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Hmm what are your opinions.

Imo bane and nihilus are severely overrated and i believe DK has a bad habit of overpowering his characters

ROTS Palpatine.

Originally posted by Se7in
ROTS Palpatine.

Nothing overrated about him imo

^agreed^

I say hands down, its Marka Ragnos. That character is worshiped like Christ around here and we have no clue really of what he did while he was alive. But for some reason, fanboys think off the strength he had a 'scepter' he can go heads up with Luke.

Originally posted by Darth Scythe
^agreed^

I say hands down, its Marka Ragnos. That character is worshiped like Christ around here and we have no clue really of what he did while he was alive. But for some reason, fanboys think off the strength he had a 'scepter' he can go heads up with Luke.

You should have seen this place a year or so ago.

Yea it was pretty stupid here then. "oh well we don't know anything about him so he has to be the most powerful ever!" Shit like that.

I'd say Bane, Sion, and Nihilus.

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
Yea it was pretty stupid here then. "oh well we don't know anything about him so he has to be the most powerful ever!" Shit like that.


LOL!

I can only remember traces of stuff like that happening. Times like those if I could only reach through the screen and punch people....

I would say it has to be Sadow/Ragnos(Can't remember which is which lol). The one that is treated like a god, despite all he's done is thrown a brick at a guy's head.

pretty much any ancient sith, lol.

Pretty much any and all episode I, II and III characters. Empire, KOTOR era, and especially anything post-Empire is much better.

No, they are not, on the whole, PT is superior. There are others that would be considered very powerful in the PT era, like Nihilus, Revan, or Exar Kun, but on the whole PT is greater.

What's PT?

Sidious

Originally posted by caedusrulesall
What's PT? Ep. 1-3, stands for Prequel Trilogy.

Revan and Kun.

Kun seems to be placed right below Sidious and above the likes of Dooku/Vader for some reason, despite being nothing special in the grand scheme of things (i.e. combat skills - so what if he makes the first double bladed, intelligence and actual achievements not involving learning sith magic "completely".

His claim to fame seems to be related to hyperbole in the comics without substantial feats and a run down of his ds powers in the DSSB.

Revan is a mystery. He gets written down like a very generic hero template in Kotor 1 and suddenly he's the god. His biggest combat feat is beating down on a guy (Malak) who the game pretty much confirms is weaker than him. Everything else about him seems to be related to how he was a masterful strategist again without relevant feats (and now he's second to Thrawn in military strategy).

Everything about him is overrated, he just seems to be a walking template for hyperbole, and insubstantial verbal fellatio.

No one is saying these guys aren't powerful, but overrated they surely are.

Sidious? How so? And post ROTJ are all overpowered force gods...kinda lame.

At least they arent overrated unlike nihilus sion and bane

Revan is overrated. When speculation is being used over feats, you are overrated.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Revan is overrated. When speculation is being used over feats, you are overrated. Actually nihilus is overrated seeing that people claim feats he has never done before

Anybody from the PT. Whata shocking bunch of films.

Originally posted by Manslayer
Actually nihilus is overrated seeing that people claim feats he has never done before Like what? If you mean lifting the fleet, that is still debatable, and it can be understood to get confused by Tobin. Sion is also pretty overrated.

EDIT

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Like what? If you mean lifting the fleet, that is still debatable, and it can be understood to get confused by Tobin. Sion is also pretty overrated. Again he never lifted a fleet, its never proven. He was never there when nihilus dragged his ship out of the gravity well


If he did draw the sith interdictors out of the gravity well(Other ships in telos), they would surely show obvious exterior damage because those ships who got caught by the MSG were very very badly damaged or destroyed.

Now take a look at these:


This is what an undamaged sith interdictor looks like

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/7997/600pxkotorscreen098mr5.jpg

Here are the sith inderdictors along side the ravager which shows no damage at all :




http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/3119/ravexpai9.jpg


Heres some more

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Telos_mandshuttle.jpg

Originally posted by Manslayer
Again he never lifted a fleet, its never proven. He was never there when nihilus dragged his ship out of the gravity well


If he did draw the sith interdictors out of the gravity well(Other ships in telos), they would surely show obvious exterior damage because those ships who got caught by the MSG were very very badly damaged or destroyed.

Now take a look at these:


This is what an undamaged sith interdictor looks like

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/7997/600pxkotorscreen098mr5.jpg

Here are the sith inderdictors along side the ravager which shows no damage at all :




http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/3119/ravexpai9.jpg


Heres some more

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Telos_mandshuttle.jpg ...I wasn't debating for or against it, I was just saying, it would be more of a misunderstanding than overration.

Im just disproving the "nihilus can lift star fleets" bull shit when its never proven, Nikkolas and allankes came up with that ridiculous claim

Nikkolas is the only one overrating nihilus, i dont consider nihilus severely overrated, just a bit.

Bane and sion on the other hand are severely overrated

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
Sidious? How so?

Some stupid book said he was the most powerful force user in history, when he got his ass kicked by Mace, Yoda, Vader, and Luke

Darth Sidious greatly, Yoda, Luke and Jacen.

Originally posted by Blue_Hefner
Some stupid book said he was the most powerful force user in history, when he got his ass kicked by Mace, Yoda, Vader, and Luke

Luke never kicked sidious ass, nor did vader, nor did yoda for that matter as it was a stalemate.

And the mace windu fight? Vaapad gave him an advantage, so did his shatterpoint, so did sidious not using the lightsaber or force powers for 13 years

Originally posted by Blue_Hefner
Some stupid book said he was the most powerful force user in history, when he got his ass kicked by Mace, Yoda, Vader, and Luke

Excuse me?

First, no book ever declared Sidious to be the most powerful Force user in history, and he's not.

Second, Yoda never kicked his ass. It was a stalemate at best. Mace? He was equipped with innate advantages against dark siders. Luke? Apparently, he was boosted by Leia's battle meditation and had assistance in separating Sidious from his Force Storm. Third, Vader never kicked Sidious's ass -- unless you're referring to him dropping him down a reactor shaft -- which wasn't so much of an ass kicking as it was a surprising move which, yeah, Vader ended up dying from as a result.

So the only person who gave him an "ass kicking" was Mace. If that even qualifies.

EDIT

Mis read your post

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Ep. 1-3, stands for Prequel Trilogy.

Thanks.
It's true though, a lot of characters such as Anakin Skywalker, Padme Amidala, Darth Maul and General Grievous get really overrated. Especially Maul.

Sion is very overrated. The only thing special his his invulnerability(which quite possibly requires him to be on a strong Dark Side planet) and he has proficient saber skills, that is it.

I wouldn't say that Grievous and Maul are overrated in fact i would say the opposite they are underrated at times.

Originally posted by caedusrulesall
Thanks.
It's true though, a lot of characters such as Anakin Skywalker, Padme Amidala, Darth Maul and General Grievous get really overrated. Especially Maul.

How so? If anything, Anakin is constantly underrated by people who personally don't like him. How can the Chosen One be overrated? Padme has nothing to be overrated about, Maul is and isn't - all depends on who's talking about him. He was called one of the most deadly sith apprentices ever, so that should say something for him.

GG to me was over-hyped, but what can you do.

But ancient Sith, Bane and all them...overrated. Same with the post ROTJ characters. Its easy to make someone Uber in a book without looking stupid like it would in a movie.

Yeah, who the f*ck overrated Padme?

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Yeah, who the f*ck overrated Padme?

A weak minded fool?

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
How so? If anything, Anakin is constantly underrated by people who personally don't like him. How can the Chosen One be overrated?

Quite easily. Because someone has the potential to be something great doesn't imply their power. Anakin should be the strongest person in the SW Universe, uncontested. However, there a many PT Era Jedi that can contend with him. Hell, at his peak, he's only what, 80% of Sidious? Just because he is the Chosen One implies only one thing, potential, not pure combat prowess or strength.

80% of Sidious is mech Vader's peak, Anakin had more raw power than that, it just wasn't refined to the point where it would be effective. Anakin was still able to do things that his "peers," should they be called that, couldn't. GL says that during the AOTC commentary when he jumps out of the speeder. His power in uncanny, and by ROTS, he could destroy virtually anyone around him when he's in his proper mind-state. If anything, people underrate him cause of his lack of patience as a teen and his loss to OB1 via blinding rage. Had he been in the same mental state as he was with Dooku, Ob1 wouldn't have left Mustafar.

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
80% of Sidious is mech Vader's peak, Anakin had more raw power than that, it just wasn't refined to the point where it would be effective. Anakin was still able to do things that his "peers," should they be called that, couldn't. GL says that during the AOTC commentary when he jumps out of the speeder. His power in uncanny, and by ROTS, he could destroy virtually anyone around him when he's in his proper mind-state. If anything, people underrate him cause of his lack of patience as a teen and his loss to OB1 via blinding rage. Had he been in the same mental state as he was with Dooku, Ob1 wouldn't have left Mustafar.

While you are true about Anakin limiting himself with his emotions, you can't forget that it is a character trait within him. He always lets his emotions fuel his actions, and it can result in victory, like his duel with Dooku, or his defeat, like his duel with Obi-Wan. It's funny how people always say that Anakin would have one again Obi-Wan had he not had emotion, yet he won using his emotion against Dooku. It's a double-edged sword for him.

Uh....how is Bane overrated? I've never heard anybody say any ridiculous statements about him; the eradication of the Brotherhood of Darkness and the Army of Light wasn't luck, it was masterstroke. He also gained greater insight into the ways of the Force through his studies and his actions. Am I overrating him by saying that?

I have to say, IMO, from an in-universe perspective, wouldn't it make sense for half of these characters to be overrated in some way? Thousands of years, billions of people, millions of stars....legends, both from true and dubious sources, are bound to crop up and cloud the truth of the matter.

If anything, instead of Revan-hating or the like, I think the one thing that people should be clamouring against would be the entire Legacy storyline. WTF? It renders the entire saga completely pointless.

I don't think Bane, Nilhius and Revan are overated because we don't know...there are just as many people willing to say they did many things as there are dening it.

however, i don't think Bane knew everything about the force and i don't thing Revan was anything as good as someone like Vader. but it's ridiculous to say that Nilihus was a bad swordsman or that any of these were weak.

simply because i don't think your right, ...if someone talked to you and you and told me their opinion it doesn't make it right...If i said it's right it doesn't make it right...and just cus 2 people say it's right (if you remember your rights and wrongs) it doesn't make someone else wrong.

formula: right + right (not =) wrong

i'm only telling you this because on the expanded univere forum all they do is say things and have people agree with them but it's not true...i just don't get why you guys fight when there is no answer....

Originally posted by Manslayer
Well bane is powerful to be honest but what i dislike is the "bane is more powerful than the entire BOD" when the BOD are utter weaklings and people try to use that to dispute he is greater than vader, sidious and the movie stars

Alright, I see what you mean.

Still, I don't see the point in trying to compare people's ability/affinity with the Force, because I've seen far too many real-world examples of people toppled by those "weaker" than them to question the possibility that it could happen to anyone.

Originally posted by Darth Sparrow
I don't think Bane, Nilhius and Revan are overated because we don't know...there are just as many people willing to say they did many things as there are dening it.

however, i don't think Bane knew everything about the force and i don't thing Revan was anything as good as someone like Vader. but it's ridiculous to say that Nilihus was a bad swordsman or that any of these were weak.

simply because i don't think your right, ...if someone talked to you and you and told me their opinion it doesn't make it right...If i said it's right it doesn't make it right...and just cus 2 people say it's right (if you remember your rights and wrongs) it doesn't make someone else wrong.

formula: right + right (not =) wrong

i'm only telling you this because on the expanded univere forum all they do is say things and have people agree with them but it's not true...i just don't get why you guys fight when there is no answer....

Certainly Bane didn't know everything there is to know about the Force; he simply understood the facets of it which applied to himself more than his peers.

Originally posted by Darth Sparrow
I don't think Bane, Nilhius and Revan are overated because we don't know...there are just as many people willing to say they did many things as there are dening it.

The thing is nihilus is overrated because he performs one feat and people whorship him like a god, the same used to go for ragnos, people dubbed him the most powerful sith lord when he has not even done anything yet.

Maul= most overrated character ever.

^how do you figure?

Because he can apparently solo TPM Jedi Council and is will somehow "Give Rots Obi-Wan a run for his money" simply because he beat Anoon. Anoon's no slouch but c'mon.. aiside from that his best feat is defeating Qui-gon and being bested by Padawan Kenobi in lightsaber combat.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Because he can apparently solo TPM Jedi Council and is will somehow "Give Rots Obi-Wan a run for his money" simply because he beat Anoon. Anoon's no slouch but c'mon.. aiside from that his best feat is defeating Qui-gon and being bested by Padawan Kenobi in lightsaber combat.

Maul gives ROTS Obi Wan a run for his money. The only reason he even loses to Obi Wan in the first place is arrogance. Maul was actually the superior duelist in TPM. Second, ROTS Obi Wan has become a completely different fighter, more powerful but also less offensive minded.

And as far as the council goes, with the exception of Mace and Yoda, Maul probably has the beating of the TPM council.

Revan can be pretty overrated. Not by really people on this forum, but on other sites, he is greatly overrated.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Revan can be pretty overrated. Not by really people on this forum, but on other sites, he is greatly overrated.
That is probably thing the aggravates me the most is the kotor fanbiys who say revan is god.

Originally posted by Darth Hord
That is probably thing the aggravates me the most is the kotor fanbiys who say revan is god. Yeah lol.

Most overrated person is Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Yeah, the guy who killed Darth Maul and General Grevious, defeated Anakin Skywalker, Durge, and A'sharad Hett in one on one combat is so overrated.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Revan can be pretty overrated. Not by really people on this forum, but on other sites, he is greatly overrated.

Bullshit, of what I seen, Revan is underrated.

HANDS DOWN DE EMPEROR PALPATINE!

Originally posted by Darth Scythe
Yeah, the guy who killed Darth Maul and General Grevious, defeated Anakin Skywalker, Durge, and A'sharad Hett in one on one combat is so overrated. Yea...he got lucky with Maul and Anakin, and he's lucky there just happened to be a blaster there with GG and he's lucky that GG didn't just pull him apart instead of throwing him.

And didn't Anakin kill Durge?

Anakin killed durge but im sure kenobi defeated him in a duel.

And as far as revan goes i can understand how he can be both overrated and underrated. He can be over by fanboys who say he is god and he can defeat anyone or virtually anyone (cep. sids. and luke) But I do think he can be underrated at times and in particular his saber skills because even though they are an unknown it is very doubtful he could win against a powerful opponent like malak without using his saber. (Have u ever seen more than a few all out duels when a lightsaber is not used at all between a jedi and sith?)

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
Yea...he got lucky with Maul and Anakin, and he's lucky there just happened to be a blaster there with GG and he's lucky that GG didn't just pull him apart instead of throwing him.

And didn't Anakin kill Durge?

Notice I said defeated, not killed.

But 3 wins being chalked up to luck? I guess he got lucky he had his lightsaber to cut off Hett's arm too huh.

Originally posted by ThoraxeRMG
Bullshit, of what I seen, Revan is underrated. When people are claiming you TK skyscrapers,you know you are being overrated.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
When people are claiming you TK skyscrapers,you know you are being overrated.

what kind of moron said that?

Originally posted by Darth Scythe
Notice I said defeated, not killed.

But 3 wins being chalked up to luck? I guess he got lucky he had his lightsaber to cut off Hett's arm too huh.

Notice i said the others, not Hett.

And yes, luck. Hence the irony of, "In my experience there's no such thing as luck." That was part of Lucas' intent...same with the other "running joke" of everyone losing their sabers.

EDIT:
And in someone like Durge's case who can't just be killed like normal, he's not defeated unless killed.

Originally posted by ThoraxeRMG
Bullshit, of what I seen, Revan is underrated.

Wishful thinking.

Revan's status as the world's most popular Gary-Stu notwithstanding, I'd say the majority here (with the exceptions of those such as LeGenD and apparently yourself) have a fair perception of Revan's powers.

Was he an upper tier Sith Lord? Most certainly. One of the most powerful ever.

Was he a great Sith Lord? Personally, I'd give him top three in that category. Bane and Sidious are his only competition, though -- to be fair -- Sidious outstrips every Sith Lord by a great deal in accomplishments.

Was he a brilliant tactition? Yes. But LeGenD's BS like "he's second only to Thrawn!1!" is unfounded.

All in all, Revan's a major powerhouse. Sadly, there are people who are smarter than him (Sidious, Thrawn, Zaarin, ect.), people who are more powerful than him (Luke, Sidious, Yoda, probably Ragnos, ect), people who are greater than him (Luke, Sidious, Leia, Thrawn, ect), and so forth.

He's hardly the best.

Hmm... I don't know, I think Nihilus is kinda overrated..

I don't see why people say Bane is very overrated.

Btw, I agree with you completely, Gideon.

Originally posted by Gideon
Wishful thinking.

Revan's status as the world's most popular Gary-Stu notwithstanding, I'd say the majority here (with the exceptions of those such as LeGenD and apparently yourself) have a fair perception of Revan's powers.

Was he an upper tier Sith Lord? Most certainly. One of the most powerful ever.

Was he a great Sith Lord? Personally, I'd give him top three in that category. Bane and Sidious are his only competition, though -- to be fair -- Sidious outstrips every Sith Lord by a great deal in accomplishments.

Was he a brilliant tactition? Yes. But LeGenD's BS like "he's second only to Thrawn!1!" is unfounded.

All in all, Revan's a major powerhouse. Sadly, there are people who are smarter than him (Sidious, Thrawn, Zaarin, ect.), people who are more powerful than him (Luke, Sidious, Yoda, probably Ragnos, ect), people who are greater than him (Luke, Sidious, Leia, Thrawn, ect), and so forth.

He's hardly the best.

That's quite reasonable. I concur.

Originally posted by Gideon
people who are more powerful than him (Luke, Sidious, Yoda, probably Ragnos, ect)
How is Ragnos more powerful then Revan?

Provide some good and convincing reasons please!

Originally posted by Gideon
people who are greater than him (Luke, Sidious, Leia, Thrawn, ect), and so forth.

He's hardly the best.
How is Leia greater then Revan?

Again provide some convincing reasons.

That is irrelevant, Legend. The point Gideon is explaining you that there ARE people who are undoubtedly better than Revan, on every case.

He said "probably" Ragnos, meaning its uncertain.

Didnt KJA say somewhere that kun is stronger than ragnos?
(Not saying its true at all, i cant remember where i heard this but i cant confirm it)


But personally i think revan and exar kun are pretty much equals in terms of power, BOD certainly seems to make it so


But in terms of overration, other websites and youtube etc severely overrate revan claiming he is more uber and powerful than luke,
Legend here doesnt super overrate him if you compare it to other sites.

Lucasforums used to be one place but now i made sure they didnt happen, so they know its sidious and luke > revan

Obi Wan messed up Durge so bad on Muunlist that he had to make a hasty retreat. So he's definitely defeated him.

See this is where I think Revan is overrated. I also think Bane is too. Why should Revan be ranked right below Bane and Sidious when he never did anything as a Sith? Overall Revan was at his best as a Jedi, but as a Sith he's below the likes of Vader, Dooku etc

Well i just finished that young adult novel "rise and fall of darth vader".

It was stated that vader studied ancient sith holocrons in his castle in vjun and doesnt studying that make you more powerful as it did to palpatine according to the visual guide?

I think people should stop disrespecting and underrating vader and dooku

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
Yea...he got lucky with Maul and Anakin, and he's lucky there just happened to be a blaster there with GG and he's lucky that GG didn't just pull him apart instead of throwing him.

Put your sources in context.

Like clockwork. This is becoming so predictable that it's kind've sad. Regardless, this isn't the place to debate why Ragnos is better than Revan. If you want, make a thread. I'll be sure to PM Nai Fohl, who will probably be itching for such an argument.



If you insist: she (along with Mon Mothma) managed to form the galaxy-spanning government that eventually overthrew the most powerful military regime in galactic history, and saw the defeats of the Emperor Reborn, Grand Admiral Thrawn, the Yuuzhan Vong, and the Killiks.



I just did.

Originally posted by Allankles
Obi Wan messed up Durge so bad on Muunlist that he had to make a hasty retreat. So he's definitely defeated him.

See this is where I think Revan is overrated. I also think Bane is too. Why should Revan be ranked right below Bane and Sidious when he never did anything as a Sith? Overall Revan was at his best as a Jedi, but as a Sith he's below the likes of Vader, Dooku etc

If not for Revan, Bane wouldn't have gained the knowledge he needed in order to strengthen/reorganize the Sith Order.

I agree with that, Allankles, but I don't think Bane is one of the most overrated characters.