He-man vs Hercules

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.



GoBotsLive

endrict
Been here done that, please use search.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by endrict
Been here done that, please use search.

Well, I did do a search and this is what I found: He-man vs Hercules vs Thor (link not permitted)

It's a three-way melee between He-man, Hercules and Thor in which people are giving our Golden Boy from Eternia WAY too much props.

Read where someone says "He-man made himself as strong as PC Superman and can make himself 1000 x stronger." Jeesuz... If he could do that, then why would villians on Eternia even bother. Yet, Hordak and Skeletor continue to present problems.

Again, if you ever read this comic, it was a poorly written cross-over in which Superman pwns He-man in less than one page.

It's implied that Superman is more powerful than Greyskull because Skeletor summons a being capable of "DEFEATING HE-MAN." Also, Superman was in the midst of destroying Castle Greyskull, the source of He-man's supposed infinite power, before he snapped out of Skeletor's power.

Therefore the questions arise:

If He-man was so infinitely powerful, why would Skeletor's spell bring Superman to defeat him?

If the power of Greyskull is so powerful, then why would Superman be a threat?

You see, He-man is somewhat of an inconsistent character. I remember his origins as a barbarian with better than average strength. Then on the cartoon, I believe they said he had the strength of 100 men. Then in the comics, they power him up to Superman strength level, in rare occasions. But his median range is less than admirable compared to other super heroes.

In a universe that includes the Hulk, Thor, Hercules, Iron Man and Superman, etc... He-man is toast.

guy222

Soljer
I'd be inclined to agree. He-man is QUITE inconsistent, and though he has a few outlier showings that may put him in the same tier as Hercules, I would NEVER say that He-Man has any sort of 'unlimited' or even quasi-unlimited strength. He doesn't.

Meh.

As far as the fight goes, though, I doubt it'd be a curbstomp, and I believe He-Man has quite a few mystical powers via his sword that we must take into account as well.

DigiMark007
He's got a respect thread now, ya know....because most KMC battles involving him to this point involve mostly speculation.

Anyway, I'd side with He-Man. Excellent combat speed and fighting skills, and he definitely has strength feats that put him in Herc's bracket or beyond.

Soljer
Originally posted by DigiMark007
He's got a respect thread now, ya know....because most KMC battles involving him to this point involve mostly speculation.

Anyway, I'd side with He-Man. Excellent combat speed and fighting skills, and he definitely has strength feats that put him in Herc's bracket or beyond.

Too true, I forgot about He-man's impressive speed.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by Soljer
He-Man has quite a few mystical powers via his sword that we must take into account as well.

The Power Sword is primarily a conductor from which to channel the Power of Greyskull unto Adam. Other than that, when was the last time He-man used it to weld a devastating attack.

Also, you must consider that whenever He-man is in need of much power, it's through the sorceress. She also acts as a conductor, channeling power to He-man.

Anyway, I recall reading quite a few He-man comics in the day when I was a fan. He never really had combat skills or speed to speak of. Even if he did, it was seldom used. I seem to remember him being captured more than once by Hordak with nothing more than energy beams. Also, even Beastman was a handful when they first met.

Like I said, other than the campy Superman cross-over, He-man's never faced any as formidable as Hercules. He has trouble with giant rock monsters, snake men and cheezy side-kicks. Blondie is out of his league in this fight.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by guy222
good thread. he-man wins

ROTFLOL at all the threads stating He-man can beat the Hulk, Thor, Superman and other super heroes. This is a muscle-bound meathead who gets pwned by Hordak and Skeletor every now and then. Dr. Strange could kick Hordak's @ss any day.

And Skeletor... Let me just say that if Hulk, Thor or even Wolverine lived in Eternia, Skeletor would be no more.

Soljer
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
ROTFLOL at all the threads stating He-man can beat the Hulk, Thor, Superman and other super heroes. This is a muscle-bound meathead who gets pwned by Hordak and Skeletor every now and then. Dr. Strange could kick Hordak's @ss any day.

And Skeletor... Let me just say that if Hulk, Thor or even Wolverine lived in Eternia, Skeletor would be no more.

Doctor Strange could also kick the ass of Superman, Hulk, Thor, and He Man. Simultaneously.

So saying that Doc Strange is superior to Hordak, isn't really putting Hordak down.

LORDSIDIOUS01
Where is Battlecat in all this?

DigiMark007

GoBotsLive

Adam_PoE
He-Man has the equivocal endurance, resistance to injury, and strength of a demigod.

He-Man also has an indestructible Sword of Power that can project mystical energy and open inter-dimensional gateways.

In "Taking of Grayskull," He-Man not only lifts Castle Grayskull, but hurls it with sufficient force to exceed the gravitational pull of a whitehole.

In "Trouble In Arcadia," He-Man lifts an entire city.

In "Stone City," He-Man moves an entire mountain range.

In "Eternal Darkness," He-Man hurls a planet into orbit.

In "She-Demon of Phantos," He-Man breaks chains fashioned out of an indestructable mineral.

In "Awaken the Serpent," He-Man kills the god, Serpos.

bigbran
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
In "Eternal Darkness," He-Man hurls a planet into orbit.
I don't really get this one...

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by bigbran
I don't really get this one...

Beat me to it.

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by bigbran
I don't really get this one...

A planet on a collision course with Eternia is hurled into orbit by He-Man. What is there not to get?

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
A planet on a collision course with Eternia is hurled into orbit by He-Man. What is there not to get?

Most planets are in orbit of something. It seems like an odd feat out of context.

Hercules
How does he "hurl" it if hes in outer space? or was he in outer space?

I'm a little confused too, how do you "hurl" a planet into orbit thats on a collision course?

I mean did it enter the upper atmosphere or what?

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by Hercules
How does he "hurl" it if hes in outer space? or was he in outer space?

I'm a little confused too, how do you "hurl" a planet into orbit thats on a collision course?

I mean did it enter the upper atmosphere or what?

srug

I assume a great amount of comic book physcis was involved in order to allow the planets to get that close together.

Hercules
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
srug

I assume a great amount of comic book physcis was involved in order to allow the planets to get that close together.

Ahh yes comic book physics, that defy all the laws of physics to make the impossible, possible! big grin

The temptation is to yell "PIS!" at the top of my voice but I will refrain until I know exactley how it happened.

Faceman
Well let's consider He-Mans enemy's. Besides Skelator they are all just 2nd rate compared to some of the people Hercules battle's in Marvel. If we would replace both heroes, i think Herc would do just fine in Eternia. Remember Herc has weapons too. Weapons that are Godly in nature.

juggernaut74
I gotta go with He-Man. He's Thor with a sword basically.

Hercules
Originally posted by juggernaut74
I gotta go with He-Man. He's Thor with a sword basically.

Hes actually a Conan the Barbarian rip off, who evolved into something more.

Calling him "Thor with a sword" is stretching the character quite a bit.

juggernaut74
Originally posted by Hercules
Hes actually a Conan the Barbarian rip off, who evolved into something more.

Calling him "Thor with a sword" is stretching the character quite a bit. I would say calling him a Conan rip is stretching the character a bit. Conan has peak human strength or slightly higher. He-Man is in Hercs league.

Faceman
Originally posted by juggernaut74
I would say calling him a Conan rip is stretching the character a bit. Conan has peak human strength or slightly higher. He-Man is in Hercs league. Correct, but the quality of fighter that Herc battles on a regular basis is better. He-Man is strong, but he looks even stronger because he's pounding guy's like Merman, or Beast man, guy's like that would last 3 seconds in either DC, or Marvel.....

Hercules
Originally posted by juggernaut74
I would say calling him a Conan rip is stretching the character a bit. Conan has peak human strength or slightly higher. He-Man is in Hercs league.

No he literaly is a Conan Rip off, Mattel orginaly wanted to do a line of Conan action figures but couldn't get the licence.

Like I said, he EVOLVED into what he is now, read an early He Man mini comic and he fights with an axe and a shield and is merely a very strong barbarian character.

No Prince Adam, no screaming "by the power of grayskull" and no hurling planets into orbit.

I'm not stretching the character at all, merely stating how he started out and what he turned into.

juggernaut74
Originally posted by Hercules
No he literaly is a Conan Rip off, Mattel orginaly wanted to do a line of Conan action figures but couldn't get the licence.

Like I said, he EVOLVED into what he is now, read an early He Man mini comic and he fights with an axe and a shield and is merely a very strong barbarian character.

No Prince Adam, no screaming "by the power of grayskull" and no hurling planets into orbit.

I'm not stretching the character at all, merely stating how he started out and what he turned into. But we are not using He-Man the way he started out. Now he's Got godlike strength and a powerful magical weapon. Like Thor.

Hercules
Originally posted by juggernaut74
But we are not using He-Man the way he started out. Now he's Got godlike strength and a powerful magical weapon. Like Thor.

This is why I used the word "Evolved" but fact remains the idea for He Man came from Conan not Thor.

If your using such simplistic terms to say he is like Thor then I would agree but the same terms could be used for Hercules too and Odin etc etc, most Gods have Godlike strength and magical weapons.

Hes much more a Herc type character than a Thor, Herc would be the closest Marvel had to a match for him, which is why the topic is well chosen.

Hercules is a hero based in myth, his feats equal He man's, he has a few millenia on He Man experience wise and has defeated foes that seem to be a much greater threat than He Man's.

Combat edge has to go to Herc, its a toss up between them Strength wise, Hercs mace can block Thor's hammer so its blocking the power sword.

Speed wise, He man may be on top but even using your Thor analogy, Herc regularly fights Thor to a stand still.

Seriously, toss a coin between these two its that close.

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Most planets are in orbit of something. It seems like an odd feat out of context.

Evil-Lyn uses her powers to pull a moon planet from its orbit and send it on a collision course with Eternia.

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Hercules
Hes actually a Conan the Barbarian rip off, who evolved into something more.

Calling him "Thor with a sword" is stretching the character quite a bit.

Originally posted by Hercules
No he literaly is a Conan Rip off, Mattel orginaly wanted to do a line of Conan action figures but couldn't get the licence.

Like I said, he EVOLVED into what he is now, read an early He Man mini comic and he fights with an axe and a shield and is merely a very strong barbarian character.

No Prince Adam, no screaming "by the power of grayskull" and no hurling planets into orbit.

I'm not stretching the character at all, merely stating how he started out and what he turned into.

Originally posted by Hercules
This is why I used the word "Evolved" but fact remains the idea for He Man came from Conan not Thor.

If your using such simplistic terms to say he is like Thor then I would agree but the same terms could be used for Hercules too and Odin etc etc, most Gods have Godlike strength and magical weapons.

Hes much more a Herc type character than a Thor, Herc would be the closest Marvel had to a match for him, which is why the topic is well chosen.

Hercules is a hero based in myth, his feats equal He man's, he has a few millenia on He Man experience wise and has defeated foes that seem to be a much greater threat than He Man's.

Combat edge has to go to Herc, its a toss up between them Strength wise, Hercs mace can block Thor's hammer so its blocking the power sword.

Speed wise, He man may be on top but even using your Thor analogy, Herc regularly fights Thor to a stand still.

Seriously, toss a coin between these two its that close.

Wrong.

Mattel had a license to produce a line of action figures based on the 1982 film "Conan the Barbarian," but upon learning of the content of the film and its R-rating, did not believe that enough children would be able to see the film for a line of action figures to be successful, and the project was abandoned.

He-Man is the conception of Mattel designer, Roger Sweet. Inspired by the fantasy paintings of Frank Franzetta, Roger Sweet sculpted the He-Man prototype over an existing Big Jim action figure, and went on to design the first three waves of Masters of the Universe action figures, playsets, and vehicles.

Hercules
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Wrong.

Mattel had a license to produce a line of action figures based on the 1982 film "Conan the Barbarian," but upon learning of the content of the film and its R-rating, did not believe that enough children would be able to see the film for a line of action figures to be successful, and the project was abandoned.

He-Man is the conception of Mattel designer, Roger Sweet. Inspired by the fantasy paintings of Frank Franzetta, Roger Sweet sculpted the He-Man prototype over an existing Big Jim action figure, and went on to design the first three waves of Masters of the Universe action figures, playsets, and vehicles.

Not entirely wrong, I knew mattel wanted to make a conan the barbarian line, I thought they just had problems with the licence.

Are you also saying I'm wrong that Prince Adam never exsisted in the first wave? are you trying to tell me I'm wrong with the FACT that He Man was a wandering Barbarian type character originaly.

I will give you that I was wrong about Mattel not getting the licence and you obviously have more knowledge of the concept than I do.

But don't make out as everything I have said is wrong, when I stated the idea evolved from Conan.

Which you ahve just supported, seriously people need to understand what I mean when I say a concept EVOLVED.

EDIT: let me try and break this down, Mattel decide that Conan is too adult and drop the idea but they still want a barbarian type musclular hero, enter Roger Sweet, Mattel don't want to do Conan, he takes the barbarian concept and puts his own take on it, 1981 comes and ta da we have He Man.

Later they give He Man an alter ego, a little like Shazam, his strength increases as his story line evolves etc etc.

See where I was going, Conan rip off was a bit harsh but character wise he has little in common with Thor.

If I'm wrong about the Conan licence, fair enough but don't quote every single one of my posts, term them ALL "wrong" and only prove me wrong on the licence.

olympian
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
ROTFLOL at all the threads stating He-man can beat the Hulk, Thor, Superman and other super heroes. This is a muscle-bound meathead who gets pwned by Hordak and Skeletor every now and then. Dr. Strange could kick Hordak's @ss any day.

And Skeletor... Let me just say that if Hulk, Thor or even Wolverine lived in Eternia, Skeletor would be no more.
The same Skeletor that owned Pre Crisis Superman? Doesnt fly. As for Hordak, depends the version but the last one of the cartoon was pretty high. The guy killed King Greyskull. They may be comedic sometimes but doesnt change the high feats they have.

DigiMark007
Yeah, and besides, old-school comics were always inconsistent. There were both good and bad showings.

But He-Man's power fluctuates based upon need, so the high showings are just as valid, if not moreso, than low showings.

So sorry, but 1 anti-fanboy doesn't negate a character's canon.

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Hercules
Not entirely wrong, I knew mattel wanted to make a conan the barbarian line, I thought they just had problems with the licence.

Are you also saying I'm wrong that Prince Adam never exsisted in the first wave? are you trying to tell me I'm wrong with the FACT that He Man was a wandering Barbarian type character originaly.

I will give you that I was wrong about Mattel not getting the licence and you obviously have more knowledge of the concept than I do.

But don't make out as everything I have said is wrong, when I stated the idea evolved from Conan.

Which you ahve just supported, seriously people need to understand what I mean when I say a concept EVOLVED.

EDIT: let me try and break this down, Mattel decide that Conan is too adult and drop the idea but they still want a barbarian type musclular hero, enter Roger Sweet, Mattel don't want to do Conan, he takes the barbarian concept and puts his own take on it, 1981 comes and ta da we have He Man.

Later they give He Man an alter ego, a little like Shazam, his strength increases as his story line evolves etc etc.

See where I was going, Conan rip off was a bit harsh but character wise he has little in common with Thor.

If I'm wrong about the Conan licence, fair enough but don't quote every single one of my posts, term them ALL "wrong" and only prove me wrong on the licence.

Wrong.

He-Man was conceived as the ultimate hero in that while Conan is a barbarian, G.I. Joe is a soldier, and Flash Gordon is a science fiction hero, He-Man was not constrained by any of these roles; he could alternate between them, and more.

With no supplemental programming to promote a line of action figures, Mattel comissioned a series of 30 second television advertisements and a season of episodes to be aired in syndication from Los Angeles-based animation studio, FILMation.

In order for each of the figures in the first assortment to be packaged with supplemental materials upon release, Mattel licensed four miniature comic books to be produced by various artists and writers. Without the Masters of the Universe series bible, the writers of the first four miniature comic books only had the appearance of the figures to go on. This is why there is a disparity between the first four miniature comic books and the cartoon series.

Hercules
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Wrong.

He-Man was conceived as the ultimate hero in that while Conan is a barbarian, G.I. Joe is a soldier, and Flash Gordon is a science fiction hero, He-Man was not constrained by any of these roles; he could alternate between them, and more.

With no supplemental programming to promote a line of action figures, Mattel comissioned a series of 30 second television advertisements and a season of episodes to be aired in syndication from Los Angeles-based animation studio, FILMation.

In order for each of the figures in the first assortment to be packaged with supplemental materials upon release, Mattel licensed four miniature comic books to be produced by various artists and writers. Without the Masters of the Universe series bible, the writers of the first four miniature comic books only had the appearance of the figures to go on. This is why there is a disparity between the first four miniature comic books and the cartoon series.

Well thanks for the background, still again your saying that the first four comic books had no prince adam in it, these would be the first four mini comics I read and a lot of kids read.

So as I said there was no Prince Adam at first, there was no Prince Adam figure in the first line of figures either, I said there was no Prince Adam in the first wave.

And there was not, so why I consider myself educated in the background of mattel (thanks for that) some of my statements were correct all be it for the wrong reasons.

Also while the Conan connection has been denied by mattel and who can blame them for that, you have to wonder if mattel hadn't originaly wanted to make a Conan line of figures would they have come up with the concept for He Man?

Also isn't it just one of those crazy coinky dinks that He Man fights bare chested in a pair of fur shorts with ancient weapons, very much like Conan?

There has also been a lot of theories thrown round that Skeletor was based on Thulsa Doom, but hey as long as Mattel throws out the official line that he wasn't who am I to judge.

The debate I believe was He Man vs Hercules and I still say this is a toss up as to who wins, strength wise they seem to be pretty close to each other, Hercules I would say had the edge in combat experience and skill.

I would give He Man the edge in speed and both have been seen to be very durable.

I would go so far as to say they are in deadlock 5/10 no majority.

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Hercules
Well thanks for the background, still again your saying that the first four comic books had no prince adam in it, these would be the first four mini comics I read and a lot of kids read.

So as I said there was no Prince Adam at first, there was no Prince Adam figure in the first line of figures either, I said there was no Prince Adam in the first wave.

And there was not, so why I consider myself educated in the background of mattel (thanks for that) some of my statements were correct all be it for the wrong reasons.

Also while the Conan connection has been denied by mattel and who can blame them for that, you have to wonder if mattel hadn't originaly wanted to make a Conan line of figures would they have come up with the concept for He Man?

Also isn't it just one of those crazy coinky dinks that He Man fights bare chested in a pair of fur shorts with ancient weapons, very much like Conan?

There has also been a lot of theories thrown round that Skeletor was based on Thulsa Doom, but hey as long as Mattel throws out the official line that he wasn't who am I to judge.

The debate I believe was He Man vs Hercules and I still say this is a toss up as to who wins, strength wise they seem to be pretty close to each other, Hercules I would say had the edge in combat experience and skill.

I would give He Man the edge in speed and both have been seen to be very durable.

I would go so far as to say they are in deadlock 5/10 no majority.

That Prince Adam is not in the first four miniature comics is not the same as Prince Adam is not a part of the original Masters of the Universe concept.

Moreover, Thulsa Doom is a Krull the Conqueror villain, not a Conan the Barbarian villain.

Hercules
Originally posted by Adam_PoE

Moreover, Thulsa Doom is a Krull the Conqueror villain, not a Conan the Barbarian villain.

Let me expand, Thulsa Doom is the main villian in the Conan the Barbarian film, he was described as having "a Skull like face" in the Krull the Conqueror books and there is speculation that he was the basis for Skeletor but mattel have never confirmed this.

I accept your point on Adam, as far as I knew he was a creation of the cartoon and I know he wasn't in the first wave of figures, you have proved otherwise, I can live with that.

Now, can we debate the fight, or shall we have a "Mattel vs Theory" debate instead? wink

You haven't actually said how you would see the fight going yet... big grin

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Hercules
You haven't actually said how you would see the fight going yet... big grin

Power of Grayskull = Deus Ex Machina

Hercules
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Power of Grayskull = Deus Ex Machina

Indeed and with what I learned in the He Man vs War Hulk thread from Scoobles and digi, he is as strong as he needs to be.

I would still give Hercules the combat experience and skill edge but I have to admit on further evidence I can see He Man taking a majority.

As a huge Herc fan, you don't know how hard that is for me to admit... big grin

But, new information can change things and I'm not so stubborn that I can't admit when my boys in over his head.

Still would be a hell of a fight though! eek!

DigiMark007
Originally posted by Hercules
Indeed and with what I learned in the He Man vs War Hulk thread from Scoobles and digi, he is as strong as he needs to be.

I would still give Hercules the combat experience and skill edge but I have to admit on further evidence I can see He Man taking a majority.

As a huge Herc fan, you don't know how hard that is for me to admit... big grin

But, new information can change things and I'm not so stubborn that I can't admit when my boys in over his head.

Still would be a hell of a fight though! eek!

Well, it's goober and digi (Scoob's my tourney partner), but yeah.

And yes, it would be a good fight. But He-Man does win, and it's good that you can admit that (I have a hard time in Spidey threads, so I feel your pain).

Hercules
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Well, it's goober and digi (Scoob's my tourney partner), but yeah.

And yes, it would be a good fight. But He-Man does win, and it's good that you can admit that (I have a hard time in Spidey threads, so I feel your pain).

Oops! got confused with Scoob's being your tourney partner and you and Goober doing the respect thread.

My apologies to goober! embarrasment

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Hercules
I would still give Hercules the combat experience and skill edge but I have to admit on further evidence I can see He Man taking a majority.

As He-Man, he has the combined knowledge and experience of the Elders, i.e. he has several lifetimes of combat experience.

snoopdogg
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
As He-Man, he has the combined knowledge and experience of the Elders, i.e. he has several lifetimes of combat experience. I didn't even know that. That's pretty cool.

Hercules
Herc is 3,000 years old, he too has a fair few lifetimes worth of experience in there.

Seriously, I said He Man takes the majority, don't be turning this into a curbstomp! stick out tongue

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by snoopdogg
I didn't even know that. That's pretty cool.

In Masters of the Universe and Princess of Power, each character is a Master of the Universe in his own right.

In this sense, Masters of the Universe is less Conan the Barbarian, and more New Gods.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
As He-Man, he has the combined knowledge and experience of the Elders, i.e. he has several lifetimes of combat experience.

Is that so? And what does he have to show for it? Not very much. Otherwise, why would he need training from Man-at-arms, who by the way, can't fight his way out of Beastman's hairy palms.

As I mentioned before, He-man was truly marketed towards a kid's imagination. He's a formula taken from other heroes: Conan's wardrobe, Superman's strength, Hulk's muscles, etc... without any regard for consistency. He tosses planets around like styro-foam, but can't even knock out Trap Jaw with a single punch.

He-man fans continually remark that he's the strongest man in the universe... Well, it's a very small universe to say the least. A universe where the likes of Skeletor, Trap Jaw and Beastman are feared. Heck, those three wouldn't even last on planet earth without super heroes.

Then there's He-man's power sword. It can cut through anything . Yet, when has this ever been true? I seem to remember He-man using his sword to pierce a mountainside to break his fall. If the sword were truly able to slice anything, it would have continued in a downward motion. Picture yourself holding a very sharp Samurai sword. Stick it into a watermelon and try to hole your weight up. You get the idea. More He-man inconsistency. Also, He-man consistently clashes his sword with Skeletor's staff, yet the staff remains intact. I thought it could cut through anything?

For what it's worth, I was a big He-man fan as a kid. But that's how I remember it, fantastic stories about a muscle-bound man. I never even fathomed that He-man was even a match for REAL comic book heroes like Superman, Hulk, etc... Yes, I know He-man made it into comics. But the word is that his comics were inconsistent with the animation and few people were interested in it enough for it to continue. This is just what I heard during this time.

Batman-Prime
It would be an truly titanic fight, with two even fighters, they are so similar that i would say stalemate.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
It would be an truly titanic fight, with two even fighters, they are so similar that i would say stalemate.

I wouldn't say they're equal. He-man doesn't really hurt his foes. He just tosses them around or entraps them, for reasons already mentioned above. He lacks the tenacity that Hercules would bring. Hercules has tangled with the Hulk and gone toe-to-toe with Thor. Hercules has the experience of fighting super-powered villains, heroes and gods. He-man fights D-level villains and monsters on a daily basis. Sure, He-man has been known to do some outrageously fantastic things, more likely due to bad script writing, but his average strength suggests he's not as strong as Hercules (i.e. he grunts when picking up boulders, his punches have no real affect on villains except sending them backwards, etc...). He-man has no bloodlust, in effect.

Hercules wins 10/10 easily.

Darth Macabre
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
I wouldn't say they're equal. He-man doesn't really hurt his foes. He just tosses them around or entraps them, for reasons already mentioned above. He lacks the tenacity that Hercules would bring. Hercules has tangled with the Hulk and gone toe-to-toe with Thor. Hercules has the experience of fighting super-powered villains, heroes and gods. He-man fights D-level villains and monsters on a daily basis. Sure, He-man has been known to do some outrageously fantastic things, more likely due to bad script writing, but his average strength suggests he's not as strong as Hercules (i.e. he grunts when picking up boulders, his punches have no real affect on villains except sending them backwards, etc...). He-man has no bloodlust, in effect.

Hercules wins 10/10 easily. Man, you got to stop with this d-level crap. Who the hell are you to say they're D-level, Skeletor especially? Skeletor's been able to ensnare Superman and mind control him, that's a fact. So again, how are they d-level compared to the Joker, Lex Luthor, or, hell, even Killer Croc and the like?

LORDSIDIOUS01
"By the power of Grayskull" "I am the power" He Man goes down hard.

darthgoober

jinzin
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
ROTFLOL at all the threads stating He-man can beat the Hulk, Thor, Superman and other super heroes. This is a muscle-bound meathead who gets pwned by Hordak and Skeletor every now and then. Dr. Strange could kick Hordak's @ss any day.

And Skeletor... Let me just say that if Hulk, Thor or even Wolverine lived in Eternia, Skeletor would be no more.

Hordak and skeletor are wizards they use strategy and magic... no expression

hell even superman's been one punched unconcious by a wizard (i.e. mummra)... does that mean supes couldn't take another meathead like herc? confused

I certainly hope not. erm

jinzin
Originally posted by darthgoober
Wrong. If you look at the time on that scan you'll see that that stone flew for AT LEAST 22 seconds at a speed of 22 miles per second. See in the first panel there is 34 seconds left, and in the next panel there is 12 seconds left(and the stone still hasn't hit). So at the MINIMUM amount of flight time for the stone it went 484 miles(and possibly more).

What people like you need to realize about He-Man's strength is that it is dependant on NEED(kinda like the Hulk's is dependant on anger). When he faces someone with little or no super strength to speak of, he's not nearly as strong as he would be when facing someone like Hercules because he doesn't NEED to be to get the job done. Here take a look...

He NEEDS to be strong enough to keep the Golem's foot from crushing his friends and is therefor strong enough to do just that with effort.
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/8181/14dy0.th.jpg

But now his need changes, and he NEEDS to be strong enough to keep the same foot from crashing down with ONE hand(he was previously straining to support it with TWO hands) while he smashes the Golem. Also note that he's not straining nearly as much in the second scan as the first either, so his strength MORE than doubled in a matter of seconds.
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/1613/15qt2.th.jpg great post, great point.. QFT.

olympian
.......

Being as strong as required from a certain task its something any super strong guy can do. All you need is to control your strength.

Unless you happen to be a cold bastard like Black Adam, you hardly will punch a guy who doens`t have your level of strength with the same determination that you will save friends of yours. Its only obvious. In mythology Heracles went from dealing with Lions to held the Heavens and move Mountain sized formations. It`s the same thing.

Its hardly a "power" of either or just a particular one, like you seem to pass on.

That being said, it depends the He-Man version really, since not all are the same. The one who could hang out with pre crisis Superman takes it, the one from the recent cartoon for example likely won`t.

Nods to someone else: cut the "D-List villain" crapolla. Both Skel and Mun-Ra have taken Superham down on they`r own.

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by olympian
.......

Being as strong as required from a certain task its something any super strong guy can do.

Not if thr guy has limitations like most do.

olympian
Still i hardly see the more recent He-Man versions "borrowing" more power from the castle everytime he needs, if ever.

At most, he just uses its strength more in some feats that require it. It`s where the "being as strong as the story requires" comes from. Hercules its a prime example of it. First you deal with Lions and everyone goes "oohh" and then you move mountains or someone as big as a mountain and everyone goes "ohhhhhhhh".

Did he got a powerup? No. And frankly unless its a version that specifically calls for that, i don`t see He-Man having those either.

Make no mistake, i hardly care who wins this, since i like both. I just feel that sometimes the whole mystic of "he just needs to borrow more power and its done" to be blown out of hand.

We already have Hulk for that kind of overblowing crap.

charlemagne9746
I remember in the original cartoon, He-Man moved a moon out of his oribit. In the newer cartoon, he cast a mountain, I think, into the sun. Those feats are more Superman level than Herc level. Also, I think DC even admitted that He-Man was physically stronger than Superman.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by darthgoober
Wrong. If you look at the time on that scan you'll see that that stone flew for AT LEAST 22 seconds at a speed of 22 miles per second. See in the first panel there is 34 seconds left, and in the next panel there is 12 seconds left(and the stone still hasn't hit). So at the MINIMUM amount of flight time for the stone it went 484 miles(and possibly more).

500 miles isn't a whole lot for someone of super strength. Hercules is an Olympian discus thrower. I'm sure he would have been able to at LEAST match Originally posted by darthgoober
that.

Originally posted by darthgoober
What people like you need to realize about He-Man's strength is that it is dependant on NEED(kinda like the Hulk's is dependant on anger). When he faces someone with little or no super strength to speak of, he's not nearly as strong as he would be when facing someone like Hercules because he doesn't NEED to be to get the job done. Here take a look...

I've never heard of this, but it's irrelevant anyway. All strength is based on need. Also, regardless of whether He-man's strength is based on need, it would also have a limit.

But the true "nail in the coffin" to this theory is this: If He-man's strength depends on need, then he's truly doomed against better fighters. The point being, he would need a whole lot more strength to outweigh the advantage against someone who is more skilled and tenacious. Hercules is by far more tenacious and a better fighter and more experienced against mega-powerful foes. The theory that He-man would have a slight edge in strength (need-based) wouldn't make any difference. He would still lose.

Originally posted by darthgoober
He NEEDS to be strong enough to keep the Golem's foot from crushing his friends and is therefor strong enough to do just that with effort.

But now his need changes, and he NEEDS to be strong enough to keep the same foot from crashing down with ONE hand(he was previously straining to support it with TWO hands) while he smashes the Golem. Also note that he's not straining nearly as much in the second scan as the first either, so his strength MORE than doubled in a matter of seconds.

I don't see this at all... It's subjective at most. What REALLY happens here is that He-man stops the force of an object which undoubtedly causes some strain. When the object is no longer moving, He-man adjusts to it and is able to hold it with one arm. There's no indication that strength from Greyskull was moving back and forth to allow him to adjust to the weight. It's common physics, nothing more.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by Darth Macabre
Man, you got to stop with this d-level crap. Who the hell are you to say they're D-level, Skeletor especially? Skeletor's been able to ensnare Superman and mind control him, that's a fact. So again, how are they d-level compared to the Joker, Lex Luthor, or, hell, even Killer Croc and the like?

Skeletor is D-level because he's never been able to even so much as harm He-man. Heck, he's never even killed anyone. Skeletor would be running from Killer Croc because his mind tricks wouldn't work on Croc's psychotic mind. Skeletor, who has no super strength, intelligence or fighting skills to speak of is D-level.

Yeah, he ensnared Superman with a spell (through a plot device that somehow he was never able to repeat again), but Superman broke free. It was a cross-over and the plot device was used to make Superman beat up on He-man.

Joker is incredibly sly and tenacious for a villain and he kills for a living. And Luthor, he'd have Skeletor in a test lab in less then 5 panels. He's a genius who's been able to clone Superman, destroy Metropolis, and re-incarnate himself.

olympian
lol.

That Skeletor was opening dimensional portals in the old comics for fun.

Give me a break. And we better not talk about "plot devices" because that was what pre crisis Superman was all about. A new power out of his arse each new day.

Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Skeletor is D-level because he's never been able to even so much as harm He-man. Heck, he's never even killed anyone
...
Never read any kind of MOTU comic, have you?

Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Skeletor, who has no super strength, intelligence or fighting skills to speak of is D-level.

No you havent. Skel is highly intelligent in the majority of the versions and magical powerful. He is also skilled with figthing with his rune staff since he can hang with He-Man in that regard.

And He-man is no slouch in the figthing department itself. Really, is there any need for you to underrate to absurd levels a character in order to make its counterpart look "uninpressive"? Thats a desperate resort at best.

Faceman
Skeletor, has picked Beastman up and thrown him, so he must have some degree of superhuman strength.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by olympian
lol.

That Skeletor was opening dimensional portals in the old comics for fun.

Yeah, and what did he do with them... Nothing.

Originally posted by olympian
lGive me a break. And we better not talk about "plot devices" because that was what pre crisis Superman was all about. A new power out of his arse each new day.

Great... Only we're not discussing PC Superman are we... When was the last time Skeletor opened a portal and controlled a super-being into beating He-man down... Oh, wait... It was only once as a plot device...


...

Originally posted by olympian
Never read any kind of MOTU comic, have you?

ditto...



Originally posted by olympian
No you havent. Skel is highly intelligent in the majority of the versions and magical powerful. He is also skilled with figthing with his rune staff since he can hang with He-Man in that regard.

Define highly intelligent. Because for all the so-called magic powers and intelligence Skeletor has, he's never even defeated He-man, who just happens to be on a "need-based" strength, according to oficionados.

Originally posted by olympian
And He-man is no slouch in the figthing department itself. Really, is there any need for you to underrate to absurd levels a character in order to make its counterpart look "uninpressive"? Thats a desperate resort at best.

No one ever said He-man was a slouch at combat. But against Hercules, he's outmatched in strength, tenacity, skill, experience and ability.

Oh, and for the record... Desperate is trying to make characters from an afternoon cartoon look like gods when they were meant as plot devices for children.

charlemagne9746
Skeletor can amp his strength to huge levels. In one episode of the old cartoon, skeletor increased his size and strength to take He-Man down in a finger lock...of course He-Man eventually overcame that by taking Skeletor's feet out from under him...but He-Man was overpowered in that instance. Skeletor also created a Faker He-Man which rivaled He-Man physically.

GoBotsLive
Before many of you go on rants to show just how baddass He-man really is, please provide some proof that He-man has the ability to wreck someone like Thor, Hulk, Superman, Orion, etc...

Because frankly, I've never read, seen or heard of He-man defeating anyone of that caliber of strength, experience and skill.

Perhaps the most crushing blow to He-man is his own strength... If indeed his strength is need-based, then he would lose to Batman, Spiderman, Wolverine, Blade, Lady Shiva, and lots more. This logic follows that He-man is only given enough STRENGTH according to the situation. Well, then all these characters would give He-man a ass-whoopin' because they've all defeated foes much stronger then them. Heck, Wolverine and Spiderman have tangled with the Hulk. He-man being just stronger than Wolverine, Spiderman or Batman wouldn't suffice. They'd kill him. See my point.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by charlemagne9746
Skeletor can amp his strength to huge levels. In one episode of the old cartoon, skeletor increased his size and strength to take He-Man down in a finger lock...of course He-Man eventually overcame that by taking Skeletor's feet out from under him...but He-Man was overpowered in that instance. Skeletor also created a Faker He-Man which rivaled He-Man physically.

Oh yes, ever beloved cartoons... Well, why didn't he do the same thing when He-man was depowered? Plot device...

charlemagne9746
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Before many of you go on rants to show just how baddass He-man really is, please provide some proof that He-man has the ability to wreck someone like Thor, Hulk, Superman, Orion, etc...

Because frankly, I've never read, seen or heard of He-man defeating anyone of that caliber of strength, experience and skill.

Perhaps the most crushing blow to He-man is his own strength... If indeed his strength is need-based, then he would lose to Batman, Spiderman, Wolverine, Blade, Lady Shiva, and lots more. This logic follows that He-man is only given enough STRENGTH according to the situation. Well, then all these characters would give He-man a ass-whoopin' because they've all defeated foes much stronger then them. Heck, Wolverine and Spiderman have tangled with the Hulk. He-man being just stronger than Wolverine, Spiderman or Batman wouldn't suffice. They'd kill him. See my point.


Do you see Batman or Spiderman holding up the weight of that giant foot, in the previous scans? No, both of them would be crushed. Neither one of them would really have a way of beating something like that. Sure, they could out run it perhaps, but that about all they could do. Now, I'm not disputing that Hercules is a superior fighter than He-Man....i know Herc has more skills. However, He-Man has more strength feats than Hercules has. When was the last time Hercules moved celestial bodies...or cast huge mountain like structures into the sun while on Earth?

He-Man has many low showings...but he has high showings too. On a physical level...he could hang with anyone in Marvel or DC, imo.

Darth Wolverine
culees Mvell thumb up

Hi winz

olympian
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Yeah, and what did he do with them... Nothing.

Treatned Eternia with them, opened them to bring other warriors he wanted to Eternia.

What`s this absurd response of yours?

Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Great... Only we're not discussing PC Superman are we... When was the last time Skeletor opened a portal and controlled a super-being into beating He-man down... Oh, wait... It was only once as a plot device...

Hes done it way more than one time and you would know it if you had read about it.

If you don`t and its clear you didnt, then you could at least admit you arent that aknowleged. That comic version of Skel, was magically uber. Its not about making him into a "god", its about making him into a pre crisis type mage, wich is what he was back then. Absurd stuff is something any guy discussed here, has done.

Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Define highly intelligent.

Someone with a high level of intelligence.

Christ.


Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Because for all the so-called magic powers and intelligence Skeletor has, he's never even defeated He-man, who just happens to be on a "need-based" strength, according to oficionados..

Wich goes to show that once again, the hero wins mostly. How is that different than Superman and Batman, again?

I already made a mark that i dont agree with the "need-based" claims, since it doesnt apply with most versions that i have seen.

He doenst NEED to be boosted, tho. He`s pre crisis level at best in that regard.



Originally posted by GoBotsLive
No one ever said He-man was a slouch at combat. But against Hercules, he's outmatched in strength, tenacity, skill, experience and ability...

See how you never read a good account of MOTU material? Skel`s figthing ability hangs well with He-Man, and he`s more experienced. And according to the version he has a good degree of superstrength.

Hes also more powerful on its own.

Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Oh, and for the record... Desperate is trying to make characters from an afternoon cartoon look like gods when they were meant as plot devices for children.

Why, hello Superman.

Originally posted by charlemagne9746
However, He-Man has more strength feats than Hercules has. When was the last time Hercules moved celestial bodies...or cast huge mountain like structures into the sun while on Earth?

Hes trown objects in outer space as well and held celestial objects. Heck, in myth he shot an arrow from Earth to the sun where he hit the Sun-God Helios in the head.
Any of the two at best has ridiculous stuff. However i can see a case of He-Man in special of one version showing an advantage over say, Marvel Hercules, since he doesnt do things like these all the time. Im talking of the pre crisis version.

Its all really a matter of picking up wich version for either, since they kind of fluctuate among them.

nvrbeenwthagirl
He man has picked up and chucked mountains into outerspace. Talk about Teh uber strength feat. Not just lifted, or Held, or supported, but Picked up and hurled off the freaking planet.

olympian
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Before many of you go on rants to show just how baddass He-man really is, please provide some proof that He-man has the ability to wreck someone like Thor, Hulk, Superman, Orion, etc...

He has the physically power, added the magical one of the sword to hang out with any of these.

Marvel Thor would be the best bet to take him, as long he doesn`t resort into brawling mode, otherwise it would be a usual top tier slugfest for the most part.

Again, like most heroe characters, it depends wich version you use. Is current Superman more effective in using powers than the recent He-Man cartoon version? Probably. Is he better than some of the old He-Man comics versions? No.

Originally posted by GoBotsLive


Im rolling with laugher.

You do know that "being strong as the story requires" its a staple of pretty much all fictional strong guys, i hope?

snoopdogg
Gotta go with He-Man here.

olympian
Should we just specify wich version of He-Man and Hercules we are using for the tread. Maybe it would be for the best.

Especially to end some of the dubious logic that has been flying around here.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by olympian
Im rolling with laugher.

You do know that "being strong as the story requires" its a staple of pretty much all fictional strong guys, i hope?

Then you should really take a good look in the mirror and laugh some more... Since many He-man oficionados have already stated that He-man's strength is literally given on a need-base from Greyskull.

Hence, my argument stands and is left unchallenged. Hercules for the win 10/10.

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by olympian
He has the physically power, added the magical one of the sword to hang out with any of these.

Pure speculation, considering He-man has NEVER tussled with anyone similar to Hulk, Hercules, Thor, Orion, etc... His only encounter appeared in a bad script where Superman pwned him in less than 4 panels. You call that impressive... wink

Originally posted by olympian
Should we just specify wich version of He-Man and Hercules we are using for the tread. Maybe it would be for the best.

Especially to end some of the dubious logic that has been flying around here.

It wouldn't make any difference, but for the sake of argument, let's say Hercules vs He-man as they appear today. Hercules is stronger, more skilled and a much better fighter. He also has his mace which is virtually indestructible. Aside from that, Hercules has the advantage of experience fighting numerous super villians, heroes and gods.

He-man, while a formidable character today, fights a sorceror and his evil henchmen who have no super abilities to speak of. Fighting a sorceror and uber-powered humanoid are too different things.

Hence, Herc FTW...

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
He-Man has the equivocal endurance, resistance to injury, and strength of a demigod.

He-Man also has an indestructible Sword of Power that can project mystical energy and open inter-dimensional gateways.

In "Taking of Grayskull," He-Man not only lifts Castle Grayskull, but hurls it with sufficient force to exceed the gravitational pull of a whitehole.

In "Trouble In Arcadia," He-Man lifts an entire city.

In "Stone City," He-Man moves an entire mountain range.

In "Eternal Darkness," He-Man hurls a planet into orbit.

In "She-Demon of Phantos," He-Man breaks chains fashioned out of an indestructable mineral.

In "Awaken the Serpent," He-Man kills the god, Serpos.

snoopdogg
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Are those comic feats or cartoon?

olympian
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
many He-man oficionados have already stated that He-man's strength is literally given on a need-base from Greyskull.

Hence, my argument stands and is left unchallenged. Hercules for the win 10/10.

I am laughing more. Even if you dont agree with it, wich its to be the correct view, how does someone who depending the version you chose is as strong and more powerful loses 10/10?

It`s moronic at best.

One has to pick the versions to set a match like this. Each guy has at least 6 different versions running around, and they fluctuate in abilities.

Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Pure speculation, considering He-man has NEVER tussled with anyone similar to Hulk, Hercules, Thor, Orion, etc... His only encounter appeared in a bad script where Superman pwned him in less than 4 panels. You call that impressive... wink

You already showed you lack of knowlege into these characters. He-Man isent the only guy who is unusually strong in that universe.

And your "ownage" its a bit outdated at best. He put Superman down with a single move, traded blows and then Superman put him down with another move, and marvelous, he was back up later. Wich Superman was this? Thats rigth.

Originally posted by GoBotsLive
It wouldn't make any difference, but for the sake of argument, let's say Hercules vs He-man as they appear today. Hercules is stronger, more skilled and a much better fighter. He also has his mace which is virtually indestructible. Aside from that, Hercules has the advantage of experience fighting numerous super villians, heroes and gods.

He-man, while a formidable character today, fights a sorceror and his evil henchmen who have no super abilities to speak of. Fighting a sorceror and uber-powered humanoid are too different things.

Hence, Herc FTW...

"No super abilities to speak off"?

Yeah, you haven`t read anything. Here is an advice: go to YOUTUBE and see some videos of the new cartoon. I am in agreement that currect Hercules is physically better then that version but this is no stompage either way.

By also making Hercules winning 10/10 against a guy like this, you are overrating him in fanboysm levels that i just can`t digest especially since he is a favourite.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Are those comic feats or cartoon?

Old Cartoon i think. At least most of them.

In the Star/Marvel comics that came after that he was easily picking up mountains sometimes tho.

No way Herc gets 10/10 with a guy like this. The only way he does is if it`s Mithological Herc being a bastard and shoot his poisoned arrows from the get go without a care.

GoBotsLive

Adult Swim Guy
Well does he man not bring at least 1 person to his fights?

Adam_PoE

Evil_Ash
He-Man has fought Pre-Crisis Superman.

He-Man wins.

GoBotsLive

GoBotsLive
Originally posted by Evil_Ash
He-Man has fought Pre-Crisis Superman.

He-Man wins.

Great logic roll eyes (sarcastic) Did you come up with that all on your own?

Evil_Ash
Originally posted by GoBotsLive
Great logic roll eyes (sarcastic) Did you come up with that all on your own?

Yes.

Adam_PoE

zeel
Originally posted by juggernaut74
I would say calling him a Conan rip is stretching the character a bit. Conan has peak human strength or slightly higher. He-Man is in Hercs league.


He-man is beyond herc in str, he-man did a good job on superman in their on and only fight.

He-man = pre crisis supes in strength.

juggernaut74
Why is He-Man beyond Hercules in strength?

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.