Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Al-Kindi, one of the early Christian apologists against Islam, pointed out that Islam and its god Allah did not come from the Bible but from the paganism of the Sabeans. They did not worship the God of the Bible but the Moon-god and his daughters al-Uzza, al-Lat and Manat. Dr. Newman concludes his study of the early Christian-Muslim debates by stating, "Islam proved itself to be...a separate and antagonistic religion which had sprung up from idolatry." Islamic scholar Caesar Farah concluded "There is no reason, therefore, to accept the idea that Allah passed to the Muslims from the Christians and Jews." The Arabs worshipped the Moon-god as a supreme deity. But this was not biblical monotheism. While the Moon-god was greater than all other gods and goddesses, this was still a polytheistic pantheon of deities. Now that we have the actual idols of the Moon-god, it is no longer possible to avoid the fact that Allah was a pagan god in pre-Islamic times. Is it any wonder then that the symbol of Islam is the crescent moon? That a crescent moon sits on top of their mosques and minarets? That a crescent moon is found on the flags of Islamic nations? That the Muslims fast during the month which begins and ends with the appearance of the crescent moon in the sky?

CONCLUSION
The pagan Arabs worshipped the Moon-god Allah by praying toward Mecca several times a day; making a pilgrimage to Mecca; running around the temple of the Moon-god called the Kabah; kissing the black stone; killing an animal in sacrifice to the Moon-god; throwing stones at the devil; fasting for the month which begins and ends with the crescent moon; giving alms to the poor, etc.

The Muslim's claim that Allah is the God of the Bible and that Islam arose from the religion of the prophets and apostles is refuted by solid, overwhelming archeological evidence. Islam is nothing more than a revival of the ancient Moon-god cult. It has taken the symbols, the rites, the ceremonies, and even the name of its god from the ancient pagan religion of the Moon-god. As such, it is sheer idolatry and must be rejected by all those who follow the Torah and Gospel. moongod.htm

Yeshua Communications Network.
Copyright 1997-8, All Rights Reserved.
http://www.yeshua.co.uk

http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/



(Received from THE AP LIST - Meri Burlingame [email protected])

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ex-Moslems report why they chose Jesus

Christians from 39 nations and 50 ethnic groups are represented in a study of some 600 ex-Moslems carried out by Fuller Theological Institute's Professor Dudley Woodberry. They speak of the reasons why they decided to leave Islam to follow Jesus, even in the face of heavy persecution, sacrifice and death threats.

The most important results:
- a growing number of Moslems are turning to Jesus;
- a growing number of small groups are meeting in secret, hiding their new faith even from their own families.

The most frequently mentioned reasons for conversion were:

1. Certainty of Salvation: according to Islamic tradition (Hadith), the bridge to heaven "is only as wide as a hair; not even good deeds guarantee admission to Paradise." Many were attracted by the certainty of salvation in Jesus.

2. Christ's character is particularly attractive: "He does not retaliate, is humble, loves the poor and outcasts; the power of his love is unique, and one can enter a relationship with him, completely different to Islam, in which a personal relationship with God is unthinkable."

3. Christians' character: "Christians are the only people who really work for justice for the poor and repressed; Christians' unconditional love, and their peaceful and contented aura are very noticeable."

4. Dreams and visions: over 25% said that dreams and visions were decisive in them finding Christ. Jesus very frequently appears to Moslems as a white figure:

- One believer from Guinea recounts the dream of a figure in a white robe, calling the man to come to Him. In a related dream, he recalls that the same figure's arms were extended, beckoning him. He now knows that the figure was Christ.

- A convert from the Middle East who had been afflicted with severe headaches was lying on his bed after having prayed for his sick son. A man with a beautiful, peaceful face appeared. Dressed in white, the figure walked to the head of the man's bed and touched him three times on the head. The next morning his headaches were gone. His son, too, was fully healed.

- A West African man had a clear vision of a devout Moslem in hell and a poor Christian, who had been unable to give alms, in heaven. A voice explained to him that the difference was belief in Jesus.

5. Supernatural experiences: a number of ex-Moslems had supernatural experiences which were decisive in them finding Christ. An Egyptian Moslem was reading the gospels, and had just reached Luke 3 when a strong wind entered the room, and a voice said "I am Jesus Christ, whom you hate. I am the Lord you are seeking." "I cried and cried, and decided to follow Jesus that day," he remembers.


Source: http://www.missionfrontiers.org

http://www.ericbarger.com/whoisallah.htm

You ... you know that Christian Middle Eaterners also worhip "Allah," right? I mean, it's just "God" in a different language.

"Who is Allah?" The Judeo-Christian God. Next question?

When I saw this thread I knew you would post it, because people had already explained to you what Allah is, but you being so ignorant, thought this was a better idea.

You've already tried this when people told you Jesus is an idol. And where did it get you?

Originally posted by lord xyz
Allah is the Arabic name for God. Did you know that Arabic Christians and Jews say Allah aswell? obviously not.

Allah is taken from a contraction of the Arabic words al, "the", and ilah, "deity, masculine form", to form alilah, "the god".

Before Muhammad, Allah was used by Jews.

Allah was taken from the Hebrew language, directly from Eloah, the Hebrew term for deity.

Using your logic:

Arabs used the Hebrew word Eloah, God, to create the term Allah, the One God.

Pagan Arabs used the term Allah to name the Moon God

Islam uses Allah in reference to the God of Abraham
Your logic states that thus Islam is worshipping the Moon God, because the term was used in reference to the Moon God first.

Thus, the same logic must apply to the preceding series, so the Arabs worshipping the Moon God were really worshipping the Hebrew God, because the term was used in reference to the Hebrew God first.

Thus, all three were worshipping the Hebrew God by reason of deduction, using your logic.


Don't use stupid logic if you can help it JIA, the first posts and argument presented with this thread are a blatant example of stupid logic.

Who is Allah? (Have I become your enemy because I tell you the truth?)

Originally posted by Regret
(Have I become your enemy because I tell you the truth?)

Considering JIA is against truth....its very likely.

MODS, do we have to keep putting up with this??

How bout compiling all this guy's threads into one. Cause its the same thing over and over and over......................

ALLAH IS GOD!!!!!!

Originally posted by Gregory
You ... you know that Christian Middle Eaterners also worhip "Allah," right? I mean, it's just "God" in a different language.

"Who is Allah?" The Judeo-Christian God. Next question?

Exactly. "Allah" just means "god" in Arabic.

In Spanish "dios" means "god". So is "Dios" a complete and sepereate god from the Christian god?, no. Its just a word meaning "god".

JIA you are not a very social person are you, never the life of the party huh?

Originally posted by crazy
JIA you are not a very social person are you, never the life of the party huh?

I do believe this thread is his response to my criticising his approach to Fatimah and his/her beliefs in another thread.

Now if I could just find some way to make him answer questions I have actually asked him...

But anyway I'll have some fun - since JIA wants to use sites of questionable legitimacy in regards to "Muslims becoming Christian"...

http://thetruereligion.org/modules/xfsection/index.php?category=1

Some Christian priests and missionaries who have converted to Islam

http://www.islamfortoday.com/converts.htm#COTW

Or people of all walks of life convert

How about that... Christians convert to Islam, Muslims convert to Christianity... seems to me JIA that it is like always - no religion has a monopoly on being right, and as such people change to what they think is correct. Clearly your faith isn't the only one that has the ring of truth for people. Personally neither ring true for me, so I'll stick with my current view.

And you know, for some reason I am dubious from the get go when your base you "moon God" claim on an article from "Biblebelievers.com." And when they are based upon the writings of "Eric Barger" - evangelist and muck raker. Talks out against Harry Potter and Dungeons & Dragons - the guy who thinks the world is being invaded by occult forces spear headed by fantasy fiction and goths and Wicca. Woah, were do you get these people from JIA? Oh wait, BibleBelievers.com. Never mind.

And much of this is based on the works of other noted muck-raker Robert Morey... lets have a look at him...



Hmmmm - how about that! JIA... promoting the claims of a Chick Tract publicist, whose views have widely been discredited by the historical and theological community. JIA drawing upon theories worth less then the paper they are written on? Who would have guessed.

And wasn't he also the chap who made the statement about how he was watching terrorists and they already had nukes in the US and how WWIII will be caused by Muslims? Oh JIA, you kill me. Hmmm, and as I continue to read... why, there is controversy over his credentials - it appears he may have committed academic fraud. How very sad.

And whats this, even Christian historians seem embarrassed by him. Thanks JIA, I had a good laugh, now I shall continue to do my exam revision using actually reputable people who stand up to massive amounts of scrutiny, unlike these two who get knocked over by the merest wiff of fact.

Well, I believe Chirstianity is the only religion losing adherents.

Originally posted by Alliance
Well, I believe Chirstianity is the only religion losing adherents.

Oh, I agree there - it is the one in quickest decline out of the big three. Which makes its claims of being the one true religion even harder to swallow. It is really hard to believe if God was with the Christians their religion would lack any divine pull.

Maybe it is because it is championed by people like Barger, Chick and Morey.

Seriously, am I the only one not surprised that I can trace the entire foundation of JIA's claims back to Chick publications?

No.

Big three being Christianity, Islam, and Non-Religious?

Originally posted by Alliance

Big three being Christianity, Islam, and Non-Religious?

Actually that is what I was thinking, but I didn't want to start a whole "is Atheism a religion" in this thread as well.

I find myself hoping I will be around in 2070 because I would love to see the religious and philosophical landscape at that point.

Very different with the US scraping the bottom of the moral pot.

Originally posted by Alliance
Very different with the US scraping the bottom of the moral pot.

Which is why Christian will always claim is because "The US isn't Christian enough."

Imperial I was doing research on Jack Chick's resources so I also came across Islamic Invasion and I was amazed at how many people actually believed what he wrote. I was reading some reviews on amazon, and there is an interesting one that shows how BS his book really is.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/1931230072/ref=cm_cr_dp_2_1/102-3886636-5605739?ie=UTF8&customer-reviews.sort%5Fb

Check out the 5th one from the top by Nick Waves

Originally posted by crazy
Imperial I was doing research on Jack Chick's resources so I also came across Islamic Invasion and I was amazed at how many people actually believed what he wrote. I was reading some reviews on amazon, and there is an interesting one that shows how BS his book really is.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/1931230072/ref=cm_cr_dp_2_1/102-3886636-5605739?ie=UTF8&customer-reviews.sort%5Fb

Check out the 5th one from the top by Nick Waves

Nick Waves did a great job there, and seems to have covered all the most fundamental problems with Morey's "theory" - it is horrible to think though so many people could have given the book 5 stars.

I comfort myself thinking "it was probably Morey himself writing them."

I'll post it here for others to read:



The cover made me laugh as well. I swear it looks so much like those covers they put on spy novels in the late 80s, you know, all the ones to do with Soviet plots being foiled by Americans with large chins and guns that never run out of bullets.

Anyway - JIA, is this another thread you have started but wont return to defend?

Course, it wouldn't hurt to pull out the ol' "Ahura-Mazda" connection...

JIA in an attempt to provide facts for you argument, you have failed. I am glad you took the time to RAID an uncertified website, and took all that time to COPY AND PASTE your information instead of typing out your own researched material.....

But the fact remains that "Allah" is an Arabic term meaning "God" thereby killing your entire argument into a shithole....

Good Night JIA

I was going to post it but I did not because I did it a while ago and it looked kind of messy but unlike me, you used the quote function which makes it look better.

It is just hilarious that he made a book out of nothing and got so many people to buy into it, well I guess it should surprise me though.

Originally posted by crazy

It is just hilarious that he made a book out of nothing and got so many people to buy into it, well I guess it should surprise me though.

Which is the key to undeserved success - play on peoples fears and dislikes, publish something that justifies their irrational feelings, and you'll make a bundle as they snap it up in order to justify and validate themselves.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Exactly. "Allah" just means "god" in Arabic.

In Spanish "dios" means "god". So is "Dios" a complete and sepereate god from the Christian god?, no. Its just a word meaning "god".

Well, by JIA's logic you worship a different God you ****ing heathen! So if you do not want to end up in hell, you better stop worshipping this "Dios" guy and worship Jesus-God.

Are God and Allah One and the Same?


The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (i.e. Israel) and Allah are not the same deity. I could go on enumerating the many reasons why this is true but I would be here until Christmas so I will defer to others who have already done the legwork.

Although I will list some of the most basic reasons why God and Allah are not one and the same here they are:

1. God has a Son but Allah denies having a Son.
2. God is Triune but Allah denies being triune.
3. God's Son Jesus was killed by crucifixion but Allah denies this fact.
4. God is Love (this is Who He is) but Allah is never called love.
5. God's covenant Name is YHWH not Allah. YHWH is never called Allah in the Bible, and Allah is never called YHWH in the Qu'ran (Koran).
6. The Bible never mentions Mecca nor Medina, but mentions Jerusalem 814 times! However the Koran never mentions Jerusalem.
7. God's special treasure (the Jews) are a people that He has chosen for Himself. The God of the Bible has set His love upon the Jews. Allah states in the Qu'ran,

Sura 5:51
51 O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.

These are just seven reasons/facts that confute the fallacy/untruth that the God of the Bible and Allah are the same God. They are not the same God. Those who mendaciously assert that they are the same must deal with these scathing contradictions.



http://www.letusreason.org/Islam6.htm

http://www.kingmessiahproject.com/is_allah_not_God.html

http://www.menorah.org/allahtrc.html

http://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/god.htm

Sorry, sorry, I couldn't help myself. Reading more about Morey... he is hilarious.

From his own site http://www.faithdefenders.com/ministry/articles/

http://www.faithdefenders.com/ministry/deskof/drmorey/



Liberals stealing evangelical schools? Ecumenical whorehouses? Oh my he could have been a comedian. Or some person sentencing simple women to death by burning for Witchcraft.



For some reason this made me think "Darth Mormon and the Evil Empire must be stopped!"



WTF?

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Are God and Allah One and the Same?


The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (i.e. Israel) and Allah are not the same deity. I could go on enumerating the many reasons why this is true but I would be here until Christmas so I will defer to others who have already done the legwork.

Although I will list some of the most basic reasons why God and Allah are not one and the same here they are:

1. God has a Son but Allah denies having a Son.
2. God is Triune but Allah denies being triune.
3. God's Son Jesus was killed by crucifixion but Allah denies this fact.
4. God is Love (this is Who He is) but Allah is never called love.
5. God's covenant Name is YHWH not Allah. YHWH is never called Allah in the Bible, and Allah is never called YHWH in the Qu'ran (Koran).
6. The Bible never mentions Mecca nor Medina, but mentions Jerusalem 814 times! However the Koran never mentions Jerusalem.
7. God's special treasure (the Jews) are a people that He has chosen for Himself. The God of the Bible has set His love upon the Jews. Allah states in the Qu'ran,

Sura 5:51
51 O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.

These are just seven reasons/facts that confute the fallacy/untruth that the God of the Bible and Allah are the same God. They are not the same God. Those who mendaciously assert that they are the same must deal with these scathing contradictions.



http://www.letusreason.org/Islam6.htm

http://www.kingmessiahproject.com/is_allah_not_God.html

http://www.menorah.org/allahtrc.html

http://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/god.htm

Jews deny Jesus to be God's son and God, Jews deny God's three faces, Jews deny that Jesus died for our sins and only through Jesus can eternal salvation be had... So, do the Jews who worship the God of Abraham worship a different God than Christians?

Point being, they ARE the same God, the difference lies in practices, views and ways of worship. End the lunacy JIA.

Originally posted by Robtard
Jews deny Jesus to be God's son and God, Jews deny God's three faces, Jews deny that Jesus died for our sins and only through Jesus can eternal salvation be had... So, do the Jews who worship the God of Abraham worship a different God than Christians?

Point being, they ARE the same God, the difference lies in practices, views and ways of worship.

You failed to address the contradictions as usual.

Originally posted by Robtard
Jews deny Jesus to be God's son, Jews deny God's three faces, Jews Deny that Jesus died for our sins... So, do the Jews who worship the God of Abraham worship a different God than Christians?

Point being, they ARE the same God, the difference lies in practices, views and ways of worship.

Indeed.

JIA you have failed to address most everything else. posted here, from the criticism of sources onwards.

There is no validity in the claim that Allah is a moon God, or that the Muslims worship a moon God. There is more evidence supporting theories regarding Christian links to solar deities.

Second - there is a good reason why religious scholars classify The Muslim God as The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob - because it is. The religion has its roots there. The fact their holy text is different from the Bible is only as relevant as the fact the Jewish religious text is different from the Bible.

Each religion has its own religious texts that justifies why they are correct and the others aren't.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Indeed.

JIA you have failed to address most everything else. posted here, from the criticism of sources onwards.

There is no validity in the claim that Allah is a moon God, or that the Muslims worship a moon God. There is more evidence supporting theories regarding Christian links to solar deities.

Second - there is a good reason why religious scholars classify The Muslim God as The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob - because it is. The religion has its roots there. The fact their holy text is different from the Bible is only as relevant as the fact the Jewish religious text is different from the Bible.

Each religion has its own religious texts that justifies why they are correct and the others aren't.

Saying that there is no validity (which anyone can do including a smily) and proving that there is no validity (this is where we separate the men from the boys) is a horse of a different color.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
You failed to address the contradictions as usual.

No, I admit that there are indeed differences, but you have failed to see past your bias. Just as the Jewish faith has "contradictions" as you put it, it doesn't take away that both Jews and Christians worship the same God, the God of Abraham. The same goes for Muslims, the difference lies in certain views, practices and methods of worship as it does with Jews and Christians. The Qur'an states that Allah (God) spoke to only two men, Moses and then Muhammad, if Islam is not based on the God of Abraham, why is Moses mentioned?

On that note, different Christian denominations have "contradictions" with each other, but they still worship the same God at root.

Saying that the bible is truth and proving that the Bible is truth is a horse of a different colour.

Especially when one can so easily provide evidence of the mulititude of "appropriated" ideas, symbols and stories.

What's the colour of hypocrisy? The KMC religion forum has made me think dark blue.

Originally posted by Robtard
No, I admit that there are indeed differences, but you have failed to see past your bias. Just as the Jewish faith has "contradictions" as you put it, it doesn't take away that both Jews and Christians worship the same God, the God of Abraham. The same goes for Muslims, the difference lies in certain views, practices and methods of worship as it does with Jews and Christians. The Qur'an states that Allah (God) spoke to only two men, Moses and then Muhammad, if Islam is not based on the God of Abraham, why is Moses mentioned?

On that note, different Christian denominations have "contradictions" with each other, but they still worship the same God at root. I repeat, you have failed to address the contradictions.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I repeat, you have failed to address the contradictions.

Do you suffer from spiritual glaucoma? I have addressed and explained your "contradictions" in the posts above.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
You failed to address the contradictions. Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
JIA you have failed to address most everything posted here, from the criticism of sources onwards.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Saying that there is no validity (which anyone can do including a smily) and proving that there is no validity (this is where we separate the men from the boys) is a horse of a different color.

And that is not an argument.

Give me a single reason to think that his claims - which are not accepted by the religious history community - have any validity. It is up to the prosecution to prove the case.

And tell me - is Jack Chick your one stop shop for all your views? You mock me in other threads for demanding a standard of quality from sources, yet everything you use seems to come from a tiny little group orbiting Chick Publications - do you want me to post the question regarding his claims again? Or the reasons why they have been debunked?

It has been said by many why attacks based on the name Allah are not legitimate reasons to strip it of its status as a divinity of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Nor is there any support for the proposition Allah is a moon God.

I can provide some names of Christian scholars who do not accept the claims - would your head explode if I presented a Christian scholar, who hasn't even been accused of academic fraud, who doesn't agree?

Fact remains you are claiming Biblical claims invalidate Allah - include ones erroneously based upon the word "Allah" - which as others have mentioned was even used by Jews because it is the word for God in that language (as opposed to ones derived from the Greek root.)

The Jews don't recognise Jesus as the son of God, and their holy text doesn't acknowledged him, and since they predated both Christianity and Islam maybe Christianity also deserves to be stripped of its status of a religion of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. The Bible is not a foundation for your claims, history must be, and history does not support what your are saying. Islam is decended from Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob just like Christianity and Hebrew are. You can say till the cows come home "buuuuut the Bible says and the Koran doesn't" but that isn't changing anything.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
The Jews don't recognise Jesus as the son of God, and their holy text doesn't acknowledged him, and since they predated both Christianity and Islam maybe Christianity also deserves to be stripped of its status of a religion of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Interesting, one could make the same accusation based on similar "contradictions" as JIA puts it to separate Christianity from "The God of Abraham".

Originally posted by Robtard
Interesting, one could make the same accusation based on similar "contradictions" as JIA puts it to separate Christianity from "The God of Abraham".

Exactly.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Sura 5:51
51 O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.
This is actually widely regarded as a mistranslation of the Qu'ran. The actual translation states 'patrons,' not friends.

"It is obvious that Jews patronize the Jews and Christians patronize the Christians, so why not Muslims patronize Muslims and support their own people. This verse is not telling us to be against Jews or Christians, but it is telling us that we should take care of our own people and we must support each other."

http://www.authenticsunnah.org/sami_zaatri/friends.htm

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Are God and Allah One and the Same?


The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (i.e. Israel) and Allah are not the same deity. I could go on enumerating the many reasons why this is true but I would be here until Christmas so I will defer to others who have already done the legwork.

Although I will list some of the most basic reasons why God and Allah are not one and the same here they are:

1. God has a Son but Allah denies having a Son.
2. God is Triune but Allah denies being triune.
3. God's Son Jesus was killed by crucifixion but Allah denies this fact.
4. God is Love (this is Who He is) but Allah is never called love.
5. God's covenant Name is YHWH not Allah. YHWH is never called Allah in the Bible, and Allah is never called YHWH in the Qu'ran (Koran).
6. The Bible never mentions Mecca nor Medina, but mentions Jerusalem 814 times! However the Koran never mentions Jerusalem.
7. God's special treasure (the Jews) are a people that He has chosen for Himself. The God of the Bible has set His love upon the Jews. Allah states in the Qu'ran,

Sura 5:51
51 O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.

These are just seven reasons/facts that confute the fallacy/untruth that the God of the Bible and Allah are the same God. They are not the same God. Those who mendaciously assert that they are the same must deal with these scathing contradictions.



http://www.letusreason.org/Islam6.htm

http://www.kingmessiahproject.com/is_allah_not_God.html

http://www.menorah.org/allahtrc.html

http://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/god.htm




Quran mention the Aqsa mosqe in Jerusalem ,

God is one ..

in bible,quran ,torah, but there are people add wrong ideas in bible , i cant understand why god has son

Originally posted by Strangelove
This is actually widely regarded as a mistranslation of the Qu'ran. The actual translation states 'patrons,' not friends.

"It is obvious that Jews patronize the Jews and Christians patronize the Christians, so why not Muslims patronize Muslims and support their own people. This verse is not telling us to be against Jews or Christians, but it is telling us that we should take care of our own people and we must support each other."

http://www.authenticsunnah.org/sami_zaatri/friends.htm

Well, in JIA's case, it's pretty much the same thing, since he's sure to patronize any Muslim he comes accross

(I'm sorry ... it just slipped out...)

Did anyone even read what I said about Arabic Christians and Jews saying Allah aswell?

I think everybody in this thread read it, except possibly for the person you were addressing.

Yes, I agree with that. Allah is the name of god, not the name of the Kaaba.

(Incedentally, a Kabbah is a Mayan prayerstone.)

I'm not Muslim, but Allah is God by a different name.

Originally posted by Gregory
I think everybody in this thread read it, except possibly for the person you were addressing. Any thread started by JIA, I already know his point before I click on it. So there's no point to read his post.

No, I mean I don't think he read your post. Or if he did, he decided to ignore it.

I see... It makes perfect sense now.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
You failed to address the contradictions as usual.

Haha, are you really saying this? Just wow.




Exactly what I was thinking...

Originally posted by Alliance
Very different with the US scraping the bottom of the moral pot.
Ugh. I'm almost delighted to see how far we'll have fallen then.
Originally posted by Robtard
Jews deny Jesus to be God's son and God, Jews deny God's three faces, Jews deny that Jesus died for our sins and only through Jesus can eternal salvation be had... So, do the Jews who worship the God of Abraham worship a different God than Christians?

Point being, they ARE the same God, the difference lies in practices, views and ways of worship. End the lunacy JIA.
I too was considering this. It all depends on how strictly one defines "being the same."

Originally posted by BobbyD
I'm not Muslim, but Allah is God by a different name. A God by any other name would be just as ineffective

ALLAH BABA !

Allah promises me 72 Virgins....Jehovah promises me eternal orgasm..i duno, it's a hard choice to make....

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
ALLAH BABA !

Allah promises me 72 Virgins....Jehovah promises me eternal orgasm..i duno, it's a hard choice to make....

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
ALLAH BABA !

Allah promises me 72 Virgins....Jehovah promises me eternal orgasm..i duno, it's a hard choice to make....

My God (He Who is Yet to Be Named) promises both. At the same time. And the Virgins will somehow magical remain virgins while you experience your eternal orgasm.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
ALLAH BABA !

Allah promises me 72 Virgins....Jehovah promises me eternal orgasm..i duno, it's a hard choice to make....

If you were eternally orgasming...that gets boring.

Take the virgins and enjoy the chase.

Originally posted by Alliance
Take the virgins and enjoy the chase.

I like the way this guy thinks.

Okay, what this boils down to is that Allah is a moon god because islamic nations use the crescent moon as their symbol. I find it laughable that all the christian symbolism isn't mentioned to deflect his/her/it's arguments. Archetypes and symbolism that date back thousands of years isn't relevant?Divine birth, rising from the dead, miracles, healing the sick, facial hair, etc. All bullshit.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Okay, what this boils down to is that Allah is a moon god because islamic nations use the crescent moon as their symbol. I find it laughable that all the christian symbolism isn't mentioned to deflect his/her/it's arguments. Archetypes and symbolism that date back thousands of years isn't relevant?Divine birth, rising from the dead, miracles, healing the sick, facial hair, etc. All bullshit.
Jesus is the addition god.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
I like the way this guy thinks.

You and me both.

Originally posted by Fatima
Quran mention the Aqsa mosqe in Jerusalem ,

God is one ..

in bible,quran ,torah, but there are people add wrong ideas in bible , i cant understand why god has son


Fatima, there are many things that you do not understand. But you don't have to understand a thing to get the benefit of it. For instance do you know precisely how the mind works? Can you explain it to others in detail? But you can still enjoy and reap the benefits of having a mind even though you don't truly know how it works right? Fatima, I understand how you feel. There are many things that I do not understand either. For example, I can't understand why someone would reject Jesus. I do not understand why a person would strap a bomb to him/herself and detonate it around many innocent men, women, and children, killing himself/herself and others. The suicide bomber believes that killing other people and committing suicide is the will of Allah or that this somehow brings glory to Allah. No Christian martyr (i.e. a person who has been put to death for his/her faith in Jesus Christ for salvation from sin) ever killed anyone else while dying for what he/she believed. Peter, Paul, James, and many other disciples in Jesus' day as well as certain followers of Jesus in our time have died for their faith. But here is the distinction: none of Jesus' followers murdered other people in the process. No Christian (i.e. no true Christian or sane person) ever took the life of another person for Jesus and then took their life. But yet we see it all the time with the followers of Allah. That ought to tell you right there that the God of the Bible and Allah are not the same God. The God of the Bible (YHWH, the Father God, Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of God) have never instructed us Christians to kill other people and then take our lives in process. Our God (i.e. the God of the Bible) is Love (Personified). There is not one example of a Christian committing suicide and killing others in the process. It is not in the Bible. Here is what is in the Bible:

Luke 9:56
For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men’s lives but to save them.” And they went to another village.


I don't care how many times quiero mota ignorantly states that Allah means god in Arabic, I have shown that they are not the same deity. I have already challenged quiero mota to substantiate his claims but he has failed to do so in the past and recently. So, I do understand how you feel Fatima, but just like you, there are many things that I do not understand either, but that does not mean that those things are not true.

You're right (...shudder). Christians are much more prone to killing others, and leaving out the killing themselves part, in the name of religion.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Fatima, there are many things that you do not understand. But you don't have to understand a thing to get the benefit of it.

Hmmm-hmmm. Still not dealing with the questions I asked earlier?



Uh huh.... not sure how any of that is relevant to what she said.



Why is it so personal? Am I doing something unconscionable if I don't follow a particular football team or political party? Am I rejecting them? No, simply not following them, most likely because I have no reason to, or I feel it is better spent supporting someone else. I can easily understand why people don't follow Jesus. I believe you will find it easier to connect with people if you try and see non-Christians have a point in not believing.



But we have lots of Christians throughout history who have believed they are justified in killings others. And it wasn't limited to Catholic initiatives. Christians kill, Muslims kill.



Well, way to look at it. Christians are somehow better because when they have fought and killed for Christianity they haven't killed themselves at the same time. Amazing! Way to show the confused the way JIA.... the key is pointing out that there are Muslims who kill themselves and others at the same time! When Christians do it it is one or the other - they kill others, or they get killed! Not both at the same time!

What about Christian soldiers throughout history who killed, and were prepared to die while fighting if that was necessary?



Well, you fail to support your theory on the moon-god claim, so you go right of track and claim it is the fact some Muslims kill that makes the Muslim God not the Christian God.

Doctrine. Simple and pure. The Islamic deity is descended from the same source as the Christian and Jewish God. It doesn't matter what the followers do - that is doctrine. The fact is all three religions have a relation in the past that qualifies all three as Abraham deities.



It just makes me laugh defining it like that. Christians have killed before. Christians have been killed before. Christians have killed themselves before. But the fact they don't do it all at once proves the Christian God is the real God and the Islamic one isn't. Oh and the Bible forms this basis.



Ummm... how much more proof to you want? Allah is what it is and means what the word means. Allah is God in Arabic. Christians and Jews from that region in the past use the word Allah in place of the English God, just as Christians in Germany or South America have a word for God.

And the fact remains that Allah has an ancestral link to Abraham, just like Christianity. They aren't the same religion, they all believe about God differently, but that doesn't remove the ancestry.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Fatima, there are many things that you do not understand. But you don't have to understand a thing to get the benefit of it. For instance do you know precisely how the mind works? Can you explain it to others in detail? But you can still enjoy and reap the benefits of having a mind even though you don't truly know how it works right? Fatima, I understand how you feel. There are many things that I do not understand either. For example, I can't understand why someone would reject Jesus. I do not understand why a person would strap a bomb to him/herself and detonate it around many innocent men, women, and children, killing himself/herself and others. The suicide bomber believes that killing other people and committing suicide is the will of Allah or that this somehow brings glory to Allah. No Christian martyr (i.e. a person who has been put to death for his/her faith in Jesus Christ for salvation from sin) ever killed anyone else while dying for what he/she believed. Peter, Paul, James, and many other disciples in Jesus' day as well as certain followers of Jesus in our time have died for their faith. But here is the distinction: none of Jesus' followers murdered other people in the process. No Christian (i.e. no true Christian or sane person) ever took the life of another person for Jesus and then took their life. But yet we see it all the time with the followers of Allah. That ought to tell you right there that the God of the Bible and Allah are not the same God. The God of the Bible (YHWH, the Father God, Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of God) have never instructed us Christians to kill other people and then take our lives in process. Our God (i.e. the God of the Bible) is Love (Personified). There is not one example of a Christian committing suicide and killing others in the process. It is not in the Bible. Here is what is in the Bible:

Luke 9:56
For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men’s lives but to save them.” And they went to another village.


I don't care how many times quiero mota ignorantly states that Allah means god in Arabic, I have shown that they are not the same deity. I have already challenged quiero mota to substantiate his claims but he has failed to do so in the past and recently. So, I do understand how you feel Fatima, but just like you, there are many things that I do not understand either, but that does not mean that those things are not true.

What if I were to tell you not all suicide bombers in Palestine are Muslims, there are definitely Christian ones too, oh yea I know what you would do, ignore the point.

Originally posted by crazy
What if I were to tell you not all suicide bombers in Palestine are Muslims, there are definitely Christian ones too, oh yea I know what you would do, ignore the point.

I know that.

Originally posted by crazy
What if I were to tell you not all suicide bombers in Palestine are Muslims, there are definitely Christian ones too, oh yea I know what you would do, ignore the point.



,he will ignore it , becuase he belive that all non-christians people are wrong .

Originally posted by Fatima
,he will ignore it , becuase he belive that all non-christians people are wrong .


I am glad you caught on

Its not that hard.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Here is more proof (or substantiation) Fatima that Christians follow Jesus and Jesus came to earth to save men's (i.e. people's) lives (primarily from the consequences of our sins). But Jesus can save us from physical harm and peril as well if we ask Him to.

Um... "here is more proof Jesus is followed by Christians."

I am sorry, but that is one of the weakest arguments I have seen, and proves nothing. At all. Everyone knows the relevance of Jesus to Christians, that doesn't somehow doesn't invalidate other religions claims of make Christians any more accurate.



Wrong - claimed to have written the Bible under the influence of a holy spirit (vodka maybe?)



Ummm.... people killing themselves was not unknown in the ancient world - plenty of texts relate how a family might appeal to a person to run or something rather then kill themselves to save face or honor... does that mean these pagans are proof of pagan Gods??!!!




It is taking them along time to get there - what with them all dying a long time ago. And it is a rather odd story - doesn't sound like the normal way an ancient prison is run.



Sigh. Weak argument. All you are proving the two religions have different holy texts.

Answer this - is the God of the Jews the same God as the Christian one even with the differences in Jewish Holy texts and Christian updating in the NT?

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Um... "here is more proof Jesus is followed by Christians."

I am sorry, but that is one of the weakest arguments I have seen, and proves nothing. At all. Everyone knows the relevance of Jesus to Christians, that doesn't somehow doesn't invalidate other religions claims of make Christians any more accurate.



Wrong - claimed to have written the Bible under the influence of a holy spirit (vodka maybe?)



Ummm.... people killing themselves was not unknown in the ancient world - plenty of texts relate how a family might appeal to a person to run or something rather then kill themselves to save face or honor... does that mean these pagans are proof of pagan Gods??!!!




It is taking them along time to get there - what with them all dying a long time ago. And it is a rather odd story - doesn't sound like the normal way an ancient prison is run.



Sigh. Weak argument. All you are proving the two religions have different holy texts.

Answer this - is the God of the Jews the same God as the Christian one even with the differences in Jewish Holy texts and Christian updating in the NT?
Yes, the same God with Jesus creating a new covenant. Allah is not the same God as he is different by nature and practice (ie. text).

Originally posted by Gregory
You ... you know that Christian Middle Eaterners also worhip "Allah," right? I mean, it's just "God" in a different language.

"Who is Allah?" The Judeo-Christian God. Next question?

Actually no.

Allah WAS a Pagan Arab god of moon. He had 360 different names, Allah which he was most often refered to.

Christians and Jews in Arabia at the time did NOT refer to their gods as Allah.

It is the same thing as calling Judeo-Christian god Zeus or Thor.

You really think that JIA has this correct?

Nah.

I didn't bother reading the article, since i gather the reason for the article is less for general info, and more for...other reasons.

I just asnwered the question of the general thread title.

Its more or less the same thing as the pagan origins of Christianity and Judaism - archeologically they all derive from one thing or another. (begining from gods, to traditions, signs, that kind of stuff)

Christians kept the cross, and other rituals from pagans, as did Jews, and Muslims did too. They kept the cresent moon and the star and their calendar is lunar. (and other things religion related too)

Of course proving Allah is pagan moon god, doesn't really cancel out the pagan origin of Judeo-Christian God.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Actually no.

Allah WAS a Pagan Arab god of moon. He had 360 different names, Allah which he was most often refered to.

Christians and Jews in Arabia at the time did NOT refer to their gods as Allah.

It is the same thing as calling Judeo-Christian god Zeus or Thor.




But Allah has become the name for the Monotheistic God that exists in all three myths, including Christianity and Judaism.

Jehovah was once Yahweh, and it is very probably that Yahweh was once Ahura Mazda.

I see it the way Zeus became Jupiter.

Originally posted by Nellinator
Yes, the same God with Jesus creating a new covenant. Allah is not the same God as he is different by nature and practice (ie. text).

Wrong... the same logic applies to Islam as Muhammad just like Jesus made a new "covenant" or text based off the original concept of a one true God. Islam and Christianity are just another intrepretation of God based off the one god of the Torrah, which in turn has its roots in older pagan religions or what would be now considered pagan religions.

*sigh* Some things never change.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Nah.

I didn't bother reading the article, since i gather the reason for the article is less for general info, and more for...other reasons.

I just asnwered the question of the general thread title.

Its more or less the same thing as the pagan origins of Christianity and Judaism - archeologically they all derive from one thing or another. (begining from gods, to traditions, signs, that kind of stuff)

Christians kept the cross, and other rituals from pagans, as did Jews, and Muslims did too. They kept the cresent moon and the star and their calendar is lunar. (and other things religion related too)

Of course proving Allah is pagan moon god, doesn't really cancel out the pagan origin of Judeo-Christian God.

But would you agree that Allah is the God of Islam and has adopted a new meaning beyond the moon-god?

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Jehovah was once Yahweh, and it is very probably that Yahweh was once Ahura Mazda.
That' the ol' "Ahura Mazda" Connection for you.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Actually no.

Allah WAS a Pagan Arab god of moon. He had 360 different names, Allah which he was most often refered to.

Christians and Jews in Arabia at the time did NOT refer to their gods as Allah.

It is the same thing as calling Judeo-Christian god Zeus or Thor.

Although strictly speaking, in terms of etymology, many words for God used today have their origins with the word Zeus and pagan words for deities.

And plenty of western Muslims use God in place of Allah as Allah is in relation to terminology simply another word for God (not "a" God, "the" God - the same mindset behind the Jewish and Christian faith.) And I am fairly sure in the past in certain middle eastern regions Jews did use Allah when speaking that language as that is that languages word for God. These days it is not really common due to the far more active division between the religions but still happens as that is the word and meaning when speaking that language. The concept of a single creator God - essentially the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

You are correct - once upon a time Allah was related to a moon-god. But no more. Morey's claim that Muslims are still worshipping a moon-god are grossly inaccurate. Starting with a name. If that claim wants to be made one can tie the word Amen from Egyptian religion, the word God from Greek gods and so on. An origin in a pagan religion, just like Christian words, but no more. Muslims do not worship a moon god, their God is derived from the Abrahamic tradition. It is merely linguistic considerations that see Allah used so frequently today, with is irrelevant as Allah no longer refers to the moon god in its usage.

Originally posted by Alliance
But would you agree that Allah is the God of Islam and has adopted a new meaning beyond the moon-god?

Is it just me or do you have this irresistable urge to defend Islam no matter how trivial the point?

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Although strictly speaking, in terms of etymology, many words for God used today have their origins with the word Zeus and pagan words for deities.

As far as I know the word God comes from the old norse word Goth. Later on 'th' became 'd'. Odin used to be called Othin.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
But Allah has become the name for the Monotheistic God that exists in all three myths, including Christianity and Judaism.

Jehovah was once Yahweh, and it is very probably that Yahweh was once Ahura Mazda.

I see it the way Zeus became Jupiter.

What Allah has ''become'' noone is debating, initially. What we are saying is that Allah was the God of Moon in Pagan Arabia.

In modern Islam, his symbol, way of worship, and the calender are STILL kept. The only thing rejected are his 2 daughters and a wife.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Although strictly speaking, in terms of etymology, many words for God used today have their origins with the word Zeus and pagan words for deities.

And plenty of western Muslims use God in place of Allah as Allah is in relation to terminology simply another word for God (not "a" God, "the" God - the same mindset behind the Jewish and Christian faith.) And I am fairly sure in the past in certain middle eastern regions Jews did use Allah when speaking that language as that is that languages word for God. These days it is not really common due to the far more active division between the religions but still happens as that is the word and meaning when speaking that language. The concept of a single creator God - essentially the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

You are correct - once upon a time Allah was related to a moon-god. But no more. Morey's claim that Muslims are still worshipping a moon-god are grossly inaccurate. Starting with a name. If that claim wants to be made one can tie the word Amen from Egyptian religion, the word God from Greek gods and so on. An origin in a pagan religion, just like Christian words, but no more. Muslims do not worship a moon god, their God is derived from the Abrahamic tradition. It is merely linguistic considerations that see Allah used so frequently today, with is irrelevant as Allah no longer refers to the moon god in its usage.


I am little confused as to the point you are making to me.

You said that Allah was related to Pagan Moon God, but no more, so I am interested, when did the turnover happen?


As i already stated, Muslims kept the symbols (crescent moon and the star), the way of worship, the calendar, which is lunar, the way of fast, which is during the day, and eating during the night - which was all how the Pagan arabs did it.

Muslims also adopted the stone of Kaaba, going around it 7 times, and bringing pilgrimage to Mecca. All practiced by Pagan Arabs - in the exactly the same manner.


Pre-islamic Arabs believed that Allah or the Moon-god, was the greatest of all gods and the supreme deity in a pantheon of deities.
Muhammad however, decided that Allah was not only the greatest god but the only god.

In every other religious book, beginning from Vedas, to Torah, to Bible, and to whichever other monolithic religions, a supreme deity is described in one way or another. Apart from Qur'an. And that is completely logical and understandable - Muhammad expected Arabs to know who Allah initially is, as he NEVER implied he was sent by a NEW God.

Muhammad was never accused of preaching a different god, anyway - he preached being sent by the only God Superior to all other gods - Allah, pretty much saying ''Look you are still worshiping the same supreme deity, the way you always have, I am just taking away his wife, two daughters and all other gods''.

Allah was claimed to be a supreme deity in Abrahaic sense when it came to converting Christians and Jews - who also largely inhabited Arabia (especially Jews - they made it their home for 2000 years, prior).

Muhammad said to them, what he said to the pagans - it is the same god you are worshiping, but in a different way - its a compromise of both sides in the end - and it is very logical too.

You are saying Muslims ''used to'' worship Moon God, but no more. So i am interested, when did the turn over, from worshiping one god, to the next?

And what exactly happened to the original Allah, when Muslims decided to worship this Allah, and what exactly is the differance?

Im not trying to be horrible (as you cannot hear tone of my voice), apologies if i am, I am only trying to see where your idea is coming from.

Originally posted by Alliance
But would you agree that Allah is the God of Islam and has adopted a new meaning beyond the moon-god?

It has adapted a new meaning. Its an Abrahamic God now.
It is a Greece-Rome God-swap type thing.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
I am little confused as to the point you are making to me.

You said that Allah was related to Pagan Moon God, but no more, so I am interested, when did the turnover happen?

No, I was saying that the word Allah was once connected to an ancient celestial deity - essentially a moon God. The word changed though and the way in which Morey uses it has been declared incorrect by the historical community.

Some of his argument is "Allah was once the name of the moon god. So Allah today is not an Abrahamic divinity but rather a pagan one." Which of course is erroneous because words evolve. Just like God and Dios and so on have pasts in "Pagan" terminology so to does Allah. The argument JIA harps on about - "Everybody Allah is a moon god" - is based upon misinterpretation.



Muslims also adopted the stone of Kaaba, going around it 7 times, and bringing pilgrimage to Mecca. All practiced by Pagan Arabs - in the exactly the same manner.

Exactly, just as Christians kept many paganistic aspects.




No, I know what you are saying, my argument was based against Morey/Chick Tract historical representation. Poor typing on my part - Muslims are the followers of Islam. I mean people of that region, of that language - that is users of Allah - once worshipped a moon god. The Muslims/Islamics do not. The use of a word which has a root with a pagan deity does not equate the Muslims still worshipping a luner deity as Morey has implied - no more then the pagan derived Christian symbols mean that Christians are worshipping Zeus.

The evolution of the word Allah is complex, and happened a long time prior to the rise of Islam - that is that it had a different meaning from "name of moon god" before Muhammad - in some cases almost seeming to mean prime or chief god (since the evidence of actual moon worship is very old.) Hence how in some parts it was used by Jews when operating in the Arabic lanaguage as it had meaning

Muhammad had some leway in his preaching of his view of God, and he didn't start of preaching adherence to the moon god. From the beginning of the Islamic rise there was a distinct difference between the Islamic religion and the paganistic religions that preceded it. To my knowledge it has been attributed to the whole "Allah was always here but we have moved away from him" mentality. The early Muslims were highly successful in assimilating - hence their meteoric rise. They managed to escape the whole accusation of "if this is the true God why is it new to us" by deft manipulation of what already existed. The Muslims - Islamic believers - never worshipped the ancient moon god, simply utilised words that had once had meaning to ancient pagan beliefs



I don't think the Greek/Rome God swap is quite the same. Since they essentially adapted Greek mythology and divine figures into the Roman world merely changing there names and certain perceptions. Allah of Islam (and thus Abrahamic) is a completely different beast from Allah the ancient moon God.

The idea that Jews use the similar type of sound when speaking even in Arabic is actually erroneous, in regards to the God - ie Allah.

This has been addressed by Jewish rabbis many times over, since that idea has been thrown around infinitely by Islamic apologetics.
The Jewish high rabbis have already demonstrated this as an error.

It is the same thing as the infinite confusion that Islam means 'peace' in arabic.

It doen't. Islam means 'submission'.
Salaam means peace, which has derived from Hebrew Shalom (which Im sure everyone already knows, but never mind).

Second, you are saying again that Muslims never worshiped Allah, pagan moon god - so I am asking you, which god do they worship now, and what is the differance between the two?


Allah was a pagan moon God, and if we still had Arab Pagans, to them he still would be THAT.

The matter of the fact is, noone has presented anything to me which suggests that any kind of deity exists, and thus, from a strictly archaeological and historical point of view - Allah the God, derived from Pagan-Moon God.

Either way - Unless you can prove to me, that this Allah is different to Pre-Islamic Allah, the claim that Muslims worship anything which is different to this what Pagan-Arabs worshiped is baseless.


....

Why is it so easy to accuse Christians of having such strong pagan roots, but when it comes to Islam - no no no, it cannot possibly have any pagan roots?

From what I've seen other etymology derives Allah from Aleim from Elohim, which derives from El of Levantine polytheistic Semitic religion which is the precursor to monotheistic Judaism. The transition from El, the highest god, to El, the only only god, occurring in a similar manner to as described above in the pagan moon god etymology for Allah.

Apparently yod heh vav heh (YHVH) also is derivative of the polytheistic Semitism, with each Hebrew letter originally representative of a different deity, El, Asherah, Ba'al & Anat, respectively.

I heaven't heard that before. Interesting!

NB I'm not in any way authoritative on the subject though, I likewise just found it interesting and read a little bit about it. However it's probably pretty safe to say most monotheistic religions, and at least the Abrahamic religions, derive from polytheistic precursors and roots.

Originally posted by fini
ALLAH IS GOD!!!!!!

Oh, now do that thing with your tongue...

hmmmm, which thing?
i can do lots of stuff with my tongue

Originally posted by fini
hmmmm, which thing?
i can do lots of stuff with my tongue


GROSSSSSS....oh..you mean oral sex...in that case shifty

I meant the funny thing that Stewie asked the terrorist to do and then he did it and everyone had a good laugh.

huh??

hehehe

truth to whom? religious fanatics like you christian, jewish, muslims morons or............. tothe rest of us who really dont give a shit but are tired of your religious wannabees pestering us who really dont give a shit about your feeble religions.....................

Originally posted by finti
truth to whom? religious fanatics like you christian, jewish, muslims morons or............. tothe rest of us who really dont give a shit but are tired of your religious wannabees pestering us who really dont give a shit about your feeble religions.....................
If you don't care about anything religious why do you continue to be drawn here and post? I mean this as a serious question.

a-/anti-religious philosphy is very common in the world and is part of the global discussion.

Originally posted by Alliance
a-/anti-religious philosphy is very common in the world and is part of the global discussion.
That I can understand as it is your stance. But he says he does not care about religion. Other places he has stated that it bores him. Yet, he returns... Not very logical.

I believe it was more a reference to totalitarian religous ideology forced upon others. A little flexible thinking would allow you to see past the literalist interpretation which was likely poor grammar.

I would believe that if he contributed something to the forum. You should know that I rarely play semantics with people on this forum.

Yes, however, semantics is important as we need to discuss things on common terms.

However, it can often become a sticking point.

Too true sometimes. It is often the cause of misunderstanding and resentment too. A pity to be sure.

I find it funny that despite the historical fact that Allah was the name of the Arabic Moon God from a previous polytheistic Faith, Muslims will still insist on worshipping this historically changing character, and clinging to the claim that Allah is real.

Allah is as real as Yahweh..... and Santa Clause.