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Straight out saber duel, setting is an open field in Naboo, who takes it?

Maul easily.

Seriously Anakin beats him comfortably, however I'm sure others will say not...

Considering Anakin wtfpwned Dooku, I see no reason to think Maul would beat him.

Well, Maul beat up a bunch of battle droids in a comic book. As such, he's more then a match for Anakin.

Hmmm, my overall sarcasm is on level 10(my girlfriend calls me emotionally cut off), while yours seems to be stuck at a -2...

Indeed.

At this point it doesn't really matter. I'm just poking fun to poke fun, I'm over the irritation I had him with him. That was so last week.

Anakin Skywalker takes this.

Skywalker after a great battle.

Anakin wins but after a good fight with some difficulty.

Anakin destroys him easily, Maul doesn't have a prayer.

Anakin takes this but he gets a tough fight. Maul's pretty high up there.

BTW, Hey everyone! I'm new here. Been reading posts here every now and then for the last few days and decided to join in. I know a pretty good amount about Star Wars. I've read like 50 or so of the books since I started them about a year go.

Anakin takes this easily.

^ Why do you think that?

Anakin curbstomps maul.

^ At risk of sounding repetitive, why do you think that?

...Because Anakin tore through Dooku as if he were nothing but paper. However, comparing the situation with Dooku to the hypothetical one with Maul is ridiculous. I have no doubt Anakin will win, but it'll require more effort. Anakin was an onslaught that Dooku couldn't withstand, but Maul is of a different caliber. He's on par (if not superior) to Anakin in strength, speed, and agility, and he's got enormous martial arts skills and fighting prowess.

I think it'd be a good fight, but, yeah, Anakin will win in the end.

I definately agree with you, Gideon, Anakin will win. I just don't understand why anyone would think that Maul would go down easily or get curbstomped.

Originally posted by Lukaton
I definately agree with you, Gideon, Anakin will win. I just don't understand why anyone would think that Maul would go down easily or get curbstomped.

Most people perceive that since Dooku is more powerful than Maul (which he is), he'd get owned in the same fashion.

Makes sense I guess.

Originally posted by Gideon
...Because Anakin tore through Dooku as if he were nothing but paper. However, comparing the situation with Dooku to the hypothetical one with Maul is ridiculous. I have no doubt Anakin will win, but it'll require more effort. Anakin was an onslaught that Dooku couldn't withstand, but Maul is of a different caliber. He's on par (if not superior) to Anakin in strength, speed, and agility, and he's got enormous martial arts skills and fighting prowess.

I think it'd be a good fight, but, yeah, Anakin will win in the end.


True true

Anakin takes this with not much trouble at all. Maul has nothing at all to trouble Skywalker by this point.

And Maul is not physically stronger than Anakin, quite the opposite actually, if you read the novel it mentions more than once how strong he is in that, not his force powers.

I enjoy how the Dooku fans come out of the woodwork to justify that Anakin will own any character, since he owned Dooku. That's not the case:



Yes, he does. Dooku lost because Anakin was essentially a hurricane of unstoppable anger and frustration that Dooku literally could not stop. He essentially became a battering ram. Maul is as ferocious as Anakin and rivals him physically, whereas Dooku was neither.



I'm going to let Jollyjim handle this; he's the resident Darth Maul expert. Suffice it to say that Maul is an uber beast as far as his physical might is concerned. He trained under Sidious's regimen which involved pushing his physical and Force-assisted abilities "to the utmost" according to TPM's Visual Guide, where he couldn't improve at all. His physical resilience was such that he could withstand Force lightning and recover near instantaneously to kick some ass.

I love how you automatically label someone as a fanboy for such a trivial reason as saying that since Anakin beat Dooku he could beat Maul, which is true, actually. How very Antediluvian of you, Gideon.

Dude he said Anakin would win but with effort, not the absolute curbstomp that some people think this fight would be.

Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
I love how you automatically label someone as a fanboy for such a trivial reason as saying that since Anakin beat Dooku he could beat Maul, which is true, actually. How very Antediluvian of you, Gideon.

...And I love it how you don't pay attention. I've argued with Kiddo here before, and he's proven himself to be a staunch Dookuist. Furthermore, the tivial reason is not "Anakin beat Dooku he could beat Maul", it's "Anakin will effortlessly curbstomp" Maul because he curbstomped Dooku.

If you've been paying attention, you'll note that I said that Maul would lose this. Anakin is simply better than he is. But Dooku lost due to circumstances that have no bearing on Maul, who is stronger and more physically able than Dooku.

How very stupid of you.

Originally posted by Gideon
...And I love it how you don't pay attention. I've argued with Kiddo here before, and he's proven himself to be a staunch Dookuist. Furthermore, the tivial reason is not "Anakin beat Dooku he could beat Maul", it's "Anakin will effortlessly curbstomp" Maul because he curbstomped Dooku.

If you've been paying attention, you'll note that I said that Maul would lose this. Anakin is simply better than he is. But Dooku lost due to circumstances that have no bearing on Maul, who is stronger and more physically able than Dooku.

How very stupid of you. DANG SON YOU GOT SERVED!

Originally posted by Gideon
I enjoy how the Dooku fans come out of the woodwork to justify that Anakin will own any character, since he owned Dooku. That's not the case: Ridiculous, i don't think that b/c i am some Dooku fanboy. Maul was a good swordsman but not on Dooku's level either, but Anakin beating Maul easily is not b/c he beat Dooku easily.

Anakin was a better swordsman than Dooku.



What?? What does Maul have that could trouble Anakin?? Anakin is a better swordsman and stronger in the force, Maul has absolutely nothing that could hurt Anakin. And Maul is not physically stronger than Anakin and it would not play into anyway.

Is that so? That was convincing. The disparity between Maul and Dooku in terms of swordsmanship is miniscule.



It's all how you define 'better'. Is he as precise or as calculated? No. Anakin won the fight because he became a whirlwind of power that Dooku could not withstand. Dooku was susceptible to that in ways Maul is not.



I've already explained, but you would rather sit and deny it.



No one denied this.



No one denied this.



Incorrect. Maul had the harder training regimen. He's on par with Anakin in all physical attributes, and one would argue that he is - by far - the superior martial artist.



Prove it.



Prove it. Maul's superior strength and physical ability is what would allow him to withstand Anakin's fury in ways Dooku could not, hence - while Anakin will win this - it will be harder.

To the point of Rampant Ox? Is Count Dooku his favorite character? Does he think Dooku will beat all? If none of those three things are true, then no. He is not a Dooku fanboy, he is just misinformed.

As for your other points, I can give two sh!ts. I don't care all that much about who wins this, and the general consensus isn't that Maul will win, so I have no reason to debate. I was merely calling you out on the fact that you automatically label someone as a fanboy for something like that.

Originally posted by Gideon
Is that so? That was convincing. The disparity between Maul and Dooku in terms of swordsmanship is miniscule. really, how do you figure that?? Dooku went toe to toe w/ Yoda tired and did not get touched, Maul got his saber cut in half and almost beat straight up by a padawan, that 10 years later Dooku compeltly pwned.



How you define better?? Well its not that complicated, Nic Gillard did it very simply. Maul if anything would be more susceptible, the move Anakin pulls on Dooku was not excactly just overwhelming him w/ power.



What the hell does that fact that he can kick better have to do with anything, Anakin would just beat him, hes just way too good in skill, and it would be easier than it was w/ Dooku. Maul was stronger than Yoda, yes, but how easy would that fight be for Yoda, just b/c hes so much better.






I don't have the novel, i remember it metioned more than once how strong he was and im not talking about the Dooku fight, but the point doesn't matter b/c its not about physical strength, Anakin was just way to good with the blade, w/ the darkside in ROTS proably better than anybody in the movies.

I don't gauge the depths of fanboyism, Blaxican. I don't care. If someone is offered irrefutable evidence and they simply deny it or ceaselessly argue it in favor of a particular character, that is fanboyism.



That doesn't surprise me, since those "other points" were the reasons justified me calling him a fanboy. People tend to ignore that which makes them wrong.



...And as I've just proven, I didn't "automatically" call him a fanboy. It was based on previous encounters with Kiddo as well as this. Stick to the comic relief and sarcasm, Blaxican. I'm hardly one of Janus's ilk as you so nicely put it, nor do I make a habit of calling people fanboys without reason. My advice would be to pay closer attention before trying to go all Barry Badass on me.



I can reason.



This is why I call you a Dooku fanboy. There is nothing that remotely suggests Yoda was going full out on Dooku, in fact, there's evidence to the contrary. Couple this with the fact that Dooku couldn't overcome a distracted Yoda on Vjun - a planet steeped in the dark side of the Force - and that RotS proved that Dooku was a master of using the Force to revitalize himself after duels makes me think that is hardly an achievement.



Jollyjim or Advent would hand you your ass in ways I can't on this subject, but suffice it to say that Maul was caught off guard by Obi-Wan - who touched the dark side of the Force at that time. And even then, the TPM novelization stated that Maul was still better. In fact, Darthsith19 proved that Maul was wounded or somesuch before the duel with Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan began. Furthermore, the TPM novelization directly stated that Qui-Gon was more powerful than Obi-Wan. Maul owned him. Conclusion: Maul is thoroughly above and beyond TPM Obi-Wan.



Pardon? Anakin did overwhelm him with superior physical power. He battered the hell out of Dooku's defenses and defeated him through sheer onslaught; in that respect, Anakin won fairly and he is the 'superior' duelist.

However, Maul reigns supreme over Dooku in all physical aspects, so he is not more susceptible to such moves from Anakin. He is less.



No it would not. The RotS novelization stated that Dooku could not meet Anakin strength-for-strength, which was why he had to give ground. Dooku lacked the ability to compensate or match Anakin's sheer physical power. Maul, on the other hand, would have an easier time doing so.



...Yoda's style of swordsmanship is not dependant nor weak when it comes to physical strength. Yoda is similar to Anakin - he becomes a whirlwind of destruction. However, he also substitutes strength for speed, which is why it is near impossible to physically overpower Yoda. Dooku's style and Anakin's style are not as fast as Yoda's.



No, you're missing the point. I'm not denying Anakin is incredibly strong. But Maul is on par with him, if not stronger. He is the more capable martial artist and spent his entire training session improving his physical fitness to the point where he can literally no longer improve. He can't get any better. He pushed his "physical and Force-assisted abilities to the utmost".

Anakin will win, but it will be harder for him to do so in a purely lightsaber duel.

Obviously. You should start gauging more often.





You are... completely correct. However, this:



Doesn't show any fanboyism in it at all, actually. Hell, Dooku isn't even mentioned...





Or... people tend to ignore things that are completely irrelevant to the discussion. But who knows? Maybe it isrelevant in some small way of which I'm not aware.







I usually do, this online forum isn't really worth my spending hours ou tof a day racking my brain and forming an argument on why exactly fictional character A can beat fictional character B. I just deviate every once awhile when I see people being assholes. Except for Advent. Her *******'ism is completely off the charts, and my powers are no match for it.



techincally speaking, I never said you were part of Janus' ilk.



Lately you have done worse, lately you just go around and call people idiots and belittle them. When I first "met" you I respected you because, despite people's idiot debating skillz and own bad attitudes, you restrained yourself from bashing back and keeping a cool head. Lately, however, your posts are riddled with insults, your debates with SW_Legend case in point. You are be becoming like Janus





Now, this weeks session of psyciatric help is over. Next week, we'll discuss this love triangle between you, Sexy, and Advent.

I don't think I need to. That would be like comparing a guy who's murdered two people to a guy who's murdered three. Who cares which one's murdered more? Both are murderers, and both should be punished. The only time gauging should be involved is to see which fanboy gets the greater ass-chewing. Suffice it to say I'm restrained.



...And I told you, this is based off of prior arguments with Kiddo. In fact, if you read his continuing rebuttles, it shows a massive fanboy tendancy for Dooku.



I called him a Dooku fanboy. He is one. He's even basing this entire argument off of his duel with Dooku, or has he posted any other reasons why Maul would lose?



Advent has her special (feared) way of debating that none of us like to face. I was even worried about posting this.



You said it was very Antedivulian of me. Typically, when one exhibits a trait similar to that which you refer, they are that which you refer.



Ah, no. I make an argument. I don't just say "you're stupid!". In fact, the only person I've called that is LeGenD. I haven't even called Kiddo here stupid.



There is only so much restraint that a 16-year-old can give. That I managed to do it for 2 years in ways that Janus couldn't amazes me enough. LeGenD annoys me, because I used to be very patient with him.

I thought that Dooku loosing his fight against Anakin was because of Dookus own form II being weak against Anakins Djen So (ore something like that)

Advent and Jollyjim are sure to have manhandled that feat by Obi Wan, I'm sure about that, but isn't the Movie (apart from Lucas) the greatest and most reliable source (highest Canon) and in the Movie Maul gets owned, in the book a entirely different story, also the handbook of TPM says that Obi Wan was close to drawing on the same energies but never actually did so, as for Maul being wounded when was that to have happend to be exact?

Just questions.

Well dude Maul held his own against both a master and apprentice and after killing Qui-Gon was surprised by Obi-Wan. In a straight up fight Maul would've won.

in the star wars episode one darth maul journal he got wounded in a fight by having his leg cut by some kind of space pirates this happend shortly before he fought Qui Gon on tatooine that is how he was wounded going into the fight against Obi Wan and Qui Gon

What?? I did not even bring Dooku in this, you just said i was fanboy b/c Maul would get beat easily. The reason i said was very simple, Maul has nothing to trouble Anakin and the fact that everybody in here would agree with, that Anakin is a better swordsman, and stronger in the force, thats it. The only person being a fanboy is you about Maul, saying that his martial arts training would come into play . Theres nothing really to debate here, we all know who would win, its just whether he would get pwned or put up some fight.


And again how do you "reason" that Maul and Dooku's difference in sabers in miniscule?

Maul's no Goddamn joke, he fought Obi-wan and Qui-gon simultaneously while injured, killed the stronger of the two, but was then surprised and was killed by Obi-wan. Anakin would win, but it wouldn't be a ****in curbstomp.

100% agreed. Anakin wins, no doubt about that, but this isn't an easy fight just because he owned Dooku.

I do believe Anakin can effortlessly defeat Maul, because one of the reasons, is him trashing Dooku. But his victory against Dooku, wasn't just because he was physically more powerful, if that is the case, anyone who is physically strong can defeat Dooku easily and yet, he(Dooku), had no problems dealing with General Grievous, easily the most physically strong fighter in the movies, if he had problem with Anakin, he should have even bigger problems with Grievous and yet he didn't. Anakin won so laughably easy, because of combination of strength, speed, skill, stamina......(his Force reserve is the biggest, i mean, he tires the slowest in the movies), his blows were just so fast and powerful, Dooku didn't have the time to do anything, but to defend for his very life(and Dooku can contend with Yodas sped). Like Gideon said about Yoda, that he becomes a whirlwind of destruction, Anakin is even worst. Dooku got overwhelmed, yea, Maul is more physically more powerful then Dooku and maybe he would do better then Dooku, but not enough, for even a walk in the park defeat. Anakin is just so unstoppable.

The match ups come into play. As it has been said Dooku isn't physically strong like Anakin. But Mual is strong,fast,etc. (like anakin) which means he would fight an aggressive way that is somewhat similar to Anakin's. That could cause a problem that Anakin would overcome but it means there is a chance he could last longer than Dooku. (I'm not saying Maul>Dooku)

Originally posted by Count Makashi
I do believe Anakin can effortlessly defeat Maul, because one of the reasons, is him trashing Dooku. But his victory against Dooku, wasn't just because he was physically more powerful, if that is the case, anyone who is physically strong can defeat Dooku easily and yet, he(Dooku), had no problems dealing with General Grievous, easily the most physically strong fighter in the movies, if he had problem with Anakin, he should have even bigger problems with Grievous and yet he didn't. Anakin won so laughably easy, because of combination of strength, speed, skill, stamina......(his Force reserve is the biggest, i mean, he tires the slowest in the movies), his blows were just so fast and powerful, Dooku didn't have the time to do anything, but to defend for his very life(and Dooku can contend with Yodas sped). Like Gideon said about Yoda, that he becomes a whirlwind of destruction, Anakin is even worst. Dooku got overwhelmed, yea, Maul is more physically more powerful then Dooku and maybe he would do better then Dooku, but not enough, for even a walk in the park defeat. Anakin is just so unstoppable.

Yes, Anakin wins but he by no means pwns. Maul bested the Order's finest swordsman (Anoon Bondara). He fought one of the Order's best swordsman and that Jedi's strong apprentice 2 on 1, when not at full strength, and nearly won. And he almost killed Sidious in a lightsaber duel, most of us think ROTS Anakin could likely beat Sidious in a saber duel but that it'd be close. So yeah, Anakin wins, but with a little bit of difficulty.

Maul is way overhyped.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Yes, Anakin wins but he by no means pwns. Maul bested the Order's finest swordsman (Anoon Bondara). He fought one of the Order's best swordsman and that Jedi's strong apprentice 2 on 1, when not at full strength, and nearly won. And he almost killed Sidious in a lightsaber duel, most of us think ROTS Anakin could likely beat Sidious in a saber duel but that it'd be close. So yeah, Anakin wins, but with a little bit of difficulty.

This is true.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Yes, Anakin wins but he by no means pwns. Maul bested the Order's finest swordsman (Anoon Bondara). He fought one of the Order's best swordsman and that Jedi's strong apprentice 2 on 1, when not at full strength, and nearly won. And he almost killed Sidious in a lightsaber duel, most of us think ROTS Anakin could likely beat Sidious in a saber duel but that it'd be close. So yeah, Anakin wins, but with a little bit of difficulty.

This is true.

It's already been done, but I feel like saying it:

Anakin would probably have a harder time with Maul than Dooku. No, I don't think that Maul>>>>Dooku. In Star Wars, A being greater than B and B being greater than C rarely means that A is greater than C. Anakin would have a harder time with Maul due simply to the way they fight.

Dooku is older, obviously. He fights with a style revolving highly around finesse. He relies on a combination quick, highly accurate strikes to disable his opponents (As shown in AotC when fighting Obi-Wan), and Force techniques (As shown when fighting Obi-Wan in RotS). However, seeing as he's older now, he lacks the brute power that certain others such as Anakin and Maul. When faced with someone who has a lot of brute power but not nearly enough skill, such as Anakin in AotC, this isn't a problem. But against opponents like Maul or RotS Anakin who have not only the brute strength, but more than enough skill, he's at a severe disadvantage. Especially considering that both Anakin and Maul are not only highly skilled with sabers, but that they're pretty advanced in terms of hand-to-hand and some grappling abilities.

This means that not only can they overpower a style like Dooku's by putting raw power behind lightsaber strikes (As Anakin tends to do), but he's very poorly defended against simple hand-to-hand attacks. This is clearly shown when Anakin (While in a saber lock, IIRC) grabs his wrists, pulls him forward, and twirls his saber to cut off his hands. He spent time overpowering Dooku with the saber, and finished it by using brute strength, only using his saber to cut off Dooku's hands.

Now, against Maul, this simply wouldn't be as effective. Dooku was physically weaker than Anakin, and as such Anakin had a rather easy time overpowering him with raw physical strength. Maul, on the other hand, is probably just as strong as Anakin (Excluding Anakin's mechanical arm), and as such Anakin wouldn't be able to simply overpower him. Likewise, while Maul might be able to physically overpower Dooku, he couldn't do so with Anakin. With that in mind, it comes down to a matter of saber skill, and Force strength/skill. They both display similar types of Force abilities (Push, grab, etc, etc.), but Anakin has the advantage in power here. Both of them also seem to use rather aggressive saber styles (IIRC, Anakin uses Djem So and Maul uses Juyo style slightly altered for a double-bladed saber).

So in the end, my vote goes towards this:

Force only: Anakin pwns. They haven't displayed too many abilities, but Anakin has much more raw power.

Saber only: It could go either way. Both of them use aggressive styles, both of them have a lot of raw physical strength, and both of them are highly skilled in their styles.

All out: Anakin owns, but probably not quite as easily as he would if it was using the Force only.

Yea, but General Griveous is physically the strongest fighter in the movies and Dooku has no problem with his strength, like i said Anakin won because of his speed, strength..., not just his physical strength, i don't see Maul handling Anakin, a little better, but he would get pwned.

I don't remember Grievous ditching his saber attacks for the sake of grabbing Dooku with his bare hands and yanking him forward...

Anakin wasn't just stronger. He used that strength with more than just lightsaber strikes. Grievous on the other hand seemed to rely almost completely on his lightsabers unless he lost them.

Ok, i have to say it: people say that anakin had great physical strength, that's why he beat dooku. But i mean anakin is, well, a bit slim... I mean, look at him in the AOTC, he is almost pathetically skinny, and even with the hours he had in the gym between the 2nd and the 3rd film, he is still hardly an average man in muscle mass (hardly, because he still quite slim, just seem him shirtless, when he wakes up after the nightmare from padme dying). So, i never understood this "physical power" crap. If you say to me that anakin used his great force power to amplify his strength, i could easily understand how he beat dooku, but now to say that anakin beat dooku with physical strength when grievous couldn't do it to dooku...

Lmao. And Maul is by no means an intimidating hulk of mass, yet he'd crush 99% of the Star Wars mythos in an unarmed brawl. Anakin was strong enough to hold the combined weight of himself, Obi-Wan, and Palpatine with absolutely no trouble - with one freakin' hand.

You are confusing a movie with reality. What i am saying is that, in reality, Hayden is far from being a muscular guy, so what i am saying is that i think it's hilarious to say that anakin's strength came from his "great physic". I simply think it's much more logical to say that his strength is great because he uses the force to amplify it...

Originally posted by kamhal
You are confusing a movie with reality. What i am saying is that, in reality, Hayden is far from being a muscular guy, so what i am saying is that i think it's hilarious to say that anakin's strength came from his "great physic". I simply think it's much more logical to say that his strength is great because he uses the force to amplify it...

Depends on how you define muscular. He's just not overtly so. Wiry, perhaps.

Originally posted by kamhal
You are confusing a movie with reality. What i am saying is that, in reality, Hayden is far from being a muscular guy, so what i am saying is that i think it's hilarious to say that anakin's strength came from his "great physic". I simply think it's much more logical to say that his strength is great because he uses the force to amplify it...

So for Anakin to be physically strong,Haden has to on steroids.

Damn what's with all this talk on Anakin's muscles?

Originally posted by Reality Cell
Straight out saber duel, setting is an open field in Naboo, who takes it?

Anakin WTFpwns Maul in straight up combat.

Anakin would crush maul end of story.

You completly misunderstood me. I am not saying Anakin had to be a bodybuilder or something, but you have to agree that he is hardly an average man when it cames with muscle mass, and it's the muscles from a person's body who gave him his physical strength.

Look whatever, Anakin wins, end of the story.

Two words that destroy the "Anakin can't be as physically strong because he doesn't have crazy muscles" theory:

Cloud. Strife.


Now, to elaborate for anyone who doesn't know about Cloud Strife, Cloud is a relatively non-muscular character in a fictional universe who's capable of lifting a huge iron sword thats about as tall as he is with one hand like it was a stick. The basic point here: This is a fictional universe. In fiction, muscle mass =/= power. As a matter of fact, the skinny guy is often capable of ripping the buff guy in half in fiction. This isn't as common in Star Wars, but even then it's still a fictional universe, and therefore saying "It can't be like that because it doesn't work that way in real life" isn't a very valid argument.

Originally posted by VinCon01
Two words that destroy the "Anakin can't be as physically strong because he doesn't have crazy muscles" theory:

Cloud. Strife.


Now, to elaborate for anyone who doesn't know about Cloud Strife, Cloud is a relatively non-muscular character in a fictional universe who's capable of lifting a huge iron sword thats about as tall as he is with one hand like it was a stick. The basic point here: This is a fictional universe. In fiction, muscle mass =/= power. As a matter of fact, the skinny guy is often capable of ripping the buff guy in half in fiction. This isn't as common in Star Wars, but even then it's still a fictional universe, and therefore saying "It can't be like that because it doesn't work that way in real life" isn't a very valid argument. And FFVII rules.

Anakin wtfpwns Maul.

Indeed it does *Currently waiting for Crisis Core*