because it is a necessity. Thats it, thats the only reason. If you got in a fight with someone and they started shooting spit balls at you would you bust out your gold medal gymnastic routine or would you stride straight through the spit balls towards your enemy? Wolverine doesn't even bat an eye lash at machine gun fire... why on earth would he over exert himself to avoid it? It only prolongs the battle.

Imagine for a moment you are in a sword duel against an opponent who is your equal, or even you better in martial skill. Now imagine that instead of wasting time going back in forth with blocks, parries and ripostes you allowed your opponent to land a fatal attack for the sol purpose of exposing an opening in your enemy for you to exploit. Now imagine that same wound would heal in an instance while your enemies would not. Why prolong the battle? For an arrogant showing of martial prowess? Wolverine's efficiency in combat and fluidity of motion is enough of an example of that.

Deadpool beat Wolverine who was with out a healing factor. Should I organize the parade or just mail him his medal? Seriously did you even read the issue? Wolverine is standing in the ruins of what was once a door way and Deadpool fires on him. Wolverine dodges the blast, prison rushes DP and lands not one, not two but three fatal attacks on Wade before Wade lands one of his own. And do you want to know why DP landed that hit? The same reason Punisher would riddle Spider-man with bullets. The same reason Wolverine stabbed Spider-man in the New Avengers training season. BECAUSE THERE IS NOTHING THAT CAN BE DONE TO AVOID AN ATTACK IN MIDAIR. You can't change your momentum and you body can only contort so much.



Spider-man is gifted with the ability to over power people who... you know... are not fighting him. Wolverine was talking to Spider-man, trying to avoid a needless fight, and Spider-man being rash and impulsive came out of left field and webbed him up. I'm sure I could blind side Mike Tyson with a baseball bat... I must really be impressive.



Spider-man doesn't dodge bullets. He avoids them by anticipating the directory of the bullet and getting out of the way before the bullet is fired. That's all there is to it. Spider-man avoids gun fire from random cannon who couldn't hit the brood side of a barn. Who hasn't? When Wolverine lost his healing factor from a nano tech virus he weaved between Gatling gun fire.

The fact of the matter is that Spider-man has never dodged bullets mid air, those bullets simple missed him. A bullet aimed a center mass on a suspended target is unavoidable no matter how fast you are.



Nothing to do with coincidence, just your inability to interpret comic evidence.



Spider-man can't fly and he can't propel himself threw the air of his own volition. If Spider-man jumped in the air and someone fired his chest there is nothing he could do about it. He couldn't contort his body to avoid it. His webbing isn't faster then a bullet and even if it was he'd still need to use it to change his moment. Spider-man's fighting style is poorly suited for this type of combat and it doesn't make to best use of his attributes in general.



If Spider-man is avoiding Wolverine it means he is in the air (as Wolverine would make short work of Spider-man in melee) in which case Punisher shots him dead center.

He can't parry or block because he would lose which ever extremity he decided to use for the deed.



If Spider-man tries to grab Wolverine's wrist he will lose a hand... seems like a risky strategy to me. Why do you think that would pay off.



I don't need to go to respect thread, I (unlike you I suspect) have many long boxes filled entirely with Spider-man appearances giving me a much larger spectrum of Spider-man's abilities to work with not just the fan-boy favorites in the respect thread.


Spider-man's fighting style leaves him at the mercy of gravity, plain and simple. Explain to me how he would avoid Frank's bullets.

damn, u really kno ure s***

Originally posted by jasonk3
damn, u really kno ure s***

I like to think so.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Best of both would be Spideman dodging Wolverine and webbing him up, not having to fight him. Oh, that's a great representation of Wolverine's best senario. Wolverine's best showing involves him plowing through any and all offense by Spider-Man and landing a single blow for the win.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Edit: Really, I start believing a new feat after 2-3 times. Well he survived the nuke by Nitro and he's survived a nuke in Venom. That's two times.

Welcome to the club true believer.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Since when can't Spider-Man take the majority over Wolverine? Since Wolverine has 1 upped him most of the time they've fought. I swear you Spidey supporters just blatantly ignore 95% of Wolverine's good showings or call PIS.

Secret Wars # 3
Advantage: No one.

Spidey smacked an attacking Wolverine. Wolverine is back up and running after Spidey in the next panel. Spidey runs away. Spidey's slap did nothing.

Spider-Man vs. Wolverine # 1
Advantage: Wolverine.

Spider-Man was scared shitless the whole fight and got toyed with. Gave Wolverien everything he had to no avail. Wolverine ends the fight sitting on Spidey's chest.

Marvel Comics Presents # 48
Advantage: Wolverine.

Spider-Man sneak attacks Wolverine. Wolverine dodges Spidey's attacks, even taking the time to light up a smoke before backhanding Spidey across the roof and through a door. Spidey hits back and Wolverine pops his claws in front of Spidey's face and then kicks him in the gut. Wolverine's ready to fight. Spidey backs off.

Spider-Man # 12
Advantage: Wolverine.

Spidey tries to stop Wolverine from investigating a murder. He grabs Wolverine's arm. Wolverine grabs Spidey by the throat and slams him into a tree hard enough to shatter it. He then threatens a helpless Spidey at clawpoint.

Punisher # 34
Advantage: Wolverine.

Wolverine goes nuts and Spidey webs him to a wall. Wolverine rips the wall apart. Spidey flips over Wolverine and grabs his arms from behind. Wolverine back flips and gives Spidey a drop kick to the nards. Spidey is down.

Marvel Knights Spider-Man # 13
Advantage: Wolverine.

In a training session Spidey slams Wolverine into a wall. He then plasters Wolverine to the wall with webbing. Wolverine rips through the webbing and stabs Parker. Parker eventually passes out after the single blow.

Marvel Team Up # 1
Advantage: Spider-Man. (Debatable)

Spider-Man webs up an unsuspecting Wolverine and then runs away.

So yes Metalmanx, Wolverine does look better than Spidey a majority of the time. Your welcome.
Originally posted by Dreampanther
Every time Wolvey puts his claws into action, cutting himself free, he drops about thirty stories, and pick up a (LOT) of internal damage. Leave us not forget - Wolverine has a H-E-A-L-I-N-G factor. Which means he picks up D-A-M-A-G-E. He is not I-N-V-U-L-N-E-R-A-B-L-E. You seem to forget that Wolverine has:

Jumped off the Shield helicarrier twice AND WAS FINE.
Thrown off Avengers Tower by Spidey AND JOKED ABOUT IT.
Fell 80,000 feet from the Earth's atmosphere AND WAS STILL CONSCIOUS.

Dropping Wolverine off buildings wont stop him.

And yes, Wolverine the next best thing to invulnerable against Spidey's damage capabilities.
Originally posted by Dreampanther
and Wolvey is running around frantically trying to get a stepladder, so he can get his deadly, razor-sharp, utterly useless adamantium claws into action. You make it sound like Wolverine just sits on the ground waiting for Spidey. Shame on you.
1) Spidey can't hurt Wolverine from the air.
2) Wolverine can climb walls almost as fast as Spider-Woman can. And that's without the use of his claws. (Madripoor)
3) Spidey loses track of Wolverine while he's up in the air swinging around.
Originally posted by marvelprince
Well if you want to use best single showings then Spider-Man beat a herald of Galactus.I seem to remember Firelord's reckless stupidity doing most of the damage for Spider-Man.
Originally posted by marvelprince
A simple backhand slap over a few buildings will take Wolverine out of this one. Falling off a building for Wolverine is like you or I tripping over the dog. A minor irritant at best. Look above.
Originally posted by marvelprince
Please. Spider-Man has swatted away Logan like he was nothing,And Wolverine has done the same, but with better results to Spider-Man.
Originally posted by marvelprince
has webbed him up and placed him in a helpless position and been on the verge of killing himOh please. Check yourself. Spider-Man has never been on the verge of killing Wolverine, since we have determined that it's pretty much impossible to do. And dont bring up that Spidey breaking adamantium bullshit. You'll only embarass yourself. Wolverine was psyching him out. Playing mind games. Wolverine has on the other hand definitely had Spidey at his mercy 3 or 4 times.
Originally posted by marvelprince
and yet Wolverine fans always have an excuse.Just not as many excuses as Spidey fans make up to explain why Spidey got trounced by Wolverine.
Originally posted by marvelprince
Then its just Logan vs Peter (who's not holding back). SM can then proceed to
a) just web him up.
And Wolverine could cut his way to freedom as he has done many times.
Originally posted by marvelprince
b) punch/kick him over the horizon.We have already established that Spidey's punches and kicks only do minimal damage to Wolverine at best. And temporarily for that matter.
Originally posted by marvelprince
c) suffocate him with the liquid metal in his suit .but not before Wolverine just:
a) stabs him.
b) guts him.
c) decapitates him.
d) evicerates him.
e) rips him limb from limb.
f) pokes him.
g) prods him.
h) impales him.
i) disembowels him.
j) slices him.
k) slashes him.
l) punches/kicks/headbutts him with blows that KO chars w/ superhuman durability.
m) ETC...
Originally posted by marvelprince
Sure there are others, but I don't feel like being creative right now. I'm sure you get the point though I'll be creative:

Wolverine hits Spidey once.
Fight over.
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Plus like I mentioned earlier he can turn invisible.
Frank probably has heat vision goggles of some sort and invisibility means squat to Wolverine. Hell Wolverine can turn "invisible" without fancy technology. He's a frikkin ninja. And he's not a dime store hand ninja. He's Snake Eyes with superpowers.
Originally posted by marvelprince
I had forgotten that the costume is bulletproof.That doesn't mean Frank can't hurt him. Is it completely bulletproof? Or just against conventional firearms. Frank has been known to carry some heavy duty firepower. Give him a high power sniper rifle with adamantium rounds. Spidey's suit wont stop that.

Originally posted by jinzin
that's probably true.... with cis on in this fight logan and frank would most likely be getting in eachother's way while butting heads as well.. and in the iron spidey costume it doesn't look like pete has much to fear from frank as it is....

Hell, I wasn't even considering the Iron costume when I made that vote.

And when I said teamwork, I actually meant the numbers advantage, not their clashing personalities. On KMC, I assume that team-ups are working together as well as possible, not letting their clashing personalities get in the way. What I meant is that Spidey, for some reason, just does insanely well against multiple opponents.

Sigh. This might take some time

Originally posted by riceroost
Oh, that's a great representation of Wolverine's best senario. Wolverine's best showing involves him plowing through any and all offense by Spider-Man and landing a single blow for the win.
Well he survived the nuke by Nitro and he's survived a nuke in Venom. That's two times.

The nuke from Nitro is probably gonna be explained away so i wouldn't put my eggs in that basket if i were you

Originally posted by riceroost
Welcome to the club true believer.
Since Wolverine has 1 upped him most of the time they've fought. I swear you Spidey supporters just blatantly ignore 95% of Wolverine's good showings or call PIS.

We'll see

Originally posted by riceroost
Secret Wars # 3
Advantage: No one.

Spidey smacked an attacking Wolverine. Wolverine is back up and running after Spidey in the next panel. Spidey runs away. Spidey's slap did nothing.

Just showed Spider-Man swatting him away like the hairy irritant he is. No advantage

Originally posted by riceroost
Spider-Man vs. Wolverine # 1
Advantage: Wolverine.

Spider-Man was scared shitless the whole fight and got toyed with. Gave Wolverien everything he had to no avail. Wolverine ends the fight sitting on Spidey's chest.

Please. Spider-Man decides not to kill Logan and Wolverine takes advantage of his hesitation. Thats all. Spider-Man was dominanting the faight even with Wolverine 'psyching him out'. That was definitely a Spider-Man win

Originally posted by riceroost
Marvel Comics Presents # 48
Advantage: Wolverine.

Spider-Man sneak attacks Wolverine. Wolverine dodges Spidey's attacks, even taking the time to light up a smoke before backhanding Spidey across the roof and through a door. Spidey hits back and Wolverine pops his claws in front of Spidey's face and then kicks him in the gut. Wolverine's ready to fight. Spidey backs off.

Wow. Use a non-fight as justification. Spider-Man didn't wanna fight him so he didn't. Pretty simple

Originally posted by riceroost
Spider-Man # 12
Advantage: Wolverine.

Spidey tries to stop Wolverine from investigating a murder. He grabs Wolverine's arm. Wolverine grabs Spidey by the throat and slams him into a tree hard enough to shatter it. He then threatens a helpless Spidey at clawpoint.

Again non-fight. Spider-Man didn't even attack him. All we see is a bit of speed and strength on Wolverine's part against a Spider-Man who wasn't even trying to fight him.

Originally posted by riceroost
Punisher # 34
Advantage: Wolverine.

Wolverine goes nuts and Spidey webs him to a wall. Wolverine rips the wall apart. Spidey flips over Wolverine and grabs his arms from behind. Wolverine back flips and gives Spidey a drop kick to the nards. Spidey is down.

Didn't see this one so won't comment. If it went as you say then I give Logan this one

Originally posted by riceroost
Marvel Knights Spider-Man # 13
Advantage: Wolverine.

In a training session Spidey slams Wolverine into a wall. He then plasters Wolverine to the wall with webbing. Wolverine rips through the webbing and stabs Parker. Parker eventually passes out after the single blow.

Training session. Training. TRAINING. Spider-Man was not expecting Wolverine to seriously attack him. When he got hit he got pissed and attacked Logan who couldn't do anything to stop him. He passed out from his own exertion, not just cause of the blow

Originally posted by riceroost
Marvel Team Up # 1
Advantage: Spider-Man. (Debatable)

Spider-Man webs up an unsuspecting Wolverine and then runs away.

Nice. Downplay the Spider-Man win here. Yet in all your other example when Spider-Man is caught off guard you count it as a win for Wolverine. You don't even put debatable for the others.

Originally posted by riceroost
So yes Metalmanx, Wolverine does look better than Spidey a majority of the time. Your welcome.
You seem to forget that Wolverine has:

No it doesn't. You've shown Wolverine get the drop on Spider-Man in situations where Spider-Man wasn't expecting it or wasn't looking for a fight. Yet you ignore the decisive examples.

Originally posted by riceroost
Jumped off the Shield helicarrier twice AND WAS FINE.

Healing factor and unbreakable skeleton. Course he'll be fine

Originally posted by riceroost
Thrown off Avengers Tower by Spidey AND JOKED ABOUT IT.

Same as above. Why wouldn't he be fine?

Originally posted by riceroost
Fell 80,000 feet from the Earth's atmosphere AND WAS STILL CONSCIOUS.

I wanna know when this was.

Originally posted by riceroost
Dropping Wolverine off buildings wont stop him.

Just web will do this

Originally posted by riceroost
1) Spidey can't hurt Wolverine from the air.

Wolverine can't get Spider-Man from the air yet Spider-man can attack from the skies or even web him to the ground.

Originally posted by riceroost
2) Wolverine can climb walls almost as fast as Spider-Woman can. And that's without the use of his claws. (Madripoor)

But thats not as fast as Spider-Man now is it?

Originally posted by riceroost
3) Spidey loses track of Wolverine while he's up in the air swinging around.

Conjecture. Please show me scans of Spider-Man fighting Wolverine and mentioning that he's lost track of Wolverine. When swinging Spider-man isn't distracted. His spider-sense kicks in so he's really going on instinct. He doesn't suffer an distractions

Originally posted by riceroost
I seem to remember Firelord's reckless stupidity doing most of the damage for Spider-Man.

Of course you would remember it that way

Originally posted by riceroost
Falling off a building for Wolverine is like you or I tripping over the dog. A minor irritant at best. Look above.

True. Eventually he'll pick himself back up.

Originally posted by riceroost
And Wolverine has done the same, but with better results to Spider-Man.
Oh please. Check yourself. Spider-Man has never been on the verge of killing Wolverine, since we have determined that it's pretty much impossible to do. And dont bring up that Spidey breaking adamantium bullshit. You'll only embarass yourself.

I really don't want to get into this again. Neck can be snapped. Beads on a chain. If it couldn't be done then I'm pretty sure Wolverine would've enlightened him to that fact. Don't embarass yourself by insisting it can't be done when Wolverine seems to think so

Originally posted by riceroost
Wolverine was psyching him out. Playing mind games. Wolverine has on the other hand definitely had Spidey at his mercy 3 or 4 times.
Just not as many excuses as Spidey fans make up to explain why Spidey got trounced by Wolverine.

Psyching him out and still getting his ass handed to him. Excuses? The guy that uses Spider-Man not trying to fight against a ready to go Wolverine is gonna tell someone about making excuses?

Originally posted by riceroost
And Wolverine could cut his way to freedom as he has done many times.
We have already established that Spidey's punches and kicks only do minimal damage to Wolverine at best.

Not if he's webbed in a way that prevents use of his claw. ie. MTU

Originally posted by riceroost
Wolverine hits Spidey once.
Fight over.

I'm sure if Wolverine can accomplish this is he gets him while he's sleeping. Wolverine vs Sleeping Spidey. Logan 6/10. Then again...

Originally posted by riceroost
Frank probably has heat vision goggles of some sort and invisibility means squat to Wolverine. Hell Wolverine can turn "invisible" without fancy technology. He's a frikkin ninja. And he's not a dime store hand ninja. He's Snake Eyes with superpowers.

Read the stipulations. Frank doesn't have anything other than his conventional tech. No googles. Frikkin ninja huh? Ninja, meet spider-sense.

Originally posted by riceroost
That doesn't mean Frank can't hurt him. Is it completely bulletproof? Or just against conventional firearms. Frank has been known to carry some heavy duty firepower. Give him a high power sniper rifle with adamantium rounds. Spidey's suit wont stop that.

Suit won't have to. He'll just dodge em

Gotta love those special fanboy goggles that allow you to see everything Wolverine does as a win. He falls off of a building, it's a win. He hits a person when they aren't looking, it's a win. Someone wails on him, he still wins. He's like the street level Superman.
Originally posted by riceroost
Oh, that's a great representation of Wolverine's best senario. Wolverine's best showing involves him plowing through any and all offense by Spider-Man and landing a single blow for the win. Spiderman is faster than Wolverine will ever be in both of their best showings, and seeing as he will never have the strength to break the webbing, well, he isn't plowing through anything. I think that's how YOU see it happening.

Originally posted by riceroost
Frank probably has heat vision goggles of some sort and invisibility means squat to Wolverine. Hell Wolverine can turn "invisible" without fancy technology. He's a frikkin ninja. And he's not a dime store hand ninja. He's Snake Eyes with superpowers. Not only can he jump several stories but he can move several times the speed of sound to be invisible in broad daylight. Wow...

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Spiderman is faster than Wolverine will ever be in both of their best showings, and seeing as he will never have the strength to break the webbing, well, he isn't plowing through anything. I think that's how YOU see it happening.


Yes but if Wolverine's speed is 100 then Spider-man's is 105.. as in not enough to make a difference.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Yes but if Wolverine's speed is 100 then Spider-man's is 105.. as in not enough to make a difference. In a non-jobbing Spiderman. It would be more like 150. The Thor-can't-see-him fast.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
In a non-jobbing Spiderman. It would be more like 150. The Thor-can't-see-him fast.

No that is Spider-man PIS speed so that he doesn't get murdered against superior opponents. Spider-man has been fighting human-esq opponents since the very moment of is creation. Guess what? They all manage to hit him. Chumps like Fancy Dan and Ox... look out he knows Judo! The Vulture, now there is a speed freak. Do you know how long I could keep going on this list? Almost forever. Just read the first 50 issues of Amazing Spider-man to get an idea... you can keep reading the rest if you want an even larger list. Examples of Spider-man being contented with in the speed department both far excite the other and pre date them as well.

We were talking about highest showings regardless of it being bs or not. Hence the "Nuke" feat.

Regardless he would be to enhanced humans what enhanced humans are to normal people.

Spidey ftw

spiderman4

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Regardless he would be to enhanced humans what enhanced humans are to normal people.

Na. He is a tich faster... thats about it.

But... *sigh* if we are counting PIS then I guess that is closer to being accurate.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Yes but if Wolverine's speed is 100 then Spider-man's is 105.. as in not enough to make a difference.

I think the speed difference is far greater than that.

When I see Wolverine dogde a bullet like this, then we can talk.

Not only does that require super reflexes, but super speed to aid those super reflexes as well.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I think the speed difference is far greater than that.

When I see Wolverine dogde a bullet like this, then we can talk.

Not only does that require super reflexes, but super speed to aid those super reflexes as well.

Either is something wrong with that bullet or the guy Spider-man is holding is flailing his arms at multitudes the speed of sound.

It's just an example of bad writing... a singular example at that.

And Wolverine surviving a nuke or Nitro's blast is a good example?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
And Wolverine surviving a nuke or Nitro's blast is a good example?

No, and I didn't bring either of them up...

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
No, and I didn't bring either of them up...

Didn't say you did. Just pointing those two out. Glad you see it my way.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
In a non-jobbing Spiderman. It would be more like 150. The Thor-can't-see-him fast. it's not really correct to say THOR can't see him.. it was eric masterson's mind's eye that had trouble tracking spidey... a human mind's eye (he wasn't using all of THOR'S actual powers) is the same kind of eye that can't track logan either..

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Na. He is a tich faster... thats about it.

But... *sigh* if we are counting PIS then I guess that is closer to being accurate. i don't even know about that.. feat for feat.. they are very similar STILL.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I think the speed difference is far greater than that.

When I see Wolverine dogde a bullet like this, then we can talk.

Not only does that require super reflexes, but super speed to aid those super reflexes as well.

bullets cut bullets out of the air has he not? I think I've also seen him literally catch a bullet... anywho... where is that feat of spiderman from?

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Na. He is a tich faster... thats about it.

But... *sigh* if we are counting PIS then I guess that is closer to being accurate. I still say much faster. If you go only by what an artist portrays them as, guys like Nightwing and BP come close. Peter is still a notch faster.

Originally posted by jinzin




bullets cut bullets out of the air has he not? I think I've also seen him literally catch a bullet... anywho... where is that feat of spiderman from? All the training in the world shouldn't allow someone like Logan to catch a bullet with ease.

Can Logan be similar to Spiderman, I agree here, but for briefer periods of time and with more effort. Spiderman's movement's are like a loaded spring. He's faster, but he moves differently.

Originally posted by jinzin
i don't even know about that.. feat for feat.. they are very similar STILL.


Wolverine cut bullets out of the air has he not? I think I've also seen him literally catch a bullet... anywho... where is that feat of spiderman from?

I'm honestly not sure. But it clearly shows him able to dodge that bullet when it looks inches away from him. Two feet away at the most.

And Spidey has caught a bullet before, too. The other just happened to go through his hand, unfortunately.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
I still say much faster. If you go only by what an artist portrays them as, guys like Nightwing and BP come close. Peter is still a notch faster.

All the training in the world shouldn't allow someone like Logan to catch a bullet with ease.

Can Logan be similar to Spiderman, I agree here, but for briefer periods of time and with more effort. Spiderman's movement's are like a loaded spring. He's faster, but he moves differently.

I don't know I'd say that's debateable.. you have to consider that spiderman's also going to expend his energy faster than wolverine since wolverine will maintain his for a longer period of time.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I'm honestly not sure. But it clearly shows him able to dodge that bullet when it looks inches away from him. Two feet away at the most.

And Spidey has caught a bullet before, too. The other just happened to go through his hand, unfortunately.
proportionally speaking that has to be farther than two feet by a good distance..

Originally posted by jinzin
I don't know I'd say that's debateable.. you have to consider that spiderman's also going to expend his energy faster than wolverine since wolverine will maintain his for a longer period of time. He still has a superhuman metabolism, and his greater strength allows his body to unload more inertia at once... thus making move in greater bursts. He can get tired, but Spiderman is all about movement.

Originally posted by jinzin
proportionally speaking that has to be farther than two feet by a good distance..

I disagree. Look where the bullet is before he even gets the spider-sense message. The bullet is still moving. By the time he actually starts moving, that bullet is definitely within two feet of him.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I'm honestly not sure. But it clearly shows him able to dodge that bullet when it looks inches away from him. Two feet away at the most.

And Spidey has caught a bullet before, too. The other just happened to go through his hand, unfortunately.
he caught one hand gun bullet and then the other one went through his hand.

logan caught a sniper bullet.

sniper bullet>>>>>>>>>>>>hand gun bullet .

Originally posted by capt it up
he caught one hand gun bullet and then the other one went through his hand.

logan caught a sniper bullet.

sniper bullet>>>>>>>>>>>>hand gun bullet .

Scan?

Spider-Man 10/10

Originally posted by capt it up
he caught one hand gun bullet and then the other one went through his hand.

logan caught a sniper bullet.

sniper bullet>>>>>>>>>>>>hand gun bullet .

Wasn't that in a non cannon comic? .

Originally posted by Soljer
Wasn't that in a non cannon comic? .
no it was cannon it talks of both there histories aand even shows logan with bones claws and talks about his time in france during world war 2

Originally posted by capt it up
no it was cannon it talks of both there histories aand even shows logan with bones claws and talks about his time in frances during wolrd war 2

Scans, merce?

Originally posted by Soljer
Scans, merce?
don't have my comic at school nor do I own a scanner. go read the issue is speaks of the past and current logan. it shows him with bone claws and with adamatium claws it cannon.

Originally posted by capt it up
don't have my comic at school nor do I own a scanner. go read the issue is speaks of the past and current logan. it shows him with bone claws and with adamatium claws it cannon.

Uhh, unless I'm blind, you didn't post an issue number. How am I supposed to go read it ?

Originally posted by Soljer
Uhh, unless I'm blind, you didn't post an issue number. How am I supposed to go read it ?
my bad it wolverine/ darkness # 1

Originally posted by capt it up
my bad it wolverine/ darkness # 1

Yeah, I thought it was the Darkness cross-over.

The non-cannon Darkness Crossover.

.

Originally posted by Soljer
Yeah, I thought it was the Darkness cross-over.

The non-cannon Darkness Crossover.

.

it not non-cannon since it talks about events logan was in. it also shows logan with bones claws and then 50 years later he has admatium claws. it quite cannon actaully.

Originally posted by capt it up
it not non-cannon since it talks about events logan was in. it also shows logan with bones claws and then 50 years later he has admatium claws. it quite cannon actaully.

....

I can draw a comic in MS paint that shows Wolverine with Bone and Adamantium claws.

Your argument for that making it cannon is flawed.

Originally posted by Soljer
....

I can draw a comic in MS paint that shows Wolverine with Bone and Adamantium claws.

Your argument for that making it cannon is flawed.
not at all. The events from the past that were memories of both logan and darkness talk of world war 2 and france were logan was and that has been shown in his comic that he was indeed a soldier in war world 2 and spent time in france making there ristances much stronger. They also talk about wolverine has been up grade because when darkness firts faced him he had bone claws which was true during that time. then they talk about how he had an up grade and got metal ones which was becuase of weapon x program. also he remeber back to when he faced darkness the first time meaning he had his memories back which he has recovered recently.

Don't many non-canon comics also include many canon aspects as well?

Such as What-Ifs and the Ultimate Universes (like their powers and names for example).

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Don't many non-canon comics also include many canon aspects as well?

Such as What-Ifs and the Ultimate Universes (like their powers and names for example).
not at all ultimate is a nother universe.

what ifs are another universe.


wolverine darkness is the same universe and show examples through the issue that prove it is indeed cannon.


wolverien vs deathstroke was not cannon ebcuase it did not talk about either history and had no evidence of past events and such like wolverine vs darkness showed

Originally posted by capt it up
not at all ultimate is a nother universe.

what ifs are another universe.


wolverine darkness is the same universe and show examples through the issue that prove it is indeed cannon.


wolverien vs deathstroke was not cannon ebcuase it did not talk about either history and had no evidence of past events and such like wolverine vs darkness showed

Actually, looking back, using the Ultimate Universe was a bad example. Forget I said that.

What Ifs aren't another universe...

Originally posted by Metalmanx
When I see Wolverine dogde a bullet like this, then we can talk.Uncanny # 211. Wolverine does the same exact thing, except he dodges an optic blast (optic blast >>>>>>>bullets) and still has enough time to pull Storm out of the way. Wolverine was also VERY distracted when he pulled out this feat as he had just discovered that Jean Grey was still alive. There, we've talked and Wolverine is easily still in the game.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Not only does that require super reflexes, but super speed to aid those super reflexes as well. And it's a good thing Wolverine's speed and reflexes are both enhanced.
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
All the training in the world shouldn't allow someone like Logan to catch a bullet with ease.Training isn't what allows him to do it. How do you train a man to catch bullets??? Since no one can train you to do it it must be done via superpowers of some kind. Or just random DD/Bats BS.
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
He still has a superhuman metabolism, and his greater strength allows his body to unload more inertia at once... thus making move in greater bursts. He can get tired, but Spiderman is all about movement. Doesn't even Hulk get tired after a few massive leaps? Isn't his strength and endurance greater than Spidey?
Originally posted by Soljer
Wasn't that in a non cannon comic? Written by Frank Tieri, one of the best Wolverine writers of our time. It may be non-cannon, but Tieri is still a reliable source for Wolverine. It even fit in nicely with Wolverine's whereabouts during WW2.

Doesn't matter anyway as Logan has blocked bullets with his hands and claws several times in normal books and his perception, reflexes, speed, are all highly developed enough to allow him to hit optic blasts like they are coach pitch slow-balls. (Wolverine Origins) If he can do that to Cyclops then bullets are a cake walk.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Actually, looking back, using the Ultimate Universe was a bad example. Forget I said that.

What Ifs aren't another universe...
yes They are and they say so in the begging of them that they differ from the normal marvel universe.

Spiderman's reflexes can operate as much as forty times faster than a normal human being's - how fast is Wolverine's reflexes?

Originally posted by Dreampanther
Spiderman's reflexes can operate as much as forty times faster than a normal human being's - how fast is Wolverine's reflexes?
well he was stated to see bullets in slow motion

Originally posted by riceroost
Uncanny # 211. Wolverine does the same exact thing, except he dodges an optic blast (optic blast >>>>>>>bullets) and still has enough time to pull Storm out of the way. Wolverine was also VERY distracted when he pulled out this feat as he had just discovered that Jean Grey was still alive. There, we've talked and Wolverine is easily still in the game.
And it's a good thing Wolverine's speed and reflexes are both enhanced.
Training isn't what allows him to do it. How do you train a man to catch bullets??? Since no one can train you to do it it must be done via superpowers of some kind. Or just random DD/Bats BS.
Doesn't even Hulk get tired after a few massive leaps? Isn't his strength and endurance greater than Spidey?
Written by Frank Tieri, one of the best Wolverine writers of our time. It may be non-cannon, but Tieri is still a reliable source for Wolverine. It even fit in nicely with Wolverine's whereabouts during WW2.

Doesn't matter anyway as Logan has blocked bullets with his hands and claws several times in normal books and his perception, reflexes, speed, are all highly developed enough to allow him to hit optic blasts like they are coach pitch slow-balls. (Wolverine Origins) If he can do that to Cyclops then bullets are a cake walk.

Bull. I've seen the scan of the issue you speak of. The optic blast was't even fired before Wolverine knocked Storm down. He's not faster than the speed of light, not even by reaction time.

By some shitty writing, he was able to sense the attack coming before it came, and managed to get Storm down BEFORE Cyke fired. As crappy as this is, it makes so much more sense than Wolvie just plain dodging an already-fired, accurate optic blast.

What are some CANON examples of Wolverine catching bullets?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Bull. I've seen the scan of the issue you speak of. The optic blast was't even fired before Wolverine knocked Storm down. He's not faster than the speed of light, not even by reaction time.

By some shitty writing, he was able to sense the attack coming before it came, and managed to get Storm down BEFORE Cyke fired. As crappy as this is, it makes so much more sense than Wolvie just plain dodging an already-fired, accurate optic blast.

What are some CANON examples of Wolverine catching bullets?
that issue was cannon. you have yet to prove it not. actualy scots blast was already fire because logan even mentions that he senses the vibration in the air

Originally posted by riceroost
Written by Frank Tieri, one of the best Wolverine writers of our time. It may be non-cannon, but Tieri is still a reliable source for Wolverine. It even fit in nicely with Wolverine's whereabouts during WW2.

Talk to your boy, Capt. He says it's non-canon. And he sounds pretty confident about it.

Originally posted by capt it up
that issue was cannon. you have yet to prove it not. actualy scots blast was already fire because logan even mentions that he senses the vibration in the air

It's literally and comically not possible for Wolverine to do that.

Are you ACTUALLY going to sit there and believe that Wolverine has light-speed reaction speed?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Talk to your boy, Capt. He says it's non-canon. And he sounds pretty confident about it.
well he wrong. it cannon all evidence points to it.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
It's literally and comically not possible for Wolverine to do that.

Are you ACTUALLY going to sit there and believe that Wolverine has light-speed reaction speed?
who says scots blast move at light speed? not to mention you have no problem with spiderman doing it but when logan does it you have a problem?

Originally posted by capt it up
well he wrong. it cannon all evidence points to it.

Just the fact that there are conflicting thoughts on it leads me to believe it shouldn't even be counted. If you can't even determine if its canon or not, then well, I dunno what to tell you.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Just the fact that there are conflicting thoughts on it leads me to believe it shouldn't even be counted. If you can't even determine if its canon or not, then well, I dunno what to tell you.
you guys dont want it cannon cuz of the feat but the fact is it shows parts of logans past the occured in his series makign it cannon it even shows and talks about the fact he was up graded. the fact is it cannon.

Originally posted by capt it up
who says scots blast move at light speed? not to mention you have no problem with spiderman doing it but when logan does it you have a problem?

I never said Spider-Man has light-speed reactions. And never will.

I believe it was actually recently stated in X-Men (the one with Rogue leading a team). The caption implied that Scott's optic blasts move at the speed of light.

Which really...wouldn't make sense any other way. I mean, it's light. Light moves at an established speed.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I never said Spider-Man has light-speed reactions. And never will.

I believe it was actually recently stated in X-Men (the one with Rogue leading a team). The caption implied that Scott's optic blasts move at the speed of light.

Which really...wouldn't make sense any other way. I mean, it's light. Light moves at an established speed.
it not truely light. also logan has dodge scots blast on a number of occassions. hell arnt you the one that always posts spiderman dodging lasers?

Originally posted by capt it up
you guys dont want it cannon cuz of the feat but the fact is it shows parts of logans past the occured in his series makign it cannon it even shows and talks about the fact he was up graded. the fact is it cannon.

Not true. It's more because I've never seen him able to catch a bullet before, so it strikes me as ludicrous. But I don't mind being proven wrong.

Nontheless. Spider-Man's feats speak for themselves as well. He would beat Wolverine in a fight. Of course, you're only going to apply the cross-overs against Wolverine, but when you see everything else he's done to everyone not-Wolverine (and even Wolverine at times, too), I think it's pretty clear that Spidey would be the winner.

Originally posted by capt it up
it not truely light. also logan has dodge scots blast on a number of occassions. hell arnt you the one that always posts spiderman dodging lasers?

...Come on, capt.

Spider-sense. Spiiiiddeeerr-seeeeeeense.

And has Wolverine TRULY dodged an optic blast? Or just managed to be ahead of Scott's vision? Because the former would be impossible, unless he manages to move IF he sees Scott's finger pressing on the button in time.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Not true. It's more because I've never seen him able to catch a bullet before, so it strikes me as ludicrous. But I don't mind being proven wrong.

Nontheless. Spider-Man's feats speak for themselves as well. He would beat Wolverine in a fight. Of course, you're only going to apply the cross-overs against Wolverine, but when you see everything else he's done to everyone not-Wolverine (and even Wolverine at times, too), I think it's pretty clear that Spidey would be the winner.
ilol logan would win. logans feats speak for them self. such as dodging cable gun fire at point blank. such as cut a rocket bullet in mid air. how about logan not only cutting bullets out of mid air but perfectly dirrecting them into another person.

hell when has spiderman shown that he should catch bullets? he did it once true but besides that he neevr done a feat that would make you think he could while logan on the other hand has done many similar feats to catching bullets

Originally posted by capt it up
ilol logan would win. logans feats speak for them self. such as dodging cable gun fire at point blank. such as cut a rocket bullet in mid air. how about logan not only cutting bullets out of mid air but perfectly dirrecting them into another person.

hell when has spiderman shown that he should catch bullets? he did it once true but besides that he neevr done a feat that would make you think he could while logan on the other hand has done many similar feats to catching bullets

Unlike Logan who can take lots of gunfire, why in the hell would Spidey want to catch bullets in his hands when he can, even EASIER might I add, dodge them entirely?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
...Come on, capt.

Spider-sense. Spiiiiddeeerr-seeeeeeense.

And has Wolverine TRULY dodged an optic blast? Or just managed to be ahead of Scott's vision? Because the former would be impossible, unless he manages to move IF he sees Scott's finger pressing on the button in time.
read the weapon x noval it is explain it in detail. logan sense work like spidersense almost