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I read on another post about how Keira Knightly never signed any contract about movie 4. This got me thinking..

..If AWE is Keira/Liz's last movie, how will it end?

If Liz won't be in movie 4, how can she have any relationship with Will or Jack? This concept arose many questions about the ending.

As LovelyOne said in her "Feel Uneasy About AWE", there are more J/E shippers than W/E shippers. That means that if Ted and Terry had some common sense, they would try and make the majority of the audiences happy--they could ask Keira to do at least one more movie to entertain movie go-ers.

The past 2 movies have dropped clues leading to the fact that Jack and Liz should DEFINATELY be together. In the first draft of the first movie, Liz kisses Jack. COME ON PEOPLE!! That has to mean something. Was it that Ted and Terry were sippin' on their coffee, watching late night movies, when one says, "WAIT A SECOND!! We should TOTALLY make Liz and Will get together! Forget the whole 'Jack and Liz' thing; we will totally make this a hit if Will and Liz end up together."

^^Just my thoughts about Ted/Terry^^

I think that movie 2 had so many more clues that led to Jack/Liz because they made out! In the movie, you could sooo tell that Liz wanted to kiss him as much as Jack wanted to. If they make it a W/E ending, that will be FRICKIN BULL SH*T!! Seriously--if you agree, please comment. THANKS

whats this?? what post is this about her not signing a contract for movie 4?? If thats the case then I can see why they felt the need to make it W/E in the long run despite always possibly wanting J/E?.its like.why end a story J/E if there is no chance of her coming back for a 4...

Also I agree with you

the whole world is standing up in favor of J/L, in the form of the romances we have come to love--- listen to the songs of our era, or look at the literature, the media, the poetry. we might be charmed with the idea of W/L, but in the end, we're all aching for a romance that looks like J/L...


sorry for being dramatic, but it just seems soooo clear to me the right way for this to happen...

I KNOW....(and yes, Rogue I'm shouting)...it's got to be, has to be, can't be anything but Jack and Elizabeth.....I want buy back into a Will/Liz relationship no matter how well written that stupid AWE is....I'm sorry I didn't mean that...I'm sure it's going to be a great movie, if for no other reason than it contains, Captain Jack Sparrow...

That's very true. Jack and Elizabeth are the BEST!! They RULE they are one of the hottest couples around. Elizabeth LOVES Jack, Jack LOVES Elizabeth! its so clear! LONG LIVE SPARRABETH!!

mmmm i also agree with u *jcd*gmc*, if it does end with W/E then i cud see why they had 2...(if this was posted twice sry,)

I agree and you have a point lol about T&T

Originally posted by LovelyOne
whats this?? what post is this about her not signing a contract for movie 4?? If thats the case then I can see why they felt the need to make it W/E in the long run despite always possibly wanting J/E?.its like.why end a story J/E if there is no chance of her coming back for a 4...

Also I agree with you

thanx for agreeing w/ me, and if i remembered what post i read that on, i would tell u, but i don't remember

JD 4 Life is right. This forum sways towards Jack and Liz but that is about 10 people. Every other forum I have been to is either split about 50/50 or favors a Will/Liz ending. And it's not 'clear' that Jack and Liz are in love. Yes there is passion and lust there but not love IMO. You have to think realistically.
Has anyone here never been in love with and dating someone who you knew was the right choice for you but met someone else along the way. A charning, older, adventerous person that ignites a different type of fire in you? If you have then you would realize that that other person isnt nessessarily right. It happens all the time.

Now if the rumors are right and Orlando isnt going to sign on for number 4 then T&T may have written it so that Jack and Liz do end up together in a way that makes sense. Every action Liz takes, the adventures that she goes on, the choices that she makes, have all been to save Will and of course Will's have been to save Liz.

I think its just plain mean that Elizabeth killed Jack Sparrow and is now going to cold shoulder him even more...and people are feeling sorry for Will?? last time I looked, he wasnt swallowed by a Kraken after coming back for the woman he may love.

And Pirates Life Fo..Terry said recently that Elizabeth is crying at the end because she thinks she killed someone she may indeed love..I know its not saying she does love him but obviously it can be possible in the movie...Its not impossible to think its anything beyond lust and passion.

Also does anyone here see entire websites dedicated to W/E?? I have not found a single one...yet there are for J/E

Also on youtube..Its swamped with J/E themed music videos and clips..If you go over to KttC there are about 150 more J/E suporters that W/E supporters (a poll)

the thread for J/E is on its 4th restart thing where as W/E hasn't made it past the first

J/E has made it up for nomination at the peoples choice awards as a favorite pairing..W/E hasn't

I have search for it, and believe me I haven't seen a single website dedicated to W/E.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
Now if the rumors are right and Orlando isnt going to sign on for number 4 then T&T may have written it so that Jack and Liz do end up together in a way that makes sense. Every action Liz takes, the adventures that she goes on, the choices that she makes, have all been to save Will and of course Will's have been to save Liz.
except for the choice at the end DMC..that was all for Jack Sparrow and herself. How is that helping Will? i cant see how that last choice was for Will Turner.

Also when Beckett suggests she's helping Jack with those letters she actually over reacts and tells him off basically...people pretty much do that when they are in denial over something

Also I'm going to say that I don't think its only lust and passion when it comes to how Elizabeth feels about Jack. If there is to be one thing about Jack that she may love now or in the future. Its the honest and good man he can be.

On the directors(writers) commentary..in the curiosity scene apparently they are both challenging each other..they both want each other but on their own terms..

now if this was just a lust thing..she would have just been going on about his dirty appearance being the thing that is the problem..but she doesn't..she's also talking about the type of man he should be if they were to ever be together in the future..she wants the good man. She actually talks more about the kind of man she wants him to be..and not the way he looks..meaning its not really the lust that is the main thing when it comes to Jack and how she feels about him??

but you can clearly see this may be the thing she fears when it comes to Jack because it is the part of him that means she can love him..he comes back fr her at the end and this really does make her feelings for him escalate IMO

in no way does that godlike shot, the look on her face and the way she clings to his leg imply that she's lusting after him..its showing you that she is in awe of the good man he is.

it would be a lot easier for her to stick with Will if that good man didn't exist possibly?

interesting thing to think of when you consider how Jack appears to be changed by his trip to the locker in the draft script


Also consider the ending of DMC. Once everyone begins to talk about how Jack the good man is gone from the world...is this when Elizbaeth feels truly guilty for killing Jack? Becuase she has killed the man she may indeed love..Jack..the good man...does she care for that man enough to bring him back?..more importantly..watch what Will does. He thinks she loves him and so he wants to let her do what she wants to do, he loves her enough to let her follow what appears to be her heart here. (imagining we dont know anything about AWE)

Interesting when you consider what T&T said about being happy to leave the series here if they had no sequels coming up..they felt they had got the message across with DMC that they wanted to..and I have to say..it ended more J/E than W/E

All I have been saying all along is that, whichever way it goes, it will be a good movie. And T&T arent going to write the movie based on who the fans think Liz should be with.

What really bugs me is people that think that what T&T write is 'FRICKIN BULL SH*T!!' if it doesnt go along with what they think should happen.

thats just a frustration coming out because they love the aspect so much it hurts..believe me I know because I've said that once or twice..I don't think its BS what they are writing..that usually comes out when one has just got news thats unhappy to them lol

They havent gotten any bad news yet. Sure there are rumors floating around the internet but if they beleive the rumors that is their own fault. How can you already be pissed and the movie isnt even done filming?

Oh Oh ..I frgot to say..but in DMC..the pattern is..she has feelings for jack...but thinks Will is more important.she makes a bold statement that she is with will and it has to remain like that...but then she makes another choice and realises that she needs Jack..the good man..she killed...my opinion anyway

when you look at the typical 12 steps a hero tends to follow in a movie..she has in my opinion, just crossed step 5 (the first threshold of adventure) by deciding to get Jack back..this comes directly after step 4 (meeting the supernatural helper)

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
They havent gotten any bad news yet. Sure there are rumors floating around the internet but if they beleive the rumors that is their own fault. How can you already be pissed and the movie isnt even done filming?

because....its not done filming yet? I heard Keira had wrapped up...or was that only in palmdale?

Just because she thinks Jack is a good man doesnt mean anything. You dont think she believes Will to be a good man?

It was only in PALMDALE....because she was at the Guadalupe Dumes like a week ago filming!!! <----so i heard!!!

She was at the dunes about 3 weeks ago.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
Just because she thinks Jack is a good man doesnt mean anything. You dont think she believes Will to be a good man?

No I dont mean that, I mean the honest and good side its probably the only part of Jack she would love.

hence the fact she brings it up into the curiosity conversation when they "are both wanting eachother but on their own terms" according to T&T

that scene is aparently about them discussing what the other should be if they were to ever be together..both actually do it by the end of DMC too.

and the important thing to note is that she;s talking about the kind of man he would have to be if he was to be with her in the future..if it was only sex she wanted from Jack she wouldnt be talking about that..she would just be talking about his hygeine (which she does mention but its not the main thing there)

Liz IMO clearly wants that good side from Jack but doesnt want to want it because she's with Will...much like Jack wants Elizabeth but doesnt want to want her (because he wants freedom IMO)...the writers say that about jack but I think liz is having the same struggle

Ok regardless of what anything means. That may mean that they end up together. It may mean that she does sleep with him and cant deal with the hygene issue and runs off to be with Will. We dont know

lol..

doubt she would sleep with Jack...in AWE anyway lol


if she's in a 4th and Wills not, then who knows?? movie 4 will probably need a love story...

thinking..maybe Will is gonna have (or is having) a similar struggle..he wants his father but doesnt want to want him because he feels he should be there for Elizabeth??

the wanting but not wanting to want is the classic theme of the reluctant hero. Usually the thing they want but dont want to want is the very thing they end up accepting

Which is why its odd that Elizabeth is so ready to save Will before even meeting the supernatural helper of the story (who according to the actress who plays her can see each character's true hearts and desires)..which IMO says Will is not her true elixir/arc doesn't mean its Jack either..

Ya well im almost positive something drastic is gonna happen to LIZ!!!!

Something drastic, meaning good or bad?

BAD then Good!!!!!!

lol OK, that sounds good then.

possibly..each character seems to be having drastic things happen to them as consequences to their earlier actions..

well ya my theory is that Liz already suffered beacuse she thought she lost JACK....when he died...and it made her realize that she loves him!!

so now im thinking something big and unfortunately bad needs to happen to LIZ because now JACK needs to suffer and see that losing LIZ is like losing himself!!! make him realize that hes head over heels in love with LIZ!!!

So is everyone still under the impression that if the movie doesnt end Jack/Liz then it wont hit the 1 billion mark?

I dunno if she loves him but certainly she realizes that she cant betray Jack like this because she cares a lot for him now.

theres a huge difference in the 2 betrayals in both movies and the way each character behaves..in movie 1..Jack was fuming..Liz was fuming too

movie 2?? where id that go..well she did look pissed at him but it wasnt for the same reason..that look of hatred was because of how he's making her feel (guilty)

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
So is everyone still under the impression that if the movie doesnt end Jack/Liz then it wont hit the 1 billion mark?
no...but it cant be denied that J/L was a large factor in its success..I wouldnt be saying this if it was just the kiss that was between them but it wasnt...it was the two together working really well on screen not just in a "romance" way but just on screen chemistry.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
So is everyone still under the impression that if the movie doesnt end Jack/Liz then it wont hit the 1 billion mark?


I really don't know, as I said before I really would like to see a J/L ending, but I am not expecting it to happen.

WeLLLL....maybe not end JACK/LIZ but there definately has to be that very intense JACK/LIZ chemistry that we saw on the pearl and another KISS....it just has to be done!!!

So you are saying that if the romance hadnt happened it would not have made 1 billion? Even though movie 1 made $655,000 and it didnt have even the fan base it did by movie 2?

There has to be for sure, I'm expecting that. I would be disappointed if this doesn't happen.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
So you are saying that if the romance hadnt happened it would not have made 1 billion? Even though movie 1 made $655,000 and it didnt have even the fan base it did by movie 2?

and if DMC was exactly the same in theme as movie 1..it wouldnt even get to 655 million...its different to movie 1.if movie 2 was very W/J based..it would be "yawn" J/L kept it feeling fresh and obviously pushed it a tad further possibly..

which is why I can understand a more W/E based awe..but actually ending in pretty much the same place as movie 1??? I dunno..

I f Jack/Liz didnt happen....the movie probably wouldnt have captivated an audience the way it did!!! People fell in love with JACK/LIZ u cant help that!!!

Im sure a lot of people who think that is all the movie is based on would be disappointed too. Im sure there are people that would be disappointed if she DID end up with Jack. And Im sure that there are people that dont care as long as it's a good movie

going to get food.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
Im sure a lot of people who think that is all the movie is based on would be disappointed too. Im sure there are people that would be disappointed if she DID end up with Jack. And Im sure that there are people that dont care as long as it's a good movie
I agree.

but I think more people would be unhappy with Jack leaving alone and incomplete as a character in the trilogy

I know people think he's a happy man the way he is..but is that really true??

Movie 1 showed us that when Jack is forced to look at who he is under the shell...he's actually rather tragic and broken as a human being. He also doesnt like to face up to it..because it reveals he's actually alone and rather weak?? maybe that thought is a hard thing for Jack to cope with..

no human being can honestly say money buys them eternal happiness, short term happiness yes..but constantly living with only material things that cant love back can create a large void in people that just cant be filled with whores, ships, hats and rum..

maybe Jack should get a dog for companionship at least..or maybe the monkey?but why should our most loved character settle for that?

You know what really captivated me about DMC? I saw that they took-ed the characters to different places. IMO they were taken to places that I didn't expect to see. That idea captivated me, and I believe that a lot of people as well.

yes^^ as if its to get us used to possibly seeing it again but on a larger scale??? so if we see it it will be unexpected..yet make perfect sense to everything we have seen?? (which is what Terry actually said the ending of AWE will be)

to show us that Jack can give up freedom for someone he may love..and Elizabeth can give up Will in order to find the man she may indeed love..and Will can appear to let Liz go because its what she wants more? And he also can make a commitment to someone other than her,.

tell me is Jack leaving with two whores unexpected of his character?

or is that not how he REALLY ends it?

if this is to be a spectacular end to a spectacular trilogy..Jack leaving with two whores to be a pirate..is that really anything exciting..or even new?

but if he ends this on a note that says he's given up freedom for something more satisfying..that would be unexpected yes..but again make perfect sense because Jack somewhat did it in DMC anyway.

Jack leaving with the whores would have been expected in DMC, if Jack wouldn't have had those changes in the movie. But now that we have seen this side of him, we expect to see more of it in AWE.

Originally posted by Mistypirate
Jack leaving with the whores would have been expected if DMC, if Jack wouldn't have had those changes in the movie. But now that we have seen this side of him, we expect to see more of it in AWE.

true Jack leaving "happily" with two whores is unexpected because its actually inconsistent with everything we have seen from his character development in movie 1 and 2..

so IMO that cant be the true "unexpected, yet makes perfect sense to everything we have seen" ending to AWE..Because that ending doesn't actually make sense to everything we have already seen from him in the trilogy so far

Also..I know most people will view this line as a joke.I've said this before..but remember on KttC they were talking about the scene where Jack asks "did anyone come back because they missed me?" no one raises their hand but the monkey..

People who think Jack is 1 dimensional and thats all he ever was and will be, will laugh and think nothing of it. But people who can see deeper into the character of Jack..will actually see this as a sort of plea from Jack ...just wanting someone to care enough about him to miss him maybe??

its rare for Jack to show that he wants someone to care for him..as a matter of fact..that would be the first time he would have openly shown anything of the sort as a character.

Its showing you that Jack wants love IMO (probably always secretly has..yet its not so secret anymore possibly because he's yearning for it much more now)

Yea that scene is quite sad for me, only the monkey raises the hand. Jack wants somebody that cares for him, IMO this is what he is looking for. The monkey is the only one that shows some emotions for Jack, even though Jack has shot him quite a few times.
Ok the hell with everyone I am know rooting for a Jack/Monkey ending.

question. that interview floating around. what the hell is the big idea, with t and t wanting to develop will's character??? what were they going to do? talk about his sad childhood? oh gag me.

sorry dont mean to be hostile... but the only character whose history i want to see is the character with the INTERESTING history, ahem.

Terry kind of denied that comment made by JB over at wordplayer, stating "the bit about Will's line is not accurate".

What the hell is with you judging what T&T want to do with THEIR movie.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
What the hell is with you judging what T&T want to do with THEIR movie.

are you talking to me?

Originally posted by katelovespirate
question. that interview floating around. what the hell is the big idea, with t and t wanting to develop will's character??? what were they going to do? talk about his sad childhood? oh gag me.

sorry dont mean to be hostile... but the only character whose history i want to see is the character with the INTERESTING history, ahem.

hahah sad but so true! i mean we know a major part of his history and im pretty bored with it...if he aint interesting now he wont be interesting anytime soon...unless he like committed murder or something but that would barley make him interetsing oh and he would probably be more hated but anywayz....the only one we REALLY wnat to know about is Jack because wat we know so far is fascinating and the more we know the more we will be fascinated by him! its just the way things work

chill out, bro. they can do whatever the hell they want, clearly. i'm just a mopey college kid stuck between countries.

I am just constantly amazed at how one dimensional people can be. You arent looking at the big picture. Most of you seem to be blinded by ONE theme of the movie regardless how big it may or may not be.

I agree with Pirates life, actually.


A lot of these statements about TnT not knowing what they are doing or that they will suck if they don't make a J/E ending are immature, mean, and well...stupid.


They obviously know what they are doing, they have an idea of where their story needs to go, and even if we don't like it, it should be respected.

oh thnx for putting us down...but u just dont think like a lot of other people so dont be so amazed they ont think or look at things the same way you do...we all dont have to look at htings the same way....thats the while point of having discussions: to hear other peoples opinions...so just relax

ouch. burned on me. haha. i'm not going to lie, i do in fact let my shallow side hang out. these movies are, for me, fun and escape.

though i reckon our in-depth psychoanalysis of Will's character the other night on the Will is Hot thread meritted something.

And perhaps, if we ALL are blinded by this one theme, it may in fact have been intended or done on purpose? we all didn't accidentally, randomly fall in love with this one theme... if it stood out and captured our attention more than anything else, i reckon that makes a clear statement itself.

I am simply a "Pirates of the Caribbean' Shipper if you will. Even if Jack Sparrow were to die in the film, as long as the film was done well, I would be happy.

totally agree wit u kate!

Originally posted by CaptinJackLover
oh thnx for putting us down...but u just dont think like a lot of other people so dont be so amazed they ont think or look at things the same way you do...we all dont have to look at htings the same way....thats the while point of having discussions: to hear other peoples opinions...so just relax

WHo doesnt like a lot of other people?

i said we all dont THINK like each other so its ok to have different opinions on stuff

dude, guys, we are not having another argument in here.

we all respect the writers. we may act immature at times, but everyone has proven themselves to have great ideas and opinions. but we're human. we get stressed sometimes.

anyhow, i know we all can respect each other enough not to misunderstand anything. please.

CJL-- righto. different minds. its great!

I don't want Jack to die! I would probably be slightly disappointed.

giggle... me too. but he died once and i reckon he could pull another great escape.

Its not that I dont think like alot of other people. I am try to be more open minded. I am not against a Jack/Liz ending as long as its written acted and directed well and the movie is entertaining and intelligent. The same as a Will/Liz ending or a monkey/Liz ending

hahah yepp! its Jack! of course he can!

like we all said (at some point, i forget when) Jack could get off the Lost island in 24 hours.

Originally posted by katelovespirate
like we all said (at some point, i forget when) Jack could get off the Lost island in 24 hours.

He could as long as the hair on his back had grown back out so he can lasso the shark and ride it back to civilization

haha... yeah, after charming the "others" and seducing Kate (or Monica or whatever her name is LOL)

haahh i know that confuses me...i must know wat her name is! i honetsly dont like the show...i despise it! but somethings just keep me intrigued!

Her name is Kate. At least that is what her mom calls her.

oh i hotught her mom calle dher monica but the people in the island know her as kate..?

great name

but who the heck does she really like? the dude she just slept with or the dude whose killing the freaky other?

oh sorry back to pirates...

I hate Lost with a burning fiery passion. Unhappily I know everything that has been happening on the island because my dad likes it and I watch it with him for 'bonding' time. Ugh.


As for my previous statement, I'm not putting anyone's ideas down, but I am putting down all the "TnT sucks" statements...Kate just said that TnT don't know what they're doing, and even if she's just kidding, it shouldn't even be said.


It's disrespectful.

Surreal, I notice a trend of hostility towards me. Whats up?

I like to rant sometimes. I know my actions speak louder than my words, and I try to treat everyone with respect.

Anyways, i really don't want any arguing.

I don't exactly LIKE Lost, but I'm pretty addicted to it... lol. its a social thing. its so fun to watch and freak out with a big group of people.

ahahha same thing with me! Lost is the worst show! i mean wats with the polar bear! and yeah who DOES she like? i hate sawyer but Jack annoys me like crazy!

PIRATES RULE! lol

I like Lost, I think its a weird show. Still its cool.

You have to be familliar with the show to know what's up with the polar bears. I wont go into it on a Pirates forum

I'm not being hostile to you Kate. If I was, trust me, you'd know.


It's just that you happen to post stuff that I completely disagree with or find disrespectful. What else can I say? I'm a blunt person, and I'm not going to try to make things syrupy to protect feelings or make nice.


If I think you're rude, I'll call you on it. If I think you're disrespectful, I'll call you on it.


And when I say 'you', I mean everyone who isn't me. I wasn't very nice to what's her name that tried to accuse Pirates life of being a pervert, and if she/he had continued with her non-sense I would've gotten extremely rude, but luckily for all of us, it stopped posting.


My behavior is always the same...if I think we can carry on an interesting and fun convo, I'll go for it. If I think you're being a ninny, I generally let you know. I'm the same here as I am in other forums, including ones that have nothing to do with PotC.


It's not personal, I assure you.

allright mate, though if we're on the subject of rude, the kate-bashing post you made the other night didn't exactly make me smile.

i respect people who are honest, but on this forum, it makes me sad when we cant laugh and have a good time... when we get too intense. lol. kumbaya.

i was thinking about something today--- the whole pirate concept is so big right now--- Lost sort of ties in--- islands and ships, the idea of freedom. it kinda speaks about our cultural. its interesting.

Kate, I didn't bash you. If I was, trust me, you'd know. You just posted something that bothered me, and I called you on it. Simple as that. No bashing. I just want to know where you come up with some of the stuff that you try to use to prove your ship.


I want to get along with everyone also, but I'm not going to be bullied into agreeing with you or abandoning the forum simply because I see things differently. I will call anyone on anything I see as being fishy, stupid, uninformed or an out-right lie.


So, back on topic...

NO! NEVER! no being on topic!

Originally posted by JD_4_Life
At my school and on a survey I took at the mall, many people love the W/L relationship way better. Some said, "I think that if Elizabeth wound up with Jack, that would be just plain mean! It's a Disney movie for crying out loud."

i see that you took a survey at your school, but that's just your school. there's a whole lot more people in america than the population of your school!! (no offense) i see your point....but just look here....the majority of people here are J/L shippers. there are a lot of people here, too. some are W/L shippers, but i think the difference is that people in your school may not be like "OMG i am soo obsessed with POTC!! i see everything clearly (the reasons why blank and liz should be together!!) now! here on KMC, we are deeper into the movie. we understand different concepts that other people wouldn't bother looking into.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
What the hell is with you judging what T&T want to do with THEIR movie.
because they are not really making it for themselves..they are making it for other people??? I'm sure they wanna get money the most out of all of this...If this was an independent film then I can understand why people wouldnt judge on it..but its a film thats gott please a mass audience

I mean sure they can do what they want with it but even Jerry said that he cant let them have all they want to do with it because they are trying to please the audience not the writers..

Originally posted by Surreal_44
I agree with Pirates life, actually.


A lot of these statements about TnT not knowing what they are doing or that they will suck if they don't make a J/E ending are immature, mean, and well...stupid.


They obviously know what they are doing, they have an idea of where their story needs to go, and even if we don't like it, it should be respected.

surreal..that not fair to say because you are constantly W/E or N/E shipping all the time...almost 90% of ypur comments are on how it should be either of those two endings. You are heavily focused on that and barely tak about anything else.

WHen I say it sucks that Jack doesnt get her..what annoys me is people are like "oh poor Will..if he doesnt get her thats plain mean"

but what about Jack too? He's fallen for her..she lead him on and if she rejects him, she killed him...isnt that just as mean if not worse?

Both men have the potential to mirror Davy Jones in terms of the kind of man he became...I mean personality..and me dont thinks its Will

If Liz cares for Jack's heart in any way..would she not try to help him? Because I really do think the only part of Jack she may indeed love is his good, compassionate side..and if thats gone..she may be feeling widdowed

PEOPLE I DIDN'T MEAN TO START AN ARGUEMENT HERE!! I JUST WANTED YOUR HONEST OPINIONS (even though you people pretty much "expressed" yourselves in a way I was trying to avoid) WITHOUT GETTING MAD AT EACH OTHER FOR THEIR OPINIONS, WHICH YOU DID!! Look, people; I just want to know if you AGREE or DISAGREE with me. If you disagree, you don't have to be mad at those who agree, and vice-versa. PLEASE STOP!!

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
What the hell is with you judging what T&T want to do with THEIR movie.

Are you talking to me? Because if you are I'm sorry you disagree, but I think T+T could try to compromise with the majority of audiences.

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
JD 4 Life is right. This forum sways towards Jack and Liz but that is about 10 people. Every other forum I have been to is either split about 50/50 or favors a Will/Liz ending. And it's not 'clear' that Jack and Liz are in love. Yes there is passion and lust there but not love IMO. You have to think realistically.
Has anyone here never been in love with and dating someone who you knew was the right choice for you but met someone else along the way. A charning, older, adventerous person that ignites a different type of fire in you? If you have then you would realize that that other person isnt nessessarily right. It happens all the time.

well, I guess since you work on the set and have seen the script and know how the movie is going to end...I guess we should start listening to you....and in all your post its pretty obvious that it's going to be a Will and Elizabeth ending...so, I guess I'll just wait and see AWE when it comes out on DVD....unless I hear otherwise after people go see it at the theatre...but I won't be there on opening day, that's for sure.

YOu are very adamant about it too...so thanks for letting us know how it's going to go....I know myself and many others on this forum have discovered all the clues and symbolisms and lines and innuendos that point to Jack and lIz but I guess they were just coincidences...I just wish Ted and Terry would never have used the character of Jack as the bump in the road for Will and LIz...cuz now it's ruined the whole trilogy for me....I do not like that they did this to Jack Sparrow...and I'm hoping he can redeem himself in AWE....

And, besides.....Lovely is right...the poll on KTTC was heavily in favor of J/E....the thread dedicated to J/E is so much larger than the one for W/E, Jack and Liz have been nominated as a favorite couple for People's choice...they are tons of videos dedicated to that relationship on youtube compared to Will and Liz...and there are websites dedicated to their pairing....haven't seen one on Will and Liz...anyway......I think there are more people who want to see Jack and liz together...and t and t have no one but themselves to blame for showing a side of Jack Sparrow that the audience fell in love with......they should have left well enough alone....WHY DID THEY HAVE TO MAKE JACK AND LIZ KISS (* yes, rouge i'm yelling)....they should have left that out of the movie...she should have used the sword instead as was originally intended.....

Well, sorry I'm sad about this Pirates Life Fo....but thats just the way many, many feel

Originally posted by Pirates life fo
So is everyone still under the impression that if the movie doesnt end Jack/Liz then it wont hit the 1 billion mark?

I am...I think it will only do as good as POTC 1 .....I still think the reason DMC did as well as it did was because the people that did go back to see it over and over were intrigued by what was developing between Jack and Liz.....they wanted to see the kiss.....the conversations.....the development of the characters.....I know that's why I went back 5 times to see it...

And someone mentioned (Kate I believe) about not caring about seeing Will's history...ditto......I can't help it. I am being honest here, I could honestly care less about Will....I've never been a fan of his...I guess cuz since POTC 1 I've always been a Jack fan and believe me, I was a J/E shipper even during POTC 1.....I am a historical romance junkie and to me...everything about Jack and liz's relationship jumped out to me as being the one that T and T should have developed.....the anitclimatic kiss between Will and Liz at the end of POTC 1...ugghhh...

my heart actually skipped a beat when Jack says "Elizabeth, darling, it would have never worked between us, I'm sorry"...the first time I saw it...I was like woaahhh.....okay, come on Elizabeth, run after Jack....he's the man for you..he's the Pirate, not Will....I hated that line when Swann says "after all, he's only a blacksmith." and Liz says, "No, he's a Pirate".....the funny thing is, as movie 2 opens we learn that Will still is not in favor of being a Pirate...he hates being called a Pirate....I don't know...I'm talking in circles I know....can anyone relate????

Believe me, I wish I wasn't this attached to the J/L relationship...but T and T did this when they decided to act upon that chemistry in DMC...and it's left a large part of the audience hungry for more....because it's what people dream about..it's fantasy...it's forbidden love...it's hot, passionate...the love between Will and Liz..that's everyday love...the kind that's nice and sweet....but not very enduring....this is only my opinion....just venting that's all..

So, that's it? Is JE offcially dead? It's gonna be a WE ending for sure??
Well, if that's the case I wait until people have seen AWE and I know how nausiating the WE is, before I go see it....I'm sensing a "Elizabeth becomes Mrs FishFace and sail with Will on TFD" ending I'm seriously annoyed by now...

Did I expect a WE ending: Yeah,
Did I hope for a (implied)JE ending: Hell Yes
Am I crushed it will be WE: No, but ekstreamly annoyed and pissed
Will I see AWE as much as I did DMC: Probably not...depends on the amount of WE(gag)and capt Jack...

Originally posted by lovethemtigers
I am...I think it will only do as good as POTC 1 .....I still think the reason DMC did as well as it did was because the people that did go back to see it over and over were intrigued by what was developing between Jack and Liz.....they wanted to see the kiss.....the conversations.....the development of the characters.....I know that's why I went back 5 times to see it...

And someone mentioned (Kate I believe) about not caring about seeing Will's history...ditto......I can't help it. I am being honest here, I could honestly care less about Will....I've never been a fan of his...I guess cuz since POTC 1 I've always been a Jack fan and believe me, I was a J/E shipper even during POTC 1.....I am a historical romance junkie and to me...everything about Jack and liz's relationship jumped out to me as being the one that T and T should have developed.....the anitclimatic kiss between Will and Liz at the end of POTC 1...ugghhh...

my heart actually skipped a beat when Jack says "Elizabeth, darling, it would have never worked between us, I'm sorry"...the first time I saw it...I was like woaahhh.....okay, come on Elizabeth, run after Jack....he's the man for you..he's the Pirate, not Will....I hated that line when Swann says "after all, he's only a blacksmith." and Liz says, "No, he's a Pirate".....the funny thing is, as movie 2 opens we learn that Will still is not in favor of being a Pirate...he hates being called a Pirate....I don't know...I'm talking in circles I know....can anyone relate????

Believe me, I wish I wasn't this attached to the J/L relationship...but T and T did this when they decided to act upon that chemistry in DMC...and it's left a large part of the audience hungry for more....because it's what people dream about..it's fantasy...it's forbidden love...it's hot, passionate...the love between Will and Liz..that's everyday love...the kind that's nice and sweet....but not very enduring....this is only my opinion....just venting that's all..


clap. Magnificent!!! That is all I have to say about your post.

lovethemtigers, YAY for you.

i think i'm steering clear of this thread. its too angsty.

Yeah, I tend to agree they will miss an opportunity if they go W/E. Of course, I believe people are packing up and going home before the game's over. You can know all the secrets, read the script, talk to the writers, whatever, but so much depends on what is actually shown on the screen...how the actors express themselves, what the camera is looking at. Those two things alone could certainly imply a J/E ending.

Oh and by the way...the only reason I went out and bought the DVD for Pirates of the Caribbean after seeing it when I rented it...was one reason...Captain Jack Sparrow.....it had nothing to do with Will and Elizabeth.....in fact, I thought their relationship was nauseating, but that's just me.........the only reason I went to see DMC in the theatres was because Keira said at the premiere that she gets to kiss Johnny...and I was like.."WHAT?" that's what i've been secretly hoping for since movie 1.....and then I became obsessed with DMC after I saw it and saw the magical chemistry between jack and liz....and the great scenes in the movie...definitely not the dice game (I hated that part of the movie, to be honest).....so that's how I find myself here today....a desperate J/E fan.....someone who is angry that they took the great Captain Jack Sparrow....developed him into a deep and intriguing character beyond the rogue we fell in love with in POTC and then leaving him out to dry...a victim of unrequited love....don't like it one bit

Ltt & Willo I agree with both of you.

And Willo even TnT said Captain Jack Sparrow is exactly as they wrote him, but the way JD played CJS was not at all what they had envisioned
or expected.

It's just like in these threads. Ppl say something and because you cannot see them or tell by the inflection in their voice, someone becomes offended.

I still think we will like the outcome and I am not giving up and I will be there on opening day.

My passion is not just J/E in DMC, but JD and that roguish smile and the sexy way he moves. I still say he has courtly movements and mannerisms. But, don't get me wrong, I would love to see the fairytale ending of J/E.

Originally posted by lovethemtigers
Oh and by the way...the only reason I went out and bought the DVD for Pirates of the Caribbean after seeing it when I rented it...was one reason...Captain Jack Sparrow.....it had nothing to do with Will and Elizabeth.....in fact, I thought their relationship was nauseating, but that's just me.........the only reason I went to see DMC in the theatres was because Keira said at the premiere that she gets to kiss Johnny...and I was like.."WHAT?" that's what i've been secretly hoping for since movie 1.....and then I became obsessed with DMC after I saw it and saw the magical chemistry between jack and liz....and the great scenes in the movie...definitely not the dice game (I hated that part of the movie, to be honest).....so that's how I find myself here today....a desperate J/E fan.....someone who is angry that they took the great Captain Jack Sparrow....developed him into a deep and intriguing character beyond the rogue we fell in love with in POTC and then leaving him out to dry...a victim of unrequited love....don't like it one bit

You said it....I agree with you. The thing is, with me, my JE obsession started with a fanfic, though I could see the chemistry in CotPB and found the WE BORING. (Not to mention that Capt Jack/Johnny captured my heart and I was pissed that he didn't get the girl)It started to grow and soon I loathed Will and WE completely and started looking for all kinds of signs in P1...When I learned that there would be a Kiss between JE in DMC I was ecstatic. After I saw it, I sooo wanted them to be together, but I've always been a pessimist and I never truly believed that we would get what we wanted and I've resigned myself to WE(though I HATE it)...and I agree with you, to have Jack being unrequited in love is NOT to my liking. It would have been better if they never kissed or if TnT never wrote so much flirting into DMC.
I'm annoyed that AWE most likely will be "haha got you with the JE didn't we, nanananana"
Ah well, there is always fanfiction...

Originally posted by Alina
You said it....I agree with you. The thing is, with me, my JE obsession started with a fanfic, though I could see the chemistry in CotPB and found the WE BORING. (Not to mention that Capt Jack/Johnny captured my heart and I was pissed that he didn't get the girl)It started to grow and soon I loathed Will and WE completely and started looking for all kinds of signs in P1...When I learned that there would be a Kiss between JE in DMC I was ecstatic. After I saw it, I sooo wanted them to be together, but I've always been a pessimist and I never truly believed that we would get what we wanted and I've resigned myself to WE(though I HATE it)...and I agree with you, to have Jack being unrequited in love is NOT to my liking. It would have been better if they never kissed or if TnT never wrote so much flirting into DMC.
I'm annoyed that AWE most likely will be "haha got you with the JE didn't we, nanananana"
Ah well, there is always fanfiction...


yes, and there's always youtube.....i've downloaded many of those vids so I can continue to watch them even if they are ever removed....which they be soon come time for the DVD to be released...dunno just a thought.....

Originally posted by lovethemtigers
yes, and there's always youtube.....i've downloaded many of those vids so I can continue to watch them even if they are ever removed....which they be soon come time for the DVD to be released...dunno just a thought.....

Hmm, maybe I should do that as well...I have like 100 on my favourites list...Something to do on a boring Sunday!

Originally posted by calypso
Ltt & Willo I agree with both of you.

And Willo even TnT said Captain Jack Sparrow is exactly as they wrote him, but the way JD played CJS was not at all what they had envisioned
or expected.

It's just like in these threads. Ppl say something and because you cannot see them or tell by the inflection in their voice, someone becomes offended.

I still think we will like the outcome and I am not giving up and I will be there on opening day.

My passion is not just J/E in DMC, but JD and that roguish smile and the sexy way he moves. I still say he has courtly movements and mannerisms. But, don't get me wrong, I would love to see the fairytale ending of J/E.

Calypso, I agree with you.....for me, although I am in love with the J/E pairing...obsessed actually, I love JD as JS and that's what first drew me to the movies....yes, I can't wait to find out what the real mystery is behind our dear Captain Jack Sparrow...yes, love seeing his rougish smile, his mannerisms...love seeing him get himself out of tight spots and I love to just see him period....so, I will see AWE if for no other reason than to see Johnny D.....one more time as our beloved Captain Jack Sparrow...but they better make him a hero, they better not leave him a victim of unrequited love....that would be terrible....but there is just something about seeing a sexy man being in a love scene...that's why that kiss is so hot....maybe it is all about Johnny...forget Keira/elizabeth...just give me Jack/ Johnny....LOL

oh god tigers! standing ovation
I agree so much..

IMO they have actually ruined what could have been one of the most interesting romances to develop on screen in a very long time.

I know Pirates life fo says the movie got to 1 billion because movie 1 did so well..

Well thats true but that only really effects the opening weekend. The success of a previous movie usually is only reflected in the opening weekend gross of its sequel..

If something really works then people keep going back to see it again and again. That is when it gets to 1 billion...I had to learn all of this.

when a movie gets to 1 billion thats mainly because people become die hard fans of it and this mostly happens because of a romance aspect like Titanic or because its an end to an epic like Lord of the rings. PotC DMC is kinda a mixture of both possibly??

And its not because of the ride..for one most of the planet don't even know the ride exists and have never been on it in their life yet they are die hard fans of the movie (me for one although I know it exists but I dont love it)..Its the story people go to watch they don't go there to watch ride references.

haunted mansion is a loved ride isn't it?? that movie flopped..its the quality of the stories and Jack sparrow thats the main reason for PotC's success..and DMC's story was based around Jack and Elizabeth..the main climax revolves around the two..because the whole movie built to it...which means J/E is the prime theme of DMC..and this is obviously what people enjoyed about it..plus everything else that comes along with PotC which was theree in movie 1.

And Tigers I agree with you on the whole using Jack as a spanner..that is what upsets me the most..people care more about Jack Sparrow than Will Turner..and they chose the wrong guy to use as a spanner in the works of a sickening W/E relationship IMO..

Jack is not a back up character to be used like that..he is the STAR, He's not Norrington. it pisses me off that they used him in a similar way to Norrington in CotBP...Jack is far more precious to the audience than that..they shouldnt have done it with him.

Originally posted by LovelyOne
oh god tigers! standing ovation
I agree so much..

IMO they have actually ruined what could have been one of the most interesting romances to develop on screen in a very long time.

I know Pirates life fo says the movie got to 1 billion because movie 1 did so well..

Well thats true but that only really effects the opening weekend. The success of a previous movie usually is only reflected in the opening weekend gross of its sequel..

If something really works then people keep going back to see it again and again. That is when it gets to 1 billion...I had to learn all of this.

when a movie gets to 1 billion thats mainly because people become die hard fans of it and this mostly happens because of a romance aspect like Titanic or because its an end to an epic like Lord of the rings. PotC DMC is kinda a mixture of both possibly??

And its not because of the ride..for one most of the planet don't even know the ride exists and have never been on it in their life yet they are die hard fans of the movie (me for one although I know it exists but I dont love it)..Its the story people go to watch they don't go there to watch ride references.

haunted mansion is a loved ride isn't it?? that movie flopped..its the quality of the stories and Jack sparrow thats the main reason for PotC's success..and DMC's story was based around Jack and Elizabeth..the main climax revolves around the two..because the whole movie built to it...which means J/E is the prime theme of DMC..and this is obviously what people enjoyed about it..plus everything else that comes along with PotC which was theree in movie 1.

I agree.....the success of the movie has nothing to do with it being a beloved ride...yeah, that's what attracted some to the original movie...but it was Captain Jack Sparrow that made it successful..and then his character development in DMC that catapulted that one over the one billion mark....I guarantee you...if it ends with a similar twist...a J/E ending for AWE..then it could possibly pass Titanic...

also, I agree that movie 2 is about the J/E relationship....they over this overlying them about Jack has a debt to pay to Davy Jones...his soul, etc. blah, blah, blah...but if that were the main theme...then why isn't Jack's compass working...why is there such focus on the one big symbol of DMC..the compass....THE COMPASS...the compass that doesn't point north ....it points to the thing you want MOST in this world....when does the compass finally appear to work..when Elizabeth shows up in Tortuga..loading the Pearl....and when she holds it...it points to JACk....if it was suppose to be the chest on the island..why did the camera focus on Jack, why did she get mad, why did Norrie have that "oh please" look on his face...Why does Beckett want the compass.....Will needs the compass to free Liz....People say Jack was selfish and betrayed Will...but isn't that what Will was really trying to do with Jack...he wanted the compass for his own selfish reasons, to free the bonny lass, what's her name.....if Jack just hands the compass over to will to bring to Beckett...what does that do....Jack is actually protecting everyone involved when he sends Will to find the key....he knows he cannot let Beckett control the sea...he knows what it will mean for the ex-slaves, the pirates, etc...he knows Beckett...he probably knows he won't uphold his end of the bargain with Will, Jack is a smart man.....

Will is the bloody stupid one.....I still believe Jack actually did Will a favor sending him onto the Flying Dutchman...he knew Will was safer there than with him...he knew Will would get in his way...he knew Will would meet up with his father, who would protect him, he knew Davy would not really accept Will as payment for his debt.....he knows Beckett wants the compass to control the sea...but Will doesnt'....

So, how stupid would it have been for Jack to just willingly hand the compass over to Will...duh...Jack's a smart man...
I wish Will supporters would just realise this...and Jack did not actually Lie to Elizabeth....he just misled her, he was telling the truth about the compass and the chest...he just fibbed a little about how Will got on board the Flying Dutchman..cuz he knew she wouldn't understand his motives.....

But...it's Will who is going to betray Jack in AWE...and that more than anything is going to make me really dislike Will more and more.....

I've hated Will(and Orlando) for a long time, if he does anything to my beloved Jack, I won't answer to the concequences.
It irritates me how TnT seem to constantly try and convince us that Will is an interesting character, the main character,when 95% of the audience goes to see the movies because of JACK/JOHNNY...Not Binky...If they had an actor, who doesn't always overact, to play Will, things would be a little more interesting. The Character of Will is so one-dimesional and to have an actor like O.Bloom to play him is a bad casting choice. IMO, he is the weakest one of the whole actors-group.

I agree with everything you say lovethemtigers. I have a feeling Elizabeth may have realized what Jack's motives were whilst she was in Tia's hut..she is a pirate too, she's very much like Jack she made a whole ship do what she wanted it to do without raising a finger just like Jack. and I think she may have realized that Jack didn't do that to Will in a cold hearted way..He was doing it for a rather noble purpose. He didn't want pirates to die out as well as himself...

which makes me think of what Elizabeth's actions have actually done to Jack in AWE..she appears to have made that honest and good man disappear in that draft script

I agree Will is rather annoying, If they want me to be rooting for him to be with Liz at the end of AWE..I can tell you making him betray Jack is not the way to go.

Alina I agree with you when it comes to T&T having a habit of making Will be the most deserving person all the time..they are trying to give him depth but are the critics reviews just not getting through to them?? Because people dont care about Will Turner..Even when I wasnt a shipper you dont understand how bored I was watching them trying to give Will more screen time on the dutchman, the liars dice was so bloody boring. I was like where is Jack??

if they go into depth with any character of course the majority of the audience are going to only be interested in Jack's character and back story not Will's.

It's a pity...I remember all to well, how Ted or Terry, some time ago, on their forum, started complaining about how Johnny got all the attention...Yes, POTC is a team effort, but if it hadn't been for Johnny's Capt Jack, we wouldn't be sitting here, because then there would have been no sequels.....

I think they just dont like the thought of having a character that no one really cares about..and so they are trying to make him more accepted...

Could be....But I have a spooky feeling that AWE will be very Will-focused and frankly I don't want to see more Will. I want more Jack, more Liz, more Norry, heck even more Beckett. It wouldn't surprise me if they turn AWE into a Will Show, might be their attempt to make people like him. Good Luck with that *sarcasm*
Well, I'm off. See you later.

yeah I agree...with you..I would rather see Liz develop more than him..because it irks me how they say movie 1 was Elizabeth's story?? how is it?? It was more Will's than anything.

yh thts true (beginning- when he gt saved end- when he used his blood 4 the curse)

...interesting how the mast of the ship almost looks like an alter and she leaves Jack there..

that scene was Jack's "sacred marriage" that usually comes at the step he's at ..after facing step 8: "the supreme ordeal" its then step 9: "taking the reward"..

if its a woman there's usually a love scene/sacred marriage..I dunno if that was a proper marriage or if she left him before it could happen...

I'm guessing it may have been a sort of marriage because of the line "widowed before marriage, searching for her husband lost at sea".She cant even be a widow unless she was married, lost that man and is then going to re-marry.. and so she has married Jack and now she's searching for him because he IS now lost at sea and dead to her.

He seems to say "I do" with the "pirate" she refuses and runs away...but the fact she almost kisses him again suggests that its her saying "I do" cuz terry, in the commentary says that her doing that means she has to admit that she does have a desire to be with him or something..

Davy Jones anyone?

I'm wondering if Calypso was in fact married to Davy and then left him and that is how he became a monster in terms of personality

Applause for Ltt, LO and Alina.

IMO TnT wanted this to be a story about Lizzie and how a young woman grows up to follow her dream. I also think they envisioned W/L being the main focus with CJS being a secondary character, according to what they wrote for him.

If say Sean Penn, John Malkovich, Matthew McConnahe, Chevy Chase, oh hey you choose one, no one would have stood out in their portrayal of CJS like JD. Everyone keeps talking about JD's over the top creation of CJS. I never was a JD fan before COTBP, but I have since gone to the trouble to find every one of his films and see them. As an actor, he is phenomenal. He was the choice of Jerry & Gore because they knew what he could do with a character. He was always the principal principal. Someone tell me where his characterization of CJS is too over the top. He's a pirate.

Keira came next about the same time as Geoffrey Rush and then Orly signed the day before he started shooting and arrived on location in time to shoot the sword scene with Gov. Swann. Orly didn't even know if he wanted to do pirates because it was too risky. So TnT's whining is just about to tick me off. If they are nominated for any award or win any of them this year it's because JOHNNY DEPP developed one of their characters into an Oscar winning performance and delivered to them 1 BILLION $$$$ for his trouble. Without JD, their nice DMC would have been a not so seen summer blockbuster and he could have taken his paycheck and gone home.

Their comments are ludicrous and contradictory. But, they are still trying to sell AWE.

Let's all stay calm and don't do anything RASH like Will. Keep the faith.

Calypso would have had to be mortal in order to marry Davy, because he was mortal. She was a sea siren. She may have appeared to him in human form, but I cannot crossover to that in my imagination. Can anyone else?

I always thought she was crazy about CJS and acted a his protector more than his lover.

I thought the story was that she was going to marry him but left him at the altar, so they would have been only engaged.

edit - removed


I think she was with him and then left him

Honestly i have to say that this has Truely been the YEAR OF THE PIRATE!! Johnny Depp made pirates COOL again!!! And Yes JOHNNY is carrying this Movie on his BACK!! I mean the whole cast is amazing dont get me wrong but JOHNNY....well he's JOHNNY...and he DELIVERED!!! JOHNNY has created a character that will go down in history....JACK SPARROW along with JOHNNY DEPP have now become a legends!!! even though Johnny has made a name for himself before....this just put him over the TOP!!!

Okay, LovelyOne, I see what you're trying to say about feeling sorry for Jack, but come on! We all knew when we left the theater, that Jack was going to be alright. I mean, he practically waltzed into the Kraken's mouth. He's the infamous Captain Jack Sparrow, savvy? He can do anything. Will on the other hand, is just starting to get familiar to his pirate side. You guys keep on saying, "Will is a whelp. He's not a pirate" but give him a break. If you just found out you were a pirate you wouldn't immediately start doing pirate actions. He's not going to be like, "Since I'm a pirate now, I think I'll go rob some people" ALL CHARACTERS develop in a movie. He just needs to come out of his shell. Yes, I will admit that I feel more sorry for him than I do for Jack. Will saw him girlfriend kiss another man AFTER he fell and bust his ass and Liz didn't even come to see if he was alright. Also, he got whipped by his own freaking FATHER! And you say that I have no reason to feel sorry for him?! Pssh! Trust me, Jack knows how to brush his shoulder off and move on, but Will is like a puppy. He needs LOVE, and Liz is just not giving any to him.

But, I'm still more of Jack fan than Will. I'm just saying that I really do get frustrated when people give a character with great value, no credit.

Well first of Im sorry everyone is going through stressed times right now. I dont have all night to read every single post and I appoligize but I dont have enough time. But I do like to comment an opinion of my own.

Im gonna start by saying that I dont believe this. I know "big help" and no I have no proof, but its just I dont bbuy this. They havent even started writing the 4th. I thought for you to make a contract you have to have the script written already. Johnny wants to keep going but hasnt signed any contracts yet. So what makes you think keira will then.

This kind of dont make sense. Remember all those rumors about killing orlando and disney came to the rescue denying it. Now Disney sooner or later is gonna deny all this BS.

I have heard that Terry dont know if keira has said that she was gonna keep going for pirates 4 or not. I knew this was fake right away. If keira wants to or not should the writers know first? Its reall between her and the writers, they are the ones who writes the story, so why tell the press first other than the ones who made you the character and made you famous for the role??

I smell BS in here and again I have no proof...but I just dont buy it.

LOL Good point there Chiki, its just pure garbage... I Dont buy it.

wait- buy what?

The contracts, I don't think neither one of them have sign in a contract for the 4th installment

neither do I. Those rumors are crap to me! I wont belive anything until the third one ends in a cliffhanger of some sort!

ditto!

*ACHOOO** Im sorry Im just allergic to bull shit lol

HAHAHAH ur hilarious Mina!

Originally posted by Chiki Mina
*ACHOOO** Im sorry Im just allergic to bull shit lol

LMAO!!!!

I'm sticking to my guns, and every interview I've seen....Calypso I agree...without Johnny D.....and with Alina....and Lovely, Kate, PirateDiva, Misty Pirates, J D 4life, and Chiki.......without Johnny D none of us would even still be sitting here today having these discussions....without his absolutley fabulous portrayal of Jack Sparrow....there would have been no DMC....and yes, sorry - but I can't help it...i've tried to like Will, I really did.....but I just think he's boring and he's bloody stupid....when I'm in the theatre watching DMC for the first time and they are having all those scenes with Will on the Flying Dutchman I was thinking to myself "okay, this movie is crap, where is Captain Jack..." I was really disliking the movie up to that point, for me the best parts of the movie start in Tortuga when Jack is sitting behind the plant "i know what I want"...then NOrrington shows up...gosh, what a great part, Ilove that...and then Elizabeth shows up..and then the scene "Captain Sparrow".."come to join my crew lad, welcome aboard"....."i've come to find the man I lvoe..."......."elizabeth, hide the rum...you know, these clothes do no flatter you a'tall, it should be a dress or nothing"...I sat up in my chair and was like...okay, now this is getting interesting..and then the stupid liar's dice scene came on..which I sitll don't understand....oh well, have to run....

Originally posted by JD_4_Life
Okay, LovelyOne, I see what you're trying to say about feeling sorry for Jack, but come on! We all knew when we left the theater, that Jack was going to be alright.


wanna bet on that? Trust me...Jack Sparrow is not gonna be fine and dandy when he's in purgatory and gets pulled out. Its gonna affect him in ways we never thought possible of Jack. because Jack is not a 1 dimensional character who never changes..he has a lot of depth and it really annoys me that people only see him as if he has one layer and is just the comic relief all the time..he's not.he's very tragic actually..

Will is a bastard..have you not seen the leaked script?

He trades Jack the moment he comes back so that he can have his ship

if T&T are trying to make us root for Will to get the girl over Jack.IMO they are going the wrong way about it by making him betray everyons favorite character.

Why are they using Jack as if he;s a ****ing rag doll to be trhown around so that W/E can end "happily" ever after..

Also JD for life..I dont feel sorry for Will because Liz kissed him. I feel sorry for Jack putting his life on the line and gaining feelings for a woman who could give a shit about him it seems..

remind you of Calypso and Davy Jones?

if not..I'm sure AWE will get that point across right from the get go.

Jack is a shell of a human being..He's not alright..in movie 1 whilst he was on the beach we saw his weakness...when he doesnt have anything to his name we see him for what he really is underneath, as a rather tragic, weak, cowardly man..

Yet again though..people just laughed at that despite seeing that Jack underneath has nothing in life to live for but material possesions and whores..what human being can honestly say money buys them happines?? Jack is not happy with the way he lives his life IMO..no human would be after years and years of it..by DMC..Jack is starting to feel the void created by this kind of on a large scale IMO.

movie 2 showed us that even material objects cant keep him safe and strong, his pearl cant, land cant, the sea cant and Elizabeth doesnt seem to be the answer either..so what on earth is this man going to live for once everything is taken away from him in the future when pirate kind comes to an end? Every time Jack shows people who he really is they turn it around on him and treat him like shit..it really does hurt him..what a sad thing to happen to a man who has such an honest nature deep down...by movie 3 according to T&T Jack begins to truly loathe the honest side of himself because every time he displays it to people they run away from him and leave him to die basically *cough* davy Jones *cough*

poor Jack..

Originally posted by LovelyOne
Also JD for life..I dont feel sorry for Will because Liz kissed him. I feel sorry for Jack putting his life on the line and gaining feelings for a woman who could give a shit about him it seems..

remind you of Calypso and Davy Jones?

if not..I'm sure AWE will get that point across right from the get go.

Jack is a shell of a human being..He's not alright..in movie 1 whilst he was on the beach we saw his weakness...when he doesnt have anything to his name we see him for what he really is underneath, as a rather tragic, weak, cowardly man..

Yet again though..people just laughed at that despite seeing that Jack underneath has nothing in life to live for but material possesions and whores..what human being can honestly say money buys them happines?? Jack is not happy with the way he lives his life IMO..no human would be after years and years of it..by DMC..Jack is starting to feel the void created by this kind of on a large scale IMO.

movie 2 showed us that even material objects cant keep him safe and strong, his pearl cant, land cant, the sea cant and Elizabeth doesnt seem to be the answer either..so what on earth is this man going to live for once everything is taken away from him in the future when pirate kind comes to an end? Every time Jack shows people who he really is they turn it around on him and treat him like shit..it really does hurt him..what a sad thing to happen to a man who has such an honest nature deep down...by movie 3 according to T&T Jack begins to truly loathe the honest side of himself because every time he displays it to people they run away from him and leave him to die basically *cough* davy Jones *cough*

poor Jack..

I agree Lovely, I sure hope that Jack is redeemed in movie 3....that he finds true happiness.....Jack is a very lonely man, deep down inside...that's why he carries on with such antics....he's hiding his true nature....I know we say Jack is a Pirate...but he was forced to become a Pirate....think about. Real true pirates are nasty, mean, theiving, murdering, raping, maddening individuals...like Barboosa....and those other nasty pirates in his crew of miscreants.....look at Jack. He is nothing like those other Pirates....he may look like one...although he is absolutely gorgeous despire his dirty hands, he may be mischevious and use people as leverage (to protect everyone around him in the end)...but he is not really and truly a Pirate...he's a good man, with a good heart....i think we will find that in the end Will is the true Pirate...the murdering, nasty, hateful Pirate...like Barbossa...and perhaps, Liz is too....Jack is more like a Privateer...without sanction from the EITC....he doesn't raid, pillage and plunder....he tries so hard to be a real Pirate...but he's really not...he's a good man. Look at Gibbs and Cotton and Marty and Pintel and Ragetti....do they truly have Pirate personalities...no, because they couldn't desert Jack...they didn't stick to the code and leave him behind....because they are not really, truly Pirates....they are social outcast who have been forced into the pirate lifestyle but are not really....do you understand where I'm coming from....what does all this mean....Ragetti is trying to read the bible, he's tired of being bad. Gibbs is like a father figure to Jack. I've never seen any of them do anything really horrible...except in POTC 1 when Pintel and Ragetti were part of Barbossa' crew of miscreants......

That was very beautiful Lovethemtigers I totally agree.

Jack was branded a pirate by Beckett...but was he committing any crime...no, I think Beckett branded him that so that Jack would be an outcast...because he refused to do Beckett's dirty work...he refused to transport the slaves, he refused to be mean and cruel to women and children....once I read where a Will supporter said that Jack was a nasty Pirate with scurvey and dirty, ratty hair and has bad breath, that he's comitted ungodly crimes.....but I have seen no evidence that Jack has comitted any crime greater than lifting a few items from Tia's cabin, taking the money bag on the dock at the beginning of POTC....and knowing Jack, he probably gave that money to a poor, helpless individual on the streets of Port Royal.....at the end they said he impersonated the clergy...I bet if he did it was to help someone get out of a tight spot...cuz Jack's like that....remember he hates that honest side of himself cuz it gets him in trouble....everytime Jack does the right thing, people take advantage of him....he's trying to help Will save Elizabeth and what does Will do...knock him over the head with a paddle....Jack tries to keep Will's identity a secret from Barbossa and what does Will do...he tells Barbossa who he is and thus endangers Jack and Elizabeth when they are forced to jump into the ocean and swim to the deserted Island....Jack comes back to the Pearl to help Elizabeth and the rest of them escape...and what happens, a person he opens his heart too, shows his unverability to....chains him to a mast and leaves him to die....because she is too bloody stupid to realize she actually loves the man, that he is the man for her not Will....but I think she will discover this truth in AWE....if not, well, then. Death to the B****!

Look how Jack is acting in that last scene..."she's only a ship, Mate".....We are not free yet, luv"....the way he is looking at Lizzie just before the kiss is breath taking...I think his eyes were telling her how much she means to him in that seen...eyes and mannerisms speak volumes, more than words at certain times....and then Liz acts an a selfish impulse...she wants to know what Jack tastes like....she can't resist, then she also wants to act like a Pirate..so she sacrifices him so she and the others can escapse...but Liz is young and confused...she doesn't really grasp the magnitude of what she has done until she gets to Tia's cabin....to her it was almost like a game...to show Jack that she could be piratey...that he and her are alike....PIRATE....I don't believe she wants to rescue Jack simply because she feels guilty...

And again, as we've said many times...interesting how both movies end and begin in similar fashion...that cannot be coincidence...I think T and T intended...if not, then they didn't realize what they were doing....movie one..Liz is singing the Pirate song on a ship looking out into the ocean, she teaches Jack the pirate song and then he is singing it on a ship looking into the ocean at the end.....then movie 1...Liz is crying and looking miserable in the rain, it ends with Liz crying (we see Jack in a coffin) and looking miserable in Tia's cabin (jack was last seen being swallowed by the Kracken)....

Sorry for the long post I just have so many thoughts about the movie right now...a movie I'm suppose to be letting go of...but can't seem to....especially the closer we get to Dec. 5

LoveThemTigers you that was wonderful I agree with you 100%. I think Elizabeth will realize that what she did was wrong. Also I agree with that she's not going to the end of the world and beyond to get Jack because she fells guilty she's doing it because she realizes that she does love him and wants him back. I don't know if you had read the Dead Man's Chest comic book that Disney did put out. But in the last scene of that comic book when Tia asks them what they be willing to do to bring Jack back Elizabeth says': I'll go down to Davy Jones Locker if that what it takes" Interesting right?

Lovethemtigers I agree with you on everything you say

Also I really do love the way Jack is just looking at Elizabeth there before she kisses him. Jack is most honest when he is silent..he barley says 2 words in that entire scene..the way he is looking at her is exactly how he feels..he's honest..he's being who he really is, he's laid bare again and Liz knows it the *****..notice no swaying on the spot..no smirking because he thinks hes gonna get a kiss..he's being dead serious, he's being his honest self. He wants her more than anything and not just for sex..if he was lusting after her here it would look very different. And yes he does look down at her lips..but its not a lusting way..he just looks at them

*swoon* its getting hot in here... all that talk of pirate kisses... wow.

you guys are amazing, seriously. everything you have said is so poignant and true.

Lovethemtigers, I so agree with you. if Elizabeth and Jack don't end up together in some vein, then by all means, IMO, Elizabeth can drown herself to save Will or whatever. lol.

yeah those two can royally just **** off from the franchise now. Jack is better off without them in his life to constantly ruin things for him, and destroy all that is good about him..I hope Elizabeth does get shackled to the whelp as if its a prison sentence..oh funny hows she's in a prison at the start of 2 saying she's wait for will...well **** no she didnt do that..Actually I hope elizabeth dies. I hate her..she better get punished for what she did to Jack ..or at least redeem herself for HIM

..so far from what I'm hearing she brown noses Will throughout much of AWE..Will is NOT the man she destroyed at the end of DMC..

yup. its clear that cant trust each other. she's a man-eater. lol.

Actually ..why does it seem according to the spoilers that she doesnt redeem herself for Jack at all in AWE??

Just getting him back is not enough...no way near enough..she may have brought him back but she has done a lot more damage than I think she's aware of..and she has the cheek to spit in his face when he trades her over in the leaked script the little *****

No way are they going to let her leave this trilogy without redeeming herself for Jack...no way..she will go down as a pretty disliked character..

Yeah the curiosty scene...if that was just about lust then in no way would she be talking about the kind of good man she wants him to be..that is obiously the one thing about Jack she would love and I think she has probably destroyed that now..when he first comes back from purgatory Jack is very cold hearted in the leaked draft script..she better bring that good man back or I'll hate her for an eternity

If she really a cold hearted ***** like Calypso then she will not help Jack..but if she does really love that part of him..she'll love him enough to bring him back IMO And if Will's not an entire selfish bastard he will let Liz do this..

A possible spoiler that Kate got in an email:

"Jack realizes something about himself that stems from what happened in DMC. With the help of Elizabeth and his father, he is able to overcome this struggle. It is at this moment that Elizabeth realizes where her heart truly lies."

yeah I heard he only comes in at the very end too..

yes the spoiler continues... Elizabeth realizes that life without Jack is simply not worth living, so she chains herself to the Pearl and tricks Jack into marrying her by faking a pregnancy. Will and Norrington add a politically correct gay romance into the equation, and Jack and Elizabeth decide to adopt the whores to keep Gibbs company.

Originally posted by katelovespirate
yes the spoiler continues... Elizabeth realizes that life without Jack is simply not worth living, so she chains herself to the Pearl and tricks Jack into marrying her by faking a pregnancy. Will and Norrington add a politically correct gay romance into the equation, and Jack and Elizabeth decide to adopt the whores to keep Gibbs company.

LOL!!!