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Michael Smith just wrote an article for ESPN:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=smith_michael&id=2646827&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab1pos1

Basically, he says that by the end of their careers, Manning and Brady will be the consensus top 2 QBs ever. Period. So that got me thinking...

What's everyone's list? There's plenty of people you could add into the discussion.

Not including Brady/Manning, here's mine:
1. Dan Marino
2. Joe Montana
3. Brett Favre
4. Steve Young
5. John Elway
6. Otto Graham
7. Johnny Unitas

...I once heard the argument that, given a year or two to use modern workout techniques and to learn modern NFL offensive systems, guys like Graham and Unitas would be fine, even great QBs by today's standards. Having seen plenty of film, I'd tend to agree. The arm strength and athleticism were all there.

...

I don't hold a lack of championships against Marino. Hence, the #1. Teams win championships, not individuals. Peyton has had a bad playoff game or two, but usually he's not the reason the Colts lose. So I'd tend to have him higher than Brady too.

...

And I think I agree with Michael Smith. Peyton and Brady are the best. Unless they completely tank their careers right now, Peyton's on his way to every record in the book and Brady's on his way to as many championships as Montana, but with better stats and less talent around him.

I think manning could hold the #1 spot one day, but just cant give it to him yet.

Where's Tony Banks? Come on, at least make a realistic thread. I mean, averaging 1 fumble per game takes talent!

This is a difficult thread for me to comment on as there are many QBs that I like; and thus makes it difficult for me to come up with a list....will get back on this one....toughy.

ok.. so here's my list after about 10 minutes of hardcore research
Superbowl wins don't mean that much to me, but they count for something.

1. Brett Favre
2. Dan Marino
3. Joe Montana
4. John Elway
5. Steve Young
6. Johnny Unitas

Otto Graham - who?

There's only 1 person on this list that i could find a legitimate reason for them to be number 1 and thats Brett Favre. Why is he number 1 on my list... well Dan Marino's numbers, as of this point are better than Favre's but Favre's overall play speaks for itself. He created a positive play when there was no chance of there being one.. from shovel pass's to talking smack with Warren Sapp to 4th quarter comebacks... his charisma, attitude and leadership are unparalleled, besides that of Montana's leadership. By the way, Favre will pass Marino in two key categories this year.. Completions and TD pass's. 3 straight MVP's. And oh by the way... THE STREAK 228 strait starts at the qb position is downright sick.

Marino... ehhh i could easily put him number 1 and it was a hard choice between him and favre,they have almost the same numbers, but favre has the streak, the mvp's and the superbowl so those are the tie breakers. otherwise Marino was downright the best.

Montana had JERRY RICE to throw to along with dwight clark and other hall of famers surrounding him.

Same goes for Steve Young... Jerry Rice... enough said.

John Elway.. wow i could give u a uber long analysis of why Elway is ranked where he is but... i'll give you this. he didn't win a superbowl until he got a running game. He lost of bunch of superbowls so that also goes into the equation.

Unitas.. the best qb of his era.. but thats it.. his era, the game has grown by leaps and bounds since then and i'll take any of the above over Unitas anyday. Even though he was great.

Graham... don't know much about him and i don't really care thats why i left him off the list

in 10 years.. the list will look like this.

1. Peyton Manning ( 2 superbowl wins )
2. Tom Brady ( 4 Superbowl wins)
3. Brett Favre
4. Dan Marino
5. Joe Montana
6. John Elway

the rest are insignifact by this point in time.

Originally posted by botankus
Where's Tony Banks? Come on, at least make a realistic thread. I mean, averaging 1 fumble per game takes talent!

Don't ever mention the name Tony Banks again. He's the chuck knoblauch of football.

Okay here goes....

Joe Montana
Johnny Unitas
John Elway
Tom Brady
Dan Marino
Terry Bradshaw
Brett Favre
Peyton Manning
Otto Graham
Roger Staubach

My Top 10 list as it stands "today".
...missing the cut are Fouts and Tarkenton.

Originally posted by BobbyD
Okay here goes....

Joe Montana
Johnny Unitas
John Elway
Tom Brady
Dan Marino
Terry Bradshaw
Brett Favre
Peyton Manning
Otto Graham
Roger Staubach

My Top 10 list as it stands "today".
...missing the cut are Fouts and Tarkenton.

I'm sorry... but no, u must not know much about football. i can see Montana, but u do not... i repeat do not... i repeat do not put Unitas ahead of Elway Marino Favre or Staubach. And what is Bradshaw doing on that list... the defense won the championships for him. READ the creators list... it says excluding Brady and Manning, granted they belong in the discussion.. but they have so far to go in their careers its not fair to include them in the list. again.. unitas was not as good as the 4 i named.. no even close... go do 10 minutes of research like me and u'll realize that.. also u better make it ultra hardcore research because u sound like u have a disease that prevents u from thinking.

p.s. sorry for being so critical but honestly... come on.

Favre is actually an interesting one. BloodyHell saying he's #1 is valid, but I think he's citing the wrong reasons.

Yes, 3 MVPs. But what other QBs were truly "great" during that era? Montana, Marino, Elway, Aikman, Young, Moon, Kelly, etc. all basically peaked within a 5-years span of each other. Favre never had that type of competition. All of those guys were near the end of their careers when he won his.

You'd first have to point to the fact that Favre is, with little or no discussion, the best foul-weather QB ever. Better than Manning, Brady, Marino, Montana, anyone. If it's raining, snowing, or cold as hell....he's money.

Then you'd point to his stats. Longevity isn't everything, but he's up there with guys like Marino and Manning in terms of TDs per game and yds per game. Those count more to me than mere totals.

So yeah, you could make that case, but just in a different manner.

...

And if you don't know who Otto Graham is, shame on you. He was the first "great" QB to play football. Everyone talk about Montana/Brady's championships, but in the pre-Super Bowl era Graham went to something like 10 straight World Championships (with the Browns, I think), winning 7-8 of them. Using championships as an argument for a QB isn't the best way to go, but if we did, he'd be #1 easily.

And he had impressive stats in an era of football that was utterly dominated by the running game. Teams today pass twice as much as they did back then, so his numbers are even more impressive.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
I'm sorry... but no, u must not know much about football. i can see Montana, but u do not... i repeat do not... i repeat do not put Unitas ahead of Elway Marino Favre or Staubach. And what is Bradshaw doing on that list... the defense won the championships for him. READ the creators list... it says excluding Brady and Manning, granted they belong in the discussion.. but they have so far to go in their careers its not fair to include them in the list. again.. unitas was not as good as the 4 i named.. no even close... go do 10 minutes of research like me and u'll realize that.. also u better make it ultra hardcore research because u sound like u have a disease that prevents u from thinking.

p.s. sorry for being so critical but honestly... come on.

Okay, Sunshine...you made some compelling albeit harsh remarks. Now, please enlighten me as to whom you think is the greatest RB ever. Seeing that you were born in 1987, my guess is you may say Reggie Bush. Be aware: that there is only 1 answer as far as the greatest RB ever. Get it correct, and I'll take your whipping, glady. Get it wrong, and I'll dismiss your argument as someone who does not much about the history of the game.

Yes, I did not follow the threadmaker's rules...fau paux on my behalf.

hmmmmm greatest rb ever... thats a tough one... i could go on and on about gale sayers... marcus allen, emmit smith, barry sanders, walter payton, curtis martin, dorsett, marshall faulk and Orange Juice Simpson... but i'll go ahead and say Jim brown... why? he dominated his era... gained 12,000 plus yards in 9 seasons.. over 100 TD's, and only one year under 1,000 yards.. which was over 900 yards. Also, he played in 14 game season's instead of 16 games. and i know for a fact he's in the top 10 in rushing yards and rushing td's despite not being in the top 20 in attempts. Keep in mind i'm a genious and your not.

Barry Sanders would be my second choice because he was just downright incredible, with emmit and marcus allen following them.

oh yea and don't downtalk me about reggie bush.. he'll never be anymore than a good running back.. i think Ladanian Tomlinson will be the best RB ever when he's done.

Originally posted by BobbyD
Now, please enlighten me as to whom you think is the greatest RB ever. Seeing that you were born in 1987, my guess is you may say Reggie Bush.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Favre is actually an interesting one. BloodyHell saying he's #1 is valid, but I think he's citing the wrong reasons.

Yes, 3 MVPs. But what other QBs were truly "great" during that era? Montana, Marino, Elway, Aikman, Young, Moon, Kelly, etc. all basically peaked within a 5-years span of each other. Favre never had that type of competition. All of those guys were near the end of their careers when he won his.

You'd first have to point to the fact that Favre is, with little or no discussion, the best foul-weather QB ever. Better than Manning, Brady, Marino, Montana, anyone. If it's raining, snowing, or cold as hell....he's money.

Then you'd point to his stats. Longevity isn't everything, but he's up there with guys like Marino and Manning in terms of TDs per game and yds per game. Those count more to me than mere totals.

So yeah, you could make that case, but just in a different manner.

...

And if you don't know who Otto Graham is, shame on you. He was the first "great" QB to play football. Everyone talk about Montana/Brady's championships, but in the pre-Super Bowl era Graham went to something like 10 straight World Championships (with the Browns, I think), winning 7-8 of them. Using championships as an argument for a QB isn't the best way to go, but if we did, he'd be #1 easily.

And he had impressive stats in an era of football that was utterly dominated by the running game. Teams today pass twice as much as they did back then, so his numbers are even more impressive.

Your right in the fact that favre didn't have any other qb's peak the same time that he did.. bledsoe never turned out to be much, all those that u mentioned were at the end. Aikman was just as good in 1996 as he was in 1995 so i don't get where u get that name, but is that favre's fault? i believe that i said i wasn't basing my pick on super bowls, though they counted a little. i also mentioned that marino was a close second and could easily be interchangable with favre. marino was as equal a passer as far, but the leadership and intangible quality goes in favre's favor thats what i based my pick on. as far as otto graham goes... ok your right i did not know. but my point is how much is he recognized... not very much. IF this were a superbowl era question he wouldn't even be mentioned.. but since its not he is. keep in mind there weren't that many teams and not very many dominant players before the early 1960's. Yards, td's, longevity winning %, leadership, teammates all go into the picture. so in saying that i will retract my "10 years from now list" and switch brady and peyton. because brady will have good numbers without a hall of fame receiver, whereas peyton has 2. and brady will have more championships. Feel free to pick apart my comments as i enjoy firing back at you.

Originally posted by botankus


go laugh at someone else... either that or read my reply to it and understand what i was trying to prove... argue with me, i enjoying wooping ass in a battle of knowledge, when it comes to football, i'm the the schwab... undefeatable... almost.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
but i'll go ahead and say Jim brown... why? he dominated his era... gained 12,000 plus yards in 9 seasons.. over 100 TD's, and only one year under 1,000 yards.. which was over 900 yards. Also, he played in 14 game season's instead of 16 games. and i know for a fact he's in the top 10 in rushing yards and rushing td's despite not being in the top 20 in attempts. Keep in mind i'm a genious and your not.

Barry Sanders would be my second choice because he was just downright incredible, with emmit and marcus allen following them.

Sadly, I would agree with you. Okay, so you know a thing or 2.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
go laugh at someone else... either that or read my reply to it and understand what i was trying to prove... argue with me, i enjoying wooping ass in a battle of knowledge, when it comes to football, i'm the the schwab... undefeatable... almost.

However, you also need to know a thing or two about tact and diplomacy, oh young one.

Originally posted by BobbyD
However, you also need to know a thing or two about tact and diplomacy, oh young one.

sorry ... i'm hyper, drank about 3 bottles of mountain dew and a cup of coffee this morning... when i'm not typing i'm running around my room like a mad man. BTW despite not being born until 1987, jim brown is my favorite player of all time... with favre and barry sanders a close second.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
sorry ... i'm hyper, drank about 3 bottles of mountain dew and a cup of coffee this morning... when i'm not typing i'm running around my room like a mad man. BTW despite not being born until 1987, jim brown is my favorite player of all time... with favre and barry sanders a close second.

Much better. ..remember how easy it is for words to sting (especially when written), even if unintentional.

Thanks, BobbyD. I was getting ready to give up watching football and cry all weekend.

mmmmm good quality debate... gotta love it

brady has superbowls, but i still dont think brady can handle pressure that great. I dont mean pressue of a big game, i mean when his o-line isnt playing great and he gets a lot of defensive pressue, ive seen brady make some of the worst throws out there under pressure. He hasnt shown quite the ability to create something out of nothing as Favre could always do. But I do see Brady being able to climb somewhere up this list eventually, though I just dont think he can ever take #1 short of winning 6 or 7 super bowls.

Brady is still young, as is manning. Brady will win at least 1 more superbowl, probably more. If manning doesn't win one.. he will be Dan Marino. But brady will easily be in the top 5 by the top he's done and if he keeps putting up 3500-4000 yards a season for the next 6 or 7 years, and wins another superbowl or two, he'll easily be number 1, baring whether or not peyton manning comes alive and wins 3 to 5 superbowls over the next 8 years or so.

No QB does well with a D-line in their face. Not Brady, Manning, Favre, Marino, Vick....no one.

But, I've recognized something in many "great" QBs. The two least sacked QBs in the league over the past 5 years are Manning and Favre. Coincidence? Hell no.

And why is this? They get rid of the ball quickly. Not all the time, mind you, but on most of their plays. Marino had the quickest release in NFL history according to most experts who know what they're talking about. Again, it's not a coincidence.

Dan Marino imo.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
No QB does well with a D-line in their face. Not Brady, Manning, Favre, Marino, Vick....no one.


yea but some QB's can still make something happen or salvage the play get something positive was my point. Ive seen Brady too many times do something stupid or take the sack in those situations.

the reason why Favre was sacked the least amount in the last five years is because he rushes his throws most of the time ( keep in mind i'm a hardcore packers and Favre fan) and when u rush your throw what happens.... all together now.. INTERCEPTIONS. Gotta love those good old favre picks. throwing into quadruple coverage to a rookie WR. Man, lately he's been the worst decision maker at QB in the league, but only becuase the last 3 years he hasn't had a WR to throw to besides driver because their either hurt or getting suspended.. Favre for life.

a LOT of favres picks are passes that hit a WR and they couldnt pull it in, so it was picked off a tip. This really isnt the QB's fault and i would say shouldnt count. But then when they throw a 3 yard pass and a guy runs for 80 yards and gets a TD the QB doesnt deserve 80+ yards and a TD either so I suppose it balances out.

Originally posted by forumcrew
a LOT of favres picks are passes that hit a WR and they couldnt pull it in, so it was picked off a tip. This really isnt the QB's fault and i would say shouldnt count. But then when they throw a 3 yard pass and a guy runs for 80 yards and gets a TD the QB doesnt deserve 80+ yards and a TD either so I suppose it balances out.

thats pretty much right on. Last year if you seen any of the games about 15 or 16 of those Ints of were passes going right through his receivers hands but most of them were either Robert ferguson dropping passes over the middle or trying to take off before he has the ball david martin running bad routes or chapman" think god they let him go" just flat out dropping passes or alligator arming passes over the middle. But Gado was the worlds worst reciver out of the back field biggest reason he got the boot could not hold on to the ball. But the other 11 ints was just Farve forcing passes making bad decisions cause he had no running game and they were aleways down 2 tds...

Tommy Maddox

Originally posted by SpadeKing
Tommy Maddox

giljotiini

I won't defend some of Favre's more questionable decisions, but if you look at his career he still has one of the best TD-to-INT ratios ever. Yeah, not kidding.

It was really just 1-2 bad years...and he's actually playing decent again right now.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
I won't defend some of Favre's more questionable decisions, but if you look at his career he still has one of the best TD-to-INT ratios ever. Yeah, not kidding.

It was really just 1-2 bad years...and he's actually playing decent again right now.

406 tds to 260 Ints he's has thrown for 30+ tds 8 times in his career so half of his career he put up 30 or more tds. Only twice in his career has the guy thrown less than 20 +tds 1992 and 1993..

To me its hard to nail down one guy to me its between these three guys:

1.Brett farve
2.dan marino
3.John elway

Personally, I think Steve Young is underrated. Better runner than Elway (in his younger years) and as good a passer too. Not quite Elway's canon arm, but I think he was just as good. One of the most efficient QBs ever (highest career QB rating ever, and also high up in completion %).

Nice to see Favre getting such love though. Most go with Montana or Marino. Good picks, no doubt, but it's often hard to get people to consider Favre.

I think if Manning can get a couple of Superbowls, I think he will be considered the best.

If not, top 5. I havnt seen alot of Favre, but I've been watching Manning for a bit and he's just a league in his own right now. Got to be one of the smartest QB's.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Personally, I think Steve Young is underrated. Better runner than Elway (in his younger years) and as good a passer too. Not quite Elway's canon arm, but I think he was just as good. One of the most efficient QBs ever (highest career QB rating ever, and also high up in completion %).

Nice to see Favre getting such love though. Most go with Montana or Marino. Good picks, no doubt, but it's often hard to get people to consider Favre. Young is underated alot of that is he was surrounded by stout talent tho not fair its kinda true.

Elway literally carried teams had to do it all and with the game on the line deadliest ever went to 5 superbowls if he would had the talent he had at the end through his career he would have broke most if not all the records titles etc..

Marino had no running game his whole career very little talent still put up ungodly numbers could read every defense like a book had every throw just never had the talent. Give the guy a decent running back not a great one a decent one with a decent defense well you know. Even with not having that his numbers are sick look them up sometime crazy.. very similar to farve kind spooky 420 tds to 252 Ints


Farve total package Accurate 61.7% ungodly arm strength what made farve so good was his ability to bye time he can move in the pocket better than anybody got every throw sometimes his downfall because he has that arm ultimate competitor, And has been great his whole career never misses starts the most durable player ever has got the ring second all time in career wins and is going to break marinos passing yards and touchdowns, and completions records which nobody thought was possible.. Had good talent at one strectch the best team but for the most eractic talent ahman been god for a 3yrs stretch for him very injury prone dorsey levins was good for like 2 but never had hall of fame talent around him except Big reggie white he makes guys look good I mean he put bubba franks into 3 probowls for christ sakes...

Originally posted by Smasandian
I think if Manning can get a couple of Superbowls, I think he will be considered the best.

If not, top 5. I havnt seen alot of Favre, but I've been watching Manning for a bit and he's just a league in his own right now. Got to be one of the smartest QB's. Manning is good very smart I just want to see the rest of his career unfold before I proclaim him anything but the guys is sick..

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Personally, I think Steve Young is underrated. Better runner than Elway (in his younger years) and as good a passer too. Not quite Elway's canon arm, but I think he was just as good. One of the most efficient QBs ever (highest career QB rating ever, and also high up in completion %).

Nice to see Favre getting such love though. Most go with Montana or Marino. Good picks, no doubt, but it's often hard to get people to consider Favre.

i would've liked to see what would've happened if Favre had Jerry Rice, Tim Brown, Cris Carter, or any other great receiver of that era, he would've broken marino's records years ago. But think about this.. Sterling Sharpe, he was on his way to being a great WR himself, him and Favre would've been unstoppable. But instead Favre had WR's such as Robert Brooks, who was decent, Antonio Freeman, who was a joke, Bill Shroeder, Don Bebee, and many other that didn't do much when they weren't in Green Bay. Favre, when it comes down to it. Is just to good for words. U could break him down all you want, but at the end of the day, he's just "Great".

Originally posted by chris_64256
Manning is good very smart I just want to see the rest of his career unfold before I proclaim him anything but the guys is sick..

He is.

And I agree, cant really say he is the best until he retires. But too me, he is better than Favre.

J.Elway

Stoney Case

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
i would've liked to see what would've happened if Favre had Jerry Rice, Tim Brown, Cris Carter, or any other great receiver of that era, he would've broken marino's records years ago. But think about this.. Sterling Sharpe, he was on his way to being a great WR himself, him and Favre would've been unstoppable. But instead Favre had WR's such as Robert Brooks, who was decent, Antonio Freeman, who was a joke, Bill Shroeder, Don Bebee, and many other that didn't do much when they weren't in Green Bay. Favre, when it comes down to it. Is just to good for words. U could break him down all you want, but at the end of the day, he's just "Great".

Antonio Freeman was no slouch either.

He mentioned Freeman. Don Beebe was more of an impact player in Buffalo than in Green Bay. Not to take anything away from Favre's career, though. It's been great watching him in action.

Originally posted by Smasandian
He is.

And I agree, cant really say he is the best until he retires. But too me, he is better than Favre.

Peyton's a better decision maker.. a better play caller.. and i'd even say a more accurate passer, but look at the WR's Peyton has compared to Favre's. Give Favre Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne a few years ago when ahman green was at his best and their line and defense were playing well and they would've pushed for a Superbowl. Peyton, with the talent he's got, and got around him.. he needs to at least get to a superbowl in the next couple years. He's got the numbers, he's got the respect, he's got the endorsements.. but he doesn't have the big one.. so to say Peyton is the better QB is a little bit of a joke... Favre in his prime VS Peyton in his prime... Give me Favre, 99% percent of the time. All of the intangibles Favre brings to the table.. its just more than Peyton Manning can chew at this point.

Overall... Peyton has been consistent for his entire career, whereas favre has had some off-years and has been streaky.. Peyton is never going to have an "off year" he's must to consistent for that.

Originally posted by botankus
He mentioned Freeman. Don Beebe was more of an impact player in Buffalo than in Green Bay. Not to take anything away from Favre's career, though. It's been great watching him in action.

Bebee was at the end of his career, your right though.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
Peyton's a better decision maker.. a better play caller.. and i'd even say a more accurate passer, but look at the WR's Peyton has compared to Favre's. Give Favre Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne a few years ago when ahman green was at his best and their line and defense were playing well and they would've pushed for a Superbowl. Peyton, with the talent he's got, and got around him.. he needs to at least get to a superbowl in the next couple years. He's got the numbers, he's got the respect, he's got the endorsements.. but he doesn't have the big one.. so to say Peyton is the better QB is a little bit of a joke... Favre in his prime VS Peyton in his prime... Give me Favre, 99% percent of the time. All of the intangibles Favre brings to the table.. its just more than Peyton Manning can chew at this point.

Overall... Peyton has been consistent for his entire career, whereas favre has had some off-years and has been streaky.. Peyton is never going to have an "off year" he's must to consistent for that.

I'd take Peyton every day of the friggin' week.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
Brady is still young, as is manning. Brady will win at least 1 more superbowl, probably more. If manning doesn't win one.. he will be Dan Marino. But brady will easily be in the top 5 by the top he's done and if he keeps putting up 3500-4000 yards a season for the next 6 or 7 years, and wins another superbowl or two, he'll easily be number 1, baring whether or not peyton manning comes alive and wins 3 to 5 superbowls over the next 8 years or so.

3-5 superbowls???!!! Are you freakin' kidding me??!! He needs 1-2 superbowls over the duration of his career, and to keep playing as consistent as he does to become numero uno imo.

He's got the arm, the numbers, the talent, the brains.... all he needs is two superbowls TOPS to be the best ever. Of course, this is just my opinion.

Originally posted by batdude123
3-5 superbowls???!!! Are you freakin' kidding me??!! He needs 1-2 superbowls over the duration of his career, and to keep playing as consistent as he does to become numero uno imo.

He's got the arm, the numbers, the talent, the brains.... all he needs is two superbowls TOPS to be the best ever. Of course, this is just my opinion.

sorry i was exaggerating a little bit.. thats what i think he can win over the rest of his career if he plays another 8 years or so.. If Bledsoe never got hurt and Brady never played... he probably would've had at least 1 by now. But manning will almost surely win at least 1 by the time he's done.. he's almost too good not to.. but thats what was being said about dan marino 15 years ago.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
sorry i was exaggerating a little bit.. thats what i think he can win over the rest of his career if he plays another 8 years or so.. If Bledsoe never got hurt and Brady never played... he probably would've had at least 1 by now. But manning will almost surely win at least 1 by the time he's done.. he's almost too good not to.. but thats what was being said about dan marino 15 years ago.

Ah, okay. You confused me.

how do you know what was being said about marino 15 years ago when you only 18?

!

Because he can read, and its easy to read articles from the 80's

Originally posted by chris_64256
how do you know what was being said about marino 15 years ago when you only 18?

Yea, you must not know what reading is.. Plus i watch espn like 4 hours a day when i'm not at work or school. the rest of my time is spent searching the internet and reading things that i'm curious about at a given time.

Do you have anything legitimate to add to the discussion or are you just going to question everybody on what their saying..

and i'm 19 by the way.. dumbass

No has mentioned Warren Moon. I would put him in the top 5 for sure. Number 1 is probably Favre for me.

Originally posted by chris_64256
how do you know what was being said about marino 15 years ago when you only 18?

or maybe he was a boy genious?

About warren moon.. if you count in his CFL years his numbers are amazing.

Yeah, if you do,. but if you count his numbers, count Damon Allen's, he broke Warren Moon's all time throwing yards in professional football.

I'm taking Favre as number 1. I might be a little biased since Green Bay is my favorite team, but his stats and numbers speak for themselves.

1. Montana
2. Marino

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Michael Smith just wrote an article for ESPN:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=smith_michael&id=2646827&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab1pos1

Basically, he says that by the end of their careers, Manning and Brady will be the consensus top 2 QBs ever. Period. So that got me thinking...

What's everyone's list? There's plenty of people you could add into the discussion.

Not including Brady/Manning, here's mine:
1. Dan Marino
2. Joe Montana
3. Brett Favre
4. Steve Young
5. John Elway
6. Otto Graham
7. Johnny Unitas

...I once heard the argument that, given a year or two to use modern workout techniques and to learn modern NFL offensive systems, guys like Graham and Unitas would be fine, even great QBs by today's standards. Having seen plenty of film, I'd tend to agree. The arm strength and athleticism were all there.

...

I don't hold a lack of championships against Marino. Hence, the #1. Teams win championships, not individuals. Peyton has had a bad playoff game or two, but usually he's not the reason the Colts lose. So I'd tend to have him higher than Brady too.

...

And I think I agree with Michael Smith. Peyton and Brady are the best. Unless they completely tank their careers right now, Peyton's on his way to every record in the book and Brady's on his way to as many championships as Montana, but with better stats and less talent around him.

If u base it on rings, Terry Bradshaw and Joe Montana have four. My favorite is Dan Fouts.

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
ok.. so here's my list after about 10 minutes of hardcore research
Superbowl wins don't mean that much to me, but they count for something.

1. Brett Favre
2. Dan Marino
3. Joe Montana
4. John Elway
5. Steve Young
6. Johnny Unitas

Otto Graham - who?

There's only 1 person on this list that i could find a legitimate reason for them to be number 1 and thats Brett Favre. Why is he number 1 on my list... well Dan Marino's numbers, as of this point are better than Favre's but Favre's overall play speaks for itself. He created a positive play when there was no chance of there being one.. from shovel pass's to talking smack with Warren Sapp to 4th quarter comebacks... his charisma, attitude and leadership are unparalleled, besides that of Montana's leadership. By the way, Favre will pass Marino in two key categories this year.. Completions and TD pass's. 3 straight MVP's. And oh by the way... THE STREAK 228 strait starts at the qb position is downright sick.

Marino... ehhh i could easily put him number 1 and it was a hard choice between him and favre,they have almost the same numbers, but favre has the streak, the mvp's and the superbowl so those are the tie breakers. otherwise Marino was downright the best.

Montana had JERRY RICE to throw to along with dwight clark and other hall of famers surrounding him.

Same goes for Steve Young... Jerry Rice... enough said.

John Elway.. wow i could give u a uber long analysis of why Elway is ranked where he is but... i'll give you this. he didn't win a superbowl until he got a running game. He lost of bunch of superbowls so that also goes into the equation.

Unitas.. the best qb of his era.. but thats it.. his era, the game has grown by leaps and bounds since then and i'll take any of the above over Unitas anyday. Even though he was great.

Graham... don't know much about him and i don't really care thats why i left him off the list

in 10 years.. the list will look like this.

1. Peyton Manning ( 2 superbowl wins )
2. Tom Brady ( 4 Superbowl wins)
3. Brett Favre
4. Dan Marino
5. Joe Montana
6. John Elway

the rest are insignifact by this point in time.

I will disagree with u on Peyton. Stat wise, he should break every record there is. Until they get a defense, he will never be in a Super Bowl. I think Bret Favre like all the veterans like a Michael Jordan, he's playing way too long. Brady may another ring, i agree

Originally posted by BloodyHell222
hmmmmm greatest rb ever... thats a tough one... i could go on and on about gale sayers... marcus allen, emmit smith, barry sanders, walter payton, curtis martin, dorsett, marshall faulk and Orange Juice Simpson... but i'll go ahead and say Jim brown... why? he dominated his era... gained 12,000 plus yards in 9 seasons.. over 100 TD's, and only one year under 1,000 yards.. which was over 900 yards. Also, he played in 14 game season's instead of 16 games. and i know for a fact he's in the top 10 in rushing yards and rushing td's despite not being in the top 20 in attempts. Keep in mind i'm a genious and your not.

Barry Sanders would be my second choice because he was just downright incredible, with emmit and marcus allen following them.

I think when LT finishes his career in San Diego, he just might be the greatest ever

Bump!

And I would say Favre is the best QB.

Originally posted by Grimm22
Bump!

And I would say Favre is the best QB.

Brett is a classic. But he's playing too long without a defense. Brady is in the Hall already with three rings. Glad for Peyton. Hopefully, they can win another. If u base it on rings, Joe=Terry. I prefer Fouts as a good QB. Never won it, but he has such numbers. Some of the QBacks now use the quick, speed offense he was so good at

1) Brett Favre
2) Dan Marino
3) Joe Montana
4) Johnny Unitas
5) John Elway

ima green bay fan, but hey, cmon Favre's numbers are second of all time, and they will be first next year when he beats marino's TDs and yards, thats for sure.

Manning definitely moves a lot closer with his Superbowl ring... still Montana in my books though. I imagine by the end of his career Manning will have been the greatest.

If he continues at the pace he is at right now for another 5-8 years then yeah, he will be considered the greatest QB ever.

He got that stupid championship ring, will probably break ever major passing record and will probably be an MVP once or twice more.