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Did anyone else notice that when J/E kiss,no matter what angle,it formed a heart?!


http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j102/EmpireLady/heart1.jpg

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j102/EmpireLady/hear3.jpg

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j102/EmpireLady/hear2.jpg

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j102/EmpireLady/heart4.jpg

No! Thats cool

I know! shockyes

Reminds me of that heart in this scene, in the background.

Oh yeah! I forgot about the background ones!

no, interesting

Omg thats really interesting lol, but WHAT could it mean...I wonder...*dozes off*

hmmmm....

....

I got nothin'

True love?...sorry i dont have anything either apart that THEY should be together rather than Liz and Will, maybe it's their sort of hint to us...im really hopeful its a SPARRABETH - SPARRABETH ROCKS

that's amazing.

It is.


And AudioHeart,I agree!!!

Thankyou!

I'm not trying to be mean, but come on...anyone who kisses makes a heart-shape. It's nothing special about Jack and Elizabeth.

yeah, i'll just be silly and go with Surreal on this--- all the W/L kisses make hearts too.

But its still sweet!

Well yeah, it is sweet, except that Liz is using this particular kiss to distract Jack so that she can leave him for Kraken bait.


But the heart-shape around people kissing...don't they use that for like the ending of cheesy romance movies?? Oh, and sometimes on the cover of badly written romance novels...

Kate, darling, been meaning to tell you, I just love your siggy.....it's to die for.....

Got to agree, Will and Liz kissing would also make a heart shape. I wonder if that's what inspired the symbol we have for a heart. It's definitely not the shape of the heart we have in our bodies. Maybe someone saw two people kissing and liked that shape.

You know Surreal...when you put it that way..it does seem sort of silly that we think J and E can be a couple...the woman killed the man, afterall.....I just love jack and elizabeth together...I think they make a great couple...I just honestly don't really care for Will and Elizabeth..and you know what ...it's like we were discussing over at KTTC....

WE've seen the relationship of Jack and Elizabeth grow throughout the two movies...it's almost like a chest game with them....

With Will...i've always wondered..what happen between them during those 8 years from the ship to the day she meets Jack...if they are so "in Love".. why can't he call her Elizabeth....I've just never seen anything between them..except perhaps a childhood crush. There are no sparks...there is no tension...there is no build up...it just sort of happens...I was always a little confused that Will was willing to die for her...when he couldn't even call her by her first name...I know, I know, propriety and all that in those days...but still, come on....how did they fall in love..when did they see each other, how did they see each other...why do they think they are in love....I just don't get it...

Originally posted by lovethemtigers
Kate, darling, been meaning to tell you, I just love your siggy.....it's to die for.....

thank you!!!!

g*d, how much more proof do you need people?! i never noticed that!!! MANIFEST DESTINY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hehe, i just learned that..means "obvious fate"!!!!

Lovethemtiger I agree with you.How do Will and Liz know if they really love each other.Maybe Liz just wanted to be in love.As many young girls she was in love with love itself.There was Will.And remember in COTBP she says in the end that Will is a pirate.It seems like she wanted to be in love and to be in love with a pirate.But first loves aren't always last for a lifetime.There may come an other love,and that might not be a young girl's,but a grown up woman's.

Oh dear. For the love of everything holy, Jack and Liz is not going to happen, no matter how many flimsy ideas of proof you guys put together!!

Tigers - Will didn't called Liz by her first name because it was a case of class. Liz is the Governor's Daughter and high class, and therefore those "commoners" had to show respect, which is what Will insisted on doing.

*walks off sings "Not Gonna Happen" in a gospel style with a tambourine"

Kenny, you'd better watch yo-self. It's nice to have opinions, but unless you are working on the film or are one of the writers, I wouldn't make hard and fast directives. it ain't over till the fat strumpet sings, savvy?

A kiss and a compass aren't OUR flimsy proof--- that was the idea of the film-makers, in case you've forgotten. Plus, when your ship is as hott as Sparrabeth, you don't need proof. All you need is a ship and some rum.

I don't think I'd want to be on a "ship as hot as Sparrabeth" thats got a lot of rum on board.

And I'll say it again, cos I know it's winding you up, Jack and Liz is not going to happen. Who here would seriously want to settle down with someone who has killed them?

Maybe it will end as a Willabeth,but tell me please why were there all those signs,fate intervened etc. in DMC?What ever happens I will love Pirates OF The Carribean all the same,but I'm allways going to prefer Sparrabeth.

Kenny, who the hell cares what any of us think? Let some people have their fun. Think what you want to think and stop trying to change people's minds.

Originally posted by Kenny16
I don't think I'd want to be on a "ship as hot as Sparrabeth" thats got a lot of rum on board.

And I'll say it again, cos I know it's winding you up, Jack and Liz is not going to happen. Who here would seriously want to settle down with someone who has killed them?

Kenny, darling, I'll just give you the facts one more time.

1. girls like bad boys.

2. nice guys finish last

3. lust can be far more powerful than devotion or puppy love--- check the cheating and divorce rates

4. this is a PIRATE movie--- they none of them have good morals. this isnt the princess bride.

5. Jack is the money of the film. If he doesn't really want Elizabeth, then fine, no one cares. But if he does, audiences will want him to have her. Thats the way movie idolism goes.

6. pirate in eyeliner+confused ingenue+ sexy, forbidden kiss= 1 billion dollars


Alright, all that said, you can go back to your One True Love world. All this arguing is more fun than i thought it would be. hehehe. As you know, i fully expect Will and Elizabeth to get married, but that has to do with other spoilers I've been told... not just because its the only logical thing to happen.

Ooh, Kate...I gotta respond, even if it sounds mean...


Are those facts or just matters of opinion? I can honestly tell you that as a girl, I may like the bad boy, but I'd rather take the good man any day. More dependable, less likely to flirt with other women (or men ).


Good guys don't always finish last. If they did, there'd be no happily ever afters....ever.


Yes, the divorce rate is high because of lust, which doesn't really say much for your ship, does it? In other words, since Jack and Liz are so randy, they couldn't trust each other to stay faithful.


I'll grant you that it's a pirate movie and none of them have good morals. We agree on something!!!


Jack is the money of the film...but ask most people who don't analize how the sun shines in a particular direction onto the deck that creates a shadow that if you squint and tilt your head to the right and forward slightly, resembles a heart....ask THOSE peopel who don't examine every little screencap, they'll tell you that W/E will end up together.


So yeah...I don't think that the money is tied up into whether Jack gets the girl. Whether Jack is happy, possibly, but even with the trailer out with a blatant W/E kiss, At World's End is already the most anticipated film of the summer, beating out Spiderman.


Romance is shockingly not what most people who see these films care about.


I agree with your last statement, except I would add in Scruffington, awesome special effects and the fact that you had to see the film at least two or three times to get the whole wonderful story.



Now....


Why are Elizabeth and Will in love?


Who knows? Why are Jack and Elizabeth in love? Forget a hot kiss and existentialism (or however you spell the bloody word) and symbolism on freedom and all that jazz.


Why are Jack and Elizabeth in love?


You can't explain it to me so that I'd understand, and that's true with Will and Elizabeth as well.


Sometimes you just love someone for no reason, except that when you look at them your heart jumps and your knees go weak and you know that no matter what happens, you would die for them.


Does it always make sense? No. Some people you just get that instant connection, and you feel as if you've found a part of your soul that you didn't even know was missing until you looked at that person. That's love.

oh holy crap stop. lol. boooo. how many bloody times do i have to bloody say i flipping bloody agree that bloody stupid will and elizabeth will bloody get married?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? I AM NOT ARGUING THAT JACK AND ELIZABETH WILL END UP TOGETHER~!!!!! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY THAT?~!??

i dont think anyone can say I EVER argue on shadows, heart shapes, or distant histories for the strength of my ship. so dont argue with me about that, because i never said anything like that to begin with.

who would ever ask Jack or Elizabeth to stay faithful? They're PIRATES.

Nobody cares whether Will and Elizabeth get married, they mainly come for Captain Jack. I'd argue that point. The only reason Elizabeth became more interesting to audiences and critics was because she got involved with the money of the film.

hmmm... got a bit carried away there. lol.

here's the thing. Willabethers are always arguing on logic, and Sparrabethers are always arguing on passion. Why is that, do you think?

ok Surreal..*cracks knuckles* (though i can't crack my knuckles. but that is beside the point)

Concerning the girls go for bad boys deal. Yes they do, and it is also true that they often end up chosing the guy with the wonderful morals. But, taking all the rumors and facts about AWE into consideration, we won't be able to call Will a 'good boy' as we could in COTBP, or even in DMC. And after it all, I doubt the Bad boy/Good boy issue will come out on top. It's about more than that.

And yes, it's true, good guys don't always finish last in movies. Especially Disney ones. And most Disney happy endings are with the good guy. Maybe all up to this point are. But it all depends on the character, and their idea of a happy ending.

And who says all there is between Jack and Lizzie is lust? They are very much alike, and they are good friends. Friends. I said this before months ago. Jack and Lizzie have good times together. They smile, they joke, they laugh. This is, in my opinion, one of the most important things in a relationship. To be able to be with eachother and have a good time. Will and Liz to me have a puppy love relationship, and there has been no proof that they were great friends, or are. It seems to me that Will fell in love with Liz from afar, and to an extent, this is the same with Liz. I can't think of a moment in the movies where Liz and Will had a fun, casual conversation. And I think there is something to be said about this in relationships.

And yes. Jack is the money. And although not everyone analyzes, the writers do include forshadowing, and subtle hints. And TnT aren't just writing this movie for the people who don't analyze. They will do what they think makes sense. And I know many people who prefer Jack with Liz and don't analyse the movie to near the completness that we do here. I don't know how you don't see the evidence for Jack and Liz, Surreal. It's not all in the little details. I think there was some pretty obvious evidence in the movie.

And I agree that the money does not lie in whether Jack gets the girl, because there are a good number of both J/E shippers and W/E shippers, and the ones who don't care will want to see the main characters happy. And the kiss between Will and Liz doesn't mean any one thing at this point, as we don't know the context in which the kiss is placed. You can't just assume the end of one of the bigger questions for the next movie by something that was in the trailer. Disney isn't that stupid. There are goign to be many twists and turns, and you can't count on that kiss to be the end of the Jack/Liz/Will question.

Romance isn't what makes this film, to be sure, but it is very important, as it affects everything else.

Why do Jack and Liz love each other, excluding the symbolism and the they look hot together argument? And the kiss? I'm not going to go into a long rant, but I'd say something along the lines of they enjoy being in each other's company, for both romantic reasons and not. And they understand eachother. They can see the real person in the other. I can't say the same thing about Will and Liz. I'm not sure that he sees that Liz is an independant young woman. Jack loved her because he knows she is trapped in the mold of how she should be, but longs for freedom and adventure. Will saw the beautiful and proper lady. He might be able to love her for who she will become, but Jack saw it in her, and he liked, if not loved, her for who she really is, from the beginning.

I agree with what everyones been saying.

I mean, it's never been that kind of raw, passionate love with Will & Liz. I think Liz was just, so in love with the thought of being in love.

I'm obviously a sparrabeth shipper, but if you really think about it, it's disney. The girl ends with the good guy...the one they portray to be the love of her life.

And the whole 'its just lust' thing...I mean, maybe it is, maybe its not...no one really -knows- how jack thinks. His mind is a mystery, and thats what everyone loves about him.

I just think Will and Jack love Liz differently as to how Liz loves them both differently. Will loves the proper lady she was around her family, with her being the perfect lil daughter of the governor. But Jack, loves the wild side of her, the pirate side, where shes free and careless.

Well, thats my rant for the afternoon...lol

"Why are Jack and Elizabeth in love? Forget a hot kiss and existentialism (or however you spell the bloody word) and symbolism on freedom and all that jazz.
Why are Jack and Elizabeth in love?"----Surreal

For the same reason Rhett and Scarlett are in love. They see an extension of themselves in the other person. Am I arguing that they are without a doubt in love and will end up together? No. I am not 100% sure of anything that will happen in AWE. But if they share a mutual love, that's the reason right there. Soulmates.

"I just think Will and Jack love Liz differently as to how Liz loves them both differently. Will loves the proper lady she was around her family, with her being the perfect lil daughter of the governor. But Jack, loves the wild side of her, the pirate side, where shes free and careless."---pirates life

Hmm, I have to disagree here. You're probably all going to think I'm just going back and forth, but I can't discount Will. If he's loved her from afar for a long time, he probably knows she's not the proper lady she's supposed to be. I think he admires her bravery, her unconventionalism, and her intelligence. It's those things that got her to agree to marry him in the first place since no perfect governor's daughter would have ever married a blacksmith. He places a higher value on her than just some well-bred lady. He was the one who taught her how to fight, remember. He most likely doesn't love the true pirate side of her, but I think he's attracted to her sense of adventure and her other "amaiable qualities," to quote Mr. Collins (Tom Hollander rocks!)

And I think it unfair to say that if Jack loves her, he loves only a part of her. He's more attracted to her when she's being a pirate, yes, but I think he's at least amused by her proper side. She's not afraid to try to be a good person, while he doesn't believe he can be one anymore, so he has to be a little envious of her there. And he's not so infatuated with the pirate Liz so much that he finds those pants arousing. "It should be a dress or nothing."

I agree with you:Jack and Elizabeth love to be in each other's company.They enjoy being together.I don't see if she's so much in love with Will,with all her heart,how can she flirt with Jack,and smile while thinking of him in a way that even Norrington noticed it.

I'll put my two cents worth in...but I don't have time to be very analytical..but....as far as I see it...
Why are Jack and Elizabeth in love?....well, Willo said it best...they see an extension of themselves in each other..
Jack said it best in the curiosity scene...."we are very much a like you and i, i - you, us. You will come over to my side I know it?

One word, luv, curisoity...you long for freedom, you long to do what you want to do because you want it...to act on selfish impulse...you want to know what it feels like..one day you won't be able to resist....

and Liz's response...

You and I are alike, and there will come a moment when you have the chance to do the right thing...you're going to do something really courageous and when you do..you'll discover something, that you're a good man....

So, basically...both of them are good people with a little bit of Pirate in them..they long for freedom...I think by Jack saying that..to me it implies that she can't be all those things with Willl...Will is honorable and always chooses the straight and narrow path, or at least he tries to...I know he will become a little darker in the next movie..Orlando has said that himself....but....Will would always expect Elizabeth to uphold the law and such and such..Jack is implying that with him she could do whatever she wants...they go be adventurous together...and you know what...I don't care what you guys say..Jack could be faithful if He found the right woman...it happens alot..where confirmed bachelors meet the girl of their dreams, fall in love and never wander again..and stay faithful to their soulmate, their true love....

think back to the Persuade Me scene...
Might I inquire has how you came by these...
Persuasion'
Friendly
Decidedly not.
Will strikes a deal for these and upholds it with honor, yet YOU are the one standing here with the prize...

Liz hijacks a ship and doesn't fire one single shot...and makes the ship take her to Tortuga....
and right here is when Ted and Terry are talking about it....they say..Now who does that sound like...

Liz is even dressing like Jack...

Liz and Jack complete each other...and who says Liz doesn't light up when she sees Jack...If I remember correctly... she gets little fleeting looks of embarrasment and blushes when Jack tells her the Compass points to the thing you want most in this world...

Liz is fantazising/daydreaming about Jack and just what Persuading him might entail..and good Old Norrington notices...
"it's a curious thing, there was a time when i would have given anything for you to look like that while thinking about me"...and he is not talking about Will..he's talking about Jack...and Liz's response..
"I don't know what you mean" (she can't believe Norrie caught her daydreaming about Jack)
"Oh I think you do."
"don't be ridiculous, I trust him that's all"
and Norrie laughs and shakes his head and says
"so, you never wondered how your latest fiance ended up on the Flying Dutchman in the first place?"..again smiling and shaking his head

In other words, he is accusing Elizabeth of having such rose colored glasses on around Jack..she can't see when he is playing her....

and let us not forget Beckett picking up vibes from her..."Captain Jack Sparrow, yes, I thought you might"...and he is looking right at Liz when he says that....
Beckett has been keeping tabs on them, I do believe
and then when he says "a marraige interuppted...or fate intervenes, you make great efforts to ensure the freedom of jack sparrow....
and liz responds defensively, "these are not for Jack"
Beckett responds "oh really"..(like he doesn't really beleive her)

and the compass...oh that darn compass...we learn through jack that the compass points to the thing you want MOST in this WORLD....
and afterwards on two occasions, when Liz is holding it ..it points to jACK..
now, ted and terry have said that on the island it points to the chest, but the important thing here...is that LIz believes that it is pointing to jack...and the fact that she believes this..is proof enough to me that she is starting to wonder if she has feelings for jack..and this upsets her because she knows that she has loved will for a long time, planned to marry him...but now after seeing Jack again and spending time with him, she is very confused...so much so...that when the opportune moment presents itself...she acts on selfish impulse...and gets rid of the temptation...by slaking her lust and drowning her guilt....

and for the arguement..that why would someone want to be with someone who killed them..well, this is basically a fantasy film...so I would think that in the world of Pirates and supernatural happenings...Jack will come to understand, in fact I think in a way he already knows, why Liz did what she did..and he will forgive her..she is a young and irrational girl afterall...but she is growing up more and more....

Wow, I think Surreals best friend is Kenny since they both like to argue

Kenny, I didn't know Ted or Terry died and made a will for you stating that you can take their place and say what's going to happen in the movie?

You don't like sparrabeth? Well, it won't stop us from living or
loving sparrabeth.

Im actually laughing my obsessive sparrabeth ass off with this debate lmao! It never stops. Where's the love?

LMAO i'm laughing with Mina!! Haven't read the debate, but i can tell already that it's hilarious!!!

yeah...Surreal and Kenny are like two peas in a pod....

I don't know why i wrote all that stuff earlier...all that needs be said is that jack is hot...jack and elizabeth together sizzle...will and elizabeth..yawn...nuff said...

*comes back*
.....
What'd I miss in this thread?

nothing much really...Surreal and Kenny just trying to prepare us for a W/E ending..and how silly we are to think Jack and Elizabeth could ever be togehter...Kenny actually walked off whistling and playing the tamborine....LOL

O.o

*shakes head*

Okay, it may be true that the heart shape is common, BUT WE CAN DREAM CAN'T WE i mean if TNT won't give us what we want aka SPARRABETH then we'll just have to make stuff up to keep us motivated...did that make sense?

^^ Or maybe thats just me ^^

Originally posted by Gravitation
*comes back*
.....
What'd I miss in this thread?

Supposedly Ted or Terry died and left a will to Kenny stating that there is no such thing as Sparrabeth.

And then "we killed Kenny!"

LOL

"we killed kenny"

Originally posted by Chiki Mina
Supposedly Ted or Terry died and left a will to Kenny stating that there is no such thing as Sparrabeth.

And then "we killed Kenny!"

Chiki...that is priceless...

Yes Kenny is so sure he knows the ending to AWE...he's like "jack and elizabeth, ain't gonna happen...walks off whistling and playing tamborine....

Ah, Kenny, no matter what you say...we are sticking to j and e...the screen dont' lie...

Originally posted by lovethemtigers
Ah, Kenny, no matter what you say...we are sticking to j and e...the screen dont' lie...


There would be a lot less Sparrabeth shippers if it did lol

I went RPing and I miss all this. T.T

Actually, any two humans kissing would make a heart shape...

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i61/Ericadawn16/heart3.jpg

lmao lmao NO WONDER....HE IS A eUNICH!!! bECKETT IS A eUNICH....lmao lmao lmao!!

Yay!! POTC turned into Broke Back Mountain!!

Erica, that picture is so hot.


Kenny, I got your back any time you need it. They may come off as being rude, but really they're sweet girls. Usually.

Originally posted by Ericadawn
Actually, any two humans kissing would make a heart shape...


Yeah,well I made this like at 2 am and was bored. Sooo....this happened...

You can have Kenny's back, arms, legs, and other parts of anatomy

We have Jack and Lizzie's back

Originally posted by Chiki Mina
You can have Kenny's back, arms, legs, and other parts of anatomy

We have Jack and Lizzie's back

*holds Jack plushie like how Jack held his jar of dirt* We sure do! ^^

But we still love you, Gravitation.


And just to touch back on why Jack and Elizabeth love each other; any and all theories are interesting that you give me, but as I said, you can't satisfy me with an "analytical" answer because honestly, we don't know.


We have no idea if it's the fact that Jack and Liz see a mirror in each other, or an extension of each other, or if they just like how the other one looks, or if it's because Jack likes how Elizabeth laughs and Elizabeth likes Jack's arm muscles....


Everything is pure speculation on WHY they love each other. You can't define love by one statement of "Well, they are an extension of each other," because love is much, much more than that.

Jack and Elizabet's love is so much more than that

Isn't that basically the same for W/E?

^^

oKAY...i'm tired of giving concrete evidence from the films and you say it's speculation..ted and terry even say so in their commentaries...I'm not arguing anymore..cuz it doenst' really matter..

all that matters...is we think jack and elizabeth are soulmates and belong together...and have a heck of alot more in common than her and old excellent saprano boy.....

FATE INTERVENED.....BECKETT SAID IT...and yes, rogue, I am yelling...

The compass pointed to jack...as far as elizabeth and the audience is concerned....

the compass isn't working for jack..because he knows what he wants but is loathed to claim it as his own....

elizabeth is getting more and more like jack every day..

they are very much alike....

ah...why am i doing this....we know what we find to be concrete evidence that jack and liz belong together...and that's all we are saying Surreal and Kenny..that we think j and e belong together based on all the things t and t revealed to us over the past two films....the obvious is that its will and elizabeth....but it's what is just under the surface, all the clues ted and terry implanted into DMC to tie in with POTC...and then some extras that stand alone in DMC.....they are taking risks with this third installment...going places a Disney film never thought possible....

A-A-A-Amen

WOW,lovethemtigers! When you get started,you get started! =3

Gravitation: If you were referring to my statement about J/E being in love and that one sentence doesn't work for them, then yes, it applies to W/E as well. The original question was (and I'm paraphrasing here), "How could Will know that he'd die for Elizabeth? How do they know that they are in love?"


I responded that sometimes you just KNOW that you're in love, that the person you're looking at is part of your soul. There is no way to define love, because it's all the grandest things in the world, and often it's the smaller things, and sometimes it's just plain silly things that make it all up.


But then I wanted to know how you could define J/E's love, and the answer (for me at least) is that you can't.


Lovethemtigers: I get tired of the debate as well, but if you'd look at ALL the comments of TnT and not just ignore the statements that don't support your ship, you might come to a different conclusion about J/E.


I don't think J/E is any less important than W/E, and I'm not saying that J/E isn't an interesting pairing. They are important, and they are a fascinating pair, and honestly, once I take shipping out of my mind, they are a lot of fun to watch together on screen.


My opinion is no less valid than yours, and your opinion is no less valid than mine.


Besides, I'm waiting for TnT to really surprise me and have Liz go for Norrington. That'd be unexpected, wouldn't it?

Originally posted by Surreal_44



Besides, I'm waiting for TnT to really surprise me and have Liz go for Norrington. That'd be unexpected, wouldn't it?

Watch that happen. Us having done all this and at the movies,our mouths drop,saying: 'I-I...That was... O.o'

But it'll give us warm fuzzies.

I'd be screaming at the screen saying, "NOO!!! It's either Willabeth or Sparrabeth!! Not Norriabeth!" Then I'd stomp my popcorn container.

Oh,and if it DOES turn out to be Willabeth,I hope there's like a hurt/comfort scene between her and Jack. But I still root for Sparrabeth. ^^

Originally posted by Surreal_44
Gravitation: If you were referring to my statement about J/E being in love and that one sentence doesn't work for them, then yes, it applies to W/E as well. The original question was (and I'm paraphrasing here), "How could Will know that he'd die for Elizabeth? How do they know that they are in love?"


I responded that sometimes you just KNOW that you're in love, that the person you're looking at is part of your soul. There is no way to define love, because it's all the grandest things in the world, and often it's the smaller things, and sometimes it's just plain silly things that make it all up.


But then I wanted to know how you could define J/E's love, and the answer (for me at least) is that you can't.


Lovethemtigers: I get tired of the debate as well, but if you'd look at ALL the comments of TnT and not just ignore the statements that don't support your ship, you might come to a different conclusion about J/E.


I don't think J/E is any less important than W/E, and I'm not saying that J/E isn't an interesting pairing. They are important, and they are a fascinating pair, and honestly, once I take shipping out of my mind, they are a lot of fun to watch together on screen.


My opinion is no less valid than yours, and your opinion is no less valid than mine.


Besides, I'm waiting for TnT to really surprise me and have Liz go for Norrington. That'd be unexpected, wouldn't it?

Keep waiting, darlin'

Surreal, we are not overlooking Ted and Terry's comments. Their statements also doesn't indicate about willabeth either or norribeth. We love TnT, but you are making us feel as we don't have respect for them. We don't ignore their comments.

I know that some of us are not film studies students or writers. But we do respect them as writers. But doesn't mean that we are suck ups either...

The importantance of what Elizabeth does at the Faithful Bride is coming to mind...

Hi Mina! Im so on the phone with you!!! lol

I have just found out that ALL my friends from school...are Willabeths.
-_-

omg thats a crisis!!! *pulls out all the Sparrabeth evidence* time to change their minds!!!

Originally posted by PirateDiva
Hi Mina! Im so on the phone with you!!! lol

OMG!! We talk so much

This is so much fun!! Phone and chatting

Originally posted by Ericadawn
The importantance of what Elizabeth does at the Faithful Bride is coming to mind...

meaning that she's not being faithful..

lmao.... phone and chatting!!!! i know right!!! wo0o0o00o0o0 Sparrabeth 4 life!!!! i dont care what anyone says Jack and Liz love each other!!!! *sighs*

Originally posted by PirateDiva
omg thats a crisis!!! *pulls out all the Sparrabeth evidence* time to change their minds!!!

Did...didn't work. -_-'

Originally posted by Gravitation
Did...didn't work. -_-'

Well then, *pulls out pistol* This will work!!!

Eeeekkk!! Nooooo!!!!

reply to the first post: wow. never noticed that.. cool. i wonder if it is indicating Sparrabeth pair up...

Gravi, just let them sink into their willabeth ship of doom

You are here safe with us in the good Sparrabeth ship that will never sink!

Sparrabeth... yay...

I told them that when the movie comes out,we'll all go together to see. ^^ Oh gee,5 teen girls....

uh-huh... it would be a blast.. think anyone would shriek when the movie starts in your little group?

Yeah,all of us!!! ^.^'

I would try my best to not shriek, mainly because i'm betting heavily that i would be watching this with my parents and i don't want anyone to stare at me..

my parents will most likely drop us off then pick us up when it's over. And we know we won't be the only ones shrieking!

as for me, i'm not sure. if someone else shrieks, then i'll probably do it too..

Erm... did we scare Kenny off? Sorry Kenny!!! Don't be mad!!! LOL.

This thread got intense for a few minutes. hahaha. oh gee. you guys are so funny. it's great.

Surreal, I'll just give you a hint, when arguing with me, just start talking about how hott the W/L kiss in the midst of the battle is going to be, and I'll squeal with you. kisses in the rain are always my weakness.

I'm having a very good feeling today about the fact that Jack's going to end up with everything he wants and a cheeky 'You weren't really worried about me, were you?" grin on his face... now its just a matter of deciphering what he wants...

Kate wrote:





Oh, mine too. Too bad J/E didn't kiss in the rain, or at least when one of them was dripping wet. Being wet makes everyone look so much better.


Well, Jack is a guy, so we all know what he wants. But what order does he want them in? Seriously though, I've been wondering about this theory that in order for Jack to be developed fully as a character he would need Elizabeth as a romantic partner to show that he's learned to trust himself and others....


But what if he doesn't need romance right now? What if what he needs is real friendship, where he realizes he can actually try to trust people again and to let them get close to him. He's already taken the first steps with Elizabeth, and he made a few tentative overtures to Will before he screwed up by using them and not trusting them.


Maybe what Jack really needs to complete his arc is friendship. Just a thought, aye?

AYE

I'm not one to turn down friendship. It's so underrated. People don't put a value on it as much as they used to, especially male/female friendships. They always want the two friends to get together. I think Jack will have to grow a little before he can accept some romance, but don't you think he'll grow a little in the Locker and then out of it when he's back in the real world, back where things have consequences? If he truly does just kind of collapse and hold his head in his hands, he's probably learning a valuable lesson.

Of course he'll grow from his experience in the locker. I guess my main question is this:


If Will and Elizabeth do get together, but Jack learns to allow others to be close to him emotionally, would you still feel that his arc is completed even if he doesn't 'get the girl'?


Would that be an emotionally satisfying ending for you, because I think that too much is made of whether Jack would grow as a character if he didn't "have" Elizabeth. I think it's a fair question, and I'm not trying to debate whether Jack and Elizabeth end up together or that.

Good question, and it's hard to answer it without being biased. If Will and Liz do get together, it kind of depends what happens to them. If they're all of a sudden the captain of the Dutchman and Mrs. Dutchman, I don't think Jack's character will grow because there go the only two people he's even made an effort to be able to talk to. Do you see what I mean there? It would have be a situation where the audience would get this feeling that the three of them are kind of destined to always be linked.

Because let's say Will stabs the heart and Liz goes with him and they live their immortal life on the high seas. I don't think Jack is going to follow the FD around and if the only two people he's ever really cared about leave, he might revert back to his old ways because I think that would really hurt him. But let's say the heart stabbing thing is no longer an issue and Will and Liz marry. They can't go back to Port Royal, so they would have to go somewhere else, possibly live as merchant sailors and then they could continue to be around Jack and he would be able to talk to them and develop a lasting friendship with them.

As of right now, I wouldn't say he has a complete friendship with either of them. He's doing much better with Liz then Will, though, but he will have to make a choice of how close he wants to be to her, and he would have to win back Will's trust almost entirely. He has to be with them longer to be able to have that friendship arc completed.

Captain and Mrs. Dutchman... LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


mmm... yeah it definately depends. The way I see it, if Will and Liz do the immortal thing together, Jack will play some part in bringing that about. So I reckon they'd stay friends, meet up once in a while for an adventure or a drink. But mostly, I'd say Jack would be chasing the horizon, with or without the Dutchmans. Whatever character arc he takes, I don't think it will lead him away from freedom. Make sense?

I definitely would find lots of value and delight in seeing Jack and Elizabeth resolve their friendship, even if Elizabeth is married, into that witty challenging partner of the high seas type feel--- that Jack and she would be able to appreciate each other fully and acknowledge their attraction to each other and their similarities without necessarily making vows. you know? If that were to happen, I'd be fine with Jack's character arc.

I know it was a tough question to answer considering how many variables there are to the story, and I appreciate your attempts to answer.


If the rumors are true, I think Jack has started to repair his relationship with both Will and Elizabeth by the time the whole stabby thing happens.


If Will is indeed wounded and he's too weak to stab the heart on his own, or if Jack, in the midst of battle looks down and happens to see that Will goes down and he brings the heart to Will, then I would say that Jack's character will have already made a huge change.


Jack seems to enjoy the thought of immortality, mentioned once in a deleted scene from CotBP and it's hinted at in the leaked AWE scripts. If Jack is willing to give that up for the sake of Will (or perhaps at Elizabeth's urging?), it would show that Jack is willing to give up a selfish interest of his own for the sake of others.


I think that would be extremely dramatic and interesting. Note that I have no clue what happens in that stabby sequence, so nothing I say is technically spoilerish.


And if Will and Elizabeth do end up married and immortal, I think one of the things they will have learned in this film is that they need to value the sacrifices of others, so I have no doubt that they would go and harrass -- I mean visit -- Jack every chance they get.

I like the idea of Jack saving Will in the "stabby sequence" haha. I can imagine it know...

I can imagine it too...I can also imagine that this scene will be very tense and possibly heart-tearing, if it's true. Everything is pure speculation, of course. So how would it unfold, if it were true?


Will is fighting someone and then...

According to rumor, he's fighting Norrington. They're evenly matched since the writers have said that they've got the same skill with a blade. He sees that Jack has the heart, and is distracted. Perhaps he sees that Jack either falls from the mast, or is about to. Anyway, he's mortally wounded, Jack sees that he's dying, and decides that imortality without honor is not worth it.
So he sacrifices his chance at redemption, makes Will stab the heart, Will becomes the Captain of the Flying Dutchman. Thanks to Will, the Dutchman turns on the ships of the ETTC, and they win the battle.

That still leaves, ELizabeth reaction to the news that Will has been wounded. I imagine, depending on how she leaves things with him that she'll be distraught. I also imagine that since Jack is the one that may have forced Will's hand that he'll be the one to have to tell her. So maybe that would incorporate the rumor that Jack comforts Elizabeth about something distressing.

What about Norrington? How do you think he would fit into all of this?


I can't imagine he'd try to kill Will on purpose, unless there's something else going on...

I hope James will stand on the right side and help Jack,Will,Liz and the others.He is a good guy.

Originally posted by Surreal_44
What about Norrington? How do you think he would fit into all of this?


I can't imagine he'd try to kill Will on purpose, unless there's something else going on...

I might have misunderstood. It might just be that Will is stabbed with Norrington's sword.

Now I feel like I'm missing something. It doesn't seem like it makes sense does it? Especially with Norrington's strength of character, unless he finally goes over the deep end and looses it.

What if the person who started the rumor got it wrong and it's Groves or some other member of the EITC who stabs Will? Some people have a tendency to get the Naval men confused because of the wigs.

maybe its beckett..

Originally posted by Chiki Mina
meaning that she's not being faithful..

No, actually...

Oh, dammit...lesson learned, never trust what other people say, always see for yourself. I kept hearing that the writers say that it was foreshadowing for what Elizabeth would do to save someone she loves, but actually, it's just to save people in general apparently, darn.

However, if you would like to see more of the film that the Tom pic is from, go here where my friend, EC, has put 9 minutes of it up:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=XeERQfgitHU

Originally posted by Kenny16
Oh dear. For the love of everything holy, Jack and Liz is not going to happen, no matter how many flimsy ideas of proof you guys put together!!
*walks off sings "Not Gonna Happen" in a gospel style with a tambourine"
And I'll say it again, cos I know it's winding you up, Jack and Liz is not going to happen. Who here would seriously want to settle down with someone who has killed them?

Guys I'm sorry to disappoint everyone, But Kenny is telling the truth. I believe him. Thank you Kenny for getting the blind off my eyes..I can see clearly now the rain has gone". doh So thats the reason why J/L is not going to happen..SHE KILLED HIM PEOPLE!!. doh Ouch I better stop doing that or I'm going to get a concussion. But how can we all be so blind?? Never have thought of that. Kenny you are the MAN. I thank you for getting me down from my snuggle cloud I rather be disappointed now than later. THANK YOU KENNY!! UR THE MAN
*I almost got blind* *runs away crying*

Originally posted by Ericadawn
No, actually...

Oh, dammit...lesson learned, never trust what other people say, always see for yourself. I kept hearing that the writers say that it was foreshadowing for what Elizabeth would do to save someone she loves, but actually, it's just to save people in general apparently, darn.

However, if you would like to see more of the film that the Tom pic is from, go here where my friend, EC, has put 9 minutes of it up:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=XeERQfgitHU

LOL

Is Elizabeth even honest with herslef

Originally posted by Mistypirate
Guys I'm sorry to disappoint everyone, But Kenny is telling the truth. I believe him. Thank you Kenny for getting the blind off my eyes..I can see clearly now the rain has gone". doh So thats the reason why J/L is not going to happen..SHE KILLED HIM PEOPLE!!. doh Ouch I better stop doing that or I'm going to get a concussion. But how can we all be so blind?? Never have thought of that. Kenny you are the MAN. I thank you for getting me down from my snuggle cloud I rather be disappointed now than later. THANK YOU KENNY!! UR THE MAN
*I almost got blind* *runs away crying*

LMAO MISTY!!

Please come back!! I miss you!! *cries*

MisTy!!!! Come back Love....Miss Ya GiRL!!!

Damnit! Misty!!!!!

Im getting depressed...

Why u getting depressed?

I have to reply really quick I'm at work, I couldn't bare to see you all I wanted to let yous now that I missed u and love u. I'm frigging working almost all the weekends. I'll try to get back later if I can.. Love yous all!

come back soon misty!!!!

Yes come back soon Misty!!! Gotta restore ur faith!!!

*Sits in the corner and hums to herself*

Dudes...I'm putting my fingers in my ears, and sticking pins in my eyes so i don't know what people are saying

If they dont get together then they dont get together...but i'll bet you that we're gonna get a REALLY GOOD pay off if they don't...

I miss Misty...

T.Maria,that siggy is SOOO true!!!

where do u go gravi?? ur on for a min and then gone again...lol

Sorry,I'm on but hidden. You'll never know WHERE I am....shuriken

lol long live Askaninja.com.....

oh i see...i wonder how u do that??? lol

Originally posted by pirate179
oh i see...i wonder how u do that??? lol

'user cp'-'Edit Options' first one on that list.

oh! thanks!!!

Originally posted by Gravitation
T.Maria,that siggy is SOOO true!!! omg i know! i swear im gonna die while looking at JOhnny smile

LOL! Yeah,when I'm 90 I'll have a pic of a smilling Jack in front of me....then I'll die with happy thoughts and a smile on my face. ^^

Originally posted by ivebeendepped43
lol long live Askaninja.com.....

what is that about??confused1

Originally posted by Gravitation
LOL! Yeah,when I'm 90 I'll have a pic of a smilling Jack in front of me....then I'll die with happy thoughts and a smile on my face. ^^

Originally posted by pirate179
what is that about??confused1 gravi posted a ninja smilie and whenever i c a ninja i think of askaninja

oh i see..

hehe

I've realized that people spell my SN in MANY different ways...

like how?? sorry im REALY bored

*starts doing la Macarena*

i LOVE the macarena *joins mina*

yay!! *joins in too*

Originally posted by pirate179
like how?? sorry im REALY bored

Gravvi,Graviy,gravvy,gravi.... Just many diff ways,I might get it changed again though...

lol to what?

Originally posted by Gravitation
Gravvi,Graviy,gravvy,gravi.... Just many diff ways,I might get it changed again though...

I remember you used to be Scch

or Shhh..something like that lol.

it was sccch

most likely my 'Pirates' character, Sammy Sparrow.I've been using her alot lately.

Originally posted by ivebeendepped43
it was sccch

I've used that name for soooo many sites. -_-'

me too! scch... i sometimes wondered how to say it.. and what it meant

she explained one time....

Sch. The first 3 letters of my last name. I just added 2 extra 'c's to make in long enough.

Im thinking about taking the Chiki out. I dunno.

lol....that was funny...not quite sure why...........