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Don't you think Jack is gonna to take every opportunity to get what he wants from her by playing on her guilt. On the trailer did you could see the look on her face when he says"one of you suceeded".

What do you think?

your probably right.
I dont think he will do it to the extent where he makes her feel guilty, though...i think he will do it in a way that will make her blood boil and her heart race...cause thats what jack is all about

i think he will possibly keep reminding her of exactly WHAT happened before she chained him and effectively 'killed' him....

I agree to a point. You can't assume he's not going to be mad at her at all. She killed him! She put him in a place where he is reliving his nightmares day in and day out. He'll forgive her, of course, but I think he will bring it up at first to make sure he knows she feels guilt. Remember she told him "I'm not sorry." Well, he should want to make her sorry. After he's done being mad, I think he'll concentrate more on what led up to his death, specifically a certain kiss that was far too much for either of them to handle.

Jack doesn't get over things easily. Things stay with him. Most pirates would have stopped looking for the Pearl and Barbossa and just gotten another ship, but Jack loved the Pearl and wanted his revenge. Most pirates would have gotten over a girl that burned their rum in a heartbeat, but here it is a year later and Jack can't get her off his mind.

Yes like willo said Jack is definately gonna feel resentment towards Liz...and he has every reason to want to make her feel sorry!!

Liz kissing him was the last memory that Jack took with him to his watery grave (per say).....so it was sure to be the memory to haunt him while he's there! and being in a place surrounded by sand and heat with no water is making him go mad...so the man is bound to change....he's had time to think about what happened...so yes by the time he see's Liz he's gonna let her have it..GUILT, DESIRE, PAIN, ANGER!!!!!

and if u look at the trailer JACK seems different....he's character seems darker....and it's obvious he's a little crazier!!! And u can totally tell that Jack isnt the same Jack....his presence is different!!!

willofthewisp is right, Jack doesn't forget. but Lizzie, well she's guilty, but she's courageus too. Anybody else from the crew wouldn't let Jack alone on board of the Pearl. But she did. But I don't think she wanted to kill Jack at first. She just wanted to save her life, and lifes of crew. If somebody else was left on board, she wouldn't be guilty, 'cause she wouldn't kill Jack. So problem is in Jack, he feel betrayed. But I think, that Jack would do the same, if he had to decide between his own life and life of somebody else.

See, I think he'd be a little disturbed if he answered yes or no to "would I have done the same thing." I think he would have because it says in the novelization it makes him realize their hearts are the same, but I think he would be disturbed saying yes because he wouldn't want to do that to her or kill her so easily and he would be disturbed saying no because he doesn't want to acknowledge she's special to him.

I think he does understand she was trying to save everybody, but he's allowed to resent it. She is responsible for his death.

i wouldn't exactly agree that his character's presence is different--- because he actually seems more like he was in film 1 (which I just watched) than like he was in film 2 (which i liked better).

my current opinion is, that Jack was asking for it with his behavior toward Elizabeth. He was tempting her and flirting with her, full well knowing she was on a mission to save her fiance and it was in his best interests to let her complete that mission. Jack was playing with fire. Of course, that's the reason we love him. Elizabeth didn't have to respond the way she did, and that's the reason we love her.

I don't think Jack realized at the time he was chained the true ramifications of death. He's probably been on the verge of death several times before, but came away alive, and only remembers the rush of adrenaline. So to actually see the kraken, and then, to go through the awful torment in the locker... these will give him a more realistic, pragmatic view of what Elizabeth actually did to him. At the time of the betrayal, he's high on kiss emotions, all he can think about is how alike they are, etc... but now he's had to pay for her mistake. the "kiss high" has worn off. of course he's pissed. he's been in torment for quite some time by this point.

well, I sure hope he continues to haunt her and goad her and everything else....cause that will be great.....just as long as in the end we know that their hearts truly lie with each other.....

At the end of DMC...yes, Jack is smiling at her...he's just received the rewards that followed doing the right thing..doing something courageous and he is high on the kiss...he faces the Kracken with all the bravery that I've ever seen come out of jack..but as Kate says, after spending an undetermined time in the Locker...his mind has been damaged even more..he's madder than ever...so, of course, now that he's had time to think about it..I'm sure he would be a little peeved with Elizabeth..and aggravated that she betrayed him...once again his good side, that he hates about himself, did him in...so he shoots his good side so he can never be hurt again...or so he thinks.....I'm sure we have not seen the last of Jack's good side....

I agree. He seems dazed when he first escapes the chain and gets his sword ready, but comes back with that firepower. The Locker is going to give him a lot of time to think and it's not like it's his "evil side" that is going to be mad at her. All of him should be mad at her. His presence has to be a little different because he knows the pain of death and has probably gone a little crazy from the Locker. I also think he's tired of playing games with her. He'll continue to play them, but he's tired of it. Time is short, she should get over her inhibitions and just give in to him and it probably frustrates him even more that she won't.

You know Willo...I agree...that's why when he says "keep telling yourself that, Darling"...he seems serious...and mad at the same time. He's had it with her games....

Well, I know this won't happen but wouldn't it be great if at some point after all her denials...he grabs her and lays one on her and tells her "this is what you'll be missing...think about that Lizzie when you are pinning away from Dear William, fish face eunichy boy"...LOL

I just want Jack to grab her and kiss her with a passion she's never ever experienced before.....a passion that oozes with LOVE...

I "just want Jack to grab her and kiss her with a passion she's never ever experienced before.....a passion that oozes with LOVE..."----lovethemtigers.

Hell yeah! Let him have a chance! She did all the work for their last kiss. Let him give her a taste of her own medicine. Sigh, I want some time to write a fanfic. I'm convinced no one's done this before but I need like massive amounts of time and that's just not going to happen.

So to what Kate said, yeah, his presence itself isn't all that different. He shouldn't seem drunker or weirder or anything to us because we know that's how he acts. Watch COTBP like she said. Come to think of it, he's not all that serious in DMC that much, save for a few scenes. This is a new side to him, but not a foreign one. It only follows logic he should be tired and vexed, physically and mentally. Think of all the pressure that's on him to defeat the whole EITC. Combine that with what's going on in his head and you will have a very tired pirate.

a very tired, very sexy pirate that is. i watched film 1 again last night... poor Will looks like he is 12 in that film! good thing he beefed up. Jack Sparrow owned that film. totally.

yes, and what's going on in his Heart...Poor Jack...

but this is all wrong....when Johnny agreed to play Jack..he wanted him to be someone that the entire audience could relate too...he wanted Jack to be light-hearted and funny...but then I remember how Johnny said that His Character will go places in AWE that he never dreamed would be possible for Jack....ah..Johnny, what an actor....I'm sure he will be very successful at showing us another side to Jack....

Cuz...the jack that he portrayed in the Kiss of Death scene and slaying the Kracken was unlike any thing we've ever seen...of Jack...there was no more drunken swagger, no joking, no sly remarks...Just a man with a heart ......a serious man facing death...a man vexed by a woman...and looking sexier than I ever thought possible...

hahaha lovethemtigers, you are sooooo eloquent. i love it. its so true. sigh.

maybe he just meant by that line he would never of dreamed he would get to play a fish face for a few minutes... hahahaha

True....ah,....Jack the fish face...and here we were calling Will fish face..and look who ends up the Fish Face...but surely he won't stay a fish face.....

OMG...I just remembered the line in DMC when Jack calls Davy...

'you slimy git...."

hee hee, git. That's about as close to swearing as these pirates do, isn't it?

Seriously, Johnny could be talking about anything, though. I'm sure when he made COTBP he never thought his character would have this epic chance to shoot a kraken in slow motion. I know he knows Jack better than anyone, but this just means there are definitely going to be some surprises (hopefully pleasant) for him in AWE. He deserves them. I think he needs a break.

I don't know about you girls...but I am so tired....tired of defending Jack...tired of wishing and hoping for the ending we all want.....tired of analyzing everything....the trailer has just about finished me off....I think back over these past 8 months...and we've been through so much together...so many ups and downs.....

but here is one thing...I said it on another thread...have we discussed this before....Just why did Elizabeth murder Jack??? Think about it...She knew they could make it to land..she had already seen jack in the longboat headed for land while the kracken attacked the pearl, still....she knew they had time to escape while the Kracken took down the Pearl...so just why did she really decide to leave Jack to die? Was it revenge for Will....for what she thinks Jack did to Will by sending him to the FD....or did she do it out a selfish impulse....to see what it would be like to be really bad.....to get rid of Jack and the temptation he represents to her........I just wonder/?????

Yes, she wants to know how the kiss with Jack tastes like. And because she didn't want to look as weak girl, she left him to die. and, well, she could remember discussion with Will in first movie. So she proved him, he's not only one man who trades a man's life for a ship. Will has nothing to do with that.

Originally posted by lovethemtigers
or did she do it out a selfish impulse....to see what it would be like to be really bad.....to get rid of Jack and the temptation he represents to her........I just wonder?????

In the DMC commentary, TnT brought up that snipped that someone stated.

Elizabeth was drowning her guilt and snaking her lust all at the same time.

And TnT said this was a good statement...maybe this is what the writers had in mind?
(And if im right, then its what willo, lovelyone, lovethemtigers and chiki had been saying for months? lol)

Aw, thanks, T. Maria, but I was more of an advocate of Liz being good and saving the crew rather than eliminating Jack from her life. lol.

I think when LovelyOne first brought up this idea, a lot of people (including myself) didn't like it because it makes Liz out to be this she-devil rather than the (fairly) good person she is. There are so many ways to look at it and it all depends on what you think of Elizabeth Swann.

"It's after you, not the ship. It's not us. This is the only way, don't you see? I'm not sorry."

Hmm. Well, she did see him go off in the longboat while the kraken was going after the Pearl. That is definitely evidence for the slake her lust theory. But no one in these movies is stupid except for maybe Pintel and Ragetti. These people know when they caught a break and when they didn't. Maybe Liz thought lightning wouldn't strike twice and someone would find out it didn't kill Jack and then wherever he went, there the kraken would be. Does that seem possible? Maybe she looked it at as luck rather than kraken-logic?

Originally posted by willofthewisp
Aw, thanks, T. Maria, but I was more of an advocate of Liz being good and saving the crew rather than eliminating Jack from her life. lol.

I think when LovelyOne first brought up this idea, a lot of people (including myself) didn't like it because it makes Liz out to be this she-devil rather than the (fairly) good person she is. There are so many ways to look at it and it all depends on what you think of Elizabeth Swann.

"It's after you, not the ship. It's not us. This is the only way, don't you see? I'm not sorry."

Hmm. Well, she did see him go off in the longboat while the kraken was going after the Pearl. That is definitely evidence for the slake her lust theory. But no one in these movies is stupid except for maybe Pintel and Ragetti. These people know when they caught a break and when they didn't. Maybe Liz thought lightning wouldn't strike twice and someone would find out it didn't kill Jack and then wherever he went, there the kraken would be. Does that seem possible? Maybe she looked it at as luck rather than kraken-logic?

^^^ good theory

See the thing is ... was there any evidence within the film that the crew knew that the kracken was sent after JACK???
or did they assume that the kracken was after the whole ship??

Cause i mean...they either REALLY loved their captain (and I mean REALLY REALLY loved him!) or they really didn't know that the kracken was just after him, and not the rest of them....

and yet...liz figured it out.
Was this because she saw him in the longboat???

Also...those words;

"It's after you, not the ship. It's not us. This is the only way, don't you see? I'm not sorry."

when you read them...it sounds like shes almost saying them to herself...trying to convince herself that this is the right thing to do...

Well, she was the only one to see him sneak away. Jack isn't very open with his crew about what's going on. The only person I can see who could figure it out would be Gibbs, but I think the crew believes the kraken's after the whole ship. Liz knows differently because there's Jack off in the distance.

Counterpoint: Jack is in a long boat with Liz, Norrington, Pintel, and Ragetti going to Isla de Cruces and nothing happens there. That should leave Liz to believe it's after Jack and not the ship, but seeing him go off again would prove that it attacks where it THINKS Jack is.

good point willo