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This is RotS Anakin. Neutral setting. Anything goes.

Anakin though a tough fight by Kas'Im.

Anakin is simply more powerful.

Anakin wins, though I'm sure Nebaris- I mean Planet will say otherwise.

Sorry...

no no no, you mean dessel will say that Kas'im pwns because he knows all the lightsaber forms.

BTW, Anakin wins.

Originally posted by General Kenobl
Anakin though a tough fight by Kas'Im.

Originally posted by jollyjim311
Anakin is simply more powerful.

Indeed

Care to post any reasons why?

'Within the first few passes Bane knew he couldn't win. Kas'im had trained his entire life for this moment. After years of study, he'd mastered all seven forms of the lightsaber. Then he'd honed his skill for decades, perfecting every move and sequence until he had become the perfect weapon and the greatest living swordsman in the galaxy. Maybe the greatest swordsman ever. Bane was no match for him.'

Anakin's up against someone who mastered all 7 forms of lightsaber combat, for dual sabers and the saber staff as well as a single saber. He then spent decades refining and perfecting his moves, until he was described as the perfect weapon, the greatest living swordsman and possibly the greatest ever. He also switched up between these forms in combat, giving him a somewhat unique style. There is simply no other in the entire SW universe who was ever as dedicated to saber combat as Kas'im was, PoD makes it pretty clear that he pretty much spent every bit of free time he had honing his skills, I'm pretty sure he didn't even sleep.

In short, he's mastered every form there is including Anakin's, he has a unique style that Anakin has never come across, and he perfected all of his moves. There's no way Anakin can win in my eyes.

Well let's see. Anakin was said to be the strongest Jedi alive during an age where lightsaber mastery had reached a peak. He killed off Dooku, who was one of the greatest swordsmen alive. He collapsed an entire room or building by Rage. He mastered Djem So to the highest degree possible.

While Kas'Im is deadly, I put him (and many others in that good ole' thread Kas'Im vs. Dooku) on par with Tyrannus. Anakin is just a shade better.

**** it, I just typed out some major long response and my fecking internet stopped responding.

Originally posted by The Planet
**** it, I just typed out some major long response and my fecking internet stopped responding.

petpet

1. Where was Anakin said to be the strongest jedi alive? This doesn't make sense, as both Yoda and Mace are definitely more powerful.

2. Where was lightsaber mastery said to have reached its peak? Need I remind you of the hundreds of Niman users who died at Geonosis?



Under questionable circumstances.



This was an unfocused attack - his rage taking pure form in an uncontrolled way, he wouldn't be able to successfully employ it in a versus scenario. And remember, this is the same Anakin that couldn't even overpower Obi-Wan with the force.

Anyways, this compares to Bane destroying a temple, how? 'Cause Kas'im was able to defend against an attack which was so powerful that its redirection was able to collapse the entire Rakatan Temple, imagine how powerful the blast was head on? No, I think it's pretty safe to say that Kas'im can defend against anything Anakin throws at him with the force.



To the highest degree possible? Proof? And the funny thing is, with Kas'im's perfecting his moves for decades, he most likely did master the form to its highest degree.

In the Revenge of the Sith novelization, it says along the lines that Anakin was "the greatest, the finest, the best pilot..., the Order had seen." Mace and Yoda are greater due to their experience and mastery of the Force. However, Anakin has the highest raw power and has one of the highest Midi-Chlorian counts. Already at the age of 23, his Force strength is only surpassed by Yoda, Sidious, Mace, and Dooku (all who had to spend decades to reach their level).

And yes, Jedi lightsaber training has been perfected to a very high degree. Ever since the Battle of Ruusan, which nearly destroyed the Jedi Order, the Jedi have been fearful of the Dark Side. They saw how powerful it was {Thought Bomb}, and that explains why many Jedi don't use any many Force moves as Jedi during the Jedi Civil War for example. Even Mace tells Yoda that "it's time to tell the council that your ability with the Force has diminished" to indicate how Force moves have deteriorated. Yet the PT Order has made up for this via lightsaber training. During the CW, there were many deadly saber users besides the primary heroes and villians, like Quinlan Vos, Asajj Ventress, Kit Fisto, Agen Kolar, Cin Drallig, Depa Billaba, etc. All the forms have been mastered and even Juyo has been molded into a form: Vapaad.

And Geonosis was a different case. Niman was a balanced form. Yet for its intentions it's moves were highly perfected. In addition, the 200 Jedi on Geonosis were heavily outnumbered.



Hardly, just because some people can't deny it, we know that Anakin > Dooku.



My point was to show Anakin is not weak with the Force. And neither is Kas'Im. But Anakin doesn't have to use the Force to beat Kas'Im, does he?



Funny, look what happened to Dooku at Skywalker's hands.

While Kas'Im puts a helluva fight, Anakin's Djem So grants him the victory.

Kas'im was good but with his anger, anakin would win this battle.

Besides Kas'im's skill and age, let's remember how gifted of a swordsman Bane was when he made that comparison, and what era he was living in. While I am confident Skywalker, if he put everything he had into it, could put up one hell of a fight, Kas'im will eventually find some way to use Skywalker's recklessness against him, otherwise Kas'im could simply distract/surprise Skywalker with some move, or draw him into a bad position. Skywalker simply doesn't have the focus and experience to win.

Well, Bane was great but also, he was great when all the other siths were not that great... For example, an holocron from Revan had more knowledge to him them all the sith lords' knowledge from his time... So, basicly, i am not saying that Kas'im was not good, but i doubt he could beat anakin, the choosen one, in ROTS.

Most people agree that Skywalker > Kas'Im and that the Twi'lek Lightsaber Master is on par and slightly below Dooku.

Well, Kas'im was nearly as good as Bane so I think he could likely take Skywalker.

The planet, don't take me wrong but, are you trying to say that dooku>anakin? Because anakin>dooku is probably one of the few things we really know about lightsaber duels... Dooku was pretty much handed in the movie and the book even explain why anakin defeated Dooku...

Anyway, i doubt Kas'm is stronger then dooku, and even less that he would beat Anakin. I think that Anakin is superior, even if Kas'm would give him a hard fight.

EDIT

Admiral Planet? Don't try to copy Advent General, you're not smart enough to pull it off.



Did you read what I posted? I wasn't talking about personal combat prowess, just how good a jedi he is.



No, he wasn't. Mace's physical strength is far above Anakin's



The point is, you were acting as if the jedi order focused more on personal power after the BoR, the opposite is the actual truth.



That's not the point, the whole argument is based on the entire jedi order.



Tholme and Shaak Ti, I'll give you. Provide proof for the others.



Despite the fact that not even the wisest and most in tune with the lightside of the force attempted to master it, due to the fact that it was as dangerous to its user as it is to its opponent.

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?books=239

Chapter 3.

You read it yourself, then come back.

Look dude, whatever point you're trying to make, I'm not going to read through an entire chapter of a book just because you're too lazy to make a proper argument. Seriously...

That's cute Prodigal. Funny how not one person has ever said jack about you.



It relates to it in a very small way. Your post gave the impression that you believed that was my main point. It was not. I was mostly talking about how good a general he was, how many battles he won (as a general), his piloting skills...



Vaapad is even more kinetic than Djem So, Kenobl.



Mace can punch through durasteel, dummy.



No. You were completely wrong, I was right.



Prove it!!



This is ridiculous. By this logic, Anakin must know Soresu because he trained under Obi-Wan. Seriously, your arguments couldn't get more fallacious.



Since when is a curved lightsaber exclusive to Makashi? Assaj Ventress used a curved saber, she didn't utilise Makashi. Darth Bane used a curved saber, he utilised Shien...



By your logic, anyone who utilises another form other than Makashi is totally immune to blaster fire. Please.



Right... I guess that all the jedi who got gunned down by clones utilised Makashi, correct? Please, if your arguments don't get any better, I'm gonna end this, because you're starting to bore me and your inept arguments are quite frankly not worth my time.



Not that this point is relevant to the argument (as it is just speculation into a what if scenario), but yeah, Mace was nothing special, there would have been plenty of Mace Windus after he. Please...

First off, you brought Advent and crap into this, so please shut up all right.



No, it doesn't refer to it in a very small way. One of the quote's primary purposes was to show how powerful Anakin was, as a General and as a Jedi.



Vapaad drives in short fast deadly attacks. Djem So are more long, and have more strength to them.

And please don't switch the topic Planet. Your reply is something totally different to what I originally posted. Try again:

Anakin when fighting generates high strength due to his use of Djem So.



1.) Yep, the same Mace Windu who punched out thousands of battle droids without his hands bleeding. The Clone Wars Series are Jedi exaggerations at their finest.

2.) Do you have proof that Anakin cannot?



Wow, you're persuasive.



I already typed up an explanation some posts ago. But who cares.

As time passes by, and you get older, you learn many things along the way. You gain experience, which is why people consider old people wise. The Jedi's lightsaber training have been continuously perfected over the years. The Jedi learn more techniques, new things, which they add to the Holocrons. It seems logical that more techniques and perfection on certain attacks and defensive moves in all forms increased over the centuries. Even Vapaad has been perfected. This is a huge step since nobody in millenia has been able to complete the form. It seems likely that this is the case.



Actually, Anakin and Obi-Wan both knew Ataru in AOTC. However, after this they began to learn their own special forms and master it. Obi-Wan became a master of Soresu and Anakin a master of Djem So.



First off, I wrote more to that. That just a part of what I wrote. The curved lightsaber plus Tyvokka losing to some gunshots makes sense that he uses Makashi. Please don't try bullshit on me.



Pathetic. Makashi is naturally susceptible to blaster fire than other forms. ""By my logic"", please you're making a fool of yourself. Did I ever say that? No, I said Makashi is weak to blaster fire.



Pff, look who's talking. I'm not even trying to argue, and still you're doing pretty bad. Hey, whatever happened to the Dooku argument? Obviously, you couldn't come up with a better rebuttal, so you just skip it.



Had the Order survived, Jedi like Kyp Durron and others could have entered the Temple. In thousands of years to come, if Order survived all ways, you don't think there would be any more Jedi with the power of Mace Windu?

"Sigh" This is getting quite boring.

with all the logic here, it's as if people are saying Anakin could beat Yoda too, when Kas'im had more saber knowledge than even Yoda. He would slice Anakin up in a saber duel.

Anakin beats kas'im, hands down. He is just too powerfull.

Also, after read this book i am now 100% sure that anakin>dooku

What book are you talking about?

The novelization. I actually never read ROTS' book, but now i see that anakin>dooku quite clearly. The book states this in a very clear way.

Everyone knows Anakin>Dooku

Anakin, Mace, Yoda, and Dooku could (imo), take down Kas'im.

Originally posted by Blaxican
Anakin, Mace, Yoda, and Dooku could (imo), take down Kas'im.


I disagree with all of these except for possibly Yoda. We're talking about pure saber combat here. Read POD.

You don't think Mace could take out Kas'Im adter a hard fight?

May I ask why? I'm nto disagreeing, I'm just wondering, bot contradicting.

Originally posted by Blaxican
You don't think Mace could take out Kas'Im adter a hard fight?

May I ask why? I'm nto disagreeing, I'm just wondering, bot contradicting.

because again, Kas'im mastered all 7 forms of lightsaber combat, mastered jar'kai, mastered doube bladed techniques, and was deemed the perfect warrior.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
because again, Kas'im mastered all 7 forms of lightsaber combat, mastered jar'kai, mastered doube bladed techniques, and was deemed the perfect warrior.

Doesn't know Vaapad. Doesn't have defense against Shatterpoint. I can see Mace winning, and even if he doesn't, he's sure as hell not going down easily.

Vaapad isn't really that different from Juyo, the actual moves and sequences were hardly expanded upon, Mace just took it to the next level with the mental aspects of the form. And it's not like Shatterpoint is infallible, it clearly didn't help him against Dooku.

In a way actually, speaking only in terms of the moves and sequences of the forms, Kas'im did what Mace did to Juyo to all 7 forms,
After years of study, he'd mastered all seven forms of the lightsaber. Then he'd honed his skill for decades, perfecting every move and sequence until he had become the perfect weapon and the greatest living swordsman in the galaxy.

Originally posted by Gideon
Doesn't know Vaapad. Doesn't have defense against Shatterpoint. I can see Mace winning, and even if he doesn't, he's sure as hell not going down easily.

Form 7 is Juyo, nobody but Mace knows Vaapad. And I don't see Mace winning against Yoda's different styles, so I highly doubt that he would do better against somebody that knows MORE in terms of saber combat, than Yoda.

Anakin was called something along the lines of "The perfect warrior" during the time of the clone wars.

Also, he isn't one to ***** about two lightsabers the way Bane is. He does fine against them.

Yeah, against Assaj Ventress, who's nothing compared to Kas'im.

Who cares. Kas'Im is like the very equivalent of verbal fellatio of a character, way overrated and didn't do anything of any real note, especially compared to the likes of Anakin Skywalker/ Vader.

However, I have to acknowledge Kas'Im's skill, and obviously he's very very very good. But I still give it to Anakin. Sometimes attempting to master everything is actually not as good as trying to master 1 thing perfectly, like Anakin with Form V. Plus Anakin is just badass, Kas'Im is just the new fanboy craze, soon he will be forgotten once a newer, yet more vague character comes along who has like two quotes of "l33tness" to his/ her name that people get hard-ons for for some reason. It goes in Phases.

First it was Ragnos, then Revan, now Kas'Im....I wonder what "Great" new character we can expect from authors in the future. I cant hardly wait.

The same can be said about any powerful character if you dislike them.



Right, defeating Bane isn't noteworthy...



ZOMG, he had more source material!!



You're arguing from ignorance here Anomaly, Kas'im didn't just attempt to master everything, he mastered all seven forms for every primary saber, and then spent decades improving his skills, and perfecting the forms.



Oops, I forgot, Anakin's a movie character, he wins by default.

Originally posted by Captain Planet
The same can be said about any powerful character if you dislike them.



Right, defeating Bane isn't noteworthy...



ZOMG, he had more source material!!



You're arguing from ignorance here Anomaly, Kas'im didn't just attempt to master everything, he mastered all seven forms for every primary saber, and then spent decades improving his skills, and perfecting the forms.



Oops, I forgot, Anakin's a movie character, he wins by default.

Let our powers combine! Earth! Fire! Wind! Water!...Heart!
By your powers combined, I am Captain Planet!
GO PLANET!

I know you're not an immature guy Anomaly, so I can see where you joke's at, real funny stuff.

Originally posted by ((The_Anomaly))
Who cares. Kas'Im is like the very equivalent of verbal fellatio of a character, way overrated and didn't do anything of any real note, especially compared to the likes of Anakin Skywalker/ Vader.

However, I have to acknowledge Kas'Im's skill, and obviously he's very very very good. But I still give it to Anakin. Sometimes attempting to master everything is actually not as good as trying to master 1 thing perfectly, like Anakin with Form V. Plus Anakin is just badass, Kas'Im is just the new fanboy craze, soon he will be forgotten once a newer, yet more vague character comes along who has like two quotes of "l33tness" to his/ her name that people get hard-ons for for some reason. It goes in Phases.

First it was Ragnos, then Revan, now Kas'Im....I wonder what "Great" new character we can expect from authors in the future. I cant hardly wait.

Basically.

Although, I'd go with less of the he wins due to being a "Badass" and more to the incredible dispalys of power, but you got it.

Originally posted by Captain Planet

I know you're not an immature guy Anomaly, so I can see where you joke's at, real funny stuff.

In retrospect I should have posted this. Its far more effective

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LET3nCX8x0

Originally posted by jollyjim311
Basically.

Although, I'd go with less of the he wins due to being a "Badass" and more to the incredible dispalys of power, but you got it.

Yea I thought so too. The next guy will have a vague quote about mastering everything tenfold to the extent of Cro-Magnun proportions.

****, only just realised who he was, changing username now.

JEsus christ, you really have absolutely NO life do you?

Sorry Sexy, weren't you the guy who had 1000 posts on this forum in under a week when you first joined this forum?

Originally posted by Captain Planet
Sorry Sexy, weren't you the guy who had 1000 posts on this forum in under a week when you first joined this forum?

Not sure but if I was, you definitely beat me by a LARGE margin

Actually, the animated Captain Planet seriously kicks ass. The theme song is so catchy, I haven't heard that since I was like 7.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LET3nCX8x0

Lol, I remember now. Great themesong.

Whenever the part "hear what captain planet has to say!" I automatically here CP saying "I'm gay!"

Seriously, could he be more lame? 'Gonna take pollution down to zero'? WTF?

Originally posted by zephiel7
Whenever the part "hear what captain planet has to say!" I automatically here CP saying "I'm gay!"

ROFL.



So your similarities aren't just within the name then.

haha

Originally posted by Advent
So your similarities aren't just within the name then.

PWNT QED (lol)

Haha, as if you changed your name...

"YOUUUU'LLL Pay for this Captain Planet!!!!!"

Originally posted by ((The_Anomaly))
Haha, as if you changed your name...

"YOUUUU'LLL Pay for this Captain Planet!!!!!"

I used to watch that show. Don't compare this guy to something as cool as Captain Planet.

Originally posted by ((The_Anomaly))
Haha, as if you changed your name...

"YOUUUU'LLL Pay for this Captain Planet!!!!!"

lol.

Originally posted by Gideon
I used to watch that show. Don't compare this guy to something as cool as Captain Planet. Lets refer him to captain n00b

Okay, the way I see it, Kas'im is good because he can find weaknesses in people's techniques, he can tell patterns, and Anakin, when most powerful, is also the most reckless.

Anakin has more power, but Kas'im has more experience, both because of his age and the fact we are talking about the millennia-long New Sith Wars here, where the Jedi and Sith were in their most martial form.

Now, I can see Kas'im beating Anakin the same way Obi-Wan did. Kas'im has more focus and knows how to surprise/distract his opponents. He isn't just magically good. I am confident that Anakin can give Kas'im one hell of a fight, but Anakin would have to be at his very best to win (he can't normally do it).

Anakin cannot beat Yoda, what makes you think Anakin can defeat someone even MORE skilled with a saber?

Also, you shouldn't think of Kas'im as the guy who has only mastered the forms, and nothing else. There's much more to him than that, his reflexes were insane, and his physical condition was superb. He ticks all the boxes really.

You should of Anakin as the guy who mastered Djem So to a very high degree (was said to be the greatest user of it by former Battlemaster Dooku). His speed was off the charts, his reflexes awesome, his midi-chlorian count off the charts, physical condition amazing (muscles across his body). He ticks all the boxes really. And he ticks one box that Kas'Im does not tick, and that's the WINNER BOX! LOL

Originally posted by General Kenobl
And he ticks one box that Kas'Im does not tick, and that's the WINNER BOX! LOL

Lol! Pwned.

Originally posted by General Kenobl
You should of Anakin as the guy who mastered Djem So to a very high degree (was said to be the greatest user of it by former Battlemaster Dooku). His speed was off the charts, his reflexes awesome, his midi-chlorian count off the charts, physical condition amazing (muscles across his body). He ticks all the boxes really. And he ticks one box that Kas'Im does not tick, and that's the WINNER BOX! LOL

Man, the way you talk about Anakin, I swear. Youre basically saying he can defeat Yoda too, since Kas'im is better trained in the lightsaber arts.

It is possible that Anakin possesses sheer lightsaber prowess that supercedes anyone in the PT. It is very possible.

Possible but unlikely he could ever defeat the likes of Mace, Yoda, or Palpatine.

If Anakin was in the same mind set as when he fought Dooku I could see him very easily beating Mace. Yoda and Sidious might be harder because of their phenomenal force prowess, however I can see Anakin eventually overcoming them as well.

Originally posted by General Kenobl
You should of Anakin as the guy who mastered Djem So to a very high degree (was said to be the greatest user of it by former Battlemaster Dooku).

Not the best ever, just the best that Dooku had ever seen.



Were his reflexes ever actually noted? 'Cause Kas'im's were.



Is that right?

Originally posted by Sexyback
Were his reflexes ever actually noted? 'Cause Kas'im's were.

Yes, Durge once stated that Anakin was the fastest Jedi he had ever seen. Which is A LOT of Jedi seeing as he lived for over 2000 years.

I'm sure there are other references, but this is the one off the top of my head.

He was that old? Hmm, perhaps he'll have a run in with Bane at some point.

Originally posted by Sexyback
He was that old? Hmm, perhaps he'll have a run in with Bane at some point.

And what? Get his ass 100% tooled?

Originally posted by ((The_Anomaly))
Yes, Durge once stated that Anakin was the fastest Jedi he had ever seen. Which is A LOT of Jedi seeing as he lived for over 2000 years.

I'm sure there are other references, but this is the one off the top of my head.



Actually, he said "Fastest jedi I've ever KILLED"......

Also, that speaks for speed, not reflexes.

Originally posted by zephiel7
And what? Get his ass 100% tooled?


...Ehhh. Probably, but not that easy. As far as combat gos, Durge is just plain better. Force powers would be a *****, though. Durge has fought Jedi and learned all their tricks, but, Banes command of the darkside is impressive. Without offensive force powers, though, I doubt a POD Bane could take Durge, or come close, really.

Sorry, this is the wrong place for this. If you feel the need to make a thread, go ahead, but, let's not spam on this one, like I'm doing.

Anyway, Anakin has solid evidence that he is better. Kas'Im has one hyperbolic quote. But, even then, Anakin has him beat in that department.

"This is Anakin Skywalker: The most powerful Jedi of his generation. Perhaps of any generation..."

The quote goes on, but, I can't find it...

IIRC, wasn't that quote talking about how good a jedi he was, not purely how great his combat prowess was but multiple factors such as his piloting, his skills as a general etc...

The quote on Kas'im explains clearly just how good with a saber Kas'im was, and there's plenty of other stuff in PoD to gauge his power off, and he's quite clearly much better than Anakin.

His speed, agility and stamina were off the scales, as were his reflexes, and after having mastered all 7 forms for all types of the saber, he then spent decades perfecting each form.

This, coupled along with the fact that he frequently switched up between styles during a duel gave him a unique style, and the only person that could ever contend with him was Bane, only for part of the duel, and that was because Bane knew the setting inside out, his strength in the force and mastery was phenomenal and beyond Kas'im's, he knew Kas'im's moves with the saber staff inside out, and well, because he was BANE - most probably the most prodigious force user with a lightsaber ever...

Kas'im's also most likely very strong and masterful of the force as well, given how incredible his reflexes, stamina and physical attributes were, and the fact that he defended against the mega pwnage attack that Bane produced, which collapsed the entire Rakatan temple.

Originally posted by -kV-
Most people agree that Skywalker > Kas'Im and that the Twi'lek Lightsaber Master is on par and slightly below Dooku.



lol1

Neph and DMB would lmao

They'd agree, except for the Anakin and Dooku > Kas'im part.

Nebaris wtfpwning noobs since the age of eleven.

Ahsoka Tano would likely kill Kas'im without too much difficulty

Originally posted by NewGuy01
They'd agree, except for the Anakin and Dooku > Kas'im part.
I have never said Kas'im>Anakin and Dooku...

Originally posted by appletonia

Nebaris wtfpwning noobs since the age of eleven.


no