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This is Kyp Durron when he's being controlled by Exar Kun (that would be his prime as far as fighting abilities go, wouldn't it?). Note that while being controleld by Kun's spirit, he nearly kills Luke (takes place one year after DE). I don't know any details about his encounter with Luke, though - if it was really close, or he caught him by susprise, ect.

DE Sidious still wins with some difficulty.

Kyp may very well possess greater potential in the force than Sidious, but he lacks the experience and knowledge of the sith lord, so I'd have to go sids on this one

Whether Kyp possesses Kun 's spirit not he still loses.

Originally posted by Pwned61
Kyp may very well possess greater potential in the force than Sidious, but he lacks the experience and knowledge of the sith lord, so I'd have to go sids on this one

I find it highly unlikely anyone not named "Luke" or "Anakin" possesses more force potential than Sidious.

100% agreed.

DE Sidious wins, I place him second after Luke.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
I find it highly unlikely anyone not named "Luke" or "Anakin" possesses more force potential than Sidious.

luke says that kyp has a greater potential than he does

Luke THOUGHT that he did, but clearly he was wrong. That's not evidence.

To be fair, I think most of the Skywalker clan has a potential that - at the very least - rivals Palpatine's own. The difference is the depth of the knowledge and quality of teaching. For all of Luke's power, he is far from being one of the most knowledgeable in the Force. Any of the PT Jedi are likely still miles ahead of him, including people like Yoda or Sidious.

Hell, according to the omniscient narrator in LotF, Jacen > Kyp. But from what we've seen, Jacen would get obliterated in a sheer fight because he's an absolute wimp.

Actually, it was Kyp who said he had more potential than Luke. Right before he starts to manipulate the Dovin Basel, he's having a sort of inner-monologue about how he always knew he was stronger than Luke and how he didn't dislike or feel arrogant about it.

Something to that effect.

Originally posted by Gideon
To be fair, I think most of the Skywalker clan has a potential that - at the very least - rivals Palpatine's own. The difference is the depth of the knowledge and quality of teaching. For all of Luke's power, he is far from being one of the most knowledgeable in the Force. Any of the PT Jedi are likely still miles ahead of him, including people like Yoda or Sidious.

Hell, according to the omniscient narrator in LotF, Jacen > Kyp. But from what we've seen, Jacen would get obliterated in a sheer fight because he's an absolute wimp.

You know Escape, while I was in my biology lab, I was thinking.. From a biological standpoint, there's no way that Luke could have the same exact potential as Anakin, nor is there a way that Jacen could rival Luke. Lets consider for a moment, Anakin's father was the force and mother was shmi. So he got dominant and recessive genes from the force and the mom, making his power limitless, or very close to it(because he's not actually the force). Now Luke got mixe genes(dominant and recessive) from Padme, who wasn't a force sensitive, and from Anakin, who was the most powerful being ever, but obviously he wasn't omnipotent(like the force). Let me clear my original point up, it's POSSIBLE they could have the same potential but it's VERY unlikely. What is impossible is the fact that Jacen has equal to, or more potential than Luke. Leia wasn't nearly as strong in the fore as Luke(although a skywalker), and she married yet another non force sensitive, so Jacen's force potential should always be below Luke's. At the same time, Ben should, biologically, have more force potential than Jacen, but at the same time it's possible for him to have the force potential of Luke, because of Luke and Mara both being force sensitive and Mara being considerably powerful in the force.

Yes, but the Force doesn't work biologically, otherwise someone who had 2 non-force sensative parents couldn't be a powerful Jedi.

Look, to bring genetic, or science of any kind for Star Wars, it's not very good idea. Remember the fact that he actually hear esplosions in space.

BUT, if you want to think this way, well, let's imagine that force genes are recessive, what is quite natural since there are few people being force sensitive. In that case, since anakin was concieve by the force and shmi 2 things could have happen, or he got 2 recessive and very powerful genes from the force or he got 1 from the force and another recessive gene from his mother, and so, his strongest force gene may have manifest himself. So, Luke could have recieved the all powerful gene from anakin, plus another recessive one from Leia and since anakin's gene manifested himself, he was as powerful as him.

Yet, if Anakin got his 2 force genes from the force, and if both manifest themselves, Luke would be weaker then Anakin, yet the problem with this theory is that this way Anakin wouldn't have theorically a mother. So, i think the second theory is the best.

So, if we use this theory, notice that Leia, since is much weaker then Luke in the force, probably recieved the other gene from anakin, the one who came from his mother, plus the same gene luke got from Padme (because padme is non force sensitive, thus the other one has to be the dominant non force sensitive one). And, with this theory, or Han had a strong recessive force gene or Jacen would never have the power from Anakin or Luke. Yet, Ben can still have it.



Wrong, because recessive genes can be present and not manifest themselves. Besides, there are the possibility of mutations that could turn non force sensitive genes in force sensitive genes.

Hmm... I tried to simplify the things but perhaps my post was too much elaborated for people here... That's the problem of having 20 in Biology, you know the things just too well

By the way, i thought in other possibility. Maybe there also co-dominance in force genes, and also we don't know if the strongest just is always the one who manisfest himself. so Leia could have also Anakin's strong gene, yet not manifestaded or being the less one form the pair.

Seriously, the way force potential is inherited or developed has never really been made clear in Star Wars.

We can say for sure that force sensitives have a tendency to have force sensitive children, regardless of whom them have children with (Anakin, Leia, Kol, ect.).

However, force potential can also just kinda spring up, kyp for example didn't have force sensitive parents, nothing suggests Revan did either.

Also, force potential can't be "watered down" as Luke possess the same potential as his dad. As well, all of the solo children appear to be stronger than their mother.

Basically, force potential is whatever the writer at the time wants it to be.

I beg to differ. Force potential CAN be watered down. It watered down the ancient sith, mainly the sith who interbred with the exiled jedi. And even if it couldn't, from a biological standpoint, it's less likely that Luke had the same potential as Anakin.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
I beg to differ. Force potential CAN be watered down. It watered down the ancient sith, mainly the sith who interbred with the exiled jedi. And even if it couldn't, from a biological standpoint, it's less likely that Luke had the same potential as Anakin.


How did the interbreeding weaken them? The most powerful of their era, Ragnos, was a half breed correct?

You may not like it, I don't really like it, but if Lucas says it then it's cannon, besides it hardly contradicts anything, so it's all good.

Well yea but I was merely looking at it from a biological perspective, that's all.

Sidious
more powerful with force and better saber fighter

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
luke says that kyp has a greater potential than he does

Wait, I don't remember that. I remember him saying that a test of Durron's force capacities blew Luke across the room, but I always had the impression that Luke's force abilities could blow his own weight a lot farther then that.

And why does force potential even matter? I don't care if Kyp's force potential is triple what Sidious has. Sidious learned the techniques, deceptive tricks and methods of controlling the situation that were passed down and expanded upon for 1000 years. It has been implied that he can even lie and decieve using the force. How do you tap into the force to fight someone when you actually have to focus on making sure you can trust the force and that it isn't being altered by your opponent? I mean, I'm sure there are Jedi who can see through the deceptive tricks, but its got to slow them down some. It isn't like Sidious isn't fast enough without slowing down his opponents.

I would say Kyp, but I may think Sidious.

grey jedi ThoraxeRMG

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
Luke THOUGHT that he did, but clearly he was wrong. That's not evidence.

no he didn't think that he's still saying it and yes he may be wrong cause jedi often say other people are better than they are at stuff like mace windu sayin depa is better with a lightsaber than he is.

personally i agree with you i dont think he has a better potential but its deffinately possible since luke can sense his power

force potential doesn't really matter anyways
Troy Denning said Leia has as much force potential as Luke and yet Luke is awesome and Leia sucks

Originally posted by tulakhordpwns
force potential doesn't really matter anyways
Troy Denning said Leia has as much force potential as Luke and yet Luke is awesome and Leia sucks

really? when did he say this in an interview or book? cause as far as i know they have an equal amount of potential.

and come to think of it your are absolutely right potential doesnt really matter when we're talkin about sith lords and masters

i meant they have equal potential

Originally posted by tulakhordpwns
grey jedi ThoraxeRMG

Huh?

spell check

Its a close fight, but Sidious wins. I don't have the slightest doubt that Sidious will be able to beat Luke even if Luke's power is greater. Sidious knows more about how to use his power a lot better, and Luke's power can't be THAT much greater then Sidious' power anyway.

Quark.. Luke is twice as powerful as Sidious. His power IS that much greater. However, Sidious has more offensive techniques. At the very end, Luke is the only force user he can't beat.

Okay. Luke beats Sidious. But is Kyp's power double Palpatine's?

No, Kyp's power is nowhere near Sidious

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
No, Kyp's power is nowhere near Sidious
Then how come

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
DE Sidious still wins with some difficulty.

if this power is nowhere close?

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
No, Kyp's power is nowhere near Sidious

Kyp who manipulated the dovin basal's, who pulled the sun crusher out of a gas giant. I agree that Kyp won't necessarily be beating Sidious, but he isn't a push over either.

He's not a push over, his power is considerable, but next to DE Sidious? Not to mention the sun crusher was pulled out with the help of Kun's spirit.

DE Sidious IS the most powerful Sith Lord EVER. The only living being who can beat him is Luke.

That's why making DE Sidious threads doesn't make sense.

It may make sense if DE Sidious vs Kyp, Yoda, Kyle...