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Everyone from DMC 1 ,2 ,3 ,4
against Kain.

DMC kills him.

hmm no comment till ive played DMC 4..which i probably wont so ill have to w8 till theres vids and tonnes of info on it


i think kain would have some problems, not from dieing but the numbers of them all would not be easy, is this the bad guys, good guys and all their minions also?

He said DMC Universe, so yeah.

they cannot kill him, we have to take into consideration that all the weak beings are here also, food for the reaver so kain can almost constantly cast inspire hate to make legions of them attack each other not to menstion he can still mist, teleport and go immaterial to split them up

its not going to be a simple task for them all to attack one target either

Well, if they all attack him at once, it'll be trouble.

it will, but since kain has so many defensive moves like turning into mist, going immaterial and teleporting they could be fiering off blast after blast of their high powered attacked and killing all the lesser minions and harming eachother, spardas dragon attack would devestate the battlefield while mundus would unleash all kinds of lasers that would be vapourising the area while kain is teleporting and misting away, kains teleportation is almost instant so he could be half a mile away while their blasting holes in their forces.

if he inspires hate in the brothers and perhaps even sparda then theres going to be madness, quicksilver going off, dragon blasts, mundus may end up completly destoryed by the 2 brothers and their father since he is the largest target arguably. What about the icon of despair VS sparda, would be quite an incredible fight. hmm

am i the only one that thinks this thread is pointless since there's already a dmc vs lok thread with a different title. and on the front page

Not pointless from Kain's faithful adepts' point of view- those who think that Kain is unstoppable, invulnerable, can control souls and minds of EVERYONE in DMC universe at once (including things like Despair Embodied etc which is really funny), blast them all into another dimension with his ALL MIGHTY TK and stuff. Also I still don't get where did he get that Kain's combat teleportation with Dimension Reaver is better than Dante or Vergil's one- yes, you can teleport four times in a row, but sometimes fast opponents even manage to block your strikes.

And now some funny stuff (all credits go to a friend of mine)- "Defeating evil with love".

Huge field, huge crowd of everyone facing Kain... Nevan comes tovards Kain out of the crowd.
"My sweet vampire king...won't you make me your queen?"
"Get out of me, *****...I'm going to finish your pointless life now...",- cries Kain, but something in his eyes is wrong...he looks somewhat confused?
"Well",-Nevan claps her fingers, and then Nero rips Kain's pants away with his TK "hand". And EVERYONE see the greatest Kain's secret- he lost his "little thing" during either his "endless battles" or "endless evolution".
The great laugh begins. Kain, ashamed, runs away, wishing everyone forget what they've just seen.

EVEN ONE PERSON FROM DMC COULD KILL KAIN!!

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
Not pointless from Kain's faithful adepts' point of view- those who think that Kain is unstoppable, invulnerable, can control souls and minds of EVERYONE in DMC universe at once (including things like Despair Embodied etc which is really funny), blast them all into another dimension with his ALL MIGHTY TK and stuff. Also I still don't get where did he get that Kain's combat teleportation with Dimension Reaver is better than Dante or Vergil's one- yes, you can teleport four times in a row, but sometimes fast opponents even manage to block your strikes.

And now some funny stuff (all credits go to a friend of mine)- "Defeating evil with love".

Huge field, huge crowd of everyone facing Kain... Nevan comes tovards Kain out of the crowd.
"My sweet vampire king...won't you make me your queen?"
"Get out of me, *****...I'm going to finish your pointless life now...",- cries Kain, but something in his eyes is wrong...he looks somewhat confused?
"Well",-Nevan claps her fingers, and then Nero rips Kain's pants away with his TK "hand". And EVERYONE see the greatest Kain's secret- he lost his "little thing" during either his "endless battles" or "endless evolution".
The great laugh begins. Kain, ashamed, runs away, wishing everyone forget what they've just seen.

thats quite good..however seriously

he could beat this with a great deal of effort ofcourse but he is invincible, why does it seem so many people overlook that fact, and the only time hes been knocked out for perhaps less than an hour or two as an elder vampire is when his heart of darkness, the object of his life and creation is ripped from him and he was hit several times by raziels reaver yet he got up not long after. If this is Kain at his finest then he has no heart to be ripped from him and none of these characters have the ability to even harm him since they do not have the reaver which has proven it seems not to kill him either

also i did not say he could control minds of the universe at once, he doesnt control anything at all infact, he just activates inspire hate and anyone near him within a radious of about 20 yards goes mad and on a bloodthirst rampage killing everything except kain unless ofcourse he gets in their way in which case the may attack him, but by this one power he could end up sending the sparda family into madness killing everything to help him, and he has his own version of the spell that he can do from long range and he could cast it on Nelo angelo if hes in the battle at the same time as vergil or cast it on Mundus, ive completed DMC 2 but despair embodied does not seem impressive and at any rate wont be able to stop dante, vergil, nelo and Sparda from breaking it into pieces

kain could beat the DMC 1,2 and 3 universe simply because theres so many all trying to attack one, their powers will be blasting eachother and kain can escape through teleport, his dimension teleportation is better because he can teleport instantly in extremely quick succession 4 times from above or behind his enemies wheras Vergil can teleport quickly but not many times in a row from diffrent angles it seems, not as quickly as this, another diffrence is that your beiing hit by the reaver not yamato.

a combination of inspire hate, infinite reaver charge thanks to all the minions and weak creatures to kill as well as teleportation, Tk and his trump of invincibility allows him to take this on with difficulty but eventually after Mundus lasers, sparda family wreaking havoc from inspire hate and most of the strongest enemies dead or smashed Kain will be able to let loose his soul devouring blasts and kill the sparda family and continue to break mundus into a sizable throne

Originally posted by judgement hand
EVEN ONE PERSON FROM DMC COULD KILL KAIN!!

Don't poke the fanboys!!!

Originally posted by judgement hand
EVEN ONE PERSON FROM DMC COULD KILL KAIN!!

yeh rofl....the ZOMG SUPER DANTE invincible character.....or is there a ZOMG dante can kill GOD and Blow up the Multiverse character in there, cant rememebr seeing it but it may be in the unlockable costumes

Bad joke, darling. Your sence of humour leaves much to be desired...

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
Bad joke, darling. Your sence of humour leaves much to be desired...

i thought it was just as good a joke as Judgement hands but then again ime no expert, ill ring up peter Kay he knows a few good jokes and see if he likes it

No offence, but Dante's fandom in general looks much more sane than Kain's one...though there are mad asses like Lionheartmm (who claimed once that Dante moved on lightspeed in his fight with Vergil in DMC3- the one under the rain) who are shame to the fandom.
Kain's fanboys like Aqua-pimp are laughable.

whos aqua-pimp, i mean some people are obviously fanboys, they claim Kain can move mountains with his TK and can do things he blatently cannot

however so far in this debate i have given my opinion on the fight as i am entitled to and given facts and logic, for example its logical that simply because theres tonnes of opponents against kain doesnt necesserily mean they can hit him all at the same time, not to menstion some of them will simply be food since drinking blood restores his strength if he actually does get hit by one of the stronger powers that will bother him and food for his reaver, he could continually use reaver powers with a fresh supply of weaker demons, Lady and the girls as well as the weaker enemies

using inspire hate would logically be a sound weapon, especially against the sparda brothers who could stomp Mundus, Despair. Imagine if Kain inspires hate in the horse who has quicksilver, he could end up freezing the lot of his enemies, it would probably hit him as well but it would be interesting to see

many enemies could be a plus side for kain as well as a difficulty

Aqua-pimp's the bastard who said Kain can move mountains with his TK and casually rip through dimensions with it and blah-blah-blah.

As I've already said (and you agreed to me) Kain's mind control spells work not on all enemies. Strong-minded ones should be resistant to that.

Also Geryon's timestop powers in game unleached in form of dodgeable blasts (though when Dante gets said powers after taking Geryon's soul, he uses them in quite a different way).

move mountains certainly not, rip through dimensions is unlikely as well since Raziel broke into the demon deimension only because the boundries were weakened, although its officially stated not anyone could TK through and that Raziel used an especially powerful bolt neither of htem can break dimensions at will thats for sure well...as far as we know on fact

was Aqua-pimp on this forum

and yes but inspire hate although unlikely to harm Mundus and Icon of despair would be impossible to turn for obvious reasons the brothers would be feasable, its not really mind powers, its a spell that kain can use on Demons, humans and some vampires alike so theres no reason for the two brothers to end up affected, sparda ime not so sure off but he seems so human and has moral values unlike mundus who doesnt seem to have any moral values and may be affected but the two brothers going mad and letting loose is going to cause havok

yeh the horses orbs of time power were dodgable but its likely to be touches wont it by someone or something and everyone will get slow down to a crawl or for those who have super speed slowed down to human speed

Yes. Check Kain vs Doomsday thread in Comics vs forum.

wow lol, he really loves kain, kain has a lot of powers up his sleave but i dont like to break into conclusions and assumptions that he can move mountains and ridiculous rubbish like that

ime wondering if the guy has actually played the games because he thinks kain has the Light reaver and Dark reaver and raziel powers, although this is a possblity since he took raziel its not a fact and so its not fair to use it as a debate

That's possible, since Raziel owned spiritual side of the Reaver, while Kain owned material one. And when Kain absorbed Raziel's eccence into the sword, he sort of unified material and spiritual sides of the sword, completing the sword and making it a Purified Soul Reaver.

But if you debate Kain's powerset DURING the Defiance (and so far we've seen only one combat mode of purified Reaver), it isn't fair, of course.

if this was super evolved kain with his full powerset it would be one awsome battle

But even without purified Reaver stuff (which is possible fact since absorbing Raziel was in fact reunion of material and spiritual sides of the Reaver) Aqua-pimp still stretched unearthly with all that mountain tossing or blasting people into the orbit with his TK.

yes he did, the extent of kains TK although not shown many limites except on gameplay its unlikely he has that kind of range on his TK, if not impossible not to menstion blasting people into orbit isnt much of a move itself if its someone who can breathe in space, its obvious such an extent of TK power is unlieky

eventually Kain may have such powers of dimension ripping and TK mountain explosions due to his evolution, eventually he will proably gain Raziels wings as well like we see in the murals in the games but such a character cannot be used in debate since he doesnt excist yet, he may never excist what with the state of the LOK team

Bumphaermm

Sparda alone would give Kain a run for his money, plus his two sons in Devil mode would add a fair amount of punch to the arsenal. Kain wouldn't be destroyed, he would simply realise their is nothing he can do against the numbers and would retreat, living to fight another day.

Originally posted by HonkyTonkMan
Sparda alone would give Kain a run for his money, plus his two sons in Devil mode would add a fair amount of punch to the arsenal. Kain wouldn't be destroyed, he would simply realise their is nothing he can do against the numbers and would retreat, living to fight another day.

Totally agree with you, especially going by the fact that by now Dante has surpassed his dad in terms of power. Both of them in their high demonic forms (Sparda/Super Sparda forms) plus Vergil in Nero Angelo form...Kain wishes he had evolved more

why would he retreat...he can one or two hit any of these things as well as turn them against each other, the numbers against him soon become large groups against eachother while kain battles with the lesser demons and bosses like that griffon and the gorilla thing out of DMC 2, while Dante, his father and Vergil battle against eachother or better for kains benefit the emobidment of Despair and mundus. To kain the real threats are the full demon forms and perhaps embodiment and Mundus, mainly because their large and the embodiment is fairly fast although its durability is suspect.

just because theres so many of them is actually a weakness, tonnes of food for both kain and the reaver and the heavy hitters with their flashy area of affect meteors and blasts like mundus will end up wiping away their own forces as well as quicksiler. The difficulty this group will face is that when kain lets off inspire hate on quicksilver, he can teleport miles away and watch the madness unfold, a lot of them will be slowed down to a crawl, Mundus and sparda may be fighting eachother in slow motion and so will spardas two sons destroying the emobdiment

during all this chaos kain can chill out by restoring his powers incrediblly quickly on the women in this fight or the lesser minions, empowering his abilities and then teleporting in the fight over and over casting inspire hate from spell form as well as reaver form causing madness and ofcourse letting off soul deaths

Originally posted by Estacado
Bumphaermm

Originally posted by Burning thought
why would he retreat...he can one or two hit any of these things as well as turn them against each other, the numbers against him soon become large groups against eachother while kain battles with the lesser demons and bosses like that griffon and the gorilla thing out of DMC 2, while Dante, his father and Vergil battle against eachother or better for kains benefit the emobidment of Despair and mundus. To kain the real threats are the full demon forms and perhaps embodiment and Mundus, mainly because their large and the embodiment is fairly fast although its durability is suspect.

just because theres so many of them is actually a weakness, tonnes of food for both kain and the reaver and the heavy hitters with their flashy area of affect meteors and blasts like mundus will end up wiping away their own forces as well as quicksiler. The difficulty this group will face is that when kain lets off inspire hate on quicksilver, he can teleport miles away and watch the madness unfold, a lot of them will be slowed down to a crawl, Mundus and sparda may be fighting eachother in slow motion and so will spardas two sons destroying the emobdiment

during all this chaos kain can chill out by restoring his powers incrediblly quickly on the women in this fight or the lesser minions, empowering his abilities and then teleporting in the fight over and over casting inspire hate from spell form as well as reaver form causing madness and ofcourse letting off soul deaths


I've got a headache so I don't want to debate that in circles anymore. Inspire Hate is not that uber of a spell as you portray it, that's all.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel


I've got a headache so I don't want to debate that in circles anymore. Inspire Hate is not that uber of a spell as you portray it, that's all.
You are wring!!!!!!11111
Kain izzz inviciblllllll!1111111@

From what I've heard just now Kain is invincible, so he wins.

Edit: LOL at the post above me..

Err, read the thread title, Guilty.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel


I've got a headache so I don't want to debate that in circles anymore. Inspire Hate is not that uber of a spell as you portray it, that's all.

according to what?...it inspires hate..thats what we know as fact, it makes kains enemies fight eachother, DMC unvierse=kains enemies...
Inspire hate makes kains enemies fight eachother so....DMC unvierse fights themselves most of it

obviously Emobdiment it wouldnt work on and maybe not mundus, but the brothers..yes...the horse..yes...there is no proof that it would not

and yeh Estacado and Shin gear, kains invincible, play the games, find out why, no point in whineing about it

Originally posted by IceJaw
Err, read the thread title, Guilty. I did. DMC Universe Vs Kain.

I said Kain wins because he's invincible.

There's no way Kain wins against a UNIVERSE.

what lol...under what reason does he lose then?...

by DMC universe you mean everything in DMC?..in which case he wins perhaps quite simply unless you can put a proper reason why he cannot

it seems people just think, omg everything on one, one has to lose..but 100 soldiers with pistols cannot beat an abrams tank if they ran at it fiering

I'm sure that a universe will have someone in their who can take a vampire out. Or perhaps opening a gate to the demon world and sending the f*cker there to spend an eternity. That is unless he can dimension travel aswell. Also, it is Dantes profession to hunt the likes of Kain down, he's not going to go charging in without a plan. Even if he did, he has Sparda by his side aswell as Vergil. There's no friggin way Kain's walking away from this.

read kains feats....first none of them can kill kain...opening a hole into hell? since when can any of them do that, especially how are they going to get kain in it if he can teleport several miles almost instantly, if not instantly and turn into mist..even if they all tried to grab him hed simply mist through them or teleport half a mile away

he has immunity to their weaponry..has perhaps the most powerful sword in gaming and is likely to be able to kill almost any of them, especially the brothers with one slash of his sword, or one blast from it at long range

but his biggest power is that the whole universe of them is against them...all the characters inluding the weak ones which means he has basically infnite reaver charge, inspire hate turning hundreds against eachother, especially the sparda brothers and sparda himself then he has dimension shift to move through dimensions and strike them at instant speed from any angle through instant teleportation, can launch lightning from his reaver or call it from the skies, turn into thousands of bats to escape if he needs to get some distance between his enemies

his like Allucard on steroids, they wont be able to do anything to kain if their inspired hate and killing eachother and the other enemies, quicksilver making them go slow mo...hell kain can just stand back and launch soul death blasts into the area, instantly killing the main characters while Dante and vergil are ripping eachother and many of Kains enemies apart

Don't forget the Kain is invincible part!haermm

Originally posted by Burning thought
read kains feats....first none of them can kill kain...

i didnt one of the first things i said

...................

By the way, if you claim that Inspire Hate won't work on Mundus, then you agree that it shouldn't work neither on Sparda nor on Dante in their high demonic forms.
Mundus wasn't a god at all, he was just a high demonic lord just as Sparda and his heir, though with different powerset, more focused on destructive ablities, but in general Mundus was WEAKER than Sparda or Dante when the latter got his father's full power (I'm not claiming that Dante can do everything Mundus can do but even better, since it's ridiculous and their powersets are quite different). The king of hell and the warlord of hell army were just titles.
Both Sparda and Dante in their high demonic form (Sparda\Super Sparda form) were able to deflect\resist dark magic, even coming from true god (Despair Embodied).

And despite being "just a halfblood", Dante was called a demon of highest order even in Dreamwave comics adaptation of 1st DMC (I'm tempted to remake Dante's RT using those scans). He actually surpassed his legendary father in terms of power in DMC2.

perhaps is all i can say, thnking on it perhaps in their high forms they would be resistent, or, my assumption it would not work on Mundus is wrong, perhaps it will

also where does it say Despair embodied is a God, also another title i know but ime just curious, it means nothing because weve all seen it getting owned and its power is minute.

regardless if their not affected almost all other enemies will be

id still give kain winning this 7/10 if were assuming Inspire hate will not work on them and 9/10 if it does

The Despair Embodied was definetely more "godly" of a god that your beloved Elder God...a material form of all despair in the univerce apparing as fiery androginous creature.

Also, minor ones kill each other, that's fine, but you still have big guns (Sparda clan, Mundus, Despair Embodied, probably someone else of the bosses- the ones I've listed won't be affected for sure, I suppose) going straight for vampire's head...

what makes you think its more godly..the elder God claims it controls the fate of all beings in Nosgoth, can instantly regenerate lost tentacles and is the size of a planet, or at least a continent as well as being immaterial so few things can harm it, its surprising its bothered by the soul reaver but ofc thats a good example of the blades power not to menstion it seems to be in all time zones at once and knows almost all events except ofcourse those by kain

well the thing is, kain can inspire hate quicksilver...slowing down to a crawl all his enemies before he teleports to safety, you cannot claim nor would it be logical to assume quicksilver would affect the entire universe in a time capsule, that would be absurd, it has a range so while the DMC universe are stuck in this time laps kain can blast them with soul deaths

also none of them can harm him, their only chance is to knock him out but his endurance is incredible, the only thing that would do as such is perhaps getting hit by a constant stream of mundus meteors...a few sparda dragons but they are all slow attacks, Kain can just play the game of teleporting out of the way of any large attacks and destroying the heavy hitters, i mean there will be madness amongst the DMC universe as Quicksilver, Gryphon from DMC 1 i think it is and most of the lesser baddies start smashing the brothers and mundus around, as powerful as they are the lesser bosses are no joke either and would deal a great deal of havoc, enough for kain to soul blast the brothers and their father, possibly mundus.

Jackpot banishes Kain to hell like it did to Mundus.

BS....too much of it, where does it say Jackpot can banish things to hell, Mundus physical form was just blown the hell to bits by it so he went back to hell, theres no point in assuming it makes beings go back to hell

besides he needs Trish as well to do that didnt he, so hes gonna have a job protecting her or charging up before kain thrown em both into the ground and takes their guns from them with TK..also if they let it looe gl to them hitting mist...or the air itself if he teleports and be sure their prepared for a great deal of sword into their heads after that

Originally posted by Burning thought
BS....too much of it, where does it say Jackpot can banish things to hell, Mundus physical form was just blown the hell to bits by it so he went back to hell, theres no point in assuming it makes beings go back to hell

besides he needs Trish as well to do that didnt he, so hes gonna have a job protecting her or charging up before kain thrown em both into the ground and takes their guns from them with TK..also if they let it looe gl to them hitting mist...or the air itself if he teleports and be sure their prepared for a great deal of sword into their heads after that
Dante's speed>>>>Kain's speed and he can do it with Vergil aswell.

Dante speed beats kain speed? once again on what grounds, not to menstion the jackpot is takes a while to charge so its nothing to do with dantes speed nor does it make a diffrence to the projectile

also prove to me that it sends them to hell

regardless, it would not hit kain, its simply not fast enough regardless of dantes speed

Dante can simply freeze Kain in time, so it wouldn't matter if Dante's speed matched Bowser's.

kain can also control time with the reaver...snap

also its debatable in itself wether quicksilver would actually work, since it doesnt seem Dante can use it whenever or whereever or that it would effect all beings and at the same time, hed be freezing Trish/Vergil...so kain just has to w8 until Dantes power runs dry and time powers are stop..then he kills them

Look whose in their universe.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/75/Fighting_Evolution_JEDAH.jpg
Still think he wins holmes?

Originally posted by Burning thought
Dante speed beats kain speed? once again on what grounds, not to menstion the jackpot is takes a while to charge so its nothing to do with dantes speed nor does it make a diffrence to the projectile

also prove to me that it sends them to hell

regardless, it would not hit kain, its simply not fast enough regardless of dantes speed

So Kain is as fast as Dante according to what? To the fact he can swing his sword in a blur motion? Regular human (not superstrong vampire) can swing butcher knife in a blur motion. The blur itself shows NOTHING.
Dante moves on supersonic speeds in his HUMAN form (cutscene before he gets swallowed by Leviathan)- that's faster that anything Kain can do, be it mist, bats or wolves. Kain has never deflected a friggin' arrow, while Dante deflects or cuts bullets and missles in midair.
Gameplaywise Kain's combat teleportation seems better because it's 4 jumps in a row, but you hit each opponent only ONCE and that's not instant kill AFAIR. Vergil's or Dante's combat teleportation while not impressive in numbers seems more strategic.

Originally posted by HonkyTonkMan
Look whose in their universe.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/75/Fighting_Evolution_JEDAH.jpg
Still think he wins holmes?

That's merely DMC\Darkstalkers crossover, so I won't put much faith in it. But given the overall Dante's powerset (including invulnerable Super Sparda form) it doesn't seem alike to Venom beating down depowered Superman one.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
So Kain is as fast as Dante according to what? To the fact he can swing his sword in a blur motion? Regular human (not superstrong vampire) can swing butcher knife in a blur motion. The blur itself shows NOTHING.
Dante moves on supersonic speeds in his HUMAN form (cutscene before he gets swallowed by Leviathan)- that's faster that anything Kain can do, be it mist, bats or wolves. Kain has never deflected a friggin' arrow, while Dante deflects or cuts bullets and missles in midair.
Gameplaywise Kain's combat teleportation seems better because it's 4 jumps in a row, but you hit each opponent only ONCE and that's not instant kill AFAIR. Vergil's or Dante's combat teleportation while not impressive in numbers seems more strategic.

deflecting arrows is not what he "would" do would he, and moving at supersonic speeds is suspect, is that the part when he is running down the wall? thats not necceserily supersonic unless ofcourse it says somewhere it is then i am mistaken, is there a video of it?

its not combat tele, its Dimension tele..when kain hits its powered to higher levels by the dimension energy as he says it does, if it hits one of the brothers it could be the last thing he sees, the reavers soul and blood draining combined with its power to blast opponents to pieces, ofcourse that was when it touched a human but when it hits one of the brothers its powered by dimensional energy as well, their not likely to be getting back up, especially if kain comes from above and hits their head, its coming off for sure.

Originally posted by HonkyTonkMan
Look whose in their universe.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/75/Fighting_Evolution_JEDAH.jpg
Still think he wins holmes?


hehe yeh rite, not in canon DMC..but can Jedah actually do much?, nobody no matter how many times ive asked for it can show me canon proof that he can "destroy universes" and stuff like that

kain will prob lose to him anyway, he will go unconcious with laughter at how ridiculous Jedah looks

The air around him starts burning because of tension, created by running faster than a speeding bullet... I've posted a video somewhere in that thread or in previous one, so you might have check him.

I know that it's dimension teleportation, I've used term "combat" just because Kain uses it in a combat.
I'm not talking about teleportation in a beam of light from SR1 now.