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There have often been times in comics when the superhero's powers were removed and he/she had to fight as a normal human being. So who would win in an all out brawl between the following considering that ALL their super powers were removed and they had to fight as just normal human beings:

Thing
Flash
Colossus
Superman
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Woman
Juggernaut
Spiderman

Wonder Woman 1st Place
Thor 2nd Place
Thing 3rd

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Wonder Woman 1st Place
Thor 2nd Place
Thing 3rd precisely

Without powers I would go with Colossus, I mean his quite buff already.

Thor. WW would take it but he has equal training and is physically stronger.

Thor.

WW or Thor.

Thor
WW
Collossus
Thing
Marko

Thor
WW
thing

WW. she's shown more skill consistently over Thor. She wins then Thor. Usually when people say thor wins its because of Mjolnir. without mjolnir i don't see him beating her.

When has Thor shown enough H2H skill to say he can contend with Diana?

Thor because hes a dude.

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
When has Thor shown enough H2H skill to say he can contend with Diana?

10,000 years of training in the underworld killing demons .

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
When has Thor shown enough H2H skill to say he can contend with Diana?
Never.

Originally posted by grey fox
10,000 years of training in the underworld killing demons .

Boo. When has he SHOWN IT.

When he judoplexed Champion insensate on the Kree Homeland

Originally posted by don't shiv
When he judoplexed Champion insensate on the Kree Homeland

Doesn't compare to WW's 3,000 plus known martial arts and her actually showing the use of them.

Originally posted by FrothByte
There have often been times in comics when the superhero's powers were removed and he/she had to fight as a normal human being. So who would win in an all out brawl between the following considering that ALL their super powers were removed and they had to fight as just normal human beings:

Thing
Flash
Colossus
Superman
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Woman
Juggernaut
Spiderman

diana
piotr

Without their powers, thor would be a 6'6", 300lbs something guy (im considering he's not as dense as his 600lbs asgardian self) and he's a GUY. Diana without her powers would just be a girl.

Not that i'm discriminating or anything, but both have had proper training in hand to hand. doesn't matter if thor hasn't shown it, that's just the artist's choice of not showing it. It is stated in his bio, that he is a master of h2h combat, and swordsmanship, and hammer throwing.

I'm not saying that he's a better h2h fighter than ww, i'd say their equal. but when you remove their powers, thor would just be plain faster and stronger.

Originally posted by FrothByte
There have often been times in comics when the superhero's powers were removed and he/she had to fight as a normal human being. So who would win in an all out brawl between the following considering that ALL their super powers were removed and they had to fight as just normal human beings:

Thing
Flash
Colossus
Superman
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Woman
Juggernaut
Spiderman 1st place - Juggernaut
2nd Spidey
3rd WW or Thor

Thor
Wonder Woman
Colossus
Thing
Juggernaut
Superman
Flash
Silver Surfer
Spiderman

Originally posted by Rewmac
1st place - Juggernaut
2nd Spidey
3rd WW or Thor

Ermm . . . wut?

Originally posted by FrothByte
Without their powers, thor would be a 6'6", 300lbs something guy (im considering he's not as dense as his 600lbs asgardian self) and he's a GUY. Diana without her powers would just be a girl.

Not that i'm discriminating or anything, but both have had proper training in hand to hand. doesn't matter if thor hasn't shown it, that's just the artist's choice of not showing it. It is stated in his bio, that he is a master of h2h combat, and swordsmanship, and hammer throwing.

I'm not saying that he's a better h2h fighter than ww, i'd say their equal. but when you remove their powers, thor would just be plain faster and stronger.

Wonder Woman is the master of over 3000 martial arts and unmatched in so many weapons styles it's crazy.

I've never heard that stated anywhere.

Anyway, unless you also put Thor in a normal body he is going to have a rather large strength edge over everyone.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I've never heard that stated anywhere.

Anyway, unless you also put Thor in a normal body he is going to have a rather large strength edge over everyone.

Then you dont' know wonder woman.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Then you dont' know wonder woman.

Really? tell me the issue# and I'll post the quote, I have almost her entire post-crisis run so it shouldn't be to hard.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Wonder Woman is the master of over 3000 martial arts and unmatched in so many weapons styles it's crazy.

anyone who has studied martial arts will tell you that its not how many martial arts you know that counts, but how well you put to use what you do know.

Originally posted by FrothByte
anyone who has studied martial arts will tell you that its not how many martial arts you know that counts, but how well you put to use what you do know.

WW always uses her martial arts skills. How many times have we seen thor use skill?

It doesn't matter if WW knows 10000 martial arts. The fight is WITHOUT POWERS , in the end all she will be is a 120 pound woman contending with the likes of men who are 300+ pounds. I don't care how many 'martial arts' you know if a woman is confronted by a man 4 times her size she goes down everytime.

Martial Arts mean squat.

A. Having multiple styles actually is more difficult to utilise , it makes things harder not easier.

B. Size + Strength advantage usually >>>>> MA Skills. Two Big guy's can take down 1 women trained in Kung-fu and Mui Thai.

Originally posted by grey fox
Martial Arts mean squat.

A. Having multiple styles actually is more difficult to utilise , it makes things harder not easier.

B. Size + Strength advantage usually >>>>> MA Skills.. Never watch MMA, I take it?

Originally posted by Juntai
Never watch MMA, I take it?

What does MMA have to do with a woman fighting 500 pound monsters? I don't care how many styles a WOMAN knows, she is going to get crushed by people that size.

Thor vs Wonder Woman.
http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/3269/slapwd0.jpg

Originally posted by don't shiv
Thor
WW
Collossus
Thing
Marko

I agree with that, only WW before Thor.

Originally posted by joesdabest1
What does MMA have to do with a woman fighting 500 pound monsters? I don't care how many styles a WOMAN knows, she is going to get crushed by people that size. I was talking about the comments altogether, not about Wonder Woman, hinted by the idea I didn't mention Wonder Woman anywhere in my post.

Without their powers would someone 500 pounds be slow?ermm

I'd say Thor first, there is nothing wrong with knowing mixed styles, I do it myself. But people overrate them when they go on about someone knowing xxx amount of styles. It's not how many styles you know, it's how you utilize them.

If Thor is naturally that dense and thick without his other powers, he holds a serious advantage in plain physicality. The others will be more or less ordinary human beings.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
I'd say Thor first, there is nothing wrong with knowing mixed styles, I do it myself. But people overrate them when they go on about someone knowing xxx amount of styles. It's not how many styles you know, it's how you utilize them.

If Thor is naturally that dense and thick without his other powers, he holds a serious advantage in plain physicality. The others will be more or less ordinary human beings. nicely put
and besides its not a bad thing to be behind Thor damn not sayin shes not a beast but this is no pwers stright human, and they still have their fighting styles yet they ARE HUMAN
Thor
WW
Peter/Ben

didn't WW take down Shiva in a sparring match without her powers. and also size won't matter when skill comes in. Sure he's stronger. But she's shown way more skill and i'd be inclined to say that tactically she's better. Skill and smarts trumps size and strength. Are you honestly saying that if one of the world's most skilled martial artists faced a pretty skilled strongman that the strong man would win. no the skill would allow her to win. Size and strength gets pwned by skill.

thor takes first without a doubt. thor for the gold

Originally posted by Superherovandal
didn't WW take down Shiva in a sparring match without her powers. and also size won't matter when skill comes in. Sure he's stronger. But she's shown way more skill and i'd be inclined to say that tactically she's better. Skill and smarts trumps size and strength. Are you honestly saying that if one of the world's most skilled martial artists faced a pretty skilled strongman that the strong man would win. no the skill would allow her to win. Size and strength gets pwned by skill. Except in this case he's a *very* skilled fighter. A skilled person with a vastly superior physicality generally beats a simply skilled person. Besides Batman has outsparred her WITH powers.

The worlds best MA won't beat an elephant. It's just common sense. I think WW can do some wins, but just not the majority.

Originally posted by joesdabest1
What does MMA have to do with a woman fighting? I don't care how many styles a WOMAN knows ermmnone

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
The worlds best MA won't beat an elephant. It's just common sense.

I know some street leveler fanboys who would disagree.


A couple elephants too.

This is the order

Thor
Juggerpimp
Colossus
Thing
WW
Flash
Spiderpus

bump

Originally posted by joesdabest1
This is the order

Thor
Juggerpimp
Colossus
Thing
WW
Flash
Spiderpus
This list is FOS.

Thing is a far better fighter than Colossus.

Originally posted by Nikkolas
Thing is a far better fighter than Colossus.

And WW is a far better fighter than everyone on the list.

down to these 3

Thor
Superman
Colossus

Thor restrains her by the wrists and delivers a beating, they might even make a Lifetime movie of the week out of it. Also, isnt Thing naturally pretty burly too? Didnt he used to run with a streetgang?
(As for the mma thing, MMA now uses weightclasses, hmm I wonder why)

Could Bruce Lee kick the Big Show or Undertaker's ass?

or a better question is:

could bruce lee beat someone like fedor emelianenko

Originally posted by Priest
Thor because hes a dude.


No..and you fail

Good one Angie.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Wonder Woman 1st Place
Thor 2nd Place
Thing 3rd

Hasn't Supes had over 1000 years of training?

Originally posted by Priest
Good one Angie.


...thanks & I know

Should Surfer even be on this list ? - he's not a particularly great fighter.

Also educate me on Flash - is he great hand to hand without his power?

Hell, I'd have thought Flash Thompson over Flash.

I say colossus, here's why. This is a hard question to really interpret: How would it be possible for a normal human to have practiced thousands of years or styles of training? Can that even apply? We know for sure that Peter is a very big athletic muscular man with lots of physical and fighting training in his human form. Everybody else takes some kind of interpretation as to what they would actually be as mortals. Would Thor still be as big? How big was Cain before he got the gem of Cytorrak? How big and well trained would superman be for an equivalent human? And I agree that a woman would get killed by a much bigger man. I say Peter takes it. He would be the only one used to being human anyway, so that along would give him an edge.

Originally posted by Southern_Rebel
Could Bruce Lee kick the Big Show or Undertaker's ass? Lee could spring a 235 lb (107 kg) opponent 15 feet (4.6 metres) away with a 1 inch punch
Lee could cause a 300-lb (136 kg) bag to fly towards and thump the ceiling with a side kick.
My bet is on Bruce but Wikipedia is funny

Originally posted by Tha C-Master

The worlds best MA won't beat an elephant. It's just common sense. I think WW can do some wins, but just not the majority.

Don't they do this in comics all the time? like they beat lions and bears and tigers all the time anyway. (I remember doom beat a lion pretty easy and he's not the best MA. He's no shrimp though) So can Lady Shiva and Batgirl not beat any MA's that are bigger than them?

If thor gets his Asguardian super dense body or whatever then that's a totally different story too.

Skillwise though i'm not sure how much better wonderwoman is than thor. you do never see thor do anything that good martial arts wise but his history makes it so he should be extremely skilled.

let's say that thor doesn't get his asgardian body, but gets what a peak human being gets being his size and muscularity...

so that's around 6'6", probably 300 or something lbs... max weight lifting capability of 800lbs or something

Originally posted by FrothByte
There have often been times in comics when the superhero's powers were removed and he/she had to fight as a normal human being. So who would win in an all out brawl between the following considering that ALL their super powers were removed and they had to fight as just normal human beings:

Thing
Flash
Colossus
Superman
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Woman
Juggernaut
Spiderman

1st: Wonder Woman
2nd: Thor
3rd: Colossus
4th: Thing
5th: Juggernaut
6th: Spider-Man
7th: Silver Surfer
8th: Superman
9th: Flash

Thor has held his own grappling with Hercules. No reason he doesnt deliver a Lifetime movie of the week beatdown here.

Originally posted by FrothByte
There have often been times in comics when the superhero's powers were removed and he/she had to fight as a normal human being. So who would win in an all out brawl between the following considering that ALL their super powers were removed and they had to fight as just normal human beings:

Thing
Flash
Colossus
Superman
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Woman
Juggernaut
Spiderman

thor
colossus
ww
thing
juggernaut
superman
flash
spiderman
surfer

Originally posted by redhotrash
Thor has held his own grappling with Hercules. No reason he doesnt deliver a Lifetime movie of the week beatdown here.

Except for the fact that 2 or 3 people here are much more skilled than him. And he and everyone else is reduced to peak human stats.

And good call on the maker taking away Thor's asgardian advantage. Otherwise, this fight is pointless.

It's really between Clark and Diana. Clark is the only guy here with demonstratible high end skill besides her. He could probably still lose, but he at least can hang and maybe take a few. The others are vastly outmatched in skill.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
1st: Wonder Woman
2nd: Thor
3rd: Colossus
4th: Thing
5th: Juggernaut
6th: Spider-Man
7th: Silver Surfer
8th: Superman
9th: Flash

Superman and the Flash have both trained with Batman and Wonder Woman for years.

They are definitely more potent in a powerless fight than the Silver Surfer and Spiderman.

Superman has also been trained by Mongul, and had a one thousand year battle in Asgard, and a 100 year battle against Gog.

Yet he rarely shows his skill...ever or even his genius intelligence too

Originally posted by Metalmanx
1st: Wonder Woman
2nd: Thor
3rd: Colossus
4th: Thing
5th: Juggernaut
6th: Spider-Man
7th: Silver Surfer
8th: Superman
9th: Flash
Noorin's tougher than Clark or Wally?

cool!

Originally posted by Soljer
Superman and the Flash have both trained with Batman and Wonder Woman for years.

They are definitely more potent in a powerless fight than the Silver Surfer and Spiderman.
Surfer could start moralising, they wouldn't stand a chance if he did that!

i actually think those superheroes with superspeed might suffer a bit from this... since they won't be used to operating at such slow speed.

Originally posted by FrothByte
There have often been times in comics when the superhero's powers were removed and he/she had to fight as a normal human being. So who would win in an all out brawl between the following considering that ALL their super powers were removed and they had to fight as just normal human beings:

Thing
Flash
Colossus
Superman
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Woman
Juggernaut
Spiderman


Top 5

THOR
WW
THING
Colossus
Juggernaut

Enuff said...

WW
Thor
Colossus
Thing

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Wonder Woman is the master of over 3000 martial arts and unmatched in so many weapons styles it's crazy.

Here we go again... comic nerdiness run amok! There aren't 3000 martial arts disciplines (h2h) in existence. May I make a suggestion?

GO WATCH A UFC MIXED MARTIAL ARTS FIGHT!!!

Size and strength make ALL the difference in a real fight. Fancy techniques and slick moves play a very small role... it comes down to the basics of strength, speed, size, basic striking, and basic grappling. Yes skill matters- but a depowered Thor totally overwhelms a depowered Diana. Only a fool who has never seen a fight in real life thinks otherwise.

Thor - a HUGE man, a warrior. First, no contest.
Thing - a big, tuff, street fighter... AND Ben was a Gold Gloves boxer.
Juggernaut - also a big, tuff guy. He was in the army, had some training.
Colossus - very big, very strong- knows at least a few Logan moves.
Wonder Woman - very strong for a woman her size, extremely skilled (tied with Thor in fighting skill/experience), but not enough power.
Superman - good size and strength, average skills.
Flash, Surfer, and Spider-man fight for the last three spots- Spidey has an edge, cause he uses a LOT more h2h in his fighting.

A woman of 125/150 lbs punching a man of 290/320 lbs? Laughable.

When WW kicks Thor in the balls and drops to the floor....he's no longer in first place. That's why she gets first place.

Originally posted by Endrict
When WW kicks Thor in the balls and drops to the floor....he's no longer in first place. That's why she gets first place.

if it was that easy to kick a guy in the balls, then any martial artist woman should stomp a man in a street fight.

Originally posted by Cap'n Happy
Here we go again... comic nerdiness run amok! There aren't 3000 martial arts disciplines (h2h) in existence. May I make a suggestion?

GO WATCH A UFC MIXED MARTIAL ARTS FIGHT!!!

Size and strength make ALL the difference in a real fight. Fancy techniques and slick moves play a very small role... it comes down to the basics of strength, speed, size, basic striking, and basic grappling. Yes skill matters- but a depowered Thor totally overwhelms a depowered Diana. Only a fool who has never seen a fight in real life thinks otherwise.


May I make a suggestion?

Pick up a comic. You're debating about comic book characters on a comic book versus forum. In the comics there are three thousand slick fancy moves that will allow a person to easily match someone five times their size. See Cassandra Cain for evidence.

For example, how about an eight year old female girl taking on five fairly built guys?
http://img459.imageshack.us/my.php?image=batgirln1p024td.jpg
http://img460.imageshack.us/my.php?image=batgirln1p037ly.jpg

Oh...and massacring them.

Or, hell, doing it again - a bit older, but certainly not much heavier:
http://img462.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gothamcitysecretfilespg044yp.jpg
http://img486.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gothamcitysecretfilespg054ec.jpg

Maybe these guys aren't as big as Thor? Well, how about someone who's forehead is about the size of Cassie's torso?
http://img455.imageshack.us/my.php?image=batgirl003161oo.jpg



Yes - I agree whole heartedly; in a real world fight with real world martial arts, size and strength are gargantuan factors.

When we're talking comic-book characters with comic-book skill? Skill tops all.

That's why Batman wins vs tougher opponents...skill and brains.

Originally posted by Endrict
When WW kicks Thor in the balls and drops to the floor....he's no longer in first place. That's why she gets first place.

Again, foolish. Thor is a brute. Do me a favor pal... go into a gym in any big city, walk up to some 6'6'' dude- a guy around three hundred pounds and enough muscle on him to snap your neck like a twig...
and kick him in the balls.
Shroud be easy, right? And think of your rep... you'd be the man!
Please try to be a little realistic. Thor is a Viking War-god. Have you seen how Vikings fight? Go rent Gladiator and watch the opening battle scene. The Viking's were berserker warriors... they even scared the Roman legions. Take a look at those gigantic blood lusting wariors and tell me a skinny little woman could even get a kick to the balls in, let alone stop such a fighter. It would NEVER happen. One punch from such a powerful man would shatter a woman's jaw... it's called truth.
Yes< I know that comics are fantasy... but the nature of this thread stripped all characters of their poweres- placing them squarly in the realm of reality.

Originally posted by Cap'n Happy
Again, foolish. Thor is a brute. Do me a favor pal... go into a gym in any big city, walk up to some 6'6'' dude- a guy around three hundred pounds and enough muscle on him to snap your neck like a twig...
and kick him in the balls.
Shroud be easy, right? And think of your rep... you'd be the man!
Please try to be a little realistic. Thor is a Viking War-god. Have you seen how Vikings fight? Go rent Gladiator and watch the opening battle scene. The Viking's were berserker warriors... they even scared the Roman legions. Take a look at those gigantic blood lusting warions and tell me a skinny little woman could even get a kick to the balls in, let alone stop such a fighter. It would NEVER happen. One punch from such a powerful man would shatter a woman's jaw... it's called truth. I agree with you in a way Thor weighs way more than 300 pounds which makes it somewhat unfair but remember what Wonder Womans background contains. She a bloody amazon not only are they physically fit but they train to beat men in battle they use the man physique against them i wouldn't say she would win but Thor isn't one shotting any amazon that easily.

Originally posted by Cap'n Happy
Again, foolish. Thor is a brute. Do me a favor pal... go into a gym in any big city, walk up to some 6'6'' dude- a guy around three hundred pounds and enough muscle on him to snap your neck like a twig...
and kick him in the balls.
Shroud be easy, right? And think of your rep... you'd be the man!
Please try to be a little realistic. Thor is a Viking War-god. Have you seen how Vikings fight? Go rent Gladiator and watch the opening battle scene. The Viking's were berserker warriors... they even scared the Roman legions. Take a look at those gigantic blood lusting warions and tell me a skinny little woman could even get a kick to the balls in, let alone stop such a fighter. It would NEVER happen. One punch from such a powerful man would shatter a woman's jaw... it's called truth.



Dude, this is comics and not real life. I am the one that's being comic realistic and your trying to be real life realistic where most of it doesn't apply here.

1. Wonder Woman
2. Colossus
3. Thing
4. Superman
5. Thor
6. Juggernaut
7. Silver Surfer
8. Flash
9. Spider-Man

Originally posted by Endrict
Dude, this is comics and not real life. I am the one that's being comic realistic and your trying to be real life realistic where most of it doesn't apply here.

Your point is taken- in fact, I recognized this point in an earlier post. But the thread started out stripping all characters of superpower, so doesn't this fight have to reflect at least a little reality?
I grant you that Diana would get her share of wins. I have her beating Superman- depowered, he lacks the tools to beat her. She would win against a lot of non-supers... Hawkeye, Hank Pym, Peter Parker, Barry Allen... she would mop the floor with guys like this. But it's just ignorant to have her surviving, let alone winning against Thor. Even Grimm wins fairly easily. You could debate Colossus and Juggs (still think they win), but not Thor.
Love WW all you want- with powers, she's awesome, argue her merits all day long. In this (non-super, hence, non "comic" fight, Thor thrashes her around like a rag doll.

Originally posted by iceman24567
I agree with you in a way Thor weighs way more than 300 pounds which makes it somewhat unfair but remember what Wonder Womans background contains. She a bloody amazon not only are they physically fit but they train to beat men in battle they use the male physique against them i wouldn't say she would win but Thor isn't one shotting any amazon that easily.

WW of Thor, WW has more skill, but without powers due to his massive build he would be much stronger.

I just thought of Rocky 4...but instead of Roco and Ivan it's Ben vs Pitor. But Pitor wins.

Originally posted by Endrict
I just thought of Rocky 4...but instead of Roco and Ivan it's Ben vs Pitor. But Pitor wins. I'm sure if Piotr killed Reed in a fight Ben would be like Rocky and win against Piotr.

Originally posted by iceman24567
I'm sure if Piotr killed Reed in a fight Ben would be like Rocky and win against Piotr.


...it's possible in that situation, yes. But other times Pitor wins.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Wonder Woman 1st Place
Thor 2nd Place
Thing 3rd


have to agree WW would win on pure knowledge and her fighting instincts. weather she fought a female or male foe me thinks.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
WW of Thor, WW has more skill, but without powers due to his massive build he would be much stronger.


one thing ya gota love bout wonderwoman. She can be mean and agressive. I dont care how big thor is. He still has a penis, and one boot to the nuts and its goodnight thor.

i've been thinking, if we took all their powers away, it would be

dr blake
diana prince
norin rodd
clark cent
ben grim
peter
peter parker
wally
cane marco

soooo.....

peter
ben grim
cane marco
peter parker
clark kent
wally
diana
dr blake

mwahahahaha

Thor
Diana
Ben

Originally posted by zeel
one thing ya gota love bout wonderwoman. She can be mean and agressive. I dont care how big thor is. He still has a penis, and one boot to the nuts and its goodnight thor.

No he doesn't, who told you that?

Originally posted by FrothByte
There have often been times in comics when the superhero's powers were removed and he/she had to fight as a normal human being. So who would win in an all out brawl between the following considering that ALL their super powers were removed and they had to fight as just normal human beings:

Thing
Flash
Colossus
Superman
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Woman
Juggernaut
Spiderman
Thor takes it, better fighter, and in better shape than most of them, maybe Supes will fall last.

bump

1. Thing
2. Colossus
3. Thor
4. Wonder Woman
5. Juggernaut
6.Superman
7.Flash
8. Silver Surfer
9. Spiderman

Diana or Thor.

My first thought would be Diana because of demonstrated skill. (Thor would be close)

But, even without powers, wouldn't Thor's Asgardian physiology give him more strength and endurance?

I was wondering something along the same line as well. Amazons are naturally stronger than humans as well. When the OP said without powers, did he also include traits that are inherent to other races?

Thor
Wonder Woman
Thing

I dont see how wonderwoman could win if turned to a normal human shes a pretty small woman. Thor and thing would both be pretty skilled guys that are alot biger and stronger and faster for that matter. They would hit harder take more, and hit just as fast. She'd beat the other bums though

WW
Thor
Thing

Originally posted by jrodslam
WW
Thor
Thing
how does she beat thor and thing as a normal human. they are her supeirs in every way and skilled enough to make it so that she isn't able to dominate them

colossus has a shot, imo...

For surfer are we removing his cosmic glaze as well or just his cosmic powers? If he still has his glaze then he wins. If not then he gets thrashed and Thor probly wins.

Originally posted by jalek moye
how does she beat thor and thing as a normal human. they are her supeirs in every way and skilled enough to make it so that she isn't able to dominate them

A normal human that would still have her fighting skills, yes? WW has sparred with Batman as well as Black Canary and has done so more than once. Batman is one of the best h2h combatants in DC and so is Canary. She didnt use her massive strength nor speed advantage. Has Thor or Thing done anything similar?

well thor isnt some no skilled bum. If you turn them into normal humans well you have a reletivly skinny girl that is skilled against a much larger, stronger, durable man who is just as fast with alittle bit lower skill. Who do you think would win that.

Against thing it would be more even but i still think he would beat her.

But she def beats all the other in this thread

Originally posted by jalek moye
well thor isnt some no skilled bum. If you turn them into normal humans well you have a reletivly skinny girl that is skilled against a much larger, stronger, durable man who is just as fast with alittle bit lower skill. Who do you think would win that.

Against thing it would be more even but i still think he would beat her.

But she def beats all the other in this thread

if thing can do it, i really don't see why colossus can't...

Originally posted by jalek moye
well thor isnt some no skilled bum. If you turn them into normal humans well you have a reletivly skinny girl that is skilled against a much larger, stronger, durable man who is just as fast with alittle bit lower skill. Who do you think would win that.

Against thing it would be more even but i still think he would beat her.

But she def beats all the other in this thread

Not saying Thor is a no skilled bum, but when has he displayed any real type of skilled against fighters comparable to Canary and Batman? Same for Thing? WW's size doesnt have much to do with the outcome of the fight. It may if she were to get grabbed, but i feel her skills are good enough to prevent it. What proof do you have that Thor and Thing would be just as fast as her if everyone is powerless?

Originally posted by jrodslam
Not saying Thor is a no skilled bum, but when has he displayed any real type of skilled against fighters comparable to Canary and Batman? Same for Thing? WW's size doesnt have much to do with the outcome of the fight. It may if she were to get grabbed, but i feel her skills are good enough to prevent it. What proof do you have that Thor and Thing would be just as fast as her if everyone is powerless?

Well when powerless normal humans that have fighting skill are about the same speed. and generally guys are capable of striking faster. so i just assumed that they would be about the same sinc ethere is no evidence either way for them being comparable while powerless.

And size and strength have alot to do with the outcome of fights. While she would have alot harder time hurting them, they would have an eaiser time and I feel Thor should be able to grab her, doesn't he have longer reach also?

Thor vs Wonder Woman without any powers is like Andrei Arlovski vs Chloe Bruce (one of the top female kickboxers).

Originally posted by MightyEInherjar
Thor vs Wonder Woman without any powers is like Andrei Arlovski vs Chloe Bruce (one of the top female kickboxers).
Great female fighters = decent male fighters

Well, he kept up with Cap when he was powerless and IIRC he had some decent skill feats in the Son of Asgard series, however Wonder Woman likely has even better feats.

That said, in normal bodies Thor would have around 200 pounds of muscle and 7 inches on her, that should more than make up for her skill advantage.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Well, he kept up with Cap when he was powerless and IIRC he had some decent skill feats in the Son of Asgard series, however Wonder Woman likely has even better feats.

That said, in normal bodies Thor would have around 200 pounds of muscle and 7 inches on her, that should more than make up for her skill advantage.
thor would have more then 200 pounds, he'd be like 250 or somthing

I think he meant 200 lb advantage.

Thor
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/Vaklam/thorvsthanos.jpg

then Wonder Woman
http://www.silver-surfer.us/Top10list/4_Wonder_Woman.gif

finally then the Thing
http://www.progressiveruin.com/images/ff107a.jpg

Originally posted by ultimatethor
For surfer are we removing his cosmic glaze as well or just his cosmic powers? If he still has his glaze then he wins. If not then he gets thrashed and Thor probly wins.

Yes, we're removing ALL of their powers, including Thor's asgardian physic. So they get stuck with human bodies (with all human weaknesses) appropriate to their size and appearance.

Originally posted by Eel O'Brien
My first thought would be Diana because of demonstrated skill. (Thor would be close)


Just because WW is consistently drawn in comics doing fancier kicks and sommersaults than thor doesn't mean she's the better fighter.

Capt. America beat the crap out of Daredevil using nothing but punches. DD came at Cap using all of his sweet ninjutsu moves, and all Capt. A did was to dodge, punch, dodge, punch, block, punch and down went DD.

I'm not saying thor is better than Diana either. All i'm saying is that we have no definite proof that WW has higher fighting skills than thor. All we know is that they have both been trained in H2H since birth, and that thor (i think) is a couple of hundred years older.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Just because WW is consistently drawn in comics doing fancier kicks and sommersaults than thor doesn't mean she's the better fighter.

Capt. America beat the crap out of Daredevil using nothing but punches. DD came at Cap using all of his sweet ninjutsu moves, and all Capt. A did was to dodge, punch, dodge, punch, block, punch and down went DD.

I'm not saying thor is better than Diana either. All i'm saying is that we have no definite proof that WW has higher fighting skills than thor. All we know is that they have both been trained in H2H since birth, and that thor (i think) is a couple of hundred years older.

Lol thats true cap has a very simple style all he does is punch dodge and do a side kick

1. Thing- He is a formidable and relentless hand to hand combatant. His fighting style incorporates elements of boxing, wrestling, judo, jujutsu, and street-fighting techniques, as well as hand-to-hand combat training from the military. (From wiki)
2/3. Colossus - toss up, both are big dudes
2/3. Thor- toss up both are big dudes. I feel like Colossus wins though cause Thor is not used to fighting without his powers. (I know he has lost his powers before, but even still)
4. Wonder Woman- good fighter but lacking in size and strength
5. Juggernaut
6.Superman
7.Flash
8. Silver Surfer
9. Spiderman

Okay, now that we have all the info, I'm going to go with:

1. Thor
2. Diana
3. Thing
4. Colossus
5. Superman

In most situations I don't think the weight difference would make a difference. I don't remember who it was that talked about the guy at the gym who is 6'6 and 300pounds. If he is not a trained fighter he still gets his butt handed to him because a skilled fighter would know how to turn the weight disadvantage into an advantage. Not to mention that the more skilled fighter probably wouldn't take any blows and would know exactly how to attack.

Thor is another animal though. He is a huge guy that also is a trained warrior. He's the only one on the list that comes close to Diana's skill. Close enough that his physical advantage would remain so. She would embarrass just about everyone else though.

1. Thor
2. Thing
3. Colossus
4. Wonder Woman

simple thing is in real human bodies if diana gets a knock from one of the big guys here she is out. manny paquiao may be a really talented boxer, but he would get killed in a brawl with someone like big show.
sure diana is probs p4p the best here like but this isn't a tournament with rules and stuff its a fight. she gets destroyed

Originally posted by Superherovandal
didn't WW take down Shiva in a sparring match without her powers. and also size won't matter when skill comes in. Sure he's stronger. But she's shown way more skill and i'd be inclined to say that tactically she's better. Skill and smarts trumps size and strength. Are you honestly saying that if one of the world's most skilled martial artists faced a pretty skilled strongman that the strong man would win. no the skill would allow her to win. Size and strength gets pwned by skill. A good big man will ALWAYS beat a good smaller man . Wonderwoman skill ''advantage'' only works if Thor is completly unskilled.

THor has enough skill coupled with his size advantage to make Diana's skill advantage moot.

There is a reason that there are weight classes in pro MA's

We still talk about comic book fights right???
Not a real live situation???

Than I guess
1. WW
2. Thor

Other than that I'm not really sure who would be number 3 would be between cain, ben, supes and piotr.

In a real fight since some of the guy's are pretty big and also got some skill maybe not as much as WW, but I believe there size would be to much for her skill.

I disagree on the part that a bigger guy would alway's win only because of his size.

Thor bashes WW head in.

That isn't actually what people are saying, they're saying that Thor is good enough that his massive size advantage more than makes up for WW's edge in skill.

Originally posted by Silent Master
That isn't actually what people are saying, they're saying that Thor is good enough that his massive size advantage more than makes up for WW's edge in skill.

Wenn has size been more important in comics than skill?
They most of the time play the skill trick in saying a guy or girl knows all the martial arts in the world or something like that.
I mean ain't that the deal with all those street level guy's that they have some amazing ma skill so they can hang or last a while against those super strong type's?

I mean we still talk about a comic book fight right not a real fight, iff we are talking about a real fight than sure her skill wouldn't help her that much against guy's who are three times heavier with some skills or for some who has some good skills.

Thing wins
Than Thor or Colossus (lets go with the majority and say Thor)
So Colossus is next
Than we can have WW

Nobody is saying Wonder Woman's skill isn't important, they're saying that ITO she doesn't have enough of a skill edge to overcome somone of Thor's skill that also has a massive size advantage.

thor without powers is still a multi-ton lifting asgardian.

I was just going by how strong someone his size would likely be in a normal human body, I'd say he'd be close to if not a little over 300 pounds seeing as Cap is supposed to be around 240 and Thor is both taller and drawn noticeably larger.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
thor without powers is still a multi-ton lifting asgardian.

Good point.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I was just going by how strong someone his size would likely be in a normal human body, I'd say he'd be close to if not a little over 300 pounds seeing as Cap is supposed to be around 240 and Thor is both taller and drawn noticeably larger.

Yeah that would matter in a real live fight, but like I said before people who have more skill in comics seem to be able to last longer or far better than they would in a real live situation.
It's like in the comics the person with more skill would win more easier.
Than the guy with the muscle's.
And I'm not saying that Thor is unskilled or not unless someone can show me he's really close to her in the skill department.
I'll change my mind.

Strength and size advantages also matter in comics, granted not as much as they would in real life, but they do matter.

What I and other people are saying is that we believe Thor's his size and strength advantage when combined with his skill trumps Wonder Woman's slight skill advantage.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Strength and size advantages also matter in comics, granted not as much as they would in real life, but they do matter.

What I and other people are saying is that we believe Thor's his size and strength advantage when combined with his skill trumps Wonder Woman's slight skill advantage.

I kind of agree Thor's size and strength and relative skill will over come what skill advantage WW has. I admit WW is very badass and tends to rely on her h2h combat skills but without her powers her skill alone is not enough. But think about this...

WW is of amazon decent trained despite being a clay figure. Lets just say she has a body of a amazon warrior, which she does. Her strength would be the only one comparable to Thor's physical poweress but not enough. Thor 7/10. Then WW, Thing, Colossus the rest should just be average.

Also Bruce Lee would easily kick the living crap out of Big Show and Under Taker at the same time in a freaking straight jacket

Originally posted by Lord Feron

Also Bruce Lee would easily kick the living crap out of Big Show and Under Taker at the same time in a freaking straight jacket as a person that actually does martial arts...i will have to disagree with that.

minus the straight jacket and in a ring, he might get the undertaker but not the big show also. 143lbs vs approximately 260 +/- lbs and 450 +/- lbs = a very tired bruce lee.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
as a person that actually does martial arts...i will have to disagree with that.

minus the straight jacket and in a ring, he might get the undertaker but not the big show also. 143lbs vs approximately 260 +/- lbs and 450 +/- lbs = a very tired bruce lee. Undertaker is pretty old now too.

But he'd still hurt Bruce pretty bad imo.

two on one is never good, especially since in real life your opponents won't run at you single file.

Oh I wasn't even thinking about at the same time, Bruce Lee pretty much has no chance.

People thinks martial arts gives you some mythical super power.

Originally posted by Mindset
Oh I wasn't even thinking about at the same time, Bruce Lee pretty much has no chance.

People thinks martial arts gives you some mythical super power. don't get me wrong it's effective, but the weight difference is too vast for strikes to win it for lee.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
don't get me wrong it's effective, but the weight difference is too vast for strikes to win it for lee. Being effective and being what people see in the movies are 2 completely different things.


Fighting multiple people at once is an uphill battle, fighting multiple people who far outweigh you and hoping to beat them, well, you're better off running.

Ben Grim takes it. He is pretty big/muscular maybe not as much as colossus and Thor without powers but he knows/has the best ma out of everyone. After that it would either be Colossus or Thor. I'm leaning Colosus, than WW.

a dream fight for bruce lee that i would pay to see would be him vs prince naseem hamad, if you don't know him there's always youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfUFYtXNN0A

maybe you'll agree.

Actually, without his powers; Ben has a rather large gut. Plus, out of the starting list, I'd say that WW is the best martial artist

Originally posted by Silent Master
Actually, without his powers; Ben has a rather large gut. Plus, out of the starting list, I'd say that WW is the best martial artist

well think of Ben Grim as like the human version of the Blob. This is a gross exaggeration, but you know what I mean. He just has more muscle. A little bit of fat can help in a fight. Look at the best mixed martial arts fighters or even certain linebackers etc. The immensely jacked usually do not turn out to be the best fighters in real life. All that is for appearance/looks, so unless you are a body builder or actor 0% body fat is not necessary in a real fight.

Colossus, Thor and Juggernaut would all have more muscle than Ben in human form.

Originally posted by Brutacus
Yeah that would matter in a real live fight, but like I said before people who have more skill in comics seem to be able to last longer or far better than they would in a real live situation.
It's like in the comics the person with more skill would win more easier.
Than the guy with the muscle's.
And I'm not saying that Thor is unskilled or not unless someone can show me he's really close to her in the skill department.
I'll change my mind.

Didn't Bane (big non-martial artist) break batman's (superb martial artist) spine? I've never read the comics, just heard about it so correct me if i'm wrong, but that's one big muscular dude winning over a martial artist.

Besides, you're asking for proof that thor is close to WW in fighting skills, but do you actually have proof that WW is a better fighter than him? Until you can provide proof that she is the better fighter, then that will remain as just your opinion.

like i said in my previous post, just because she's drawn doing fancier kicks and sommersaults doesn't necessarily mean she's the better fighter. like i said, i've seen Capt. America beat the crap out of Daredevil using nothing but punches despite DD's best moves (and it wasn't even a close fight). It's not how many different styles or moves you know that matters, it's how you apply what you know into actual fighting.

As far as we know, both thor and diana have been trained in h2h since birth (and thor is by far the older of the two). They've been trained such that they had no equal in their respective races. So I don't see where the conclusion is comming from that diana is the better fighter. She might very well be, or she might not. its a toss up as far as i'm concerned.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Colossus, Thor and Juggernaut would all have more muscle than Ben in human form.

Its not all muscle. But I would agree they all have more muscle. Except for Juggernaut, who would revert to a skinny dude without his powers. But I think that Ben might have the best mix of Martial Arts ability. I do not think Thor knows any MA, and I am not sure how good colossus is. However, from the Colossus scans/X-men comics I have looked at he does not seem to know a lot of MA. Moreover, for WW how tall and heavy is she? I have seen different incarnations of her where she is a tall and muscular amazon and other scans where she is smaller and less muscular but still kicks butt and has all her powers. I think this is an important question to answer

Martial arts isn't just Kung Fu or Ju Jitsu, it's any form or style of combat training and Thor has been trained in combat since he was a kid.

As for WW's height and weight, I believe she is supposed to be 5'11" and 160 pounds.