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Aizen wins very very quickly.

How?

Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
How?
Well first of all there is the fact that Kyouka suigetsu makes it imposible to percieve him, which means unless we are using Ultimate Magneto then he's definitely affected. Secondly his speed far exceeds individuals such as Quicksilver, and his spells are extremely deadly, Aizen simply uses the fast step and then shoots a lightning beam through magneto's heart, and black coffin would probably ko magneto.

Aizen basically recreates this scene:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPni-qpKw00

Magneto's shields have withstood Thor's hammer and nukes. Thor's hammer can bust planets. Aizen's shitty attacks would NEVER ever work on him.

You're not one of those people who think that the only thing Magneto can do is move metal?

Originally posted by Akuki
Well first of all there is the fact that Kyouka suigetsu makes it imposible to percieve him, which means unless we are using Ultimate Magneto then he's definitely affected. Secondly his speed far exceeds individuals such as Quicksilver, and his spells are extremely deadly, Aizen simply uses the fast step and then shoots a lightning beam through magneto's heart, and black coffin would probably ko magneto.
Can I call Bullshit?

Aizen hasn't done shit,sure he's more powerful than most of the Bleach characters but so is Magneto.

Until Aizen does more on panel Magneto wins...

Originally posted by Skeets
Can I call Bullshit?

Aizen hasn't done shit

He owned 3 bankai's in a row, and stoped one with his finger.


Originally posted by llagrok
Magneto's shields have withstood Thor's hammer and nukes. Thor's hammer can bust planets.

PIS, magnus should never be able to take an attack from mjolnir.

Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
He owned 3 bankai's in a row, and stoped one with his finger.
And?

You honestly think Magneto couldn't of done that?
He's handled far worse.

Originally posted by Skeets
And?

You honestly think Magneto couldn't of done that?
He's handled far worse.

Why don't you form an argument instead of mention things that magneto sheilds have taken?

Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Why don't you form an argument instead of mention things that magneto sheilds have taken?
hehe...

Care to explain how Aizen's gonna get passed Mags shields?

Aizen hasn't done shit in the whole series that would imply that he'd even give Mags a challenge.

Originally posted by Skeets
hehe...

Care to explain how Aizen's gonna get passed Mags shields?

Aizen hasn't done shit in the whole series that would imply that he'd even give Mags a challenge.

Sameway the X-men always have, mess up his concentration. Kyoka Suigetsu is perfect for that, but I'm still undecide for now.

Originally posted by Skeets


Aizen hasn't done shit in the whole series that would imply that he'd even give Mags a challenge.

I guess you haven't watched bleach.

It's kinda hard to stop someone if you have no clue where they are, can you think of any reason why Magneto could avoid Kyouka Suigetsu? Also I am quite aware of Magneto's shields capabilities, however several of Aizen's attacks could penetrate it.

Originally posted by Akuki
Magneto's shields capabilities, however several of Aizen's attacks could penetrate it.

Like what?

Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Like what?
First of use reiatsu to smash Magneto to the floor,maybe use kyouka suigetsu to make magneto think he's burning alive, if that doesn't mess up his concentration I don't know what will. Secondly magneto's shield is a decent distance off from his body right? So any indirect attacks that manifest themselves within that area can still hurt him,so a black coffin that springs up within the shield would still be just as effective.

Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Sameway the X-men always have, mess up his concentration. Kyoka Suigetsu is perfect for that, but I'm still undecide for now.



I guess you haven't watched bleach.
Actually I've read every chapter that's been released so far...Originally posted by Akuki
It's kinda hard to stop someone if you have no clue where they are, can you think of any reason why Magneto could avoid Kyouka Suigetsu? Also I am quite aware of Magneto's shields capabilities, however several of Aizen's attacks could penetrate it.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Like what?
Exactly,he hasn't even had a real fight he's mostly just overwhelmed people with his spirit pressure...
Originally posted by Akuki
First of use reiatsu to smash Magneto to the floor,maybe use kyouka suigetsu to make magneto think he's burning alive, if that doesn't mess up his concentration I don't know what will. Secondly magneto's shield is a decent distance off from his body right? So any indirect attacks that manifest themselves within that area can still hurt him,so a black coffin that springs up within the shield would still be just as effective.
What?
All that relies on Magneto not having his shield up.
And illusions working on a telepath?

Originally posted by Skeets
Actually I've read every chapter that's been released so far...

Exactly,he hasn't even had a real fight he's mostly just overwhelmed people with his spirit pressure...

Are you forgetting that with Kyoka Suigetsu, he can reduce mags into a state of total unbreakable hypnosis?

Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Are you forgetting that with Kyoka Suigetsu, he can reduce mags into a state of total unbreakable hypnosis?
Not with Mags willpower,and telepathic abilities...
If he can resist a TP attack from X he can resist Hypnosis...

Magneto's minor telepathy hasn't been seen on panel in decades, also he's been affected by individuals such as mastermind before, so he's definitely vulnerable to illusions.

I've read Bleach since chapter 8 was released and watched the anime since day one. Aizen has never performed ANYTHING that can be compared to Magneto.

I don't care what you call PIS on Ak, because Magneto has withstood attacks from all of the Avengers at the same time. Including blasts and strikes from Mjolnir. That's planet busting attacks. Let's not mention his ability to rip NEO members Rax and Salvo apart with a mere gesture. That's people with enhanced strength, speed, endurance and so on. He can reverse people's bloodflow to completely shut off any powers or he can just kill them.

Aizen has NO way of getting past Magneto's shield and I've yet to see the Bleach character perform any form of attacks strong enough to level a city. Which means that they basically stand no chance against Magneto.

You're better off matching Aizen up against someone who can't form shields and has to fight physically. Telepathic attacks/illusions/hypnosis wouldn't work on Magneto. Either he can choose to simply resist it or use his helmet. Which he always has with him.

Originally posted by llagrok
I've read Bleach since chapter 8 was released and watched the anime since day one. Aizen has never performed ANYTHING that can be compared to Magneto.

I don't care what you call PIS on Ak, because Magneto has withstood attacks from all of the Avengers at the same time. Including blasts and strikes from Mjolnir. That's planet busting attacks. Let's not mention his ability to rip NEO members Rax and Salvo apart with a mere gesture. That's people with enhanced strength, speed, endurance and so on. He can reverse people's bloodflow to completely shut off any powers or he can just kill them.

Aizen has NO way of getting past Magneto's shield and I've yet to see the Bleach character perform any form of attacks strong enough to level a city. Which means that they basically stand no chance against Magneto.

You're better off matching Aizen up against someone who can't form shields and has to fight physically. Telepathic attacks/illusions/hypnosis wouldn't work on Magneto. Either he can choose to simply resist it or use his helmet. Which he always has with him.

the helmet ability to block telepathy feature has only appeared in the movies and in Ultimate Magneto. And when the hell has he blocked planet busting attacks, I was only aware of him blocking two nukes, and that was when he was using a high powered machine to manipulate the entire magnetic field of the earth.

Originally posted by Akuki
the helmet ability to block telepathy feature has only appeared in the movies and in Ultimate Magneto.
ermmnone

And in new x-men..... and Polaris did it....

Originally posted by llagrok
And in new x-men..... and Polaris did it....
When??

Originally posted by llagrok
I've read Bleach since chapter 8 was released and watched the anime since day one. Aizen has never performed ANYTHING that can be compared to Magneto.


So, an unbreakable hypnosis is nothing?


Originally posted by llagrok

I don't care what you call PIS on Ak, because Magneto has withstood attacks from all of the Avengers at the same time. Including blasts and strikes from Mjolnir. That's planet busting attacks.

Yet, was on has struggledfrom an optic blast from cyclops and gets his arse handed to him by the X-men which are far weaker?

Nevermind that Mjolnir should have nullified his sheild easily by absorbing it's elector magnetic energy. Mags isn't taking a blast from thor, that's bad writing.


Originally posted by llagrok

Telepathic attacks/illusions/hypnosis wouldn't work on Magneto. Either he can choose to simply resist it or use his helmet. Which he always has with him.

Telepathy and Hypnosis are nothing a like, and a helmet won't stop you from being hypnotised.

Originally posted by llagrok
And in new x-men..... and Polaris did it....

Is this the same new X-men that had wolverine killing magneto?

Originally posted by Skeets
Not with Mags willpower,and telepathic abilities...
If he can resist a TP attack from X he can resist Hypnosis...

Telepathy has nothing to do with Hypnosis.

Anime fanboys are such fun.

If you haven't read any of the "latest" uncanny x-men/x-men or new x-men, don't bother getting into these discussions. Polaris recreated Magneto's helmet and armor during her wedding with Havok. Esme was unable to read Xorn/Sublime/Magneto's mind while he was wearing the helmet, as was xavier and jean. Nor could they affect or attack him. That's why they had to fool him to take it off.

Affected by an optic blast, yes. Are you dense? Magneto can be harmed like any other man, he doesn't possess any form of enhanced or superhuman endurance. Why wouldn't Cyclops' blast affect him? He fired 2 inches away from his face.

I've yet to see Aizen perform any impressive combat feats though. Black Sacrophagus? Not very impressive. It wasn't even able to kill Komamura. Do you know how easily Magneto could've ripped them apart? All he has to do is focus and he can rip anyone apart.

If he can rip Rax and Salvo apart, he has NO problem ripping Aizen apart. Aizen with no apparent superhuman endurance or stamina. Hell, Aizen hardly has any feats at all. Who knows whether it's illusions or him.

Originally posted by llagrok

If you haven't read any of the "latest" uncanny x-men/x-men or new x-men, don't bother getting into these discussions. Polaris recreated Magneto's helmet and armor during her wedding with Havok. Esme was unable to read Xorn/Sublime/Magneto's mind while he was wearing the helmet, as was xavier and jean. Nor could they affect or attack him. That's why they had to fool him to take it off.

Since when did Jean and Xavier use hypnosis?
Do you know how hypnosis works, and how it's not a psychic attack or telepathy?


Originally posted by llagrok

Affected by an optic blast, yes. Are you dense? Magneto can be harmed like any other man, he doesn't possess any form of enhanced or superhuman endurance. Why wouldn't Cyclops' blast affect him? He fired 2 inches away from his face.

I was refferin' to when he had his shield up.

Originally posted by llagrok
Anime fanboys are such fun.


If your gonna debate, just debate minus the insults. Furthermore, just because someone hasn't read every comic on earth, doesn't make them an anime fanboy. Marvel's continuity spans 40 plus year, it's understandable if someone doesn't know one little detail. Not everyone follows comicbooks religously.

I don't expect you to follow the comic books regularly, I expect you to know certain things about a character when you go into a debate. I love anime myself, but I know that most characters in bleach don't measure up to comic book characters.

When Xavier was forced to mindwipe Magneto (in fatal attractions) he and Jean had to put their best effort into doing so. That alone tells us something about his resistance. People who are resistant to telepathy have a general resistance towards hypnosis and illusions. They all affect the mind/eyes.

Let's say that Magneto falls for Aizen's illusion. He would easily detect that there is no iron in his blood, he can easily tell a false body from a real one. Someone as experienced as him can easily sense bodies around him as well. So telling a copy from the real deal apart, is no problem for him.

Now, how does Aizen plan on getting through Magneto's shield? He can't, simply as that. Magneto on the other hand has plenty of ways to kill off Aizen.

It's very hard to find a good match for Aizen really. Against anyone who can be cut and who doesn't have any means of protecting themselves, he has an instant win. Against someone who can get up forcefields, he doesn't really stand a chance.

Originally posted by llagrok
I don't expect you to follow the comic books regularly, I expect you to know certain things about a character when you go into a debate. I love anime myself, but I know that most characters in bleach don't measure up to comic book characters.

I never claimed they did, and I never made any mention of bleach Vs comics. This between magneto and Aizen, so, why are you bringing comicdom into this?


Originally posted by llagrok

When Xavier was forced to mindwipe Magneto (in fatal attractions) he and Jean had to put their best effort into doing so. That alone tells us something about his resistance. People who are resistant to telepathy have a general resistance towards hypnosis and illusions. They all affect the mind/eyes.

Do you know know how hypnosis works, and the mind in general?
It's not telepathy, and has nothing to do with telepathy period. It is simply a natural occuring momoment where the mind is open to suggestion. Aizens hypnosis can open up the mind to suggestion at any given time. Comparing :Telepathy and Psychics attacks to hypnosis is like comparing apples to oranges.

Furthermore, no matter how much reisistance you have. You can't resist manipulations of certain parts of your mind when your hypnotisize by aizen. Since he's suggestions are unbreakable, combine that with the fact that under hypnosis your already open to suggestion. Also, Mags wouldn't know he's hypnotisized.

Originally posted by llagrok

Let's say that Magneto falls for Aizen's illusion. He would easily detect that there is no iron in his blood, he can easily tell a false body from a real one. Someone as experienced as him can easily sense bodies around him as well. So telling a copy from the real deal apart, is no problem for him.

How would he do that if his sense work against him?

Speculations, don't bother.

Originally posted by llagrok
Speculations, don't bother.

What speculations, you mean when you speculated that mags resistance to telepathy would help him against hypnosis??

Originally posted by llagrok
Anime fanboys are such fun.

If you haven't read any of the "latest" uncanny x-men/x-men or new x-men, don't bother getting into these discussions. Polaris recreated Magneto's helmet and armor during her wedding with Havok. Esme was unable to read Xorn/Sublime/Magneto's mind while he was wearing the helmet, as was xavier and jean. Nor could they affect or attack him. That's why they had to fool him to take it off.

Affected by an optic blast, yes. Are you dense? Magneto can be harmed like any other man, he doesn't possess any form of enhanced or superhuman endurance. Why wouldn't Cyclops' blast affect him? He fired 2 inches away from his face.

I've yet to see Aizen perform any impressive combat feats though. Black Sacrophagus? Not very impressive. It wasn't even able to kill Komamura. Do you know how easily Magneto could've ripped them apart? All he has to do is focus and he can rip anyone apart.

If he can rip Rax and Salvo apart, he has NO problem ripping Aizen apart. Aizen with no apparent superhuman endurance or stamina. Hell, Aizen hardly has any feats at all. Who knows whether it's illusions or him.

Ummm.. you say it yourself, that wasn't actually Magneto, that was Xorn, Xorn has a huge resistance to telepaths due to his powers, not as a result of any helmet. And what the hell do you mean with him having no superhuman resistance or stamina? He's been shown taking enormous blows that would destroy most other characters in bleach with no ill effects at all, as for stamina, he's never needed to show it since he simply destroys all of his opponents in the first few seconds of a fight, just because he hasn't needed it doesn't mean he doesn't have it, plus we can look at the feats of his minions and based on simple logic we can say that basically any feat they can perform he can as well, after all since when have you heard of a final boss being weaker than his minions? As for the senses argument, think of Kyouka suigetsu as the matrix, you can notice inaccuracies and tell it's an illusion but that won't help you break it, and the one instance where an individual broke it was a extremely skilled doctor given days to analyze something as complicated as a corpse, that is an extremely difficult feat to duplicate under battlefield conditions, and if worst comes to worst Aizen can simply shut off all of magneto's senses.

Furthermore, how exactly does a helment keep mags from being manipulated by telepathy? Is it made with anti-psychic material, because I smell a plot device.

As for your comment about if you haven't read the latest X-men to stay out of this, I have read nearly every X-men comic ever made, I just need the series and around when it happened so I can go read up on the helmet claim.

Originally posted by Akuki
Ummm.. you say it yourself, that wasn't actually Magneto, that was Xorn, Xorn has a huge resistance to telepaths due to his powers, not as a result of any helmet. And what the hell do you mean with him having no superhuman resistance or stamina? He's been shown taking enormous blows that would destroy most other characters in bleach with no ill effects at all, as for stamina, he's never needed to show it since he simply destroys all of his opponents in the first few seconds of a fight, just because he hasn't needed it doesn't mean he doesn't have it, plus we can look at the feats of his minions and based on simple logic we can say that basically any feat they can perform he can as well, after all since when have you heard of a final boss being weaker than his minions? As for the senses argument, think of Kyouka suigetsu as the matrix, you can notice inaccuracies and tell it's an illusion but that won't help you break it, and the one instance where an individual broke it was a extremely skilled doctor given days to analyze something as complicated as a corpse, that is an extremely difficult feat to duplicate under battlefield conditions, and if worst comes to worst Aizen can simply shut off all of magneto's senses.

1. Xorn had healing powers, gravitational and magnetic manipulation. Pretty much the same as Magneto, bar the healing powers. No particular mental resistance. If you will pick up new x-men 149, 150 or 151 you will clearly see that the helmet provides him with protection from mental attacks. Anyone wh read it can see that.

2. On KMC we go by feats, not speculation. Aizen took a hit from Komamura, how can you know that was Aizen? Who's to say that was another illusion? Because everyone else who watched the episode or read the manga were clearly capable of seeing that it was an illusion. Until you have something better, I'm gonna have to give you a NO. Aizen does not have enough stamina feats to make him capable of surviving Magneto's attacks.

3. Shut off all of Magnetos' senses? How does that NOT affect his brain? Once again, crazy speculation.

Just went and checked, and Xorn's helmet did protect him,(not that I take it as definite proof since I haven't seen any scans with the actual magneto using that portection) but I won't contest the point for now. As for the hits, I wasn't talking about Komamura, i was referring to the Ichigo and renji vs. Aizen since he hadn't hypnotized them yet. Also for the strength and endurance, there is a pretty good way to measure that. We know that according to bleach rules the more reaitsu you have the stronger and more ble you are to take damage. Since Aizen was able to floor Grimmjow with his reiatsu which requires far superior reiatsu, Aizen can basically perform any endurance feat that Grimmjow can, and he can perorm any of the spells shown in the series as they are a common system available to all shingami, and he has stated that he has mastered all shinigami arts. Also how do the X-men usually force magneto to drop his force field, because to be quite honest, I don't see the X-men doing anything that Aizen couldn't duplicate quite easily.

Aizen isn't an Espada which means that his zanpakutou most likely won't grant him speed/strength/endurance comparable to any marvel characters. So far, we haven't seen them at Mrs.Marvel level, which is far below what Magneto can handle.

As for telepathy and illusions, check out Eve of Destruction. They mention that the only reason they get to cast an illusion on him is because his helmet is off. Which he took off after having messed up Xavier's bloodsteam, shutting off his power. Didn't take off the helmet until Xavier's powers were off. Common, you see the connection.

The x-men never force Magneto to drop his forcefield, he just stopped using it after a while. They wait until he's distracted with something else and then Wolverine is able to kill him. Which is probably the most ridiculous thing in comics. Worse than Ultimate Colossus beating Mags.

When written properly, Magneto gets up his shield and can pretty much take on any hero. It's just like with Apocalypse. The x-men never beat him in a straight up battle, they do it through PIS. Which is non-existent in KMC fights.

You also know that Xorn was really intended to be Magneto? Claremont said "Xorn was always Magneto." It was Chuck who retconned the whole thing with Shen :/

So give the fact that Magneto has resisted telepathic attacks from anyone. Under Stan Lee he had telepathy and was the second strongest mind on earth and an amplified Psylocke was BARELY able to hurt him with her psychic knife.

Either way, Aizen doesn't have a viable way of beating Mags here. He won't get past Mag's forcefield, Magneto can easily tell him apart from his clone and rip him apart, blast him, freeze him, control him, burn him, pretty much do anything. If he wants to, Magneto has also been shown able to amplify his own physique.

That's all I have to say for today.

Magneto 10/10

Originally posted by llagrok
Aizen isn't an Espada which means that his zanpakutou most likely won't grant him speed/strength/endurance comparable to any marvel characters. So far, we haven't seen them at Mrs.Marvel level, which is far below what Magneto can handle.

The x-men never force Magneto to drop his forcefield, he just stopped using it after a while. They wait until he's distracted with something else and then Wolverine is able to kill him. Which is probably the most ridiculous thing in comics. Worse than Ultimate Colossus beating Mags.

When written properly, Magneto gets up his shield and can pretty much take on any hero.

You also know that Xorn was really intended to be Magneto? Claremont said "Xorn was always Magneto." It was Chuck who retconned the whole thing with Shen :/
I really don't get your point with the zanpaktou, what difference does being espada or not being espada make? Could you elaborate?

Originally posted by llagrok
Aizen isn't an Espada which means that his zanpakutou most likely won't grant him speed/strength/endurance comparable to any marvel characters. So far, we haven't seen them at Mrs.Marvel level, which is far below what Magneto can handle.

As for telepathy and illusions, check out Eve of Destruction. They mention that the only reason they get to cast an illusion on him is because his helmet is off. Which he took off after having messed up Xavier's bloodsteam, shutting off his power. Didn't take off the helmet until Xavier's powers were off. Common, you see the connection.

The x-men never force Magneto to drop his forcefield, he just stopped using it after a while. They wait until he's distracted with something else and then Wolverine is able to kill him. Which is probably the most ridiculous thing in comics. Worse than Ultimate Colossus beating Mags.

When written properly, Magneto gets up his shield and can pretty much take on any hero. It's just like with Apocalypse. The x-men never beat him in a straight up battle, they do it through PIS. Which is non-existent in KMC fights.

You also know that Xorn was really intended to be Magneto? Claremont said "Xorn was always Magneto." It was Chuck who retconned the whole thing with Shen :/

So give the fact that Magneto has resisted telepathic attacks from anyone. Under Stan Lee he had telepathy and was the second strongest mind on earth and an amplified Psylocke was BARELY able to hurt him with her psychic knife.

Either way, Aizen doesn't have a viable way of beating Mags here. He won't get past Mag's forcefield, Magneto can easily tell him apart from his clone and rip him apart, blast him, freeze him, control him, burn him, pretty much do anything. If he wants to, Magneto has also been shown able to amplify his own physique.

That's all I have to say for today.

Magneto 10/10

Originally posted by Akuki
I really don't get your point with the zanpaktou, what difference does being espada or not being espada make? Could you elaborate?

Sure.

Espada receive a bonus to their durability, strength, speed, whatever when they release. Thus far, Aizen creates illusions. Releasing won't give him any form of enhanced physique, meaning that he is at his max.

No city-levelling attacks? Let's look at this:
Ichigo defeated Kenpachi, who's single swing levelled the building beside him. Kenpachi's passive reiatsu flattens cities.
Aizen stopped Ichigo's bankai with one finger. One finger stopped a city-levelling attack. This also rebuts your 'Aizen has no stamina' point.
And you say his power wouldn't increase with his bankai. Er, hello? Every bankai increases reiatsu exponentially, as has been stated multiple times throughout the series.
Finally, you said that Magneto could sense copies of himself or whatnot through Kayoka Suigetsu's hypnosis. This is impossible, as it is COMPLETE hypnosis, not hypnosis that stops at a certain level.

why are people talking like aizen is a weakling? if you forgotten he's stronger than most if not all the captains (and that was before he used the orb of distortion) he's mastered all 4 areas of shinigami combat in bleach terms he's a powerhouse in his own right one of his abilities is his illusions but it's not like thats all there is to him and theoretically speaking he's 50 times stronger than the last time we saw him in action

I'm still not sure what strength class Aizen should fall into. Anyone have any suggestions?

Ichigo's bankai just increases his speed. How is that a "city - levelling attack"?

Kenpachi cut down one building, that was perhaps 30 meters tall. How is that destroying a city?

Not to mention Ichigo was weakened from his fight with Byakuya when he attacked Aizen.

youtube.com/watch?v=CaxC2FV-OHU&search=
Watch 3:33 roughly. I'm fairly sure that's more than one building.

Another example of Aizen surviving such power can be interred through Grimmjow. Grimmjow survived a bankai getsuga with barely a scratch, without releasing. Aizen's reiatsu knocks Grimmjow down. I'm fairly sure you can figure out the rest.

yes aizen is not an espada... he is ABOVE espada in power