Obama not black?

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Marxman
I was watching a rerun of the Colbert Report and he had a guest that came on disputing Obama's "blackness". She claimed that since his father immigrated here from Kenya is 1959 (I think that's what she said) that he is not the same as those who are considered "black" in America today. According to this woman, "black" people are the descendants of West African slaves brought to America. Since Obama isn't the descendant of a African slave, he is not "black". African-American, but not black.

Now I have a problem with this. She says this under the guise that she wants to respect Obama's unique and rich heritage of being the son of a Kenyan immigrant but please. It seems like people look for ways to hate each other. Obama didn't "go through the same hardships" black people in America went through.

As far as I know, no black people alive today were ever slaves. What's the point in giving Obama another label, and pretty much calling him unworthy of being black?

Capt_Fantastic
Originally posted by Marxman
As far as I know, no black people alive today were ever slaves. What's the point in giving Obama another label, and pretty much calling him unworthy of being black?

Pretty much. And it's a big pile of shit. The man is black. Just because he's never been broke-ass poor doesn't mean he's not black.

AngryManatee
Maybe to take the black vote away from him? I dunno. She sounds like a biatch.

Imperial_Samura
Originally posted by Marxman
I was watching a rerun of the Colbert Report and he had a guest that came on disputing Obama's "blackness". She claimed that since his father immigrated here from Kenya is 1959 (I think that's what she said) that he is not the same as those who are considered "black" in America today. According to this woman, "black" people are the descendants of West African slaves brought to America. Since Obama isn't the descendant of a African slave, he is not "black". African-American, but not black.

Hmmm. I definitely smell the opinions drawn from someones... hat. This woman's spouting is possibly the stupidest thing I have heard for some time.

What about the white Americans? By golly, if you aren't descended from a family that kept slaves you aren't a white American. You're a grey one, like Obama - in some sort of strange nether world of this womens fantasies.



Yeah, I am fairly sure this women hasn't gone through the same hardships as the slaves either. Unless she is well over a hundred years old.



There is no reason. Some people have opinions, and regardless of how crazy like them to be known. Personally I don't think race should matter at all, but Obama is no less a person because his family weren't slaves at some point.

Oncewhite
Originally posted by Marxman
I was watching a rerun of the Colbert Report and he had a guest that came on disputing Obama's "blackness". She claimed that since his father immigrated here from Kenya is 1959 (I think that's what she said) that he is not the same as those who are considered "black" in America today. According to this woman, "black" people are the descendants of West African slaves brought to America. Since Obama isn't the descendant of a African slave, he is not "black". African-American, but not black.

Now I have a problem with this. She says this under the guise that she wants to respect Obama's unique and rich heritage of being the son of a Kenyan immigrant but please. It seems like people look for ways to hate each other. Obama didn't "go through the same hardships" black people in America went through.

As far as I know, no black people alive today were ever slaves. What's the point in giving Obama another label, and pretty much calling him unworthy of being black?


I've met some blacks and some African-Americans, they are not the same, and putting them in the same category is what causes a lot of problems, those two are not the same entity, they look similar but that's it. Once people start understanding that, they can see that differences doesn't mean hatred, it just means each group respects his or her own respective label that THEY GIVE THEMSELVES.

That's free will.

I wish blacks would stop harassing anyone with slightly negro features and making them out to be them, when we all know it's not true.

There are fundamental differences and it's not a disrespect to anyone by noticing them, the only ones who are scared of the difference are the ones who feel they will lose more out of the equation.

And I don't believe it has anything to do with slavery, but with mentality, the mentality that your parents teach you. It's a different mentality for someone who is a first generation immigrant. And he is mixed race, if he wants to only claim his African origin, that's up to him. Black is not exactly every color in Africa, and not all aFricans worship blackness or black or nubian culture. Blacks have voted for people who aren't the same color, so I can't see why they would feel so offended by someone who looks similar to them but who simply was raised with a different cultural mentality. So, I can't see why open minded blacks wouldn't vote for him, if they liked him, anymore then they would vote for any person who is within their interest, and the interest shouldn't be to turn this entire nation black, as it shouldn't be the interest of gays to turn this entire nation gay, although this nation does allow both, it's not to dominate the entire nation.

Ya Krunk'd Floo
Who gives a shit? He's an intelligent, principled and charming guy; what else is there worth considering?

Marxman
Originally posted by AngryManatee
Maybe to take the black vote away from him? I dunno. She sounds like a biatch. Quite. The worst thing about this, SHE'S BLACK!!!

She said she is black but Obama is not. She wrote a book called "The End of Blackness". I did a little search on google, her name is Debra Dickerson. Her book is a call for all black people to "get over" slavery and racial oppression. In this book she discusses how racism no longer blocks blacks from "playing the game".

Now while I agree that people should stop victimizing themselves and making a "them" and an "us", racism is still a very real thing. ignoring it is just as bad as being racist. While this woman seems to be trying to end the self-victimization of black Americans, it seems to me that she's actually trying to have blacks lose their identity.
Originally posted by Oncewhite
I've met some blacks and some African-Americans, they are not the same, and putting them in the same category is what causes a lot of problems, those two are not the same entity, they look similar but that's it. Once people start understanding that, they can see that differences doesn't mean hatred, it just means each group respects his or her own respective label that THEY GIVE THEMSELVES.

That's free will.

I wish blacks would stop harassing anyone with slightly negro features and making them out to be them, when we all know it's not true.

There are fundamental differences and it's not a disrespect to anyone by noticing them, the only ones who are scared of the difference are the ones who feel they will lose more out of the equation.

And I don't believe it has anything to do with slavery, but with mentality, the mentality that your parents teach you. It's a different mentality for someone who is a first generation immigrant. And he is mixed race, if he wants to only claim his African origin, that's up to him. Black is not exactly every color in Africa, and not all aFricans worship blackness or black or nubian culture. Blacks have voted for people who aren't the same color, so I can't see why they would feel so offended by someone who looks similar to them but who simply was raised with a different cultural mentality. So, I can't see why open minded blacks wouldn't vote for him, if they liked him, anymore then they would vote for any person who is within their interest, and the interest shouldn't be to turn this entire nation black, as it shouldn't be the interest of gays to turn this entire nation gay, although this nation does allow both, it's not to dominate the entire nation. I'm not trying to lump anybody with a little bit of color in their skin together. I grew up with mostly black friends. I didn't have a white friend until high school. I know the animosity that black people have towards Africans and Haitians. My point is why is it there? Why is race an issue in the first place? Maybe I'm a part of the problem by bringing this to your attention but I feel it needs to be known that whether Obama is black, white, Puerto Rican, Chinese, Arab, whatever, it shouldn't make a difference but rather his qualifications should be what we judge him on.

Oncewhite
Originally posted by Marxman
Quite. The worst thing about this, SHE'S BLACK!!!

She said she is black but Obama is not. She wrote a book called "The End of Blackness". I did a little search on google, her name is Debra Dickerson. Her book is a call for all black people to "get over" slavery and racial oppression. In this book she discusses how racism no longer blocks blacks from "playing the game".

Now while I agree that people should stop victimizing themselves and making a "them" and an "us", racism is still a very real thing. ignoring it is just as bad as being racist. While this woman seems to be trying to end the self-victimization of black Americans, it seems to me that she's actually trying to have blacks lose their identity.
I'm not trying to lump anybody with a little bit of color in their skin together. I grew up with mostly black friends. I didn't have a white friend until high school. I know the animosity that black people have towards Africans and Haitians. My point is why is it there? Why is race an issue in the first place? Maybe I'm a part of the problem by bringing this to your attention but I feel it needs to be known that whether Obama is black, white, Puerto Rican, Chinese, Arab, whatever, it shouldn't make a difference but rather his qualifications should be what we judge him on.

Well, someone started the thread about his race, so you have to ask them why race is so important in this subject.

I feel that there is a desire among some blacks to retain black culture mentality, could be negro spirituals, roots, particular type of dance, walk, and talk and financial mentality, educational mentality, family values, and again, religious/spiritual beliefs, type of foods that they eat (and the combinations of certain foods which may be very unhealthy, a lot of fried food, chitlings -southern dish, etc), values on how you treat another person, how they teach children to deal with stress and rejection and jealousy and disappointments (the negative stuff in life that slows people down), those are cultural things that make a person black, not the facial features.

I didn't read her book, but I doubt she's trying to make black Americans lose their identity, seems like an avenue for those who have an open mind to branch into a different level (mind you, i didn't qualify that level).

Alliance
This argument is stupid. Obama had a black father and a white mother. He is black because people says he is, because people say he looks black.

Obama has said he doesn't care about his race label. He himself acknowledges that his family reunions look like UN general assembley meetings.

Oncewhite
Originally posted by Marxman
Quite. The worst thing about this, SHE'S BLACK!!!

She said she is black but Obama is not. She wrote a book called "The End of Blackness". I did a little search on google, her name is Debra Dickerson. Her book is a call for all black people to "get over" slavery and racial oppression. In this book she discusses how racism no longer blocks blacks from "playing the game".


the book is her opinion as well as what she thinks of obama.
she's not black to me, she is what she says she is, stop trying to dominate folks, the poor woman is probably being harassed.


i know what it's like to be harassed by black folks, it's really an experience. trust me, some think/assume that b/c your skin is dark that they have the right to dictate to you who you are and your sense of reality. i had a GAY "BLACK" GUY tell me about my race, and was dressed AS A WOMAN, but was TELLING ME WHO I WAS, I'm like, NO SIR, YOU dressed as a woman can't tell me that i'm confused about who i am.

Oncewhite
I should say "he was trying to tell me what race I belong to" but he was dressed in drag, pretending to be a woman, so it was odd that someone who was wanting to be a female (perhaps b/c he has a female spirit in him) decided to comment about what race I should belong to...and the guy was a complete stranger.

Robtard
He's a mulatto, he's as black as he is white. Simple as that.

Marxman
Oncewhite, I'd ask you to keep your ridiculous idea of you being a white woman trapped in a black man's body, or whatever it is you claim, out of this discussion and stick to the topic.

Obama and the differences between black people and Africans are just the background information to the actual question of this topic.


Why do people look for differences between themselves and other people? Can't we accept the fact that we are all human? When will we see that our differences shouldn't be something we use to segregate but rather they should be celebrated and cherished? Why isn't it good enough for us to see that Obama is either qualified or not qualified for being the President of the United States and not make it about his race? Same with Hilary. Is she qualified or isn't she? Why make a big deal about her being a woman?

PVS
the right wing is launching a sort of uncle tom swiftboating campaign. also they want to paint him as...well...a terrorist.

i love it though. let the stupid whores give into the hype and expose themselves for what they really are. when these pricks panic (as they're doing now) they shoot themselves in the foot.

by mid-08 he'll be able to say he overcame racist attacks etc. and come out even cleaner as if that was possible.

Oncewhite
Originally posted by Marxman


Obama and the differences between black people and Africans are just the background information to the actual question of this topic.


Why do people look for differences between themselves and other people? Can't we accept the fact that we are all human? When will we see that our differences shouldn't be something we use to segregate but rather they should be celebrated and cherished? Why isn't it good enough for us to see that Obama is either qualified or not qualified for being the President of the United States and not make it about his race? Same with Hilary. Is she qualified or isn't she? Why make a big deal about her being a woman?

BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE DIFFERENT, my GOD. a person can be mixed with black culture, and look light colored but consider themselves black because they eat soul food, they talk with Ebonics at home, they do certain dances, they're involved in certain roots or spiritual work, they are into these things, a person can look totally dark but wasn't raised to eat that kind of food, talk that kind of talk, not into roots or spiritual work, and have a totally different way of addressing people, DIFFERENT, so it's wrong for those folks to be clumped with the soul food eating, ghetto talking, root working, negative sum mentality of blacks. If blacks like that GOOD FOR THEM, but DO NOT PUT EVERY NEGRO PERSON IN THAT GROUP, AND THAT'S WHY YOU ARE SO FRUSTRATED B/C IT'S SIMPLY NOT THE SAME culture. Similar looks maybe, but culture, NOPE, it's not the same, and blacks get frustrated trying to impose their culture on other negro looking or mixed (Africanish-Asiatic descendant) group. They tried it with me so I know they try this on others who are mixed or who aren't mixed at all, my thing is why not leave a person alone, if someone wants to be within the group, they usually will come ON THEIR OWN FREE WILL, NO NEGATIVITY TO BRING THEM THERE. Leave people be, there's peace there. Blacks are not the same as all Afro-Asiatics, sometimes they are the same, but not always GIVE PEOPLE THEIR FREE WILL TO DECIDE, A PERSON KNOWS THEMSELVES BETTER THEN YOU WHO IS TRYING TO POLICE EVERYBODY.

Oncewhite
Originally posted by Marxman
Oncewhite, I'd ask you to keep your ridiculous idea of you being a white woman trapped in a black man's body, or whatever it is you claim, out of this discussion and stick to the topic.




roll eyes (sarcastic)

Oncewhite
Originally posted by PVS
the right wing is launching a sort of uncle tom swiftboating campaign. also they want to paint him as...well...a terrorist.

i love it though. let the stupid whores give into the hype and expose themselves for what they really are. when these pricks panic (as they're doing now) they shoot themselves in the foot.

by mid-08 he'll be able to say he overcame racist attacks etc. and come out even cleaner as if that was possible.

How can an Afro-Asiatic or mixed race person be an Uncle Tom when they get along well with whites?

Why can't it be that these folks of different skin colors get along b/c they have the same mentality?

The mentality is the same and that's why THEY (republican party) get along, but since YOU ONLY SEE RACE(clumping all negro looking people as the same, as coming from SLAVERY, you use the word UNCLE TOM WHICH IS A BLACK American EXPERIENCE, not a Haitian, Jamacian (Collen Powel), South American (Peru or Brazil), or African, or British-Africana, etc, they aren't UNCLE TOMS BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T COME FROM THAT KIND OF CATEGORY FOR SLAVERY, you see them as unlce toms BECAUSE YOU CLUMP them as one, I don't, I see the dynamics of people.

Robtard
"Uncle Tom" is a phrase too... I believe that was the angle PVS was going for, duh.

On a funny note, you have a history of being racially negative towards blacks and painting them inferior to whites while being black yourself (at least you claim to be), that would make you an "Uncle Tom".

Quiero Mota
Originally posted by Marxman
I was watching a rerun of the Colbert Report and he had a guest that came on disputing Obama's "blackness". She claimed that since his father immigrated here from Kenya is 1959 (I think that's what she said) that he is not the same as those who are considered "black" in America today. According to this woman, "black" people are the descendants of West African slaves brought to America. Since Obama isn't the descendant of a African slave, he is not "black". African-American, but not black.

Now I have a problem with this. She says this under the guise that she wants to respect Obama's unique and rich heritage of being the son of a Kenyan immigrant but please. It seems like people look for ways to hate each other. Obama didn't "go through the same hardships" black people in America went through.

As far as I know, no black people alive today were ever slaves. What's the point in giving Obama another label, and pretty much calling him unworthy of being black?

He's Black.

Originally posted by Ya Krunk'd Floo
Who gives a shit? He's an intelligent, principled and charming guy; what else is there worth considering?

The vast majority of American voters give a shit.

Oncewhite
Originally posted by Robtard
"Uncle Tom" is a phrase too... I believe that was the angle PVS was going for, duh.

On a funny note, you have a history of being racially negative towards blacks and painting them inferior to whites while being black yourself (at least you claim to be), that would make you an "Uncle Tom".

That's Ms. Aunt Tom to you!

And I don't have a history of being racially negative, I am not shy about explaining the issues that I have observed, you can take that as negative or just another person's experience, it's up to you.

Robtard
Originally posted by Oncewhite
That's Ms. Aunt Tom to you!

And I don't have a history of being racially negative, I am not shy about explaining the issues that I have observed, you can take that as negative or just another person's experience, it's up to you.

And your issues (angle) 9 time out of 10 times is essentially "Blacks are inferior to Whites" Auntie Tom.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marxman
I was watching a rerun of the Colbert Report...

Enough said. roll eyes (sarcastic)

They don't have to tell you the truth as long as it's funny.

Strangelove
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Enough said. roll eyes (sarcastic)

They don't have to tell you the truth as long as it's funny. This woman meant what she said. And Colbert satirized her all the way.

It really doesn't matter at all how 'black' Obama is. To parrot myself, anyone who really gives credence to exactly how black Obama is really doesn't deserve to vote if their judgment is going to be clouded by race.

Oncewhite
Originally posted by Robtard
And your issues (angle) 9 time out of 10 times is essentially "Blacks are inferior to Whites" Auntie Tom.

you see it as inferior or superior, i never stated that...but if that's the only thing you understood then my point of view must have been lost in translation, even though we are speaking the same language, uhm.

Alfheim
Originally posted by Marxman
I was watching a rerun of the Colbert Report and he had a guest that came on disputing Obama's "blackness". She claimed that since his father immigrated here from Kenya is 1959 (I think that's what she said) that he is not the same as those who are considered "black" in America today. According to this woman, "black" people are the descendants of West African slaves brought to America. Since Obama isn't the descendant of a African slave, he is not "black". African-American, but not black.

Now I have a problem with this. She says this under the guise that she wants to respect Obama's unique and rich heritage of being the son of a Kenyan immigrant but please. It seems like people look for ways to hate each other. Obama didn't "go through the same hardships" black people in America went through.

As far as I know, no black people alive today were ever slaves. What's the point in giving Obama another label, and pretty much calling him unworthy of being black?

I must admit it would be cool to have a black American President, but to an extent I dont think it would change much. To be fair I dont think Mandela did that much for black people in S.Africa, alot of them still live in alot of poverty now.

At the end of the day it doesnt matter what race you are if you are a compassionate human being you would be able to get the job done and relate to people.

To be quite honest im getting sick and fed up with Black Americans telling people they dont understand. I was on another forum and I was saying that I was interested in taking the beliefs of the Vikings as my religon. Of course I was told I was a sell out and I didnt understand what it felt like to be told I was inferior because I was black.

The fact that I was black didnt matter, I still didnt understand. They didnt listen to anything I had to say, I was a sellout and thats that.

The fact that I was sticking up for African culture was neither here nor there.

Ya Krunk'd Floo
Originally posted by Quiero Mota
The vast majority of American voters give a shit.

So the vast majority of Americans are racist? Woah, that's shit.

Imperial_Samura
Originally posted by Quiero Mota
The vast majority of American voters give a shit.

And that is why the vast majority of American voters are stu... no, I won't generalise and be unfair, because I don't think it is nearly that bad, and I really don't think it is the "vast majority." But maybe I am being naive.

However it is disappointing and somewhat disheartening to hear about "race votes" - being voted for or against based on race. Heaven forbid the voters don't see a color to approve or disapprove in the white house and actually vote on the qualities of the person as a leader - because by damn color is neither here nor there when it comes to that.

"This is a political election people", I feel like saying, "not a freaking trip down to the hardware store to find a color that matches the drapes." To think a capable, intelligent, worthy person might face an up hill battle because "The vast majority of American voters give a shit" about his/her color and lack the maturity to look beyond that really is depressing.

Soleran
Originally posted by Ya Krunk'd Floo
So the vast majority of Americans are racist? Woah, that's shit.


Elitist eek!

Strangelove
Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
"This is a political election people", I feel like saying, "not a freaking trip down to the hardware store to find a color that matches the drapes." To think a capable, intelligent, worthy person might face an up hill battle because "The vast majority of American voters give a shit" about his/her color and lack the maturity to look beyond that really is depressing. I believe a poll by a major news source asked "If your party were to nominate a qualified black person for President, would you vote for him?" A same poll asked about women. I think the numbers were 98% for blacks and high 80s% for women.

Of course, I think the key words there are "your party." Even worse than the possibility of race voters are those that continue to vote party-line erm

PVS
Originally posted by Oncewhite
How can an Afro-Asiatic or mixed race person be an Uncle Tom when they get along well with whites?

Why can't it be that these folks of different skin colors get along b/c they have the same mentality?

The mentality is the same and that's why THEY (republican party) get along, but since YOU ONLY SEE RACE(clumping all negro looking people as the same, as coming from SLAVERY, you use the word UNCLE TOM WHICH IS A BLACK American EXPERIENCE, not a Haitian, Jamacian (Collen Powel), South American (Peru or Brazil), or African, or British-Africana, etc, they aren't UNCLE TOMS BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T COME FROM THAT KIND OF CATEGORY FOR SLAVERY, you see them as unlce toms BECAUSE YOU CLUMP them as one, I don't, I see the dynamics of people.

ZOMG SRSLY!?!?!?!?!1211
i wasnt calling him an uncle tom. maybe if you read past half the first sentence you would see that

oh i forgot, you're mentally challenged. my apologies. carry on

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Strangelove
This woman meant what she said. And Colbert satirized her all the way.

It really doesn't matter at all how 'black' Obama is. To parrot myself, anyone who really gives credence to exactly how black Obama is really doesn't deserve to vote if their judgment is going to be clouded by race.

How do you know that? She could have been a comedian. roll eyes (sarcastic) It is just a comedy show after all.

Strangelove
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
How do you know that? She could have been a comedian. roll eyes (sarcastic) It is just a comedy show after all. Colbert is the only comedian on that show. Everyone else is real.

I'm fairly sure from your posts that you don't watch the show yourself, so why are you bothering to argue? erm

Robtard
Originally posted by Oncewhite
you see it as inferior or superior, i never stated that...but if that's the only thing you understood then my point of view must have been lost in translation, even though we are speaking the same language, uhm.


Your point of view is usually very clear no matter how you sugar coat it or how utterly insane it may be. Just about everything you post dictates that blacks are sub-par in comparison to whites, that is of course if you don't go off on some insane tangent about hi-tech space-angels or rape causing third eyes, but even then at times those bizarre tangents have something to do with blacks being inferior. But hey, that's your point of view so proceed.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Strangelove
Colbert is the only comedian on that show. Everyone else is real.

I'm fairly sure from your posts that you don't watch the show yourself, so why are you bothering to argue? erm

Colbert is not the only comedian on the show, I have seen the show enough times to know for a fact that you are not correct. He does have real people on his show, however, he also has other people who are actors or comedians who are there to help set up the comedy. My point is, you should enjoy the show, but never take it too seriously.

Strangelove
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Colbert is not the only comedian on the show, I have seen the show enough times to know for a fact that you are not correct. He does have real people on his show, however, he also has other people who are actors or comedians who are there to help set up the comedy. My point is, you should enjoy the show, but never take it too seriously. There are 2 other comedians that appear periodically, but they're obviously not real people. Everyone else is real.

And even though you shouldn't take it seriously (both Colbert and Jon Stewart make that point very clear), they do make good points on their shows.

Shakyamunison

Strangelove

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Strangelove
Sort of stick out tongue

Sadly, she represents a sizable number of blacks who are criticizing Obama for his lack of 'black-ness' as if it's something he can change. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Now, I'm sorry I missed that one. What would he have to do to be more black? eek!

Strangelove
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Now, I'm sorry I missed that one. What would he have to do to be more black? eek! Be enslaved roll eyes (sarcastic)

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Strangelove
Be enslaved roll eyes (sarcastic)

What a shame.

Marxman
Originally posted by Strangelove
Be enslaved roll eyes (sarcastic) That's what Colbert said stick out tongue

And no, she was no a comedian. She was dead serious about what she was saying and even though Colbert made fun of her every step of the way she kept her ridiculous ideas.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marxman
That's what Colbert said stick out tongue

And no, she was no a comedian. She was dead serious about what she was saying and even though Colbert made fun of her every step of the way she kept her ridiculous ideas.

Can you provide proof that she was real and not just an actor?

Marxman
Well she was also promoting her book "The End of Blackness" on the show. Here's a link with a description of the book.

http://www.motherjones.com/arts/books/2004/01/12_100.html?welcome=true

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marxman
Well she was also promoting her book "The End of Blackness" on the show. Here's a link with a description of the book.

http://www.motherjones.com/arts/books/2004/01/12_100.html?welcome=true

OK, thanks.

She's a nut.

Alliance
Suprising, this is not.

Marxman
Thanks, Yoda.

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