Man of Miracles vs [Pre-retcon] Beyonder

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Thanos_THOTU
Both the most powerful fictional characters created by their company (remember TOAA is the editor he is not created by someone, and not a fictional character.)

http://board.spawn.com/images/board/1027ofmiracles.jpg


VS


http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/3943/beyonderisrealitydw2oa1.jpg

S-Ranger
Damn though fight. I may have to give it Beyonder hmmmmmmmmmm i dunno i need to go back and re-read my comics.

manjaro
if im not mistaken the man of miracles is THE actual "God" of his company, so i'll take him

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by manjaro
if im not mistaken the man of miracles is THE actual "God" of his company, so i'll take him
He is the creator of the Image-verse, he have no conections to his company what so ever, he's just a fictional character ... However.

I'm not sure, whom I will go with, they seem about equal, if not MoM have the upper hand.

Lord Urizen
MOM is Mother, she has no real gender.


Pre-Retconned Beyonder has more displayed feats, however it's a hard toss up.

MOM is the most powerful character in Image, so I say just flip a coin.

Thanos_THOTU
More oppinions?

bigbran
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
MOM is Mother, she has no real gender.


Pre-Retconned Beyonder has more displayed feats, however it's a hard toss up.

MOM is the most powerful character in Image, so I say just flip a coin. Goku is basically the most powerful character in Dragon Ball Z, so that means he can fight with TOAA, right?

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by bigbran
Goku is basically the most powerful character in Dragon Ball Z, so that means he can fight with TOAA, right?


Bad analogy on my part.


We don't have enough to go on. Beyonder is obviously rediculously powerful, but in Image, it is not certain whether or not the Universe is infinite or finite.

However, MOM has countless children, and they are all the equivalent of God and Satan.

Take a look at feats/Facts for a sec:






Pre Retconned Beyonder:

1) Erased and Revived Multi Death

2) Destroyed a Galaxy instantly

3) Is millions of times more powerful than the marvel multiverse combined

4) Every bacteria and micro organism bowed to him

5) Played with Marvel like it was a fkn joke

6) Is omnipotent, can do whatever the fck he wants




MOM:


1) Created the Image Universe

2) Created God and Satan

3) Fused Spawn's heart with 6000 other souls

4) Banished God and Satan from Heaven and Hell, made them reborn as children

5) Is the greatest power in Image

6) Froze Spawn, Zera, God, and Satan in Time

7) Is Omniscient- can see all that occurs in her universe.

8)CANNOT DIE OR BE DESTROYED- this fact is based on the logic that since Urizen cannot die, and Urizen is an inhabitant of MOM's Universe, she being wayyyy more powerful than Urizen cannot die or be destroyed either.


9) Rewrote Earth's History so that Wanda never gave birth to Katie and Jake (God and Satan)

10) Turned Spawn into a God







Classic Beyonder made the original Marvel Multiverse seem like a toy to him.....his power was beyond what we can truly measure.

MOM created everything that exists in Image. Image has shown parallel realities (Curse of the Spawn, Godslayer, alternate timelines, etc.), but MOM has made it clear that she is in the center of all of that. It is unclear whether or not the Image Universe is infinite, however, it is implied as such since MOM has infinite children, all the equals of God and Satan.



Classic Beyonder is immature, uncertain, and in self-conflict. MOM is not. MOM is intelligent, compassionate, fair, strong minded, and clear. MOM is logical, while Classic Beyonder is illogical.


There is no surefire way to determine who wins. You have to just take your pick, and justify why.

Xplosive
MOM is practically what we call true Almighty God (completely without equal, completely infinite in it's existence).
PR Beyonder was also a beast, without equal that was ever created orignally in it's existence (by Marvel).
This is a toss up.

Lord Urizen
thumb up

Lord Urizen
But if you are ONLY going FEATS wise, then Classic Beyonder takes it. However, that is NOT always the most accurate way to decipher a victory.

King Kandy
Their powers are both defined as limitless. It's a meaningless battle.

Mordum
MOM wins. He is the supreme creator he has no flaws power never fluctuates.

Pre rect beyonder was all over the place and didnt know very much.

Galan007
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Both the most powerful fictional characters created by their company no Thanos /w/ THOTI is more powerful then Beyonder ever was...... and don't throw around that "well Beyonder had the power of the writers" crap, because that dosen't equate to any sort of feat....

This is just another "God v.s. Beyonder thread" people will just bring their own oppinions into it, so its ultimatley a pointless thread.

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by Galan007
no Thanos /w/ THOTI is more powerful then Beyonder ever was...... and don't throw around that "well Beyonder had the power of the writers" crap, because that dosen't equate to any sort of feat....

This is just another "God v.s. Beyonder thread" people will just bring their own oppinions into it, so its ultimatley a pointless thread.
Beyonder killed Death, Thanos coulden't.
Thanos had to die to restore the "universe" he absorbed.

Howard_Jones
We're gonna have to see more of MOM to know, really.

Galan007
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Beyonder killed Death, Thanos coulden't.Thanos "couldn't" kill her, or he overlooked her? Because I believe Warlock said that Thanos "overlooked" Death during his frenzy.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Thanos had to die to restore the "universe" he absorbed. He didn't die when he restored the "multiverse"

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by Galan007
Thanos "couldn't" kill her, or he overlooked her? Because I believe Warlock said that Thanos "overlooked" Death during his frenzy.

She is beyond your reach - Rings a bell?

In the comics it said universe. - And yes he died. Or at least dissapeared.

Galan007
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
She is beyond your reach - Rings a bell? Warlock never once said that. I have the comic in front of me right now, and I can provide scans if need be........ can you?

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
In the comics it said universe.and in the comic it also said Thanos was bonded with the "omni-reality" wink

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
And yes he died. Or at least dissapeared. Thanos didn't die, in the official Annihilation bio for Thanos, under threat level it clearly says "One time reality ender"
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9458/thanos1zx6.th.jpg

Here it is outlined in red, so you don't miss it:
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/9330/thanos2tk8.th.jpg

Mordum
Ownage if the third degree right there.

Thanos_THOTU
http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/4032/marveluniversetheend1p0vi9.jpg
First page: He confirms that he destroyed the 616 universe.
All reality, not realities.
One of Mr Master scans even confirms that All reality = One universe.
http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=eternityaspectisallreality24ke.jpg
Multi-Eternity wasent created before the Abraxas arc.
Besides, Multi-Eternity have a little red spot on his body, which looks like a red-sun.


Omni-reality = Omni = All- = All-reality, still not realities


I let this scan speak for itself:
http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/1140/theend0621tatoxq5.jpg

---

For she as well exist outside this poor reality, which means, Thanos have only affect one reality, and that's why Azela and Co survived.
http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/3316/theend0618tatoua6.jpg

Universe ... Again ... Not even that, he even says that he survived because he was outside this "reality"
http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/6013/theend0612tatozu5.jpg

Thanos_THOTU

thedude1948
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
First page: He confirms that he destroyed the 616 universe.

I dont see it.... where does it say anywhere that it was the 6 1 6 Universe.

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by thedude1948
I dont see it.... where does it say anywhere that it was the 6 1 6 Universe.
616 = Original universe ... You could se it at the character's as well, Spider-man, Thor ect.
Atzela's realm, or "pocket universe" is outside the 616th, Franklin Richard's created pocket universe's at the age of 5.

thedude1948
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
616 = Original universe ... You could se it at the character's as well, Spider-man, Thor ect.

In handbooks it says that Marvel: The End happened in the 4321 Universe not 616.

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by thedude1948
In handbooks it says that Marvel: The End happened in the 4321 Universe not 616.
Well maybe it was, perhaps a mirror universe (exactly the same, just different timeline) -- Still one universe - No?

Galan007
Odd how you seemed to ignore everything I posted roll eyes (sarcastic)

Though I could still prove you wrong, I don't care to type anymore then I have to. Plus Mr. M explains it best. Please read this before you post more of your "proof"

Originally posted by Mr Master
Here's the tale of the tape:


If you take a few minutes to read, perhaps it'll sink in:




The Omniversal Architecture

When Warlock first exited the Multi-verse, he entered a place called the Cosmic Vortex.
http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/3198/adamgoesbtwnuniverses15yh.th.jpg


In it, an INFINITE number of MULTI-VERSES are spiralling upward, while below lies Oblivion, (the ultimate Abstract in terms of everlasting), swallowing Multi-verses that collapse, are nullified, have a weakened Anchor (like Atleza) ect...

http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/7376/adamgoesbtwnuniverses26zw.th.jpg


These are MULTI-VERSES!


When I realized that Thanos DID in fact, Absorb MORE than just a UNIVERSE, that he actually absorbed ALL he could (which is the MULTI-VERSE)

Here Thanos ABSORBS LT, ETERNITY and INFINITY

http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/4876/teb9kg7.th.jpg



Thanos ABSORBED ETERNITY and INFINITY and there is still Space and star stuff behind him

http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/741/t2gw1oa6.th.jpg
This is not a designed attack, he's saying it himself "it's Out of Control"

Like a raging drunk, who's not selective in a brawl, anything in the way goes, and with that KIND of Power, that means everything goes. (like it did)




I felt I had to add this to the equation:


When a UNIVERSE is ERASED or ABSORBED, it's ETERNITY that DISAPPEARS:

The Ultimate Nullifier ERASING a UNIVERSE:

http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/5489/kpz4.th.jpg

Realize it's ETERNITY that's being ERASED.



And AGAIN, now a MULTI-VERSE is ERASED by the Ultimate Nullifier:

http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/6069/1unisusedbyreedtodestroyabraxa.th.jpg

http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/932/2undestroysmultieternityinfini.th.jpg

Realize it's ETERNITY (Multi-Eternity) that's being ERASED.




Continues in the next post...

Galan007
Originally posted by Mr Master
Continues...



Let us proceed:




Here it continues,

(REMEMBER, NOW this is AFTER he ABSORBED, LT, Eternity & Infinity)

Watch, and Read



"For IF this BAND (the Living Tribunal, ETERNITY/INFINITY) Could Defy Me...might not OTHERS* be equally Foolish?"
http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/4746/t6bi7.th.jpg
"Could I ALLOW ANY to question my divine AUTHORITY?"



"NO....So I CONTINUED to Absorb ALL that MIGHT THREATEN my REIGN...Until....
http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/2830/t7fq0.th.jpg


See...He's absorbing MORE SPACE now, WHERE is this SPACE coming from if he already absorbed ALL of Space and Time?

WHERE!!!


I'll answer that,


It has to be coming from the Multi-verse, there is no other way to look at it.
*(That's WHO these OTHERS are that MIGHT be equally foolish, the rest of Space, in other words, the MULTI-VERSE)


WHO else COULD question his AUTHORITY, except anyone left in the MULTI-VERSE,


WHO else can THREATEN his REIGN?


CAN'T be the UNIVERSE or the Living Tribunal, he just ABSORBED the UNIVERSE (Eternity/Infinity remember) and LT.




Now your saying to yourself, fine, that conclusively despicts Thanos absorbing the Multi-verse.

But Mr M showed scans of the Cosmic Vortex, where an INFINITE number of Multi-verses are,

How could Thanos have absorbed ALL he could, when he ONLY absorbed ONE Multi-verse?

Now we go back to the OMNIVERSAL structure:




The OMNI-VERSE and the rest of the Multi-verses rest with in the Cosmic Vortex.

See those little Purple Balls, thats where Atleza is (the Cosmic Anchor of the "616" Multi-verse)...

and every little Purple Ball is the Domain of an Anchor of a Multi-verse ...

Each Domain is Outside the Multiverse...Untouched by Space or Time....

The much bigger Blue Balls represent EACH a Multi-verse, and the SUM of the Blue Balls is the Omni-verse.

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/8021/unilook17qj.th.jpg

http://img280.imageshack.us/img280/9715/unilook21qc.th.jpg

Anything Outside the Blue Balls is Untouched by Space & Time,
which Multi-Eternity/Infinity encompass.

See how the Blue Balls (Multi-verses) are separate from each other, and how the little Purple Balls (the Anchor's domain) are separated from the Blue Balls.

This is why Atleza, Gamora and Warlock were untouched, they were there, in A little Purple Ball, (the Anchors domain, Outside it's respective Multi-verse)

This is why Thanos could not absorb more, he absorbed everything within that Blue Ball (a Multi-verse) and evidently, he could not reach any furthur

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/991/allhecouldum7.th.jpg
"Nothing Remained"

Remember he was "Out of Control"

He kept on absorbing till there was nothing left for him to absorb (literally), HAD he been able to absorb everything Outside his Multi-verse, it would have been no problem with TOAA's power,

But Thanos was NOT able to do it, meaning that's as FAR as TOAA permitted his power to be used, absorption of a Multi-verse and Remaking that same Multi-verse, even though being the most powerful being in the Omni-verse.

Galan007

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by Galan007

Yeah the post by Mr M, wonder why he almost never post he entire page ...
It clearly said one reality or universe, the worlds "realities" and "Multi-verse" was never used, not in the entire comic ...

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by Galan007
So did you read the scans I posted? I'm guessing you didn't, because if you would have read them, you would have noted that the bio says Universal/one time reality ender they are 2 completely different things in the bio, please read them again....
Under threat level it clearly says "Universal(SLASH)One time reality ender"
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9458/thanos1zx6.th.jpg

Here it is outlined in red, so you don't miss it:
http://img287.imageshack.us/img287/9330/thanos2tk8.th.jpg

Thanos was a Universal threat when he obtained the IG. Thanos litterally became one with eternity, he litterally was the universe, but was he a complete reality ender????? Nope no

He was a Reality ender when he obtained "The heart of the Infinite" and absorbed the Multiverse. Proof was given just above that shows that Thanos DID in fact absorb more then a single universe, and not just one universe.

Please read everything that I have posted before you respond again.
Each universe is one reality, don't tell me you didn't knew ...
The "Infinity being" the big bang of creation of the universe.
Same being as in the Infinity gem's -- Except for that his it is heart, its main power source ...

Than we have HotU >> IG ... True
But Magus with the IG did only affect the 616-universe and an other he created. He could not effect anything else.

Then the Ultimate Nullifier, before Quasar said that he was going to fire it at Magus he said something like this: If I do a single misstake I might flush the entire universe down the tube.

So how did the Nullifier end the Multi-verse?
Simply, Reed just deleted and remade Multi-Eternity ...

As you probably know it can delete most of the beings in Marvel.

But belive what you wanna belive ... I really don't care. stick out tongue

Galan007
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
But belive what you wanna belive ... I really don't care. stick out tongue This is one thing I agree with you about. wink

Mordum
Even mr master agrees that it was the multiverse destroyed.

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by Mordum
Even mr master agrees that it was the multiverse destroyed. Deluded fanboy? -- Cause the comics says the differ ...

Xplosive
I only remember that it says on panel, Universe was destroyed.

Galan007
Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Deluded fanboy? -- Cause the comics says the differ ... Odd how you would have the nerve to call someone a fanboy, when you have consistantly argued the rediculous claim that:

Beyonder>God

roll eyes (sarcastic)

Thanos_THOTU
Originally posted by Galan007
Odd how you would have the nerve to call someone a fanboy, when you have consistantly argued the rediculous claim that:

Beyonder>God

roll eyes (sarcastic)
No I don't, look:

God screws Beyonder in every aspect ...

Lord Urizen
I honestly don't think we have enough to go on to make a valid argument of who would win this...

Mordum
Your calling mr master a delusional fanboy? cause im not the one who said it.

Mr Master
Originally posted by thedude1948
I dont see it.... where does it say anywhere that it was the 6 1 6 Universe.

Exactly, I don't see 616 anywhere.

I do see the term "Universe" which can easily mean Multi-verse, they just prhase that way sometimes, this is why we have to look at the whole, instead of a sinlge phrase.

Mr Master
How about this fellas:


When Thanos with THOTI (TOAA'S Power) reaches Omni-Reality he says,


"My Consciousness reached out to embrace the INFINITE no mere words can describe the sensation of being ONE with ALL"

http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/9356/t1bb1.th.jpg

"I was EVERYTHING, bonded to OMNI-REALITY"



NOW, Thanos is in AWE of the feeling he's receiving from being ONE with EVERYTHING right,

Fine,

If Thanos is JUST bonding with ONE Universe as YOU SAY, WHY would Thanos be so AMAZED by what he is feeling IF he has bonded with ONE Universe before?


Thanos became ETERNITY (EVERYTHING in A UNIVERSE) with the Infinity Gauntlet

http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/7195/thcq1.th.jpg

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/5641/tuni2cy5.th.jpg

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/6876/tuni3fe4.th.jpg



http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/4971/godhoodyn7.th.jpg


Ok, there we go...

Mr Master
I think this is a better explanation of the Thanos incident:



The Omniversal Architecture

When Warlock first exited the Multi-verse, he entered a place called the Cosmic Vortex.
http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/3198/adamgoesbtwnuniverses15yh.th.jpg


In it, an INFINITE number of MULTI-VERSES are spiralling upward, while below lies Oblivion, (the ultimate Abstract in terms of everlasting), swallowing Multi-verses that collapse, are nullified, have a weakened Anchor (like Atleza) ect...

http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/7376/adamgoesbtwnuniverses26zw.th.jpg


These are MULTI-VERSES!


When I realized that Thanos DID in fact, Absorb MORE than just a UNIVERSE, that he actually absorbed ALL he could (which is the MULTI-VERSE)

Here Thanos ABSORBS LT, ETERNITY and INFINITY

http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/4876/teb9kg7.th.jpg



Thanos ABSORBED ETERNITY and INFINITY and there is still Space and star stuff behind him

http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/741/t2gw1oa6.th.jpg
This is not a designed attack, he's saying it himself "it's Out of Control"

Like a raging drunk, who's not selective in a brawl, anything in the way goes, and with that KIND of Power, that means everything goes. (like it did)




I felt I had to add this to the equation:


When a UNIVERSE is ERASED or ABSORBED, it's ETERNITY that DISAPPEARS:

The Ultimate Nullifier ERASING a UNIVERSE:

http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/5489/kpz4.th.jpg

Realize it's ETERNITY that's being ERASED.



And AGAIN, now a MULTI-VERSE is ERASED by the Ultimate Nullifier:

http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/6069/1unisusedbyreedtodestroyabraxa.th.jpg

http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/932/2undestroysmultieternityinfini.th.jpg

Realize it's ETERNITY (Multi-Eternity) that's being ERASED.




Continues in the next post...

Mr Master
Continues...



Let us proceed:




Here it continues,

(REMEMBER, NOW this is AFTER he ABSORBED, LT, Eternity & Infinity)

Watch, and Read



"For IF this BAND (the Living Tribunal, ETERNITY/INFINITY) Could Defy Me...might not OTHERS* be equally Foolish?"
http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/4746/t6bi7.th.jpg
"Could I ALLOW ANY to question my divine AUTHORITY?"



"NO....So I CONTINUED to Absorb ALL that MIGHT THREATEN my REIGN...Until....
http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/2830/t7fq0.th.jpg


See...He's absorbing MORE SPACE now, WHERE is this SPACE coming from if he already absorbed ALL of Space and Time?

WHERE!!!


I'll answer that,


It has to be coming from the Multi-verse, there is no other way to look at it.
*(That's WHO these OTHERS are that MIGHT be equally foolish, the rest of Space, in other words, the MULTI-VERSE)


WHO else COULD question his AUTHORITY, except anyone left in the MULTI-VERSE,


WHO else can THREATEN his REIGN?


CAN'T be the UNIVERSE or the Living Tribunal, he just ABSORBED the UNIVERSE (Eternity/Infinity remember) and LT.




Now your saying to yourself, fine, that conclusively despicts Thanos absorbing the Multi-verse.

But Mr M showed scans of the Cosmic Vortex, where an INFINITE number of Multi-verses are,

How could Thanos have absorbed ALL he could, when he ONLY absorbed ONE Multi-verse?

Now we go back to the OMNIVERSAL structure:




The OMNI-VERSE and the rest of the Multi-verses rest with in the Cosmic Vortex.

See those little Purple Balls, thats where Atleza is (the Cosmic Anchor of the "616" Multi-verse)...

and every little Purple Ball is the Domain of an Anchor of a Multi-verse ...

Each Domain is Outside the Multiverse...Untouched by Space or Time....

The much bigger Blue Balls represent EACH a Multi-verse, and the SUM of the Blue Balls is the Omni-verse.

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/8021/unilook17qj.th.jpg

http://img280.imageshack.us/img280/9715/unilook21qc.th.jpg

Anything Outside the Blue Balls is Untouched by Space & Time,
which Multi-Eternity/Infinity encompass.

See how the Blue Balls (Multi-verses) are separate from each other, and how the little Purple Balls (the Anchor's domain) are separated from the Blue Balls.

This is why Atleza, Gamora and Warlock were untouched, they were there, in A little Purple Ball, (the Anchors domain, Outside it's respective Multi-verse)

This is why Thanos could not absorb more, he absorbed everything within that Blue Ball (a Multi-verse) and evidently, he could not reach any furthur

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/991/allhecouldum7.th.jpg
"Nothing Remained"

Remember he was "Out of Control"

He kept on absorbing till there was nothing left for him to absorb (literally), HAD he been able to absorb everything Outside his Multi-verse, it would have been no problem with TOAA's power,

But Thanos was NOT able to do it, meaning that's as FAR as TOAA permitted his power to be used, absorption of a Multi-verse and Remaking that same Multi-verse, even though being the most powerful being in the Omni-verse.

draxx_tOfU
MOM ftw...

wasnt pre-R beyonder challenged by molecule man or somebody?

anyway, at least MOM's supremacy is unmatched or unchallenged in the Imageverse...

or is it?.... confused

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by draxx_tOfU
MOM ftw...

wasnt pre-R beyonder challenged by molecule man or somebody?

anyway, at least MOM's supremacy is unmatched or unchallenged in the Imageverse...

or is it?.... confused



MOM made is clear that she/he is the greatest power in existance.





"I have many faces...You have known me as Kali The Goddess of Death and Destruction, as the Keeper of the Greenworld, as the Man of Miracles...."



"My children call me Mother, but I am neither male nor female; There is no power greater than me...



"I am the CREATOR OF THE UNIVERSE and the DESTROYER OF WORLDS ! "


-MOM

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