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I've been seeing threads here and there, about how powerful the characters from that timeline are....

Its overblown.

I was rereading both books, and nobody did anything that stood out alot.
Even Gog, was a dud.

He wasn't faster than Flash, he simply followed his electron trail.
Nothing that Surfer or any hyper sensitive type couldn't do.

KC Superman wasn't that powerful in showings.
The best thing about him, was Luthor theorizing him being completely immune to K-nite.

Marvel got taken out by a bomb that amounts to 3 nukes, iirc. Low showing indeed.

Gog was strong, and had a time stream advantage. Plus he had a magic staff thingy.

He killed Mxy.......So what.

The story was great, as i was back when i first read it.
But the powerlevels are grossly overblown.

I agree that the powerlevels are overrated, but it was one of the best stories i have ever read, and I would recommend it to anyone.

I have the Kingdom Come tpb and it's an awesome story, but I've seen people on the versus forum say that Kingdom Come Gog is near skyfather level. All i remember seeing him do is kill joker and pick up a house. I assumed he did something a little more impressive in The Kingdom, but I haven't read it.

You're getting Magog and Gog confused.

Originally posted by UniOmni
I've been seeing threads here and there, about how powerful the characters from that timeline are....

Its overblown.

I was rereading both books, and nobody did anything that stood out alot.
Even Gog, was a dud.

He wasn't faster than Flash, he simply followed his electron trail.
Nothing that Surfer or any hyper sensitive type couldn't do.

KC Superman wasn't that powerful in showings.
The best thing about him, was Luthor theorizing him being completely immune to K-nite.

Marvel got taken out by a bomb that amounts to 3 nukes, iirc. Low showing indeed.

Gog was strong, and had a time stream advantage. Plus he had a magic staff thingy.

He killed Mxy.......So what.

The story was great, as i was back when i first read it.
But the powerlevels are grossly overblown. Yes, he was faster than Flash. Flash tried to rush him and he said with the electron trail he might as well be waving a flag.... He still had to outspeed him to grab him.
And even after that, Hunter tried to use his time bands to step between seconds even faster than Flash, and found that he was still far too slow.

Yeah, don't read KC for power levels.

Read for the story.

i have it but i haven't read it yet been so busy but it seems to have great reviews i guess i better get to it!

Originally posted by Juntai
Yes, he was faster than Flash. Flash tried to rush him and he said with the electron trail he might as well be waving a flag.... He still had to outspeed him to grab him.
And even after that, Hunter tried to use his time bands to step between seconds even faster than Flash, and found that he was still far too slow.

Did you even read his post? He didn't outrun flash. Outrun means to be faster in running speed!



Good lord.

I know Uniomni from Superherochat. He may have a bias, but at the very least he's honest about power levels when it comes to DC.

Originally posted by Howard_Jones
Did you even read his post? He didn't outrun flash. Outrun means to be faster in running speed!



Good lord.

I know Uniomni from Superherochat. He may have a bias, but at the very least he's honest about power levels when it comes to DC. And did you read mine? He outreacted dozens of heros, including Flash himself, and Hunter passing between seconds greater than Flash, and to Gog he was still going too slow. Flash may have been waving the electron flag or whatever, but 1 - he was still passing at speed, and 2 - hunter was NOT giving off the electrons and was going faster, and still was too slow.

Originally posted by Juntai
And did you read mine? He outreacted dozens of heros, including Flash himself, and Hunter passing between seconds greater than Flash, and to Gog he was still going too slow. Flash may have been waving the electron flag or whatever, but 1 - he was still passing at speed, and 2 - hunter was NOT giving off the electrons and was going faster, and still was too slow.

Yeah, please stop flaunting your bias toward the power levels you think those characters are at.

I've seen two posts of yours and I already don't like you. Why do I have a feeling you haven't even read the comic? You probably just saw a scan of it and gave a twisted interpretation.

Originally posted by Howard_Jones
Yeah, please stop flaunting your bias toward the power levels you think those characters are at.

I've seen two posts of yours and I already don't like you. Why do I have a feeling you haven't even read the comic? You probably just saw a scan of it and gave a twisted interpretation. lmao. I'm not flaunting bias, I'm merely telling events that happened in them. And yes, I own both stories. Though I honestly wished I hadn't spent money on The Kingdom.

Originally posted by Juntai
lmao. I'm not flaunting bias, I'm merely telling events that happened in them. And yes, I own both stories. Though I honestly wished I hadn't spent money on The Kingdom.

Understandable, becasue Kingdom was a horrible read, but you may wanna look over that again. Just make sure your eyes don't bleed.

Originally posted by Howard_Jones
Understandable, becasue Kingdom was a horrible read, but you may wanna look over that again. Just make sure your eyes don't bleed. I'm looking over it right now.
Gog was given "Godly knowledge and power" -- as per Highfather and The Quintessence saying so.... at levels vastly beyond any conventional hero and then some, as portrayed in the comics themselves.

Gogs staff had the power of a dozen red suns.

"Gog is more powerful than all of you combined." - Says Hunter -- who was sent as an agent of Phantom Stranger and thus knows the truth of who/what Gog is.-- while trying to save the heros, who included Supes, Wondy, Batman, Flash, a bunch of Amazons, Jade, Sentinal Alan Scott, Nabu the Lord of Order, Red Tornado, Barda, Zatarra, Powergirl, Hawkman, Nightstar, Lightray and others.

Gogs speed was first truly tested against Flash, of course, he was smacking around Wonder Woman and Supes before that, but Flash is the first real test. Also keep in mind that this is the Flash that is so fast he exists in multiple times and realities at once, even metaphysical ones.

Another thing is to consider that there is a barrier keeping Gog from using his time powers during the encounter- meaning he's using purely his power.
"When you move that quickly Flash you energize the electrons in your path. To my eyes you might as well be waving a flag."

On the very next page... Hunter says;
"No one has bothered to clock Gog's speed... but if I use the power of these wristbands to step between nano-seconds, I have to be faster than him."

On the next page, it shows Hunter running up behind him-
"Not so fast."
"I beleive these wristbands are the devices which maintain your time barrier are they not? Were they not?"

And that type of stuff is just in issue 1.

In issue two we see the introduction of our current JLA, which are likewise useless against Gog. And tons of strategies that are equally useless. So even if you didn't find the Kingdom/Kingdom Come characters impressive, the inclusion of our JLA and all the feats they bring with them more than seals the deal.

When the two JLA's try to attack him,
they find that he's been siphoning off power of the Supermen he's been killing each day for years and years.. A trick he learned off of Amazo 2025.

On and on.

First of all, nobody cares about The Kingdom.

Second, I rationalize CM's death by assuming he was in normal human form. He flew into the sky as CM obviously and said Shazam three times which would put him in human form. I don't really give a shit whether anyone agrees either.

Originally posted by Validus
First of all, nobody cares about The Kingdom.

Second, I rationalize CM's death by assuming he was in normal human form. He flew into the sky as CM obviously and said Shazam three times which would put him in human form. I don't really give a shit whether anyone agrees either. I had the same conclusion.

Another thing to consider is that by the way they were talking. Supes would have easily survived it.

Supes says "I can stop the bomb, that much I'm sure of."
Giving his little speech to Billy.
It ended with "With a word, you can stop me."
And Supes says it's his choice to make.

I don't think Billy wanted to live anymore with all of his mistakes really.

Well it generally doesn't make sense that Superman would survive, totally unharmed while CM would get utterly vaporized. Everyone else, even the human level guys left a skeleton and while CM was closer to the explosion he was vastly more powerful than anyone who died.

Originally posted by UniOmni
Marvel got taken out by a bomb that amounts to 3 nukes, iirc. Low showing indeed.
Marvel said Shazam 3 times which means he was only Billy when the bomb exploded.

Originally posted by Validus
Well it generally doesn't make sense that Superman would survive, totally unharmed while CM would get utterly vaporized. Everyone else, even the human level guys left a skeleton and while CM was closer to the explosion he was vastly more powerful than anyone who died. Yeah, I was merely pointing that out. I agree that Billy was in human form because of his SHAZAM SHAZAM SHAZAM!! bit.

It could also be argued that the events and therefore many of the deaths were part of Spectre's judgement. Since he said as much as the same time as the bomb was going to go off.

On a side-note, I got a good laugh out of Ameri-Commando appearing in Uncle Sam recently.

Originally posted by Juntai
I had the same conclusion.

Another thing to consider is that by the way they were talking. Supes would have easily survived it.

Supes says "I can stop the bomb, that much I'm sure of."
Giving his little speech to Billy.
It ended with "With a word, you can stop me."
And Supes says it's his choice to make.

I don't think Billy wanted to live anymore with all of his mistakes really.

But that bomb was supposed to be immune to any superpower, and they launced three just in case. You can see Superman's heat vision bounced off it. Still, Marvel's magic lightning managed to detonate it high up - Billy being in human form, that would make sense how he died.
I didn't read The Kingdom, because it's been widely regarded as an inferior follow up - it even said so on Alex Ross' Wiki bio, I think.

(Kingdom Come Flash didn't do all he seemed capable of, when you think about it.)

This thing only amounts to 3 Nukes?

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d8/maxofguardiana/KingdomCome4-165Never-EndingBattle.jpg

Originally posted by UniOmni
I've been seeing threads here and there, about how powerful the characters from that timeline are....

Its overblown.

I was rereading both books, and nobody did anything that stood out alot.
Even Gog, was a dud.

He wasn't faster than Flash, he simply followed his electron trail.
Nothing that Surfer or any hyper sensitive type couldn't do.

KC Superman wasn't that powerful in showings.
The best thing about him, was Luthor theorizing him being completely immune to K-nite.

Marvel got taken out by a bomb that amounts to 3 nukes, iirc. Low showing indeed.

Gog was strong, and had a time stream advantage. Plus he had a magic staff thingy.

He killed Mxy.......So what.

The story was great, as i was back when i first read it.
But the powerlevels are grossly overblown.

That's not really the truth.

Gog did kill Myx. So......
He also stole powers form anyone he met.....
His staff had the synergistic power of the Quintessence and he was faster than the Flash. You are confusing Mangog and Gog in your post also.

Originally posted by I watch Pokemon


http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d8/maxofguardiana/KingdomCome4-165Never-EndingBattle.jpg

Note that in the scan it states that it's shielded against...... 'All catalogued metahuman powers' I'm pretty sure magical lightening originating from a Greek deity isn't exactly your average metahuman power...

Originally posted by grey fox
Note that in the scan it states that it's shielded against...... 'All catalogued metahuman powers' I'm pretty sure magical lightening originating from a Greek deity isn't exactly your average metahuman power... Yeah, probably not. Wisdom of Solomon ftw.

Could someone explain the differences between Gog and Mangog?

(Kingdom Come Flash didn't do all he seemed capable of, when you think about it.)

Yea I was always curious about that. Flash should have been able to take out at least half of the rogues when the prison blew up. People like Americommando, the guy with the leather and piercinf fetish as well a a handful of other street levelers should have been taken out by flash by himself.