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Got this idea from the Hulk vs. Sandman thread

They're fighting in the Sierra Desert. Who wins?

Personally, I believe that it is stalemate 7/10 times, with Gaara winning the other three.

Sandman has the ability to manipulate sand that is he absorbs, but cannot (To my knowledge, I have never read any comics with Sandman in them because I never found him to be an intresting character. So this is mostly speculation) manipulate sand that is not absorbed into him (I.E.: He can't use sand that is not part of him as a weapon.). However, Gaara can control and manipulate any and all sand, regardless of whiether he attaches it to himself. So, I don't see why Gaara cannot simply control Sandman himself, seeing as he is mostly made up of sand.

Anyway, what is you guys' opinion?


Here's Wiki's description on Gaara's powers, btw. It's fairly accurate.

As the host of Shukaku, Gaara has the ability to manipulate sand at will. Gaara always carries a calabash gourd on his back filled with an abundant amount of chakra-enhanced sand that has been soaked in the blood of those he has killed. Although Gaara can control any sand, and can even make sand himself by using his sand to break apart minerals in the ground, his personal sand is much easier to control because it is enhanced with his chakra. Other sand puts a greater strain on him since it requires more chakra to animate it. With his personal sand, not only does Gaara always have his own sand supply, but his attacks also increase in both speed and power. Gaara cannot, however, manipulate sand which has come in contact with water.

Originally posted by Burnt Pancakes
Got this idea from the Hulk vs. Sandman thread

They're fighting in the Sierra Desert. Who wins?

Personally, I believe that it is stalemate 7/10 times, with Gaara winning the other three.

Sandman has the ability to manipulate sand that is he absorbs, but cannot (To my knowledge, I have never read any comics with Sandman in them because I never found him to be an intresting character. So this is mostly speculation) manipulate sand that is not absorbed into him (I.E.: He can't use sand that is not part of him as a weapon.). However, Gaara can control and manipulate any and all sand, regardless of whiether he attaches it to himself. So, I don't see why Gaara cannot simply control Sandman himself, seeing as he is mostly made up of sand.

Anyway, what is you guys' opinion?


Here's Wiki's description on Gaara's powers, btw. It's fairly accurate.

As the host of Shukaku, Gaara has the ability to manipulate sand at will. Gaara always carries a calabash gourd on his back filled with an abundant amount of chakra-enhanced sand that has been soaked in the blood of those he has killed. Although Gaara can control any sand, and can even make sand himself by using his sand to break apart minerals in the ground, his personal sand is much easier to control because it is enhanced with his chakra. Other sand puts a greater strain on him since it requires more chakra to animate it. With his personal sand, not only does Gaara always have his own sand supply, but his attacks also increase in both speed and power. Gaara cannot, however, manipulate sand which has come in contact with water.

stalemate

Sandman can manipulate other sands.

Do you have a link or anything? My curiosity is piqued.

http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/s/sandman.htm

Which Gaara ?

Crazy badass Chuunin Gaara, Grudgingly good pre-timeskip Gaara or post Timeskips Kasekage Gaara ?

Crazy Badass has to resort to the Shukaku , Grudingly Good blows Marco appart and Post Timeskip get's his ass beat.

Originally posted by WorldWarHulk
http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/s/sandman.htm

I don't see anything that states he can control sand that he hasn't absorbed into his body.

Powers: Sandman possesses the ability to transform his body into a malleable, sand-like substance that can be hardened, dispersed or shaped according to his will. Also, he is able to increase his size and mass to an unknown extent by incorporating nearby sand into his form.

Sandman.

I prefer Garaa as a character personally but the sand he uses for most of his neat tricks has a psychic tie to him which makes using it easier.

Sandman can fight off any attempt at direct control pretty easily I would think. Then it just becomes a fight to grab as much sand as possible. I think Sandman would win that.

Lastly Garra doesn't really have techniques that can do anything but destroy Sandman physically which is kinda pointless.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Sandman.

I prefer Garaa as a character personally but the sand he uses for most of his neat tricks has a psychic tie to him which makes using it easier.

Sandman can fight off any attempt at direct control pretty easily I would think. Then it just becomes a fight to grab as much sand as possible. I think Sandman would win that.

Lastly Garra doesn't really have techniques that can do anything but destroy Sandman physically which is kinda pointless.

Seperate each grain and fling them into space ?

Originally posted by grey fox
Seperate each grain and fling them into space ?

Why would Sandy let him do that to his body?

Originally posted by grey fox
Seperate each grain and fling them into space ?

Since when has Gaara ever shown that sort of control? And why would Sandman let him do that?

Gaara doesn't really have any way of injuring Sandman here, but I don't imagine Sandman being able to penetrate Gaara's defense.

Stalemate.

Gaar can create sand simply be rearranging moelcules in the dirt. If he can manipulate mocules whats stopping him from just hurling Sandman into orbit?

Originally posted by Burnt Pancakes
Gaar can create sand simply be rearranging moelcules in the dirt. If he can manipulate mocules whats stopping him from just hurling Sandman into orbit?

The fact that those two things have nothing to do with each other. Also he's never done anything like that before.

So manipulating molecules has nothing to do with manipulating grains of sand?

Originally posted by Burnt Pancakes
So manipulating molecules has nothing to do with manipulating grains of sand?

No. Manipultaing sand or molecules doesn't automatically mean you can toss them into space.

And I have never heard of Gaara having matter manipulation.

Gaara can't hurt Sandman in any way. He runs out of chakra after a few minutes and then gets killed.

Argh... is this a joke?

Look at Gaara's fight with Deidara. Look at the sheer volume of sand he controls (and the time it takes from him to do it) to shield the Sand Village from Deidara's explotion. This isn't even a fight. Even pre Chunin Exam Gaara could seal him self in his sand shield and rip Sandman apart. Once he has mixed his Chakra into the sand, he controls it... as simple as that.

He's never met someone like Sandman. Frankly, the only thing Gaara has going for him, is that Sandman is an idiot. He's gotten better, but......Sandman never runs out of gas. And ripping Sandman apart won't stop him. Chakra be damned, he's never fought a sand elemental (borrowing a phrase, but it does fit.)

Except Sandman isn't even made out of sand.... just a similar substance. And he has never shown the ability to control sand that is sentient and has a mind of its own. Not to mention that there would be no way to hurt him, Sandman can just reform, while Gaara is vulnerable flesh and blood that can tire and be killed.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Except Sandman isn't even made out of sand.... just a similar substance. And he has never shown the ability to control sand that is sentient and has a mind of its own. Not to mention that there would be no way to hurt him, Sandman can just reform, while Gaara is vulnerable flesh and blood that can tire and be killed.

It is similar enough to sand that it won't make a difference (which is why he can absorb sand into his body bulk up and replace lost parts). Gaara can control sand once he mixes his chakra with it. He can take control of Flints body and cause him to disperse and simply prevent him from reforming... he could even mix Flint with blood soaked sand in his gourd and it would all be over.

Way to make tons of unsupported assertions. You assume his control is better even though he has to consciously infuse the sand with his chakra while Sandman just has to think to control it, and Sandman can control its density and create projectiles with more variety, etc. You assume that Sandman can't simply reform when his chakra runs out, or just impale him. There is nothing Gaara can do to hurt Sandman.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Way to make tons of unsupported assertions. You assume his control is better even though he has to consciously infuse the sand with his chakra while Sandman just has to think to control it, and Sandman can control its density and create projectiles with more variety, etc. You assume that Sandman can't simply reform when his chakra runs out, or just impale him. There is nothing Gaara can do to hurt Sandman.

More variety? They guy turns his hands into hammers! You call the mayor about a medal and I'll see what I can do about the parade. Please don't make me laugh; Gaara uses his sand to fly and make clones for Christ's sake. And his sand shield is so dense, so compact that the only thing that can penetrate it is the Chidori... and even that is because in Naruto Earth based chakra has an elemental weakness to Lightening based chakra.

You don't think Gaara can control Flint... because Flint is in control of his own body? Do you have no idea how Naruto works? I guess the Kagemane no Jutsu doesn't work on people because they are in control of their own bodies... oh... wait. You can't combat chakra with brute strength, you need a stronger chakra.... thats just how it is. Flints body is made up of the one material that Gaara's chakra type is compatible with. Gaara can control him, the same way Shikamaru can control anyone with a Shadow. End of story.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
You can't combat chakra with brute strength, you need a stronger chakra.... thats just how it is.

And this is why cross medium debates don't work.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
More variety? They guy turns his hands into hammers!

And can create tendrils, bullets, shields, sinkholes, sandstorms, clouds, and a bunch of other stuff.



More bullshit - Lee and Gai punched through it, Kimimaru did too, and Deidara blasted through it with his explosives.



Complete red herring. That's a completely different skill that has absolutely nothing to do with Gaara's technique. Sandman controls his own body instinctively without having to use chakra or any other kind of crap, and demonstrates better control (he can even control it when it has turned to glass). Show me Gaara controlling a mass of living, sentient sand that is actively resisting him and can do such things and I'll believe you. Besides, as I explained, he's not even made of real side, he's a sand - like substance.



No - limits fallacy. Concession accepted.



Wrong. Shikamaru physically restrains someone's body with his jutsu, Gaara sends his chakra into the sand to control it from inside. Won't work if that sand is alive (and not even sand in the first place) and has class 80 strength and fighting against him. He can't hurt Sandman in any way, he'll run out of chakra, and he'll die.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
And this is why cross medium debates don't work.

Yes they do, you just have to recognize bullshit when you see it. He's using a no - limits fallacy, instead of actually comparing what has been accomplished by various characters/techniques/entities and judging from that.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
And can create tendrils, bullets, shields, sinkholes, sandstorms, clouds, and a bunch of other stuff.



More bullshit - Lee and Gai punched through it, Kimimaru did too, and Deidara blasted through it with his explosives.



Complete red herring. That's a completely different skill that has absolutely nothing to do with Gaara's technique. Sandman controls his own body instinctively without having to use chakra or any other kind of crap, and demonstrates better control (he can even control it when it has turned to glass). Show me Gaara controlling a mass of living, sentient sand that is actively resisting him and can do such things and I'll believe you. Besides, as I explained, he's not even made of real side, he's a sand - like substance.



No - limits fallacy. Concession accepted.



Wrong. Shikamaru physically restrains someone's body with his jutsu, Gaara sends his chakra into the sand to control it from inside. Won't work if that sand is alive (and not even sand in the first place) and has class 80 strength and fighting against him. He can't hurt Sandman in any way, he'll run out of chakra, and he'll die.

If you are trying to show that Sandman is more versatile the Gaara it may be helpful to give some examples of things Gaara hasn't done himself... just a thought.

Gai and Lee never punched through Gaara's sand... that was the whole reason he needed to remove his weights and open the seals. He had to be fast enough to get ahead of Gaara's sand because he was unable to penetrate it... did you even read the manga?

They work essentially the same. Shika sends his chakra into shadows and controls them, Gaara sends his chakra in to sand and controls it. The difference is that one is sand and the other is shadow.

The fact that Flint is conscious is irrelevant, the guy is made of sand. If Gaara's power was just some sort of Tetrakinesis/Geokinesis I might be willing to let you get away will saying Gaara would be unable to control Flint but that isn't the case. Gaara's ability works by mixing his chakra into the sand. He controls the chakra, so he controls the sand. Sandman has no defence. He can't dispel the chakra and he can't combat it. Even if it came down to a battle of will power over who controlled the sand... do you think Sandman would win? Gaara is simply more power and he has greater control.

Gaara for 2 reasons
1) Gaara controls sand, Sandman is made of sand, and can only control the sand that makes up his body.
2) Gaara's powers come from a demon, hence they are magic in nature. Sandman is a mutation like Spiderman or the Hulk. Magic>>Mutation.

Originally posted by Tassadar
Gaara's powers come from a demon, hence they are magic in nature. Sandman is a mutation like Spiderman or the Hulk. Magic>>Mutation.

Yeah because Jaspers is tottaly below Zatanna.

Since no one is giving any examples here, i will give you my exmaples of why Sandman will lose to Gaara, and why Gaara will beable to control him

Gaara can convert anything that is similar to sand, minerals, rocks etc, INTO his OWN sand and he can control it, dont understimate this guys chakra control, its POWERFUL, he gets it from shukaku demon.

Scenario: 13 year old pre-chuunin Gaara vs Kimmimaro in a field

Gaara: "You're the foolish one, it doesnt take any effort to create sand from he ground"
Rock lee: "I see... He turns the rocks and minerals underground into additional sand"
http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/3015/narutov24ch21511ya1.jpg

Showing Gaara's strength, remember, this is 13 year old Gaara
http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/744/kimmsh7.jpg

Able to shift the whole landscape
http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/3325/narutov24ch21518xj8.jpg

And here is Kazekage Gaara



so what class 80 strength, Gaara is lifting a huge amount volume of sand most likely heavier then the whole village itself, class 80 strength is nothing to this
http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/2503/narutov28ch24811lb5.jpg

Gaara will just toss Sandman into a lake or somethin, anyway i dont see Sandman being able to get through Gaara's absolute defense either

He does that by grinding them into sand with his own sand. That sand isn't alive and fighting back against him, able to increase its own density to be as hard as diamond or reform. You forget that Gaara tires after only a few minutes of fighting, when he will be completely vulnerable and Sandman can kill him, whereas there is absolutely nothing he can do to hurt Sandman whatsoever.

What do u mean fighting against him? Like punching back at the sand? Nah that wont work, Sandman will get swept away, and into a lake or something.

When has gaara ever tired from only a few minutes of fighting? The fight against kimmimaro was like 2 full non interrupted episodes which is a hella long time in anime time, the fight against deidara, they fought until the sun was almost up

Yeah, you forget that the fights aren't uninterrupted, they constantly cut to scenes of other things going on at the same time. Gaara only had the time to use 3 - 4 attacks and 2 last - ditch lines of defense before he was exhausted. As for Deidara, the fight started near dawn anyway.

1. Those who claim that magic is more powerful than mutations, are wrong. MJJ, Brian Braddock, Franklin Richards. They're all above magic users. Thus, the magic over mutation logic fails.

2. Gaara's control over sand, meh. He can throw, hurl and crush. He doesn't have that much fine control. Sandman can reform himself no matter what and can absorb sand. He has full control over the sand he absorbs, its density and it's form. Which means that he can touch Gaara's shield and he'll be able to control it's form and density. That's means, Gaara's shield go bye bye.

3. Gaara's chakra is limited at best. He runs it out very quickly. Sandman can keep on going as long as he feels like.

4. If Gaara has his sand armor on, Sandman can touch it and gain complete control. Which means that he can crush Gaara with his own sand.

5. Those who say that Sandman can't penetrate Gaara's ultimate defense are right. However, he can wait the 5 minutes it takes for Gaara to go out of chakra.

6. Gaara can blow Sandman away, rip him apart, crush him, remove any limb he wishes to and Sandman can still reform.

7. Gaara cannot regenerate any limbs or anything like that. He's a feeble little boy, who's durability is far below the average shinobi.

8. Kimimaro would've killed him if he hadn't been sick.

9. Deidara owned Gaara.

10. Gaara's demon has been taken by Akatsuki.

If Gaara tires the sand automatically protects him. Sandman does not have Rock Lee speed, so how is he going to get around the sand that protects Gaara. Gaara will just use the Sandman's own sand and crush his internal organs with the Sand Coffin. If the Racoon Demon awakes in Gaara, that's all she wrote.

Originally posted by llagrok
1. Those who claim that magic is more powerful than mutations, are wrong. MJJ, Brian Braddock, Franklin Richards. They're all above magic users. Thus, the magic over mutation logic fails.

2. Gaara's control over sand, meh. He can throw, hurl and crush. He doesn't have that much fine control. Sandman can reform himself no matter what and can absorb sand. He has full control over the sand he absorbs, its density and it's form. Which means that he can touch Gaara's shield and he'll be able to control it's form and density. That's means, Gaara's shield go bye bye.

3. Gaara's chakra is limited at best. He runs it out very quickly. Sandman can keep on going as long as he feels like.

4. If Gaara has his sand armor on, Sandman can touch it and gain complete control. Which means that he can crush Gaara with his own sand.

5. Those who say that Sandman can't penetrate Gaara's ultimate defense are right. However, he can wait the 5 minutes it takes for Gaara to go out of chakra.

6. Gaara can blow Sandman away, rip him apart, crush him, remove any limb he wishes to and Sandman can still reform.

7. Gaara cannot regenerate any limbs or anything like that. He's a feeble little boy, who's durability is far below the average shinobi.

8. Kimimaro would've killed him if he hadn't been sick.

9. Deidara owned Gaara.

10. Gaara's demon has been taken by Akatsuki.

Deidara owned him!!! What's fight did you watch?

Originally posted by jmcnasty
If Gaara tires the sand automatically protects him. Sandman does not have Rock Lee speed, so how is he going to get around the sand that protects Gaara. Gaara will just use the Sandman's own sand and crush his internal organs with the Sand Coffin. If the Racoon Demon awakes in Gaara, that's all she wrote.

1. No demon or any sort of control mate

2. Sandman absorbs sand. You think he can't absorb that little gourd Gaara carries around?

In my opinion it all comes down to who's will is stronger. However, Sandman doesn't have any Chakra, so this fight is just stupid.

Originally posted by jmcnasty
Deidara owned him!!! What's fight did you watch?

I both watched and read the one where Gaara ended up unconscious.

Originally posted by llagrok
1. No demon or any sort of control mate

2. Sandman absorbs sand. You think he can't absorb that little gourd Gaara carries around?

In my opinion it all comes down to who's will is stronger. However, Sandman doesn't have any Chakra, so this fight is just stupid.

Didn't say I was using the post Skipped Gaara. Even if Sandman absorbs the sand, Gaara chakra is still missed with it, meaning that Sandman is just going to become a puppet that Gaara can control.

Originally posted by llagrok
I both watched and read the one where Gaara ended up unconscious.

Doesn't mean he got owned. I saw Gaara being distracted by a clay bomb that would have destroyed his village and Deidara getting the upper hand. I only saw Deidara sneak a few spider bombs into Gaara's sand. That's far from getting owned.

Yeah right, like Sandman can overpower Gaara with brute force, show me a picture of sandman even doing anything close to what gaara was capable of doing, Gaara will wash him away in a second

And plus Gaara has a trumph card, a GIANT RACCOON DEMON
http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/2429/narutov15ch13410fb9.jpg


Can Sandman really defeat it?? Cmon a guy who tries to save his fatherby goin stealth into a police station, gets sprayed by a hose and runs for his life?
http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/7990/sandmandw1.jpg

Listen up, idiots.

Gaara can wash him away, ****ing eat him if he wants to. IT WON'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. Gaara will run out of chakra and then have no defense at all. Do you understand that?

Also, Deidara didn't exactly go all out against Gaara. He barely brought any clay at all, they even gave him more than he originally had in the anime. Gaara was in the middle of the desert.

Why would Gaara run out of chakra by easily tossing him in the ocean? He only runs out of chakra when he exhausts himself, and once Sandman touches water hes unable to fight, unless u wanna see sandman tossin mud at gaara or somethin

Why do u keep bringing up Deidara? This isnt a Deidara vs Gaara fight, Deidara only won because he had to protect the village from Deidaras C4 Explosive which would have blown up the village, If they fought alone, Deidara wouldve got crushed

Originally posted by Terryc250
Why would Gaara run out of chakra by easily tossing him in the ocean? He only runs out of chakra when he exhausts himself, and once Sandman touches water hes unable to fight, unless u wanna see sandman tossin mud at gaara or somethin

Why do u keep bringing up Deidara? This isnt a Deidara vs Gaara fight, Deidara only won because he had to protect the village from Deidaras C4 Explosive which would have blown up the village, If they fought alone, Deidara wouldve got crushed

1. Deidara was poorly prepared. If they had fought alone he would've used a different tactic, and brought more explosives.

2. Doing anything with the sand requires chakra. How can he just toss Sandman into the water? He tries to grab Sandman, he'll have to touch him with sand. Sand will just get absorbed by sandman, or he can move through the sand.

sometimes, when all alone, i am struck by the sheer lameness of manga/anime.

Originally posted by manorastroman
sometimes, when all alone, i am struck by the sheer lameness of manga/anime.

Or how similar their "shocked faces" are.

If someone raises their voice in an anime. They're all :O OMFGWTF!!!!!

Originally posted by llagrok
1. Deidara was poorly prepared. If they had fought alone he would've used a different tactic, and brought more explosives.

2. Doing anything with the sand requires chakra. How can he just toss Sandman into the water? He tries to grab Sandman, he'll have to touch him with sand. Sand will just get absorbed by sandman, or he can move through the sand.

Well who cares about Deidara for now, Gaara was clearly in a bad situation because he had to protect his village at the same time while battling Deidara.

Anyway,

If he absorbs the sand and becomes one with the sand, itll just make him easier to control for Gaara who will overpower him with the chakra infused with the sand, and toss him into a lake or something, sandman isnt all that great, he got defeated once by a vacuum cleaner and and once by an indoor sprinkler system lol

btw, can we not turn this into a manga bashing thread?

Originally posted by Terryc250
Well who cares about Deidara for now, Gaara was clearly in a bad situation because he had to protect his village at the same time while battling Deidara.

Anyway,

If he absorbs the sand and becomes one with the sand, itll just make him easier to control for Gaara who will overpower him with the chakra infused with the sand, and toss him into a lake or something, sandman isnt all that great, he got defeated once by a vacuum cleaner and and once by an indoor sprinkler system lol

btw, can we not turn this into a manga bashing thread?

Everyone has bad feats, it's only natural that Sandman would have more PIS bullshit against him, he's fighting Spidey.

Here's the fact, Gaara can't simply overpower Sandman. We have no idea how that would work. We've never seen Gaara overpower any form of sandperson

Fact is that it's impossible to decide this fight. You can't cross manga/comics in fights like these. I mean, everyone Naruto character has ZE OMFGXORS LEGPOWASSSHH They can jump 10 feet up in the air at age 5.

Originally posted by llagrok
1. Those who claim that magic is more powerful than mutations, are wrong. MJJ, Brian Braddock, Franklin Richards. They're all above magic users. Thus, the magic over mutation logic fails.



I call Bullshit.

MJJ is only a threat in our reality. A single spell sends him to un-space and BAM . Jaspers is a threat no more. Braddock isn't a mutant , he's mystically enhanced human , Franklin is (at best) a Celestial. Thor pwned a Celestial, most competent magic users can.

Originally posted by grey fox
I call Bullshit.

MJJ is only a threat in our reality. A single spell sends him to un-space and BAM . Jaspers is a threat no more. Braddock isn't a mutant , he's mystically enhanced human , Franklin is (at best) a Celestial. Thor pwned a Celestial, most competent magic users can.

I call bullshit on that.

I meant jamie braddock, and Fury was created by MJJ thus it counts as a threat as well. Thor does not beat a celestial, he sent one away. Not even the Skyfathers can harm the celestials.

Originally posted by llagrok
Everyone has bad feats, it's only natural that Sandman would have more PIS bullshit against him, he's fighting Spidey.

Here's the fact, Gaara can't simply overpower Sandman. We have no idea how that would work. We've never seen Gaara overpower any form of sandperson

Fact is that it's impossible to decide this fight. You can't cross manga/comics in fights like these. I mean, everyone Naruto character has ZE OMFGXORS LEGPOWASSSHH They can jump 10 feet up in the air at age 5.

We've seen Gaara lift up and control like Mountain Mass worth of sand with his chakra, and u think he cant overpower a 150 pound guy made out of sand?

Yeah u mock that theres ninjas who can jump high at age 13, wow how ignorant are you.. yeah thats way to unbelievable, stupid manga should take more advice from MARVEL COMICS!!!! Ninjas jumping high is ZOMGWWTF FAKE NO WAAAYZZ!! THEY SHOULD DO MORE REAL STUFF LIKE WARP REALITY AND HAVE UBER POWER GUYS THAT CREATE UNIVERSES WITH THERE POWERZ!! ZOMG NOW THAT IS WAY MORE BELIEVABLE!!@!~11one

Originally posted by llagrok
I call bullshit on that.

I meant jamie braddock, and Fury was created by MJJ thus it counts as a threat as well. Thor does not beat a celestial, he sent one away. Not even the Skyfathers can harm the celestials.

Thor beat the shit out of a celestial and smashed it's brain dome open. Sure it regenerated but he kicked it's ass 8-ways to Sunday. Also two words.

Sue. Storm.

Jamie , meh. He needs to physically pull upon the strings.

No hand , no pulling. Plus the object needs to be relatively dense.

Originally posted by grey fox
Thor beat the shit out of a celestial and smashed it's brain dome open. Sure it regenerated but he kicked it's ass 8-ways to Sunday. Also two words.

Sue. Storm.

Jamie , meh. He needs to physically pull upon the strings.

No hand , no pulling. Plus the object needs to be relatively dense.

That's where you're wrong. Like just proven in uncanny x-men, he can't be stopped like that. Shoot him through the head, won't work. The Celestial's armor is merely a shell, not their real form. You think because Thor can crack his shell he can defeat them?

Originally posted by llagrok
That's where you're wrong. Like just proven in uncanny x-men, he can't be stopped like that. Shoot him through the head, won't work. The Celestial's armor is merely a shell, not their real form. You think because Thor can crack his shell he can defeat them?

He took him down for a time. And a ko (at least on this forum) is a win.

Originally posted by grey fox
He took him down for a time. And a ko (at least on this forum) is a win.

Spidey also took down firelord

Originally posted by llagrok
Spidey also took down firelord

Are you THAT bitter.

Accept it man , firelord lost due to his general suckiness and 'honour' .

If you want to get into that type of 'Cosmics pwn everyone else , anything else is IDLIIDK' argument then consult Digi, otherwise were getting off topic 'k

Originally posted by grey fox
Are you THAT bitter.

Accept it man , firelord lost due to his general suckiness and 'honour' .

If you want to get into that type of 'Cosmics pwn everyone else , anything else is IDLIIDK' argument then consult Digi, otherwise were getting off topic 'k

Celestials = Transcendent
Thor = High herald

RKT beating a celestial is feasible, but normal Thor isn't more powerful than Celestials. Trust me, I'm normally a big fan of Thor, but he's not taking down Celestials. Remember when the skyfather's attempted to take the Celestials? Tossed away like flies.

Anyways. If Gaara can take control over Sandman then he wins this. If he can't then Sandman will wear him out. Your talk about tossing sandman into the water won't work, because if they're not fighting nearby a big source of sand Sandman will take him out. "creating" sand like he did against Kimimaro will take time, I doubt he'll be able to call up his Shukaku defense while creating sand. The defense he used against Kimimaro sucked and I doubt he'd take out Sandman inside his little ball of iron sand. I mean what's he gonna do, carry sandman with sand?