Should the Bible be taught in US public schools.

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Alliance
Were you taught the Bible in your public school?

Should the Bible be allowed to be taught in public schools?
If so, how should the Bible be taught in public schools?

BigRed
No I wasn't.

It should be presented as an elective, not mandatory.

And it should be presented in such a way as to allow for individual interpretations.

Symmetric Chaos
Never taught in my school.

Out constitution has a law that seperates the Church and the State.
The Bible also says to "Give Caesar what is his and God what is his".

Basicly as far as I'm concerned my religion and the laws that I live under both call for religious education and schooling to be seperated.

Shakyamunison
No.

If someone wishes to learn about the bible, there are lots of privet schools at there that will teach the bible.

I don't want to pay for it with my tax money.

Storm
An understanding of the Bible, like an understanding of other ancient mythologies, will help students better understand literature, art, and history.

However, when abused as a forum for Christian proselytization, no.

Capt_Fantastic
The bible shouldn't be taught in any school. EVER. Period.

Religion has no place being taught in public schools. I went to private catholic school, so I had to endure it. (Which was actually the best thing. It gave me the chance to see it for what it was, a bunch of fairy tales that had been blown way out of proportion.) But as soon as the bible is taught, then you'd have to teach Islam and Hinduism, etc. So, religion is best left to the parents and family, outside of school.

Alliance
I was taught the Bible both in High School and repeatedly in college, never in a religious studies class.

Teaching the Bible in Public schools is perfectly legal, as long as it is taught, not preached.

In many ways, I think having the Bible taught in public schools is and could be beneficial. Keep in mind, this is not teaching the bible is fact, its teaching it as the literary, cultural, and historical text that it is.

BigRed
As an elective though, that allows for people to have the "option" of taking it. Not "having" to take it.

And in that sense, I don't see why it be a problem.

Although, I just remembered, they do offer a Bible class at my school and I'll be taking it.

jasonk3
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Never taught in my school.

Out constitution has a law that seperates the Church and the State.
The Bible also says to "Give Caesar what is his and God what is his".

Basicly as far as I'm concerned my religion and the laws that I live under both call for religious education and schooling to be seperated.

Co-signed...religion should be kept to churches, mosque's, synagoges etc...

Alliance
Originally posted by jasonk3
Co-signed...religion should be kept to churches, mosque's, synagoges etc... Because the Bible is a religous text, does that mean teaching it teaches religion?

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by Alliance
Because the Bible is a religous text, does that mean teaching it teaches religion?

Teaching the message of the Bible teaches religion.

Teaching about religion as a subject is fine as far as I'm concerned. However it makes people uncomfortable and imay do better if its optional.

jasonk3
Originally posted by Alliance
Because the Bible is a religous text, does that mean teaching it teaches religion?

I dont mind teaching religion...hmmm...you raised an interesting point ...I have to think this over

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Alliance
Because the Bible is a religous text, does that mean teaching it teaches religion?

Yes.

Capt_Fantastic
Originally posted by Alliance
I was taught the Bible both in High School and repeatedly in college, never in a religious studies class.

Teaching the Bible in Public schools is perfectly legal, as long as it is taught, not preached.

In many ways, I think having the Bible taught in public schools is and could be beneficial. Keep in mind, this is not teaching the bible is fact, its teaching it as the literary, cultural, and historical text that it is.

But, don't you think that would all depend on who was teaching it? Can that teacher remain totally objective and impartial to what they're teaching, rather than preaching about? Which I totally don't understand. What's the difference between teaching and preaching, at least in this case?

JacopeX
Originally posted by Alliance
Were you taught the Bible in your public school?

Should the Bible be allowed to be taught in public schools?
If so, how should the Bible be taught in public schools? It should be a course, such as an elective. Yes I believe it should be taught in schools for thoese who are religious to learn it. They should gain that permission from there parents though.

I was taught religion and it was mandatory, in Peru. If you didnt take it, you fail.

TRH
No,not until high school where they take an elective called religion where you study everything,certainly not to little ones

Alliance
Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
But, don't you think that would all depend on who was teaching it? Can that teacher remain totally objective and impartial to what they're teaching, rather than preaching about?

Isn't that the position any teacher should take?

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Which I totally don't understand. What's the difference between teaching and preaching, at least in this case?

I guess it depends on how you define it. I've been taught the Bible both as literature, as history, and as philosophy. I don't mean to teach the mythological aspects of the bible as fact. Literatrure is the easiest, philosophy is the hardest because you get into morality.

Certainly it would be beneficial to get people who actually think they follow the bible to critically examine it and to do so from an outside perspective.

fini
Hmm, that would not be fair to other religions

Here in Trinidad , in public schools, they have Religious Education, and what it is, is classes sorted by religion. SO catholics have one( or 3 depending on amount of students) class, muslims, hindus( have 2), 7day adventist, pentecostal, Jehovah Witness etc.

Alliance
How would it not be fair? We are not teaching religion, we are teaching a text.

Capt_Fantastic
Originally posted by Alliance
Isn't that the position any teacher should take?

I don't think so. I don't think it would be applicable.

Originally posted by Alliance
I guess it depends on how you define it. I've been taught the Bible both as literature, as history, and as philosophy. I don't mean to teach the mythological aspects of the bible as fact. Literatrure is the easiest, philosophy is the hardest because you get into morality.

Certainly it would be beneficial to get people who actually think they follow the bible to critically examine it and to do so from an outside perspective.

Sure, I can understand how the bible can be used as a tool to define morality. It's a long stretch and you can pretty much eliminate the old testament as any sort of morality guide, but it is possible.

As a philospohy, the bible can be stretched after it's been edited.

As liturature it's not really important for the same reason other books have been considered important. If it hadn't been about god, it wouldn't have been flying off the shelves the way it has for teh last thousand years.

As history, it's totally wrong and misleading on top of unsubstantiated.

If the bible were to be taught, the Jefferson bible should be used. Thomas Jefferson basically edited the bible, well the new testament, by removing all divine aspects to the character of Jesus and making it a true morality guide. (But, people will still argue this nation was established as a christian nation...despite people like Jefferson saying that Christianity would eventually go the way of the ancient religions)

Black Dalek
If Bible was taught in public schools, then other religions will protest that their religion is taught to. Koran, Buddhism, or even *gulp* Scientology. We don't want that do we?

CosmicSurfer
Good question, the answer is simply no.

If you read the bill of rights, our founding fathers specifically said that government has no authority to *LEAD* any religion to the people.

It is simply on behalf of the individual's personal responsibility. As a parent, it is your responsibility to teach your children on whatever you believe in, not the govenment's.

Lord Urizen
I read this in the Time Magazine Article...I was gonna make this thread, but Alliance beat me to it mad



My answer is yes. As long as the Bible is taught, not preached, then it doesn't violate the Constitution.



The Bible, the Quran, the Lotus Sutra, the Vedas Books of Wisdom, Buddha's teachings, etc. should all be taught.


People should be made aware of the details and history of other people's religions. It should also be taught as objectively as possible.


People should be allowed to decide for themselves what to beleive, after being taught everything there is to know in terms of ancient and current human knowledge and history.

Lord Urizen
Honestly though, I notice that many of you are afraid that being taught about the Bible, and being compelled to actually read the Bible will brainwash young children/teenagers into becoming Christians, without giving them the chance to decide for themselves....


Have you ever considered that maybe if more people READ the Bible, they would be better able to make up thier minds ?


According to Time Magazine, a servey was taken which revealed that 44% of Evangelical Teenagers do NOT know that much about the Bible...these 44 % cannot name the Gospels, nor do they know the difference between the Book of Genesis and the Book of Revelations !!!!!


Ironic , No ?


Devout people of a religion who do not even know thier own text....



The TRIGGER which turned me OFF to Christianity was ACTUALLY READING THE BIBLE....


Before I actually started doing Bible reading, I beleived that Christianity was flawless, I beleived that this God was all good, I beleived in Jesus, etc. Without any true doubts.


Once I started actually READING the damn Bible, I turned away....I got to know the basis of my religion, and found that I did not personally agree with it.



Beleive it or not, many Conservative Christians do not actually read the Bible !!!


They just rant a bunch of crap thier parents and teachers preached them, without question, and don't even know the majority of what thier religious text states.


My catholic High School actually avoided the subject of Hell....entirely....did not even mention it. They avoided teaching MANY MANY MANY things about the Bible....


IGNORANCE is the TRUE PROBLEM....KNOWLEDGE is the ONLY WAY to actual FREEDOM.....



Everyone should be taught about the Bible....everyone should be taught about EVERYTHING...the Quran...the Vedas Books of Wisdom....Lotus Sutra...Buddhism....Evolution....scientology...EVERYTHING



Only then do you have the true freedom to make up your own mind....

Atlantis001
No, preaching should be limitated to the churches. However there could be a discipline to teach the philosophical aspect of religion including the paradoxes but not like a christian oriented discipline.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Atlantis001
No, preaching should be limitated to the churches. However there could be a discipline to teach the philosophical aspect of religion including the paradoxes but not like a christian oriented discipline.

You can't trust humans to do the right thing. Someone will always abuse the system.

xmarksthespot
If it was offered as an elective, and taught as a literary and cultural subject along the same vein as Classics or English Literature then I don't see too much of a problem with it. But then I'd expect other studies of religious texts to be offered as well, as well as broader philosophical studies.

Nellinator
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You can't trust humans to do the right thing. Someone will always abuse the system. Same with most other subjects. Perhaps we should simply get rid of public school altogether and let private schools do it all meanwhile depriving poor kids of a good education.

Bible studies aren't offered in any public secondary schools in Canada that I can think of which is odd considering that Canadian public education is generally better and better subsidized than American public school... what xmark said.

Regret
Originally posted by Alliance
Were you taught the Bible in your public school?No, but then I only went to public school through 8th grade. Early graduate and all.Originally posted by Alliance
Should the Bible be allowed to be taught in public schools?
If so, how should the Bible be taught in public schools? Yes, it should be taught along with all other religion in an eclectic theology class. Theology is an enormous elephant in all of history, to not teach a religions class is like saying general physics exists, is wonderful, but we won't be studying it because there is some controversy over which physicist was the best, but we will be studying astrophysics. Religion is too big a concept with too much impact to ignore in the education system, an eclectic approach is necessary, imo.

Alliance
Originally posted by Regret
No, but then I only went to public school through 8th grade. Early graduate and all. Yes, it should be taught along with all other religion in an eclectic theology class.

How could you consciously cover global religion in a class?...not only EVERY religion, but how that religion has changed over time, including athiesm and agnocsticism of course.

lord xyz
Originally posted by Alliance
Were you taught the Bible in your public school?

Should the Bible be allowed to be taught in public schools?
If so, how should the Bible be taught in public schools? I was taught the Bible in my Primary school, but not as fact, more as something I must know and I should use to better myself. I find it ridiculous, and it shouldn't be taught in schools. Something like this should be taught in the home.

lord xyz
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Honestly though, I notice that many of you are afraid that being taught about the Bible, and being compelled to actually read the Bible will brainwash young children/teenagers into becoming Christians, without giving them the chance to decide for themselves....


Have you ever considered that maybe if more people READ the Bible, they would be better able to make up thier minds ?


According to Time Magazine, a servey was taken which revealed that 44% of Evangelical Teenagers do NOT know that much about the Bible...these 44 % cannot name the Gospels, nor do they know the difference between the Book of Genesis and the Book of Revelations !!!!!


Ironic , No ?


Devout people of a religion who do not even know thier own text....



The TRIGGER which turned me OFF to Christianity was ACTUALLY READING THE BIBLE....


Before I actually started doing Bible reading, I beleived that Christianity was flawless, I beleived that this God was all good, I beleived in Jesus, etc. Without any true doubts.


Once I started actually READING the damn Bible, I turned away....I got to know the basis of my religion, and found that I did not personally agree with it.



Beleive it or not, many Conservative Christians do not actually read the Bible !!!


They just rant a bunch of crap thier parents and teachers preached them, without question, and don't even know the majority of what thier religious text states.


My catholic High School actually avoided the subject of Hell....entirely....did not even mention it. They avoided teaching MANY MANY MANY things about the Bible....


IGNORANCE is the TRUE PROBLEM....KNOWLEDGE is the ONLY WAY to actual FREEDOM.....



Everyone should be taught about the Bible....everyone should be taught about EVERYTHING...the Quran...the Vedas Books of Wisdom....Lotus Sutra...Buddhism....Evolution....scientology...EVERYTHING



Only then do you have the true freedom to make up your own mind.... Why bother? You shouldn't make people choose a religion. Religion should be chosen outside of school in one's own time. That's pretty much how people become religious.

Templares
For me, the Bible, the Koran and other religious text should only be discussed - in brief - in a History class. I also dont want any religious text to be studied in depth in my Literary class, save maybe a passing reference to its literary merits and historical importance.

Regret
Originally posted by Alliance
How could you consciously cover global religion in a class?...not only EVERY religion, but how that religion has changed over time, including athiesm and agnocsticism of course. Extremely general overview, high school courses do not provide much information most times, this wouldn't be an exception. It would merely introduce the subject.

General current beliefs, general very quick overview of history, general influences on and by religion throughout history, etc. Your question seems to imply the need for a more thorough examination of the subject at the high school level, such should be and is available at the university level.

Capt_Fantastic
Originally posted by Alliance
How could you consciously cover global religion in a class?...not only EVERY religion, but how that religion has changed over time, including athiesm and agnocsticism of course.

How should he know? He graduated "schools" after the 8th grade? Likely because his parents thought he might entertain an independant thought that doesn't center around god and baby Jesus.

FeceMan
Yes, it should be taught as an optional course, though other religions should probably be included as well.

AngryManatee
In my old highschool we learned about many of the different religions in my world history class. I see this as really the only feasible way of doing it, since it was from an analytical perspective and was not meant to persuade people towards one religion or another. To select only one would be discriminitory against the others.

The big EH
it should not be taught, because of it being fictional, and tEACHING IT REALLY EARLY ON WOULD BE ALMOST BRAINWASHING THE KIDS (sorry for caps lok)

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by The big EH
it should not be taught, because of it being fictional

It can still be taught as literature.

The big EH
good point

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
It can still be taught as literature.

No, not as long as some people believe in the bible literally.

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
No, not as long as some people believe in the bible literally.

It still gets brought up in discussions of literature in current highschools (mainly allusions to it in various texts)

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
It still gets brought up in discussions of literature in current highschools (mainly allusions to it in various texts)

I'm not against the bible as a work of Literature. I am against the fundamentalists that are plaguing the US.

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I'm not against the bible as a work of Literature. I am against the fundamentalists that are plaguing the US.

As am I.

RedAlertv2
It should be studied as literature, and be an elective class.

Any athiest should be able to admit that the Bible is a huge part of our culture. Understanding it is very useful.

Alliance
Why can't we teach the bible as history and as cultural too? And maybe it should be mandatory.

FeceMan
For the same reason that people can't get it through their heads that fundamentalism doesn't mean extremism.

Actually, those have two entirely different reasons, but I thought I'd bring it up.

Alliance
Oh we've seen how they've been intrinsically linked.

And since fundamentalism has been married to the extremist movement in US Christianinty since the 1920s, I'd say they're pretty similar in the context some have been using.

AngryManatee
lol another way for it to e taught in schools could be for skeet shooting.

Black Dalek
Hey! Let's teach kids Scientology!

TRH
ok

Alliance
There is more to the Bible than Religious dogma...its the most significant religious text in the US, if not the world.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Alliance
There is more to the Bible than Religious dogma...its the most significant religious text in the US, if not the world.

Yes, there are also some really great fight sense. cool

Nellinator
Seriously though, they should remake 300 with the 300 mighty men under Gideon as it would be an equally sweet movie.

Alliance
Or since the Bible lacks all the cultural elegance of Sparta, it would suck. Honestly, ancient Jewish culture is drier than any desert.

Nellinator
I don't know about that, I kinda like it. But then again I used to Jewish... The Book of Enoch is cool, you'd probably like that and Samson, and the Philistines, fighting the Assyrians and don't forget the siege of Jerusalem by Rome that had cannibalism in the city and so many people were crucified that the Romans started to run out of wood for siege equipment. It has got its bright spots.

Alliance
Yes. Romans are mentioned. smile

Nellinator
I figured that would work.

Strangelove
Absolutely not. The various reasons I believe this have already been expressed.

Alliance
Except I totally don't see it as a breach between Church and State. The Church is nowhere near the State. The bible is a product of the Church, and no less a product than some students that are already in the classroom.

chithappens
Ok, honestly I haven't read any of the thread and I'm not about 2 for this reply: No.

Everyone doesn't believe the Bible. The Bible is contradictory is various spots.

I.E. "Lax Talionis" and "turn the other cheek."

Just no

CosmicSurfer
Why are we still discussing this?

Look, let me be clear on this topic once and for all:

No court, state or federal, says you *can't* pray in government schools.

What it does say is that no government employee(teachers in this case) has the right to *LEAD* prayers or religious beliefs upon students in a government operated institution. It is not their responsibility nor should it ever would be. It is unconstitutional and for very good reason too.

Learning the Bible, Koran, Torah or whatever rests upon solely the INDIVIDUAL.

END. OF. DISCUSSION.

chithappens
Originally posted by Alliance
The bible is a product of the Church, and no less a product than some students that are already in the classroom.

Mind re-wording that? If you meant it exactly that way then, yea...

Besides the Danger Argument is enough to normally sweep this idea under the rug.

Weird arguments for it...

Alliance
No. Its not the end of the discussion. Some schools, including my former High School, have it as part of the cirriculum.

Nellinator
Things that are culturally significant should be taught as culture. The Bible is a major part of culture, so is the Koran so they should both be covered. It doesn't have to be in great detail, but the basics are important to understand.

I've been thinking about this and I definitely think that the above two should be covered, but I have doubts as to whether religions that lack cultural impact and are more subdued and philosophical should be taught as they lack relevance to the society. Thoughts?

Ultimately if it is to be taught there needs to be a strict cirriculm with clear objectives that don't leave room for preachiness or bashing. That is the main problem I'm afraid though.

Alliance
I made this thread specifically discussing US schools for a reason. The Quran does not have a real presnce in the US. The Bible is one of the most significant cultural and literary works in the Western world and in the US.

I can assure you that it can be taught without preaching from presonal experience and it helps a lot of people see what the bible actually is and not what they are told it is.

CosmicSurfer
Originally posted by Alliance
No. Its not the end of the discussion. Some schools, including my former High School, have it as part of the cirriculum.

You kidding me? Where are you from really? Is your school private? If so, then that would be something else entirely, a whole other case.

But no *public* school has the right to teach religion. To do so goes against the constitution and is illegal.

Alliance
I'm from Chicago. I went to a public school.

A public school does not have the right to preach religion, but they have both the right to teach what religion is and to teach its holy texts.

Nothing done here was unconstitutional. As an athiest, I'd be very sensitive to that.

chithappens
Originally posted by Alliance
I made this thread specifically discussing US schools for a reason. The Quran does not have a real presnce in the US. The Bible is one of the most significant cultural and literary works in the Western world and in the US.

I can assure you that it can be taught without preaching from presonal experience and it helps a lot of people see what the bible actually is and not what they are told it is.

There are various issues with what you said there, but here are the most obvious:

- The Bible can not be taught without avoiding some sort of personal interpretation. Everyone does not follow the Bible the same way.

How is the Bible to be taught?

- Also, saying the Quran has no real presence, first is an a$$hole thing to say and brings up the "Danger Argument."

CosmicSurfer
Originally posted by Alliance
I'm from Chicago. I went to a public school.

A public school does not have the right to preach religion, but they have both the right to teach what religion is and to teach its holy texts.



You mean to study and analyze it like any other Literature, not trying to install beliefs upon students? Is this what you mean? Then you have an interesting point.

But preaching is one form of teaching. Wouldn't you agree?

Nellinator
Teaching it as literature would be similar to teaching Shakespeare and is pointless. Teaching it culturally is what it should be. Preaching and teaching are different in a few ways, one way being the expectation following preaching in that you act on and believe what you have learned because you think it is relevant. Teaching would be something like "Christians believe that Jesus dying on the cross was the fulfillment of the OT lawand the Jewish Passover in that he is considered the perfect sacrifice to atone for our sins." That is teaching as no expectations are attached to it. Teaching is useful in churches yes, but belief is a necessary precursor to its effectiveness.

chithappens
Originally posted by Nellinator
Teaching it as literature would be similar to teaching Shakespeare and is pointless. Teaching it culturally is what it should be. Preaching and teaching are different in a few ways, one way being the expectation following preaching in that you act on and believe what you have learned because you think it is relevant. Teaching would be something like "Christians believe that Jesus dying on the cross was the fulfillment of the OT lawand the Jewish Passover in that he is considered the perfect sacrifice to atone for our sins." That is teaching as no expectations are attached to it. Teaching is useful in churches yes, but belief is a necessary precursor to its effectiveness.

While I agree to some extents, not everyone thinks the same thing. Put it like this: if there was a federal law saying that religious text should be "taught to students" the biggest interest group gets their view of whatever text to be taught. That's my only issue with it, but sadly it's a big issue

Alliance
Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
You mean to study and analyze it like any other Literature, not trying to install beliefs upon students? Is this what you mean? Then you have an interesting point.

Thats exactly what I mean.

Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
But preaching is one form of teaching. Wouldn't you agree?

Not at all. Preaching is a combination of telling and indoctrination. Teaching involves the encouragement of critical analysis.

Originally posted by Nellinator
Teaching it as literature would be similar to teaching Shakespeare and is pointless.

Not at all. As someone who has studied it as literature. It has a lot of value. Its literary merits form the foundation of Western culture. You wouldn't be able to understand the culture if you didn't understand the text.

chithappens
Originally posted by Alliance
You wouldn't be able to understand the culture if you didn't understand the text.

Mind giving an example of why it's essential to understanding the culture? Even if you mean to say the West, I don't think you have to understand hardly anything about the Bible to understand the culture.

History and revolutions, maybe, but certainly it's not important to understanding modern culture.

Nellinator
Originally posted by Alliance
Not at all. As someone who has studied it as literature. It has a lot of value. Its literary merits form the foundation of Western culture. You wouldn't be able to understand the culture if you didn't understand the text. What I'm getting at is that teaching it as literature is in part okay as it is a literary masterpiece imo (Psalm), but if you are teaching it only as literature and not as culture you are missing a great part of what it is from a secular standpoint. If it is being only taught as literature there is no question that it is not a bad thing imo as much of its literary value can be taught without ever touching theology.

Alliance
Originally posted by chithappens
Mind giving an example of why it's essential to understanding the culture? Even if you mean to say the West, I don't think you have to understand hardly anything about the Bible to understand the culture.

History and revolutions, maybe, but certainly it's not important to understanding modern culture.

Then all I can say is you have a very limited view of what culture is.

Originally posted by Nellinator
What I'm getting at is that teaching it as literature is in part okay as it is a literary masterpiece imo (Psalm), but if you are teaching it only as literature and not as culture you are missing a great part of what it is from a secular standpoint. If it is being only taught as literature there is no question that it is not a bad thing imo as much of its literary value can be taught without ever touching theology.

Not every aspect of everything must be addressed in every class. It would be impossible to teach a complete view of ANY subject. It literary aspects are quite interesting and its absurdly easy to see how stories like Cain and Abel (my personal favorite), Genesis, The ressurection, the crucifiction, Moses, etc have dramatic effects on culture. There is no clear line between literature and culture becuase literature is part of culture.

I never said that it should only be taught in terms of literature. I disagreed with your statement that teaching the Bible as literature would be "pointless."

chithappens
You can EASILY understand culture without religion. You don't even say what culture: all culture, pop culture? Be more specific. You are not even explaining what you mean to say. I'm not a mind reader. You don't even say what you think culture is and yes it matters.

Nellinator
North American culture is actual quite specific. Religion is a major player in North America and affects almost everything you do, including the laws that you are supposed to follow. That is why it is so very culturally relevant. What are there 50 million church goers in the United States? That's a massive chunk of the population. The option of choosing to learn about these 50 million people should be there imo.

Alliance
Originally posted by chithappens
You can EASILY understand culture without religion. You don't even say what culture: all culture, pop culture? Be more specific. You are not even explaining what you mean to say. I'm not a mind reader. You don't even say what you think culture is and yes it matters.

US culture.Originally posted by Nellinator
North American culture is actual quite specific. Religion is a major player in North America and affects almost everything you do, including the laws that you are supposed to follow. That is why it is so very culturally relevant. What are there 50 million church goers in the United States? That's a massive chunk of the population. The option of choosing to learn about these 50 million people should be there imo.


...and an even greater percentage historically. However, I'd say the majority of Chirstians in the US know very little about the Bible or the history of their religion. I think it is the duty of the US public education system to teach students of this nations' Christian, religious, and non-religious histories and philosophies and how it has impacted our lives historically, in the present, and in the future (the foundation of any hummanities class)

BackFire
Sure, teach it in Fiction class where it belongs, as a group of stories and nothing more.

chithappens
Originally posted by Nellinator
North American culture is actual quite specific. Religion is a major player in North America and affects almost everything you do, including the laws that you are supposed to follow. That is why it is so very culturally relevant.

My point is there is no universal understanding of ANY religion, certainly not in this country so that makes any teaching void.

While you can say that religion provides guidelines by which people live, I can't agree that one can not understand the culture without religion. If I have a basic understand of the morals of a culture then that's enough. I don't need to know the stories of the Bible to understand that.

Also, I think we all know it is way too optimistic to believe that Christian interest groups would support teach of the Bible AND the Qur'an. It's not so black and white. Some other religion would feel left out and want in and so on. There would be a cut off point, someone is pissed.
So then the argument is it ok to leave them out simple because they are a minority?

Capt_Fantastic
Originally posted by Nellinator
North American culture is actual quite specific. Religion is a major player in North America and affects almost everything you do, including the laws that you are supposed to follow. That is why it is so very culturally relevant. What are there 50 million church goers in the United States? That's a massive chunk of the population. The option of choosing to learn about these 50 million people should be there imo.

This has got to be one of the most absurd posts you've made.

Lord Urizen
If more people actually READ the Bible, and knew the History of the Church, they would know more about the basis of Christianity and would be better able to make any decision in regard to the religion.



Isolating someone from a religion is just as bad as forcing it upon others. You should NOT force anyone to be Atheist, the same way you should not force anyone to be Christian, by isolating them from the subject or by shoving the Bible down thier throat.


Most Christians, beleive it or not, are not aware of the fact that thier Bible indirectly promotes violence and close mindedness...

Many Christians who focus on forgiveness aren't even aware that the Bible ALSO promotes punishment and judgement....


If more people knew these things...if the Bible was EXPOSED for what it truly is.....trust me....things would be much better. People would make much better decisions...

A person who is against violence, judgement, and hypocrisy would most likely turn away from the Bible.


A person who is true to the ideals of judgement, "justice", service, tradition, and uniform culture may find the Bible is truly thiers to treasure...

At least decisions would be based on the entirely of the Bible, with a fuller and more experience view on the matter, than just by Blind Faith or Blind bias.

Adam_PoE

Alliance
I don't think we are a "Christian nation" but Christianity dominates our conception of everything in this nation.

Keep in mind that "no affiliation" does not mean "no religion" or athiest/agnostic.

Lord Urizen

Alliance
You also forgot that Americans don't know tha much about the bible.

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by Alliance
You also forgot that Americans don't know tha much about the bible.


That too

Nellinator

chithappens
Originally posted by Alliance
I don't think we are a "Christian nation" but Christianity dominates our conception of everything in this nation.

Keep in mind that "no affiliation" does not mean "no religion" or athiest/agnostic.

And you don't see that as a bit of a reach?

chithappens
Originally posted by Alliance
You also forgot that Americans don't know tha much about the bible.

That should say most people, rather than simply Americans

Alliance
I disucuss what I feel I have a basis to. This thread is about Biblical education in the US. Look at the title.

I hate to exclude foreign discussion, but it helps to keep topics relevant.

Lord Urizen
The Bible should be taught so people can see it for what it really is....a large collection of contradicting wisdom and bullshit....

Most people who have an unquestioning devout regard to the Bible don't actually read it.....

TRH
Originally posted by chithappens
That should say most people, rather than simply Americans no

TRH
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
The Bible should be taught so people can see it for what it really is....a large collection of contradicting wisdom and bullshit....

Most people who have an unquestioning devout regard to the Bible don't actually read it..... no is should not,it should be taught from a neutral point of view

Bardock42
There should be Philosophical/Religious education....obviously.

Robtard
Originally posted by Bardock42
There should be Philosophical/Religious education....obviously.

Agreed and it should cover several or at least the "world" religions as most people today do not have a clue.

TRH
Originally posted by Bardock42
There should be Philosophical/Religious education....obviously. your back

chithappens
Originally posted by Bardock42
There should be Philosophical/Religious education....obviously.

College, this I agree with. K-12, no. There is no neutral teaching of religion. Even if I learn about a philosophical paradigm I don't agree with, there's no way to just say "This is what it is. Don't think about it! Don't even pay any mind if it directly makes what you believe seem questionable."

And TRH, there's no way to say that people, as a majoirty, outside of America have a much better understanding of the Bible. Most people are just idiots, PERIOD. That don't mind not giving a damn and just being find with what they were given because that's what makes them comfortable.

The world would be a much different place if people, as a majority, understood what they say they believe and actually applied it in their actions.

TRH
Originally posted by chithappens
College, this I agree with. K-12, no. There is no neutral teaching of religion. Even if I learn about a philosophical paradigm I don't agree with, there's no way to just say "This is what it is. Don't think about it! Don't even pay any mind if it directly makes what you believe seem questionable."

And TRH, there's no way to say that people, as a majoirty, outside of America have a much better understanding of the Bible. Most people are just idiots, PERIOD. That don't mind not giving a damn and just being find with what they were given because that's what makes them comfortable.

The world would be a much different place if people, as a majority, understood what they say they believe and actually applied it in their actions. Thats not the point this thread is talking about americans

chithappens
Originally posted by TRH
Thats not the point this thread is talking about americans

And yet you commented on it so I decided to retort.

lil bitchiness
Originally posted by Storm
An understanding of the Bible, like an understanding of other ancient mythologies, will help students better understand literature, art, and history.

However, when abused as a forum for Christian proselytization, no.

I agree. Only in the matter of history art and literature.

If Bible is to be thought, then should Tanakh, Qur'an, Tipitaka, and Vedas.

chithappens
Which is why I say it should be given as a college course rather than a mandatory course in K-12.

It's not that I think people should not know about other beliefs besides their own but I don't trust the individual to not bastardize the text. It could happen in college also, but a person is likely more mature and able to make distinctions in bullshit by the time they reach college.

TRH
Originally posted by chithappens
And yet you commented on it so I decided to retort. yes i did

FeceMan
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
The Bible should be taught so people can see it for what it really is....a large collection of contradicting wisdom and bullshit....

Most people who have an unquestioning devout regard to the Bible don't actually read it.....
You're an idiot.

(I was going to come up with a witty retort, but I decided not to waste my time.)

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by FeceMan
You're an idiot.

(I was going to come up with a witty retort, but I decided not to waste my time.)

If you are just going to call people names, maybe you should go do something else. Being on the Internet may not be for you.

chithappens
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If you are just going to call people names, maybe you should go do something else. Being on the Internet may not be for you.

I agree with you but I agree with the 'idiot' comment.

I'm so torn laughing

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by FeceMan
You're an idiot.

(I was going to come up with a witty retort, but I decided not to waste my time.)


The surveys do not lie...go look it up yourself: 40% of Evangelicals don't know that much about the Bible. Most of these 40% cannot name the first book of the Bible, nor can they name the Gospels in order.


That's quite alarming, but at the same time hilarious

TRH
do you hav a link

Lord Urizen
I'll find one for you.


I did not find this information online..the latest issue of Time Magazine reveals this info....look it up if you have time.

TRH
I have it what page

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by TRH
I have it what page


i think its page 40...the cover shows the Bible and the cover is based on this issue of this thread....

Alliance
What an amazing discovery erm

TRH
tis not on page 40 mad

Alliance
Hell there was an article in Newsweek a few weeks ago too.

chithappens
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Most of these 40% cannot name the first book of the Bible





jawdrop

Bardock42
Originally posted by TRH
tis not on page 40 mad

It is the cover story...you'll figure it out.

JacopeX
Originally posted by TRH
No,not until high school where they take an elective called religion where you study everything,certainly not to little ones I'm pretty sure teens know what they want to choose as an elective to learn from. wink

JacopeX
Originally posted by Black Dalek
If Bible was taught in public schools, then other religions will protest that their religion is taught to. Koran, Buddhism, or even *gulp* Scientology. We don't want that do we? Scientology?

:slaps:

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by JacopeX
Scientology?

:slaps:


Catholicism ?


:slaps:

Alliance
Originally posted by JacopeX
I'm pretty sure teens know what they want to choose as an elective to learn from. wink

What if it is mandatory?

JacopeX
Originally posted by Alliance
What if it is mandatory? In this country's education system? Yea, ok. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Alliance
Wake up. I've already said it was mandatory at my high school.

JacopeX
Originally posted by Alliance
Wake up. I've already said it was mandatory at my high school. Im talking about the U.S. Not your country. But in other countries, it is mandatory yes, Because countries originate with a religious past. In South America for example, has a 95% population of catholics that are willing to teach and pass t he word of The Virgin Mary, Jesus Christ, and Jehova.

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by JacopeX
Im talking about the U.S. Not your country. But in other countries, it is mandatory yes, Because countries originate with a religious past. In South America for example, has a 95% population of catholics that are willing to teach and pass t he word of The Virgin Mary, Jesus Christ, and Jehova.



1) Alliance is from United States


2) Christianity has raped South America....especially Peru. Do you even know about Manco Copa ? The Legend of Lake Titicaca ? The glory of the Incan Empire and everything they achieved ?


Do you know how Catholic Spaniards stole Peruvian Gold ? Do you know your country was so much richer and more prosperous before Christianity reared its ugly head ?


Do you know that Catholic Spaniards melted Golden Incan treasures, relics of splended Incan History, and transformed them into blocks ?



Most of KMC is ignorant of Peru and its history, but NOT ME Jacope. I am also Peruvian by blood, and I cannot forget the conquest of Christianity and destruction of our Ancient culture.

JacopeX
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
1) Alliance is from United States


2) Christianity has raped South America....especially Peru. Do you even know about Manco Copa ? The Legend of Lake Titicaca ? The glory of the Incan Empire and everything they achieved ?


Do you know how Catholic Spaniards stole Peruvian Gold ? Do you know your country was so much richer and more prosperous before Christianity reared its ugly head ?


Do you know that Catholic Spaniards melted Golden Incan treasures, relics of splended Incan History, and transformed them into blocks ?



Most of KMC is ignorant of Peru and its history, but NOT ME Jacope. I am also Peruvian by blood, and I cannot forget the conquest of Christianity and destruction of our Ancient culture. 1) Ok.

2) Yes, I have studied it all, but how does history have to make you question christianity if it is belived by faith. Raped? Coming from an atheist, it comes without a shock to hear that word when it comes to religion.roll eyes (sarcastic) I've been to those places aswell were the incans settled and it was an interesting place to be in with all the mysteries you find out.

3) Yes I know it all, but I pay attention more to the spaniards then to the rise of the CATHOLIC religion. We believed in the sun before.

Dont think I dont know anything. I know alot more about the conquest of Fransisco Pizarro and the conquistadores. They have taken all of our riches, and gave us the word of religion. But how is that brainwashing if it was a choice we made. If Atahualpa wanted to make a sacrifice for the religion of the sun, then he would of stayed that way and died for hisi ncan tribe. I wouldve done it for the whole tribe. For the faith I have for a religion I prospure. But of course, you would not understand that. I know how powerless and defensless the Incans were against the spanish. These are one of the reasons why I dont like the Spanish. not only that, there are many things through history they caused damage.

Look up "Faith".

chithappens
The West did it to every culture.

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by JacopeX
1) Ok.

2) Yes, I have studied it all, but how does history have to make you question christianity if it is belived by faith. Raped? Coming from an atheist, it comes without a shock to hear that word when it comes to religion.roll eyes (sarcastic) I've been to those places aswell were the incans settled and it was an interesting place to be in with all the mysteries you find out.

3) Yes I know it all, but I pay attention more to the spaniards then to the rise of the CATHOLIC religion. We believed in the sun before.

Dont think I dont know shit. I know alot more about the conquest of Fransisco Pizarro and the conquistadores. They have taken all of our riches, and gave us te word of religion. But how is that brainwashing if it was a choice we made. If Atahualpa wanted to make a sacrifice for the religion of the sun, then he would of stayed that way and died for hisi ncan tribe. I wouldve done it for the whole tribe. For the faith I have for a religion I prospure. But of course, you would not understand that. I know how powerless and defensless the Incans were against the spanish. These are one of the reasons why I dont like the Spanish. not only that, there are many things through history they caused damage.

Look up "Faith".




The Incan tribes were forced to become Catholic because they were over powered by the Spaniards.


You ever hear of Tupac Amaru ?


No...not the rapper, the man he was named after....he was killed by Catholic Spaniards, because of his refusal to submit to the Spaniards....refusal to become a servant, and refusal to become Christian...


The INCANS DID FIGHT BACK...they simply LOST THE FIGHT.


Inti, the sun god, was simply replaced by the character you know as Jehova....don't be a fool Jacope....


Incans did not CHOOSE to submit and change thier religion. They HAD to change, because it was either submit or DIE....thier numbers were running to low.


The children of these fallen Incas were then taught Christianity, and were forced to speak Spanish....to speak the Incan Language of Cechua was considered a social atrocity, as well as to refer to any of the Peruvian Legends....




Bottom Line: CHRISTIANITY WAS SPREAD BY THE SWORD....NOT BY PEACE, NOT BY ANY POSITIVE MEANS


You claim you aren't Ignorant ?


Then you must know this.....you have Faith, because that's how you were RAISED.....Peru is a Catholic Nation...that's no secret. However, because the people in power were Catholic, and because Catholicism is a mandatory cirriculum in Peru, that is why you are all Catholic...not by CHOICE, but by nurture....so yes...that IS brainwashing.

JacopeX
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
The Incan tribes were forced to become Catholic because they were over powered by the Spaniards.


You ever hear of Tupac Amaru ?


No...not the rapper, the man he was named after....he was killed by Catholic Spaniards, because of his refusal to submit to the Spaniards....refusal to become a servant, and refusal to become Christian...


The INCANS DID FIGHT BACK...they simply LOST THE FIGHT.


Inti, the sun god, was simply replaced by the character you know as Jehovah....don't be a fool Jacope....


Incans did not CHOOSE to submit and change thier religion. They HAD to change, because it was either submit or DIE....thier numbers were running to low.


The children of these fallen Incas were then taught Christianity, and were forced to speak Spanish....to speak the Incan Language of Cechua was considered a social atrocity, as well as to refer to any of the Peruvian Legends....




Bottom Line: CHRISTIANITY WAS SPREAD BY THE SWORD....NOT BY PEACE, NOT BY ANY POSITIVE MEANS


You claim you aren't Ignorant ?


Then you must know this.....you have Faith, because that's how you were RAISED.....Peru is a Catholic Nation...that's no secret. However, because the people in power were Catholic, and because Catholicism is a mandatory cirriculum in Peru, that is why you are all Catholic...not by CHOICE, but by nurture....so yes...that IS brainwashing. I skipped to the last part because the history lesson to me is very useless now.

Now, without a religion, you expect South America to be an Atheist Continent? That part got me thinking alot. It depends actually on what we believe it now days. Every religion has it's beliefs of many sub cultural ways as well, don't forget that. When the Spaniards took over the Whole West coast of South America is an example. Brainwashing? Well, we have been brainwashed for hundreds of years? If we never knew that we have been brainwashed, then 95% of the Peruvians are idiots. Pretty ignorant logic if you ask me. The religion is still within our faith as we believe and have faith in our CATHOLIC religion.

Yes I know Tupac Amaru, and the rest. No, not the rapper. IF it was the rapper, its Tupac Shakur. Really, with all the slow talking, you are getting no where.

Ignorant? OK. Whatever. We had a different Religion and it was the belief of mother nature such as the sun. The Aztecs and the Mayans went through the same problems as well, but Atheist have a terrible history. I made research on them for school and they have killed alot more from the power of Nazism, Communism, Fascism, and alot more.

Jehovah now days is known as God. I'm the fool? I'm talking about what we know now days.

Nellinator
Umm... Christianity was not spread by the sword. The biggest conversion were all done in a peaceable manner after the semi-conversion of Constantine. Before Constantine, Christians were peacebly spreading the gospel and being persecuted without much resistance. I just thought I'd clear that up.

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by JacopeX
I skipped to the last part because the history lesson to me is very useless now.

Now, without a religion, you expect South America to be an Atheist Continent? That part got me thinking alot. It depends actually on what we believe it now days. Every religion has it's beliefs of many sub cultural ways as well, don't forget that. When the Spaniards took over the Whole West coast of South America is an example. Brainwashing? Well, we have been brainwashed for hundreds of years? If we never knew that we have been brainwashed, then 95% of the Peruvians are idiots. Pretty ignorant logic if you ask me. The religion is still within our faith as we believe and have faith in our CATHOLIC religion.

Yes I know Tupac Amaru, and the rest. No, not the rapper. IF it was the rapper, its Tupac Shakur. Really, with all the slow talking, you are getting no where.

Ignorant? OK. Whatever. We had a different Religion and it was the belief of mother nature such as the sun. The Aztecs and the Mayans went through the same problems as well, but Atheist have a terrible history. I made research on them for school and they have killed alot more from the power of Nazism, Communism, Fascism, and alot more.

Jehovah now days is known as God. I'm the fool? I'm talking about what we know now days.



You are completely missing the point.....



I don't care about Peru being Catholic today....I don't care about your Faith. Your Faith is your right...your Faith is your own personal intepretation of what you were taught mixed with Hope in effort to better your life, and life of your loved ones..

I am not asking you to justify your Faith..I would never ask that.


What I am asking you is why you excuse Catholicism, when you know full well what it did to your country....



You KNOW Catholicism was spread by bloodshed and violence, but that's somehow okay ? It doesn't get you to question your Church, question why this happened ? How this was right ?


Where is your pride, seriously ?


Incans suffered died because of the spread of Christianity...you're OWN PEOPLE.....Christians ALSO stole your Gold, and reduced Peru to the state of Poverty it is today. It's White, Catholic Peruvians who are primarily rich, not Native Peruvians.


Because of Christianity it was a SIN to speak Cechua...you're Ancient Language....OUR Ancient Language.


How can you EXCUSE the spread of Christianity in Peru ? It was NOT a good thing.....it cost a lot of LIVES AND BLOOD...on TOP of that our riches....


After the spread of Christianity, Native Peruvians went from being very wealthy to being poor as Hell.



And YES Peru WAS brainwashed....no, that does NOT mean Peruvians are idiots....you were FORCED into this new beleif by a more powerful force...the Spaniards. It's not your fault....I am not insulting Peru, or Peruvian Catholics.


I am specifically asking YOU, Jacope X, how can you CONDONE the Spread of Christianity in Peru, when you know it was spread by means of bloodshed, violence, murder, and theft ?????




And secondly, Atheists were rarely ever in power...you're claim that more people died because of Atheism is total bullshit. More people have been tortured and killed in the name of God than anything else in History. GET your FACTS STRAIGHT !

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by Nellinator
Umm... Christianity was not spread by the sword. The biggest conversion were all done in a peaceable manner after the semi-conversion of Constantine. Before Constantine, Christians were peacebly spreading the gospel and being persecuted without much resistance. I just thought I'd clear that up.


Shut the **** up ...you don't know what we're talking about...I'm not talking about Europe, I am talking about South America and Peru...


YES, in South American, CHRISTIANITY WAS SPREAD BY THE SWORD....both myself and Jacope KNOW THIS...do NOT speak of things you are ignorant of Nellinator.


If you do not know what we are talking about, then stay the hell out

TRH
yes it was spread by the sowrd in SA and some of africa

Alliance
Originally posted by Nellinator
The biggest conversion were all done in a peaceable manner after the semi-conversion of Constantine.

Which conversion was that again?

JacopeX
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I am specifically asking YOU, Jacope X, how can you CONDONE the Spread of Christianity in Peru, when you know it was spread by means of bloodshed, violence, murder, and theft ?????




And secondly, Atheists were rarely ever in power...you're claim that more people died because of Atheism is total bullshit. More people have been tortured and killed in the name of God than anything else in History. GET your FACTS STRAIGHT ! I accept the history of how Peru and south America became a Catholic/Christian continent by the hands of the Spaniards. Thats all I need to say. I never did agree with the things they have done by forcing us into religion. I think People would know that we are brainwashed our selves and become non believers easily since we already have the history of how religion has spread ed. Who would not know that? Peru is a very rich historically, but thanks to the conquistadores, they have taken everything and forced us and also TAUGHT us the religion of catholic and Christianity. I'm going to stay catholic however because of what I believe, not the history of the spaniards, but the Religion itself.

I love it how every Atheist deny how many Atheist or Anti religious groups have killed in quests, Tyranny, etc. I have given facts already.

Alliance
Fortunately, athiests have never been powerful enough as a group to cause the mass-purges major-religions have.

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by JacopeX
I accept the history of how Peru and south America became a Catholic/Christian continent by the hands of the Spaniards. Thats all I need to say. I never did agree with the things they have done by forcing us into religion. I think People would know that we are brainwashed our selves and become non believers easily since we already have the history of how religion has spread ed. Who would not know that? Peru is a very rich historically, but thanks to the conquistadores, they have taken everything and forced us and also TAUGHT us the religion of catholic and Christianity. I'm going to stay catholic however because of what I believe, not the history of the spaniards, but the Religion itself.

I love it how every Atheist deny how many Atheist or Anti religious groups have killed in quests, Tyranny, etc. I have given facts already.


I am just happy that you acknowledge that Christianity was spread by the sword...and you said you do not approve of how it was spread....good thumb up

That's all I was looking for: Whether you denied it, or faced it.


I am not Atheist. I am Buddhist. Secondly, I did not deny Atheist Tyrants....the dictator of China is the perfect example. However, there are far more Christian and Islamic Tyrants then there were Atheist....

Secondly Atheism does not give any justification for violence, nor does it promote it. Atheism is simply a lack of beleif in God...there are no references or guidlines that Atheism gives for any action-good or bad.


Christianity and Islam (or better yet, the Bible and Quran) give definate justification for violence and hate. It's all there, ready to view.

Nellinator
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Shut the **** up ...you don't know what we're talking about...I'm not talking about Europe, I am talking about South America and Peru...


YES, in South American, CHRISTIANITY WAS SPREAD BY THE SWORD....both myself and Jacope KNOW THIS...do NOT speak of things you are ignorant of Nellinator.


If you do not know what we are talking about, then stay the hell out I do know exactly what happened in South America. But you see saying this:
Bottom Line: CHRISTIANITY WAS SPREAD BY THE SWORD....NOT BY PEACE, NOT BY ANY POSITIVE MEANS
should not be taken out of context and all too often it is. I was not arguing against the fact that Christianity was forced in South America. You need to stop jumping to conclusions and consider what people's motives are. You are more judgemental and quicker to jump than anyone else on the forum. Why don't you calm down and remember some of that Buddhism you profess to follow?

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by Nellinator
I do know exactly what happened in South America. But you see saying this:
Bottom Line: CHRISTIANITY WAS SPREAD BY THE SWORD....NOT BY PEACE, NOT BY ANY POSITIVE MEANS
should not be taken out of context and all too often it is. I was not arguing against the fact that Christianity was forced in South America. You need to stop jumping to conclusions and consider what people's motives are. You are more judgemental and quicker to jump than anyone else on the forum. Why don't you calm down and remember some of that Buddhism you profess to follow?






YOU JUST SAID THAT CHRISTIANITY WAS NOT SPREAD BY THE SWORD, and now you admit that it was....you do realize that, no ?


And right now I am furious...you do not know what I've been through in the past few weeks....do not seek to judge me at this moment.

Nellinator
Yes, it originally spread by word, then later it was spread by sword. It is important to seperate the two occasions though.

I don't which is why I am simply asking you to just chill a little bit and remember that I am not here to judge you and I'm trying to remind you that we have in the past had civil discussions that are far more productive than what is occurring now. Can we do that please?

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by Nellinator
Yes, it originally spread by word, then later it was spread by sword. It is important to seperate the two occasions though./B]


What Catholicism did to Peru is horrible....Peru is poorer today because of the spread of Catholicism, and much of Peru's culture (thier artifacts, thier legends, thier riches) has been destroyed because of the spread of Christianity.


Has Catholicism done good for Peru? Yes, but very little. Racism is still very high in Peru today, as is Classicism, and Catholicism has not helped these issues.






Originally posted by Nellinator
I don't which is why I am simply asking you to just chill a little bit and remember that I am not here to judge you and I'm trying to remind you that we have in the past had civil discussions that are far more productive than what is occurring now. Can we do that please?


I am sorry, but as you can tell, I am not in the best of moods. I had a horrible past few weeks, which I rather not discuss.


It doesn't help that I have Alliance and Rogue Jedi giving me bullshit, following me in every thread, insulting me when I tried to avoid addressing them.

Alliance
Then please, put me on ignore, because I'd really appreciate it.

Peru would nto have sold their artifacts to make money. Sensationalism once again. You are simply out to demonize Christianity, and you fial miserable, only making a fool of yourself.

Nellinator
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
What Catholicism did to Peru is horrible....Peru is poorer today because of the spread of Catholicism, and much of Peru's culture (thier artifacts, thier legends, thier riches) has been destroyed because of the spread of Christianity.


Has Catholicism done good for Peru? Yes, but very little. Racism is still very high in Peru today, as is Classicism, and Catholicism has not helped these issues.









I am sorry, but as you can tell, I am not in the best of moods. I had a horrible past few weeks, which I rather not discuss.


It doesn't help that I have Alliance and Rogue Jedi giving me bullshit, following me in every thread, insulting me when I tried to avoid addressing them.
Yah, its bad, but that is the past. I'm more open to hearing solutions than simply complaining about something that the Catholics have apologized for.

It's perfectly natural and understandable. It's forgotten... let's just keep it civil please.

chithappens
Christians have done a lot of in the form on conquest and colonization across the globe. It sucks, yes, but what are we going to do about it?

It's established, now we should probably get back on topic.

Lord Urizen
The conversation was between myself and Jacope X, and the rest of you just HAVE 2 out your two cents in.....

Alliance
Then it should be done over PMs and not in the forums.

chithappens
I'm not trying to piss anyone off but frankly this is beating a dead horse. It's been established Christians did this to Latins, as they did with Asians and Africans.

This should either be a new thread and or we could get back on topic

JacopeX
Back to topic

So, what do you guys think of classes for seperate religions?

Like it would be a whole new type of class.

MAth-

Basic Algebra
Algebra 1A
CP algebra
Honors

Religion-

Christianity
Catholic
Buddhism
Pagan
Etc.

Lord Urizen
Originally posted by JacopeX
Back to topic

So, what do you guys think of classes for seperate religions?

Like it would be a whole new type of class.

MAth-

Basic Algebra
Algebra 1A
CP algebra
Honors

Religion-

Christianity
Catholic
Buddhism
Pagan
Etc.



i think that's a good proposal....

TRH
Originally posted by chithappens
Christians have done a lot of in the form on conquest and colonization across the globe. It sucks, yes, but what are we going to do about it?

It's established, now we should probably get back on topic. you noob are not in the position to say this

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