Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

There shouldn't be a discussion. Phoenix can be a Universal threat. Storms basically planetary level.

DC... much as I agree... attracting the crazies to the Discussion forum isn't ideal...

Meh, it's not really a versus thread either. This seemed like the right place to post it. Let's hope they stay at the range of the thread, then.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
DC... much as I agree... attracting the crazies to the Discussion forum isn't ideal...

gotta agree... the likes of 2damn and Rutog running around here is the last thing we need...

though i do agree 100% DC, i honestly do...

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Meh, it's not really a versus thread either. This seemed like the right place to post it. Let's hope they stay at the range of the thread, then.

But does a topic like this really need discussing. I find the ignore button works wonders, if they want to delude themselves so be it. There's nothing more to discuss because going by their logic Jean Grey is literally an atom bomb and Exodus is literally Life and Resurrection.

But pressing the ignore button isn't funnnnn!

Except in Judge's case...

But in stuff like this, I'm not going to give up. I can't. It's Obsessive- compulsive disorder thingy, I guess. Just can't read their retarded claims without at least trying to prove that they are wrong.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
But pressing the ignore button isn't funnnnn!

Except in Judge's case...

But in stuff like this, I'm not going to give up. I can't. It's Obsessive- compulsive disorder thingy, I guess. Just can't read their retarded claims without at least trying to prove that they are wrong.

Heh..I guess

It's gotten to the stage where I don't care anymore. Their credibility on these forums is in a complete shambles. Heck even on the forum where Claremont answers questions, their credibility is a shambles. A certain someone actually got banned from there as well. That in itself speaks of the individuals credibility. And best part is it's not only us KMC folk. It's the general consensus who feel this way .

I just feel that acknowledging their existence just makes matters worse.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
But pressing the ignore button isn't funnnnn!

Except in Judge's case...

But in stuff like this, I'm not going to give up. I can't. It's Obsessive- compulsive disorder thingy, I guess. Just can't read their retarded claims without at least trying to prove that they are wrong.

I know the feeling, but i just console myself with the fact that they're wrong...

there is that temptation though...

This Thread is basically useless. You went to a whole lot of troub;e just for 2damnloud to come in here and post " " If you recall Xmeat and Devilgoblin, despite their inferior grammar, these Stormlings, as some mongooses call them, are no better than them. Xmeat would spaz out on people, 2damnloud goes on a tangent calling everyone racist and sexist. Their both trolls, but this is making you seem kind of like an obsesive ass amigo. All you did was further convince the rest of us, that she ain't nothing compared to the Phoenix. Which we allready knew!




Locked





maybe not, Digi likes you afterall

Ha, Redatom fails.

Good old DC, you can always rely on him to slap some sense into those fanboys. I like your thread over on SHC about Black Panther also DC, you do KMC proud.

Originally posted by CasanoVa
Ha, Redatom fails.

Good old DC, you can always rely on him to slap some sense into those fanboys. I like your thread over on SHC about Black Panther also DC, you do KMC proud.



t('.'t) . V, you honestly don't believe this will talk sense into storm fanboys

Originally posted by CasanoVa
Ha, Redatom fails.

Good old DC, you can always rely on him to slap some sense into those fanboys. I like your thread over on SHC about Black Panther also DC, you do KMC proud.



Linky?

Originally posted by Redatom65
This Thread is basically useless. You went to a whole lot of troub;e just for 2damnloud to come in here and post " " If you recall Xmeat and Devilgoblin, despite their inferior grammar, these Stormlings, as some mongooses call them, are no better than them. Xmeat would spaz out on people, 2damnloud goes on a tangent calling everyone racist and sexist. Their both trolls, but this is making you seem kind of like an obsesive ass amigo. All you did was further convince the rest of us, that she ain't nothing compared to the Phoenix. Which we allready knew!




Locked





maybe not, Digi likes you afterall

Shuddup. glare

GO DC, GO DC, GO DC!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Redatom65
t('.'t) . V, you honestly don't believe this will talk sense into storm fanboys

Never said it would.

Doesn't mean it doesn't have to be said though, those bastich Storm boys piss me off something fine. I'd like to see what they have to say for themselves regarding this thread, whether they can actually back up their claims, time will tell I guess.

did Xmeat or Devilgoblin ever back up his claims. Their just bloody trolls, who'll probably ignore this thread. I mean I apppreciate the trouble DC went to, but it's all in vain.

Originally posted by Soljer
Linky?

Done and Done.

http://herochat.com/forum/index.php/topic,127072.0.html

point is, this thread phails, and can't you see that if they didn't listen to you in the respect thread, that they won't listen to you here -_-

Originally posted by 2damnloud
limitless?

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/9093/xmtdps125vh2.th.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/7268/xmtdps180yz7.th.jpg

Phoenix second to creator(Every version)

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/8828/xmtdps150ep7.th.jpg


Look, they're equal and have equal potential. The only difference is Storm is stronger in that she doesn't need help from a goddamn bird and she can stop herself before she goes all bonkers and destroys everything.

Phoenix was created so Jean could be on par with Storm. There's a reason why Phoenix is all the Psionic energy that ever existed, ever has existed and every will exist. It's Jean's Potential. Storm is a Goddess, a 3-dimensional Goddess all by herself. She has and will ascend.

It isn't my fault writers NEGLECT Storm's continuity set forth by CC who created the Phoenix and has been writing Storm since her beginings in 1975.

He basically fathered BOTH characters.



Celestial energy and Sustenance.

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/9093/xmtdps125vh2.th.jpg

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/6445/stormandthegalaticcore15zq.th.jpg


They do different things in different ways, yet they are APPROXIMATELY EQUAL.

Just deal with it.shocklaugh

Thread=Phails=2Damnloud

Originally posted by Redatom65
Thread=Phails=2Damnloud

Seriously, you are a nitwit who has a hard on for a drawing. DC, though not necisarry, posted a gazillion scans, proving how inferior she is. In the movies it shows how inferior she is, in the cartoons! Everything and everyone knows she's inferior to Phoenix

thing is, the reason the phoenix is off out in the galaxy is because its too powerful to have on one team... honestly, what kind of stories can you do if you know jean can just phoenix the enemy away...

and yet storm is still on earth, whether it be with the x-men or (ugh) black panther...

Originally posted by 2damnloud
limitless?

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/9093/xmtdps125vh2.th.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/7268/xmtdps180yz7.th.jpg

Phoenix second to creator(Every version)

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/8828/xmtdps150ep7.th.jpg


Look, they're equal and have equal potential.

Phoenix was created so Jean could be on par with Storm. There's a reason why Phoenix is all the Psionic energy that ever existed, ever has existed and every will exist. It's Jean's Potential. Storm is a Goddess, a 3-dimensional Goddess all by herself. She has and will ascend.

It isn't my fault writers NEGLECT Storm's continuity set forth by CC who created the Phoenix and has been writing Storm since her beginings in 1975.

He basically fathered BOTH characters.



Celestial energy and Sustenance.

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/9093/xmtdps125vh2.th.jpg

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/6445/stormandthegalaticcore15zq.th.jpg


They do different things in different ways, yet they are APPROXIMATELY EQUAL.

Just deal with it.shocklaugh How do you see storm=phoenix in any of those scans. In fact one of them shows shes not in Thors league let alone Phoenix. In one of the scans Storms admits she has to work with nature while Thor can command it to do his will.

Originally posted by Redatom65
point is, this thread phails, and can't you see that if they didn't listen to you in the respect thread, that they won't listen to you here -_-

Shut up Red, I've yet to see you do anything as good as this .

None of your threads have done any better than this, so I don't think you can criticise DC for his efforts. If you haven't got anything good to say, don't say anything.

Originally posted by CasanoVa
Shut up Red, I've yet to see you do anything as good as this .

None of your threads have done any better than this, so I don't think you can criticise DC for his efforts. If you haven't got anything good to say, don't say anything.

Didn't 2damnloud admit that he wasn't serious 90% of the time about Storm? Anyway, I just quote his posts with a durfist most of the time. He doesn't seem malicious.

badabing

Originally posted by Badabing
Didn't 2damnloud admit that he wasn't serious 90% of the time about Storm? Anyway, I just quote his posts with a durfist most of the time. He doesn't seem malicious.

badabing

ooh! penguins...

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/2433/xmtdps150ep7bn5.th.jpg



Claremont must've been high or drunk when he wrote this.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
It has been long established that the fully realized Phoenix Force is universal, limitless entity, the big bang, spark of creation and the end of it,

By word of mouth, (hyperbole) in X-Men titles exclusively.

Phoenix is no "Big Bang" ...

theoretically Phoenix is the "Spark" that ignites the Big Bang,

theoretically because it has never occured on panel.


In fact Phoenix has never Remade a Universe, or Created a Universe,

Phoenix has never even Destroyed the 616 Reality.

the Force did destroy an Alternate Reality in a What If ... ermm ... Once.


Originally posted by DarkCrawler
able to manipulate universe in the palm of her hand...

Never happened.

Phoenix manipulated the Alternate Future of Reality 15104, nothing more:


"In ONE Future, Phoenix severed the Alternate Future of Reality - 15104"
http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/5749/n2uo1.th.jpg
(excerpt from the OHOTMU 2006 Updates - Mkraan Crystal bio)




PS. Phoenix is far beyond Storm though.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Since I have no interest in spamming the Storm Respect Thread anymore, we can continue the discussion here.



Why were you spamming a "respect" thread in the first place. It's highly disrespectfull and quite trollish!

Originally posted by Mr Master
By word of mouth, (hyperbole) in X-Men titles exclusively.

Phoenix is no "Big Bang" ...

theoretically Phoenix is the "Spark" that ignites the Big Bang,

theoretically because it has never occured on panel.


In fact Phoenix has never Remade a Universe, or Created a Universe,

Phoenix has never even Destroyed the 616 Reality.

the Force did destroy an Alternate Reality in a What If ... ermm ... Once.




Never happened.

Phoenix manipulated the Alternate Future of Reality 15104, nothing more:


"In ONE Future, Phoenix severed the Alternate Future of Reality - 15104"
http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/5749/n2uo1.th.jpg
(excerpt from the OHOTMU 2006 Updates - Mkraan Crystal bio)




PS. Phoenix is far beyond Storm though. After readin alot of her appearance, she reminds me of the Spectre. Her purpose is burn away all that doesn't work and eventually everything, why the hell isn't she doing her job?

Originally posted by Big Sexy
After readin alot of her appearance, she reminds me of the Spectre. Her purpose is burn away all that doesn't work and eventually everything,

Theoretically? Yes.

On panel her power output is pultry in comparison with that of the Spectre and his feats.

Originally posted by Big Sexy
why the hell isn't she doing her job?

Cause it's all hyperbole if you ask me.

I've seen the PF (Hostless) the purest incarnation, defeated by 6 Heroes (Phoenix/Resurrection)

(I'm sure you seen it too, I posted them many times)


An alien Ship nearly killed that Host-less Phoenix. (Phoenix/Resurrection)

Galactus nearly erased the actual PF from existence. (Excalibur #25)

The PF was an unwitting servant of Death (X-Men Forever)


Right before Jean became the WPOTC,

she was killed by a measely Electric Magnetic Pulse at the hands of Xorn. (New X-Men #150)

Originally posted by Mr Master
Theoretically? Yes.

On panel her power output is pultry in comparison with that of the Spectre and his feats.



Cause it's all hyperbole if you ask me.

I've seen the PF (Hostless) the purest incarnation, defeated by 6 Heroes (Phoenix/Resurrection)

(I'm sure you seen it too, I posted them many times)


An alien Ship nearly killed that Host-less Phoenix. (Phoenix/Resurrection)

Galactus nearly erased the actual PF from existence. (Excalibur #25)

The PF was an unwitting servant of Death (X-Men Forever)


Right before Jean became the WPOTC,

she was killed by a measely Electric Magnetic Pulse at the hands of Xorn. (New X-Men #150) Maybe if we know what shes doing in the white hot room then we could base her power better. What throws her off as a character is that for being said to be so powerful , she hardly deals with anyone but the X-men. The whole "amputating the future " thing makes me beleive that she is what she says she is but unless she has more interaction with cosmic beings or at least does her job, she falls into the ambiguous category.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Theoretically? Yes.

On panel her power output is pultry in comparison with that of the Spectre and his feats.



Cause it's all hyperbole if you ask me.

I've seen the PF (Hostless) the purest incarnation, defeated by 6 Heroes (Phoenix/Resurrection)

(I'm sure you seen it too, I posted them many times)


An alien Ship nearly killed that Host-less Phoenix. (Phoenix/Resurrection)

Galactus nearly erased the actual PF from existence. (Excalibur #25)

The PF was an unwitting servant of Death (X-Men Forever)


Right before Jean became the WPOTC,

she was killed by a measely Electric Magnetic Pulse at the hands of Xorn. (New X-Men #150)

three of those are very explicable. namely, the NXM and resurrection instances. i don't want to get into it, just saying.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
I said what I had to say.

CC agrees dur

Originally posted by CasanoVa
Shut up Red, I've yet to see you do anything as good as this .

None of your threads have done any better than this, so I don't think you can criticise DC for his efforts. If you haven't got anything good to say, don't say anything.


Nor have I ever tried to make a thread better than this, so what you said has little to any relevance. And it was merely constuctive critism. And if I don't have anything good to say? This whole bloody thread is to bash 2damnloud, so in a way your statement is a double standard. And you're probably going to argue that he made this thread to point out that Storm isn't as powerful as The Phoenix, so outside the initial post, everything is bloody spam. I pointed out that there was no point in making this thread, cause 2damnloud is so disillusioned, and even after the fact, i'm told to shut up. What DC did was completely in vain. Now if your going to put me down, for stating the obvious, even though everyone else clearly didn't see it, then I beleive you should shut up. And finally, again I applaud DC's efforts, but if it didn't work in any of the v.s threads nor in the respect thread, he didn't need to waste his time

*edit*

Originally posted by Big Sexy
Maybe if we know what shes doing in the white hot room then we could base her power better. What throws her off as a character is that for being said to be so powerful , she hardly deals with anyone but the X-men.

I agree.

Originally posted by Big Sexy
The whole "amputating the future " thing makes me beleive that she is what she says she is

The Future of an Alternate Reality though, then on top of that she damages that Timeline she severed, then she has to Repair the Timeline Atomically instead of on a whim.

There's plenty of cats that could have wished that Timeline anew and so it would have been.

Also, she has to detach an entire Timeline to solve a Global issue?

Where the heck were the Other Heroes during this Global epidemic?

Oh I forgot, only X-Men exist in this Reality 15104

150 Years in a "Possible" Future that supposedly Diverged from 616 and yet ONLY X-Men exist.

hum

Garbage,

that's just Morrison placing them there where he can get away with the PIS in the Story.



In the end, in order for Jean to Alter this "possible" Future of Reality 616, she has to go to the Past, mind rape Scott, in order for him to stay with Emma and continue as an X-Men.

This ensures Reality 15104 escaping it's demise since it was Scott's decision to quit that triggered it.


Again, plenty of cats could just gesture and the Universe is Remade,

Past, Present and Future.

Originally posted by Big Sexy
but unless she has more interaction with cosmic beings or at least does her job, she falls into the ambiguous category.

I agree.

Originally posted by manorastroman
three of those are very explicable. namely, the NXM and resurrection instances.

Yea, she and it got owned.

Originally posted by Redatom65
Nor have I ever tried to make a thread better than this, so what you said has little to any relevance. And it was merely constuctive critism. And if I don't have anything good to say? This whole bloody thread is to bash 2damnloud, so in a way your statement is a double standard. And you're probably going to argue that he made this thread to point out that Storm isn't as powerful as The Phoenix, so outside the initial post, everything is bloody spam. I pointed out that there was no point in making this thread, cause 2damnloud is so disillusioned, and even after the fact, i'm told to shut up. What DC did was completely in vain. Now if your going to put me down, for stating the obvious, even though everyone else clearly didn't see it, then I beleive you should shut up. And finally, again I applaud DC's efforts, but if it didn't work in any of the v.s threads nor in the respect thread, he didn't need to waste his time

You shut up, you come in here saying "Thread=Phail" and you call that constructive criticism? Bullshit, that's just you being a dick.

There's every point in making this thread, if DC wants to make it to inform 2damn and others, then fine let him make it. But if I went to every thread you made and said "Thread=phail" do you not think that would be out of order? especially seeing as he put a bit of effort into it.

I know you should shut up, because you've done nothing except criticize the thread and assume that DC's wasting his time, DC obviously wanted to make this thread; is doing to do a waste of his time? No.

One again:

If you've got nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all.

Thread to bash? No, it's pretty much just about the same as Mr.Master's thread to sort out the cosmic hierarchy, if it was to bash him it would have been closed like you said. But it didn't.. so YOU fail.

Put you down for stating the obvious? I did no such thing, I put you down for being a dick.

Originally posted by CasanoVa
You shut up, you come in here saying "Thread=Phail" and you call that constructive criticism? Bullshit, that's just you being a dick.

There's every point in making this thread, if DC wants to make it to inform 2damn and others, then fine let him make it. But if I went to every thread you made and said "Thread=phail" do you not think that would be out of order? especially seeing as he put a bit of effort into it.

I know you should shut up, because you've done nothing except criticize the thread and assume that DC's wasting his time, DC obviously wanted to make this thread; is doing to do a waste of his time? No.

One again:

If you've got nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all.

Thread to bash? No, it's pretty much just about the same as Mr.Master's thread to sort out the cosmic hierarchy, if it was to bash him it would have been closed like you said. But it didn't.. so YOU fail.

Put you down for stating the obvious? I did no such thing, I put you down for being a dick.

dude i explained myself enough, if you're going to be a dick, and go off upon plenty of double standards, then I really don't care. I have made my point, and clearly you just want to be a dick and keep it going, well dear sir, I would much rather ignore your boarish statements, then continue this battle of "wits"

Originally posted by Mr Master
Yea, she and it got owned.

shrug

it seems very obvious that she allowed herself to die, as they all but spell it out, but hey. whatever blows your hair back.

Hello everybody. http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j241/Badabing_2006/durwave.gif

Originally posted by manorastroman
it seems very obvious that she allowed herself to die, as they all but spell it out, but hey.

Interesting,

where did you read that in NXM?

Cause she didn't seem to orchestrate her death on panel.

Originally posted by manorastroman
whatever blows your hair back.

Perhaps we should stay on topic.

The Phoenix has had too many retcons to even make sense. See and to think POTWC meant something:

http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/6389/xmenphoenixwarsong3021qj7.th.jpghttp://img515.imageshack.us/img515/3687/xmenphoenixwarsong3022gr8.th.jpg

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
The Phoenix has had too many retcons to even make sense. See and to think POTWC meant something:

I thought the sisters shared the PF now?

Originally posted by Mr Master
I thought the sisters shared the PF now?

Yep they do. They share a fragment. The sacred cow forgot to take it with her in the last Phoenix mini.

Don't mind Emma, she's a bit insane at the moment.

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/961/img015jq7.th.jpghttp://img513.imageshack.us/img513/896/img016fr8.th.jpghttp://img91.imageshack.us/img91/4004/img017018ht0.th.jpghttp://img525.imageshack.us/img525/9392/img019ww7.th.jpghttp://img515.imageshack.us/img515/3866/img020qh2.th.jpghttp://img515.imageshack.us/img515/2079/img021gt6.th.jpghttp://img515.imageshack.us/img515/5931/img022lw0.th.jpghttp://img515.imageshack.us/img515/7865/img023fg0.th.jpghttp://img245.imageshack.us/img245/5131/img024qf0.th.jpg

Nice.

Originally posted by Redatom65
This Thread is basically useless. "Useless" implies it doesn't have a use.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Nice. Thats going to lead to a new arc since Jean is currently looking for the rest of the force.

Jean is increasingly annoying.

Also, I'm glad the interview thing was put to rest.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
Also, I'm glad the interview thing was put to rest.

Yep, and Ororo and Jean-Phoenix are approx EQUALmistdance

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Yep, and Ororo and Jean-Phoenix are approx EQUALmistdance must be a very low showing for phoenix then. Like venom-level.

i'd say they're approximately equal in the way that zero is approximately one billion on a grand scale. sure the power difference is enormous, but if you look at it from a scale that goes and everything in between... eh. approximately.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Yep, and Ororo and Jean-Phoenix are approx EQUAL
I don't think that's what he was talking about.

GS would roll over in his grave, upon seeing this thread...

Originally posted by Jebus reborn
GS would roll over in his grave, upon seeing this thread... GS is dead?

Originally posted by Disappear
i'd say they're approximately equal in the way that zero is approximately one billion on a grand scale. sure the power difference is enormous, but if you look at it from a scale that goes and everything in between... eh. approximately.

Well, in the mind of the creator of both characters, they are equal.

Every writer does have their own vision, yet and still they don't keep up with Storm's continuity as much as they should.

They are both capable of the same things, though they may go about them differently. It's much too abstract for the less sharp people.

Storm is the Avatar/archetype of the Goddess, Jean is the Avartar for the Phoenix.

DarkCrawler would have had something if his premise wasn't hindged on a differentiation between one Phoenix and another--Dark P being limitless which was proven to be incorrect and "Green Suite Phoenix" which was weaker--all wrong.

Dark Phoenix and Green Suit Phoenix are two sides of the same coin--Child of light and Dark. It's the same with Storm and Roguestorm--both capable of wielding limitless power and both capable of becoming the forces they wield incarnate--"I am power".

Too bad writers don't keep up with Storm like that.

I guess it's because she has to operate in a team paradigm and they write her down even at her PRESENT powerlevel and don't explore her vast power as to not look out of place.

Jean is now god and look at her..........

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Every writer does have their own vision, yet and still they don't keep up with Storm's continuity as much as they should.

you're just a reader. you're not a writer or editor. you don't get to decide what they "should" do. your opinion doesn't negate years of continuity.

and how the hell would storm read someone's mind? if she can do what jean can, that is. how would she molecularly dissipate a race of beings, virtually wiping them from the face of creation? she can't. she isn't a parallel to jean. she isn't an archetype, whether or not she was meant to be.

Chris Claremont was neither the creator of Jean Grey nor Storm.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Chris Claremont was neither the creator of Jean Grey nor Storm.

He created Phoenix you Jack and wrote for Storm from the begining.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
He created Phoenix you Jack and wrote for Storm from the begining.

Who's Jack?

I believe he said wasn't the creator of Jean Grey, which is correct. dur

Originally posted by Disappear
you're just a reader. you're not a writer or editor. you don't get to decide what they "should" do. your opinion doesn't negate years of continuity.

and how the hell would storm read someone's mind? if she can do what jean can, that is. how would she molecularly dissipate a race of beings, virtually wiping them from the face of creation? she can't. she isn't a parallel to jean. she isn't an archetype, whether or not she was meant to be.

" It's much too abstract for the less sharp people."

You're very obtuse.

Also, "continuity", please look it up.

Originally posted by Hercules
Who's Jack?

I believe he said wasn't the creator of Jean Grey, which is correct. dur

Did I ever say he was??

Jack as in Jackass.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Did I ever say he was??

Jack as in Jackass.

I was always under the impression that Stan Lee and Dave Cockrum created Phoenix?

And that Len Wein and Dave Cockrum created Storm?

Ahh ok, you were insulting him.

Originally posted by Hercules
I was always under the impression that Stan Lee and Dave Cockrum created Phoenix?

And that Len Wein and Dave Cockrum created Storm?

Ahh ok, you were insulting him.

I stand corrected.

Claremont came up with DP.

And Claremont had been wrting Storm since forever.

Factually correct statement:Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Chris Claremont was neither the creator of Jean Grey nor Storm.
Incorrect statement in multiple ways:Originally posted by 2damnloud
Well, in the mind of the creator of both characters, they are equal.
313

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Factually correct statement:
Incorrect statement in multiple ways:
313

Not really. I was half right

Well mostly right.

Claremont made that comparison right between Pheonix and Dark Phoenix.

They are both very powerful and keep each other in check.

i think it would take a bleak, vapid and utterly "obtuse" mind to believe itself capable of deciding what is and is not canon; what does or does not belong in comics. but congratulations on mixing up your insults.

continuity being the established history of the text. yes, i know what it means. i also know that a retcon establishes a new series of events within the history that either elaborate on or replace pre-established events. i also know that nowhere in marvel's continuity is there even the slightest hint that storm is on phoenix's level.

can you even name the last thing storm did that could possibly keep the phoenix "in check?" because, if such an event exists, i'd love to hear about it.

getting put in your place this many times must be giving you the worst case of fanboy blue balls this side of the great depression.

Originally posted by Disappear
i think it would take a bleak, vapid and utterly "obtuse" mind to believe itself capable of deciding what is and is not canon; what does or does not belong in comics. but congratulations on mixing up your insults.

continuity being the established history of the text. yes, i know what it means. i also know that a retcon establishes a new series of events within the history that either elaborate on or replace pre-established events. i also know that nowhere in marvel's continuity is there even the slightest hint that storm is on phoenix's level.

can you even name the last thing storm did that could possibly keep the phoenix "in check?" because, if such an event exists, i'd love to hear about it.

getting put in your place this many times must be giving you the worst case of fanboy blue balls this side of the great depression.

blah, u missed the point again.

Jean and Storm are like sisters thus the relationship correlation with keeping in check with regard to emotions, powers whatever.

Is everything always about ****ing fisticuffs and vulgar dsiplays of power?? Open your MIND, DAMN

Nothing was retconned. Claremont said they were equal, then they're equal, especailly since Jean was given Phoenix to be equal to Storm.

Storm already ascended, she became power incarnate, but through sheer force of will, she let it go. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

THey both have a connection to life and the universe until the world around them is "alive".

Ororo is the archetype for nature, balance etc. She is the goddess archetype.

Look at persona as it relates to power, not just vulgar diplays while being totally ignorant to how the character excercises said power.--nature, life forces of the universe,"living worlds, stars, empty space" etc. etc.

Both wield very primal forces of nature and the universe and connect to it spiritually.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
I said what I had to say.

CC agrees

So now you are dodging direct evidence, pussy?

Chris Claremont has only stated that Storm is equal to Phoenix with limits and even then Jean's power is at higher level.










Because she has limits. For gods sakes, MAGNETO could siphon the energy within that Phoenix.

True Phoenix Force can hold the peak of it's power as much as it wants because it doesn't have psychic blocks in it's head or Jean Grey fighting against it. Thus, Storm can NEVER equal it.

Claremont and every other writer have showcased this. Claremont agrees with me, not with your retarded statements.

You've been owned in every way possible. I'd like to thank YOU for posting that interview though, it made this total and utter pwnage even more funny. Or was it Rutog who originally? Doesn't matter, because your side supplied the evidence. It is so DELICIOUSLY ironic, that your own non-canon pathetic excuse for proof comes back to bite you in the arse.

(And to Mr.Master, this thread was not really dedicated to discussion about Phoenix's powerlevel. You've obviously looked at it more so I am not debating it with you. This was only put to show that Storm isn't as powerful as the Phoenix Force - and I think you agree with that at the least?)

Originally posted by Redatom65
Nor have I ever tried to make a thread better than this, so what you said has little to any relevance. And it was merely constuctive critism. And if I don't have anything good to say? This whole bloody thread is to bash 2damnloud, so in a way your statement is a double standard. And you're probably going to argue that he made this thread to point out that Storm isn't as powerful as The Phoenix, so outside the initial post, everything is bloody spam. I pointed out that there was no point in making this thread, cause 2damnloud is so disillusioned, and even after the fact, i'm told to shut up. What DC did was completely in vain. Now if your going to put me down, for stating the obvious, even though everyone else clearly didn't see it, then I beleive you should shut up. And finally, again I applaud DC's efforts, but if it didn't work in any of the v.s threads nor in the respect thread, he didn't need to waste his time

Waste my time?

I'm having a riot in here!

This is the funniest point of debating ever. When the other side has been drained out of all their evidence and points and are still trying to make their last stance, fighting like rabid retard monkeys against an ARMY, slowly realizing that there is nobody who supports their utterly ridicolous stance and they have no other choice then to post the same bullshit that has been shot down eons ago.

It's like watching an boxing match between the World Champion and a guy who has put the gloves on his hands for the first time. You know that the guy is going to lose to the Champion, but you can't turn the channel off because you want to see the complete ownage.

This is one of the main reasons I am debating. Don't steal my fun now.

It's not like I really have anything better to do at this point until finals start and stuff.

Win what?? shocklaugh

What the **** are you winning??

Your premise is ****ed. You're putting words in the man's mouth. He didn't say shit about "with limits". He said approx. EQUAL. That's it, end of.

You tried your damndest to make a differentiation between the two Phoenixes, when CC made that statement in 1979 right in btween "Green Suite"(some shit you made in your false premise) and Dark Phoenix. He had both in mind yet he STILL made the comparison.

DP and Green suite are two sides of the SAME coin.

I already proved the DP had limits as well.

He said they're equal, nothing you can say can change that.

Come back when you have another premise for your argument because this "one is different than the other" is bullshit. Notwithstanding the fact that he made the statement on the verge of the DP saga AFTER the Green suite Phoenix.

All this also notwithstanding that it was second to the creator period, no matter what version.

I love this thread.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Win what?? shocklaugh

What the **** are you winning??

Your premise is ****ed. You're putting words in the man's mouth. He didn't say shit about "with limits". He said approx. EQUAL. That's it, end of.

You tried your damndest to make a differentiation between the two Phoenixes, when CC made that statement in 1979 right in btween "Green Suite"(some shit you made in your false premise) and Dark Phoenix. He had both in mind yet he STILL made the comparison.

DP and Green suite are two sides of the SAME coin.

I already proved the DP had limits as well.

He said they're equal, nothing you can say can change that.

Come back when you have another premise for your argument because this "one is different than the other" is bullshit. Notwithstanding the fact that he made the statement on the verge of the DP saga AFTER the Green suite Phoenix.

All this also notwithstanding that it was second to the creator period, no matter what version.
You seriously think Magneto could beat Dark Phoenix?

Originally posted by King Kandy
You seriously think Magneto could beat Dark Phoenix?

Magneto can't beat DP or Storm without some kind of PIS to make him a credible villain.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Magneto can't beat DP or Storm without some kind of PIS to make him a credible villain.
Good. Because he can beat Greensuit Phoenix. Guess that kinda blows that theory that her and DP are equal, huh?

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Magneto can't beat DP or Storm without some kind of PIS to make him a credible villain.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Good. Because he can beat Greensuit Phoenix. Guess that kinda blows that theory that her and DP are equal, huh?

Nope, that Phoenix was just as much "second to the creator" as DP is which makes it even MORE PIS.

Claremont made his statement 2 years AFTER the Phoenix saga and on the precipice of Dark Phoenix in 1980.

Believe what you want.

Why would he even make a new thread about this??

I musta really pissed him off shocklaugh

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Magneto can't beat DP or Storm without some kind of PIS to make him a credible villain.

I've never seen a Storm fan stretched so thin.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
I've never seen a Storm fan stretched so thin.

Originally posted by Redatom65
dude i explained myself enough, if you're going to be a dick, and go off upon plenty of double standards, then I really don't care. I have made my point, and clearly you just want to be a dick and keep it going, well dear sir, I would much rather ignore your boarish statements, then continue this battle of "wits"

This isn't a "battle"

I'm just telling you what everybody else seems to have realised.

I wasn't the one who started being a dick in the first place, but if it takes me coming into the thread to tell you you're a dick (When plenty of other people realised, yet someone you manage to think you're contributing somehow), thusforth acting like a dick myself, then I will do it.

Wanker

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Magneto can't beat DP or Storm without some kind of PIS to make him a credible villain. Really? Chris Claremont, the most important writer in Storms comic career certainly seems to think that he can defeat Storm and has indeed written him to do so, easily if I may add, and multiple times to boot. Maybe you should send him an e-mail and tell him that he is wrong?

Can't argue with "Canon", although, when it comes to Storm alot of people like to pick and choose what qualifies as "canon" exactly. (If you're "called" an Omega, in canon, then you qualify. If someone, in "canon", compares you to the PHOENIX well.............?)

I just want to see everybody's reaction when Hudlin makes her the 3-d Goddess she was always intended to be.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
(And to Mr.Master, this thread was not really dedicated to discussion about Phoenix's powerlevel. You've obviously looked at it more so I am not debating it with you. This was only put to show that Storm isn't as powerful as the Phoenix Force - and I think you agree with that at the least?)

I noticed.

I just wanted to make clarifications concerning that feat.

Bottomline though:
Originally posted by Mr Master
PS. Phoenix is far beyond Storm though.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Waste my time?

I'm having a riot in here!

This is the funniest point of debating ever. When the other side has been drained out of all their evidence and points and are still trying to make their last stance, fighting like rabid retard monkeys against an ARMY, slowly realizing that there is nobody who supports their utterly ridicolous stance and they have no other choice then to post the same bullshit that has been shot down eons ago.

It's like watching an boxing match between the World Champion and a guy who has put the gloves on his hands for the first time. You know that the guy is going to lose to the Champion, but you can't turn the channel off because you want to see the complete ownage.

This is one of the main reasons I am debating. Don't steal my fun now.

It's not like I really have anything better to do at this point until finals start and stuff.


ight DC, sorry for trolling your thread, but V you're still a dick bra ermmhappy

I am sorry, but storm fans are now the most rediculous people on the forum..........

next to wolvie fans

you change your mind more often than a drunk driver. your entire argument has been "storm is as powerful as phoenix," but when you get questioned on a claim you've made suddenly you're discussing their emotional bond as best friends? peddle your bullshit somewhere else.

blueD, the only thing hudlin's done to storm thus far is made her a subservient housewife who can't help but defend her new husband's honor and openly profess how utterly meaningless her life was before the wedding. does that sound like storm to you?

Originally posted by Disappear
you change your mind more often than a drunk driver. your entire argument has been "storm is as powerful as phoenix," but when you get questioned on a claim you've made suddenly you're discussing their emotional bond as best friends? peddle your bullshit somewhere else.



My God, you're so ****in obtuse.

They keep each other in check as stated by Chris Claremont himself. I posted it on here somehwere, I'll find it.

i'll ask again, what has storm done to keep the phoenix in check? ever. at any point in time.

What happened to the Fallen or First Fallen or whatever. The one that isn't Tyrant and is the opposite of the Phoenix Force that's supposed to keep it in check.
Originally posted by 2damnloud

Usually you twist the implication you're just grasping at straws into something that's compliments or aids you. What's wrong? ...Are you getting ready to tell us we've been Candy Camera'd? *wags finger*

Originally posted by capt it up
I am sorry, but storm fans are now the most rediculous people on the forum..........
You guys have no idea how much this means.

Originally posted by BlueDMighty
Can't argue with "Canon", although, when it comes to Storm alot of people like to pick and choose what qualifies as "canon" exactly. (If you're "called" an Omega, in canon, then you qualify. If someone, in "canon", compares you to the PHOENIX well.............?)

I just want to see everybody's reaction when Hudlin makes her the 3-d Goddess she was always intended to be.
Has Storm ever been compared to Phoenix in canon? I recall the Roguestorm page where it says something like "Now I know what Phoenix felt like" or something similar. That doesn't really constitute Storm = Phoenix.

Normally, I don't think anyone would care what happens to Storm. In fact, without 2cloud and Rudy, I'm sure most people would be happy if Storm was finally announced as an omega or some half decently explained power-up occurred. Although in the case of the omega thing, it'd be kind of strange with her having the cable/nate/magneto thing going on with the readers constantly being reminded that their body is holding them back, something that doesn't seem to happen with omegas. But with all the negative attention...

You'll have Rudy and 2cloud claiming they were always right because of a recent event then the fuss would be everyone still explaining how information and the flow of time works to them.

Originally posted by Disappear
i'll ask again, what has storm done to keep the phoenix in check? ever. at any point in time.

What are you 3?

You're thinking about who can bitchslap who other the hardest. It's about dynamics of friendship/relationships as well as comparable power and destructive potential.

Storm has shown the ability to wield the primal forces of the Universe like nobodies business.

It just so happends that these two women are what???? FRIENDS

It's an interesting dynamic really if you can get your head out of your ass.

"Originally posted by Chris Claremont in Storm Part II
What creates a bond between Storm and (my conception of) Jean -- and a potential abyss between her and Charles Xavier as he's currently being portrayed -- is the fact that both these women came to face, in the most brutal and unforgiving terms, the consequences of power without restraint, without responsibility. Unchecked, they can cause untold harm, even if they start with the best of intentions. (Kind of like being the sole super-power in the world. At least, when there were two with the capability and will to annihilate all life on earth, they tended to keep one another honest and in balance. Winning global peace is apparently much easier than sustaining it.) Be interesting to see how things develop in the X-community from here on."

you made the claim that storm is as powerful as jean grey. you made the claim that storm can keep jean in check. you haven't proven either. if storm was enough to keep jean in check, why did it take the combined minds of all x-men past and present to show jean her human side in endsong? why not just storm?

your points are moot, your arguments are non-linear and your sources are non-canon. move on, kid. you're wasting your time.

Originally posted by Disappear
you made the claim that storm is as powerful as jean grey. you made the claim that storm can keep jean in check. you haven't proven either. if storm was enough to keep jean in check, why did it take the combined minds of all x-men past and present to show jean her human side in endsong? why not just storm?

your points are moot, your arguments are non-linear and your sources are non-canon. move on, kid. you're wasting your time.




You ignore everything per the creator of the character.

It is YOU who should get the **** outta here.

I care about the creator and his vision.

He says they're equal, then they'e equal. Simple as that.

Originally posted by 2damnloud


You ignore everything per the creator of the character.

It is YOU who should get the **** outta here.

I care about the creator and his vision.

He says they're equal, then they'e equal. Simple as that.

It's nice that you can admit when you have literally no argument left.

you obviously don't care about the characters, then. because they're more than what one man thinks of them; they're the combined outcome of years of writers making years of stories about them.

again i'll point out that you've not been able to prove anything you say with a canon source. again i'll point out that claremont is not the be-all-end-all of storm, phoenix or marvel canon. and again i'll laugh quietly to myself as i post this, thinking of what nonsense things you'll try to push as proof next.

Originally posted by Disappear
you obviously don't care about the characters, then. because they're more than what one man thinks of them; they're the combined outcome of years of writers making years of stories about them.

again i'll point out that you've not been able to prove anything you say with a canon source. again i'll point out that claremont is not the be-all-end-all of storm, phoenix or marvel canon. and again i'll laugh quietly to myself as i post this, thinking of what nonsense things you'll try to push as proof next.

Jean-Phoenix is his creation.

The writers wouldn't have anyhting without that.

Phoenix has limits in every incarnation.

I respect the creator's original vision. Everything after that is a mere interpretation of said vision, hit or miss.

As of now, Storm and Jean-Phoenix are approx =

that's the most exclusive view of comics i've ever seen. not exclusive in the sense that it's unique, but in the sense that you intentionally exclude everything that disproves your point.

i've decided to take the same approach. madrox is now the most powerful mutant in the world. i have it from a canon source written by peter david himself thus, multiple man is more powerful than storm. my argument wins.

Originally posted by Disappear
that's the most exclusive view of comics i've ever seen. not exclusive in the sense that it's unique, but in the sense that you intentionally exclude everything that disproves your point.

i've decided to take the same approach. madrox is now the most powerful mutant in the world. i have it from a canon source written by peter david himself thus, multiple man is more powerful than storm. my argument wins.

Suite yourself.

Jean-Phoenix and Ororo are equals.

Phoenix in any and every incarnation was one step down from the almighty when Claremont made his claim, and she had/has limitations as I have proven.

Personally I like Storm because there's a growth there. Jean was given so much power trying to compete with Storm until she's just a parody.

Storm on the other hand has struggles and limitations, yet just below the surface, can summon an entire Galaxy's worth of power with ease and transcend her being to become power itself.http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/8317/ext5pg12sc8.th.jpghttp://img205.imageshack.us/img205/6464/ext5pg13lp3.th.jpg

Both wielding the primal forces of the universe, when unchecked they can...... And as it turns out, they're friends........... sisters almost

Two goddesses who can transcend creation.

The internal struggles, the dynamics....

This man can write some good shit, man.

how exactly does the power to wipe out civilizations, eat stars and transcend life itself on a whim become categorized as "competing with storm" exactly? just wondering.

Phoenix is second to the creator; Multiple Man creates multiples of himself. I think that's the reference Claremont was trying to make in the the Dark Phoenix saga. He truly was a visionary.

If someone was to actually read those scans. They'd realize that it refers to ALL mutants having the capacity to being able to transcend their very being.

Squirrel Girl is the creators creator in fur.

that point, contrasted against the perception of omega mutants, was brought up in the storm respect thread. not squirrel girl, though

Originally posted by Disappear
that point, contrasted against the perception of omega mutants, was brought up in the storm respect thread. not squirrel girl, though

But the key thing being "perception" seeing how Horsemen Sunfire, Shadow King and Malice all have transcended their very beings and they aren't Omegas. There's absolutely no criteria for being called an Omega apart from it being stated on panel.
So the line "All of us hold within ourselves the capacity to transcend our very being" and "But mutants possess the means to actually achieve that goal" would not only be limited to Omega Level Mutants.

Originally posted by Redatom65
ight DC, sorry for trolling your thread, but V you're still a dick bra ermmhappy

Takes one to know one.

And OMGosh? I'm a dick haermm I thought I was Wyatt mother-****ing Earp.

He rocks, I mean I rock. One of the two.

Originally posted by Redatom65
ight DC, sorry for trolling your thread, but V you're still a dick bra ermmhappy

I have to stop you there Red, for the use of the words "dick" and "bra" to insinuate that there is such a thing as a bra for your penis.

How woud that even work?

Originally posted by Mr Master
By word of mouth, (hyperbole) in X-Men titles exclusively.

Phoenix is no "Big Bang" ...

theoretically Phoenix is the "Spark" that ignites the Big Bang,

theoretically because it has never occured on panel.


In fact Phoenix has never Remade a Universe, or Created a Universe,

Phoenix has never even Destroyed the 616 Reality.

the Force did destroy an Alternate Reality in a What If ... ermm ... Once.




Never happened.

Phoenix manipulated the Alternate Future of Reality 15104, nothing more:


"In ONE Future, Phoenix severed the Alternate Future of Reality - 15104"
http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/5749/n2uo1.th.jpg
(excerpt from the OHOTMU 2006 Updates - Mkraan Crystal bio)




PS. Phoenix is far beyond Storm though.


All the points you dispute have been handled by myself in every thread we've debated the matter on. On top of that my respect thread has enough scans stating the points you would like to dispute with mere opinion. Stop running around trying to demean the Phoenix at its every mention every time im away for a few days.

i see dead people, apparently.

also, existing without a flesh-and-blood body is not technically the same thing as "transcending." as you pointed out, a good handful of characters have "energy" bodies without being confirmed omegas. transcending could mean something more metaphysical, or on a grander scale, or whatever. all we know is that it doesnt explicitly mean existing outside of a human body, and storm's context clearly establishes that she's not talking about the same transcending often applied to omega level mutants.

Originally posted by Disappear
also, existing without a flesh-and-blood body is not technically the same thing as "transcending." as you pointed out, a good handful of characters have "energy" bodies without being confirmed omegas. transcending could mean something more metaphysical, or on a grander scale, or whatever.

It could but, if you mean transcending in terms of the PF, then it's also been done by a non-Omega. Phoebe was able to act as a host for it. As for Sunfire, in AoA he burnt away his flesh and became living flame in a containment suit. I just assumed he did the same in 616 but was able to reconstitute himself. I guess not.
Whatever it is Omeganess has yet to be explained.



Well if we agree on this then I guess we both agree.

it was never fully explained how far sunfire's self-burning had faded him out in the age of apocalypse. when rogue touched him to calm him down, he still had a scarred and charred face, iirc. the suit may have been mostly a measure to keep himself from burning to death, for all we know.

and i agree about omegas. all we know as a canon explanation is that all omegas have an unlimited potential for growth in their mutation, and that power levels really don't affect classification. aside from that, as you said, we can only really rely on on-panel clarification as to whether one mutant is or is not omega; and previous hyperboles do not automatically qualify anyone.

Yep, still.......



http://www.equal.com/images/packet.jpg

that was clever. i concede my argument, despite your complete lack of fact or your non-biased, out-of-the-blue, chickenshit interpretations of interviews, due entirely to you being clever.

Originally posted by Disappear
that was clever. i concede my argument, despite your complete lack of fact or your non-biased, out-of-the-blue, chickenshit interpretations of interviews, due entirely to you being clever.

Well thank you.

Storm in her Flesh body has at least shown the ability to destroy a Galaxy, maybe?

DP and Phoenix are two sides to the SAME coin--Rebirth and Destruction.--The laws of what??? NATURE

really, you needn't continue. i'm still blown far, far away by your cleverness. i can't seem to wrap my head around the idea that someone could have a misconception, focus in on one word as a part of a phrase, and then FIND that word in some other, well known medium and use it to display their wit. it's AMAZING. i'm flabbergasted, to be sure.

The Phoenix already has a counterbalance. 313
http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/5413/uncannyxmen10473ny9.th.jpg
And it's not Storm. 131

Originally posted by Disappear
really, you needn't continue. i'm still blown far, far away by your cleverness. i can't seem to wrap my head around the idea that someone could have a misconception, focus in on one word as a part of a phrase, and then FIND that word in some other, well known medium and use it to display their wit. it's AMAZING. i'm flabbergasted, to be sure.

I'm happy to help.

Just know that the whole premise is ****ed.--Green Suite>>>>>>>>Dark Phoenix?? Nope.

One= all. Just differing facets of the primal forces of the universe.--Birth/rebirth and destruction.

Let's just say he was talking about Green suite. Look over that incarnation from that time on. It's STILL powerful.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
The Phoenix already has a counterbalance. 313
http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/5413/uncannyxmen10473ny9.th.jpg
And it's not Storm. 131


Did I say DP was a counterbalance??

I said just what I said--two facets of nature.

That scan says first fallen wants to screw with nature/cycle.

I did not say it was Ororo either.

Personally I believe 2damnloud believes in his theories so hard, that he actually warps reality around himself and his comic books reflect that.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
Jean-Phoenix is his creation.

The writers wouldn't have anyhting without that.

Phoenix has limits in every incarnation.

I respect the creator's original vision. Everything after that is a mere interpretation of said vision, hit or miss.

As of now, Storm and Jean-Phoenix are approx =

I suspect youre one and the same as Energy World from Comicxfan forums. If that is the case then you'll be very familiar with Energy Worlds questions and Chris Claremonts answers:

http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?t=6305&page=16&pp=20



Chris Claremont may have created the Phoenix concept and the character Storm however they were created for Marvel and they are Marvels property to do with as they please. As illustrated here, Chris Claremont does NOT dictate continuity, Marvel does and if Marvel wanted to completely disregard all of Chris Claremonts ideas for Storm or Phoenix, then they could do so and we as readers would have to accept that.In fact the whole Dark Phoenix Saga and subsequent Phoenix retcon came about because of an editorial rejection of Claremonts ideas and an editorial imposed revision. Here we as debators abide by continuity, continuity is what Marvel says it is, not what one of its multitude of expendable writers wishes it to be. Understand and accept that.

At the time of that interviews writing Chris' words were true, the limited Green Phoenix and Storm were on par. Jean went on to become something very different to what that interview refers to therefore rendering its comments about Jean and Storm outdated and therefore irrelevant.

By your logic i could use comments regarding Pre retcon Beyonder to reflect the status of Beyonder now in the hierarchy.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I suspect youre one and the same as Energy World from Comicxfan forums. If that is the case then you'll be very familiar with Energy Worlds questions and Chris Claremonts answers:

http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?t=6305&page=16&pp=20



Chris Claremont may have created the Phoenix concept and the character Storm however they were created for Marvel and they are Marvels property to do with as they please. As illustrated here, Chris Claremont does NOT dictate continuity, Marvel does and if Marvel wanted to completely disregard all of Chris Claremonts ideas for Storm or Phoenix, then they could do so and we as readers would have to accept that.In fact the whole Dark Phoenix Saga and subsequent Phoenix retcon came about because of an editorial rejection of Claremonts ideas and an editorial imposed revision. Here we as debators abide by continuity, continuity is what Marvel says it is, not what one of its multitude of expendable writers wishes it to be. Understand and accept that.

At the time of that interviews writing Chris' words were true, the limited Green Phoenix and Storm were on par. Jean went on to become something very different to what that interview refers to therefore rendering its comments about Jean and Storm outdated and therefore irrelevant.

By your logic i could use comments regarding Pre retcon Beyonder to reflect the status of Beyonder now in the hierarchy.

He never did truly answer me.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
He never did truly answer me. http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a132/materiaall/crybaby.jpg

Originally posted by grey fox
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a132/materiaall/crybaby.jpg

I'll be alright

http://www.popular-pics.com/PPImages/Baby_Smoke_Joint.jpg

Originally posted by 2damnloud
He never did truly answer me.

Believev it or not Storms actually my favourite character. Most people assume its Phoenix because i'm always arguing about her, but thats because shes so misunderstood. Despite my love for the Storm character i would never overrate her or present a notion that can't be backed up fully by on panel evidence.

This notion that Storm is a match for Phoenix is ridiculous. Parallels were drawn between the two in Uncanny X-men 147 because Storm like Phoenix was corrupted by her power and was unleashing it without restraint. Not once did it equate them to each other in terms of power, parallels however were drawn between the two characters and the struggle they faced.

Chris Claremont equated the two at a point in time when Phoenix had self imposed restraints placed on her power after the M'kraan crsytal feat. She had just contained a multiversal power, what use would she be to a writer, how boring would it be for us to have a character of that level on the team, hence the reason they were introduced. That is the Phoenix he compared her to. That was the Phoenix that was in place at the time of the interview. Jeans status changed, therefore making that interview outdated and totally unrepresentative of the current status of the two characters.

Phoenix has eaten suns, is heralded as the power that gives the entire universe life, has thrashed Galactus many a time, has contained a multiversal power, has cut off a future reality from the timeline and carried it away in her hand, before materializing the remaining timeline in her hand demonstrating control at an atomic level of an entire universe.

Storms feats pale in comparison. Storms not even on Thors level as she'd said herself and as demonstrated most recently in Black Panther and yet you would truly have us believe she's on par with the avatar of the life force of all reality? Without the Phoenix Force there would be no Storm, without Storm Phoenix would get along just fine.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm

Chris Claremont equated the two at a point in time when Phoenix had self imposed restraints placed on her power after the M'kraan crsytal feat. She had just contained a multiversal power, what use would she be to a writer, how boring would it be for us to have a character of that level on the team, hence the reason they were introduced. That is the Phoenix he compared her to. That was the Phoenix that was in place at the time of the interview. Jeans status changed, therefore making that interview outdated and totally unrepresentative of the current status of the two characters.



Maybe that's why they/he didn't fully explore Storm.

and maybe it's not. believe it if it makes you feel better, but please, stop trying to push things you can't prove as proof.

Originally posted by Disappear
and maybe it's not. believe it if it makes you feel better, but please, stop trying to push things you can't prove as proof.

an educated response if ever i saw one.

Originally posted by Disappear
an educated response if ever i saw one.

Don't make me thrash you Mr. "enhanced/ altered" have the same meaning.

enhanced can be implied in the term altered. that, actually, is what i said. if you don't understand that, grab a dictionary.

That is true isn't it? Enhanced IS altered, from the base object that is enhanced. Altered can be enhanced. Or turning into a werewolf after collecting three spirit orbs.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y186/zanpanzer/843.jpg

Might be an enhancement for others.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
That is true isn't it? Enhanced IS altered, from the base object that is enhanced. Altered can be enhanced. Or turning into a werewolf after collecting three spirit orbs.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y186/zanpanzer/843.jpg

Might be an enhancement for others.

Riiiiiiiise from your grave!!!

Altered Beasts.? lol.

Originally posted by CasanoVa
Takes one to know one.

And OMGosh? I'm a dick haermm I thought I was Wyatt mother-****ing Earp.

He rocks, I mean I rock. One of the two. If you're Wyatt Earp then I'm Doc Holiday.

Couldn't you get another orb and turn into a Golden Werewolf on that game?

Or am I thinking about Dragonball GT?

Originally posted by Hercules
Couldn't you get another orb and turn into a Golden Werewolf on that game?

Or am I thinking about Dragonball GT?

Nerd ermmfrown

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Nerd ermmfrown

Look who's talking!

durfist

Originally posted by Hercules
Look who's talking!

durfist w00tdur

Originally posted by Hercules
Couldn't you get another orb and turn into a Golden Werewolf on that game?

Or am I thinking about Dragonball GT?
Probably on the later levels. I could never get that far and my cousin always yelled at me for taking the spirit orb when I was already in an animal form and he wasn't. And because I always died.

Originally posted by 2damnloud
limitless?

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/9093/xmtdps125vh2.th.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/7268/xmtdps180yz7.th.jpg

Phoenix second to creator(Every version)

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/8828/xmtdps150ep7.th.jpg


Look, they're equal and have equal potential.

Phoenix was created so Jean could be on par with Storm. There's a reason why Phoenix is all the Psionic energy that ever existed, ever has existed and every will exist. It's Jean's Potential. Storm is a Goddess, a 3-dimensional Goddess all by herself. She has and will ascend.

It isn't my fault writers NEGLECT Storm's continuity set forth by CC who created the Phoenix and has been writing Storm since her beginings in 1975.

He basically fathered BOTH characters.



Celestial energy and Sustenance.

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/9093/xmtdps125vh2.th.jpg

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/6445/stormandthegalaticcore15zq.th.jpg


They do different things in different ways, yet they are APPROXIMATELY EQUAL.

Just deal with it.shocklaugh http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j241/Badabing_2006/2damnbanned.jpg
dur

That was uncalled for. You're totally stealing the thunder from my Altered Beast reference.