Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Judges: Nvr, Kurash, Illadelph, Smurf, and battlehammer.

Arena: LA, starts in front of Tri-Star studios. Combatents are 3-4 blocks apart.

Classic Apocalypse vs. Guardian I.

Apocalypse has all normal 616 feats and is assumed to be at his classic level of power.

Guardian I has all his normal feats and is the cyborg version.

Battle ends at 6PM Wed Oct 17 2007.

Game on.

Just to clarify I will be posting feats from Guardian II who is stated to be inferior to the upgraded Guardian I, but posting the scans to show the capabilities of Guardian I as her suit is based off of his original design. So what you see her doing, amplify it and then you have James Hudson.

Offense Introduction
No need to make extensive battle plans or extensive prep as Guardian just as is, is a force to be reckoned with. Guardian with his complete and utter control of the electromagnetic spectrum a spectrum is utmost dangerous, as Apoc is a part of it. It doesn’t take him long to pinpoint a wavelength, but once he accesses the wavelength of say Apoc mind he can simply control and override it as he can with ALL electromagnetic frequencies. Below Guardian shows he can pinpoint a persons frequency and even shut their brains down. Heather shows she can take energy attacks sent at her and send them back stronger at the opponent. Plus Guardian schools Dr.Doom and Galactus so effortlessly Apoc doesn’t have much of a chance.

Also while Mac tries to pinpoint the frequency he can deliver EXTENSIVE amount of damage with his E-M blasts. These powerful blasts have killed Snowbird in Sasquatch form with one blow, rendered a weakened Galactus useless, and incinerated a car instantly. Apoc does have excellent durability, but against this firepower? Not a chance, he would be left a puddle of goo and yes Apoc has healed from said goo in the past, but Guardian can keep doing this till the cows come home until he simply registered Apoc frequency and shuts him down for good. If things are not going Guardian’s way, which they should he can simply use flares and powerful sonics to greatly disorient his opponent leaving them open for a barrage of attacks or time to lock on their frequency and shut them down.

Stamina? Power consumption could play a key role in this battle, but an issue that means little to Mac as classic Mac has shown to recharge his suit in seconds. So Mac could literally keep going indefinitely

Also there is no contest Mac is vastly superior in speed, via base level and using his “teleportation” trick that allows him to reach speeds faster then mach 33. The speed advantage is quite large, sure Apoc tagged classic Quicksilver, but QS can’t hold a candle to the speed of Guardian. Below are scans of Mac and Heather using their speed not simply for traveling, but using their speed in combat situations.

Summary:
-Mac can pinpoint Apoc wavelength and simply shut him down
-Mac has blasts that have killed beings with Sasquatch durability and defeated a weakened Galactus with a single attack
-Mac has an indefinite stamina supply, where he can recharge his suit even when it’s depleted in seconds.
-Mac has superior speed, which he can use to avoid all of Apoc attacks, while he can deliver continuous attacks uninterrupted thanks to his computer mind reflexes.

Offense
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #113 (Vol.1)
Screens of Heather Hudson’s weaponry system

Weapon Systems: Electromagnetic Projectors, Down Beam Pulse, Flare, Ultrasound Beam, Graviton Beam, Concussion Wave, Dispersal Beam

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-12.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Wavelength Manipulation
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #100 (Vol.1) or Alpha Flight Special - 4/4: Galactus
Guardian has sent half of the heroes to the Quwrlin homeworld in order to battle Galactus. Galactus was indeed weakened, but what is interesting to note Guardian tool Galactus down in one shot when the combined might of Guardian II, Her, Quasar, Windshear, BOX IV, Hercules, Vision and Sersi couldn’t

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-25.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-26.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-27.jpg
4. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-28.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #100 (Vol.1) or Alpha Flight Special - 4/4
After Galactus was defeated he decided to make a deal, but required both Guardian and Vindicator to sacrifice their lives to do it and in turn save billions of lives on Qurlln and on Earth. As only they can achieve the frequency that is required to power Galactus’ technology. Where Her, Quasar, Sersi, BOX IV, etc. couldn’t

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-31.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-33.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-34.jpg
4. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-35.jpg
5. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-36.jpg
6. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-37.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #93 (Vol.1)
Mac sending out a wide-spread EM field that disrupts the people's neural functions making them immobile

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/alpha_flight_93_Mac.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #94 (Vol.1)
Since Mac has a computer mind it makes it damn near impossible for anyone to use telepathic attacks on him, the more he becomes machine the less the attacks will work. Here he blocks Headlok's control over Alpha Flight the Fantastic Four and frees a town under his manipulation

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-17.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-20.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #91 (Vol.1):
Cyborg Guardian takes on Latverian Liberation Front that were sent to kill Dr.Doom. Guardian easily manipulates the Freedom Fighters armor as if it was a part of him

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlightv191-04.jpg-- ---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #96 (Vol.1) or Alpha Flight: Special #1/4
Heather and Cyborg James are shown sending out an EMP on Consortium’s shields disrupting their power

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AFS-18.jpg
-------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #121 (Vol.1)
Guardian gets hit by Klaw's sound attacks, but she absorbs it and sends it back amplified even taking Klaw out

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight121-17.jpg
2. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight121-18.jpg
3. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight121-19.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #91 (Vol.1):
Ordered to protect Doom as Latveria and Canada are in trade discussions the L.L.F try again with their assassination attempt. Mac senses Doom is responsible for the soliders death and steps in registered all the frequencies and shuts Doom’s shield instantly

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlightv191-18.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlightv191-19.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlightv191-20.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Energy Blasts
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #100 (Vol.1) or Alpha Flight Special - 4/4: Galactus
Guardian has sent half of the heroes to the Quwrlin homeworld in order to battle Galactus. Galactus was indeed weakened, but what is interesting to note Guardian tool Galactus down in one shot when the combined might of Guardian II, Her, Quasar, Windshear, BOX IV, Hercules, Vision and Sersi couldn’t

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-25.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-26.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-27.jpg
4. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-28.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #1 (Vol.1)
Battling the Elder God, Tundra. Alpha Flight has 20 minutes to stop him or they will never stop him as noted by Snowbird. Vindicator (classic James) sends forth an energy blast that reels Tundra and in turn nearly destroys Canada

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AlphaFlight01-29.jpg
----------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #120 (Vol.1):
Heather lets lose a powerful blasts that incorporated all her battle systems into one attack. That's Electromagnetic projectors, Down beam pulse, Flare, Ultrasound beam, Graviton beam, Concussion wave, and a Dispersal beam all into one lethal attack

1. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f130/A_Flight7/AlphaFlight120-18.jpg
2. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f130/A_Flight7/AlphaFlight120-19.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #103 (Vol.1)
Guardian II destroys Diablo's earth elemental summons with a single blast

1. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight103-10.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Marvel Two-In-One #84
Battling the would-be God, Ranark the Ravanger. Vindicator (classic James) lets out a blast that even staggered him.

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Two-in-One084_11.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Uncanny X-Men #140
Mac (classic James) shows the power of his suit incinerating a car thrown out him in seconds

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/uxm140pg09.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #42 (Vol.1)
Heather uses a plasma burst that is so strong it killed Snowbird while in Sasquatch form

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlight44-20.jpg
2. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlight44-21.jpg
3. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlight44-22.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #100 (Vol.1)
Heather shows the force of her blasts redirecting over 100 ton spaceship from a floating rock.

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight58-10.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight58-11.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight58-12.jpg

Offense
---------------------------------------------
Disorientation Attacks
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #113 (Vol.1):
Here Heather is using a flashbang to blind Mauler, a Iron Man villain

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-13.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #127 (Vol.1):
Heather using her sonics on Wonder Man and their so effective she stops to prevent major damage.

1. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/AlphaFlight127-08.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #113 (Vol.1):
Here Heather is using sonics on the Iron Man villain Mauler with great success

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-13.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Stamina
---------------------------------------------
Marvel Two-In-One #84
Battling the would-be God, Ranark the Ravanger. Guardian (pre-upgrade) lets out a blast that even hurts Ranark and his suit recharges in seconds.

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Two-in-One084_11.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Speed
---------------------------------------------
Marvel Two-In-One #84
Here Mac uses his speed to shunt away from Ranark’s attack with no damage what’s so ever. This method can be used to avoid all of his opponents attack. With this "shunt" Mac reaches up 18.5 miles per second. Escape velocity is 7 miles per second.

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Two-in-One084_21.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Two-in-One084_22.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #90 (Vol.1)
Heather using her teleportation trick inside to defeat the powerful Witchfire.

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Alpha_Flight_v1_090_03.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #113
Here Heather speedblitzes Mauler an Iron Man villain who was said to even be faster then Iron Man himself. Yet she keeps easily catching up to him and this was an inexperienced Heather at the time to.

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-07.jpg
2. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-10.jpg
3. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-17.jpg
4. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-18.jpg
5. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-19.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #88 (Vol.1)
Mac shows his superior reflexes thanks to his computer mind that reacts with computer like speed

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Alpha_Flight_v1_088_09.jpg

Defense Introduction
What would Apoc even do to Mac? The Guardian shields have proven themselves time after time to be one of the best in the Marvel universe. They have withstood a nuke, combined attacks from Witchfire, Shaman, Human Torch, Windshear and Guardian II, etc. Apoc has no means of breaking through the shields where many have failed.

Cloaking perhaps? Won’t work either due to Guardian’s multiple sensors, which has enabled him to see cloak opponents multiple times.

Well before you try to use Apoc ability to use telepathy, think again. Thanks to Mac being basically a computer it’s practically impossible to attack his mind, and if you attack his human side of his mind the computer side takes over

Also attempting to battle field remove Guardian would fail. Below not even Nightcrawler can accomplish it on Heather Hudson, while Mac below he shows he can teleport multiple people to a different dimension instantly.

Summary:
-Mac has an impenetrable forcefield that have withstood far more then what Apoc can dish out.
-Apoc can’t use a cloaking device to hide as Mac can see him.
-Mac can’t be mind attacked
-Mac can’t be battle field removed

Defense
---------------------------------------------
Durability
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #65 : Guardian (Heahter)
Hunter seeker missiles can't penetrate Heather's shield

1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight65-19.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #20 (Vol.2)
At the Hellpounder, which is an atomic incinerator at Devil’s Bay. It’s used in theory that dangerous goods could be dropped into an extremely deep, earth drilled core tube and disposed of by a chasing nuclear detonation. Both Mac and James (clone) create a E-M shield covering the entire Hellpounder after a nuclear explosion goes off. Guardian I does most of the work as Guardian III never had the cybernetic augmentation.

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlightv220-AlphaOmega03-18.jpg
2. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlightv220-AlphaOmega03-19.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #34 (Vol.1)
After James apparently died , Heather took up the mantle and went to Wolverine to train her to be a hero. She hasn't fully learned how to control the suit, but her shield is strong enough to break Deathstike's sword, which was giving Wolverine’s, claws a hard time.

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-17.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-18.jpg
3. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-19.jpg
4. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-20.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #94 (Vol.1)
Knowing the best way to stop Headlok is to activate Mac's computer mind, so Vindicator, Windshear, Human Torch, Shaman and Witchfire all attack him at once and all it did was activate his computer mind

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-15.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-16.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-17.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Sensors
There’s no where Apoc can hide with all the sensors and abilities Guardian has. Also with these sensors it won’t take long what’s so ever to pin point Apoc frequency and shut him down
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #113 (Vol.1)
Screens of what Heather Hudson such as her tracking systems: Radar, Sonar, Infrared, Computer Projection, Energy Patterns, Vapor Trail

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight113-09.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #96 (Vol.1) or Alpha Flight: Special #1/4
Cyborg Guardian shows he can see cloaked objects by seeing the wavelength it’s hidden under

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AFS-21.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AFS-22.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #91 (Vol.1):
Ordered to protect Doom as Latveria and Canada are in trade discussions the Latverian Liberation Front try again with their assassination attempt. Once again Guardian sees cloaked objects.

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlightv191-15.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Telepathic Resistance
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #94 (Vol.1)
Since Mac has a computer mind it makes it damn near impossible for anyone to use telepathic attacks on him, the more he becomes machine the less the attacks will work. Here he blocks Headlok's control over Alpha Flight the Fantastic Four and frees a town under his manipulation

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-17.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-20.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Battle Field Removal
---------------------------------------------
Alpha Flight #33 (Vol.1)
Here Nightcrawler fails to teleport Heather and causes him great pain in doing so.
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/A-F33-09.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/A-F33-10.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Here Mac activates his computer mind and teleports Sersi, Windshear, Quasar, Hercules, Guardian (Heather), Vision, and Box v.4 all against their will instantly into another dimension

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight99-19.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight99-21.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight99-22.jpg
4. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight99-23.jpg

AAAAHHHHH!!!!! TOO MUCH CONTENT! Can you not make all your posts essays btw?

Let's start with the vast superiority of Apoc's durability. Yes, he healed from goo, in a weakened state. He was so weak, his body was falling apart.

An extremely weakened Apocalypse (bones breaking with every step, falling apart, flesh rending, etc.) beats 6 X-Men in under 60 seconds

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen1.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen2.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen3.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen4.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen5.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen6.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen7.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen8.jpg

so don't try to say that was a fair showing.

Here's his fight with the HE.

Apocalypse looked to have the edge in this fight, and against a (sub) skyfather level HE, though he did not beat him. High Evolutionary is one who has fought a constantly evolving Immortal Hercules and the Avengers singlehandedly.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers1.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers24.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe25.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe26.png


'Ike Harris' aka Prime Eternal Ikaris.


Apocalypse defeats or has the definitive upper hand against Ikaris in a fight, even stating he could kill him (likely sub-atomic dispersal over a very wide area for a Prime Eternal). Does severely injure Ikaris with some sort of spike, which had to be more than a physical attack to do that to him. Ikaris also fell to Earth unconscious.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph3.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph4.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph5.png

Can you do more damage than Blackbolt? Or X-Factor, the Inhumans, Askani/Rachael Summers, and Charlotte Jones w/big tech gun, all at the same time?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers4.png

Now, onto energy powers.

Living Monolith? Pshh, taste Apoc's pimp cane.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/Jyppe/apocalypseowns.jpg

While weakened, he drains Cyclops dry of energy.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers6.png

Bit of energy control.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/oneshootsenergy.png

Apocalypse controlled his celestial tech ship by controlling it's particles.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocslave.png

Apoc redirecting Storm and Havoc's blast, while amping it back at them.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/Jyppe/apocstorm2.jpg

So Apocalpyse has options.

One of which you yourself gave me. Technopathy.

Originally posted by Bad Ash231
Apocalypse morphs his hand to interact with Celestial tech.

http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/3019/apocinteractcelestialey4.th.jpg

Originally posted by Bad Ash231
Apocalypse can adapt his molecular structure to any adversity.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocadaptmolcularstructure.png

Cable confirming that he has the same virus as Apoc and that Apocalypse can regen himself from a single drop of blood.
Originally posted by Bad Ash231
Apocalypse is capable of regenerating his entire body from a drop of blood and surrounding matter.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocbloodremanin.png

Apocalypse can create materials and alloys out of his body, and he's altered adamantium and encountered it before. He took Sabertooth's adamantium and gave it back to Wolverine when he made him into his Death horseman.

A weakened Apocalypse (As he was during the entire Apocalypse vs. Dracula mini-series) vs. one of his most powerful descendants who was also turned into a vampire (increasing his power).

http://images6.theimagehosting.com/X-MenApocalypsevsDracula3-008.jpg
http://images6.theimagehosting.com/X-MenApocalypsevsDracula3-009.jpg
http://images6.theimagehosting.com/X-MenApocalypsevsDracula3-010.jpg

Note the gun he forms and that the gun expels bullets. Bullets formed from his own body.

Oh yes, I forgot. During X-ecutioner's song, he cured Xavier of the TO virus and controlled it easily. So what's stopping him from using it on Mac?

You have no defense against technopathy, and if you think your canadian tech can counter celestial technology, then you are nuts.

Your move.

Counterpost
Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Let's start with the vast superiority of Apoc's durability. Yes, he healed from goo, in a weakened state. He was so weak, his body was falling apart.

An extremely weakened Apocalypse (bones breaking with every step, falling apart, flesh rending, etc.) beats 6 X-Men in under 60 seconds

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen1.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen2.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen3.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen4.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen5.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen6.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen7.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/Derek9012/apocvsxmen8.jpg

so don't try to say that was a fair showing.

*snickers* Not a great showing here, as Mac could literally send out an E-M field instantly disrupting their neural patterns taking out all the X-Men, which he can defiently do to Apoc

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/alpha_flight_93_Mac.jpg

I was talking about his healing factor in general not how he got like that. Not like it matters as there is no way for Apoc to stop Mac from shutting him down.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Here's his fight with the HE.

Apocalypse looked to have the edge in this fight, and against a (sub) skyfather level HE, though he did not beat him. High Evolutionary is one who has fought a constantly evolving Immortal Hercules and the Avengers singlehandedly.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers1.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers24.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe25.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe26.png

and where or where did HE show any level of subskyfather power here? Because if that's subskyfather I guess that means Guardian is above taking down Galactus and all. Hell here is Heather defeating two Elder Gods . I guess Guardian is skyfather after all

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight55-14.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight55-15.jpg

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

'Ike Harris' aka Prime Eternal Ikaris.

Apocalypse defeats or has the definitive upper hand against Ikaris in a fight, even stating he could kill him (likely sub-atomic dispersal over a very wide area for a Prime Eternal). Does severely injure Ikaris with some sort of spike, which had to be more than a physical attack to do that to him. Ikaris also fell to Earth unconscious.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph3.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph4.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph5.png

and how oh how does that even come close to realating to Guardian? He isn't a melee fighter so he won't charge at him, and he has insanely durable shields. Shields Apoc would not get through.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Can you do more damage than Blackbolt? Or X-Factor, the Inhumans, Askani/Rachael Summers, and Charlotte Jones w/big tech gun, all at the same time?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers4.png

and how do we know how strong Blackbolt's scream was here? Considering the surrounding area wasn't effected I'm not to concerned. While Mac has shown to take a nuke and cover an entire building to protect from the nuke

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlightv220-AlphaOmega03-19.jpg
Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Now, onto energy powers.

Living Monolith? Pshh, taste Apoc's pimp cane.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/Jyppe/apocalypseowns.jpg

and? Apoc made Monolith so I don’t see how that’s impressive.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

While weakened, he drains Cyclops dry of energy.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers6.png

Meh again, this was pre-upgrade Cyclops who has an unlimited supply. Back in those days Cyclops tired himself out frequently. While Mac has an indefinite amount of stamina. Also Guardian > Cyclops

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Bit of energy control.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/oneshootsenergy.png

*scratches his head* That’s it? Mac has complete and utter control over the E-M spectrum. Has anyone else ever did this to Doom? Nope.

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlightv191-19.jpg

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Apocalypse controlled his celestial tech ship by controlling it's particles.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocslave.png

*psst* Apoc doesn’t have his ship here.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Apoc redirecting Storm and Havoc's blast, while amping it back at them. http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/Jyppe/apocstorm2.jpg

Meh again, have you seen anyone do this to Klaw? And those attacks wouldn’t even phaze Guardian

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight121-17.jpg
2. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight121-18.jpg
3. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight121-19.jpg
Originally posted by TricksterPriest

So Apocalpyse has options.

Not really if those blasts have defeated Galactus, why would Apoc be safe. Also your going by the assumption Mac only can with through melee, which he doesn’t even need to or is it a focal point of him winning here. He would access Apoc wavelength and shut him down, he has no defense against that. He doesn’t even have to touch him to that. Here Mac disrupts Headlok’s entire control and preventing him from using his telepathy again

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-17.jpg

Counterpost
Originally posted by TricksterPriest

One of which you yourself gave me. Technopathy.

*snickers* and how is Apoc going to use that to win? When Madison Jeffries tried and failed horribly

1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight87-18.jpg
2. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight87-19.jpg

Hell here is classic Mac instantly tapping into a Plodex ship and taking control, where years later the combined genius of Hank Pym, Tony Stark, Stingray and Black Knight only were able to tap into a small part of it’s power. You think Mac is an ameateur to technopathy? Not at all

1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/Avengersv352-CounterAttack-06-1.jpg
2. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f130/A_Flight7/AlphaFlight04-08.jpg
3. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f130/A_Flight7/AlphaFlight04-18.jpg

and here Mac easily taps into all of Roxxon's databases

1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight87-19.jpg

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Apocalypse morphs his hand to interact with Celestial tech.

*snickers* and that helps how?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Apocalypse can adapt his molecular structure to any adversity.

Fine and dandy, but he has never done that on the fly or like it matters as basically all Mac has do to is register his wavelength and shut him down for good not even needing to go melee.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Cable confirming that he has the same virus as Apoc and that Apocalypse can regen himself from a single drop of blood.

So? and while he heals fromt he drop of blood, which would be awhile so don't see how this is an advatnage Mac still can pinpoint his wavelength and shut him down, without cosntantly hitting him with a barrage of EM blasts

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Apocalypse can create materials and alloys out of his body, and he's altered adamantium and encountered it before. He took Sabertooth's adamantium and gave it back to Wolverine when he made him into his Death horseman.

Sure he can, but on the fly without his technology? Not at all. He doesn't have prep and it's not like Guardian is going to be standing still allowing him to do anything.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

A weakened Apocalypse (As he was during the entire Apocalypse vs. Dracula mini-series) vs. one of his most powerful descendants who was also turned into a vampire (increasing his power).

http://images6.theimagehosting.com/X-MenApocalypsevsDracula3-008.jpg
http://images6.theimagehosting.com/X-MenApocalypsevsDracula3-009.jpg
http://images6.theimagehosting.com/X-MenApocalypsevsDracula3-010.jpg

Oh my your not actually comparing a vampire with Guardian are you? Guardian is faster, stronger, more durability, has more abilities, etc, etc. etc. If anything this hurts your case if a vampire could still do what he did to Apoc here.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Note the gun he forms and that the gun expels bullets. Bullets formed from his own body.

Ummm...so? This is Wolverine. Wolverine claws > Apoc bullets

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/guardian003.jpg

That's classic Mac too

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Oh yes, I forgot. During X-ecutioner's song, he cured Xavier of the TO virus and controlled it easily. So what's stopping him from using it on Mac?

Basically every ability Mac has via speed, power and durability. Not going to happen, especially since this isn't a virus Mac is the technology

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

You have no defense against technopathy, and if you think your canadian tech can counter celestial technology, then you are nuts.

Your move.

You would be false, if Madison Jeffries who is the ultimate technoparth failed against Mac, why would Apoc win with tech that doesn't have full abilities from the celestials, and Guardian was rebuilt to take on Galactus himself work?

1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight87-18.jpg
2. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight87-19.jpg
=====
Summary:
-You still have no way to stop Guardian from simply accessing Apoc frequency and shutting him down
-You still have no way to counter Guardian VAST speed advantage
-You still have no way to actually HARM Guardian thanks to his impenetrable shield
-Your only attack thus far, your technopathy tactic has been debunked.

So basically Guardian can zip around Apoc as long as he wants, taking no damage hitting him with a barrage of fire that rocked Galactus until he access his wavelength which won’t take long and simply shut him down for good.

Clarification
This section is to help clarify things for those who may be unfamiliar with certain aspects of Guardian’s power or the tactics in general

Q. How is Guardian built to fight Galactus with Canadian tech?
A. Well he isn’t using Canadian tech anymore, as it was the Qwrlln who rebuilt him to take on Galactus. They have spent thousands of years trying to find a way to fight Galactus and here is the history of what happened to Mac where he first met the Qwrlln. He first comes into contact with him by protecting Heather, Mac activates the full power of the suit traveling at speeds faster then light teleporting him thousands of years into the past

1. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AlphaFlight90-06.jpg
2. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AlphaFlight90-07.jpg
3. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AlphaFlight90-08.jpg
4. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AlphaFlight90-09.jpg
5. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AlphaFlight90-10.jpg

Q. How are you using the “teleportation trick” as a means of using it in a battle?
A. Simply, it’s being used for both offense and defense. With offense, Guardian can “teleport” around the room at speeds faster then Mach 33 hitting his target, while Apoc could do nothing. Below is a scan of Heather using the same tactic against the uber powerful Witchfire. Now for defense, Mac shows he can simply use the trick to avoid anything that potentially could cause him harm. The first batch of scans is pre-upgrade James.

Offense
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Alpha_Flight_v1_090_03.jpg

Defense
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Two-in-One084_21.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Two-in-One084_22.jpg

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-16.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-17.jpg

Q. Wavelength? Can Guardian really simply shut Apoc’s mind down?
A. Yes, Guardian has complete and utter control of the E-M spectrum since his upgrade and can control and override all electromagnetic frequencies. Apoc is not above the E-M spectrum, even his thought process is connected to the E-M spectrum. So can Mac shut down Apoc’s mind? Most definetly and in record time as shown below

Here he mentions his control over the E-M spectrum and disables Dr.Doom’s shield with no trouble
1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlightv191-19.jpg

Mac sending out a wide-spread EM field that disrupts the people's neural functions making them immobile

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/alpha_flight_93_Mac.jpg

Here Mac is so efficient with his control he frees people under the control of the powerful telepath Headlok and prevents him from taking over anyone else mind with no trouble

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-17.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-20.jpg

Q. Can Guardian’s E-M blasts hurt Apoc?
A. Yes, they can. They have hurt stronger people then Apoc from the Elder God Tundra to the would be God-Ranark

Tundra, and this is classic Guardian

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AlphaFlight01-29.jpg

Ranark, and this is classic Guardian

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Two-in-One084_11.jpg

One shot put down a weakened Galactus, when the combined might of Quasar, Windshear, Her, Vindicator II, BOX IV, Vision, Sersi, and Hercules failed to do so

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-25.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-26.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-27.jpg
4. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-28.jpg

Heather lets lose a powerful blasts that incorporated all her battle systems into one attack. That's Electromagnetic projectors, Down beam pulse, Flare, Ultrasound beam, Graviton beam, Concussion wave, and a Dispersal beam all into one lethal attack. To say the least Apoc would most definetly feel that

1. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f130/A_Flight7/AlphaFlight120-18.jpg
2. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f130/A_Flight7/AlphaFlight120-19.jpg

Q. Is Guardian’s shields impenetrable?
A. For the most part yes they are, their one of the strongest shields in the Marvel universe

Blocking Wolverine’s claw strikes
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/guardian003.jpg

Here Heather shows the strength of her shield, where it breaks Deathstike's sword, which was giving Wolverine’s claws a hard time.

1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-17.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-18.jpg
3. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-19.jpg
4. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AF34-20.jpg

Here Mac and Vindicator III create a shield around the Hellpounder to protect themselves from a nuke exploding

1. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlightv220-AlphaOmega03-18.jpg
2. http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f188/A_Flight5/AlphaFlightv220-AlphaOmega03-19.jpg

Knowing the best way to stop Headlok is to activate Mac's computer mind, so Vindicator, Windshear, Human Torch, Shaman and Witchfire all attack him at once and Vindicator commenting she is hitting him with everything she got and all it did was activate his computer mind

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-15.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-16.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight94-17.jpg

I'm not done yet. survialdurest Survival of the durest. This is my last stand.

Alright, so you think your wavelength manipulation can take Apoc out.

I'm going to disabuse you of that notion.


http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/6038/whatifvol2069stryfeapoceb0.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/9649/whatifvol2069stryfeapocob7.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/9963/whatifvol2069stryfeapocrh4.th.jpghttp://img507.imageshack.us/img507/4287/whatifvol2069stryfeapocgc3.th.jpg
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/3481/whatifvol2069stryfeapocmc1.th.jpghttp://img507.imageshack.us/img507/3716/whatifvol2069stryfeapockf1.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/8895/whatifvol2069stryfeapocpj6.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/3420/whatifvol2069stryfeapocqp0.th.jpg
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/5410/whatifvol2069stryfeapocep6.th.jpg

That's Stryfe, the Xmen, the dark riders, X-factor, and X-force.

All singlehandedly beat by Apocalypse.

I'm going to continue this over a few posts. I'm not done yet.

http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/1093/apocalypsevsdracula4005eo4.th.jpg


An entire tribe of N'garai demons, soloed by Apocalypse.

Hell, Mindless Hulk couldn't even kill one N'garai. And even after it was seemingly beaten, it got right back up.

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/116/ngarai1a3kjkx0.th.jpghttp://img223.imageshack.us/img223/571/ngarai1b5znim9.th.jpghttp://img223.imageshack.us/img223/9219/ngarai1c2glxf4.th.jpg
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/1289/ngarai1d1ollt2.th.jpghttp://img223.imageshack.us/img223/6659/ngarai1e5ywye4.th.jpghttp://img223.imageshack.us/img223/1771/ngarai1f6jdxc0.th.jpg

Ummm...what does any of that have to do to stop wavelength manipulation? If your posting random feats, I can do the same thing. Even your initial post really didn't counter anything, your just posting things which have no bearing here. Even the people who you think are impressive would do nothing to Guardian, so your basically back to square one.

All that doesn't even the least show he can stop wavelength manipulation, cope with his speed or even blasts that defeated a weakened Galactus, or his durability

I'm not done. That was just a warmup. I'll be back in an hour or so.

I just wanted to bump the thread with some good feats.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I'm not done yet. survialdurest Survival of the durest. This is my last stand.

Alright, so you think your wavelength manipulation can take Apoc out.

I'm going to disabuse you of that notion.


http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/6038/whatifvol2069stryfeapoceb0.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/9649/whatifvol2069stryfeapocob7.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/9963/whatifvol2069stryfeapocrh4.th.jpghttp://img507.imageshack.us/img507/4287/whatifvol2069stryfeapocgc3.th.jpg
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/3481/whatifvol2069stryfeapocmc1.th.jpghttp://img507.imageshack.us/img507/3716/whatifvol2069stryfeapockf1.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/8895/whatifvol2069stryfeapocpj6.th.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/3420/whatifvol2069stryfeapocqp0.th.jpg
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/5410/whatifvol2069stryfeapocep6.th.jpg

That's Stryfe, the Xmen, the dark riders, X-factor, and X-force.

All singlehandedly beat by Apocalypse.

I'm going to continue this over a few posts. I'm not done yet.

Wait a minute, that's a what if story. Why are you even using this? Like I said your back to square one.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I'm not done. That was just a warmup. I'll be back in an hour or so.

I just wanted to bump the thread with some good feats.

How are non-canon feats good? Me thinks you tried to slip something by here

or did you forget your own rules?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Apocalypse has all normal 616 feats and is assumed to be at his classic level of power.

Talked to Evil_ash. He says that one is canon. shrug

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Talked to Evil_ash. He says that one is canon. shrug

It's a what if story, regardless not like it helps you even here

"What if? Stryfe & Apocalypse Killled the X-Men"

I probably shouldn't post here (and I'm not aware where else I should)...

But Trickster...

Originally posted by Bad Ash231
It's all canon. duryes

Does the Dur smiley not mean anything to you?

And I outright stated, that it was from a What If story.

trick, that gunna really gunna way in my opinion and vote on this fight.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
trick, that gunna really gunna way in my opinion and vote on this fight.

*scratches his head* What?

the fact he tried to use a what if this match up really hurts my respect for him and will effect my vote.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
the fact he tried to use a what if this match up really hurts my respect for him and will effect my vote.

You should recuse yourself from the judging process then. You should vote on the evidence presented. If the opposing side rebuffs that evidence, then they did thier job. And the fact that tricks didn't know it wasn't admissable.

I vote me for new judge. lol

Oh crap sorry wrong thread.

I plead ignorance on that one.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
You should recuse yourself from the judging process then. You should vote on the evidence presented. If the opposing side rebuffs that evidence, then they did thier job. And the fact that tricks didn't know it wasn't admissable.

.............trick clearly new it was not cannon hell the person he asked put a dur after his statement...........


either way I will ignore it for the sake of the match.

I give my vote now as I have to head out to the gym. Good fight you two. But Mungi argued better. I saw places where trick should have called him, or feats that Apoc had that could back trick up, but he didn't use them and didn't call mungi on some things.
My vote is for Mungi. Since I know lil of each, Mungi provided the superior argument for his Toon.

Shit. One down, 4 to go.

For the record, the timetravel loop at the end of the story means it could be canon. Fact is, I wasn't sure. I apologize for using something of dubious canonicity. Mea culpa.

Ok.

apocalypse would not be affected by the wavelength manipulation.

Kang's ultra diode ray took out the F4 on it's weakest setting.

http://img83.imageshack.us/my.php?image=page321nt2.jpg

but, at full power, it only succeeds in awakening Apocalypse's full powers.

http://img95.imageshack.us/my.php?image=page412wj7.jpg

Now, why am I bringing this up? Simple. It showcases something that most writers forget about Apoc. He can adapt.

The TO virus from Sinister, adapted to and under his control.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocadaptmolcularstructure.png

A world-killing plague, designed to kill off the entire planet, re-engineered to target Apocalypse alone. It weakened Apocalypse, who was not at full power to begin with, but it couldn't kill him.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocsurviveworldplague.png

The nuclear radiation of Chernobyl, which almost nothing can survive prolonged exposure to. In this scan, two beings have evolved and adapted to survive the toxic conditions. The large earthworms found in the area (true story, there really are worms that have evolved to survive radiation).........and Apocalypse.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocybernoal.png

Apocalypse can track your movements better than you think.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe26.png

and you can't hide from him.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe27.png

And btw, you're not the only one with point to point teleportation. That was the HE that Apoc teleported, and here's a teleportation across the world.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocblowsup.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers18.png

And yes, that is Exodus being punked in the 2nd scan.

More fun to come in a bit.

Fight's over it's past 6, and anyways half of what you posted was pointless.

Maybe he's a different time zone?

Doesn't matter any....

Let 'im post his scans, does a couple of hours make a difference?

I thought it was 6PM my time? It's only 3:50 here.

In fact, I distinctly remember saying west coast time.

Originally posted by llagrok
Let 'im post his scans, does a couple of hours make a difference?

Yes, as I have said I don't have much time with work and mid-terms. I finished my posts in the time allowed while Trick even posted after the timelimit.

Honestly I know you like Apoc, but give it up

Mungi - does it matter? You already have one vote, with the next two, this match is yours.

Everyone can clearly see that much. And, like I said, timezones - maybe he's confused?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I thought it was 6PM my time? It's only 3:50 here.

In fact, I distinctly remember saying west coast time.

No, you said the starting time was your time but made no mention of timezone for the finish. I even said wed isn't good for me, so we started it early. I even made several mentions in the other thread.

Originally posted by Soljer
Mungi - does it matter? You already have one vote, with the next two, this match is yours.

Everyone can clearly see that much. And, like I said, timezones - maybe he's confused?

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Yes, as I have said I don't have much time with work and mid-terms. I finished my posts in the time allowed while Trick even posted after the timelimit.

Honestly I know you like Apoc, but give it up

I thought that both time constraints were ridiculous in Nvr's and Goober's match as well. Ending it on Wednesday is okay, but Wednesday 6 pm?

Originally posted by llagrok
I thought that both time constraints were ridiculous in Nvr's and Goober's match as well. Ending it on Wednesday is okay, but Wednesday 6 pm?

Actually I didn't agree to wed, I even said in the other thread tuesday as I wouldn't have time so we started early. We originally were going to start monday, but we ended up starting sunday as I said I wouldn't have much time.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Actually I didn't agree to wed, I even said in the other thread tuesday as I wouldn't have time so we started early.

Yeah, but I don't think TP thought you wanted to move the time-table, only start it a little earlier. Either way those are the rules I suppose, sorry for butting in.

Originally posted by llagrok
Yeah, but I don't think TP thought you wanted to move the time-table, only start it a little earlier. Either way those are the rules I suppose, sorry for butting in.

I even said it in the thread a few times I wanted tuesday.

Last post.

You talk about your weaponry. What's stopping me from absorbing your weapons?
http://img518.imageshack.us/my.php?image=apocabsorbunlimitedwg5.png

Or TK crushing you in a forcefield? Or just straight TK crushing you under a building?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/Apoccreateforcefield.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/palacerise.png

Again, you bring up Apoc's durability.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers4.png

Despite what some people would say, by looking at BB's expression and the soundwave coming out of his mouth, it's more than a whisper. It's a shout, if not a scream.

I'm brining up the Ikaris fight one more time, but this time I'm going to highlight something that was overlooked.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers4.png
Notice the hole in his body which he lets the beams pass through effortlessly.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph4.png
In this one, note that he causes damage to Ikaris that takes him awhile to recover from. Ikaris has reformed from atoms before, so in order to hurt him like that, Apocalypse had to damage his atomic structure. Finally, note in the last panel, that he dodges Ikaris's beams at pointblank range.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph5.png
And this is the conclusion of the fight.

So you've the power to beat Apocalypse a few times. But take the the majority from a being who can control his atomic structure and restructure it to his will, and has technology superior to your own? And not only that, but a being who has never been defeated at full power outside of a plot device?

I've made my case. Good fight Mungi, whichever way it goes.

Edit: For the record, I said Weds, several times. and I said west coast time. So enough of the time limit BS.

*sigh*

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
apocalypse would not be affected by the wavelength manipulation.

Kang's ultra diode ray took out the F4 on it's weakest setting.

http://img83.imageshack.us/my.php?image=page321nt2.jpg

but, at full power, it only succeeds in awakening Apocalypse's full powers.

http://img95.imageshack.us/my.php?image=page412wj7.jpg
Now, why am I bringing this up? Simple. It showcases something that most writers forget about Apoc. He can adapt.

and how does that stop him from having his wavelength manipulated? Ie. having his brain shut off. I hope your not implying Apoc wouldn't become stronger with his mind not working are you? Guardian is above Kang, far above and that isn't even Kang in his future armor either.

Sadly for Apoc so can Guardian, he can change his wavelength to whatever the other person has. Has Apoc adapt in a battle? No not at all. Who did Galactus trust to power his tech? Not Quasar, not Sersi, not BOX IV but Guardian. He alone can access the required wavelength so to say Apoc could adapt somehow beyond the E-M spectrum is faulty.

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-31.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-33.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-34.jpg
4. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-35.jpg
5. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-36.jpg
6. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-37.jpg


Originally posted by TricksterPriest

The TO virus from Sinister, adapted to and under his control.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocadaptmolcularstructure.png

Once again how does that even relate to what's happening here? and he had prep, which he doesn't have year or is someone useless here. So point?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

A world-killing plague, designed to kill off the entire planet, re-engineered to target Apocalypse alone. It weakened Apocalypse, who was not at full power to begin with, but it couldn't kill him.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocsurviveworldplague.png

Point again? Guardian doesn't have to kill Apoc to beat him no where was that ever claimed. It's like using the same logic Deadpool can't be knocked out as he is immortal..faulty.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

The nuclear radiation of Chernobyl, which almost nothing can survive prolonged exposure to. In this scan, two beings have evolved and adapted to survive the toxic conditions. The large earthworms found in the area (true story, there really are worms that have evolved to survive radiation).........and Apocalypse.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocybernoal.png

*snickers* Point again? honestly, your starting to talk crazy if you think this radiation where humans have survived somehow equals the combined might of the entire electro-magnetic spectrum.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Apocalypse can track your movements better than you think.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe26.png

Point? Guardian isn't going to go invisible so why would he care if he senses him?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

and you can't hide from him.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powe27.png

Point? Guardian doesn't have to hide or ever once was said he needed to.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

And btw, you're not the only one with point to point teleportation. That was the HE that Apoc teleported, and here's a teleportation across the world.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocblowsup.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers18.png

And yes, that is Exodus being punked in the 2nd scan.

More fun to come in a bit.

Point? There's a difference between combat teleportation and traveling teleportation. Which Guardian isn't even using here. The "teleportation trick" is Guardian moving so fast it seems like teleportation but really isn't. Regardless, even Guardian can register people teleporting as shown

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlightv191-20.jpg
=====
Summary
-Once again you havn't countered Guardian's speed
-Once again you havn't counter Guardian's shields
-Once again you havn't countered Guardian's E-M manipulation

*sigh Part 2*

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
You talk about your weaponry. What's stopping me from absorbing your weapons?
http://img518.imageshack.us/my.php?image=apocabsorbunlimitedwg5.png

How on Earth does that prove he could take over Guardian's weapons? Hell beings stronger then Apoc have failed to do so.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Or TK crushing you in a forcefield? Or just straight TK crushing you under a building?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/Apoccreateforcefield.png
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/palacerise.png

*snickers* and how are you going to get past his shields again? Which to this date have yet to make a plan to get through them. Also you do realize Guardian has his own form of TK ie. His graviton beam, so there goes that plan of attack.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

Again, you bring up Apoc's durability.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers4.png
Despite what some people would say, by looking at BB's expression and the soundwave coming out of his mouth, it's more than a whisper. It's a shout, if not a scream.

and this was already countered pages ago, and for the record Guardian has hurt people stronger then Apoc.

A shout/scream are you flippin kidding me? haha you must be as Apoc clearly wouldn't be around if it was a shout or scream as even Blackbolt made cosmic beings feel fear when he did it and their vastly superior to Apoc.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

I'm brining up the Ikaris fight one more time, but this time I'm going to highlight something that was overlooked.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/powers4.png
Notice the hole in his body which he lets the beams pass through effortlessly.


Good thing Guardian can made a wide-spread beam that is larger then Apoc is in the scan or simply just coat him with the energy like he does with Galactus

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight100-27.jpg

No way for Apoc to dodge something that coats you.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph4.png
In this one, note that he causes damage to Ikaris that takes him awhile to recover from. Ikaris has reformed from atoms before, so in order to hurt him like that, Apocalypse had to damage his atomic structure. Finally, note in the last panel, that he dodges Ikaris's beams at pointblank range.

No not at all, look at Sersi she has been hurt and didn't recover longer periods then that and they didn't hurt her atomic structure. In another incident Avengers #360, Vision attacks Sersi leaving her nearly for death. So really if you look at the big picture that's not impressive at all, when weaker people can do the exact same thing. She's a top Eternal just like Ikaris

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/apocmorph5.png
And this is the conclusion of the fight.

ooooook, and that proves what?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest

So you've the power to beat Apocalypse a few times. But take the the majority from a being who can control his atomic structure and restructure it to his will, and has technology superior to your own? And not only that, but a being who has never been defeated at full power outside of a plot device?


That's if you ignore everything Guardian has done in the past ie. Ranark who is above Apoc and he can control his atomic structure too. Even if by chance his tech is superior does it matter when Guardian was built to take on Galactus and he did.
====
Summary:
-So once again no counter for Guardian's speed
-No counter for Guardian's shields
-No counter for Guardian accessing Apoc's wavelength and shutting him down for good

its over now correct?

Originally posted by Kurash
its over now correct?

I don't know anymore

hell trick last post should not be allowed since it was supose to have ended before that post.


I will have my answer tommarrow though as of the first page mungi is winning in my book but that could change

that was my last post. So yeah, it's over.

and my post is allowed. West coast time, not east coast. And it's 4:53 now.

im gonna have to agree with trick on the time rule, im gonna count all of his posts

Whatever, all's fair as long as Mungi's allowed to respond as well.

Magneto > Guardian and Apoc. ermmhappy

Originally posted by batdude123
Magneto > Guardian and Apoc. ermmhappy http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Red%20Sigs/regis.jpg

GTFO, fanboi. doped

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Red%20Sigs/regis.jpg

GTFO, fanboi. doped



http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/8623/magripsapartapocalypse4li.jpg

Originally posted by batdude123


http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/8623/magripsapartapocalypse4li.jpg

Can you say

http://home.ma.rr.com/twpics/pwned.jpg

King Mungi presented an extremely well organized arguement that Trick didnt exactly do to much to counter. The debate seemed one-sided, it wasnt clear how much time or effort Trickster was putting into this debate. He only had 3 posts i believe to King's however many (way more than 3).

Either way, King was much more clear and easy to follow and his points held focus a lot better. He got on the attack early and Trickster didnt really get a chance to recover, therefore I've got to give my vote to King Mungi

Smurph's Vote (Yes, I'm A Judge)

This made me cringe a little bit. Mungi stomped all over Trick... seriously, that was like a Grizzly Bear vs. Suzy, five year old girl from down the street.

Analytically, I agree with what's been said. Trick didn't do much in the way of countering, or, hell, even posting, and Mungi dropped practically an entire respect thread on his dome...

So, yeah, vote Trickster. ermmhappy













But, srsly,

Judge Vote: King Mungi

So that's game. I lost, as I figured I would. Stupid uber canadians. durlaugh

Seriously, good match. I hope to have a rematch when Apocalypse returns (and finally stops jobbing).

Good fight Mungi. *shakes his hand*

Right back at you, cheers.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Seriously, good match. What match were you in?

Originally posted by Harry Fingerman
What match were you in?

I supposed I could tell you to be nice, but that would be like me telling a hungry lion to be nice to a lamb.

So the first official win goes to the Royal Family? Cool

I'd feel more about this......but I'm representing a currently inactive team.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
So the first official win goes to the Royal Family? Cool

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I'd feel more about this......but I'm representing a currently inactive team.
Why don't you just jumpstart the JLA again?

I don't understand why everyones so afraid to challenge team Magik?

Originally posted by batdude123


http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/8623/magripsapartapocalypse4li.jpg



http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/HAL10WEEN/apocvsmags-1.png

I am a little disappointed. Trick started off OK and it look liked it might be an ok match, but he sorta died off.


Mungi counter every post and explain how and why he would win. He used defensive stands and offensive ones explain why apoc really stood no chance.

Mungi was the clear winner for me.


I vote mungi

Originally posted by Larceny
I don't understand why everyones so afraid to challenge team Magik?

Magical characters can be vary chaotic by nature. With loads of indirect abilities, to count on.