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Yep,you heard right,I was just reading some old Thor,and it turns out that in a past life where Thor was Sigmund,he had his family taken away,and he and Odin(disguised as a mortal dad) went around killing the viking clan that took them,long story short,dad left,Thor was beaten,went to a house and found his long lost sister wed to a cruel abusive husband,and thus they fled(fair enough).

I first suspected something was up when his siter once called him her "Beloved",but dismissed it for then.however,when Thor dies in combat,it turns out his siter is pregnant with HIS child?

It also turns out,that this baby is a reincarnation of Thor yet again,making Thor his own

1.Brother
2.Father
3.son

and his siter his

1.Wife
2.Mother
3.sister


....am i the only one who finds that a tad wack?

Originally posted by Martian_mind
Yep,you heard right,I was just reading some old Thor,and it turns out that in a past life where Thor was Sigmund,he had his family taken away,and he and Odin(disguised as a mortal dad) went around killing the viking clan that took them,long story short,dad left,Thor was beaten,went to a house and found his long lost sister wed to a cruel abusive husband,and thus they fled(fair enough).

I first suspected something was up when his siter once called him her "Beloved",but dismissed it for then.however,when Thor dies in combat,it turns out his siter is pregnant with HIS child?

It also turns out,that this baby is a reincarnation of Thor yet again,making Thor his own

1.Brother
2.Father
3.son

and his siter his

1.Wife
2.Mother
3.sister


....am i the only one who finds that a tad wack?


I have a feeling they got that idea from Vagners crappy operas based on the Volksung sagas. Yeah it is wack.

Gods are always commiting incest, its just one of those things that they do in mythology, but they way in which they have done it here sucks.

I was onna make a joke about how him moving to the south in Oklahoma now seemed appropriatte,but my geogrphy sucks and i don't know if Oklahoma is actually in the south.

Good lord -.-

Originally posted by Martian_mind
I was onna make a joke about how him moving to the south in Oklahoma now seemed appropriatte,but my geogrphy sucks and i don't know if Oklahoma is actually in the south. Not really especially the redneck South you're trying to describe. It would have worked though if it was Arkansas or West Virgina

A lot of past cultures and mythologies didn't have the stigma surrounding incest that we do today. In some courtly traditions, it was considered more ideal, so as to keep the bloodline "pure". So yeah, you'll encounter it all over the place if you search for it in older traditions.

Yes well, that was all standard fare a couple thousand years ago. Besides, I don't think Godly fluids carry diseases from such coupling. They have all evolved a bit from that behaviour. I mean, Thor in his younger days used to deal with any problem by killing it. He's learned to be more patient and give people a chance - for a couple of minutes anyway.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
A lot of past cultures and mythologies didn't have the stigma surrounding incest that we do today. In some courtly traditions, it was considered more ideal, so as to keep the bloodline "pure". So yeah, you'll encounter it all over the place if you search for it in older traditions.

Ok but I dont think it was common in Norse culture.


Originally posted by roughrider
Yes well, that was all standard fare a couple thousand years ago. Besides, I don't think Godly fluids carry diseases from such coupling. They have all evolved a bit from that behaviour. I mean, Thor in his younger days used to deal with any problem by killing it. He's learned to be more patient and give people a chance - for a couple of minutes anyway.

...Ok I hope your talking about the Marvel Thor, and not the one from Norse mythology :

Originally posted by Hercules
Its based on a story from the Volsunga saga in Norse mythology which may or may not have taken insperation from Beowulf which is an older Saxon poem.

Sigmund was never Thor in that though, although he did encounter and later do battle with Odin in mortal disguise and yes he did have a child by his sister but she came to him in disguise at the time.

Their son was called Sinfjötli and actually died before Sigmund did and Odin himself ferried him to Valhalla.

So yes there were cases of incest in Norse Mythology which is a part of Norse culture.

Actually you are right. When I said I dont think it was common in Norse culture I meant by actual Norse people.

Also in hindsight as far as I know. In Norse lore when a person was born it was believed to be a reincarnation of a person. So its actually not that far removed from Norse Lore.

I just dont like the idea of Thor being at the mercy of Odin. Thor doesnt have to take orders from Odin in Norse Lore, niether do any gods for that matter.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok but I dont think it was common in Norse culture.
Helllooo... Ymir's feet got together and birthed a six headed monster. If that's not foot on foot incest I don't know what is.

Also, his armpits gave birth to a giant son and a giantess daughter.

Norse mythology is F'd up.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
Helllooo... Ymir's feet got together and birthed a six headed monster. If that's not foot on foot incest I don't know what is.

Also, his armpits gave birth to a giant son and a giantess daughter.

Norse mythology is F'd up.

Er you know that incest is common in probably all mythology. You are joking right?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Er you that incest is common in probably all mythology. You are joking right?
No, that's his actual history. He also fed from the four rivers of milk from a giant magic cow that was formed from frost drippings.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
No, that's his actual history. He also fed from the four rivers of milk from a giant magic cow that was formed from frost drippings.

Bro their supposed to be symbolic. Like dreams. You see wierd stuff in dreams but your dreams actually have meaning if you analyse the symbols in your dreams.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Bro their supposed to be symbolic. Like dreams. You see wierd stuff in dreams but your dreams actually have meaning if you analyse the symbols in your dreams.
Are you sure people of ancient times weren't just stupid and gullible? Because some of them believed the sun was pulled across the sky by goats.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
Are you sure people of ancient times weren't just stupid and gullible? Because some of them believed the sun was pulled across the sky by goats.

Whoa, Swank..

ermm, ix-nay on the oopid-stay.. IIRC Alfheim believes in all of this Nordic Pagan shizat (for loss of a better phrase).

I'm pretty sure Pagan and Norse religion are two completely different things.

From my understanding Pagans believe in the earth itself as their deity. Mother earth, or the triple goddess ideal (Maiden, Mother, Crone ect ).

Norse have a pantheon.

Personally the perfect religion was created by the Germans.

Originally posted by grey fox
I'm pretty sure Pagan and Norse religion are two completely different things.

From my understanding Pagans believe in the earth itself as their deity. Mother earth, or the triple goddess ideal (Maiden, Mother, Crone ect ).

Norse have a pantheon.

Personally the perfect religion was created by the Germans.

Never knew you were a Nazi, Fox

Considering the even worse stories from Greek mythology, this one isn't that bad.

that story makes thor his own uncle and nephew, as well, being his own sister's son. i don't see where it makes him his own brother, though.

Originally posted by Martian_mind
Yep,you heard right,I was just reading some old Thor,and it turns out that in a past life where Thor was Sigmund,he had his family taken away,and he and Odin(disguised as a mortal dad) went around killing the viking clan that took them,long story short,dad left,Thor was beaten,went to a house and found his long lost sister wed to a cruel abusive husband,and thus they fled(fair enough).

I first suspected something was up when his siter once called him her "Beloved",but dismissed it for then.however,when Thor dies in combat,it turns out his siter is pregnant with HIS child?

It also turns out,that this baby is a reincarnation of Thor yet again,making Thor his own

1.Brother
2.Father
3.son

and his siter his

1.Wife
2.Mother
3.sister


....am i the only one who finds that a tad wack?

You oughta watch the RingCycle. On second thought the boredom would kill you.

Originally posted by The Fake Macoy
Considering the even worse stories from Greek mythology, this one isn't that bad.

True

The Incest thing is nothing new for gods of mythology

However, having Thor be his own son?!? That's just f*cked up beyond belief

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
Are you sure people of ancient times weren't just stupid and gullible? Because some of them believed the sun was pulled across the sky by goats.

Er again to understand mythology you need to understand thats its symbolic. Even the stories in the Bible are not to be taken literially. The Fall of Man is not literially two naked people in a garden its about duality.

I also dont consider "primitive" people to be more stupid. At the end of the day as Morpheus put it reality is just electrical signals going to the brain, what you believe affects your reality, this is why religous people sometimes experience miracles that confirm their faith.

The American Indians were primitive but I think their society in some ways is better than present American society.



Originally posted by grey fox
I'm pretty sure Pagan and Norse religion are two completely different things.

From my understanding Pagans believe in the earth itself as their deity. Mother earth, or the triple goddess ideal (Maiden, Mother, Crone ect ).

Norse have a pantheon.

Yyyyyyes nowhere days. Paganism could refer to heathenism but Norse pagans started using heathenism more because they wanted to seperate themselves from the fluffy wiccans.

I dont like using the word pagan because its Latin, but if you call yourself heathen you have to end up explaing yourself.

Originally posted by grey fox

Personally the perfect religion was created by the Germans.

In all fairness alot of pre-christian religons seem to be this way but theres nothing wrong with Christanity it just depends on how you intepret it.

Christanity is deeper and more complicated than people think.

Originally posted by Alfheim

Yyyyyyes nowhere days. Paganism could refer to heathenism but Norse pagans started using heathenism more because they wanted to seperate themselves from the fluffy wiccans.

I dont like using the word pagan because its Latin, but if you call yourself heathen you have to end up explaing yourself.


In all fairness alot of pre-christian religons seem to be this way but theres nothing wrong with Christanity it just depends on how you intepret it.

Christanity is deeper and more complicated than people think.

Well no. My personal preference for German religion is because not only is it a twist upon the Norse , but it's extremely simple.

Take the Goths for example. They worshipped a god with a three letter name (Tyz , in Norse he's Tyr whom sacrificed his hand to bind Fenrir) , whose worship is exemplified by murdering your enemies and letting your weapons dangle from a Tree's branches.

Badass

Originally posted by grey fox

Take the Goths for example. They worshipped a god with a three letter name (Tyz , in Norse he's Tyr whom sacrificed his hand to bind Fenrir) , whose worship is exemplified by murdering your enemies and letting your weapons dangle from a Tree's branches.

Badass

I think its more complicated than that.

Furthermore the biggest badasses seem to be the beserkers, but in all fairness that sort of thing is not unique to the Norse culture, for example in S.Africa you have the leopard men.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Er again to understand mythology you need to understand thats its symbolic. Even the stories in the Bible are not to be taken literially. The Fall of Man is not literially two naked people in a garden its about duality.

I also dont consider "primitive" people to be more stupid. At the end of the day as Morpheus put it reality is just electrical signals going to the brain, what you believe affects your reality, this is why religous people sometimes experience miracles that confirm their faith.
This just proves my point, because there are some who do believe the garden of eden was an actual place with two naked people in it, just as people in the past believed thunder was Zeus expressing anger or whatever.


True, but they had much less crap to deal with and it really says nothing either way.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
This just proves my point, because there are some who do believe the garden of eden was an actual place with two naked people in it, just as people in the past believed thunder was Zeus expressing anger or whatever.

No it doesnt. I elaborated and said that what you believe alters your reality, as far as im concerned if people believe that the sun is being pulled by chariots then thats what it is. As I said before this is why relgious people experience miracles that confirm their faith. Belief alters reality.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna

True, but they had much less crap to deal with and it really says nothing either way.

Well why do you think they had less crap to deal with? Becuase they were stupid?

Relatively off-topic, although it's a random topic anyway; subjective sensory perception does not dictate objective actuality. It's pure egotism to suggest such.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Relatively off-topic,

Yeah your right.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

although it's a random topic anyway; subjective sensory perception does not dictate objective actuality. It's pure egotism to suggest such.

Weve had this discussion before. If thats what you think, fine. Ive asked you before please not to respond to my posts. I would put you on ignore but I cant be bothered.

Anyway off topic.

Hooray? Don't care. Do as you like, while I do the same. Think what you like, while I derive from factual bases.

Please add me to your ignore list.

Originally posted by Alfheim
No it doesnt. I elaborated and said that what you believe alters your reality, as far as im concerned if people believe that the sun is being pulled by chariots then thats what it is. As I said before this is why relgious people experience miracles that confirm their faith. Belief alters reality.
So this is all hoity toity "What is real?" talk? That saves me a lot of time.


Short answer: Yes.

Though it's a real possibility it wasn't them but some of their ways that were stupid.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
So this is all hoity toity "What is real?" talk? That saves me a lot of time.


Bro there are examples of several people experienceing the supernatural at the sametime. I don think it confirms that their belief is correct. Its just correct for them, because what happens is that then other people experience something contradicatory.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna

Short answer: Yes.

Though it's a real possibility it wasn't them but some of their ways that were stupid.

Thats just shallow. I can see this thread going down the tubes.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Bro there are examples of several people experienceing the supernatural at the sametime. I don think it confirms that their belief is correct. Its just correct for them, because what happens is that then other people experience something contradicatory.
That's bogus though. If I get clocked in the head with a pipe by my bookie and I see two of him now, and everything's green, that doesn't mean there really is two bookies after me now and they turned green. It's just extenuating circumstances skewing my vision of reality. Just as stupidity, or ignorance if that's a more palatable word, skewed reality for people of the past.


If I find a culture that doesn't have stupid crap in it, I'll let you know.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
That's bogus though. If I get clocked in the head with a pipe by my bookie and I see two of him now, and everything's green, that doesn't mean there really is two bookies after me now and they turned green. It's just extenuating circumstances skewing my vision of reality. Just as stupidity, or ignorance if that's a more palatable word, skewed reality for people of the past.


Er you do know that doesnt relate to my post. I said if several people perceive the supernatural not just you. For example if several people see a ghost like figure going into my room and neither of them have been hit on the head or have been taking drugs, then maybe thats what they saw.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna

If I find a culture that doesn't have stupid crap in it, I'll let you know.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Er you do know that doesnt relate to my post. I said if several people perceive the supernatural not just you. For example if several people see a ghost like figure going into my room and neither of them have been hit on the head or have been taking drugs, then maybe thats what they saw.
It's an example of extenuating circumstances.

Specifically regarding your supernatural situation, it could be the idea is planted that the house is haunted and/or it could be the area has a natural static build up or something that effects their vision and/or reflections coupled with the natural human reaction to find a humanoid form in what they see and/or they need to call Ghostbusters. In that situation there's no conclusion as to what it is they see. At least one that isn't based purely on "belief".

People believing the sun is a chariot being ridden across the sky doesn't make it real, it makes them stupid. Or ignorant. Whatever.


Sorry to be such a downer.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
It's an example of extenuating circumstances.

Exactly. It doesnt fit your view of reality therefore its "extenuating circumstances".

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna

Specifically regarding your supernatural situation, it could be the idea is planted that the house is haunted and/or it could be the area has a natural static build up or something that effects their vision and/or reflections coupled with the natural human reaction to find a humanoid form in what they see and/or they need to call Ghostbusters. In that situation there's no conclusion as to what it is they see. At least one that isn't based purely on "belief".

Nobody was given information that the house was haunted, so you failed. Considering that several people saw it reinforces that it probably was what muslims call a Jinn.



Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna

People believing the sun is a chariot being ridden across the sky doesn't make it real, it makes them stupid. Or ignorant. Whatever.

Yeah well I think people who have no family values and who are obsessed with gaining fame and wealth are stupid.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Exactly. It doesnt fit your view of reality therefore its "extenuating circumstances".
No, in that situation my view isn't reality because it isn't real.


Without more information, I was forced to fill in the blanks, exactly what the people of the past had to do. Of course they weren't as scientifically advanced as we are today so they came up with stuff like gods crying for rain and talkative nymphs creating echoes.


Well, I think it depends on the motivation, but for the most part I agree. Though my goals are similar: Be cool, be respected (in part by being respectful), and make enough to not live in a ditch.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Relatively off-topic, although it's a random topic anyway; subjective sensory perception does not dictate objective actuality. It's pure egotism to suggest such. Wouldn't it just be easier to call subjective validation.. or say anecodotal evidence doesn't count?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah your right.



Weve had this discussion before. If thats what you think, fine. Ive asked you before please not to respond to my posts. I would put you on ignore but I cant be bothered.

Anyway off topic. X is right though. Take for example the cases of those who've had their preceptions altered by chemicals. or those persons who naturally have mental disorders. One own's preception may dictate their own reality, however they clearly do not effect other's realities, noer that of what is actual. And isn't it selfish to say that the way you preceive things to be is the way things are? Certainly it would be for me to say the way I preceive things to be is the way they are. Especially when tainted by the bias of both how you were raised and how you are genetically wired.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
No, in that situation my view isn't reality because it isn't real.

According to your defintion.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna

Without more information, I was forced to fill in the blanks, exactly what the people of the past had to do. Of course they weren't as scientifically advanced as we are today so they came up with stuff like gods crying for rain and talkative nymphs creating echoes.

Your not sticking to the subject I was refereing to something that happened in 1998. Im not talking about people of the past in that post you quoted.


Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna

Well, I think it depends on the motivation, but for the most part I agree. Though my goals are similar: Be cool, be respected (in part by being respectful), and make enough to not live in a ditch.

Fair enough.


Originally posted by Creshosk
Wouldn't it just be easier to call subjective validation.. or say anecodotal evidence doesn't count?

Its not subjective when several people percieve the same thing. Its subjective when one person percieves it.

Originally posted by Creshosk

X is right though. Take for example the cases of those who've had their preceptions altered by chemicals. or those persons who naturally have mental disorders. One own's preception may dictate their own reality, however they clearly do not effect other's realities, noer that of what is actual. And isn't it selfish to say that the way you preceive things to be is the way things are? Certainly it would be for me to say the way I preceive things to be is the way they are. Especially when tainted by the bias of both how you were raised and how you are genetically wired.


That doesnt apply when several or more than one person percieve a miracle or supernatural. That applies to one person.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Its not subjective when several people percieve the same thing. Its subjective when one person percieves it.




That doesnt apply when several or more than one person percieve a miracle or supernatural. That applies to one person. Actually it is. and your appeals to the populous are just as valid... in that they're not.

Sometime ago the majority of society precived the earth to be flat and a geocentric solar system. Because relative to their position and percpective the world was flat and the sun literally rose and set. rather than the earth being so large that the curve was to subtle to really be precieved by the human eye and we had no way of seeing that the earth revolved around the sun and rotated on its axis.

Human percpective can never truly see the truth even if we think we do.

Originally posted by Creshosk

Human percpective can never truly see the truth even if we think we do.

Well I think reality is subjective. All Im saying is that its obnoxious to say that people are hallucinating when several people percieve something that conflicts what you believe in.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well I think reality is subjective. Well, that's your subjective opinion.

Reality itself isn't subjective, our preceptions of it are.

Like we're so predisposed to aspects of our own cultures that when we see things we don't understand our brains try to relate them to things we do.

For example if several people saw some dust particles moving around and for a few moments took on a vauge human shape, those people might be predisposed to see it as a ghost. It's just how our brains work, they try to make sense of that which they don't understand.. Heck, we do that quite a bit here on the forums of interpreting comic book events...

Originally posted by Creshosk
Well, that's your subjective opinion.


Yeah

Originally posted by Creshosk

Reality itself isn't subjective, our preceptions of it are.

and thats your opinion.

Originally posted by Creshosk

Like we're so predisposed to aspects of our own cultures that when we see things we don't understand our brains try to relate them to things we do.

Or another possibility is that they did see a Jinn.

Originally posted by Creshosk

For example if several people saw some dust particles moving around and for a few moments took on a vauge human shape, those people might be predisposed to see it as a ghost. It's just how our brains work, they try to make sense of that which they don't understand.. Heck, we do that quite a bit here on the forums of interpreting comic book events...


Why are you assuming that they had to be dust particles?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah



and thats your opinion.No.. that's the way it is. Reality exists seperate from any of our consiousnesses. We can't know what it truly is other than the fact that it is seperate from the way we preceive it.

Suggesting that reality actually IS different for each person isn't just ignorant.. its down right stupid. Little kids tie towlels around their necks and think they can fly. If you were right then their preception of reality would be true for them and they would be able to fly. But you know that that's absurd because they wind up falling and getting themselves hurt.

Reality exists in a certain form. What it is I cannot say, I can only tell you how I preceive it to be.

Thinking that it's truly subjective commits both the stolen concept fallacy and the relitivist fallacy.


Originally posted by Alfheim
Or another possibility is that they did see a Jinn.Not likely. Tell me what other evidence is there of this supposed jinn's presence? You know anything to support something more than a mundane explination?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Why are you assuming that they had to be dust particles? Because its a more logical explination than a culturally subjective interpritation of something.

Originally posted by Creshosk
No.. that's the way it is. Reality exists seperate from any of our consiousnesses. We can't know what it truly is other than the fact that it is seperate from the way we preceive it.

Suggesting that reality actually IS different for each person isn't just ignorant.. its down right stupid. Little kids tie towlels around their necks and think they can fly. If you were right then their preception of reality would be true for them and they would be able to fly. But you know that that's absurd because they wind up falling and getting themselves hurt.

Reality exists in a certain form. What it is I cannot say, I can only tell you how I preceive it to be.

Thinking that it's truly subjective commits both the stolen concept fallacy and the relitivist fallacy.

Maybe somewhere in the world somebody can fly. All im saying is that belief affects reality and just because somebody perceives something that conflicts my beliefs doesnt make it wrong.

Originally posted by Creshosk

Not likely. Tell me what other evidence is there of this supposed jinn's presence? You know anything to support something more than a mundane explination?

1. They were not on drugs, drunk or half asleep.
2. They know what a shadow looks like and they know what a man looks like.....and humans dont look like that.
3. Since when do dust particles form into a shape of a man and start walking into peoples room?
4. There were no reports of a burglar dressed up in black breaking into peoples houses.

Originally posted by Creshosk

Because its a more logical explination than a culturally subjective interpritation of something.

Ok so your opinion isnt subjective is that what you're telling me?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Maybe somewhere in the world somebody can fly. All im saying is that belief affects reality and just because somebody perceives something that conflicts my beliefs doesnt make it wrong.On things that are subjective in and of themselves like preferences sure. However if its about how reality functions, things that are objective.. then no. Your beliefs won't change the way things are.

Originally posted by Alfheim
1. They were not on drugs, drunk or half asleep.
2. They know what a shadow looks like and they know what a man looks like.....and humans dont look like that.
3. Since when do dust particles form into a shape of a man and start walking into peoples room?
4. There were no reports of a burglar dressed up in black breaking into peoples houses.Since when do clouds look like stuff? It's like seeing "the devil" in wood grain. Much like a roshach test. They thought they saw something that exists in their culture. Their brains acting much like a cd filled in the gaps and their brains thought they saw something. With no lasting proof to be verified I'm affraid that all it is is a group consiousness. Much like the people who thought the earth was flat because they couldn't see the curve of the earth. Or people who thought the sun revolved around the earth because they couldn't see things from an outside perspective. Numbers don't matter.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok so your opinion isnt subjective is that what you're telling me? Are you even capable of understanding the words I write in front of you or are you being deliberatly stupid?

Originally posted by Creshosk
On things that are subjective in and of themselves like preferences sure. However if its about how reality functions, things that are objective.. then no. Your beliefs won't change the way things are.

Again thats your opinion. If thats what you think fine.

Originally posted by Creshosk

Since when do clouds look like stuff? It's like seeing "the devil" in wood grain. Much like a roshach test. They thought they saw something that exists in their culture. Their brains acting much like a cd filled in the gaps and their brains thought they saw something. With no lasting proof to be verified I'm affraid that all it is is a group consiousness. Much like the people who thought the earth was flat because they couldn't see the curve of the earth. Or people who thought the sun revolved around the earth because they couldn't see things from an outside perspective. Numbers don't matter.

Ok fine you thought they saw dust particles. Maybe it was, maybe it wasnt. How do you explain several people actually seeing stuff fly through the air?

Originally posted by Creshosk

Are you even capable of understanding the words I write in front of you or are you being deliberatly stupid?

Look the point is your opinion is subjective as well. I didnt say anything stupid......shheeeesshhh.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Again thats your opinion. If thats what you think fine.If you beleive that then you might want to be tested for Schizophrenia.

Its not just my opinion my friend. but reality the world around us exists seperate and independant from any human preception.

Or are you saying that without humans the earth would cease to exist?

Isn't that rather selfish and arrogant a thing to say?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok fine you thought they saw dust particles. Maybe it was, maybe it wasnt. How do you explain several people actually seeing stuff fly through the air?Because stuff flew through the air for them to see...

Originally posted by Alfheim
:rollseye: Its a valid question. I'm not sure if you're deliberatly trying not to understand me or if you legitimatly cannot wrap your mind around what I'm saying.

Originally posted by Creshosk
If you beleive that then you might want to be tested for Schizophrenia.

Its not just my opinion my friend. but reality the world around us exists seperate and independant from any human preception.

Or are you saying that without humans the earth would cease to exist?

Isn't that rather selfish and arrogant a thing to say?

Because stuff flew through the air for them to see...

I dont think its thats simple but nevermind.


Originally posted by Creshosk

Its a valid question. I'm not sure if you're deliberatly trying not to understand me or if you legitimatly cannot wrap your mind around what I'm saying.

Look if you say people who see ghosts are just halluicinating, thats YOUR opinion, right?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Look the point is your opinion is subjective as well. I didnt say anything stupid......shheeeesshhh. So then what you're incapable of understanding it the difference between fact and opinion...

Originally posted by Alfheim
I dont think its thats simple but nevermind. There's no need to overcomplicate matters.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Look if you say people who see ghosts are just halluicinating, thats YOUR opinion, right? The fact of the matter that is in quesitons is if they actually saw ghosts. This is not something that is subjective. Either they saw ghosts, or they saw something else and only preceived it to be ghosts.

And besides I never said they were hallucinating. Look, do you know what a Rorschach test is?

Originally posted by Creshosk
So then what you're incapable of understanding it the difference between fact and opinion...

No im not. I just have a different view of what reality is. That doesnt mean I think its as simple as "I think I can fly therefore I will."

Originally posted by Creshosk

Either they saw ghosts, or they saw something else and only preceived it to be ghosts.


I agree.


Originally posted by Creshosk

Look, do you know what a Rorschach test is?

Yes I know what a Rorschach test. You look at a piece of paper with an ink blotch or what not and different people see different things. What they believe affects what they see.

Originally posted by Creshosk


And besides I never said they were hallucinating.

Saying that they saw dust particles implies that they were hallucinating. At any rate I agree its possible that they saw something else. All im saying is to assume that there is no possibility of it being a ghost or a jinn is obnoxious.

Anyway you were saying that they were not hallucinating they just saw something they didnt understand...maybe.

Originally posted by Alfheim
No im not. I just have a different view of what reality is. That doesnt mean I think its as simple as "I think I can fly therefore I will." Well I suppose your difference could still be on the subjective effected by preception level... I guess there's nothing wrong with that.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes I know what a Rorschach test. You look at a piece of paper with an ink blotch or what not and different people see different things. What they believe affects what they see. And so you know how they're seeing things in the ink blotches. things that aren't really depicted but the mind allows itself to see?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Saying that they saw dust particles implies that they were hallucinating.Uh.. no?

Originally posted by Alfheim
At any rate I agree its possible that they saw something else. All im saying is to assume that there is no possibility of it being a ghost or a jinn is obnoxious. As obnoxious as it is, the posability only exists with evidence... You do realize how culturally limited a jinn is though right? Only those that strongly beleive in a jinn say they saw one.
While to everyone else they never say they saw a jinnt? Isn't that ... odd?

So do Jinn only exist in the areas where people beleive in them? why do you suppose that would be?

Originally posted by Creshosk

And so you know how they're seeing things in the ink blotches. things that aren't really depicted but the mind allows itself to see?




I wont deny thats a possibility.

Originally posted by Creshosk


So do Jinn only exist in the areas where people beleive in them? why do you suppose that would be?

Well no they dont. There are examples of people seeing ghosts without believing in them.

Bro I dont have all the answers neither does science. I just dont think reality is as "solid" as people think it is.

srug

Originally posted by Alfheim
I wont deny thats a possibility.



Well no they dont. There are examples of people seeing ghosts without believing in them.

Bro I dont have all the answers neither does science. I just dont think reality is as "solid" as people think it is.

srug Oh it is. but as I said our problem is our preception of reailty is all we'll ever have. It's not possible for us to ever truly know what reality turly is because everything we preceive is colored by our own expereinces and our genetic hardwiring. Even our "evidence" and "proof" is merely our interpritation of reality which is also colored by our expereinces and genetic hardwiring.

Ghosts might obbjectively exist. But people refuse to acknowledge them due to their experiences with other skeptics.

We may never know. *shrugs*

Originally posted by Creshosk
Even our "evidence" and "proof" is merely our interpritation of reality which is also colored by our expereinces and genetic hardwiring.

Ghosts might obbjectively exist. But people refuse to acknowledge them due to their experiences with other skeptics.

We may never know. *shrugs*

I would agree with all of that.

Ha.

Thor owns.

I think Creshosk pretty much went through what I was saying except I maintain that people from the middle ages, in that general time period, were dummies.

Also, Casanova's post would of been an awesome finishing post had I not ruined it by posting this.

Originally posted by Alfheim
People in the middle ages didnt think the earth was flat.
That's not my entire basis of judgment.


Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
and/or they need to call Ghostbusters.

Maybe you didn't see the movie. It was about these scientists who studied the paranormal but everyone thought they were crackpots. Then a demon or something opens a portal and real ghosts start showing up so they band together with their untested nuclear equipment and start trapping these ghosts. They call themselves Ghostbusters.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna


Maybe you didn't see the movie. It was about these scientists who studied the paranormal but everyone thought they were crackpots. Then a demon or something opens a portal and real ghosts start showing up so they band together with their untested nuclear equipment and start trapping these ghosts. They call themselves Ghostbusters.

.......Ok. Dont remember you making a post about Ghostbusters on this thread.

Originally posted by Martian_mind
Yep,you heard right,I was just reading some old Thor,and it turns out that in a past life where Thor was Sigmund,he had his family taken away,and he and Odin(disguised as a mortal dad) went around killing the viking clan that took them,long story short,dad left,Thor was beaten,went to a house and found his long lost sister wed to a cruel abusive husband,and thus they fled(fair enough).

I first suspected something was up when his siter once called him her "Beloved",but dismissed it for then.however,when Thor dies in combat,it turns out his siter is pregnant with HIS child?

It also turns out,that this baby is a reincarnation of Thor yet again,making Thor his own

1.Brother
2.Father
3.son

and his siter his

1.Wife
2.Mother
3.sister


....am i the only one who finds that a tad wack?


Interesting. Which issues?

Thor and the Eterenals vol 2 has all the story,.

Incest is fairly common in myths.

I'm however was much more suprised to find out that Loki is a fully capable hermaphrodite in the oringinal myths.

He aparently not only sired offspring but birthed them as well.

He was the mother of Odin's eight legged horse Sleipnir. It is also said that he birthed all female monsters after eating the burnt heart of a woman and that he spent eight years on earth as a woman milking cows and bearing children.

Truely the most ambiguous of beings.

Originally posted by littleredhat
Incest is fairly common in myths.

I'm however was much more suprised to find out that Loki is a fully capable hermaphrodite in the oringinal myths.

He aparently not only sired offspring but birthed them as well.

He was the mother of Odin's eight legged horse Sleipnir. It is also said that he birthed all female monsters after eating the burnt heart of a woman and that he spent eight years on earth as a woman milking cows and bearing children.

Truely the most ambiguous of beings.

Yeah but also Thor is said to have given birth to nine madiens. Thor in another story uses sex to destroy an evil women. Thor isnt as straight forward as people think either.