End up in Hell if you stole a Penny ?

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Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?










































* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic)

leonheartmm
well i do know that by muslim belief. your VIRTUES{shudnt just be GOOD acts, can be simply offering prayer/cleaning yourself/not swaying from islam} will be weighed against your sins{deviances from islam} on the day of judgement.

so i doubt willingly stealing a coin and not feeling sorry for it wud tip the balance. although, in the real world, the teenage boy would have his left hand cut without fail for any stealing, small or big. followed by his right hand on the second offence, then left foot on the third offence and finally right foot on the fourth one. kinda wierd.

i kinda get what ur getting at here. i think its sorta the thing that WILLINGLY/knowingly disreguarding relegion means you have disbelieved and not asking for forgiveness reinforces that. i suppose its hazy, but in abrahamic relegions the child might go to hell.

Nellinator
So assuming you mean this person is saved up unto this point this person would go to heaven because the God's grace extends past the moment of salvation. Naturally, they will have to give an account of the event to God and will receive loss for the deed, but his/her salvation is guaranteed. Therefore the deed only take away from the reward, not the salvation.

Goddess Kali
The point is that many Christians and Muslims (and some Jews) beleive that the reason there is Hell is because of our "sinfulness". And the only way to be saved is either through Jesus, or Allah.



But I am questioning what "sinfulness" actually means, and at what point does sinfulness warrant Hell ?


If someone did nothing their entire life, and then stole a penny, would they end up in Hell?


If someone was in a coma from age 7 to age 21, and then he stole something, then died right after, would he go to Hell ?



Christians like yourself, JIA, and Marcello, and others will often argue that because of our "sinfulness" we are on a path to Hell.


People like myself, and others, have not committed murder, rape, or anything warranting eternal suffering.


The worst any of us have ever done was insult someone, lie, or maybe even steal, not to mention have "immoral" sex out of marriage.


You won't get severe punishment or the death penalty for any of those things by Law. You won't get tortured either.


So how do you end up in Hell for those things ?



Christianity poses so many logical issues...

Vathu
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?










































* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic)

I would go say I'm sorry to a pastor and everything would be all better.

Nellinator
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
But I am questioning what "sinfulness" actually means, and at what point does sinfulness warrant Hell ? Since this seems to be your main question... I would say sinfulness excludes you from heaven when it is not forgiven. The blood of Jesus washes all sins from the past and covers sins of the future. However, those sins make Judgment Day less rewarding to say the least.

Boris
Yes, you're going to hell.

willRules
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?










































* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic)



You original premise contradicts your "challenging" statement. If someone truly was a Christian who for all intents and purposes follows the Christian faith, why wouldn't they apologise for every sin regardless of how big small, or if they can remember it or not????? confused That's a core part of being a Christian, recognising that throughout our life we sin many times, big, small, forgettable or in memorable ways, but the point is if we are truly sorry we can find repentance due to the sacrifice Jesus made for us.

Bicnarok

willRules
yes Hell is the label we have given it yes

Interestingly enough, many think of Hell as burning lakes of fire and sulphur (Mostly due to the reference of the lake of fire in John's Revelation.) However in the four gospels, Jesus references to Hell were used as an analogy to a rubbish dump outside the city walls. many scholars think that Jesus was trying to tell his disciples that Hell was like a rubbish dump where the garbage was thrown away yes

Melcórë
?

My understanding has always been that in the Hebraic and Rabbinic texts, Sheol is the "Void" (mentioned in Gen. 1:2) where all human souls go until the coming of the Messiah?

BTW: Hell was originally the name of a Germanic goddess, no?

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Nellinator
Since this seems to be your main question... I would say sinfulness excludes you from heaven when it is not forgiven. The blood of Jesus washes all sins from the past and covers sins of the future. However, those sins make Judgment Day less rewarding to say the least.


You don't get my point. If all your sins are "small ones" then why do you deserve eternal suffering? That's drastic, rediculous, and injust.



Would you say it was injust for a man to get his hand cut off for stealing a book ?


If not, then why should he burn in hell for it ?

willRules

Melcórë
Originally posted by willRules
I was referring to Jesus's teaching on hell and what it is like, but yeah Sheol is the Hebrew understanding of a hereafter yes

As for the word "Hell" I'm afraid I wouldn't have a clue, I just know it came in at a much later date and went by a different name beforehand. I'd have to wiki it big grin

That's what I thought.

Yes, I've referenced. "Hell" (or "Hel"wink was the name of a Germanic death-goddess and her abode, thus its use by Christians as the abode of the damned.

willRules
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
You don't get my point. If all your sins are "small ones" then why do you deserve eternal suffering? That's drastic, rediculous, and injust.



Would you say it was injust for a man to get his hand cut off for stealing a book ?


If not, then why should he burn in hell for it ?

According to Christian teaching a sin is a sin. The all powerful, all knowing, all loving God has far better authority to judge and decide how "bad" a sin is. According to Christian teaching, one sin isn't worse than the other, what's bad is the fact that we have sinned at all!!! But the whole point is that it isn't game over. Jesus is our hope of a redemption and salvation yes

willRules

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by willRules
According to Christian teaching a sin is a sin. The all powerful, all knowing, all loving God has far better authority to judge and decide how "bad" a sin is. According to Christian teaching, one sin isn't worse than the other, what's bad is the fact that we have sinned at all!!! But the whole point is that it isn't game over. Jesus is our hope of a redemption and salvation yes



For a person to go to Hell for stealing a penny, is injustice.


Like I said before...if a person steals a book, should you cut off their hand ?


Likewise, if a person steals a book, or penny, or whatever...should they suffer for all eternity ?



Your God, and the concept of Hell, are completely illogical.

willRules
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
For a person to go to Hell for stealing a penny, is injustice.


Like I said before...if a person steals a book, should you cut off their hand ?


Likewise, if a person steals a book, or penny, or whatever...should they suffer for all eternity ?



Your God, and the concept of Hell, are completely illogical.

Well I trust in an all powerful, all loving God. I respect his judgement and authority much more than those who would spend their time cutting off each other's hands yes

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by willRules
Well I trust in an all powerful, all loving God. I respect his judgement and authority much more than those who would spend their time cutting off each other's hands yes


Humans would cut eachother's hands off, while God would send someone to Eternal Hellfire as a punishment for the same crime.


I don't beleive what you beleive, because your sense of justice is unreasonable.

willRules
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Humans would cut eachother's hands off, while God would send someone to Eternal Hellfire as a punishment for the same crime.


I don't beleive what you beleive, because your sense of justice is unreasonable.

Well again, you have an issue with God's sense of judgement. But I believe that God is all powerful and all loving. There couldn't be anything more just than God. He created justice, he knows what it is better than we do. yes

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by willRules
Well again, you have an issue with God's sense of judgement. But I believe that God is all powerful and all loving. There couldn't be anything more just than God. He created justice, he knows what it is better than we do. yes



What you call God's sense of justice goes against Logic. That's the problem.


You cannot be all loving if you send people to Hell as punishment for anything. That is hatred.


No offense, but your beleif is completely Blind. You are not seeing what is really there, only what you want to see.

willRules
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
What you call God's sense of justice goes against Logic. That's the problem.


You cannot be all loving if you send people to Hell as punishment for anything. That is hatred.


No offense, but your beleif is completely Blind. You are not seeing what is really there, only what you want to see.

It's only hatred if you want to send people to hell. It's only hatred when you send someone because you hate them. I believe in an all loving God. He however doesn't choose to send us to hell, we make that choice very much of our own accord yes

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by willRules
It's only hatred if you want to send people to hell. It's only hatred when you send someone because you hate them. I believe in an all loving God. He however doesn't choose to send us to hell, we make that choice very much of our own accord yes


It's only hatred to torture someone if you hate them ? erm

But it's okay to torture someone if you love them ?


And no, no one chooses to go to Hell. If the Nazis attack me, and send me to a concentration camp, I didn't choose to go there. They forced me to.

Nellinator
Hell =/= torture. That is a false tradition. Hell will be unpleasant, but that will be of your own accord.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Nellinator
Hell =/= torture. That is a false tradition. Hell will be unpleasant, but that will be of your own accord.

So for all I know, Hell will be an eternal math class ?





So what about all the hell fire and brimstone, and gnashing of teeth, and eternal torment and sorrow ? erm

Nellinator
Eternal torment and sorrow doesn't mean anyone will do it to you. You will be doing it to yourself, completely and utterly separated from God.

debbiejo
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?










































* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic)

According to most Christian beliefs, though some may not want to admit it, YES they will go to hell because they did not repent. There are some Catholics that wear a special type necklace for just that purpose. It's a protector in case you forget thingie.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Nellinator
Eternal torment and sorrow doesn't mean anyone will do it to you. You will be doing it to yourself, completely and utterly separated from God.


But Hell is eternal torment and sorrow, no ?

And over what, a penny ?



Secondly, what will I do to myself ? I doubt I would torment myself at all after death roll eyes (sarcastic)

Nellinator
Perhaps if all you do is steal a penny your hell won't be so bad. Others might not be so lucky. And you will do it because you will be confronted with all your sins and they will all be called to attention at judgment day, even those that you have forgotten. And without the flesh you will be confronted with them everyday and the complete separation from God will also torment you because believe it or not, you are not completely separated from God yet.

leonheartmm
that argument doesnt hold ground because in the scriptures god has made it very clear that he is NOT with the unbelievers. in their existance or heart. so the whole, SEPERATION FORM GOD=PAIN{hell} thing doesnt hold true. atheists, satanists and people of a relegion other than yours{as you believe} are as seperated from god as can be. they live on this earth and are not in hell.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Nellinator
Perhaps if all you do is steal a penny your hell won't be so bad. Others might not be so lucky. And you will do it because you will be confronted with all your sins and they will all be called to attention at judgment day, even those that you have forgotten. And without the flesh you will be confronted with them everyday and the complete separation from God will also torment you because believe it or not, you are not completely separated from God yet.



Then why is it that I am happier now as a non beleiver, then I was as a beleiver ?

Nellinator
You may be closer now than before without you knowing it. Perhaps God is moving in you more now without you knowing, perhaps there is more prayer for you, perhaps Satan is working less against you because he already won... There are many things that we'll never know. Your life as a "believer" didn't seem to involve a healthy relationship with God. It seems more like an immature "I believe because my parents do" type of thing from what I've demised.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Nellinator
You may be closer now than before without you knowing it. Perhaps God is moving in you more now without you knowing, perhaps there is more prayer for you, perhaps Satan is working less against you because he already won... There are many things that we'll never know. Your life as a "believer" didn't seem to involve a healthy relationship with God. It seems more like an immature "I believe because my parents do" type of thing from what I've demised.



I didn't stop beleiving until I actually began reading the Bible. How much does that say ?


How can I be close to God at all, when I deny his existance completely ?

BlaxicanHydra

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
BING-BING-BING!

You don't go to hell for sins. Matter of fact no one goes to hell.


So our Bible is fallible.

BlaxicanHydra
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
So our Bible is fallible.

No. People just mistranslate it, because they're retards. I am a Jehovah's Witness, a sect of Christianity, and people don't go to hell for there sins.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
No. People just mid translate it, because they're retards. I am a Jehovah's Witness, a sect of Christianity, and people don't go to hell for there sins.



MARCELLO is gonna have a field day with you laughing

BlaxicanHydra
MARCELLO can kiss my ass smile

Nellinator
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
I didn't stop beleiving until I actually began reading the Bible. How much does that say ?


How can I be close to God at all, when I deny his existance completely ? It doesn't tell me anything. I'd suggest that I've studied the Bible as much as you, that we are of comparable intelligences and came to different conclusions. It doesn't tell if I'm right or if you are. It's pretty neutral. You not agreeing with something doesn't make it untrue necessarily.

Because he created you.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Nellinator
It doesn't tell me anything. I'd suggest that I've studied the Bible as much as you, that we are of comparable intelligences and came to different conclusions. It doesn't tell if I'm right or if you are. It's pretty neutral. You not agreeing with something doesn't make it untrue necessarily.

Because he created you.


So you actually beleive a Gay/bisexual, promiscious Buddhist, who has slight anger issues, is close to God ?













































laughing

leonheartmm
Originally posted by Nellinator
You may be closer now than before without you knowing it. Perhaps God is moving in you more now without you knowing, perhaps there is more prayer for you, perhaps Satan is working less against you because he already won... There are many things that we'll never know. Your life as a "believer" didn't seem to involve a healthy relationship with God. It seems more like an immature "I believe because my parents do" type of thing from what I've demised.

in other words, a "god of gaps" then.

Nellinator
Nope... note close(R). wink

Naturally.

BlaxicanHydra
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
So you actually beleive a Gay/bisexual, promiscious Buddhist, who has slight anger issues, is close to God ?

laughing

God loves everyone, a father (Unless he's screwed in the head) wouldn't hate his son because he turned gay, or had anger issues.

Nellinator
Originally posted by leonheartmm
in other words, a "god of gaps" then. Actually no. That's more of a "God works in mysterious ways" thing.

leonheartmm
Originally posted by Nellinator
Actually no. That's more of a "God works in mysterious ways" thing.




your using "perhaps" there a lot. not to mention your leaning towards vague highly unlikely conclusions, from little direct evidence for those SPECIFIC conclusions to hold true. as opposed to the vastly more obvious conclusions based on much clearer evidence. sounds like a god of gaps to me.{plus you ARE basically supporting the idea of god working in mysterious ways}

BlaxicanHydra
The term "God works in mysterious ways wouldn't be true if there were proof, evidence, and reason for his workings no expression

Congrats, btw. You can quote now stick out tongue

Nellinator
Originally posted by leonheartmm
your using "perhaps" there a lot. not to mention your leaning towards vague highly unlikely conclusions, from little direct evidence for those SPECIFIC conclusions to hold true. as opposed to the vastly more obvious conclusions based on much clearer evidence. sounds like a god of gaps to me.{plus you ARE basically supporting the idea of god working in mysterious ways} Perhaps = I don't know for sure because I don't know Kali's actual life situation and I'm not God. And yes I am supporting that because He does work in mysterious ways. If you think you can manage six billion people using the conventional methods of humans you should run for a high government position.

leonheartmm
Originally posted by Nellinator
Perhaps = I don't know for sure because I don't know Kali's actual life situation and I'm not God. And yes I am supporting that because He does work in mysterious ways. If you think you can manage six billion people using the conventional methods of humans you should run for a high government position.

hence that supports my previous conclusion of you referring to a god of gaps.

and personally, i dont think the human race is doing too well right now{or ever}. makes me think there isnt any manager. or one who is actively working for the detriment of his client, bringing out the worst in her/him when there is infact the potential for so much good.

Nellinator
Gaps infers something that science can't fill. That not really applicable to the situation. Unless you are using it in a different sense, in which case then you correct.

God isn't the only one working in the world and God is the one that people listen to least.

leonheartmm
gaps can also be gaps in reasoning. understanding{not to be taken in mocking way}, sensing. cause-affect.

willRules
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
It's only hatred to torture someone if you hate them ? erm

But it's okay to torture someone if you love them ?


And no, no one chooses to go to Hell. If the Nazis attack me, and send me to a concentration camp, I didn't choose to go there. They forced me to.

But the Nazi party sent people to concentration camps for not conforming to their standards through being outside their idealogical standards of race, people with specific sexual preferences, asocials etc etc

Now you may argue that God could be used as a similar analogy for sending people to hell for sinning and not conforming to his standards. However we tend to forget that his standards are not unfair, cruel or unjust. Technically we wouldn't have any argument in our defence whatsoever if God (instead of sending Jesus to die for us) just chucked us all straight into hell. He is a perfect and fair God and logically if we can't conform to the standards he set for us then we are the ones who aren't being fair.

But the whole point is that God is not vengeful or full of hate. Whilst we are the sinful, disobedient creatures who reject an all loving God and deserve hell, he still loved us enough to send his son to us as a sacrifice for our sins so that we don't have to suffer in hell yes

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by willRules
But the Nazi party sent people to concentration camps for not conforming to their standards through being outside their idealogical standards of race, people with specific sexual preferences, asocials etc etc

Now you may argue that God could be used as a similar analogy for sending people to hell for sinning and not conforming to his standards. However we tend to forget that his standards are not unfair, cruel or unjust. Technically we wouldn't have any argument in our defence whatsoever if God (instead of sending Jesus to die for us) just chucked us all straight into hell. He is a perfect and fair God and logically if we can't conform to the standards he set for us then we are the ones who aren't being fair.

But the whole point is that God is not vengeful or full of hate. Whilst we are the sinful, disobedient creatures who reject an all loving God and deserve hell, he still loved us enough to send his son to us as a sacrifice for our sins so that we don't have to suffer in hell yes
The problem is: who speaks for god here on Earth?

Jbill311
Originally posted by willRules
But the Nazi party sent people to concentration camps for not conforming to their standards through being outside their idealogical standards of race, people with specific sexual preferences, asocials etc etc

Now you may argue that God could be used as a similar analogy for sending people to hell for sinning and not conforming to his standards. However we tend to forget that his standards are not unfair, cruel or unjust. Technically we wouldn't have any argument in our defence whatsoever if God (instead of sending Jesus to die for us) just chucked us all straight into hell. He is a perfect and fair God and logically if we can't conform to the standards he set for us then we are the ones who aren't being fair.

But the whole point is that God is not vengeful or full of hate. Whilst we are the sinful, disobedient creatures who reject an all loving God and deserve hell, he still loved us enough to send his son to us as a sacrifice for our sins so that we don't have to suffer in hell yes



So the concentration camps would have been OK if the victims were chosen based on a different standard? It wouldn't have been an atrocity if the prisoners had been chosen because they disagreed with a giant invisible man on how to live their life?

Kelly_Bean
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?










































* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic)
No 'cause God is smart enough to know that a penny doesn't amount to shi*t.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Kelly_Bean
No 'cause God is smart enough to know that a penny doesn't amount to shi*t.

Billions of dollars don't amount to shi*t in the big picture.

willRules
Originally posted by Jbill311
So the concentration camps would have been OK if the victims were chosen based on a different standard? It wouldn't have been an atrocity if the prisoners had been chosen because they disagreed with a giant invisible man on how to live their life?

I have already answered this here.........

Originally posted by willRules
Now you may argue that God could be used as a similar analogy for sending people to hell for sinning and not conforming to his standards. However we tend to forget that his standards are not unfair, cruel or unjust. Technically we wouldn't have any argument in our defence whatsoever if God (instead of sending Jesus to die for us) just chucked us all straight into hell. He is a perfect and fair God and logically if we can't conform to the standards he set for us then we are the ones who aren't being fair.

But the whole point is that God is not vengeful or full of hate. Whilst we are the sinful, disobedient creatures who reject an all loving God and deserve hell, he still loved us enough to send his son to us as a sacrifice for our sins so that we don't have to suffer in hell yes

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by willRules
I have already answered this here.........

But your answer is illogical, and equates too a "just because" type answer.

willRules
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
But your answer is illogical, and equates too a "just because" type answer.

I never said you'd like the answer. But hey, truth hurts stick out tongue

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by willRules
I never said you'd like the answer. But hey, truth hurts stick out tongue

If you are ok with that, then... I have a different standard.

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
You don't get my point. If all your sins are "small ones" then why do you deserve eternal suffering? That's drastic, rediculous, and injust.



Would you say it was injust for a man to get his hand cut off for stealing a book ?


If not, then why should he burn in hell for it ?

Well, of course it's unjust, that's an obvious answer. You seem to be hell bent in making these type of threads. Just to play "Devils Advocate" with Christians, why? confused

BlaxicanHydra
'cause too a lot of people on this forum Christians= stupid, and it's fun to f*ck with them?

Quiero Mota
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?










































* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic)

According to the Koran, God is full of infinite mercy, so I don't think Muslims would be too concerned


But in the Bible, its a big deal, so if stealing something as meager as a penny is enough to spend eternity in Satan's Hilton, then my reservation is prepped and waiting for me.

chithappens
Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
a father (Unless he's screwed in the head) wouldn't hate his son because he turned gay, or had anger issues.

What world do you live in?

chithappens
Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
'cause too a lot of people on this forum Christians= stupid, and it's fun to f*ck with them?

He is looking for an answer that makes sense to him. Not that I blame him @ all. If there are circular answers then why not do the tango, I suppose Happy Dance

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Well, of course it's unjust, that's an obvious answer. You seem to be hell bent in making these type of threads. Just to play "Devils Advocate" with Christians, why? confused



Just because I question Christianity does not mean I hate it. I've been Christian for 18 years of my life, and I feel the right to critisize it as much as I want.


I am critisizing idealogy, not people.


Secondly, the reason for this thread is simple. Many Christians, particularly Evangelicals, beleive that people deserve to go to Hell, eternal torment, even if they didn't kill or rape someone.


That means being a liar, homosexual, cheater, adulterer, heathen, or fornicator is enough to get you deserving of eternal torment, and somehow God is still supposed to be all loving.


Many Christians will argue that "All Sins are Equal in the Eyes of God", as an excuse to justify Hell.

That is the problem I have with the Christian concept of Hell...well, one of many. No one answered my other questions...

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Just because I question Christianity does not mean I hate it. I've been Christian for 18 years of my life, and I feel the right to critisize it as much as I want.I am critisizing idealogy, not people.Secondly, the reason for this thread is simple. Many Christians, particularly Evangelicals, beleive that people deserve to go to Hell, eternal torment, even if they didn't kill or rape someone.

I never implied or stated that you hate Christianity, but your making these threads just for the sake of debate. I mean what's the point of constantly arguing a group of people that believe these kinda things?
What effect will it have on you that they believe in some magical place where all immoral people go after death. It's of no consequence to you what Christians believe. People will always have different beliefs, that's life. Why make threads to argue what someone believe's, just because it does not agree with yours? I'm not saying your wrong. But, it seems really pointless Especially if your whole reasoning behind it is to find an answer that justify's your contempt of Christian morals. erm




Originally posted by Goddess Kali



That is the problem I have with the Christian concept of Hell...well, one of many. No one answered my other questions...

Your looking for an answer that justify's your belief versus an authentic one., though.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
I never implied or stated that you hate Christianity, but your making these threads just for the sake of debate. I mean what's the point of constantly arguing a group of people that believe these kinda things?
What effect will it have on you that they believe in some magical place where all immoral people go after death. It's of no consequence to you what Christians believe. People will always have different beliefs, that's life. Why make threads to argue what someone believe's, just because it does not agree with yours? I'm not saying your wrong. But, it seems really pointless Especially if your whole reasoning behind it is to find an answer that justify's your contempt of Christian morals. erm



Christianity is a powerful idealogy which has shaped and influenced civilization for over a thousand years.

It is the greatest power in my country, actually in this continent, and effects my life every single day, as well as the lives of others.


It being a massive, influential phenomena, I have every right to challenge it, as do others.


Challenging Christianity is not pointless. Challening Greek mythology would be, however. I am sure you figure out why, and what the difference is.






Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Your looking for an answer that justify's your belief versus an authentic one., though.



the what ?

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Christianity is a powerful idealogy which has shaped and influenced civilization for over a thousand years.It is the greatest power in my country, actually in this continent, and effects my life every single day, as well as the lives of others.It being a massive, influential phenomena, I have every right to challenge it, as do others.

Christianity didn't spread because of it's ideology or it's belief for the most part. It spread by supressing rival cults at the time. Furthermore, your all over the place. First you claim your against Evangelical Christian ideals and now it's just Christian ideals?

Second of all, your no really different from Christians really. You disagree with Christian morals because they contradict your own. Furthermore, I don't you even understand said christian morals to begin with. These threads aren't pointless, but if your just looking to justify your own predisposed opinion of Christianity, what's the point?



Originally posted by Goddess Kali

Challenging Christianity is not pointless. Challening Greek mythology would be, however. I am sure you figure out why, and what the difference is.


It's pointless when the only answer your looking for is: "Yes, Christianity is wrong" erm

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Christianity didn't spread because of it's ideology or it's belief for the most part. It spread by supressing rival cults at the time. Furthermore, your all over the place. First you claim your against Evangelical Christian ideals and now it's just Christian ideals?


I am not against Christianity. It is a religion which has right to exist, since it serves to make many people happy. But it is clearly not perfect or infallible by many of its followers claim.

If anyone challenges Buddhism, I encourage them to do so. Even I question my own religion, very often.

And it seems to me your are unaware of the influence Christianity has over much of the world, else you wouldn't have disagreed with my statement like you did here.




Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Second of all, your no really different from Christians really. You disagree with Christian morals because they contradict your own. Furthermore, I don't you even understand said christian morals to begin with. These threads aren't pointless, but if your just looking to justify your own predisposed opinion of Christianity, what's the point?


What Christian morals do I disagree with ?


"Love Thy Neighbor" and "Treat others as thou wish to be treated" are morals I agree with very highly.


There are other aspects of Christianity that I do not agree with, but I bet you don't even know what they are.

And I am not the only person who challenges Christianity.









Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
It's pointless when the only answer your looking for is: "Yes, Christianity is wrong" erm



I beleive it is just a religion, man made, a series of human history and wisdom put together. Nothing wrong with that. But until Christians stop claiming thier religion absolute truth, I will still challenge that, and I have every right to.

Sandai Kitetsu
I don't wanna derail your thread, So, I'll get to the point. As far as I know, nowhwere in the Tanakh/Bible does it state that one will go to hell for commiting a certain sin. The Bible condemns certain Sins, but the only person that will judge is GOD. So, your premise is flawd because, even if it's a sin to steal. No one can decide who goes where, but the lord.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
I don't wanna derail your thread, So, I'll get to the point. As far as I know, nowhwere in the Tanakh/Bible does it state that one will go to hell for commiting a certain sin. The Bible condemns certain Sins, but the only person that will judge is GOD. So, your premise is flawd because, even if it's a sin to steal. No one can decide who goes where, but the lord.


However, Christians on KMC have claimed that all sins are equal. That is the point of this thread. So whether or not you murdered someone, or whether you stole a penny is irrelevant to some Christians, because God sees all sins as the same.


These Christians have supported thier claims through scripture, although one can easily dismiss thier claims using contradicting scripture.

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
However, Christians on KMC have claimed that all sins are equal. That is the point of this thread. So whether or not you murdered someone, or whether you stole a penny is irrelevant to some Christians, because God sees all sins as the same.


These Christians have supported thier claims through scripture, although one can easily dismiss thier claims using contradicting scripture.

What scriptures, I want see these scriptures that claim you will go to hell for stealing a penny.

lord xyz
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?










































* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic) He stole and didn't beg for forgiveness. He rots in hell.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
What scriptures, I want see these scriptures that claim you will go to hell for stealing a penny.




Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
However, Christians on KMC have claimed that all sins are equal. That is the point of this thread. So whether or not you murdered someone, or whether you stole a penny is irrelevant to some Christians, because God sees all sins as the same.

Marchello
*

***That person will end up in Hell...even if he kept ALL of the conditions above...and here is WHY:

(1)He/she is a BORN sinner because his/her parents were sinners and begat him/her. When Adam sinned in the garden of Eden, he was sentenced to DEATH by God because he became a SINNER by his disobedience: "In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou RETURN unto the GROUND; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou ART, and dust shalt thou RETURN" . Adam was innocent before he sinned and he walked with God in the garden. When he sinned, he LOST his "innocense"...he became a sinner. His NATURE changed and he passed this sin nature on down to his children.... Therefore, EVERY human being is a born SINNER...for the Scripture confirms: "For ALL have sinned and fall SHORT of the glory of God" ...and again "As it is written, there is NONE righteous, no NOT ONE: There is NONE that understandeth, there is NONE that seeketh after God" .

When Adam sinned he died SPIRITUALLY immediately...he lost his SPIRITUAL LIFE before God . He also lost his PHYSICAL life in death years later..."For the WAGES of SIN is DEATH...".

(2)You stated that the person died the day after he/she stole the penny..."without the slightest bit of remorse." But of course, he/she died without remorse...a testimonial of their lost SPIRITUAL condition before God...and acted out their true spiritual condition. They were sinners.

(3)There is NO gradation of sin before God...for ALL sin is DEADLY no matter how "small"...for it is written: "For the WAGES of sin is DEATH, but the GIFT of God is ETERNAL life THROUGH Jesus Christ our Lord" .

BOTTOM-LINE: ALL men are SINNERS and ALL will surely DIE. Those who die in their sins WITHOUT Jesus Christ as their Saviour and Lord will die the DEATH in HELL . It doesn't have to end that way though. The GOOD NEWS is...Jesus died for your sins and paid their penalty for you. He RANSOMED you FROM their PUNISHMENT and took that punishment FOR you...because He LOVED you Kali. NONE of your other "lovers" would actually give their lives for you...but Jesus DID so that you might have ETERNAL LIFE in Him. He will CHANGE your SINFUL NATURE and you will become a "New Creation" in Him. You then will be assured of Eternal Life instead of ETERNAL DEATH in HELL.

Marchello

debbiejo
Some people don't like to think, but only talk. Thinking for them can be a bit inconvenient.....


I know, I've asked the Church Lady....yeah, inconvenient.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***That person will end up in Hell...even if he kept ALL of the conditions above...and here is WHY:

(1)He/she is a BORN sinner because his/her parents were sinners and begat him/her. When Adam sinned in the garden of Eden, he was sentenced to DEATH by God because he became a SINNER by his disobedience: "In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou RETURN unto the GROUND; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou ART, and dust shalt thou RETURN" . Adam was innocent before he sinned and he walked with God in the garden. When he sinned, he LOST his "innocense"...he became a sinner. His NATURE changed and he passed this sin nature on down to his children.... Therefore, EVERY human being is a born SINNER...for the Scripture confirms: "For ALL have sinned and fall SHORT of the glory of God" ...and again "As it is written, there is NONE righteous, no NOT ONE: There is NONE that understandeth, there is NONE that seeketh after God" .

When Adam sinned he died SPIRITUALLY immediately...he lost his SPIRITUAL LIFE before God . He also lost his PHYSICAL life in death years later..."For the WAGES of SIN is DEATH...".

(2)You stated that the person died the day after he/she stole the penny..."without the slightest bit of remorse." But of course, he/she died without remorse...a testimonial of their lost SPIRITUAL condition before God...and acted out their true spiritual condition. They were sinners.

(3)There is NO gradation of sin before God...for ALL sin is DEADLY no matter how "small"...for it is written: "For the WAGES of sin is DEATH, but the GIFT of God is ETERNAL life THROUGH Jesus Christ our Lord" .

BOTTOM-LINE: ALL men are SINNERS and ALL will surely DIE. Those who die in their sins WITHOUT Jesus Christ as their Saviour and Lord will die the DEATH in HELL . It doesn't have to end that way though. The GOOD NEWS is...Jesus died for your sins and paid their penalty for you. He RANSOMED you FROM their PUNISHMENT and took that punishment FOR you...because He LOVED you Kali. NONE of your other "lovers" would actually give their lives for you...but Jesus DID so that you might have ETERNAL LIFE in Him. He will CHANGE your SINFUL NATURE and you will become a "New Creation" in Him. You then will be assured of Eternal Life instead of ETERNAL DEATH in HELL.

Marchello

I'm sure glad this is not the truth.

debbiejo
It is in his world.

Marchello
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***That person will end up in Hell...even if he kept ALL of the conditions above...and here is WHY:

(1)He/she is a BORN sinner because his/her parents were sinners and begat him/her. When Adam sinned in the garden of Eden, he was sentenced to DEATH by God because he became a SINNER by his disobedience: "In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou RETURN unto the GROUND; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou ART, and dust shalt thou RETURN" . Adam was innocent before he sinned and he walked with God in the garden. When he sinned, he LOST his "innocense"...he became a sinner. His NATURE changed and he passed this sin nature on down to his children.... Therefore, EVERY human being is a born SINNER...for the Scripture confirms: "For ALL have sinned and fall SHORT of the glory of God" ...and again "As it is written, there is NONE righteous, no NOT ONE: There is NONE that understandeth, there is NONE that seeketh after God" .

When Adam sinned he died SPIRITUALLY immediately...he lost his SPIRITUAL LIFE before God . He also lost his PHYSICAL life in death years later..."For the WAGES of SIN is DEATH...".

(2)You stated that the person died the day after he/she stole the penny..."without the slightest bit of remorse." But of course, he/she died without remorse...a testimonial of their lost SPIRITUAL condition before God...and acted out their true spiritual condition. They were sinners.

(3)There is NO gradation of sin before God...for ALL sin is DEADLY no matter how "small"...for it is written: "For the WAGES of sin is DEATH, but the GIFT of God is ETERNAL life THROUGH Jesus Christ our Lord" .

BOTTOM-LINE: ALL men are SINNERS and ALL will surely DIE. Those who die in their sins WITHOUT Jesus Christ as their Saviour and Lord will die the DEATH in HELL . It doesn't have to end that way though. The GOOD NEWS is...Jesus died for your sins and paid their penalty for you. He RANSOMED you FROM their PUNISHMENT and took that punishment FOR you...because He LOVED you Kali. NONE of your other "lovers" would actually give their lives for you...but Jesus DID so that you might have ETERNAL LIFE in Him. He will CHANGE your SINFUL NATURE and you will become a "New Creation" in Him. You then will be assured of Eternal Life instead of ETERNAL DEATH in HELL.

Marchello

***ADDENDA: If the "pennystealer" is a saved person and subsequently stole the penny, he will not lose his salvation but will have to give an accounting of this sin and may lose some of his rewards at the Bema Seat of Christ for believers. This does not apply to other faiths, however, for they know not Jesus and are not saved.

Marchello

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by debbiejo
It is in his world.

Well, there is the problem; any god that is a "he" is limited.

Czarina_Czarina
When God was about to set Gomorrah on fire, Abraham petition God for at least 5 righteous. What is righteousness? Faith in God. If you have faith in God, then if you fear for your soul, maybe you need to ask God for forgiveness for ALL sins and to establish a faith relationship. And maybe skew the argument, instead of asking, "will you set me on fire for one penny?", maybe you petition or pray in view of a different mindset, "will you forgive me for stealing one?" The later question invokes a sense of remorse, the first question invokes the sense of deviance and taunt. And if you have faith in God, he'll guide your heart. I think the problem with the old testiment was that the law wasn't written in their hearts, God had asked them to do that, but the law was all they knew as well as some old fashion pagan spiritual rights that seemed to work, as that's why they continued falling back into it, which caused them to have faith in their own ability, have faith in the star/celestral system, rather then to have faith in the one who gave them those gifts, the one who set the order of the celestral system, and the one who gave them breathe or life. We can be very powerful, all of us, humans, and in that power, just like this good country, we know that power can corrupt, so we are careful. Power doesn't mean we are God, but power can make us feel drunk in the idea of being god, and playing god over the life of others. Faith, faith is righteous, and that's the only thing that God loved about Abraham, it's wasn't his bloodline or status or ability (as he used Moses too), it was Abraham's FAITH. Faith will cause you to seek God and that'll change your heart to do things that are right or righteous. But, sometimes, God does use situations that seem WRONG, such as adultery (Hagar, Bathsheba), and make us wonder why he cared for those women, and how could they be in the right? God does things that doesn't make sense to the very laws he gave us, what does that mean? Don't rest your faith solely on the laws (such as the laws of marriage, as that too can be manipulated to trap or intervene with God's plans, as if someone knows the celestral system, they can see or predict something of God's plan and work against it and then tell the world, it's an established "marriage" and get the entire clan to psychically or phsyically hurt that person), do follow the law to the best of your ability, we all have our strengths and weakness, that's why we are asked not to tempt our brothers/sisters, but don't rest your entire faith on it. Your faith is in God, then the law. That's all.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
When God was about to set Gomorrah on fire, Abraham petition God for at least 5 righteous. What is righteousness? Faith in God. If you have faith in God, then if you fear for your soul, maybe you need to ask God for forgiveness for ALL sins and to establish a faith relationship.

Or maybe those are just stories that talk more about the people of the time they were written, and what they believed.

Czarina_Czarina
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Or maybe those are just stories that talk more about the people of the time they were written, and what they believed.


My life is a story, and one day, if it's ever recited as a joke or gossip or fable, maybe parts of it will seem totally out of God's law or command depending on interpretation, but even if you don't find reminants of me in Carbon form (can't find essence of my dna anywhere), that doesn't mean that I didn't exist, nor does it exclude the act of God in my life or anyone elses.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
My life is a story, and one day, if it's ever recited as a joke or gossip or fable, maybe parts of it will seem totally out of God's law or command depending on interpretation, but even if you don't find reminants of me in Carbon form (can't find essence of my dna anywhere), that doesn't mean that I didn't exist, nor does it exclude the act of God in my life or anyone elses.

Over time there have been hundreds of millions of people who believed with all their hearts in the Greek gods or the Egyptian gods. They gave all of their lives to this false belief. Why are you any better then they were? Even today, most of the population of the world, do not believe in Christianity. What makes them wrong and you right?

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***That person will end up in Hell...even if he kept ALL of the conditions above...and here is WHY:

(1)He/she is a BORN sinner because his/her parents were sinners and begat him/her. When Adam sinned in the garden of Eden, he was sentenced to DEATH by God because he became a SINNER by his disobedience: "In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou RETURN unto the GROUND; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou ART, and dust shalt thou RETURN" . Adam was innocent before he sinned and he walked with God in the garden. When he sinned, he LOST his "innocense"...he became a sinner. His NATURE changed and he passed this sin nature on down to his children.... Therefore, EVERY human being is a born SINNER...for the Scripture confirms: "For ALL have sinned and fall SHORT of the glory of God" ...and again "As it is written, there is NONE righteous, no NOT ONE: There is NONE that understandeth, there is NONE that seeketh after God" .

When Adam sinned he died SPIRITUALLY immediately...he lost his SPIRITUAL LIFE before God . He also lost his PHYSICAL life in death years later..."For the WAGES of SIN is DEATH...".

(2)You stated that the person died the day after he/she stole the penny..."without the slightest bit of remorse." But of course, he/she died without remorse...a testimonial of their lost SPIRITUAL condition before God...and acted out their true spiritual condition. They were sinners.

(3)There is NO gradation of sin before God...for ALL sin is DEADLY no matter how "small"...for it is written: "For the WAGES of sin is DEATH, but the GIFT of God is ETERNAL life THROUGH Jesus Christ our Lord" .

BOTTOM-LINE: ALL men are SINNERS and ALL will surely DIE. Those who die in their sins WITHOUT Jesus Christ as their Saviour and Lord will die the DEATH in HELL . It doesn't have to end that way though. The GOOD NEWS is...Jesus died for your sins and paid their penalty for you. He RANSOMED you FROM their PUNISHMENT and took that punishment FOR you...because He LOVED you Kali. NONE of your other "lovers" would actually give their lives for you...but Jesus DID so that you might have ETERNAL LIFE in Him. He will CHANGE your SINFUL NATURE and you will become a "New Creation" in Him. You then will be assured of Eternal Life instead of ETERNAL DEATH in HELL.

Marchello




LOL


Thanks for directly answering my question for once. This is where I was getting at.


So its true....Christianity, at its most fundamental basis, teaches that All Sins are Equal in the Eyes of God


-We inherit the sins of our fathers and mothers


-We automatically inherit the sins of Adam and Eve


-We will go to Hell for stealing a Penny


laughing

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
LOL


Thanks for directly answering my question for once. This is where I was getting at.


So its true....Christianity, at its most fundamental basis, teaches that All Sins are Equal in the Eyes of God


-We inherit the sins of our fathers and mothers


-We automatically inherit the sins of Adam and Eve


-We will go to Hell for stealing a Penny


laughing

No, even if we don't steal the penny, we will go to hell. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Marchello
BOTTOM-LINE: ALL men are SINNERS and ALL will surely DIE. Not fair, the women get all the breaks mad

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Da Pittman
Not fair, the women get all the breaks mad

laughing No, women are just animals, and have no souls. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
laughing No, women are just animals, and have no souls. roll eyes (sarcastic) My wife is going to hunt you down for that, but then again she is an animal in bed naughty

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Da Pittman
My wife is going to hunt you down for that, but then again she is an animal in bed naughty

I'm just reporting. eek!

Marchello
*

***SINFULNESS is any transgression against God and is delineated in the Bible. All transgressions are wicked and sinful.

Adam committed the sin in the garden that resulted in the SINFULNESS and DEPRAVITY of the WHOLE human race. We are BORN in SIN and LOST the MOMENT we are BORN...and on our way to Hell. That is why God promised to send a REDEEMER ...through the "woman" ...a people He chose through whom He would send the Messiah. This is what prompted King David to say: "Behold, I was shapen in INIQUITY, and IN SIN did my mother CONCEIVE me" . David knew he was a sinner from the DAY he was BORN and needed a Saviour." From his loins was His REDEEMER gggggggggrandson Jesus come. Jesus was His grandfather David's Saviour. David knew He would come.

************************************************

*

***Yes...for the reasons I stipulated in the previous post.

************************************************

*

***If he was saved before he was 7 years old, he would go to heaven. If he did not know Jesus as Saviour, he would be lost. It all comes down to what you do with the Lord Jesus Christ. Only He can save the sinner.

************************************************

*

***We do NOT argue that...we REPEAT what the Scriptures DECLARE about the "sinfulness" of MANKIND. Our AUTHORITY is the Word of God and NOT our own REASONINGS.

************************************************

*

***Unfortunately, for you, it is NOT you who makes the FINAL determination of what the PENALTY will be for your wanton WICKEDNESS. God will make His decision predicated on what you will do or NOT do with His SON whom He sent to redeem you. If you REJECT His graciousness and mercy toward you...you will DIE the DEATH in HELL.

************************************************

*

***Sinful man's laws are irrelevant and often at enmity with God's laws.

************************************************

*

***Nay...tis unrepentant sinners that pose the problems.

Marchello

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***SINFULNESS is any transgression against God and is delineated in the Bible. All transgressions are wicked and sinful.

Adam committed the sin in the garden that resulted in the SINFULNESS and DEPRAVITY of the WHOLE human race. We are BORN in SIN and LOST the MOMENT we are BORN...and on our way to Hell. That is why God promised to send a REDEEMER ...through the "woman" ...a people He chose through whom He would send the Messiah. This is what prompted King David to say: "Behold, I was shapen in INIQUITY, and IN SIN did my mother CONCEIVE me" . David knew he was a sinner from the DAY he was BORN and needed a Saviour." From his loins was His REDEEMER gggggggggrandson Jesus come. Jesus was His grandfather David's Saviour. David knew He would come.

************************************************

*

***Yes...for the reasons I stipulated in the previous post.

************************************************

*

***If he was saved before he was 7 years old, he would go to heaven. If he did not know Jesus as Saviour, he would be lost. It all comes down to what you do with the Lord Jesus Christ. Only He can save the sinner.

************************************************

*

***We do NOT argue that...we REPEAT what the Scriptures DECLARE about the "sinfulness" of MANKIND. Our AUTHORITY is the Word of God and NOT our own REASONINGS.

************************************************

*

***Unfortunately, for you, it is NOT you who makes the FINAL determination of what the PENALTY will be for your wanton WICKEDNESS. God will make His decision predicated on what you will do or NOT do with His SON whom He sent to redeem you. If you REJECT His graciousness and mercy toward you...you will DIE the DEATH in HELL.

************************************************

*

***Sinful man's laws are irrelevant and often at enmity with God's laws.

************************************************

*

***Nay...tis unrepentant sinners that pose the problems.

Marchello

But you are also a sinner, therefore you cannot know the truth.

Shakyamunison
I just love it when the hypocrites show their arrogance.

Czarina_Czarina
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I just love it when the hypocrites show their arrogance.


I love you Shakyamunison.

I have question(s) though.

When someone is arrogant, which measuring stick are you using, theirs or yours? I can see a person as a hypocrite when using their own measuring stick/cup against themselves, that's like the duality argument of symmetry. However, for arrogance, seems like that's using your own system of importance against their own, and then, finding them "lacking" based on your subjective view(s) of how they should value themselves (too self important in your eyes = arrogance, but in all appearances, the observation appears meek/humble, and yet, the motive may still be out of arrogance, which would make that person a hypocrite).

How many extra cups are they over before they are arrogant, and are the cup they are filling from their own glass or your own? (you may have only assigned them a gracious 1/2 glass, and they are filling it up to the rim/very top, well, how did they get to do that (the person observing that they should have stopped at half glass), how arrogant of them to continue to pour above the level prescribed, but how did one get to the judgment of arrogance, another observer may wonder "how hypocritical"wink.

You know, someone can think an ant is arrogant for riding on their arm too, as whom he thinks he is, being on a human being and all. But, to the ant, it may be a compliment to walk on/along the all-mighty human being or he's going to bite. Arrogance, hypocrisy, which cup belongs to whom and which is being judged relative to the other, and in that judgment alone, does that make the observer(s) either one or both?

Kelly_Bean
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Billions of dollars don't amount to shi*t in the big picture.
To certain people it does.

Shakyamunison

Marchello
*

***No...that is NOT what I said...nor does Christianity teach that. What I said was there is no gradation of sin...for all sin results in Death in Hell. There is NO "venial" sin...ONLY "deadly sin"..."For the WAGES of SIN is DEATH..."
.

************************************************

*

***I did NOT say this either. What I said is we inherit the SIN NATURE of our parents. Our parents were Sinners...and they passed down their SINFUL NATURE to us. Everyone is responsible for his OWN sin.

************************************************

*

***I did NOT say this either. We inherited the SIN NATURE from Adam. All men are responsible for their OWN sins.

************************************************

*

***Nah...You'll go to Hell because you're an unrepentant sinner who has rejected God's ONLY provision for your sins.

************************************************

*

***God will have the last "laugh."

Marchello

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***No...that is NOT what I said...nor does Christianity teach that. What I said was there is no gradation of sin...for all sin results in Death in Hell. There is NO "venial" sin...ONLY "deadly sin"..."For the WAGES of SIN is DEATH..."
.

************************************************

*

***I did NOT say this either. What I said is we inherit the SIN NATURE of our parents. Our parents were Sinners...and they passed down their SINFUL NATURE to us. Everyone is responsible for his OWN sin.

************************************************

*

***I did NOT say this either. We inherited the SIN NATURE from Adam. All men are responsible for their OWN sins.

************************************************

*

***Nah...You'll go to Hell because you're an unrepentant sinner who has rejected God's ONLY provision for your sins.

************************************************

*

***God will have the last "laugh."

Marchello

But what if you are wrong?

Marchello
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
But you are also a sinner, therefore you cannot know the truth.

***Au Contrare...I am a FORGIVEN sinner and Jesus remembers my sins NO MORE.

Marchello

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marchello
***Au Contrare...I am a FORGIVEN sinner and Jesus remembers my sins NO MORE.

Marchello

But what if you are wrong?

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Marchello
All men are responsible for their OWN sins. What about the women, I don't want to be doomed alone pitt_fist

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Da Pittman
What about the women, I don't want to be doomed alone pitt_fist

He is so blinded by his own mythology that he can't see what you are saying.


He can't even address the possibility of being wrong. The question baffles him.

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
He is so blinded by his own mythology that he can't see what you are saying. Maybe these will help wink

http://www.letusteachkids.com/images/misc/Stuff/glasses.jpg

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Da Pittman
Maybe these will help wink

http://www.letusteachkids.com/images/misc/Stuff/glasses.jpg

More like on of these would better. laughing

http://www.ipmc.cnrs.fr/~duprat/neurophysiology/images/brain2.jpg

Da Pittman
eM00JScoSg0

Marchello
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
But what if you are wrong?

***I am NOT wrong because the Word of God is TRUE and I don't preach from my OWN reasonings as do you and others on this board. "For this cause also thank we God, who without ceasing, because, when ye RECEIVED the Word of God which ye HEARD of us, ye received it NOT as the WORD of MEN, but as it is in TRUTH, the WORD of GOD, which effectually worketh also in you that BELIEVE" .

Marchello

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Marchello
***I am NOT wrong because the Word of God is TRUE and I don't preach from my OWN reasonings as do you and others on this board. "For this cause also thank we God, who without ceasing, because, when ye RECEIVED the Word of God which ye HEARD of us, ye received it NOT as the WORD of MEN, but as it is in TRUTH, the WORD of GOD, which effectually worketh also in you that BELIEVE" .

Marchello The "Word of God" was written by man, man which is a sinner therefore the word of god is written by sinners so how can that be "true"? confused

Marchello
*

***Excuse me? I've read your belief system on these boards...and, baby, it's "way out there"...so don't come mouthing off on these boards and talk about mythology. It really takes a GREATER BELIEF system than mine to believe the fairy-tale system that you believe in.

Too, I give a reason for EVERYTHING I post on these boards and go through great pains to make my position abundantly clear as to WHY I believe the way I do. I know of no others that do that on this board. You may NOT agree or like what I have to say but you cannot, with any crediblity, say that I don't make myself clear.

**********************************************

*

***I've addressed the issue many times here. I can be wrong personally on many things...but the Word of God is NEVER wrong on ANY ISSUE. Is that plain enough for you?

Marchello

Imperial_Samura
Originally posted by Marchello
***I am NOT wrong because the Word of God is TRUE and I don't preach from my OWN reasonings as do you and others on this board. "For this cause also thank we God, who without ceasing, because, when ye RECEIVED the Word of God which ye HEARD of us, ye received it NOT as the WORD of MEN, but as it is in TRUTH, the WORD of GOD, which effectually worketh also in you that BELIEVE" .

Marchello

Ah circular reasoning - "I can't be wrong because what I believe is true. How do I know it is true? Because it can't be wrong which means I can't be wrong because what I believe is true..."

And then it goes on forever and forever and forever.



Why? If as a member of a faith with an evangelical need to convert and claim the truth then that must mean other faiths, with people just as steadfast as yourself, must be wrong.

If there is one true faith - yours - then there must be a large number of wrong faiths. It seems somewhat... odd that they can all be considered wrong but you are never open to the idea you might be. Afterall - if a person isn't open minded enough to wonder whether their faith may be wrong then they have no chance to find the right faith which will save them.

It is hypocritical to expect others to be open minded enough to consider changing faiths, but proudly say you wont consider the possibility your own is wrong in anyway.

Devil King
Originally posted by Marchello
***I am NOT wrong

Originally posted by Devil King
Personally, I have a hard time seeing how that mentality is any different than this built-in, viral effect of organized religions. What does it all come down to? A complete and total inability for anyone to admit they're wrong, despite not even knowing if they're right!

Marchello
*

***"ALL Scripture is given by INSPIRATION of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness" . The sinners that wrote these verses were "forgiven" sinners ...and Jesus Christ remembers their sins NO MORE.

Marchello

Naz
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
The basis of the question is would you End up in Hell if you steal a penny?


Now..for the sake of avoiding repetitive and circular arguments, as well as semantics and loose circumstances, I will clarify the confines of the question, so i can get a straight answer:



Let's say a child grows up in a (Christian, Jewish, or Muslim) household, and this child specifically adheres to the teachings of either (the Torah, Bible, or Quran, whichever u beleive) to the best they can, always conciously, and this child's parents have a strict discipline to thier basis of Faith.


The child grows upto teenage years, having never disobeyed a rule, not conciously, always having the intent to serve thier God, to obey thier parents and live by thier Faith as best he or she can.



But one day, this teenager, sees a person drop thier penny on the floor, and steals it.


The stole.



They have sinned, with intention.




They die the day after, without having sed they are sorry, without the slighest bit of remourse, but knowing they have done something against the discipline of thier Faith.



Will this person end up in Hell ? For one sin ? Why or why not ?


* I sincerely Hope someone with brains gets the intent of this question....otherwise, I give up roll eyes (sarcastic)

I think everyone needs to stop asking other people to play God and to stop trying to play God themselves. None of us know what God would do in this situation. We can guess, obviously, but our guesses are based on our own view of how God acts, which probably isn't even close to how He does, being mysterious and all.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marchello
***I am NOT wrong because the Word of God is TRUE and I don't preach from my OWN reasonings as do you and others on this board. "For this cause also thank we God, who without ceasing, because, when ye RECEIVED the Word of God which ye HEARD of us, ye received it NOT as the WORD of MEN, but as it is in TRUTH, the WORD of GOD, which effectually worketh also in you that BELIEVE" .

Marchello

Pride comes before the fall.

Originally posted by Marchello
*

***I've addressed the issue many times here. I can be wrong personally on many things...but the Word of God is NEVER wrong on ANY ISSUE. Is that plain enough for you?

Marchello

I'm not talking about the bible being wrong; I'm talking about you being wrong about the bible.

Marchello
*

***Prove what I say about the Bible is wrong.

Marchello

doan_m
Heres to answering the question which appeared on the title. Simply put, a single sin will not damn you to eternal hell. You will however still have to be punished, but only temporarily in purgatory. This does not mean that everyone will just simply end up in purgatory and will have to burn off all thier sins before entering heaven. There is still the means of eternal damnation.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***Prove what I say about the Bible is wrong.

Marchello

I don't care about what you and the bible are saying. What I'm trying to get across to you is, what if you are wrong. What if you are the problem instead of everyone else?

If you don't take responsibility for your life, including all the flaws, you will never have the power to change it.

Imperial_Samura
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***Prove what I say about the Bible is wrong.

Marchello

Or, alternatively prove to us that your interpretation of the Bible is right and beyond reproach. And note - by the definition of evidence a Bible quote is not proof of anything other then your ability to quote the Bible.

willRules
Originally posted by Da Pittman
The "Word of God" was written by man, man which is a sinner therefore the word of god is written by sinners so how can that be "true"? confused

1. That reasoning would only work if all man did was not tell the truth. But apparently, we can do this little thing called telling the truth. You should read more about it, it's in the Bible big grin stick out tongue
2. Many Christians believe that the books in the Bible weren't just scribbled down as offhand comments. These texts were careful constructed with the help of prayer, worship and words from God. Regardless of if you believe what the Bible says to be true or not, you have to respect it as an incredibly well woven piece of literature yes

willRules
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I don't care about what you and the bible are saying. What I'm trying to get across to you is, what if you are wrong. What if you are the problem instead of everyone else?

If you don't take responsibility for your life, including all the flaws, you will never have the power to change it.

I can't answer for Marchello but I'd hope that he can atone for his mistakes and put himself right with the world if he is wrong. If he is wrong and therefore the problem then it would be his call to apologise. But if he is wrong and there is nothing after death but oblivion, everyone faces that fate regardless of their actions. Maybe another belief is right but at least he chose his side and stuck with it.

But what if he is right?

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by willRules
I can't answer for Marchello but I'd hope that he can atone for his mistakes and put himself right with the world if he is wrong. If he is wrong and therefore the problem then it would be his call to apologise. But if he is wrong and there is nothing after death but oblivion, everyone faces that fate regardless of their actions. Maybe another belief is right but at least he chose his side and stuck with it.

But what if he is right?

You are missing the point: It does not matter if he is right or wrong.

Da Pittman

Shakyamunison

Czarina_Czarina

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
There are definitions, and there are derivations of definitions. I spoke on the (possible) derivation of those words.

What are the derivations of those words?

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I don't think he could write. Read, yes, but writing was something only scribes did. Ya figure that the son of God could write is own book confused

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Da Pittman
Ya figure that the son of God could write is own book confused

He never wrote anything. roll eyes (sarcastic)

willRules
Originally posted by Da Pittman
Ya figure that the son of God could write is own book confused

roll eyes (sarcastic)

Why doesn't he just go the whole way and eliminate free will whilst he's at it??????

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by willRules
roll eyes (sarcastic)

Why doesn't he just go the whole way and eliminate free will whilst he's at it??????

What does free will have to do with Jesus not being able to write?

Marchello
*

***Of course you care...because if you DIDN'T care you would NOT become so agitated at what I quote from the Scriptures: "For the Word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing assunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a DISCERNER of the THOUGHTS and INTENTS of the HEART. Neither is there any creature that is NOT manifest in His sight: but ALL things are NAKED and OPENED unto the EYES of HIM with whom we have to do" .

The fact of the matter is you FEAR what the Word of God says about your CONDITION and POSITION before Him...that you are a BORN sinner like the rest of humanity ...but you DENY that you are. It is THIS denial that will send you to an ETERNAL HELL if you do NOT repent of it and see yourself for what you REALLY ARE--->a SINNER in need of the saving grace of the Lord Jesus Christ.

**************************************************


*

***I have NOTHING to do with the PROBLEM at hand. Too, I never make a statement predicated on my own OPINION...I only quote what the Scriptures say. You do NOT believe in the Word of God and DENY it's validity and reject Jesus Christ...and thus have a PROBLEM with what I quote from the Scriptures and say they are wrong. Your PROBLEM then is NOT with me...but with the Word of God which you DENY is the Word of God.

**************************************************


*

***Man's PROBLEM is NOT caused by his "flaws"...but by his SIN ...and ALL of his problems stem from that. He SINS because he is a SINNER . The world's PROBLEMS are the RESULT of his SINFUL nature...he is TOTALLY depraved. Man CANNOT and WILL NOT "change"...nor does he have the POWER to "change" because he is DEAD in SIN and INCAPABLE of "change." He must first have a CHANGE "in NATURE" to "change." That is why God sent His SON Jesus...to FORGIVE us our SINS and, thus, "change" our NATURE by making us NEW CREATURES by a "new birth" .

You MUST be BORN a SECOND time to have your SINFUL nature "changed"...and you CANNOT do this without the saving GRACE of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Marchello

Da Pittman
Originally posted by willRules
roll eyes (sarcastic)

Why doesn't he just go the whole way and eliminate free will whilst he's at it?????? Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What does free will have to do with Jesus not being able to write?

Why do people use others to write their words is because either they can not or they are not skilled writers and want someone else to use their skills to express their view so now if you are the son of God you should be able to express yourself very well or you would think.

Shakyamunison

Da Pittman

Marchello
*

***Please tell me how my INTERPRETATION can be a PROBLEM to you...if you "NEVER read any of the scripture" that I post! Are you DAFT? You are lying through your teeth! How can you have a PROBLEM you know NOTHING about? IMPOSSIBLE...IMPOSSIBLE...IMPOSSIBLE! I
submit sir...you have a REAL problem...and it is not ONLY with the Scriptures either.

**************************************************


*

***I don't have any problems here. In point of fact things are no different here than any other place on the planet. Just because people on this board disagree with my point of view on things does not mean that they hate me personally...only the God that I worship and adore. They can think as you want...it's a free country, you know. I have never advocated that anyone on these boards does not have a right to their opinion...only that I vehemently disagree with their opinion based on God's Word.

As to your assumption that I have the same problems in my personal as I have here, you are greatly mistaken. You do not know me at all. I live in a small town in Idaho , am married, have two children and own my own home and am comfortable financially. I go to a small Fundamentalist Baptist church and love the people in my community...Christian and NON-Christian alike. However, I do not compromise when it comes to my religious beliefs and I tell people that up front. That avoids alot of misunderstanding.

**************************************************
*

*

***I understand fully what you are trying to say...but you have NOTHING to offer. Besides, I am NOT suffering

**************************************************
*

*

***TRANSLATION: I don't know how to cope with this guy.

**************************************************
*

*

***See my previous post on this.

Marchello

Shakyamunison

Marchello
*

***Will:

I could NOT and CANNOT atone for my "mistakes" ...that is why I needed Jesus Christ to be my Saviour . Too, I need NOT put myself right with the world because the world is EVIL and at ENMITY with God:"If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. Remember the word that I said unto you. The servant is not greater than his lord. If they persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also. But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know NOT Him that sent me. If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloke for their sin" .

Marchello

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***Will:

I could NOT and CANNOT atone for my "mistakes" ...that is why I needed Jesus Christ to be my Saviour . Too, I need NOT put myself right with the world because the world is EVIL and at ENMITY with God:"If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. Remember the word that I said unto you. The servant is not greater than his lord. If they persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also. But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know NOT Him that sent me. If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloke for their sin" .

Marchello




shhh...be quiet

Marchello
*

***Please point out to me where I have called you names.

************************************************

*

***Please point out where I am hateful.

************************************************

*

***Please prove I am hateful.

************************************************

*

***What don't you understand?

************************************************

*

***Read it...you might like it.

Marchello

debbiejo
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
laughing No, women are just animals, and have no souls. roll eyes (sarcastic) Actually the Holy Roman church did say that and took a vote........We got voted a soul......I'm so, so happy!

I was worried there for a minute..sweat

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Marchello
...***I understand fully what you are trying to say...but you have NOTHING to offer. Besides, I am NOT suffering...


You live in a world filled with demons and devils. There is a war going on between good and evil and your very soul is at stake. Every person you see in the world is going to hell. You have no future for at any time the world could come to an end. Your children will never grow old and nothing you do in this life is of any real value.

That is what I call suffering.

BTW I cannot prove the sky is blue to a blind man.

Marchello
*

***Yes, we do live in a world filled with demons and devils...and there IS a spiritual warfare going on between the forces of good and evil...and yes, indeed, YOUR very soul is at stake. However, for the Christian there is NO FEAR of the future...and we WAIT for Him to COME and TAKE us away from the TRIBULATION that will SOON befall this Christ rejecting world. YOU and the rest of this sinful world will SOON see REAL AGONY and SUFFERING under the ONE you will WELCOME with OPEN arms...and will WILLINGLY take his "mark" on your right hand and forehead --->Antichrist. Those who reject Christ TODAY will WELCOME Antichrist TOMORROW.

The vast MAJORITY of humanity will PERISH in HELL...because the world is at ENMITY with God's Christ and acclaim the "god of this world" who has deceived them .

***********************************************

*.

***Nah. I do not FEAR the future because my Saviour said the following: "...I AM the RESURRECTION, and the LIFE: he that BELIEVETH in ME, though he were DEAD, yet shall he LIVE: and whosoever LIVETH and BELIEVETH in ME shall NEVER die..." . Too, I have absolutely NO FEAR for my children should they die...for they are BELIEVERS and are ASSURED eternal life THROUGH Jesus Christ our Lord. There is no FEAR of DEATH for the Christian for Our Lord overcame SIN, DEATH and the GRAVE and lives FOREVER MORE and will SOON come in GREAT GLORY and take us AWAY! Then the wrath of God will descend on all unrighteousness on the earth...and YOU will know what REAL suffering is.

************************************************

*

***It's NOT blue...it only appears blue. Refractory processes taking place in the atmosphere between the gases, light and heat from the sun make the atmosphere appear blue.

As for me being blind...tis you who is blind: "But if our gospel be HID, it is HID to them that are LOST: In whom the GOD OF THIS WORLD hath BLINDED the MINDS of them which BELIEVE NOT, lest the LIGHT of the GLORIOUS gospel of Christ, who is the IMAGE of God, should shine upon them" .

Marchello

Shakyamunison
Marchello I don't live in the same world you live in. I live in the real world. There are no demons or devils; no spirits or ghosts; no god only found in a book; no god in the sky.

Da Pittman

Shakyamunison

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Do you think he will listen? Remember, a man who knows everything can learn nothing. I figured I would try wink

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Da Pittman
I figured I would try wink

Well, don't let me stop you. Miracles do happen. laughing

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Marchello
*

***Yes, we do live in a world filled with demons and devils...and there IS a spiritual warfare going on between the forces of good and evil...and yes, indeed, YOUR very soul is at stake. However, for the Christian there is NO FEAR of the future...and we WAIT for Him to COME and TAKE us away from the TRIBULATION that will SOON befall this Christ rejecting world. YOU and the rest of this sinful world will SOON see REAL AGONY and SUFFERING under the ONE you will WELCOME with OPEN arms...and will WILLINGLY take his "mark" on your right hand and forehead --->Antichrist. Those who reject Christ TODAY will WELCOME Antichrist TOMORROW.

The vast MAJORITY of humanity will PERISH in HELL...because the world is at ENMITY with God's Christ and acclaim the "god of this world" who has deceived them .

***********************************************

*.

***Nah. I do not FEAR the future because my Saviour said the following: "...I AM the RESURRECTION, and the LIFE: he that BELIEVETH in ME, though he were DEAD, yet shall he LIVE: and whosoever LIVETH and BELIEVETH in ME shall NEVER die..." . Too, I have absolutely NO FEAR for my children should they die...for they are BELIEVERS and are ASSURED eternal life THROUGH Jesus Christ our Lord. There is no FEAR of DEATH for the Christian for Our Lord overcame SIN, DEATH and the GRAVE and lives FOREVER MORE and will SOON come in GREAT GLORY and take us AWAY! Then the wrath of God will descend on all unrighteousness on the earth...and YOU will know what REAL suffering is.

************************************************

*

***It's NOT blue...it only appears blue. Refractory processes taking place in the atmosphere between the gases, light and heat from the sun make the atmosphere appear blue.

As for me being blind...tis you who is blind: "But if our gospel be HID, it is HID to them that are LOST: In whom the GOD OF THIS WORLD hath BLINDED the MINDS of them which BELIEVE NOT, lest the LIGHT of the GLORIOUS gospel of Christ, who is the IMAGE of God, should shine upon them" .

Marchello



HUSH



Everything you say is TOTAL BULLSHIT

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
HUSH



Everything you say is TOTAL BULLSHIT

Don't just tell him that everything he says is total bullshit. Tell him why everything he says is total bullshit.

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Don't just tell him that everything he says is total bullshit. Tell him why everything he says is total bullshit.


Telling him anything is a waste of time, he had brainwashed himself into concrete ignorance.

Da Pittman
Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Telling him anything is a waste of time, he had brainwashed himself into concrete ignorance. But a single drop of water can erode a mountain over time. messed

Goddess Kali
Originally posted by Da Pittman
But a single drop of water can erode a mountain over time. messed


Yeah, I don't have that kinda time wink

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