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Vader in the first star wars movies vs Maul in TPM.

who winz??

Hard to tell, Maul is in my top 5 duelists from what we'v seen in the movies, but Vader is easily in the top 5 most powerful with the force from what we have seen in the movies.

would Vader have the dexterity to be able to keep up with Maul just saber dueling wise?

Vader is slow, but not unskilled.

Kinda like REX!

Originally posted by braz
would Vader have the dexterity to be able to keep up with Maul just saber dueling wise? EU Vader might, but not the OT Vader.

um vader defeated maul in the vader vs maul comic. And vader isnt slow, not that kind of slowv and btw ot vader > EU vader

Vader, canoncally, is slow...there's no getting around it. EU doesn't matter because, IT'S EU. Movies are the highest form of canon, and he is in fact slow. As youcan tell by using your gift of site, and by using your gift of hearing, and listening to GL say it himself.

Now, does that mean that Maul will because he's faster? Of course not. With Vader's customized form, he doesn't NEED to be fast. He'll chop you down and wear you out, then strike you down. All he would need to do is crush or choke Maul. If he can tear apart a door (which was EU) then he can rip apart Maul...physically, like tear his limbs off through the force. Maul stands no chance.

Originally posted by Kadesh
um vader defeated maul in the vader vs maul comic. And vader isnt slow, not that kind of slowv and btw ot vader > EU vader keyword=comic=EU.
Vader would probably win anyway because of his awswome ability to throw debris and things around while fighting.

Shouldn't Vader be faster than most because Greivous is?

different type of cybernetics. Anakin/Vader had more human parts...all his joints were human and presumably weakened by burning on a lava river bank. I've argued that many times myself, but to no avail.

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
Vader, canoncally, is slow...there's no getting around it. EU doesn't matter because, IT'S EU. Movies are the highest form of canon, and he is in fact slow. As youcan tell by using your gift of site, and by using your gift of hearing, and listening to GL say it himself.
ok i get your point, But sadly it has been recorded that vader actually could do those things. And no statements have been made of a contradiction

O and you want to use higher canon from movies? Then DE series completely contradicts ROTJ cuz we saw boba fett die. Try to explain that. And we are using EU vader in this battle

yup boba is alive, how can you say movies are the highest canon the highest canon should be the creator of course im not saying he shouldnt watch what he say like oh well boba fett is actually kerit the frog well of course thats not canon, but like when lucas stated or implied palps would own mace straight up but let him win then i would believe him.

if he had all his body cybernetically enchaned like grevious that would mean even more loss of mydiclorians thats why he never reaches his full potential of force power, if he did he'd be twice as powerful as emperor palpatine if he had not lost his limbs.

And didnt emperor palpatine stated that vaders limitations are mental and not psycological? I find it rather amusing when palpatine told him seld "Sith power resides in the will, not flesh" Thats what made pal and sion so powerful, Will power and vader was lacking that

who's sion........hmm well that is true the above i mean shouldnt vader have been able to heal himself.

Darth sion is a sith lord from kotor2. His flesh has been cracked and torn apart and his bones have been splintered time and again, He survived by his sheer will power alone. That is why i said palpatines statement is true of "sith power resides in the will, not flesh" And when pal says something, he is usually right because id rate him the smartest sith inall of star wars

Originally posted by Kadesh
ok i get your point, But sadly it has been recorded that vader actually could do those things. And no statements have been made of a contradiction

O and you want to use higher canon from movies? Then DE series completely contradicts ROTJ cuz we saw boba fett die. Try to explain that. And we are using EU vader in this battle

We don't see him die, we see him fall into the Sarlacc, and it is explained how he escapes in his series of novels. No contradiction.

Originally posted by Crado
We don't see him die, we see him fall into the Sarlacc, and it is explained how he escapes in his series of novels. No contradiction. Um yes we did, all those who fell into the pit were assumed dead. And didnt some one here mentioned that the commentary stated he died? By the way, "Movie is higher canon". we saw boba die on screen. Novels arent higher canon. And i doubt the rotj novel said he survied.

That is why i said whats done has been done. If the EU showed boba leaving alive then so be it, accept it. The same can be said for vaders speed. If he has already done things we think he cant, what can we do? nothing am i correct?

well i dont know, it might be vaders custamised form which MAKES him look fast. i think we all need to argue on this one dont cha think.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Um yes we did, all those who fell into the pit were assumed dead.

Keyword: assumed.

All we saw depicted on screen is that he fell. It's never stated that it's unfeasible to ever escape the Sarlacc, nor that he actually died. It's that he was presumed to be dead. Boba Fett proved that it's not impossible to escape, but implausible (although, if I recall, somewhere it's said that a Hutt survived, but I assume it's non-canon):

"These reports are allegedly from the only person known to survive being swallowed by a Sarlacc -- the bounty hunter Boba Fett. His iron will and Mandalorian armor kept him alive inside the beast, and his weapons-covered suit afforded him escape from agony. It would be years before both Fett's body and reputation recovered from the Sarlacc. "

-- Star Wars databank, Sarlacc.

So as it would seem, he did survive, and it is consider canonical and fits in with continuity, and to further prove that point Leland Chee agrees:

"Boba Fett climbs out of the Sarlacc in the Marvel comic only to be thrown back in again while inside the hull of a sandcrawler. His real escape is chronicled elsewhere in various other sources."

-- Leland Chee, Movie Characters killed in the EU.

And that Boba Fett actually survived twice, apparently, because he notes that the only non-continuity death on his list is Watto's.



No, because it didn't.



No, we didn't. We saw him fall, we didn't see him die. There's quite a difference.

Once in the Sarlacc's body, he was able to survive quite simply due to his armor (and willpower, noted by the Sarlacc's semi-sentient habits). And he eventually escaped, as his armor (which protects heavily against blaster bolts, intense heat, acid, et cetera) protected him. And further looking into the case, it's revealed in Fett's databank entry for the Expanded Universe:

"When he plunged into the beast, he was kept alive by numerous fibrous suckers that attached themselves to his body. This was part of the Sarlacc's horrible metabolic process; it would keep its prey alive for thousands of years, all the while slowly feeding off it. Fett almost lost his identity in the swirling dementia brought about by the Sarlacc's toxins. His resolve held, and he used his weapons to blast free of the beast."

Which explains exactly how Fett survived.

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2164/bobafettfallwh4.th.jpg

And for reinforcement purposes, falling is not dying, and you do not die instantly from being dropped into the Great Pit of Carkoon to the Sarlacc as proven.



Who said the RotJ novelization said he survived? It's explained in later novels, noted in the databank, and confirmed by Leland Chee.

Now, before you go on with "BUT ADDVENT WAT ABOUT VADER SPD LOL?" there's also a huge difference in attempting to analogize Darth Vader to Boba Fett in the manner you are doing because Boba Fett was never delineated on screen to die (key). He was shown to simply fall, and later tales chronicle on how he survived. However, Vader was unmistakably shown on screen to be a slow, crippled cyborg. So, the comparison is pretty faulty given that fact.

I'm not saying you cannot make an argument for his speed using another example, but the same thing cannot be said for Vader's speed in comparison to Boba's death due to the actuality (although, I'd assume majority of arguments will be futile and/or faulty anyways).

Well, they faught in an Infintry and Vader won, though it was close and Vader nearly killed himself in the process.

Originally posted by Advent
Keyword: assumed.

All we saw depicted on screen is that he fell. It's never stated that it's unfeasible to ever escape the Sarlacc, nor that he actually died. It's that he was presumed to be dead. Boba Fett proved that it's not impossible to escape, but implausible (although, if I recall, somewhere it's said that a Hutt survived, but I assume it's non-canon):

"These reports are allegedly from the only person known to survive being swallowed by a Sarlacc -- the bounty hunter Boba Fett. His iron will and Mandalorian armor kept him alive inside the beast, and his weapons-covered suit afforded him escape from agony. It would be years before both Fett's body and reputation recovered from the Sarlacc. "

-- Star Wars databank, Sarlacc.

So as it would seem, he did survive, and it is consider canonical and fits in with continuity, and to further prove that point Leland Chee agrees:

"Boba Fett climbs out of the Sarlacc in the Marvel comic only to be thrown back in again while inside the hull of a sandcrawler. His real escape is chronicled elsewhere in various other sources."

-- Leland Chee, Movie Characters killed in the EU.

And that Boba Fett actually survived twice, apparently, because he notes that the only non-continuity death on his list is Watto's.



No, because it didn't.



No, we didn't. We saw him fall, we didn't see him die. There's quite a difference.

Once in the Sarlacc's body, he was able to survive quite simply due to his armor (and willpower, noted by the Sarlacc's semi-sentient habits). And he eventually escaped, as his armor (which protects heavily against blaster bolts, intense heat, acid, et cetera) protected him. And further looking into the case, it's revealed in Fett's databank entry for the Expanded Universe:

"When he plunged into the beast, he was kept alive by numerous fibrous suckers that attached themselves to his body. This was part of the Sarlacc's horrible metabolic process; it would keep its prey alive for thousands of years, all the while slowly feeding off it. Fett almost lost his identity in the swirling dementia brought about by the Sarlacc's toxins. His resolve held, and he used his weapons to blast free of the beast."

Which explains exactly how Fett survived.

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2164/bobafettfallwh4.th.jpg

And for reinforcement purposes, falling is not dying, and you do not die instantly from being dropped into the Great Pit of Carkoon to the Sarlacc as proven.



Who said the RotJ novelization said he survived? It's explained in later novels, noted in the databank, and confirmed by Leland Chee.

Now, before you go on with "BUT ADDVENT WAT ABOUT VADER SPD LOL?" there's also a huge difference in attempting to analogize Darth Vader to Boba Fett in the manner you are doing because Boba Fett was never delineated on screen to die (key). He was shown to simply fall, and later tales chronicle on how he survived. However, Vader was unmistakably shown on screen to be a slow, crippled cyborg. So, the comparison is pretty faulty given that fact.

I'm not saying you cannot make an argument for his speed using another example, but the same thing cannot be said for Vader's speed in comparison to Boba's death due to the actuality (although, I'd assume majority of arguments will be futile and/or faulty anyways). ok.. looks like i got my ass handed again,

Well guess you are right here.

Im just saying "higher canon from movies" cant be used as an excuse to make vader slow because he has several times demonstrated speed and agility in the EU. Firstly how is he going to take on 8 jedi masters if he was really that slow. Secondly when he was shown to be fast many times it has already been recorded and already done. You cant change the fact that he has been fast in the EU by simply saying "It contradicts the movies" when it doesnt. We could say "Midget man couldnt climb this building in this movie, but he could in the Comic and he climb that same building which we thought he couldnt". Technically the same can be applied to vader, i just have no idea how to interpret it

i say Vader wins via more force power.

in a saber duel Maul would win, but force involved i think Vader would win.

Vader wins in a lightsaber duel and a Force duel actually. Vader's a master of many lightsaber forms and has strong experience and ability with them, especially Djem So. He uses the Force while fighting and he'll beat up Maul.

naw not the saber duel. Maul is too fast and quick for him. His disabilities will always be a large burden for him, and Maul is definitely strong himself. IMO as far as saber dueling goes i think Maul takes him down.

Vader is slow, but not weak. He is able to take on several Jedi at once (8) and own them. In the Vader vs. Tyrannus, he's been literally accepted by the majority (with the exceptions of Rampant Ox, Darthsith19, and some others) as the greater. And the comicbooks shows Vader killing Maul in a SABER DUEL, so your argument collapses.

Though in that comic, he didn't win by skill...

So what if he used a cheap move, he still won didn't he?

Yup, but again, not by skill, he won because Maul got cocky, and Vader basically killed himself!

That was a clone of Maul, to argue that he would be exactly as powerful as the real Maul begs for proof. And was that comic even canon?

And PK, Vader hardly owned the jedi masters.

In addition, what do you Vader was expecting when he arrived at that planet? Next thing he knows, he sees this Sith Lord Zabrak wielding a double-bladed lightsaber (which he has never seen in his life, or at least in decades) ferociously attacking him. Yet still Vader brought him down.

Yet right after ROTS, Vader busts the Conclave on Kessel and kills four Jedi: Shadday Potkin, Koffi Arana, Sia-Lan Wezz, and Ma'kis even though he had limited time inside the suit...

And yes, killing eight Jedi is hard, but Vader did it.

Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
Yet right after ROTS, Vader busts the Conclave on Kessel and kills four Jedi: Shadday Potkin, Koffi Arana, Sia-Lan Wezz, and Ma'kis even though he had limited time inside the suit...

And yes, killing eight Jedi is hard, but Vader did it.
Vader killed 8 Jedi? When was this?

Darth Maul will be a major threat to (suited) Vader in Saber Combat. But (suited) Vader has more knowledge of the force and he also has learned from his past mistakes, so he will put up a much better fight.

I think that (suited) Vader will win in this fight.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Vader killed 8 Jedi? When was this?
Darth Vader killed a total of 8 Jedi in Great Jedi Purge event after the events of Episode III.

These Jedi are:

1) Koffi Arana
2) Tsui Choi
3) Roblio Darte
4) Jastus Farr
5) Ma'kis'shaalas
6) Dama Montalvo
7) Shadday Potkin
8) Bultar Swan

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Darth Vader killed a total of 8 Jedi in Great Jedi Purge event after the events of Episode III.

These Jedi are:

1) Koffi Arana
2) Tsui Choi
3) Roblio Darte
4) Jastus Farr
5) Ma'kis'shaalas
6) Dama Montalvo
7) Shadday Potkin
8) Bultar Swan

just in saber combat? or did he just like toss some across the room w/ the force, force choke some others or not take them all at once?

I would like to know too.

A correction in my above list: Dama Montalvo was not present in the meeting but Sia-Lan Wezz was.

So, the correct list is:

1) Koffi Arana
2) Tsui Choi
3) Roblio Darte
4) Jastus Farr
5) Ma'kis'shaalas
6) Sia-Lan Wezz
7) Shadday Potkin
8) Bultar Swan

Originally posted by braz
just in saber combat? or did he just like toss some across the room w/ the force, force choke some others or not take them all at once?
Here is account of this battle:

Jedi Master Shadday Potkin organized a meeting for Jedi in a planet called "Kessel. 7 other Jedi joined her in that meeting and their names are in my list.

NOTE: Two of the Jedi: 1) Roblio Darte and 2) Jastus Farr were Jedi knights actually. The rest were Jedi Masters.

The purpose of this meeting was to trap Vader and kill him. And as expected, Vader soon attacked the Jedi.

Vader quickly killed one two Jedi: 1) Sia-Lan Wezz 2) Ma'kis'shaalas in a Saber Duel.

Then Jedi Master Shadday Potkin attacked him with a cortosis blade and managed to corner Vader and dispose of his lightsaber but then Vader used the Force to grab Shadday and steal her weapon, then snapped her neck.

Now Vader using the cortosis blade disabled the Light Sabers of two more Jedi: 1) Roblio Darte and 2) Koffi Arana.

Then two Jedi Masters: 1) Tsui Choi and 2) Bultar Swan engaged Vader with their Light Sabers and seriously injured him in the dueling.

At this point Koffi Arana demanded a Light Saber from Bultar but he refused to give it, so Arana killed him which was the first major mistake.

Then Arana took Bultar's saber and charged towards Vader. This was a second mistake and Vader send the cortosis blade from his severed hand through Arana with a wave of the hand, and grabed a spare Light Saber dropped by one of the dead Jedi.

Now only 3 Jedi are left: Tsui, Roblio and Jastus.

These three remaining Jedi resorted to use the Force against Vader and start hurling rocks at Vader. Vader was now almost defeated and Tsui Choi prepared to finish him off, but suddenly 501st Legion of Stormtroopers show up and began firing on the Jedi.

Jedi Master Tsui Choi got distracted, while the two other Jedi knights: 1) Jastus Farr and 2) Roblio Darte were killed by the troops.

But taking advantage of this distraction Vader freezed Tsui Choi in the air (like using "Force Stun" in KOTOR games). Tsui in a last effort to kill Vader managed to throw his saber at him, which cut a hole in Vader's armour but still failed to kill Vader. Then stormtroopers killed the last Jedi as well.

Vader's bad***. Was this in a novel or comic book? What's the title?

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Vader's bad***. Was this in a novel or comic book? What's the title?
I think this event has been mentioned or described in detail in a Comic Book. And the name of this Comic Book is "Star Wars: Clone Wars Volume 9 - Endgame".

Yup, read that one! Pretty good.

@ Legend

Thanks for the confirmation and more detail Yes, Vader took on 8 Jedi on Kessel and kill four of them I believe. Still being able to do that even he just got stuffed in a suit is highly impressive.

Though really, if we take into account that they actually had prepared for this a long, long time, and that they actually had a cortosis blade to shut down his sword, we can say that Vader would have done much, much better if it was just him vs them in a normal vs match!

Exactly, which strengthens the argument that he can take on 8 Jedi and win. And this Vader right after ROTS. Imagine how powerful TESB Vader would have been?

Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
Vader is slow, but not weak. He is able to take on several Jedi at once (8) and own them. In the Vader vs. Tyrannus, he's been literally accepted by the majority (with the exceptions of Rampant Ox, Darthsith19, and some others) as the greater. And the comicbooks shows Vader killing Maul in a SABER DUEL, so your argument collapses. thats one writer's OPINION of what the duel would be like, that one isnt canon anyway, and he didnt win by skill, actually if i recall Maul had him on his knees before he made his little sacrifice.



Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
Exactly, which strengthens the argument that he can take on 8 Jedi and win. And this Vader right after ROTS. Imagine how powerful TESB Vader would have been?
he would be worse, seeing as how he dosent have any more jedi to fight and all hes doing is squashing little uprisings against the empire. there is no one at least decent left to fight?

The Jedi Order was said to have contain 10,000 members. It is said that slightly more than 1% survived. This is probably 150 Jedi or so. 8 Jedi were killed on Kessel. And let's say 50 Jedi survived the Purga altogether. This leaves Vader with 92 other Jedi. Vader hunted many Jedi, my friend.



What do you mean opinion? Then every Star Wars duel written in a book is opinion! It was written and was published. As for whether canon or not remains to be seen. And yes, Vader was ambushed by a Sith Lord he has never seen before. And yet, he was able to get his act together and kill Maul.

if it isnt canon, which it isnt, then its just somebody's opinon. like somone writing a short story about Mace dueling Revan or something like that.

and no he didnt have his act together, he was on the defensive the entire time. Again Maul had him on his knees, if thats what you call getting your act together, then i guess he knew what he was doing when fought he Luke on Endor.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
A correction in my above list: Dama Montalvo was not present in the meeting but Sia-Lan Wezz was.

So, the correct list is:

1) Koffi Arana
2) Tsui Choi
3) Roblio Darte
4) Jastus Farr
5) Ma'kis'shaalas
6) Sia-Lan Wezz
7) Shadday Potkin
8) Bultar Swan


Here is account of this battle:

Jedi Master Shadday Potkin organized a meeting for Jedi in a planet called "Kessel. 7 other Jedi joined her in that meeting and their names are in my list.

NOTE: Two of the Jedi: 1) Roblio Darte and 2) Jastus Farr were Jedi knights actually. The rest were Jedi Masters.

The purpose of this meeting was to trap Vader and kill him. And as expected, Vader soon attacked the Jedi.

Vader quickly killed one two Jedi: 1) Sia-Lan Wezz 2) Ma'kis'shaalas in a Saber Duel.

Then Jedi Master Shadday Potkin attacked him with a cortosis blade and managed to corner Vader and dispose of his lightsaber but then Vader used the Force to grab Shadday and steal her weapon, then snapped her neck.

Now Vader using the cortosis blade disabled the Light Sabers of two more Jedi: 1) Roblio Darte and 2) Koffi Arana.

Then two Jedi Masters: 1) Tsui Choi and 2) Bultar Swan engaged Vader with their Light Sabers and seriously injured him in the dueling.

At this point Koffi Arana demanded a Light Saber from Bultar but he refused to give it, so Arana killed him which was the first major mistake.

Then Arana took Bultar's saber and charged towards Vader. This was a second mistake and Vader send the cortosis blade from his severed hand through Arana with a wave of the hand, and grabed a spare Light Saber dropped by one of the dead Jedi.

Now only 3 Jedi are left: Tsui, Roblio and Jastus.

These three remaining Jedi resorted to use the Force against Vader and start hurling rocks at Vader. Vader was now almost defeated and Tsui Choi prepared to finish him off, but suddenly 501st Legion of Stormtroopers show up and began firing on the Jedi.

Jedi Master Tsui Choi got distracted, while the two other Jedi knights: 1) Jastus Farr and 2) Roblio Darte were killed by the troops.

But taking advantage of this distraction Vader freezed Tsui Choi in the air (like using "Force Stun" in KOTOR games). Tsui in a last effort to kill Vader managed to throw his saber at him, which cut a hole in Vader's armour but still failed to kill Vader. Then stormtroopers killed the last Jedi as well.

wow. Vader's now officially my new favorite Sith.

definitely dosent look like he won against 8 jedi by himself. aparently he didnt learn anything from his duel with obi-wan.

Um, excuse me, but apparently have you even considered the fact that Vader was stuffed into some black lifesuit and was supposed to fight against Jedi in a armor that severely lowers his mobility? Apparently not. Anakin was supposed to be one of THE FASTEST warriors in the Jedi Order. But as this suited machine, he has become in terms of speed, one of the slowest Jedi ever.

Now we have Vader, who has a considerably little experience in this suit, taking on 8 members of the Order who are awaiting him and are ready to kill him. Vader takes on all 8 of these Jedi and kills four of them.

Do you think Maul could have taken on those 8 Jedi? Perhaps, but I'm sure he would have mostly likely gotten killed.

And again, that was Vader just after ROTS. Now consider TESB Vader, who fights with the lightsaber and the Force simueltaneosly. Vader would own Maul in the Force. In the lightsaber, Vader has Jedi hunting practice. Also he ordered the manufacture of special training droids who are much more of a "practice" than those which the Jedi practice with.

In addition, Vader has mastered several forms which he applies in his fights. He has mastered Djem So to the highest degree. Maul has no chance in hell in a lightsaber fight against Vader.

Since the comic is not canon, you can't argue that your precious Maul brought Vader to his knees. Sorry. I can concede that Maul would be an irritation to Vader, using his speed to erk the Sith Lord. However, Maul will find himself stabbed by a lightsaber in the end.

i dont understand what your getting at?

ok........whats your point?


wrong, it was setup by a few of the Jedi and not all of them were aware of it. and Vader barely survived the encounter were it not for the timely arrival of the 501st.

HAD jedi hunting practice, and droids are nothing to the real thing, besides during Maul's training up until his first enounter with an actual jedi, he trained with deadly droids as well, way more deadlier than anything the jedi trained with.

No chance in hell..... yet as you stated earlier hes one of the slowest jedi (why you told me that, i still havent figured out?), with Maul being all about speed and acrobatics, he hardly gives his opponets enough time to breath let alone switch up their style, i would think a dueler like Maul is Vader's worst nightmare, because you have a best strength compared to worst weakness. And he was trained from birth, all he knows is fighting and the Dark Side, just because we havent seen him exploit some of his powers, dosent mean he dosent have them



wow.... since YOU'RE the one who brought it up

Look man, firstly being slow does not mean you will get pwned, Tsui choi is alot faster than vader and yet vader could parry his moves so easily.

Did you forget in the purge vader could shred a 1m thick blast door apart as if it was nothing and blow it back many yards by just screaming "where is my obi wan!"

Not to forget that in RODV he ripped a tree out of the ground, a tree which is undamaged by blaster fire and hurled it at roan shryne.

Also lets not forget how incredible his fight was against the dark woman, Pulling an entire waterfall attemping to drown her, Too bad the water was shallow, And lets not forget he crushed an entire tree the size of redwood trees and dropped them on the dark woman.

You read star wars empire VOL 1? He pushed a thug 50m and slamed him strait on to a wall killing the guy, And o yea forgot to mentione that vader has been known to crush tanks with the force on the battle field as proven in Eaw and being able to kill dozens of rebel soldiers with force wave alone.

And lets not forget TESB vader is far more powerful than Purge vader who took on 8 jedi masters. Him being able to kill his officer from a distance far far away.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Look man, firstly being slow does not mean you will get pwned, Tsui choi is alot faster than vader and yet vader could parry his moves so easily.

Did you forget in the purge vader could shred a 1m thick blast door apart as if it was nothing and blow it back many yards by just screaming "where is my obi wan!"

Not to forget that in RODV he ripped a tree out of the ground, a tree which is undamaged by blaster fire and hurled it at roan shryne.

Also lets not forget how incredible his fight was against the dark woman, Pulling an entire waterfall attemping to drown her, Too bad the water was shallow, And lets not forget he crushed an entire tree the size of redwood trees and dropped them on the dark woman.

You read star wars empire VOL 1? He pushed a thug 50m and slamed him strait on to a wall killing the guy, And o yea forgot to mentione that vader has been known to crush tanks with the force on the battle field as proven in Eaw and being able to kill dozens of rebel soldiers with force wave alone.

And lets not forget TESB vader is far more powerful than Purge vader who took on 8 jedi masters. Him being able to kill his officer from a distance far far away. Force, Force, Force, Force and more Force. were not debating that, i said earlier with force involved, Vader wins. SABER ONLY i think Maul wins. And i dont know why you're telling being slow dosent mean your gonna get pwned, im pretty sure i didnt say anything about anyone getting owned, except in that comic Knight brought up, which indeed has Maul owning AGAIN, until Vader makes a life threatening sacrifice. (damn maul and his cockiness)

Originally posted by Kadesh
um vader defeated maul in the vader vs maul comic.

accidental post sorry

Originally posted by Broke Beat
Force, Force, Force, Force and more Force. were not debating that, i said earlier with force involved, Vader wins. SABER ONLY i think Maul wins. And i dont know why you're telling being slow dosent mean your gonna get pwned, im pretty sure i didnt say anything about anyone getting owned, except in that comic Knight brought up, which indeed has Maul owning AGAIN, until Vader makes a life threatening sacrifice. (damn maul and his cockiness) i can end your arguements about vader losing in a saber battle by giving you this quote




Around 3.5 ABY, Vader had ordered ASP-19 droids, lightsaber combat droids based off the ASP-series droid, to be produced to fight him in sparring matches. They were faster and stronger than an ordinary man, and programmed with the knowledge of a hundred sword masters and a dozen fighting styles. Vader defeated them time and again, and thus ordered new, improved batches of them. As his finesse improved, they became too easy to defeat, even in a two-on-one match.

I think somone else disagrees with you

Han Solo: Good against remotes is one thing. Good against the living, that's something else.

Happy Thanksgivings Everybody

Originally posted by Broke Beat
I think somone else disagrees with you

Han Solo: Good against remotes is one thing. Good against the living, that's something else. Um theres a difference between saber droids and remotes, READ the quote again

Yes, but like Kadesh says, slow doesn't mean weak. Just because Maul is fast, he is eventually going to bang sabers with Vader. Then Vader will use immense Djem So power to drive Maul back and then overwhelm him. Yes, Vader uses the Force against many enemies, however he many times just uses his saber might to slay powerful Jedi. Look at the Dark Women getting destroyed by Vader. This is what Maul is going to face in a lightsaber fight against the Darth.

http://images.wikia.com/starwars/images/a/a5/DarthVaderbattlestheDarkWoman.JPG




I did not know it was noncanon. So thanks for telling me that. Therefore any arguments of Maul being close to Vader is not true.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Um theres a difference between saber droids and remotes, READ the quote again i read your quote, it really wasnt much. you missed the concept i was implying, droids are one thing...... the living is different.



Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
Yes, but like Kadesh says, slow doesn't mean weak. Just because Maul is fast, he is eventually going to bang sabers with Vader. Then Vader will use immense Djem So power to drive Maul back and then overwhelm him. Yes, Vader uses the Force against many enemies, however he many times just uses his saber might to slay powerful Jedi. Look at the Dark Women getting destroyed by Vader. This is what Maul is going to face in a lightsaber fight against the Darth.

http://images.wikia.com/starwars/images/a/a5/DarthVaderbattlestheDarkWoman.JPG




I did not know it was noncanon. So thanks for telling me that. Therefore any arguments of Maul being close to Vader is not true.
how is it not true. Did Lucas say something? is it official somewhere? because all im hearing right now are opinions.

hes fighting a woman, of course he'll overpower her physically. Dark Woman and Maul are not the same people, they're isnt a single comparison between the 2. Vader wont overpower Maul using whatever brute stength your talking about, if thats what your implying with your arguement.

Luke with just 3 yrs of training put him on his ass twice at Endor. Now this is the Vader with his highly acclaimed "supreme" training techniques and power, getting worked by someone, who in terms of real jedi training, picked up a lightsaber yesterday. SABER ONLY, maul wins this IN MY OPINION.

Originally posted by Broke Beat
i read your quote, it really wasnt much. you missed the concept i was implying, droids are one thing...... the living is different.
Yea droids which are faster and stronger than a normal jedi in strength and programed with the knowledge of a hunderd swod masters. Maul is going to get wacked


Originally posted by Broke Beat

how is it not true. Did Lucas say something? is it official somewhere? because all im hearing right now are opinions.
He dont give jack about EU, so dont make excuses
Originally posted by Broke Beat

hes fighting a woman, of course he'll overpower her physically. Dark Woman and Maul are not the same people, they're isnt a single comparison between the 2. Vader wont overpower Maul using whatever brute stength your talking about, if thats what your implying with your arguement.
Yes he will. He sliced and diced sialan wezz before her dead body hit the floor and parried with tsui choi who is far faster than him

Originally posted by Broke Beat

Luke with just 3 yrs of training put him on his ass twice at Endor. Now this is the Vader with his highly acclaimed "supreme" training techniques and power, getting worked by someone, who in terms of real jedi training, picked up a lightsaber yesterday. SABER ONLY, maul wins this IN MY OPINION. Lets just say that luke used vaders own form of Djem so to overpower his own father, And that vader underesitmated luke AND WAS ORDERED to turn him to the dark side not kill him!

Originally posted by Kadesh
Yea droids which are faster and stronger than a normal jedi in strength and programed with the knowledge of a hunderd swod masters. Maul is going to get wacked


He dont give jack about EU, so dont make excuses
Yes he will. He sliced and diced sialan wezz before her dead body hit the floor and parried with tsui choi who is far faster than him

Lets just say that luke used vaders own form of Djem so to overpower his own father, And that vader underesitmated luke AND WAS ORDERED to turn him to the dark side not kill him!
make excuses about what?

ok thats cool that he has his little robots, but does that topple the fact that with all those beautiful droids, and his power and all that mess aside, he got his ass handed to him by Luke, with barely any saber
training, did he even know what Djem So was at that time? but regardless I would think a "MASTER of many forms including his immense Djem So power," could at least contain him..... but nope, He says the magic words, and 10 seconds later Vader is screaming in pain with his hand cut off.

Vader took on 8 average at best jedi, and barely survived the encounter because he tried to take them all on at the same time. And fortunately for him they tried to jump him stupidly with someone holding a cortosis blade, not taking into consideration that if the wielder died, they would all be ****ed because they would be defenseless.


Maul raped the entire Black Sun by himself, without being touched. he even showed up at the headquarters and chopped up everyone while, they were shooting at him. He was ducking and dodging blaster bolts, while cutting down they're guards one by one. and wasnt just 1 or 2 guards shooting at him, they were like 6-7 shooting at him all at the same time.

Originally posted by Broke Beat


ok thats cool that he has his little robots, but does that topple the fact that with all those beautiful droids, and his power and all that mess aside, he got his ass handed to him by Luke, with barely any saber
training, did he even know what Djem So was at that time? but regardless I would think a "MASTER of many forms including his immense Djem So power," could at least contain him..... but nope, He says the magic words, and 10 seconds later Vader is screaming in pain with his hand cut off.
Well did you forget vader simply underestimated luke
and was ordered not to kill him by the emperor himself? Luke mirrored vaders own form of djem so and proved how effective it can be expecially when you attack furiouslu, and lets not forget vader is fighting his own son

Originally posted by Broke Beat


Vader took on 8 average at best jedi, and barely survived the encounter because he tried to take them all on at the same time. And fortunately for him they tried to jump him stupidly with someone holding a cortosis blade, not taking into consideration that if the wielder died, they would all be ****ed because they would be defenseless.
Well why not i tell you that one of them had prepared for the arrival of vader by brining out a cortosis blade and was confident that they all can defeat vader because he is only one man? And need i tell you that he shredded the metal wall as if it was nothing by just screaming out obi wans name? Need i also tell you that with 1 lightsaber alone he can fight in a 4 on 1 match while choking another jedi at the same time?
Originally posted by Broke Beat


Maul raped the entire Black Sun by himself, without being touched. he even showed up at the headquarters and chopped up everyone while, they were shooting at him. He was ducking and dodging blaster bolts, while cutting down they're guards one by one. and wasnt just 1 or 2 guards shooting at him, they were like 6-7 shooting at him all at the same time. O simple. Maul would have been slaughtered by those 8 jedi masters, and that it was easier for him to deflect blaster bolts with a double bladed lightsaber. Lets not forget that vader did alot more than he did in empire comic, Pushing a thug hundreds of feet. Slamming a guy with telekenesis onto the ceiling causing a massive dent, Crushing tanks on the battle field, Using a water fall to drown the dark woman, Ripping a tree from its roots. Choking his officer miles away, Killed a wild animal larger than him with his bare hands, Using the dark side to tame the animals on a planet after the battle of yavin. And he sliced and diced sia lan wezz before a dead body hit the floor

What the hell is this? Luke in ROTJ using full rage knocked down Vader. Maul would have gotten a tough fight from regular ROTJ Luke, so be quiet.



And Maul could not have taken on those 8 Jedi by himself. And again, this is Vader just after ROTS. TESB Vader would destroy Maul.



Yep, I can do feat wars as well. Like Vader took on 8 Jedi just after being stuck into a suit.

Read my above post prodigal and get suprised

WOW Kadesh!!!

Yea i thanks lol, i just hate it when people underate vader.

some dumb people i know said "ZOMG! maul is teh uber and better because he wields double bladed Lightsaberz!!!!!"

@Prodigal, your picture proved how high the waterfall is when he used it to drown that old witch

Let's see what each contestant has on their side-
MAUL
-One of the fastest lightsaber duelists of all time.
-Extremely well-trained in martial arts and the use of a lightsaber.
-Relatively weak in the Force; Vader wins that aspect no contest
VADER
-Very slow; a deadly setback when fighting someone like Maul
-Immensely strong; I have a hard time picturing Maul blocking Vader's blows.
-One of the greatest Force-users of all time.

Lightsaber battle: That's about 50/50, it's the classic strength vs. speed
Force battle: Maul gets WTFpwned

Here's my simulation of the battle:
Maul makes the first move, clashing sabers with Vader. Vader blocks several of the blows, but Maul is simply too fast. He gets off several glancing blows, but Vader goes, for all intents and purposes, unharmed, due to his armor. Vader then takes the offensive, battering Maul into submission. Maul gets crushed.

OR

Vader gets a chance to use the Force. It ends there.




I think Vader wins either way.

TY Godzilla!

I haven't underrated Vader, I think hes cool and all, but i Just dont think he can beat Maul in a saber duel and I defintely dont think Luke stands a chance against Maul either, Maul IMO would beat Vader in saber duel, there is no evidence to support that Maul is relatively weak in the force, I quite frankly dont see Vader pushing Maul around physcially either, i think he would catch an asthma attack before then. Maul is strong in his own right, i dont know if you guys have read his novels and comic books, but if you havent you should, i think you would understand his strength after reading them.

i guess we watched 2 different duels then.
Maul is more aggresive than ROTJ Luke, so that little spurt he had is average for Maul, and thats just looking at the movies. Luke didnt really even do anything, he swung at him in a blind rage, no skill or control at all. But it overwhelmed Vader, and again if he cant at least contain him, than i dont see him beating Maul in a saber duel regardless of whether he underestimated him or not, it was his own fualt for doing so anyway, I dont see why you keep brining that up. Dooku was ordered not to kill, Anakin but he still lost becuase apprently he couldn't at least contain him without killing him. Which seems to be the same thing that happened in this duel. I dont think somone whos been trained for only 3 yrs can take a Master's form and use it against him, or at least he shouldnt be able to. but well as you guys claim, he did, so using your logic Vader cant be that good if he let a padawan level Luke do him in like that.

I believe everyone here knows that Maul is powerful. However, his skill with the blade just can't outclass Vader. And yes, Vader would push around Maul. Vader has immense strength and he would slam Maul around. Maul's Jar'Kai helps, but once Vader cuts the double-blade in half and charges Maul, the Zabrak is gone.



Maul got his ass almost owned by an enraged Kenobi. Are you now saying that an enraged Obi-Wan could possibily kill Vader? LOL! Rage increases your ability by a huge margin, and when Luke turned to the Dark, Vader was amazed by his sons anger and strength. And Vader was trying his son to turn to the Dark, so there's a good possibility that Vader let Luke push him back for a little while. And note, this is Luke, not a normal Padawan. Luke who will become the strongest in the galaxy. Yes, he has to start off strong, otherwise how does he grow into that demi-god which he is?

I just gotta say that Maul did not almost get owned by an enraged Obi, actually he was taking the advantage right away after being surprised and toying with him!

yeah, Maul was tossing him and Qui-gon around the whole duel. Vader is strong, but not enough to slam maul around, because that would imply that Maul is substantially weaker physically than Vader, which is something I cannot picturea at all. this is somone who trained in mind and body, probably more body from birth. I dont know if you've read his stuff, but you should man.

Rage is a double-edged sword in combat, it can help you, but it will probably cause more problems than good for you. you only need to look at some of Anakin and Vader's past mistakes to see what his rage has done for him. Obi Wan enraged chargerd at Maul, and caught him off guard, put him on his ass. right, i give you that one. But during his little flurry, did you notice how quiclky offense turned to defense, it didnt take Maul long at all to regain his footwork.

OK, but this Luke after 3 yrs of training dealing with a Jedi Knight/Sith Master. And he wins? it doesnt matter if he underestimated him or not, that fact of the matter is he lost. He couldnt at least contain him, he could have parried all of his moves with his "immense Djem So power," but you guys keep saying Luke turned it on him. How do you know this? Who was around to teach him? Djem So is Vader's own modified style, so who would teach it to Luke? Sure Luke is supposed to acheive greatness, but who can take on 2 sith lords after all only 3yrs of not even Jedi combat training. He received more Lessons in mind and body then combat. Luke went back to Yoda a year after ESB, which is rougly at the beginning of ROTJ, Obi-wan is still dead, and they havent made contact since he left Dagobah. All of his training, if at least the majority, has been by experience. There is no way he could have learned Djem So, maybe Obi-wan's Shien but not Vader's own modified style, and then learn it well enough and that short amount of time to "mirror and use it against Vader" effectively, he had the holocron Obi-wan left, but those things can only do so much for you especially at Luke's level with proper guidance from a Master.

Cool, and Vader fought against 8 Jedi and killed 4.



Frankly, your opinion holds no water here. Vader is not just strong, but very strong. He is able to life a Rebel Trooper several feet in the air with one hand. Vader is a good deal stronger than Maul. Maul is physically fit, but he has as much muscle as Kit Fisto. Vader could easily push back the Zabrak.



And this is Vader, who has mastered calmness with anger, a deadly combination. This is Vader, who has mastered his form to the highest degree. This is Vader, who who Jedi hunting abilities. This is Vader, who could comfortably defeat Maul.




This is to show you how rage in a Jedi can totally surprise an enemy. While Vader was seducing Luke, he didn't expect the full rage Luke gave him. He just thought Skywalker was angry, not extremely furious.




Again, Luke Skywalker is a powerful Padawan. Very powerful. We argued in a thread that ESB Luke is close to Qui-Gon Jinn. ROTJ Luke is much more powerful than ESB Luke.

1.) Vader was trying to seduce Luke. He hoped to turn him. Vader knew Luke would lash out at him, but not at the high level he recieved. Luke totally caught Vader off guard, really bad. Vader is a calculating opponent, he knows what's he's doing most of the time (he learned his lesson after ROTS), but the treatment from Luke was surprisingly brutal. Had Maul been in that situation, his lightsaber would have been gone in SECONDS and he would have been dead pretty fast.

2.) Umm what the hell are you saying? Luke never took on 2 Sith Lords, unless you want to consider Luke fighting Vader and then maybe going after Sidious, which NEVER happened.

3.) Luke learned elements of Soresu from Kenobi and elements of Ataru from Yoda. This blends into a Shien-like form. But yes, Luke's main advantage was his mindset. He possesed a high degree of Force Valor. He never gave up, and this allowed him to last against Vader.

Well if vader can be extremely powerful while being calm, Imagine what kind of monster he will become when he gets enraged. He could destroy an entire medical room by just getting pissed.

Now what if he was like pissed off rotj luke? I bet sidious would even leave him alone

.......and almost died in the process

Who are you to say my opinion holds no water. its common sense really. do you lift weights? do you play sports? Vader would have to be jacked, to "push" Ray Park around.and lifted a trooper "several feet?" now i know me and you weren't watching the same movie. cmon brother.

to be contiuned i g2g real quick

And he just got into the suit. It hasn't even been several monthes, yet Vader goes and takes on 8 Jedi. Lets see Maul do that. Maul got himself occupied by two Jedi, do you think he can take on 8 at once and kill 4? And again, for the last time, Vader just got into the suit. By TESB, he mastered himself in his lifesuit and became very powerful.



Seriously dawg, don't be lying:

http://www.wizards.com/starwars/images/starwars/vader_chokes_rebel.jpg

As you can see in this picture, Vader lifts this trooper a good three or four feet in the air. And this is a soldier mind you, so he's not just some 150 pound punk. No, he must weight at least 180 pounds to 220 pounds. So Vader lifts the man with ONE HAND. Do you think Maul can do that? Maybe, but with two hands. Seriously, Vader can easily slam Maul back.

why don't you step away from your computer and measure 3-4 feet, you're making me laugh man

yeah, you made this one up

opinion

and learned a lesson? oviously not if he went after 8 jedi by himself, as a matter of fact Sidious sent the 501st to make sure he would be ok, and he wasnt.

And you're making me laugh by your pathetic rebuttals. Does it matter whether its two feet or four feet? The point was Vader has the strength to easily push your precious Maul. Do you honestly think Maul could lift the trooper with one hand? I'll be damned if you think so. Vader defeats Maul. Vader is stronger than Tyrannus or at least equal to him. Are you now going to say Maul > Tyrannus. LOL!

Wookiepedia: Force Valor was a light side Force power that increased the resolve, accuracy, and speed of one's self and one's allies. Tapping into the Force, a Jedi could increase the rate at which one's capacities functioned, allowing the body to move more quickly, strike more powerfully, and fight with improved accuracy. The more wise, charismatic, and skilled the caster was, the more profound the effects of Force Valor were.

Yoda used this ability to overcome the infirmities of old age, which was quite necessary for a practitioner of Form IV lightsaber combat. Luke Skywalker unknowingly used Force Valor in the Battle of Yavin.

As you can see, Luke knows Force Valor unknowingly. What else do you think let Luke survive that long? Sheer will, c'mon, that must be a lot of sheer will then.


QUOTE]opinion

Hardly, it's called reasoning.


and learned a lesson? oviously not if he went after 8 jedi by himself, as a matter of fact Sidious sent the 501st to make sure he would be ok, and he wasnt.

Yeah, just got himself stuck into a suit and asked to take on 8 Jedi. I would hope you would have backup. Maul would have gotten killed in that scenario.

ok he went after them ON HIS OWN, Sidious sent them after him. meaning he thought he could do it himself. and dont quote wiki/wookie those anybody can put anythig on there, and has been known to hold some particualr bullshit info on there.



pathetic rebuttals? your pulling shit out of your ass, oh and did you measure 3-4 feet yet?

quick question: do you lift weights, or play any spors at all which reuqire physical contact? cuz we can settle this really quickly

Exactly my point. What kind of comeback is this? I don't need to measure three or four feet. I have already proven my point.



I play soccer and tennis. I do play football, but I am not that good at it. Why do you care?

Yes, Wookiepedia is not 100% factual, but most of the things it has is correct. That Force Valor thing I showed you, do you deny it or what do you think Force Valor?

Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
Exactly my point. What kind of comeback is this? I don't need to measure three or four feet. I have already proven my point.



I play soccer and tennis. I do play football, but I am not that good at it. Why do you care?


I play Tennis as well!


Edit: Man, that smilie is wrong. Why is it on that command? Argghhh :@



Edit 2: Arggh, that one didn't even work!

yeah it sounds cool, but where is that source credited it from? Wiki is a user maintained site, meaning anybody can put anything on there. I only remember Force Valor from that Kotor video game.

no you havent, you exagerrated your point, which is also defined as talking out of the ass, no disrepect but it is what is.

ok, in a sport like football, you would have to be substanially larger than somone to completely truck somone like you guys are claiming Vader can. Vader is not that much larger than Maul, and muscular wise, i dont think hes stronger than Maul, maybe 50/50 but not stonger.


i mean look at anakin before the suit.

http://i.imdb.com/Photos/Ss/0121766/th-86705_R.jpg



to Maul without tats

http://starwars.wikia.com/images/thumb/9/94/Ray_Park.jpg/150px-Ray_Park.jpg

but take the comparison seriously, his suit was to keep him alive, its only a burden, if before the suit he inst stronger, what makes you think now?

ok check this out, im 6'0, i bench 200lbs, and i weigh 173 lbs. I play basketball, one of my teammates benches 225, and is 6'4, he weighs about 190. He isnt that much stronger than i am, but he cant toss me around, or straight up lay me on my ass, and i sure as hell wouldnt let him either. Hes stonger than I am, but not to wheres its a Kicker compared to a Line backer.

Same scenario with Maul, (if this is even the case) IF Vader was stronger, he couldnt be that much stonger then Maul, to the point that he can lay him on his ass, and hes slow, Maul wouldnt just let it happen.

Quit being a darth maul fanboy. It have been proven that Vader is stronger than dooku.

Originally posted by Broke Beat
Same scenario with Maul, (if this is even the case) IF Vader was stronger, he couldnt be that much stonger then Maul, to the point that he can lay him on his ass, and hes slow, Maul wouldnt just let it happen. And yes, proven fact that vader greatly surpasses maul with BOTH lightasbers and force abilities, Remember that quote i gave? and the feat wars i used? That saber skill quote was PROVEN in Jedi academy. Maybe you should back down before your next arguement gets shredded


Originally posted by Broke Beat
yeah it sounds cool, but where is that source credited it from? Wiki is a user maintained site, meaning anybody can put anything on there. I only remember Force Valor from that Kotor video game.
Yea maintaned by people who respect canon policy

Originally posted by Broke Beat

ok, in a sport like football, you would have to be substanially larger than somone to completely truck somone like you guys are claiming Vader can. Vader is not that much larger than Maul, and muscular wise, i dont think hes stronger than Maul, maybe 50/50 but not stonger.
"Size matters not, the only difference is in your mind"
Stated by yoda, And need i saw that vader is stronger than maul in physical strength? As proven thousands of time in BOTH the movies and in the EU?







Originally posted by Broke Beat

but take the comparison seriously, his suit was to keep him alive, its only a burden, if before the suit he inst stronger, what makes you think now? You forget that anakin couldnt do the things vader did in his suit 19 years later, hurling palpatine to his death, killing jedis with his BARE HANDS. killing an animal 3 TIMES THE SIZE of him with his FISTS

You are gonna get owned again

Why thank you for taking over Kadesh while I was absent,

But just a question Broke Beast, do you think just because of Maul's speed Vader loses?

Your welcome

ohh im a fanboy now? becuase im defending my opinon, is it just cuz i dont agree with you? Proven? as in its a bondafide fact? its written in stone somewhere?

ohh and you know these people?

righhhhttt.....cuz once again you guys brought up the stregnth quotient. so i guess that dosent matter anymore. do you guys realize how much you keep contradiciting yourselves?

by who YOU? and quit talking like you know me.
and how much does that wrinkly old man weigh, what 100lbs.? i could of done that. so if strength dosent matter, whats the point of this post?

Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
Why thank you for taking over Kadesh while I was absent,

But just a question Broke Beast, do you think just because of Maul's speed Vader loses? that and the way he fights. His style of combat is something i dont think vader can keep up with. he uses martial arts in his fighting, hes strong and quick, his form is called Juyo, where they came up with that though i dont know. Comapring them in movie Duels, Maul seems like the stonger dueler to me. How i see Vader fighting Maul is similar to qui-gon against Maul. ecept vader would last much longer.

This is just my opinion im not saying its law, or it couldnt go any other way. its just what i THINK would happen if they fought without using the force. no need to get bent out of shape about it, you really dont have to agree with me, i dont really give a shit, its just Star Wars.

Well, Vader had just got done getting his ass stomped by his son. He'd lost a hand. He picked up the Emperor straight off the ground, with one hand, put him over his head, and dropped his ass down a reactor shaft.

one hand and the little stub he had left of the other one

Originally posted by Broke Beat
one hand and the little stub he had left of the other one

He had no stub. He had a cauterized wrist.

whatever you want to call it, he used to arms

Well, because we feel that you are a Maul fanboy because you are defending him against Vader, who's far superior.



No, but it seems likely. I don't see Wookiepedia posting bullshit, except for maybe a couple of articles.



Aye, but Vader has mastered Djem So. His strength along with the power of Djem So will drive Maul till his saber breaks and so forth from there.



Indeed, but note that most people are going to disagree with you. A high majority of this forum rate Vader equal or better than Tyrannus, who can outclass Maul.

Originally posted by Broke Beat
whatever you want to call it, he used to arms

Well, personally, I'd like to see someone pick a guy up with two hands - when one hand is removed.

He used one. Face it, dude, Vader is stronger than Maul is.

Argue his speed and mobility, but not strength.

yeah and i dont have a problem with that, again its star wars, I dont give a flying **** if everyone disagrees with me, my beliefs dont require them to do so, at least respect that have an opinion regardless of whether you agree with or not. I dont mind that you think Vader is superior to Maul in every way. Thats cool, i didnt challenge you, you challenged me. Dont chastise me calling me a fanboy when you dont know the first thing about me. i think the real fanboys are the ones who get bent out of shape, about stuff like this. you can have this one, i really dont care enough.

Broke Beat Out

I do respect your opinion. I was just debating what you said. Debating is the basis of this section of the forum.



Dude, chill. First off, when did I call you a fanboy? I explained to you why Kadesh called you a fanboy. And listen man, I know this is just Star Wars, but here, if you want to debate you go to pretend this is real and stuff. The VS. Forum helps out your debating skilz man. Unless you debated here before (I haven't seen you here), nice job with your argument!

Originally posted by Broke Beat
I dont give a flying **** if everyone disagrees with me, my beliefs dont require them to do so.

Broke Beat Out

well said Morpheus.

the winner isssssssssssss vader cuase he was trained to pist his pants when he lost

Vader ftw

Originally posted by genral
the winner isssssssssssss vader cuase he was trained to pist his pants when he lost

Can anyone translate that for me please ?

I'm not fluent in Retard.

I think it was "piss his pants"? But I don't even know how/if Vader goes to the bathroom.