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I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it?

Cures and that.

Originally posted by Saxondale
I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it?

A more realistic cause, find a way to stop the rampant "sockery"... you know, it can be a test of KMC's think-tank; what it's capable of, if successful, the Cranial Colossus's can take on African AIDS.

Cyber_tuff_guy?

Cut their taxes so that they can afford the medications and education. Otherwise they will always be borrowing money and help from others.

the problem with AIDS in Africa is cultural

we would need to change their culture, without that they wont try to get medication, since they don't believe AIDS exists.

Originally posted by inimalist
the problem with AIDS in Africa is cultural

we would need to change their culture, without that they wont try to get medication, since they don't believe AIDS exists.

You sure about that? I'm fairly certain they believe it exist, they're just ignorant* in the ways to avoid it/lack the means.

I've seen footage of Religious heads in Africa telling the people in their community that using condoms was a affront to God. Sick and sad all at once.

* I don't mean this as Africans being unintelligent.

LOL AIDS

I had this great idea... With a kind of Hitler edge... But it would solve the problem..

Make blood tests mandatory for everyone, then get Australia, the UK or some other large island, push it's inhabitants out, place the AIDs sufferers on the island and let them live out their own lives, start their own society, create a government as if it were just another country... Just one that prevents people leaving or visiting.

1. This would cut off and kill AIDs...
2. Puts all AIDs patients together, allowing them to have sex with whomever they like with no worrying about infecting them.
3. Them being altogether also means we can get the antiviral drugs to them easier.

The only real con is that it's probably against about a half a dozen human rights.

Originally posted by JLred
how about those man-made islands....

We could make the AIDs sufferers build their own islands.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
We could make the AIDs sufferers build their own islands.

Now, that would definately teach those bastards a lesson about ever even thinking about getting HIV again!

sounds like a plan to me....we just need a hitler-like king of the world guy....

Originally posted by Robtard
Now, that would definately teach those bastards a lesson about ever even thinking about getting HIV again!

Yep, they are making it easier to be cured/prevent the spread of AIDs while learning a trade at the same time.

you want to stop the spread of aids in africa...ban the catholic church from spreading its anti condom rhetoric....and be more forceful in tackling rapists in the continent

yeah i don't think jesus would be against homosexuals...or anything...but then he did choose the jewish as his people...weird....

Just kill everyone with AIDS.

Originally posted by jaden101
you want to stop the spread of aids in africa...ban the catholic church from spreading its anti condom rhetoric....and be more forceful in tackling rapists in the continent

before looking at this, pls note that another web site (many years ago) stated that Jewish/Muslim believers in Africa weren't getting AIDS compared to the other religions. Why? Removal of the foreskin, having the foreskin is thought to be in incubator for disease, if i find the link, i'll provide it.


" Christians (%) HIV/AIDS rate (%)

Congo (Dem. Rep.) 95.3 4.9

Equatorial Guinea 95.1 3.4

Angola 94.1 5.5

Congo 91.3 7.2

Burundi 90.1 8.3

Uganda 88.7 5.0

Zambia 85.0 21.5

Swaziland 82.7 33.4

Rwanda 80.8 8.9

Malawi 80.0 15.0






Non-Catholic Christians (%) HIV/AIDS rate (%)

Swaziland 78.0 33.4

South Africa 65.2 20.1

Ethiopia 64.4 6.4

Namibia 64.0 22.5

Botswana 63.2 38.8

Zimbabwe 63.0 33.7

Malawi 57.1 15.0

Kenya 56.0 15.0

Ghana 53.2 3.0

Central Af. Rep. 51.7 12.9

Zambia 51.6 21.5

Congo (Dem. Rep.) 50.8 4.9

Uganda 46.7 5.0

Eritrea 43.7 2.8

Cameroon 42.5 11.8

Congo 42.0 7.2

Nigeria 39.2 5.8

Rwanda 38.2 8.9

Mozambique 36.8 13.0

Lesotho 35.8 31.0



If you are not already sufficiently depressed, look at a table for the 10 most Muslim countries in Africa:



Muslims (%) HIV/AIDS rate (%)

Somalia 100.0 1.0

Morocco 99.9 0.1

Algeria 96.7 0.1

Libya 96.5 0.2

Senegal 92.1 0.5

Gambia 88.8 1.6

Mali 87.0 1.7

Egypt 86.5 0.1

Sierra Leone 70.0 7.0

Sudan 65.0 2.6"


http://www.martinrothonline.com/MRCC11.htm

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
before looking at this, pls note that another web site (many years ago) stated that Jewish/Muslim believers in Africa weren't getting AIDS compared to the other religions. Why? Removal of the foreskin, having the foreskin is thought to be in incubator for disease, if i find the link, i'll provide it.


Christians (%) HIV/AIDS rate (%)

Congo (Dem. Rep.) 95.3 4.9

Equatorial Guinea 95.1 3.4

Angola 94.1 5.5

Congo 91.3 7.2

Burundi 90.1 8.3

Uganda 88.7 5.0

Zambia 85.0 21.5

Swaziland 82.7 33.4

Rwanda 80.8 8.9

Malawi 80.0 15.0






Non-Catholic Christians (%) HIV/AIDS rate (%)

Swaziland 78.0 33.4

South Africa 65.2 20.1

Ethiopia 64.4 6.4

Namibia 64.0 22.5

Botswana 63.2 38.8

Zimbabwe 63.0 33.7

Malawi 57.1 15.0

Kenya 56.0 15.0

Ghana 53.2 3.0

Central Af. Rep. 51.7 12.9

Zambia 51.6 21.5

Congo (Dem. Rep.) 50.8 4.9

Uganda 46.7 5.0

Eritrea 43.7 2.8

Cameroon 42.5 11.8

Congo 42.0 7.2

Nigeria 39.2 5.8

Rwanda 38.2 8.9

Mozambique 36.8 13.0

Lesotho 35.8 31.0



If you are not already sufficiently depressed, look at a table for the 10 most Muslim countries in Africa:



Muslims (%) HIV/AIDS rate (%)

Somalia 100.0 1.0

Morocco 99.9 0.1

Algeria 96.7 0.1

Libya 96.5 0.2

Senegal 92.1 0.5

Gambia 88.8 1.6

Mali 87.0 1.7

Egypt 86.5 0.1

Sierra Leone 70.0 7.0

Sudan 65.0 2.6


http://www.martinrothonline.com/MRCC11.htm

quite astounding the difference a desert can make

i'd like to so those tied in with the rape statistics because i know that aids and hiv is a massive problem among rape victims particularly in south africa

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
Why? Removal of the foreskin, having the foreskin is thought to be in incubator for disease, if i find the link, i'll provide it.
You think that the Jewish and Muslims believe that people with foreskin are more likely to get and give AIDs? You do realise they get dircumsised for religious reasons, not hygene. Plus the HIV virus is spread through bodily fluids...

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
before looking at this, pls note that another web site (many years ago) stated that Jewish/Muslim believers in Africa weren't getting AIDS compared to the other religions. Why? Removal of the foreskin, having the foreskin is thought to be in incubator for disease, if i find the link, i'll provide it.



http://www.martinrothonline.com/MRCC11.htm

Fail

"Based on the studies published to date, recommending routine circumcision as a prophylactic measure to prevent HIV infection in Africa, or elsewhere, is scientifically unfounded."

http://www.cirp.org/library/disease/HIV/vanhowe4/

Edit: This is one of many medical studies.

Originally posted by Robtard
Fail

"Based on the studies published to date, recommending routine circumcision as a prophylactic measure to prevent HIV infection in Africa, or elsewhere, is scientifically unfounded."

http://www.cirp.org/library/disease/HIV/vanhowe4/

Edit: This is one of many medical studies.

I never said it was scientific, read the WORDS, i stated another article stated it and why, that's all. I have nothing against gentiles, please do not read it that way.

Originally posted by Saxondale
I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it?
Only homosexuals have AIDS. Kill them and you kill AIDS.

It's pretty simple, I think.

Originally posted by jaden101
quite astounding the difference a desert can make

i'd like to so those tied in with the rape statistics because i know that aids and hiv is a massive problem among rape victims particularly in south africa

from what i can guess and this is a very bad statement but i guess that some folks don't believe a person has a right to their body or mind, so if she/he says "no", it was her/his mind thinking or saying it, and the rapist says "who cares, it was just her/his mind thinking she/he doesn't want to"....

dominion

Do you ever make sense?

Originally posted by Magee
Do you ever make sense?


do you?

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
from what i can guess and this is a very bad statement but i guess that some folks don't believe a person has a right to their body or mind, so if she/he says "no", it was her/his mind thinking or saying it, and the rapist says "who cares, it was just her/his mind thinking she/he doesn't want to"....

dominion What has your post got to do with the post you quoted?

HIV(AIDS) should be fully curable with nanotechnology. I can't remember his name but this one nanotechonolgist said that by the year 2050, we should have fully functional nanotechnology. Disease should be a thing of the past in the next 100 years....(At least for the ones who can afford medical care/genetic engineering of their offspring.)

Originally posted by dadudemon
HIV(AIDS) should be fully curable with nanotechnology. I can't remember his name but this one nanotechonolgist said that by the year 2050, we should have fully functional nanotechnology. Disease should be a thing of the past in the next 100 years....(At least for the ones who can afford medical care/genetic engineering of their offspring.) By 2050 there will no doubt be something more sinister and incurable than AIDs.

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
ok, connecting the dots...

rape, what is the motive for rape, as someone suggested that it's rape that's causing the rise in AIDS in Africa. So, I thought about it, wondering, "why would rape be culturally sound/neutral?", as it has to be culturally 'ok' in order for it to go on as the poster suggested, unless the idea of the other person's will (mind/thoughts) is ignored and the desire for domination/dominion is more important then respecting free will. Well, rape is causing an increase in AIDs.... Admitting that isnt saying that rape is "ok".

Originally posted by dadudemon
Correct...a 63 year old dadudemon.

All of those years, fermenting my mind...I bet I will be a darkly sarcastic meat bag who only complains.
Horrible... *shivers*

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
We could make the AIDs sufferers build their own islands. Until they are done with that we can keep them in special facilities......camps so to speak. Originally posted by Robtard

* I don't mean this as Africans being unintelligent. Even though they are.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Correct...a 63 year old dadudemon.

All of those years, fermenting my mind...I bet I will be a darkly sarcastic meat bag who only complains.

Typo as well?

Stop ****ing.

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
Who said that rape is ok? If it's happening in increasing amounts, there has to be winking going on, sorry, that's just how I view it. Think of rap music and what was done during the 1980s-now, inner city violence was winked at, and so, it increased. Even if I was a martian, just stepping into America around 1980s, listening to rap music and listening to the news everyday and I would have wondered what was going on in the inner city, all that violence, maybe, I would also wonder if this act (violence) isn't somehow either encouraged or winked (ignored, one sees it and pretends they don't). if the act is increasing, it's either winked at or encouraged. and culture, to me, means "cultivate", rehearse, or mantra. so, if people rehearse "negativity" and everyone sees negativity, what would someone outside think? it derived from rehearsal/culture. the rape would mean that the culture/rehearsals/ thinking either winks at rape or teaches that people don't have a right to their own minds/thoughts, so if a person says "no", then taking it isn't a big issue,maybe even fun to them b/c they now dominated that person's free will, we call that rape, they may not have a definition for it if they don't recognize the rights of another person's thoughts/wishes.

i am only guessing here, so, nothing is itched in stone. This thread isnt about Rape victims though... It's about AIDs, therfor Rape only needs to be used for it's statistics in regards to AIDs figures.. Why not stay on topic... Or try at least.

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
Just because a word is used doesn't mean it is the topic of a thread.

someone mentioned CULTURE, someone else mentioned RAPE, and someone else mentioned AIDS/AFRICA, well, maybe they all tie into together, maybe some aspects of CULTURE effects if RAPE is ok, which effects the amount of poeple getting AIDS in Africa, it's only bringing it back to culture.

Originally posted by inimalist
the problem with AIDS in Africa is cultural

we would need to change their culture, without that they wont try to get medication, since they don't believe AIDS exists.

With that sort of reasoning if someone else were to blame the Jewish for AIDs you'd call the Jewish rapists.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Typo as well?

nope. not a typo...more like a random # of "old" I chose to put down.....I didn't think about the actual number...I just put something down...I would be 67, actually...a 5 year difference...pretty damn close for random number generation, I think. (I DO make calculation errors, though...it was one of the things that kept me from getting 100s and A's in my physics/math classes.)

Oh, and did I mention how much I love you, Bardock? (Seriously, I love you man )

Originally posted by Saxondale
Let's solve the AIDs pandemic in Africa.

Because HIV/AIDS is a problem that has been solved everywhere else?

Originally posted by Robtard
You sure about that? I'm fairly certain they believe it exist, they're just ignorant* in the ways to avoid it/lack the means.

I've seen footage of Religious heads in Africa telling the people in their community that using condoms was a affront to God. Sick and sad all at once.

* I don't mean this as Africans being unintelligent.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura

No, I think a lot of the people who have it believe it is real. As Robtard said it is more a lack of education.

maybe I should have specified that it is one among many conspiracy theories that abound in Africa about aids.

I would say that the lack of education is a cultural thing, but probably would have been better to use the more umbrella "social" term

Originally posted by Saxondale
I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it? what the hell is a pandemic?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
what the hell is a pandemic?

look it up dude

Originally posted by dadudemon
HIV(AIDS) should be fully curable with nanotechnology. I can't remember his name but this one nanotechonolgist said that by the year 2050, we should have fully functional nanotechnology. Disease should be a thing of the past in the next 100 years....(At least for the ones who can afford medical care/genetic engineering of their offspring.)

Seems a little too early, especially for a virus that mutates like H.I.V. does; we can hope though.

Have you read anything on the CCR5 receptor? There's a small percentage of people that are born with a defective CCR5, their bodies cope by circumventing/using other means so even though in a gene defect, the people with this live normal lives.

The plus side, HIV uses this gene as a gateway, without it, HIV either can't infect the host or has an extremely difficult time doing so.

Last I read, the spread of the gene defect was caused by mutation during Europe's medieval plagues , as people with this defect had a extremely high chance of not being infected. Think natural selection working, those with it had a better chance to survive and produce children with the same disorder, while the "less fit" for the current environment died.

Bad thing for Africa, mostly those of European decent have it, since it prospered in Europe.

all this talk of rape and aids is getting me hot and bothered.
*rubs nipples*

Originally posted by Schecter
all this talk of rape and aids is getting me hot and bothered.
*rubs nipples*

Do you pinch them too?

Originally posted by Robtard
Do you pinch them too?

not yet

i like to take it slow

Originally posted by Schecter
not yet

i like to take it slow

Hot.

Leave it to those musical saints Geldof and Bono.

Originally posted by Saxondale
. Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it?

Find a cure for AID's...,short of that, stay out of Africa. People liek to fvck, and many people in AFrica happen to have Aid's. Unless people in Africa stop fvcking and the African government starts executing rapists there is nothing anyone can do. I can understand you trying to solve the famine issue in Africa, but really...,trying to solve people's bad judgment?

Originally posted by dadudemon
nope. not a typo...more like a random # of "old" I chose to put down.....I didn't think about the actual number...I just put something down...I would be 67, actually...a 5 year difference...pretty damn close for random number generation, I think. (I DO make calculation errors, though...it was one of the things that kept me from getting 100s and A's in my physics/math classes.)

Oh, and did I mention how much I love you, Bardock? (Seriously, I love you man ) No, you forgot to mention it previously.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
what the hell is a pandemic? A big epidemic

Originally posted by Bardock42

A big epidemic

no stupid. its a really really super big mega epidemic times 50 with power ups

Originally posted by Saxondale
I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it?

We can't really force our government to contribute anymore than it's willing to, or has already planned to.


If we truly want to make a difference, I guess a Fundraiser may be a good way. Raise enough money to pay for needed medications, so that more meds can be sent.

You know...I just thought about something long ago. Take New York for example. Several millions of people live in the City. If every single person gave $1.00 to the cause, we'd have several million dollars worth to the cause.

Now....I'm assuming you're addressing KMC alone. I am not sure how many KMC members are on the forums all together, but I am sure we can all come up with some significant amount to the cause....assuming everyone cares.

But the Webmaster and Mods would have to be incharge/involved in this course of action...obviously.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
But the Webmaster and Mods would have to be incharge/involved in this course of action...obviously.

And how can we be sure the mods don't spend it all on pronz and DVDs? AHH HAA!

Originally posted by debbiejo
Cut their taxes

Debs, I have a feeling you didn't mean for it to, but this made me laugh out loud!

Originally posted by dadudemon
And how can we be sure the mods don't spend it all on pronz and DVDs? AHH HAA!


We wouldn't send cash. Only credit or check.

It would be sent to an official AIDS campaign fund, but it would have to be registered like any other charity would.

Or, we can simply send our own money to AIDS charities which already exist....but how many of us on KMC have those kind of things on our minds ?

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
We wouldn't send cash. Only credit or check.

It would be sent to an official AIDS campaign fund, but it would have to be registered like any other charity would.

Or, we can simply send our own money to AIDS charities which already exist....but how many of us on KMC have those kind of things on our minds ? I do.


I decide new everyday not to do **** about it.

Originally posted by Czarina_Czarina
ok, connecting the dots...

rape, what is the motive for rape, as someone suggested that it's rape that's causing the rise in AIDS in Africa. So, I thought about it, wondering, "why would rape be culturally sound/neutral?", as it has to be culturally 'ok' in order for it to go on as the poster suggested, unless the idea of the other person's will (mind/thoughts) is ignored and the desire for domination/dominion is more important then respecting free will.

you clearly have no concept of the realities of the south african situation regarding rape...it has nothing to do with it being culturally sound and everything to do with it being virtually impossible to prove in their legal system and thus offenders virtually never get caught.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I do.


I decide new everyday not to do **** about it.


Why not ?

There is two ways of dealing with the AIDS problem.

Cure or Cull, and since we have no cure....

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Why not ? Don't care for smelly black people reasonably far away.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Don't care for smelly black people reasonably far away. Survival of the fittest and all that. Then again, they could save your life one day.

Originally posted by parenthesis
Survival of the fittest and all that. Then again, they could save your life one day. Extremely unlikely.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Don't care for smelly black people reasonably far away.





You're fkn hilarious ! Only a talented comedian can make something as ugly as Racism so funny.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Extremely unlikely.

Blacks are physically stronger than Germans, and also have much larger penises. They have advantages over you.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Blacks are physically stronger than Germans, and also have much larger penises. They have advantages over you.

True. On average. I assume. But, it is still unlikely that an AIDS infected African is going to save my life. If anything it is just as likely as them killing me, so it cancels each other out.

Originally posted by Bardock42
True. On average. I assume. But, it is still unlikely that an AIDS infected African is going to save my life. If anything it is just as likely as them killing me, so it cancels each other out.


Dude, ever heard of Magic Johnson ?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Extremely unlikely. I thought that too, but I still believe in equal opportunity. Why should we have a world where some parts are rich and living, whereas others, are poor and dying. Shouldn't we make a world where everyone has a great life, not just ourselves. The world would be undeniably, much better that way.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny



You're fkn hilarious ! Only a talented comedian can make something as ugly as Racism so funny. You have a very small mind... It was funny, but it doesn't take much. Now, getting Dick Cheney to laugh at Bush, that would be brilliant.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Dude, ever heard of Magic Johnson ? Yes. Not sure how that relates to the AIDS epidemic in Africa.


Oh, I get it, cause he is African American, silly you. Ha...still, my point stands.

Originally posted by parenthesis
I thought that too, but I still believe in equal opportunity. Why should we have a world where some parts are rich and living, whereas others, are poor and dying. Shouldn't we make a world where everyone has a great life, not just ourselves. The world would be undeniably, much better that way.


I agree, but the problem is most people don't care.


If something is not part of my life, then why should it matter to me.---This is the kind of thinking that so many people adhere to.

And this is the ultamate problem. Most people don't see other humans as thier brothers and sisters, most people see other human beings as strangers of which we owe no responsibility or empathy to.


Only when someone already knows what its like to suffer so greatly, can they truly have empathy for the suffering of another. People who are generally spoiled, are also selfish, and think very inward. Once they learn humility, they start to open up to the lives and realities of others.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Yes. Not sure how that relates to the AIDS epidemic in Africa.


Oh, I get it, cause he is African American, silly you. Ha...still, my point stands.


He has HIV

Originally posted by parenthesis
I thought that too, but I still believe in equal opportunity. Why should we have a world where some parts are rich and living, whereas others, are poor and dying. Shouldn't we make a world where everyone has a great life, not just ourselves. The world would be undeniably, much better that way.

What do you suppose should "we" do. And why should "we" do it?

Originally posted by Bardock42
What do you suppose should "we" do. And why should "we" do it?


I honestly hope you are joking.


You can't truly be this insensitive to the mass suffering of other people. If this were your country in crisis, and you had this situation, you'd be begging for someone else's concern.

I dunno man im pretty pessimistic about mankind in general. I would to like things get better but the way I see it its only a matter of time before we blow ourselves up.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I honestly hope you are joking.


You can't truly be this insensitive to the mass suffering of other people. If this were your country in crisis, and you had this situation, you'd be begging for someone else's concern. Don't think so. But even if I did. By what right would I beg for it?

Yes they suffer, but how should we even help? Our countries shouldn't use them, but why should we help them and how?

Originally posted by Bardock42

Yes they suffer, but how should we even help? Our countries shouldn't use them, but why should we help them and how?

I not sure about how, but the why is that I was under the impression that Europe took alot of resources from Africa.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I not sure about how, but the why is that I was under the impression that Europe took alot of resources from Africa. Do you think you can blame the bad state of many African countries on Europe?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Don't think so. But even if I did. By what right would I beg for it?

Yes they suffer, but how should we even help? Our countries shouldn't use them, but why should we help them and how?


How is one thing, but why is another.


If you can't see why wealthy nations such as United States and Germany should help a devestated continent like Africa, then I have nothing more to say.

We have very different mindsets. I'm not going to convince you to care.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
How is one thing, but why is another.


If you can't see why wealthy nations such as United States and Germany should help a devestated continent like Africa, then I have nothing more to say.

We have very different mindsets. I'm not going to convince you to care. Am I right to assume there is no logical reason then? It is your mindset that makes you want to help?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Do you think you can blame the bad state of many African countries on Europe?

Are you serious? Dont they sell weapons to Africa so they can kill each other, isnt the actual economics not in favour of third world countries including Africa.

Europe has played a big part in why Africa is the way it is.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Do you think you can blame the bad state of many African countries on Europe?


I don't know about that, but I can certainly blame the poor economy of South American on Europe and United States.


Europe and United States stole the riches from the Incan empire, which was once the source of all of pre-colonized Peru's power.

They really have very little now...sports and fashion are really thier only major powers of economy, and even that is overshadowed by the debt that Latin America is required to pay to USA...and for what ? I don't even know....

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I don't know about that, but I can certainly blame the poor economy of South American on Europe and United States.


Europe and United States stole the riches from the Incan empire, which was once the source of all of pre-colonized Peru's power.

They really have very little now...sports and fashion are really thier only major powers of economy, and even that is overshadowed by the debt that Latin America is required to pay to USA...and for what ? I don't even know....

Im pretty sure they did similar **** in Africa.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Am I right to assume there is no logical reason then? It is your mindset that makes you want to help?


No, I think you're wrong.


I find it so funny how you can critisize religions such as Christianity and Islam for being cruel, sadistic, and ignorant- because of what they had done throughout history, and because of thier oppressive actions against Gays and Atheists-

-but then think it's okay to ignore the mass suffering in Africa, and claim that we don't have to help them, because thier "smelly black people".


You're just as bad as anyone you critisize then.



If you don't care about the suffering in Africa, then don't. There's nothing I can do, nor care to do, because I am not responsible for you and your ways of thinking.

But don't continue to be a hypocrite in critisizing Christians or Muslims, because of thier rather oppressive practices, when your own moral stance leaves much to be questioned.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I agree, but the problem is most people don't care.


If something is not part of my life, then why should it matter to me.---This is the kind of thinking that so many people adhere to.

And this is the ultamate problem. Most people don't see other humans as thier brothers and sisters, most people see other human beings as strangers of which we owe no responsibility or empathy to.


Only when someone already knows what its like to suffer so greatly, can they truly have empathy for the suffering of another. People who are generally spoiled, are also selfish, and think very inward. Once they learn humility, they start to open up to the lives and realities of others. Well, you agree. So to all those other people (which I hope are a minority), if I get the chance I'll tell them exaclty what I told you.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Are you serious? Dont they sell weapons to Africa so they can kill each other, isnt the actual economics not in favour of third world countries including Africa.

Europe has played a big part in why Africa is the way it is. Err...they could just...not kill each other?

They can sort out their problems.

Also, I mean the advances of Europe and North America are now partly also available in Africa, they wouldn't have the standard of living we had if they never met Europeans anyways.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I don't know about that, but I can certainly blame the poor economy of South American on Europe and United States.


Europe and United States stole the riches from the Incan empire, which was once the source of all of pre-colonized Peru's power.

They really have very little now...sports and fashion are really thier only major powers of economy, and even that is overshadowed by the debt that Latin America is required to pay to USA...and for what ? I don't even know.... To be fair, it didn't work out that great for Spain in the long run either, did it?

Again, people only seem to see the bad parts. Like Africans and South Americans lived in a paradise before Europeans came. Truly, if Europeans had never found South America (and I am not denying that there went a lot of shit down) do you think they'd live better or worse there?

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
No, I think you're wrong.


I find it so funny how you can critisize religions such as Christianity and Islam for being cruel, sadistic, and ignorant- because of what they had done throughout history, and because of thier oppressive actions against Gays and Atheists-

-but then think it's okay to ignore the mass suffering in Africa, and claim that we don't have to help them, because thier "smelly black people".


You're just as bad as anyone you critisize then.



If you don't care about the suffering in Africa, then don't. There's nothing I can do, nor care to do, because I am not responsible for you and your ways of thinking.

But don't continue to be a hypocrite in critisizing Christians or Muslims, because of thier rather oppressive practices, when your own moral stance leaves much to be questioned.

I was watching David Chapelle on youtube and he was like "You ever hear something that was so racist you didnt know how to react, your not angry your just shocked?".....im like did he say what I think he said?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Err...they could just...not kill each other?

So its ok to sell them weapons as well? Both parties are responsible

Originally posted by Bardock42

They can sort out their problems.

Not if you got somebody trying to make the situation worse.

Originally posted by Bardock42

Also, I mean the advances of Europe and North America are now partly also available in Africa, they wouldn't have the standard of living we had if they never met Europeans anyways.


Er you did notice how I didnt just mention selling of weapons but the unfair econcomics as well.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
No, I think you're wrong.


I find it so funny how you can critisize religions such as Christianity and Islam for being cruel, sadistic, and ignorant- because of what they had done throughout history, and because of thier oppressive actions against Gays and Atheists-

-but then think it's okay to ignore the mass suffering in Africa, and claim that we don't have to help them, because thier "smelly black people".


You're just as bad as anyone you critisize then.



If you don't care about the suffering in Africa, then don't. There's nothing I can do, nor care to do, because I am not responsible for you and your ways of thinking.

But don't continue to be a hypocrite in critisizing Christians or Muslims, because of thier rather oppressive practices, when your own moral stance leaves much to be questioned.

Well, that's your idea, but I criticize them because I am for the freedom of people. I think it is bad to do bad things to do to people, I also think it is bad to do "good" things to people for only their sake. People should not be put in danger and pain for no reason, but they shouldn't be pampered and be rewarded for things they don't deserve.

There is a difference between doing bad deeds and being required to do good deeds. It's not the same thing. I am not being hypocritical just because my approach is different to yours.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, that's your idea, but I criticize them because I am for the freedom of people. I think it is bad to do bad things to do to people, I also think it is bad to do "good" things to people for only their sake. People should not be put in danger and pain for no reason, but they shouldn't be pampered and be rewarded for things they don't deserve.


People in Africa dont deserve help? What so African people are stupid?

Originally posted by Alfheim
So its ok to sell them weapons as well? Both parties are responsible

Yes, of course it is alright to sell them weapons. Why shouldn't it be.



Not if you got somebody trying to make the situation worse.

Who are you blaming?

Er you did notice how I didnt just mention selling of weapons but the unfair econcomics as well.

I agree with that. Doesn't relate to my point though. They wouldn't have the higher standard of living we had if they never met Europeans. Agree?

Originally posted by Alfheim
People in Africa dont deserve help? What so African people are stupid?

Odd conclusion.


People don't deserve help for helps sake. If it makes you feel good to help them, go ahead, have fun. But don't require people that don't want to help them to do though. And you shouldn't feel better than them, you aren't just cause you use your money in different ways.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I agree with that. Doesn't relate to my point though.

Why not?

Originally posted by Bardock42

They wouldn't have the higher standard of living we had if they never met Europeans. Agree?

Well actually Europeans wouldnt have had the standard of living they have now if they hadnt met Arabs and Africans. There is alot science which people use today which Europe got from the Islamic civilization which Africa was a part of.

I dunno if Africans hadnt met Europeans they would have probably been fine, I guess.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Odd conclusion.

You did say why should I help smelly black people?

Originally posted by Bardock42

People don't deserve help for helps sake. If it makes you feel good to help them, go ahead, have fun. But don't require people that don't want to help them to do though. And you shouldn't feel better than them, you aren't just cause you use your money in different ways.

No they dont but you refered to people in Africa as smelly black people implying they dont need help.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Why not?



Well actually Europeans wouldnt have had the standard of living they have now if they hadnt met Arabs and Africans. There is alot science which people use today which Europe got from the Islamic civilization which Africa was a part of.

I dunno if Africans hadnt met Europeans they would have probably been fine, I guess.



You did say why should I help smelly black people?



No they dont but you refered to people in Africa as smelly black people implying they dont need help. Because selling weapons has nothing to do with the standard of living now.


Yeah, but they made something out of it themselves.

How fine? Living in huts like many still do, just all?

Originally posted by Alfheim

No they dont but you refered to people in Africa as smelly black people implying they dont need help.

I did that a few replies back, it was a joke reply and you concluded it from a totally different quote.

Originally posted by Bardock42
What do you suppose should "we" do. And why should "we" do it? Okay, after reading that thrice, I think I understand what you were trying to say.

I propose we let them work for us, and in return we give them the resources they need. Over time, they won't need to work for us, because they would be able to supply themselves, then work for themselves. It's a little distorted I know, but I'm not a politician. It might not work, but I'd rather we try, than do nothing.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Because selling weapons has nothing to do with the standard of living now.

Well.

1. Yes it does war doesnt increase your standard of living does it.
2. Remember for the second time now....I mentioned that its not just the selling of weapons but the economics is unfair as welll. It seems your just focusing on the weapons.

Originally posted by Bardock42

Yeah, but they made something out of it themselves.

Yes thats why it works both ways.

Originally posted by Bardock42


How fine? Living in huts like many still do, just all?

Thats just a stereotype. My tribe is the Mandingo did you know they traveled to America before Columbus. Thats just something you've been taught that African people lived in mud huts. My ancestors were part of the Islamic Empire hell they were so rich they caused masive inflation.

You going to acknowledge this bit or what?

"Well actually Europeans wouldnt have had the standard of living they have now if they hadnt met Arabs and Africans. cool There is alot science which people use today which Europe got from the Islamic civilization which Africa was a part of. "

Originally posted by Bardock42
I did that a few replies back, it was a joke reply

Im telepathic?

Originally posted by Bardock42

and you concluded it from a totally different quote.

So what your telling me im taking it out of context? If a person didnt know you were joking it sounded racist.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, that's your idea, but I criticize them because I am for the freedom of people. I think it is bad to do bad things to do to people, I also think it is bad to do "good" things to people for only their sake.


So infringing on one's freedom is wrong, but allowing poverty to continue isn't ? I dont get it.

And, I'm not making a personal attack on you by any means, I do like you as a poster. I am just trying to understand how you think....cuz it certainly boggles me, and apparently I'm not the only person who thinks you are wrong here.






Originally posted by Bardock42
People should not be put in danger and pain for no reason, but they shouldn't be pampered and be rewarded for things they don't deserve.


Being pulled out of poverty and disease isn't exactly being "pampered" and "rewarded".


And what in your mind qualifies one as deserving of help ?






Originally posted by Bardock42
There is a difference between doing bad deeds and being required to do good deeds. It's not the same thing. I am not being hypocritical just because my approach is different to yours.


You are not required to do good deeds, but to do evil is just as bad as to see evil being done and to do nothing about it.


By doing nothing, you are enabling the wrong to continue. Your silence supports it. One day, you will understand that.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Don't think so. But even if I did. By what right would I beg for it?

Yes they suffer, but how should we even help? Our countries shouldn't use them, but why should we help them and how? ...

But we have too much resources, remember? We are advanced enough to look after ourselves and others. So why can't we give our money to them, seeing as we don't need it?

Originally posted by Alfheim

"Well actually Europeans wouldnt have had the standard of living they have now if they hadnt met Arabs and Africans. cool There is alot science which people use today which Europe got from the Islamic civilization which Africa was a part of. "
I did.


Anyhow, the point stands that the arguments for helping Africa are some sort of guilt or conscience things. Those are merely moral arguments.

Originally posted by parenthesis
...

But we have too much resources, remember? We are advanced enough to look after ourselves and others. So why can't we give our money to them, seeing as we don't need it?

We have no poverty in our countries?


When did that happen?

Originally posted by Bardock42
I did.


Anyhow, the point stands that the arguments for helping Africa are some sort of guilt or conscience things. Those are merely moral arguments.


You are obviously blind to something, and please don't take it as offense, but the rest of us can see something that you just aren't seeing.

Let me ask you something. And really think about it before you respond:





Let's say there is a poor beggar on the street. He has five dollars, his last five left. A robber comes and takes away his money.

Now, another person passes by. Let's say a woman. She has five dollars in her pocket. She doesn't really need it. She sees the beggar who has no money and no food. She decides to do nothing, to just pass him by, even though she has money that she doesn't need, which she could easily give him to help him out for just another day.


Who is worse in your opinion ? The robber or the woman ? And why ?

Originally posted by Bardock42
I did.

Ok well show me where you did. I could be mistaken but it seems you refered to the selling of the weapons and the part were I said they would be fine.....but not actaully acknowledging that Europe would not be as advanced as it would be today if it were not for Africa.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Because selling weapons has nothing to do with the standard of living now.


Yeah, but they made something out of it themselves.

How fine? Living in huts like many still do, just all?

Originally posted by Bardock42

Anyhow, the point stands that the arguments for helping Africa are some sort of guilt or conscience things. Those are merely moral arguments.

How would it be when Europe is partially responsible for messing Africa up? So let me gets this straight you go into somebodies house you mess it up but you ahve no responsibility in cleaning it?

Originally posted by parenthesis
...

But we have too much resources, remember? We are advanced enough to look after ourselves and others. So why can't we give our money to them, seeing as we don't need it?

....and you OWE us. Just saying it nice to help Africans sounds condensending.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
So infringing on ones freedom is wrong, but allowing poverty to continue isn't ? I dont get it.


Oh, my bad, I will explain it more thoroughly to you:

Infringing on ones freedom is wrong, but allowing poverty to continue isn't.
Originally posted by SpearofDestiny

And, I'm not making a personal attack on you by any means, I do like you as a poster. I am just trying to understand how you think....cuz it certainly boggles me, and apparently I'm not the only person who thinks you are wrong here.


Aha






Originally posted by SpearofDestiny

Being pulled out of poverty and disease isn't exactly being "pampered" and "rewarded".


Yeah it is.
Originally posted by SpearofDestiny

And what in your mind qualifies one as deserving of help ?


Nothing really. Maybe the earned respect of the individual that wants to help. I am not against individual help at all. What I am against is the notion that we "should" help.



Originally posted by SpearofDestiny


You are not required to do good deeds, but to do evil is just as bad as to see evil being done and to do nothing about it.


Not necessarily. But I think evil is to require people to help. Create the idea that they have the duty to help. In my opinion they don't, and it is evil to imply it.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny

By doing nothing, you are enabling the wrong to continue. Your silence supports it. One day, you will understand that.

Or one day you will understand my superior and more logical philosophy (well, while we are at being condescending why not go all the way?)

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
You are obviously blind to something, and please don't take it as offense, but the rest of us can see something that you just aren't seeing.

O-or the other way around. Considered that?
Originally posted by SpearofDestiny

Let me ask you something. And really think about it before you respond:





Let's say there is a poor beggar on the street. He has five dollars, his last five left. A robber comes and takes away his money.

Now, another person passes by. Let's say a woman. She has five dollars in her pocket. She doesn't really need it. She sees the beggar who has no money and no food. She decides to do nothing, to just pass him by, even though she has money that she doesn't need, which she could easily give him to help him out for just another day.


Who is worse in your opinion ? The robber or the woman ? And why ? The robber. He stole the persons belonging. He took something he did not deserve. The woman did nothing wrong at all.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
You are obviously blind to something, and please don't take it as offense, but the rest of us can see something that you just aren't seeing.

Let me ask you something. And really think about it before you respond:





Let's say there is a poor beggar on the street. He has five dollars, his last five left. A robber comes and takes away his money.

Now, another person passes by. Let's say a woman. She has five dollars in her pocket. She doesn't really need it. She sees the beggar who has no money and no food. She decides to do nothing, to just pass him by, even though she has money that she doesn't need, which she could easily give him to help him out for just another day.


Who is worse in your opinion ? The robber or the woman ? And why ? This might shock you, but the robber obviously. The robber couldn't have need the fiver either. The woman may help him out for one day, but what's gonna help him the next day? She might aswell chuck the fiver in a fire to keep her children warm! That person might die the next day as that woman can only give it to him once. After that, we're back to square one.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok well show me where you did. I could be mistaken but it seems you refered to the selling of the weapons and the part were I said they would be fine.....but not actaully acknowledging that Europe would not be as advanced as it would be today if it were not for Africa.


I said something like "Yeah, but they made something from it"



Originally posted by Alfheim

How would it be when Europe is partially responsible for messing Africa up? So let me gets this straight you go into somebodies house you mess it up but you have no responsibility in cleaning it?

I think you got good and bad from being colonized by European. It's not our responsibility to sort out your stuff. You should do it yourself. Europe had their own problems ...
Originally posted by Alfheim

....and you OWE us. Just saying it nice to help Africans sounds condensending.

We owe you shit.

Originally posted by Bardock42
We have no poverty in our countries?


When did that happen? No, I know we have poor people here too. We are already trying to help them though, and Africa is worse off.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I said something like "Yeah, but they made something from it"


Ok I thought you were refering to the weapons ie Africans got something the selling of the arms. Bro if it wasnt for the Islamic civiliaztion the renassance would probably not have happened...so Europeans would not have been as advanced as it is today...so it works both ways.



Originally posted by Bardock42

I think you got good and bad from being colonized by European. It's not our responsibility to sort out your stuff. You should do it yourself. Europe had their own problems ...


We owe you shit.

No no no no. Look its real simple Africans are not blameless but you dont sell weapons to Africans ona regular basis and not have any responsibility, war does not make an economy better. Furthermore the economics need to be changed they are in favour of Europe and not Africa. The current state of economics was not set up by Africans and is not helping the situation therefore again Europe is partially to blame for the poverty as well.

This is what im saying you cant be partially responsible for messing something up and the have no responsibility to fix it.

Regarding weapons: Europe and the US are not Africa's nannies, if Africans want weapons we have no right or duty to stop our companies from selling the weapons to them.

So you are sure that Africa is much worse because of European interference? Why?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, that's your idea, but I criticize them because I am for the freedom of people. I think it is bad to do bad things to do to people, I also think it is bad to do "good" things to people for only their sake. People should not be put in danger and pain for no reason, but they shouldn't be pampered and be rewarded for things they don't deserve.

There is a difference between doing bad deeds and being required to do good deeds. It's not the same thing. I am not being hypocritical just because my approach is different to yours.

Quoted for undeniable, ridiculously good truth. I have been saying this shit for years and until the world understands this...their situations cannot improve at a "favorable rate". This is why I love you, Bardock42.


People have to evolve for themselves to a point of stability. Even the frickin' US of A had to kill millions of their own people in a "Civil War" to reach their "happy place".


Originally posted by parenthesis
I propose we let them work for us, and in return we give them the resources they need. Over time, they won't need to work for us, because they would be able to supply themselves, then work for themselves. It's a little distorted I know, but I'm not a politician. It might not work, but I'd rather we try, than do nothing.

This is similar to my idea on a solution. Provide the jobs, encourage entrepreneurship, and you plant the seeds of self sustained prosperity.

Also, all of you should realize that we are basing our idea of a "good society" off of our own societal norms. An industrialized and successful country may not necessarily be what the most of the people want. Even then, who are we to say that they deserve what "most of the people" want? Is it our place to decided another country's political institutions? Is that even morally right? The answer to those questions borders on theology, imo.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Quoted for undeniable, ridiculously good truth. I have been saying this shit for years and until the world understands this...their situations cannot improve at a "favorable rate". This is why I love you, Bardock42.


People have to evolve for themselves to a point of stability. Even the frickin' US of A had to kill millions of their own people in a "Civil War" to reach their "happy place".




This is similar to my idea on a solution. Provide the jobs, encourage entrepreneurship, and you plant the seeds of self sustained prosperity.

Also, all of you should realize that we are basing our idea of a "good society" off of our own societal norms. An industrialized and successful country may not necessarily be what the most of the people want. Even then, who are we to say that they deserve what "most of the people" want? Is it our place to decided another country's political institutions? Is that even morally right? The answer to those questions borders on theology, imo. If you didn't post this, I would've. Yes, we shouldn't give money to those who don't deserve it, hence the working thing, but when you have a choice between helping someone and letting them die, you help them. It makes society stronger. Having that said, there's people who don't deserve and people who do. Giving it to everyone is stupid, giving it to no one is also stupid.

So my conclusion from this debate is: Let everyone live the best way possible, as long as they do their part aswell.

Originally posted by Bardock42
O-or the other way around. Considered that?


Yes, until I realized I was actually right.



Originally posted by Bardock42
The robber. He stole the persons belonging. He took something he did not deserve. The woman did nothing wrong at all.


Yet, both lead to the same results...the beggar has nothing and will starve that day. In essence, they both did the same thing, because both thier actions lead to the same result.

Originally posted by lord xyz
If you didn't post this, I would've. Yes, we shouldn't give money to those who don't deserve it, hence the working thing, but when you have a choice between helping someone and letting them die, you help them. It makes society stronger. Having that said, there's people who don't deserve and people who do. Giving it to everyone is stupid, giving it to no one is also stupid.

So my conclusion from this debate is: Let everyone live the best way possible, as long as they do their part aswell.


For once I actually agree with you.



If you have the power to stop something evil from continuing, you should. To let someone die when you could save thier life is just as bad as killing them yourself.

Originally posted by Saxondale
I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it?
It's like cancer: NO.

Originally posted by Kelly_Bean
It's like cancer: NO.



Cancer has been cured by many people. People, with the help of doctors, right habits, and even meditation have cured thier own cancers.

There are even reports from different parts of the world of people surviving and living past HIV.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Yes, until I realized I was actually right.






Yet, both lead to the same results...the beggar has nothing and will starve that day. In essence, they both did the same thing, because both thier actions lead to the same result. Consider this, if the woman gave the beggar money, (which he didn't deserve,) he would die the next day because she can only give him the 5 dollars once. The robber however is way worse. Not because his action lead to the beggars death, but he might not need it aswell. Forget the beggar and think about the actions themselves. I understand your point, it's just your analogy.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
For once I actually agree with you.



If you have the power to stop something evil from continuing, you should. To let someone die when you could save thier life is just as bad as killing them yourself. Ermm, my point isn't just that. I'm glad you agree with me. This isn't the first time you've agreed with me either.

Originally posted by lord xyz
Consider this, if the woman gave the beggar money, (which he didn't deserve,) he would die the next day because she can only give him the 5 dollars once. The robber however is way worse. Not because his action lead to the beggars death, but he might not need it aswell. Forget the beggar and think about the actions themselves. I understand your point, it's just your analogy.


His death would not have been her fault though. She gave him something to help him survive. What he does with the money is his choice. And it's not about the beggar "deserving" the money. If someone falls down the stairs and breaks thier arm, should I not call the Ambulence because he or she didn't earn my help ? Is there something a person has to do to deserve help ?

I think that's rediculous.






Originally posted by lord xyz
Ermm, my point isn't just that. I'm glad you agree with me. This isn't the first time you've agreed with me either.


Well, for the most part, I think you were right.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Cancer has been cured by many people. People, with the help of doctors, right habits, and even meditation have cured thier own cancers.

There are even reports from different parts of the world of people surviving and living past HIV.
Cancer isn't really fully cured. There's always the possibility of it coming back. I watched somewhere that we're all born with a bit of cancer in us from some chemical imbalance in our brains or something. Just because some people survive cancer and it's "rid" of with chemo and stuff like that doesn't mean it's gone, the traces will always be there.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
His death would not have been her fault though. She gave him something to help him survive. What he does with the money is his choice. And it's not about the beggar "deserving" the money. If someone falls down the stairs and breaks thier arm, should I not call the Ambulence because he or she didn't earn my help ? Is there something a person has to do to deserve help ?

I think that's rediculous.
Look, I agree that hurting someone and not helping someone are just as bad, but they are not the same. Just because I don't help you doesn't mean I should be held responcible, unless I undeniably, deliberately allowed you to suffer. That's ridiculous.
Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Well, for the most part, I think you were right. In other words, you only agree with the parts that support your biased claim. As if, you didn't listen to me at all.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Oh, my bad, I will explain it more thoroughly to you:

Infringing on ones freedom is wrong, but allowing poverty to continue isn't.



How ?


If the State forbids me from marrying another man, I'll still be healthy. I'll still have my house, my money, food, and the man I love. I might be upset and feel oppressed, but I'll still have everything else I need to live and be happy.


If I'm poor, and the State does nothing to help me, not only will I not be married, I'll also have no money, no food, and probably die shortly.




Living in Poverty seems far worse to me than not being able to do certain things.







Originally posted by Bardock42
Yeah it is.



How so ? If I help find a cure for someone's deadly illness and help them out of poverty, then I'm rewarding and spoiling them ?


Isn't that just the right thing to do since they are, after all, human like myself ? I'd want the same done If I were in thier situation.





Originally posted by Bardock42
Nothing really. Maybe the earned respect of the individual that wants to help. I am not against individual help at all. What I am against is the notion that we "should" help.


I think you are misintepretting me.


I am not saying that you are obliged to do it, and should be punished for not doing so.


What I am trying to tell you is that I find your stance hypocritical.


And the reason is this: You have attacked Christianity and Islam, and religion in general, for its oppressive actions. I agree with most of what you say in regard to religion, by the way.

However, by doing so, you are putting yourself on a moral pedestal. By judging the wrongs of others, you are claiming to know whats right, somehow. And then on top of that, you say that it's okay to let poor people starve, and that the reason you don't want to help Africans with AIDS is because they are "smelly black people".


I don't understand how you can't see your own hypocrisy.


If you truly beleive that people deserve to be happy (which seems to be the case since you beleive no one's rights should be infringed upon), then you should be for people's happiness all the way. Not just in *certain cases* (like if thier white and wealthy).








Originally posted by Bardock42
Not necessarily. But I think evil is to require people to help. Create the idea that they have the duty to help. In my opinion they don't, and it is evil to imply it.



How is it evil to require someone to help ?


Even if you gave $5.00, that would help Africa. Thier economy is so bad, that even $5.00 or five Euro makes a huge difference to one African family.


How is that more evil than allowing people to suffer and die, people who are asking for our help, when you had the power to help ?




Originally posted by Bardock42
Or one day you will understand my superior and more logical philosophy (well, while we are at being condescending why not go all the way?)


Don't flatter yourself bro. I respect you sometimes, but in this debate, you've shown me a side of yourself that I dislike.

Originally posted by Kelly_Bean
Cancer isn't really fully cured. There's always the possibility of it coming back. I watched somewhere that we're all born with a bit of cancer in us from some chemical imbalance in our brains or something. Just because some people survive cancer and it's "rid" of with chemo and stuff like that doesn't mean it's gone, the traces will always be there.


Remission is the end of Cancer. That's when its cured.


You don't understand Cancer. Cancer flourishes when the Immune System is damaged. AS long as the Immune System is strong, pre-cancerous cells will be destroyed before they can spread.

And not all tumors are cancer. Benign Tumors are "cancerous" cells which have grown out of proportion, but will not lead to cancer, since they do not touch the bloodstream.

Malignant tumors are tumors which grow out of control, and will eventually spread though the bloodstream. While benign tumors dont grow back, malignant ones do.

Originally posted by lord xyz
Look, I agree that hurting someone and not helping someone are just as bad, but they are not the same. Just because I don't help you doesn't mean I should be held responcible, unless I undeniably, deliberately allowed you to suffer. That's ridiculous.


I didn't say they were the same action. I said they lead to the same result, which is a result of death and suffering. And you agree with me there.

My anology may have been flawed, but my point is very clear. And that's all that matters to me. As long as you got my point, then my anology worked.

And no, ofcourse you are not responsible for another person's survival. I never said that. But in deciding to not help someone, knowing full well they are suffering and in need, knowing full well you can help them, you are no better than the person who intentionally takes away from them. That's all I said.




Originally posted by lord xyz
In other words, you only agree with the parts that support your biased claim. As if, you didn't listen to me at all.


You don't even know what I disagree with.

What I don't agree with is you saying that "some people don't deserve to be helped". What qualifies someone as deserving of your help ? Do they have to pass a certain test ? Do they have to clean your shoes for you first ? How the hell is a young child with HIV supposed to earn your help ? That's absurd.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Remission is the end of Cancer. That's when its cured.


You don't understand Cancer. Cancer flourishes when the Immune System is damaged. AS long as the Immune System is strong, pre-cancerous cells will be destroyed before they can spread.

And not all tumors are cancer. Benign Tumors are "cancerous" cells which have grown out of proportion, but will not lead to cancer, since they do not touch the bloodstream.

Malignant tumors are tumors which grow out of control, and will eventually spread though the bloodstream. While benign tumors dont grow back, malignant ones do.
As if you do?
Like I said before, once cancer is in the system it is never fully flushed out, no matter what.

Originally posted by Kelly_Bean
As if you do?
Like I said before, once cancer is in the system it is never fully flushed out, no matter what.

that is incorrect.

While many "cured" cases of cancer, or remissions, are just dormant cancer cells that could one day become active again, it is not impossible for all cancerous cells to be expelled from the system.

As many cancerous tumors are genetic or environmental, many times the cancer will return, which would be almost indistinguishable from it always having been there.

Unfortunately, much like brain death, being 100% rid of cancerous cells may just be something we don't have the technical equipment or understanding to be specifically positive about.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Oh, my bad, I will explain it more thoroughly to you:

Infringing on ones freedom is wrong, but allowing poverty to continue isn't. I respect your belief. I know what you're saying, that you believe it's not wrong to allow others suffer. Like I said before, survival of the fittest.

Speaking of nature, are you aware of the Asian Small-Clawed Otter? They are a breed of otter that hang around in big social groups. They aren't the strongest, nor are they the biggest, they're the smallest, yet they live longest and are known as the healthiest. I was told by the zookeeper this is because they live in a social group. Now, yes it would be foolish to accept that as fact straight away, but it just makes sense. Being social makes people advance more than advancing separately. That's in many TV shows and films. You can call me stupid for that belief, but that's what I think. I mean, I don't have all the answers, I'm not the smartest guy in the world, but it's my belief, and I stand by it.

To put it another way, helping eachother out is what I believe is the main importance in society. The more we help eachother, the better our society. The less we help eachother, the worse our society. We can't survive on our own. We as people and communities. We survive better with allies. 2 heads are better than one and all that. A team is better than a player and an army is better than a soldier. Get it?

Originally posted by Kelly_Bean
As if you do?


Yes, I've researched it for a while. The reasons why I have are personal, so I won't go into them.




Originally posted by Kelly_Bean
Like I said before, once cancer is in the system it is never fully flushed out, no matter what.


That's not true. You are mistaking terms.


We are born with cells which will deviate from thier original function, because they were not developed properly. Those cells are termed "cancerous cells" because they do not abide by thier original programming and instead only replicate without end.


Those cells are killed off my our immune system every day. That happens all the time, to every single person. That is not Cancer.


Cancer is when those cells grow exceeding the rate at which our immune system can stop them. That is what Cancer is.

Remission is when Cancer no longer occurs. When the "cancerous" cells are destroyed at a successful rate by a dominant immune system.

When Remission occurs without interruption for atleast five years, the cancer is considered cured. Look it up.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I didn't say they were the same action. I said they lead to the same result, which is a result of death and suffering. And you agree with me there.

My anology may have been flawed, but my point is very clear. And that's all that matters to me. As long as you got my point, then my anology worked.

And no, ofcourse you are not responsible for another person's survival. I never said that. But in deciding to not help someone, knowing full well they are suffering and in need, knowing full well you can help them, you are no better than the person who intentionally takes away from them. That's all I said. And I disagree with that. They create the same result, but for different reasons. One is deliberate, one is unitentional, and that's what I was trying to say.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
You don't even know what I disagree with.

What I don't agree with is you saying that "some people don't deserve to be helped". What qualifies someone as deserving of your help ? Do they have to pass a certain test ? Do they have to clean your shoes for you first ? How the hell is a young child with HIV supposed to earn your help ? That's absurd. You know, I forgot this thread was about AIDS in Africa.

Helping people get better I believe is right as I believe nothing is more important than human life. Helping people like a beggar who's probably gonna die anyway, is stupid. And going back to healthcare in Africa, if we help them and they still die, we would have wasted our money. That's absurd.

And I understand the confusion with me using deserve. I apoligise for that, but I don't know the specific word I should have used.

In most Sub-Saharan African countries, HIV percentages are rising.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIDS_in_Africa

I want to say some things that would make me look like a jerk, but I won't.

Can I say some things and you guys not hold it against me? In other words, if I say something you don't like, tell why you don't like it, AND do not hold that against me permanently IF I decide to change my point of view based on your argument. Thank you.

Originally posted by Saxondale
I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it? Quarantine the continent, effectively cutting off all aid, tourism, immigration, etc. The inhabitants will ultimately slaughter each other in bids for power (much like nowadays except without foreign interference), and with lack of foreign aid, spread the virus to the point that they create quarantine sectors within Africa itself, and likely kill anyone with the virus inside the "safe-zone."

Of course to do that effectively you need international cooperation.

And to do that you need to unite all Western and Eastern power-hub nations under one banner and vision.

To do that you need to eliminate much of said nations existing problems so as to create peaceful and determined societies.

Yet to do that you need a figurehead within one or more of these nations to take Democracy by the reins and steer it away from rampant corruption.

That being said, Fascism is only half a century dead and still used as a synonym for "bully." Communism simply ignores human corruption, and any other form of authoritarian/totalitarian rule (which would give the aforementioned figurehead the power to enact the above scenario) has been shunned by most of the major powers of the world, thereby rendering the Save Africa From AIDS Now campaign, a total bust.

Originally posted by dadudemon
In most Sub-Saharan African countries, HIV percentages are rising.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIDS_in_Africa

I want to say some things that would make me look like a jerk, but I won't.

Can I say some things and you guys not hold it against me? In other words, if I say something you don't like, tell why you don't like it, AND do not hold that against me permanently IF I decide to change my point of view based on your argument. Thank you. Ermm, well that depends, if what you say is stupid, we'll hold it against you, if what you say is "sick", stupid people will hold it against you.

About the HIV rising thing, I'm not sure if that's true. If it is, holy shit.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Quoted for undeniable, ridiculously good truth. I have been saying this shit for years and until the world understands this...their situations cannot improve at a "favorable rate". This is why I love you, Bardock42.


People have to evolve for themselves to a point of stability. Even the frickin' US of A had to kill millions of their own people in a "Civil War" to reach their "happy place".


Yeah so that means that everbody has to do it as well. Furthermore the history of Africa isnt the same as America so thats a bad comparison.

1. You didnt have rich business men from other rich countries selling them weapons making it worse.
2. You didnt have to pay a massive debt that was so bad that you still ahve to pay it today.
3. America does not have to deal with Economics that is unfair to them.

Im sick of tired of people saying stuff that we should help Africans because its a nice things to do. Europes is partially responsible for ****ing up Africa and therefore has some responsibility in making it better.

You realise Europe is pumping millions, and millions into Africa?

Originally posted by chillmeistergen
You realise Europe is pumping millions, and millions into Africa?

You do realsie that the debt that the third world has is due to Europe as well? If you hadnt givcen us the debt we wouldnt need you to pump billions of pound in the first place!!!!! What you think were ignoramuses who werent doing well and you came along and saved us??? WTF.

Hell I was watching a Canadian comedian called Glenn Wool and he stated "The english going around invading and colonsing people then they complain when Immigrants decide to follow them back."

You go around colonising people forcing them to convert to Chrisanity make black people feeel bad about being black massacring other people and its like you got to no resposnibility to help the third world. What the **** is going on here?????

Originally posted by Saxondale
I've been watching KMC GDF for sometime. I have been truly impressed by the high level debating that goes on here. So many truly intelligent people. I think you should put these skills to good use. I truly believe the great minds here capable of solving world issues (at least online). Let's start with the African AIDs pandemic. Please put your minds to this. How can we solve it?

If we can't solve it here in america.How can we solve it anywhere else?jm

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny

Yet, both lead to the same results...the beggar has nothing and will starve that day. In essence, they both did the same thing, because both thier actions lead to the same result. Holy power of Jesus, you are a moron, aren't you?

Okay, who is worse:

Let's say there is a village. There are 20 people in that village, the only 20 people in that village. A mass murderer comes and kills 10.

Now, there is a village of ten people. Two almost get killed by a falling meteor, but a woman saves them from it.


Who is worse in your opinion ? The mass murderer or the woman ? And why ?

Originally posted by chillmeistergen
You realise Europe is pumping millions, and millions into Africa?

...and "pumping" out billions. European countries, especially the U.K. has always had a strong "interest" in Africa and play dirty politics to control it's countries... America is guilty of this too.

Ask yourself this, Africa is arguably the wealthiest continent in terms of resources, they have bounties of gold and other precious minerals, enough diamonds to 'bling-bling' everyone, oil, lumber, natural gas, arable lands etc. etc. etc., why are they so poor though?

Originally posted by Robtard
...and "pumping" out billions. European countries, especially the U.K. has always had a strong "interest" in Africa and play dirty politics to control it's countries... America is guilty of this too.

Ask yourself this, Africa is arguably the wealthiest continent in terms of resources, they have bounties of gold and other precious minerals, enough diamonds to 'bling-bling' everyone, oil, lumber, natural gas, arable lands etc. etc. etc., why are they so poor though? They are not very intelligent?

N o, no, wait...they get ****ed in the ass by their own people?

Originally posted by Bardock42
They are not very intelligent?

N o, no, wait...they get ****ed in the ass by their own people?

No, I don't think they're stupid as a whole. Problem is corruption and their dirty/greedy leaders. It also seems like they're prone to violence (genocides, hacking off arms etc.); I think this is a cultural thing though.

Yes, they definitely "get ****ed in the ass by their own people", the Western countries help this, rely on this and exploit this though.

Originally posted by Bardock42
They are not very intelligent?

N o, no, wait...they get ****ed in the ass by their own people?

Did you see that bit??????? Didnt you see the point that if it wasnt for the Islamic civilization which Africa was a major part of Europeans wouldnt have been so developed. Its like you forgot important points and just choose to believe that African people are stupid.


Originally posted by Robtard
...and "pumping" out billions. European countries, especially the U.K. has always had a strong "interest" in Africa and play dirty politics to control it's countries... America is guilty of this too.



The fact of the matter is both UK and America are partially responsible for Africa being a mess. Yes Africans opress each other but that means Africans are partially to blame as well.....BUT since the Europe and America share part of the blame they have a duty to restore Africa.

Are you serious?

Originally posted by Alfheim

The fact of the matter is both UK and America are partially responsible for Africa being a mess. Yes Africans opress each other but that means Africans are partially to blame as well.....BUT since the Europe and America share part of the blame they have a duty to restore Africa.

Are you serious?

You basically said what I said, then asked me if I was serious... what?

African countries need to take the first steps, they need to stop hacking each other apart and they need to rise up and dispose of their corrupt leaders. The West won't really do a thing until Africa shows the world it can and wants to stabilize itself.