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How far does he get?

Black Tarantula- http://www.marvel.com/universe/Black_Tarantula

1.Wolverine
2.Omega Red
3.Sabretooth
4.Cyber
5.Gorgon

His bio confirms he has a HF. It hard to say how far he will get due to his low showings. He could possibly make it to Gorgon maybe not...

Doesn't get passed Wolverine.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Doesn't get passed Wolverine.

Why not!

Originally posted by Alfheim
Why not!

Because he thinks he is a melee brick and will get cut to shit?

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Because he thinks he is a melee brick and will get cut to shit?

Hes an MA expert, not just a brick

He beat the snot out of Spider-Man which is saying something

Originally posted by Alfheim
Hes an MA expert, not just a brick
who shown little to no actaul skill. he gets stop at wolverine and stomp at every one else

Wait...

So Wolverine is stroked on this board just like Darkseid?

Black Tarantula beats the living hell out of Wolverine.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Wait...

So Wolverine is stroked on this board just like Darkseid?

Black Tarantula beats the living hell out of Wolverine.
he not being stroked at all. It common sense.

Tarantula fights h2h. He not as skilled and can't take any were enar the punishment. If they fight he will get stabbed and go down. There really nothing Tarantula can do to put him down before he stabbed.


The guys feats arnt even that good.

logan being stroked hahaha on this board lol could not be farther from the truth.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Tarantula fights h2h.

Sure.

Aside from his energy blast, of course.

But I'm sure you're well-versed on him, so it was pointless my saying that.



Damn it! If only he had a healing factor of some kind!




Let's drop the pretense, kid. It's not live you've ever actually read a comic book with Black Tarantula in it.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
logan being stroked hahaha on this board lol could not be farther from the truth.

Yeah, that's exactly what nvr says about Darkseid.

Sure.

Aside from his energy blast, of course.

But I'm sure you're well-versed on him, so it was pointless my saying that.

oh Im not forgetting that. funny little thing is there not enough to put lgoan down and he could easily dodge them. Also funny little thing you may have forgotten. He honorable and almsot always goes straight hand two hand.

for got about cis dident you.


Originally posted by KK the Great
Damn it! If only he had a healing factor of some kind!
funny little thing is ti was never shown nor is therer any evidence to suggest he can take a stabb let a lone many.




Originally posted by KK the Great
Let's drop the pretense, kid. It's not live you've ever actually read a comic book with Black Tarantula in it.

Oh I have and he done nothing to suggest him being able to take Logan. he beat spiderman once badly in h2h. whoopy him. To bad spiderman goign against logan in h2h would be a death sentance.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Yeah, that's exactly what nvr says about Darkseid.
he right. Most people dislike deathseid here and disagree with him constantly.

Though most of us understand he quite powerful. Though not as ppowerful is nvr would like us to believe.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Oh I have

Sure you have, sport.

Sure you have.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Sure you have, sport.

Sure you have.

Thats all you have? You have no other response so you say this? I read so many spiderman comics it make your head spin.


face it you got jack shit. were talking out your back end due to bias and have no other response.

Black tarantula has done nothing to suggest he take any majority over Logan.


If you want I be glad to take this right into a battle zone.

Oh and any one else after Logan would kick the living shit out of Black tarantula

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Thats all you have? You have no other response so you say this? I read so many spiderman comics it make your head spin.


face it you got jack shit. were talking out your back end due to bias and have no other response.

Black tarantula has done nothing to suggest he take any majority over Logan.


If you want I be glad to take this right into a battle zone.

Oh and any one else after Logan would kick the living shit out of Black tarantula

agreed

I could have sworn I seen a comic were bullseye mess black tarantula up pretty bad in jail.

They said he was depowered when Bullseye did that

The Black Tarantula was incarcerated in the U.S. and kept depowered in Rykers prison along with Daredevil (Matthew Murdock), the Kingpin (Wilson Fisk), Hammerhead, and the Punisher (Frank Castle) where he was nearly killed by Bullseye.
Retrieved from "http://www.marvel.com/universe/Black_Tarantula"

Originally posted by carver9
agreed

I could have sworn I seen a comic were bullseye mess black tarantula up pretty bad in jail.

Have you seen any comics where he wasn't depowered?

He's much stronger than Spider-Man, faster than Spider-Man, has a healing factor (and can even heal others), has an energy blast, has superhuman durability, and on top of all that is an MA expert. One of his henchmen could survive an exploding gas tanker and being in an exploding building.

In spite of Battlehammer's laughably inane attempt to make "beating the hell out of Spider-Man" into a mark in the negative column, Black Tarantula is quite a bit above street level, and would be an enormously uphill battle for any street level hero when he's got his powers.

Tarantula > Classic Spidey > Wolverine

313

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Thats all you have? You have no other response so you say this?

Response to what?

Your argument is laughable on the face of it.

Battlehammer's idea of logic:

1) Black Tarantula beat the hell out of Spider-Man.
2) Therefore Wolverine would whoop Black Tarantula.

That's not logic.

It's the debate equivalent of a botched coat-hanger abortion.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Sure you have, sport.

Sure you have. Great debating skill, champ.

And don't assume that we overrate Darkseid just because Nvr has an obsession that he is looked down upon because of (well, and the Wonder Woman thing... and the douche thing... but, beside the point).

Originally posted by KK the Great

Battlehammer's idea of logic:

1) Black Tarantula beat the hell out of Spider-Man.
2) Therefore Wolverine would whoop Black Tarantula.

That's not logic.

It's the debate equivalent of a botched coat-hanger abortion. No.

If you read back, he said that just because he took Spidey in H2H doesn't mean he could take Logan.

Up close and personal, Logan > Parker.

So there's no evidence of ability to take down Logan, but plenty of rationale behind Logan taking BT down...

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph
If you read back, he said that just because he took Spidey in H2H doesn't mean he could take Logan.

That was his entire argument.

He's ridiculously trying to paint Black Tarantula's obvious superiority to Spider-Man as a bad thing.



How in the hell is that considered something that should be taken for granted?

He hasn't presented any argument thus far.

All he was doing was pointing out that beating Spiderman doesn't equate to beating Logan. They're different beasts.

An earlier poster had acted as if Black Tarantula wins solely based on his winning record against Spidey. Capt was just refuting that. No harm, no foul, calm your happy ass down.

Originally posted by KK the Great
That was his entire argument.

He's ridiculously trying to paint Black Tarantula's obvious superiority to Spider-Man as a bad thing. Bad thing?

No... just not necessarily consequential thing.

Originally posted by KK the Great
How in the hell is that considered something that should be taken for granted? Well, if you would like to debate it, we can.

Spider-Man, no webbing, against Wolverine in a close quarters match?

Wolverine eviscerates him.

Superior fighting skills, ability to one-shot, can take many, many solid hits while Pete can take one, maybe two or three.

Originally posted by Soljer
He hasn't presented any argument thus far.

All he was doing was pointing out that beating Spiderman doesn't equate to beating Logan. They're different beasts.

It's not as though he managed to pull out a tough-fought victory against Spider-Man. He thoroughly outclassed Peter on every front. He's just on another level of power.

Originally posted by Soljer
He hasn't presented any argument thus far.

All he was doing was pointing out that beating Spiderman doesn't equate to beating Logan. They're different beasts.

An earlier poster had acted as if Black Tarantula wins solely based on his winning record against Spidey. Capt was just refuting that. No harm, no foul, calm your happy ass down.

correct. seems KK is not as quick of mind as he likes to act.

Originally posted by KK the Great
It's not as though he managed to pull out a tough-fought victory against Spider-Man. He thoroughly outclassed Peter on every front. He's just on another level of power.
If not mistaken they ahd a second fight that ended in a draw.


BT really only showed to be superior in skill and strength.


Logan would ruin spiderman in a melee confrontation.


so im still waiting to see how BT beats wolverine the majority.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph
No.

If you read back, he said that just because he took Spidey in H2H doesn't mean he could take Logan.

Up close and personal, Logan > Parker.

So there's no evidence of ability to take down Logan, but plenty of rationale behind Logan taking BT down...
correct as well.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph
Bad thing?

No... just not necessarily consequential thing.

The primary indication we have of his power level is inconsequential.

Right.




Ah, yes. The old "webbing can't be used in h2h, but adamantium claws are fair game" card.

Here's the thing, though.

Spider-Man wasn't handicapped against Black Tarantula. If you have to handicap him against Wolverine to get the same outcome (tenuous as it is), then you don't really have much of an argument on your hands, do you?

Originally posted by KK the Great
The primary indication we have of his power level is inconsequential.

Right.




Ah, yes. The old "webbing can't be used in h2h, but adamantium claws are fair game" card.

Here's the thing, though.

Spider-Man wasn't handicapped against Black Tarantula. If you have to handicap him against Wolverine to get the same outcome (tenuous as it is), then you don't really have much of an argument on your hands, do you?
.........were not handy caping spiderman............were saying if spiderman tried and take it h2h like he did verse BT he get stomped.


man your not very quick on the ball. And you love putting words in peoples mouths that they did not say.

So KK your entire arguement is that BT beat spiderman in h2h match so there fore he beats wolverine?

If thats your arguement your extremely ignorant.

Stops at Logan.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
.........were not handy caping spiderman............

Yes you absolutely are.



He used webbing against BT. It just wasn't as effective as it is against Wolverine.

Originally posted by KK the Great
The primary indication we have of his power level is inconsequential.

Right. In respect to why he takes a majority over Wolverine?

I see nothing of consequence.
Originally posted by KK the Great
Ah, yes. The old "webbing can't be used in h2h, but adamantium claws are fair game" card. The original point was that BT would take this to an up close match, because of CIS. Wolverine excels at H2H, and would do much more damage in a melee match than Spider-Man would. Hell, he would do much more damage in a melee match than Spider-Man would in an all-out match. And, because Logan uses his claws in melee confrontations, we assume that he would here as well.

I don't see why limiting Wolverine past what his character would normally do (use teh clawz), is necessary...

Originally posted by KK the Great
Here's the thing, though.

Spider-Man wasn't handicapped against Black Tarantula. If you have to handicap him against Wolverine to get the same outcome (tenuous as it is), then you don't really have much of an argument on your hands, do you? No. I was comparing Wolverine's up close melee skills and abilities to Spider-Mans. Not attempting to say "BT > Parker < Wolvz"

Again, I see plenty of rationale as to why Logan would take Tarantula, and nothing to the contrary.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
So KK your entire arguement is that BT beat spiderman in h2h match so there fore he beats wolverine?

If thats your arguement your extremely ignorant.

Which of his fights are you basing your opinion of his formidability on, then?

Unless...

Silly me.

You're not basing it on anything.

You're just mindlessly supportive of Wolverine because of your exceptional bias. Which explains that ridiculous *quiz* you subjected me to in my PM box when I first registered.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Yes you absolutely are.



He used webbing against BT. It just wasn't as effective as it is against Wolverine.
.....again abc logic is crappy and does not work.


First off spiderman went almost purely h2h with BT. he tried to web him a little and stop. Also BT strong enough to break webbing. Wolverine on the other hands not. Not that he needs to be.

also the scann you used was from a non fight. Logans claws are in and talking. But nice try there champ. Oh and anther thing spiderman has never been able to put Logan down in a fight via webbing.

Oh also

Originally posted by KK the Great
Which of his fights are you basing your opinion of his formidability on, then?

Unless...

Silly me.

You're not basing it on anything.

You're just mindlessly supportive of Wolverine because of your exceptional bias. Which explains that ridiculous *quiz* you subjected me to in my PM box when I first registered.

..............You have yet to give a single reason for why BT wins ecpt for "um he wins becauses he so powerful".

Please I love to here how BT takes Logan down who by the way can take BT best shots and is still vastly more skilled.

I asked you a question.

Which of his fights are you basing your opinion of his formidability on?

on his encounters with spiderman..............

what are you basing yours own? First off your try to act like BT has a good healing factor yet this was never once shown. stop using wiki.

and will ask you again what has he done that even gives you the slightest hint he can take Logan?

Originally posted by Battlehammer
on his encounters with spiderman..............


and will ask you again what has he done that even gives you the slightest hint he can take Logan?

He's much stronger.

He's much faster.

He also has a healing power.

He has comparable skill.

He has a distance attack.

He has every advantage in this fight.

The only thing Wolverine has going for him in this fight is his claws, and with BT's speed, there's no good reason to think Wolverine would ever tag him with them. And even if he did, the notion that BT's healing power would somehow "not work" on stab wounds is desperate reaching.

You need to face the possibility that you may just be a biased fanboy.

Originally posted by KK the Great
He's much stronger. As is Hulk... or Thing... or Spider-Man... who have all gone toe to toe with Wolverine in the past.

Originally posted by KK the Great
He's much faster. Based on?

Originally posted by KK the Great
He also has a healing power. Lulz. Feats?

Originally posted by KK the Great
He has comparable skill. ... Wolverine holds a significant edge here.

Originally posted by KK the Great
He has a distance attack. Which he wouldn't use, is dodgeable, and wouldn't put Logan down.

Originally posted by KK the Great
He has every advantage in this fight. Skill, combat experience, endurance, healing, and the ability to deal major lasting damage go to Wolverine.

BT has... strength. And a ranged attack that he wouldn't use.

Originally posted by KK the Great
The only thing Wolverine has going for him in this fight is his claws, and with BT's speed, there's no good reason to think Wolverine would ever tag him with them. And even if he did, the notion that BT's healing power would somehow "not work" on stab wounds is desperate reaching. Wolverine's tagged people faster than BT.

And Wolverine's endurance and capacity to heal, afaik, dwarf BT's. So, again, of little consequence.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph
As is Hulk... or Thing... or Spider-Man... who have all gone toe to toe with Wolverine in the past.

Based on?

Lulz. Feats?

... Wolverine holds a significant edge here.

Which he wouldn't use, is dodgeable, and wouldn't put Logan down.

Skill, combat experience, endurance, healing, and the ability to deal major lasting damage go to Wolverine.

BT has... strength. And a ranged attack that he wouldn't use.

Wolverine's tagged people faster than BT.

And Wolverine's endurance and capacity to heal, afaik, dwarf BT's. So, again, of little consequence.

dam I think your response is better then mine lol

Someone may need to post feats and end this back and forth. How long ago did he fight Spiderman? Is it on panel or did a character say that he fought Spiderman. We need feats of his speed, strength, healing factor, etc. At least something thats kinda current or current enough that shows that he still has these abilities.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
dam I think your response is better then mine lol Pretty much the same thing.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
You should take your own advice champ.

Right.

I'm a huge Black Tarantula fan.

Say the words out loud.

Black Tarantula fan.

Does it sound as ridiculous when you speak the words out loud as it does to me?

Meanwhile you felt compelled to quiz me and score me on a dozen or more Wolverine fights in my PM box shortly after I registered, to make sure I would fall in line with your views on the character.

But you're probably right.

I'm the one with a character bias in this.

Oh and as for Ben Koing wolverine. It was a low shoing for Logan. We don't uses low showings as the norm. '

Thing strength>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>BT

Logan was already Dazed prior to the Attack.


Logan also has gotten massive healing factor up grades since then

i dont see him getting past logan, although i dont see him loosing to logan more than likely the fight will remain a stalemate for quite some time.... depending on how long they fight for though i would say wolverine would probably come up on top

Originally posted by KK the Great
Right.

I'm a huge Black Tarantula fan.

Say the words out loud.

Black Tarantula fan.

Does it sound as ridiculous when you speak the words out loud as it does to me?

Meanwhile you felt compelled to quiz me and score me on a dozen or more Wolverine fights in my PM box shortly after I registered, to make sure I would fall in line with your views on the character.

But you're probably right.

I'm the one with a character bias in this.

Yes I do actaully. Judging from your post I seem to be correct.


I sent you a list to see how much of an idiot you were and if I had another masterbruce on my hands.


yes I am rigth you are bias and ignorant.

There's nothing I like better than spending ten minutes translating someone's messy abortion of spelling and grammar only to find that the guy was attempting to insult my intellect.

Oh... for a moment, I thought it said Batman... I was going to say he punches (not batkicks, as that would be unfair) out all of them... and I haven't even read the first post.

Originally posted by KK the Great
There's nothing I like better than spending ten minutes translating someone's messy abortion of spelling and grammar only to find that the guy was attempting to insult my intellect.
actaully I was not insulting you at all. Not to mention that spelling and grammar do not indecate intelligence.


also you still have no arguement and get turn down at every turn.

Black Tarantula is essentially a less skilled Sabretooth, with his healing factor traded in for superhuman durability and useless laser vision. Against Spider-man that works fine since he is durable enough not to sustain any substantial damage from Spider-man's attacks, so he never needs to heal... but against Wolverine he is going to get cut to shit and lack a healing factor powerful enough to keep him in the fight. Unless you think that Black Tarantula is going to wade into melee with Wolverine and a) not get hit at all or b) be durable enough to shrug off Wolverine's claws, then there is no logical train of thought that will lead you to the conclusion Black Tarantula > Wolverine.

but bt does posess healing abilities,although not automatic like a normal healing factor, he has to make ane effor to heal wounds, not saying anything else just that he has a healing ability

Originally posted by lando005
but bt does posess healing abilities,although not automatic like a normal healing factor, he has to make ane effor to heal wounds, not saying anything else just that he has a healing ability

when has he done this? also when has he done this when fighting or any thing resembling a stabb wound. Also the onl time on pannel he healed some thing to my knowledge was DD which in no way means he can heal him self.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
when has he done this? also when has he done this when fighting or any thing resembling a stabb wound. Also the onl time on pannel he healed some thing to my knowledge was DD which in no way means he can heal him self. he beat the living tar out of deliha snaped her neck and then fully healed her with a touch. He can heal himself and others through touch but it would required more energy than a healing factor and he would have to fight one handed for a monent while he healed. I'm not trying to get invovled with this topic but it should be noted that he posesses healing abilities

umm just becuases you can heal other does not mean you can heal your self. Unless theres on pannel evidence of such an event of him doing so it simply incorrect speculation on your part.

it's a simple matter of turning one's healing ability on yourself dont see anything that would suggest it wont work

Originally posted by lando005
it's a simple matter of turning one's healing ability on yourself dont see anything that would suggest it wont work

because he giving up his energy to heal another. Putting his own energy back into his body would solve nothing.

many characters that have been shown to heal others can not heal them selfs.

The only one that really can is angle and his actaul healing factor that hheal him sucks, but his abiltiy to heal others is very powerful.

so like I said it pure speculation on your part with no actaul on pannel evidence to support such a claim.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
because he giving up his energy to heal another. Putting his own energy back into his body would solve nothing.

many characters that have been shown to heal others can not heal them selfs.

The only one that really can is angle and his actaul healing factor that hheal him sucks, but his abiltiy to heal others is very powerful.

so like I said it pure speculation on your part with no actaul on pannel evidence to support such a claim. then that would depend on how one's healing ability worked wouldn't it? either way we can neither confirm or deny if he can heal himself, we would have to understand how his healing abilities worked to know for sure

Regardless if he can heal himself or not, it appears from what others are saying that it takes a bit out of him, or time to do so. It was also stated in his bio that after shooting an eye beam, it takes a bit of time to do it again.

Wolverine, Omega Red, Sabertooth all heal pretty instantly. Im not sure about Cyber or Gorgon, but BT is going to have to inflict alot of damage to keep them down while he heals himself.

I dont see him getting past Wolvie.

Originally posted by lando005
then that would depend on how one's healing ability worked wouldn't it? either way we can neither confirm or deny if he can heal himself, we would have to understand how his healing abilities worked to know for sure
Yes so we assume it can't unless shown.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Yes so we assume it can't unless shown. we cant say that for sure we are unclear on the full extent of his healing ability so we will have to say we dont know saying yes he does or no he doesn't would be an unfair statement

Originally posted by lando005
we cant say that for sure we are unclear on the full extent of his healing ability so we will have to say we dont know saying yes he does or no he doesn't would be an unfair statement

Analogous to arguing that Aunt May has supercalafragilisitic cosmic powah!

Originally posted by lando005
we cant say that for sure we are unclear on the full extent of his healing ability so we will have to say we dont know saying yes he does or no he doesn't would be an unfair statement

Not at all. If it has not been shown then it has not happen which means, to date he does that have the ability. Which means he does not have it in this fight.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Not at all. If it has not been shown then it has not happen which means, to date he does that have the ability. Which means he does not have it in this fight. it's neglegance to say that with such conviction, we are unsure about the full extent of his healing ability as he can possibly do more so the safest stance to take on the subject is to say that we dont know. Or you could run 2 comparisons of this fight one taking into count his healing ability and one without

Originally posted by lando005
it's neglegance to say that with such conviction, we are unsure about the full extent of his healing ability as he can possibly do more so the safest stance to take on the subject is to say that we dont know. Or you could run 2 comparisons of this fight one taking into count his healing ability and one without
Who saying we don't no the full extent? We have only seen him heal other people never him self. There completely no reason to think he could heal him self.

No the correct stance is that he does not have the power to heal him self at this point in time.

so it should not be brought into the debate.

Thats like me saying wolverine now can heal other people.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Who saying we don't no the full extent? We have only seen him heal other people never him self. There completely no reason to think he could heal him self.

No the correct stance is that he does not have the power to heal him self at this point in time.

so it should not be brought into the debate.

Thats like me saying wolverine now can heal other people.
we havent seen much of bt we know the full extent of wolerine's abilities to me there is too big of a margine of doubt to say that he can not heal himself, we have no idea how his healing abilities work, you may feel ok making that call but i dont

Originally posted by lando005
we havent seen much of bt we know the full extent of wolerine's abilities to me there is too big of a margine of doubt to say that he can not heal himself, we have no idea how his healing abilities work, you may feel ok making that call but i dont

It the same thing. You can't simply assume some one has a power when they never showed to have it.


Becuase he heals other he can heal him self?

I mean Logan and many others have healing factors, but they can't heal others.


your argument is rediculous.

He never shown to heal him self, so he can't until proven other wise.

You can't simply act Like he has the ability to heal him self when he never shown it.

There to big a margin of doubt? there not a single margin of doubt. There the fact he can heal others. There the fact he never healed him self before.

I mean I could say Logan can heal other, but does not make it true.


We go by on pannel shown powers, not what we wish they could do.

His on pannel power is healing others. He can't heal him self in this thread becuases he never once done it on pannel or even been stated to do such on pannel.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
It the same thing. You can't simply assume some one has a power when they never showed to have it.


Becuase he heals other he can heal him self?

I mean Logan and many others have healing factors, but they can't heal others.


your argument is rediculous.

He never shown to heal him self, so he can't until proven other wise.

You can't simply act Like he has the ability to heal him self when he never shown it.

There to big a margin of doubt? there not a single margin of doubt. There the fact he can heal others. There the fact he never healed him self before.

I mean I could say Logan can heal other, but does not make it true.


We go by on pannel shown powers, not what we wish they could do.

His on pannel power is healing others. He can't heal him self in this thread becuases he never once done it on pannel or even been stated to do such on pannel. he's never had to heal himself because he's never been injured and there is nothing to say he cant heal himself so i'm taking a neutral stance end of story

Originally posted by lando005
he's never had to heal himself because he's never been injured and there is nothing to say he cant heal himself so i'm taking a neutral stance end of story
Actaully in his second fight with spiderman he was beat up.


also Thats not a good enough reason. If he could heal him self it been shown or stated.

It has not been, so as of now he can't.

I mean I guess Logan can heal others. I mean he never tried before who to say he can't.


Like I said your reason is ridculous for your stance.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Actaully in his second fight with spiderman he was beat up.


also Thats not a good enough reason. If he could heal him self it been shown or stated.

It has not been, so as of now he can't.

I mean I guess Logan can heal others. I mean he never tried before who to say he can't.


Like I said your reason is ridculous for your stance. no in his second fight with spiderman he took a lot of hits but he was nowhere near hurt, his outfit was ruined that's about it. and stop with the wolverine thing we didnt know about his healing factor for a long time but look he has one and the only clue we had was a comment by him saying "i heal quick". You can very well be right about him not being able to heal himself but i have to also aknoledge the fact that there is a good possiblilty he could. it's 50/50 there for i cant make a call

Originally posted by lando005
no in his second fight with spiderman he took a lot of hits but he was nowhere near hurt, his outfit was ruined that's about it. and stop with the wolverine thing we didnt know about his healing factor for a long time but look he has one and the only clue we had was a comment by him saying "i heal quick". You can very well be right about him not being able to heal himself but i have to also aknoledge the fact that there is a good possiblilty he could. it's 50/50 there for i cant make a call

ya and if you at the time had a debate with wolverine and can't go"um he might have a healign factor".


it rediculous. Any characte rcould have another power, but that does not mean they do.

Like I said as of now he does not have the ability. You can't assume he does.


Also I guess X-23 can heal people now I mean she never tried.


Man you can't even see how stupid your arguement sounds.


I mean you want us to assume he the ability to heal him self in this debate when there no prove of it.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
ya and if you at the time had a debate with wolverine and can't go"um he might have a healign factor".


it rediculous. Any characte rcould have another power, but that does not mean they do.

Like I said as of now he does not have the ability. You can't assume he does.


Also I guess X-23 can heal people now I mean she never tried.


Man you can't even see how stupid your arguement sounds.


I mean you want us to assume he the ability to heal him self in this debate when there no prove of it. your making an enemy out of me for nothing. The ability to heal others is much diffenrent from a healing factor because this is an ability he can project, because of that i have no choice but to acknowledge that he may be able to turn that ability on himself as well. I'm only talking about myself i havent been trying to convince you or anyone else about this i was explaining the stance i was taking and you attack me because i dont see things your way. Please take more time to understand what point i'm trying to get across we had this little talk before.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Wait...

So Wolverine is stroked on this board

Welcome to the forum...you dont know the half of it....


Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph
As is Hulk... or Thing... or Spider-Man... who have all gone toe to toe with Wolverine in the past.

None of those guys are martial art experts...thats the point your missing.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Based on?

He is much faster than Spiderman because he had no trouble tagging him. Spiderman is faster than Wolverine but not more skillful if Spiderman was a top tier martial artist he would give Wolverine alot of trouble now imagine somebody who is even faster than Spiderman. Hell Mister X almost killed Wolverine all BT needs to do is get him into a choke hold.


Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Lulz. Feats?

He can heal people by touch and his bio says that he has a HF. Its not illogical to think that he can touch himself and heal

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

... Wolverine holds a significant edge here.

Thats debetable....


Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Which he wouldn't use, is dodgeable, and wouldn't put Logan down.

Why wouldnt he use it? He used it against Spiderman...

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Skill, combat experience, endurance,.

You cant prove that he is superior in skill and endurance. Just because he has more combat experience doesnt neccesraily make him better, look at Thor 100s of years of combat experience and he still sucks.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

healing, and the ability to deal major lasting damage go to Wolverine.

His healing is probably more efiicient but an MA expert at class 25 could probably literially make his punches as powerful as class 100.


Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

BT has... strength. And a ranged attack that he wouldn't use.

Why do you keep saying that?

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Wolverine's tagged people faster than BT.

Speed Demon? Not a martial expert if he was he would have probably dropped Wolverine. Wolverine was getting punched all over but because he was more skillful Wolverine won. BT is fatser than Spiderman and miles more skillful than Speed Demon.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

And Wolverine's endurance and capacity to heal, afaik, dwarf BT's. So, again, of little consequence.

You dont know wether he has greater endurance a more efficient HF...probably.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Actaully in his second fight with spiderman he was beat up.




He was holding back...he could have killed Spiderman in 1 second falt but just dislocated his shoulder instead also he had to fight giant robots and guys with guns...and also Spiderman was packing extra weapons.

If Spider-Man went all out on Wolverine he would get dropped with his amazing speed agility reflexes and strength he would land 50 punches to Wolverine in seconds.

Originally posted by golem370
If Spider-Man went all out on Wolverine he would get dropped with his amazing speed agility reflexes and strength he would land 50 punches to Wolverine in seconds.

No he would not he would get stabbed to death. Wolverine is not mcuh slower than Spiderman.

Spider-Man vs X-Men
http://img317.imageshack.us/my.php?...deyxmen11kx.jpg
http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?...deyxmen27do.jpg
http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?...deyxmen35so.jpg

Originally posted by golem370
Spider-Man vs X-Men
http://img317.imageshack.us/my.php?...deyxmen11kx.jpg
http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?...deyxmen27do.jpg
http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?...deyxmen35so.jpg

That was ages ago. Wolverine has had fights since then were he has done better. I wish somebody could scan the whole fights though.........

Where is it shown that Black Tarantula is a MA expert? Besides a handbok where we take what they say with a grain of salt.

Originally posted by jrodslam
Where is it shown that Black Tarantula is a MA expert? Besides a handbok where we take what they say with a grain of salt.

1 His bio states that he is.

AND.

2. http://img414.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vsspider2k0sa.jpg
Its stated that every one who becomes BT must train, I would assume that would include martial arts. I would assume that is one of the reasons why he beat Spiderman so easily.

Originally posted by Alfheim
1 His bio states that he is.

AND.

2. http://img414.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vsspider2k0sa.jpg
Its stated that every one who becomes BT must train, I would assume that would include martial arts. I would assume that is one of the reasons why he beat Spiderman so easily.

Not sure if you fully read my post.

Where on panel/in a comic, shows that hes a martial arts expert. Bios are often wrong regarding many characters stats.

Secondly, if everyone who becomes BT must train, we dont know to what extent. Definately not enough to say that hes an expert. Also, he didnt beat Spiderman easily. I will say that once he grabbed Spidey it was pretty much a wrap after that.

It was said on panel in Daredevil that BT has a "healing ability" that makes him diffcult to take down. He was also shown to be vulnerable to bullets recently (while he was bullet proof in the past) so it is possible that his durability was traded in for a healing factor.

Originally posted by jrodslam
Not sure if you fully read my post.
Where on panel/in a comic, shows that hes a martial arts expert. Bios are often wrong regarding many characters stats.

Secondly, if everyone who becomes BT must train, we dont know to what extent. Definately not enough to say that hes an expert.

Yes I know you said that...again here are my reasons.

1. His bio states it....but that is not enough on its own this is further confirmed by the fact that:
a) He had to train and probably included MA
b) He beat Spiderman really easily not everybody who is superhuman can beat Spiderman like that. I would assume that since its been stated that hes trained and he beat Spiderman with ease that this partially due to his training as opposed to Venom who beats Spiderman but has not had any training.

Originally posted by jrodslam

Also, he didnt beat Spiderman easily. I will say that once he grabbed Spidey it was pretty much a wrap after that.

Yes he did he wanst even trying.you can clearly see in their second fight he could have killed Spiderman straight away but settled for dslocating his shoulder.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
It was said on panel in Daredevil that BT has a "healing ability" that makes him diffcult to take down. He was also shown to be vulnerable to bullets recently (while he was bullet proof in the past) so it is possible that his durability was traded in for a healing factor.

Well there you go then. When was he shown vulnerable to bullets.

http://img178.imagevenue.com/loc70/th_58911_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0042_122_70lo.jpghttp://img207.imagevenue.com/loc362/th_58920_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0043_122_362lo.jpghttp://img152.imagevenue.com/loc677/th_58932_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0044_122_677lo.jpghttp://img15.imagevenue.com/loc861/th_58939_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0045_122_861lo.jpg
http://img34.imagevenue.com/loc787/th_58945_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0047_122_787lo.jpghttp://img157.imagevenue.com/loc907/th_58954_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0048_122_907lo.jpg

I dunno man theres a statemnt about drugs and him not being what he used to be, does this imply he wasnt in top form.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I dunno man theres a statemnt about drugs and him not being what he used to be, does this imply he wasnt in top form.



http://img202.imagevenue.com/loc194/th_60658_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0007_122_194lo.jpghttp://img189.imagevenue.com/loc486/th_60665_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0009_122_486lo.jpghttp://img190.imagevenue.com/loc117/th_60672_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0011_122_117lo.jpghttp://img155.imagevenue.com/loc754/th_60684_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0012_122_754lo.jpg

Originally posted by Alfheim
None of those guys are martial art experts...thats the point your missing. Neither is BT, so that's irrelevant.

Originally posted by Alfheim
He is much faster than Spiderman because he had no trouble tagging him. Spiderman is faster than Wolverine but not more skillful if Spiderman was a top tier martial artist he would give Wolverine alot of trouble now imagine somebody who is even faster than Spiderman. Hell Mister X almost killed Wolverine all BT needs to do is get him into a choke hold. I've seen Daredeil tag Spider-Man. Is Daredevil much faster?

Bt = tp tier martial arts expert?

Hell, I reckon I've seen better h2h feats from Gambit...

Originally posted by Alfheim
He can heal people by touch and his bio says that he has a HF. Its not illogical to think that he can touch himself and heal It's illogical to think that it will do anything other than prolong his death.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Thats debetable.... Sure, you could debate it. You'd still be clearly wrong, but you could do it.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Why wouldnt he use it? He used it against Spiderman... History shows he'd favor a h2h fight with a melee fighter. Spider-Man wouldn't take it to h2h normally, so he logically would use ranged attacks against him. Pretty basic logic, and CIS.

Originally posted by Alfheim
You cant prove that he is superior in skill and endurance. Just because he has more combat experience doesnt neccesraily make him better, look at Thor 100s of years of combat experience and he still sucks. Actually, using feats, I can... unless you've seen Black Tarantula demonstrate the level of Logan...

Originally posted by Alfheim
His healing is probably more efiicient but an MA expert at class 25 could probably literially make his punches as powerful as class 100.Firstly, that's bullshit. Secondly, he's not an MA expert.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Why do you keep saying that? Truth, CIS, and logic dictate it.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Speed Demon? Not a martial expert if he was he would have probably dropped Wolverine. Wolverine was getting punched all over but because he was more skillful Wolverine won. BT is fatser than Spiderman and miles more skillful than Speed Demon. BT isn't faster than Spider-Man, and he's not an MA expert... Wolverine could drop him LONG before Wolverine would be dropped.

Originally posted by Alfheim
You dont know wether he has greater endurance a more efficient HF...probably. He definitely does, until further notice.


Originally posted by Alfheim
He was holding back...he could have killed Spiderman in 1 second falt but just dislocated his shoulder instead also he had to fight giant robots and guys with guns...and also Spiderman was packing extra weapons. Lulz.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes I know you said that...again here are my reasons.

1. His bio states it....but that is not enough on its own this is further confirmed by the fact that:
a) He had to train and probably included MA
b) He beat Spiderman really easily not everybody who is superhuman can beat Spiderman like that. I would assume that since its been stated that hes trained and he beat Spiderman with ease that this partially due to his training as opposed to Venom who beats Spiderman but has not had any training.


Yes he did he wanst even trying.you can clearly see in their second fight he could have killed Spiderman straight away but settled for dslocating his shoulder.

Again, him training does not make him a MA expert. At all. He hasnt shown us anything that suggests that. At all. And again, he didnt beat Spidey easily. Only after he grabbed Spidey was when it got easy. Hell, the only attack Spidey even tried was webbing him up. You also mention that he wasnt trying against Spidey? Which fight was this? What comic was their second fight in?

Originally posted by golem370
If Spider-Man went all out on Wolverine he would get dropped with his amazing speed agility reflexes and strength he would land 50 punches to Wolverine in seconds.
get out of here with this nonsenses.

Originally posted by jrodslam
Again, him training does not make him a MA expert. At all.

The hell do you think he was trained in, exactly?

Business ethics?

Originally posted by KK the Great
The hell do you think he was trained in, exactly?

Business ethics?
sorry, but training alone does not make you MA expert. You need feats of this.



it pritty sad that you said his MA ability was comparable to logan when this guy has no feats and Logan consider on of the best MA fighters on earth.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
sorry, but training alone does not make you MA expert.

I'm sorry, but training is *exactly* how one becomes an MA expert.

Originally posted by KK the Great
I'm sorry, but training is *exactly* how one becomes an MA expert.
yes,but some one being stated to have trained a lot means jack when they have no feats of fighting skills. To say there an expert in MA is rediculous when they have shown nothing to suggest this.

you can train and not be an MA expert.


Also Logans training>>>>>>>>>>>>>>BT

Originally posted by KK the Great
The hell do you think he was trained in, exactly?

Business ethics?

Because youre the BT fan, maybe YOU can explain what areas of combat he was trained in. Every time ive seen BT train in a comic, it was lifting weights. Only one time did i see him training in fighting against MA's and it wasnt even shown what he did on panel. All im asking is proof of his martial arts expertise.

Originally posted by jrodslam
Because youre the BT fan,

Say those words out loud.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Say those words out loud.
You are and some of your rediculous comments comfirm it

Originally posted by Battlehammer
You are

Remember that time you registered and then I sent you a quiz about Black Tarantula to make sure your views were acceptable to me?

Oh..

Wait.

No.

That was the other way around.

Its clear that because KK cant come up with proof of BT's expert MA skill besides what the handbook says, sarcasm is issued instead. Any type of fighting on panel that shows MA expertise from BT cant be submitted by anyone who says that he is.

Ill just take the sarcasm as a childish way of saying "I cant prove it.".

Like stated before, training doesnt automatically mean MA expert. Does he train in gymnastics? Boxing? Who knows. He hasnt shown any indication of being an expert. Period. Until then, ill continue to take what the handbook says with a grain of salt.

Feats >>>> Handbooks.

EDIT: I will however concede that hes able to heal himself. Definately not like Wolvie, Red or Sabes, but heal nonetheless. Ill also take his durability as being bulletproof. His strength as 25 cl? I havent seen him do anything over 10cl.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Remember that time you registered and then I sent you a quiz about Black Tarantula to make sure your views were acceptable to me?

Oh..

Wait.

No.

That was the other way around.
uve said this about 4 times already.

It getting old and rather futile remark.


becuase Im not the one saying a character will beat another character with out giving any valid reasons.



I am also not the one saying that "um BT trained so he expert MA" so that means he comparable to Logan in skill who a top tier fighter way better trained and vastly better feats of skill and vastly more experience.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
uve said this about 4 times already.

It getting old and rather futile remark.

My mentioning your unapologetic fanboyism doesn't take away from the laughable irony in your accusing anyone else of bias, no matter how many times I mention your bizarre compulsion to quiz new posters for compatibility.

Originally posted by KK the Great
My mentioning your unapologetic fanboyism doesn't take away from the laughable irony in your accusing anyone else of bias, no matter how many times I mention your bizarre compulsion to quiz new posters for compatibility.
It was to say who I could battle zone you shc people with. It was also to see your general knowledge of the street and midtier levels.


you just love gio off topic.............could it be ebcuase you have no arguement and are getting spanked on this thread at every turn?



Oh and I may be bias, but unlike your self I don't let my bias take over so I say retarded arguments liek BT is comparable to Logan skill lol

Originally posted by Battlehammer
you just love gio off topic.............could it be ebcuase you have no arguement and are getting spanked on this thread at every turn?


Please.

All throughout the thread I've been met with nothing but brash, even proud ignorance of the character being discussed.

How many damn times have one of you said "he would never use his eye blasts because of honor" or "he can only use it once before needing to recharge" so far? Ten times? Maybe more?

When the reality is this:

The first time he ever fought Spider-Man, do you know what his first move was?

Don't. I'll tell you.

It was his eye blast.

Right off the bat he used it.

Then do you know what he did as his second move, scant seconds later?

If you guess "eye blast" you can expect your prize in the mail, because that's exactly right.

This attack that he "would never use" and "needs minutes to recharge" was both his first and second attack in his very first encounter with Spider-Man. OBVIOUSLY, you guys are arguing from a position of resounding ignorance.

And while we're on it, what was the other counter to his eye blast? I think you guys just brushed his long-range capabilities off with "Logan could dodge" and that was that. But Spider-Man comments in their second fight that he was barely able to dodge the eye blast even with his spider-sense.

If Spider-Man has trouble dodging something, then you're dealing with a very difficult to dodge attack.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Please.

All throughout the thread I've been met with nothing but brash, even proud ignorance of the character being discussed.

How many damn times have one of you said "he would never use his eye blasts because of honor" or "he can only use it once before needing to recharge" so far? Ten times? Maybe more?

When the reality is this:

The first time he ever fought Spider-Man, do you know what his first move was?

Don't. I'll tell you.

It was his eye blast.

Right off the bat he used it.

Then do you know what he did as his second move, scant seconds later?

If you guess "eye blast" you can expect your prize in the mail, because that's exactly right.

This attack that he "would never use" and "needs minutes to recharge" was both his first and second attack in his very first encounter with Spider-Man. OBVIOUSLY, you guys are arguing from a position of resounding ignorance.

And while we're on it, what was the other counter to his eye blast? I think you guys just brushed his long-range capabilities off with "Logan could dodge" and that was that. But Spider-Man comments in their second fight that he was barely able to dodge the eye blast even with his spider-sense.

If Spider-Man has trouble dodging something, then you're dealing with a very difficult to dodge attack.

No ignorance at all. So you final looked at the BT thread. So much for BT superior speed. Spiderman in there first encounter was moving so fast BT was getting hit on all sides. Yes BT did get his leg, but after been hitt repeatedly. This clearly shows that BT not on spidermans level of speed.

also in there second fight spiderman was already injured. so an injured spiderman ahd trouble dodging whoopy lol he still managed it thatg does not say much for BT.

Also I like to add BT would shoot eye blast maybe on or two, but as soon as his opponet made it clear they wanted to go h2h that what he did due to his honor code.

Also his eye blast are crap and are not able to KO logan in the least. They damage a brick wall whoopy. Not to mention Logan could do this

Originally posted by Battlehammer
No ignorance at all. So you final looked at the BT thread. So much for BT superior speed. Spiderman in there first encounter was moving so fast BT was getting hit on all sides. Yes BT did get his leg, but after been hitt repeatedly. This clearly shows that BT not on spidermans level of speed.

What are you talking about? He doesn't have Spider-Man's particular combat style, but he casually reaches out and plucks Spider-Man from the air during one of Peter's patented blitzes.



The scans are in the wrong order, genius.

He's injured from the fight with BT in the later scans.




Spider-Man, with his spider-sense, could barely dodge his blasts. Wolverine is *not* going to just cock his head to the side and avoid them.

A few things about Spidey's blitz on BT. It doesnt look like Spidey was attacking. It looks more like he was trying to evade BT. The 2 indications on BT's shoulder look as if its where bricks fell.
http://img237.imageshack.us/my.php?image=asm432p188hn.jpg

In regards to the second fight, i think its after the first encounter between the two.

Originally posted by KK the Great
What are you talking about? He doesn't have Spider-Man's particular combat style, but he casually reaches out and plucks Spider-Man from the air during one of Peter's patented blitzes.



The scans are in the wrong order, genius.

He's injured from the fight with BT in the later scans.




Spider-Man, with his spider-sense, could barely dodge his blasts. Wolverine is *not* going to just cock his head to the side and avoid them.
He was getting hit over and over. if he had spidermans combat speed he would have got him before beig blizt. Not to mention in there second fight spiderman is shown to have superior speed yet again.


not so sure about that the first scann which si the first page show spiderman arm injured to beggin with.



actaully wolverine will be. Scot skill with his laser>>>>>>>>>>BT




so again whats your arguement for BT. He gunna do what?

Originally posted by Battlehammer
He was getting hit over and over. if he had spidermans combat speed he would have got him before beig blizt. Not to mention in there second fight spiderman is shown to have superior speed yet again.

Over and over? At best you can say he was hit twice.

The bottom line is that he casually snatched Peter out of the air during one of his famous speed-blitzes.



Again, the scans are out of order.

His arm is dangling and injured in the first scan because of BT dislocating it in a later scan.

Look how he's all busted up and battle-damaged in the first scans, but then all of the sudden he bounds onto the scene with a fresh costume and no signs of damage. Those later pages actually come first.



Which is why Wolverine dodging Cyke's blast is such an anomaly, and a ridiculously poor showing for Scott.

All that would've taken on Cyke's part is producing a wider beam that couldn't be dodged so easily at close range. But he opted to shoot a couple of thin-beams and call it quits? You can talk all you'd like about his skill with his eyebeams, but it doesn't matter much if he blatantly neglected to use it in your reference.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Over and over? At best you can say he was hit twice.

The bottom line is that he casually snatched Peter out of the air during one of his famous speed-blitzes.



Again, the scans are out of order.

His arm is dangling and injured in the first scan because of BT dislocating it in a later scan.

Look how he's all busted up and battle-damaged in the first scans, but then all of the sudden he bounds onto the scene with a fresh costume and no signs of damage. Those later pages actually come first.



Which is why Wolverine dodging Cyke's blast is such an anomaly, and a ridiculously poor showing for Scott.

All that would've taken on Cyke's part is producing a wider beam that couldn't be dodged so easily at close range. But he opted to shoot a couple of thin-beams and call it quits? You can talk all you'd like about his skill with his eyebeams, but it doesn't matter much if he blatantly neglected to use it in your reference.

Spiderman was bouncing all around him. He finally caught spiderman...........meaning he not on spiderman level of speed let a lone above. Meaning there no way in hell he faster then Logan likly not as fast.

Then in there second find spiderman again showed superior combat speed to BT.

how it poor writing that wolverien dodged scots blast? it well with his his ability and scots character for somethign like that it happen. Ya scot could have taken off hsi visor and killed his wife, capt and every one else. also scot used his skill with aim, but Logan was to fast to be hit. You can have all the aim in the world, but if the person can dodge your attacks your screwed.

also Logan dodge scots blasts in the past as well...........he actaully has dodged them after they were fired before..........

actaully if you look the first scann has the title in it...........mean it was the first scann of the issue and oh look spiderman injured already

Scott's blast was said to be the speed of light.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph
Neither is BT, so that's irrelevant.

Its stated that hes recieved training and has been able to catch Spiderman with ease. Cap maybe able to beat Spiderman in H2H but ive never seen him casullay catch Spiderman while speed-blitzing.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

I've seen Daredeil tag Spider-Man. Is Daredevil much faster?

Bt = tp tier martial arts expert?

Hell, I reckon I've seen better h2h feats from Gambit...

You missed the point. The issue is not just about tagging its about how easily he did it. Spiderman did a speedblitz and BT casually caught him, furthermore its harder to grab your opponent with one hand than it is to hit them.

Furthermore he took out Delilah who is a trained assassin. If hes been trained and can take out people who are MA trained then its not illogical to think he an MA expert.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

It's illogical to think that it will do anything other than prolong his death.

Why?

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Sure, you could debate it. You'd still be clearly wrong, but you could do it.

Can Wolverine casually grab Spiderman while speedblitzing?

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

History shows he'd favor a h2h fight with a melee fighter. Spider-Man wouldn't take it to h2h normally, so he logically would use ranged attacks against him. Pretty basic logic, and CIS.

Also BT has been shown that he is a tactical fighter and will use whatever means he can to win. On one occassion he allowed himself to get hit, so its not illogical that he would also use the eye blast if he thought it would be useful.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Actually, using feats, I can... unless you've seen Black Tarantula demonstrate the level of Logan...

Firstly, that's bullshit. Secondly, he's not an MA expert.

Again he has not trouble catching or tagging him. In their second fight he could have killed Spiderman in one second flat. Hell DD can tag Spiderman but not that easily.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

BT isn't faster than Spider-Man, and he's not an MA expert...

Again he has not trouble catching or tagging him. In their second fight he could have killed Spiderman in one second flat. Hell DD can tag Spiderman but not that easily.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

Wolverine could drop him LONG before Wolverine would be dropped.


Why?

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph

He definitely does, until further notice.

He might do but you cant say that about a character that has not had that many showings.

Originally posted by SwindlingSmurph


Lulz.

No what your supposed to do is explain why you think the statement is crap. When two people debate that dont just make statements like "lulz" what people do is then explain clearly and coherently why they think the statement is crap.

Originally posted by jrodslam
I

Like stated before, training doesnt automatically mean MA expert. Does he train in gymnastics? Boxing? Who knows. He hasnt shown any indication of being an expert. Period. Until then, ill continue to take what the handbook says with a grain of salt.



Look that argument is crap. Lots of people on this forum use the argument that we dont know that its certain and its bullshit. You know why because in the real world people are not certain about lots of things but they use the evidence to indicate what the most likely conclusion is. Programmers implement progarms all the time and they are not entirely sure that it will work but they still use them, if they followed your line of logic nothing woulf get done.

Its not stated explicitly but we can deduce that he probably is an MA expert because he has taken out Spiderman with ease something that Cap and DD have not been able to do and his training has enabled him to beat Delilah who is a trained assasin. So we can conclude that he is an MA expert because his job involves beating people up and he does it very well.

Hell its been said on-panel that Delliah is a skilled assasin you might as well argue that she wasnt trained in MA either when the most likely conclusion is that she is.

....................becuase BT took out spiderman that makes him an expert MA?

the reasoning is well illogical.

seeing as how BT beat spiderman through durability and strength.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
....................becuase BT took out spiderman that makes him an expert MA?

the reasoning is well illogical.

seeing as how BT beat spiderman through durability and strength.

Whose TB?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Whose TB?

typo its 5:57 am here lol

Originally posted by Battlehammer
typo its 5:57 am here lol

Right well i already explained, read my post again. Venom can beat Spiderman easily but he ahs not recieved any training, he does it because of his stats BT does it becuse of his training.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Right well i already explained, read my post again. Venom can beat Spiderman easily but he ahs not recieved any training, he does it because of his stats BT does it becuse of his training.

actaully BT does it ebcuases of his powers. Nothing he did suggest it was due to skill.

All he did was ripp through spiderman webbing and beat spiderman due to superior strength/durability

In both there fights.


please tell me were he showed any signs of skill that would lead you to believe he was an expert MA fighter.

I read your post nothing in it even suggests this.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
actaully BT does it ebcuases of his powers. Nothing he did suggest it was due to skill.

All he did was ripp through spiderman webbing and beat spiderman due to superior strength/durability

In both there fights.


please tell me were he showed any signs of skill that would lead you to believe he was an expert MA fighter.

I read your post nothing in it even suggests this.

We already know that he has superhuman powers but it is also stated that he has training. If he has training he obvoulsy is going to use it and we can conclude this is one of the reasons why is able to tag Spiderman easily.

As I stated at the beginning of the fight BT casually grabbed Spiderman and dislocated his shoulder. The reason why he was able to do that so easily is because of his training its not just because he is superhuman.

Luke Cage is superhuman but he cant casually tag spiderman but he could if he was trained better. Venom can tag Spdierman but thats because he is superhuman. BT is inbetween Luke Cage and Venom in the sense that its not just superhuman stats that make him dangerous but its his training as well.

Originally posted by Alfheim
We already know that he has superhuman powers but it is also stated that he has training. If he has training he obvoulsy is going to use it and we can conclude this is one of the reasons why is able to tag Spiderman easily.
or we can conclude it was due to his reflexes which are superhuman due to his powers...........catching some one is relfex no skill.

sorry tagging some one is far from skill full. espicial when he getting hit more times then he hititng them.

Originally posted by Alfheim
As I stated at the beginning of the fight BT casually grabbed Spiderman and dislocated his shoulder. The reason why he was able to do that so easily is because of his training its not just because he is superhuman..
no it due to his reflexes that come from his powers............catching some one is far from making you skill full. Hell the way he did it was not even skill full.

also He got hit a lot more times then he hit spiderman.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Luke Cage is superhuman but he cant casually tag spiderman but he could if he was trained better.
actaully he couldent reguardless. He needs superhuman reflexes which he deos not have, but BT does have.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Venom can tag Spdierman but thats because he is superhuman. BT is inbetween Luke Cage and Venom in the sense that its not just superhuman stats that make him dangerous but its his training as well.

actaully it pritty much his superhuman abilities. He show little to no skill. Nothing that even remotly puts him at even 3rd tier.

BT has superhuman reflexes. I don't know why you think him catching spiderman means he skill full what it simply his reflexes.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
or we can conclude it was due to his reflexes which are superhuman due to his powers...........catching some one is relfex no skill.

You cant say that for sure. Cap is trained he has superhuman reflexes he can see bullets in slow motion. It does not state explcitly WHY he has superhuman reflexes but we could assume since it is stated that he has had intense training that his training has something to do with it. Other people have had superhuman reflexes and have trouble hitting Spiderman so thats not clear cut.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

sorry tagging some one is far from skill full. espicial when he getting hit more times then he hititng them.


no it due to his reflexes that come from his powers............catching some one is far from making you skill full. Hell the way he did it was not even skill full.

also He got hit a lot more times then he hit spiderman.

1. Why would he doddge when Spidermans punches dont even hurt?
2. Spiderman was speedblitzing him.. If he had just punched him that could be a fluke but he just casually grabbed him without effort.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

actaully he couldent reguardless. He needs superhuman reflexes which he deos not have, but BT does have.

No not neccesarily. Scorpion has superhuman reflexes and Spiderman gives him grief.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

actaully it pritty much his superhuman abilities. He show little to no skill.

Again you dont know that, but you do KNOW he has had recieved training. Superhuman reflexes do not neccesarily mean you are going to beat Spiderman but training has shown time and time again to beat him.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Nothing that even remotly puts him at even 3rd tier.

So third tier fighters can easily beat Spiderman?

Originally posted by Battlehammer

BT has superhuman reflexes. I don't know why you think him catching spiderman means he skill full what it simply his reflexes.

I already explained.

Originally posted by Alfheim
You cant say that for sure. Cap is trained he has superhuman reflexes he can see bullets in slow motion. It does not state explcitly WHY he has superhuman reflexes but we could assume since it is stated that he has had intense training that his training has something to do with it. Other people have had superhuman reflexes and have trouble hitting Spiderman so thats not clear cut.
or maybe it due to umm..................the super soldier serum..........


ya and BT at times was having trouble hitting spiderman as well.........


Originally posted by Alfheim
1. Why would he doddge when Spidermans punches dont even hurt?
2. Spiderman was speedblitzing him.. If he had just punched him that could be a fluke but he just casually grabbed him without effort.
.
..........punching some one and grabbing them really is no deffrent. it takes the same amount of speed..........pritty much.


Originally posted by Alfheim
No not neccesarily. Scorpion has superhuman reflexes and Spiderman gives him grief..
........yes becuases he a putz. And he also no were near as durable as BT. If he was spiderman would lose to him as well.




Again you dont know that, but you do KNOW he has had recieved training. Superhuman reflexes do not neccesarily mean you are going to beat Spiderman but training has shown time and time again to beat him...
...........Yet he shown little to no skill. Which is a fact. We also don't know jack about it training or even if he master a single style at all.

.........it not his superhuman reflexes that beat spiderman it his strength and durability............



Originally posted by Alfheim
So third tier fighters can easily beat Spiderman?



I already explained.

If you have BT powers yes. well at the time.


BT has shown nothing top put him even at 3rd tier let a lone above.


Hell he faced a second tier fighter...........and quess what he almost died.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
or maybe it due to umm..................the super soldier serum..........

No its not because even without the serum he has beaten top tier fighters.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

ya and BT at times was having trouble hitting spiderman as well.........

Please EXPLAIN how he was trouble hitting him.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

..........punching some one and grabbing them really is no deffrent. it takes the same amount of speed..........pritty much.

No but when you punch somebody you just make contact then you lretract. When you grab somebody you make contact then you have to grip...its more compliacted...not rocket scince but more difficult.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

........yes becuases he a putz. And he also no were near as durable as BT. If he was spiderman would lose to him as well.

Does Scorpion have superhuman reflexes or not? He might be a putz but he was still able to beat up Luke cage and give Cap some trouble. So Luke Cage and Cap are idiots?


Originally posted by Battlehammer

...........Yet he shown little to no skill. Which is a fact.

You call casually garbbing a speeblitzing Spiderman no skill?

Originally posted by Battlehammer

We also don't know jack about it training or even if he master a single style at all.

.........it not his superhuman reflexes that beat spiderman it his strength and durability............

"Its not stated explicitly but we can deduce that he probably is an MA expert because he has taken out Spiderman with ease something that Cap and DD have not been able to do and his training has enabled him to beat Delilah who is a trained assasin. So we can conclude that he is an MA expert because his job involves beating people up and he does it very well"


Originally posted by Battlehammer

If you have BT powers yes. well at the time.


Read above.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

BT has shown nothing top put him even at 3rd tier let a lone above.
Originally posted by Battlehammer

Hell he faced a second tier fighter...........and quess what he almost died.

Is second tier the same as third tier? Who was this person anyway and how did the fight go?

Originally posted by Alfheim
No its not because even without the serum he has beaten top tier fighters.

really he beat some one with superhuman reaction speed/reflexes with out.........his serum. I wanna see this.



Originally posted by Alfheim
Please EXPLAIN how he was trouble hitting him.
you know due to the fact he was missing..........




Originally posted by Alfheim
No but when you punch somebody you just make contact then you lretract. When you grab somebody you make contact then you have to grip...its more compliacted...not rocket scince but more difficult..
It does not involve skill never the less nor is it more then a fraction of a bit harder to do.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Does Scorpion have superhuman reflexes or not? He might be a putz but he was still able to beat up Luke cage and give Cap some trouble. So Luke Cage and Cap are idiots?]
capt pritty much stomped him and capt does not have spidermans powerset.

stop trying to use abc logic it does not work here




Originally posted by Alfheim
You call casually garbbing a speeblitzing Spiderman no skill?
No it not it reflex speed.



Originally posted by Alfheim
I]"Its not stated explicitly but we can deduce that he probably is an MA expert because he has taken out Spiderman with ease something that Cap and DD have not been able to do and his training has enabled him to beat Delilah who is a trained assasin. So we can conclude that he is an MA expert because his job involves beating people up and he does it very well"?
sorry, but he ebat spiderman due to his superior durability and strength. Nothing to do with skill at all. Ya and what has Delilah done? nothing jsut like BT

sorry rough-house job involves beating people up as does most bad guys and there not all 2nd tiers or even 3rd or 4th.





Originally posted by Alfheim
Read above.



Is second tier the same as third tier? Who was this person anyway and how did the fight go? [/QUOTE
off pannel. bull eye almost kill him.........and dient sound like he put up much of a fight.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
really he beat some one with superhuman reaction speed/reflexes with out.........his serum. I wanna see this.


The point im trying to make is that even without the serum Cap is still dangerous. Cap has dodged attacks from a pissed off Thunderstrike, no hes not as fast as Spiderman but he does have enhanced reflexes. So its not just the serum thats makes him so good its tha training as well so you cant assume that superhuman stats are what makes you dangerous. If Cap fought Spiderman with no H2H knowledge he would get stomped.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

you know due to the fact he was missing..........

He wasnt trying. Read the dialogue. In their second fight he stated that he didnt want to kill him. In the first fight he was allowing himself to get hit, does that look like somebody who is trying their best?

Originally posted by Battlehammer


It does not involve skill never the less nor is it more then a fraction of a bit harder to do.

So what you saying is grabbing a fast person doesnt take skill?


Originally posted by Battlehammer
capt pritty much stomped him and capt does not have spidermans powerset.

stop trying to use abc logic it does not work here

He beat him with skill.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

No it not it reflex speed.

Grabbing somebody fast doesnt require fasr reflexes? You cant have speed without reflexes?


Originally posted by Battlehammer

sorry, but he ebat spiderman due to his superior durability and strength. Nothing to do with skill at all.

So why did he have no problem grabbing him?


Originally posted by Battlehammer

Ya and what has Delilah done? nothing jsut like BT

She is trained assasin. My point is in order to beat somebody higly trained you need to be higly trained, its not always the case but its a good indication of somebodies training. She also beat one of BTs henchmen and has fought Spiderman before, so shes no wimp.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

sorry rough-house job involves beating people up as does most bad guys and there not all 2nd tiers or even 3rd or 4th.

Its not just that his job involves beating up its the fact that its stated that he has had training. Roughouse hasnt recieved formal training but if was going to recieve formal training what do you think it would be in?


Originally posted by Battlehammer


off pannel. bull eye almost kill him.........and dient sound like he put up much of a fight.

Let me guess did it involve throwing something at him?

Originally posted by Alfheim
The point im trying to make is that even without the serum Cap is still dangerous. Cap has dodged attacks from a pissed off Thunderstrike, no hes not as fast as Spiderman but he does have enhanced reflexes. So its not just the serum thats makes him so good its tha training as well so you cant assume that superhuman stats are what makes you dangerous. If Cap fought Spiderman with no H2H knowledge he would get stomped.
when was this? I have a feeling your talking about when he lsot his super strength not serum.

Yes but his training does not give him faster reflexes. It makes him a better fighter.





Originally posted by Alfheim
He wasnt trying. Read the dialogue. In their second fight he stated that he didnt want to kill him. In the first fight he was allowing himself to get hit, does that look like somebody who is trying their best?.
ya becuase spiderman was trying to kill him right

really wer ein the first fight does he elude to letting him self be hit again?



Originally posted by Alfheim
So what you saying is grabbing a fast person doesnt take skill??.

no it requirea reflex.





Originally posted by Alfheim
Grabbing somebody fast doesnt require fasr reflexes? You cant have speed without reflexes???.
.......umm I stated it required reflex speed............




Originally posted by Alfheim
So why did he have no problem grabbing him????.
..........are you serous. Spiderman hit him at least twice prior to getting caught. You can still hit/grab some one who faster then you are.




Originally posted by Alfheim
She is trained assasin. My point is in order to beat somebody higly trained you need to be higly trained, its not always the case but its a good indication of somebodies training. She also beat one of BTs henchmen and has fought Spiderman before, so shes no wimp.
Not if you have powers. Also she not highly skilled either. She ebat a cannon fodder whoopy. She must be a top tier fighter now.

Give me a break.


Originally posted by Alfheim
Its not just that his job involves beating up its the fact that its stated that he has had training. Roughouse hasnt recieved formal training but if was going to recieve formal training what do you think it would be in?.
sorry training not enough. He shown nothing to even elude to him being ma expert. We know nothing about his training. Also blood scream was trained...........and he no better fighter then rough-house..........




Originally posted by Alfheim
Let me guess did it involve throwing something at him?

card. I think.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
when was this? I have a feeling your talking about when he lsot his super strength not serum.

No its was not when he lost his super strength.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Yes but his training does not give him faster reflexes. It makes him a better fighter.

Yes it does because thats what martial arts do and thats why he has to train to keep at peek peformance even when he has the SSS.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

ya becuase spiderman was trying to kill him right

Well Spiderman would not have been pulling his punches or tyring to move slow would he?

Originally posted by Battlehammer

really wer ein the first fight does he elude to letting him self be hit again?


1. Its common sense. Spidermans punches have no effect on him whatsoever, why would he bother to dodge.
2. In the second fight he states that he alloed a Killeroid to hit him so he could get into a favourable position which indicates he is in the habit of letting himself get hit.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

no it requirea reflex.

Good grief. You cant have skill without reflexes. If you have crap reflexes you cant be a skillful martial artist. If your reflexes are shit you cant hit, dodge, grad or do anything.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

.......umm I stated it required reflex speed............

See above.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

..........are you serous. Spiderman hit him at least twice prior to getting caught. You can still hit/grab some one who faster then you are.

He wasnt taking it seriously. In their second fight he grabbed Spiderman straight away.


Originally posted by Battlehammer

Not if you have powers. Also she not highly skilled either. She ebat a cannon fodder whoopy. She must be a top tier fighter now.

Give me a break.

no no no no no. I didnt say that she was top tier I said her training is enough to make her not a pushover since she has fought Spiderman.



Originally posted by Battlehammer

sorry training not enough. He shown nothing to even elude to him being ma expert.

Taking out Spiderman with ease, you have to remember in both fights he was holding back and is in the habit of letting himself get hit if it doesnt hurt.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

We know nothing about his training.


and again we can conclude that is training is good because it enabled him to beat good opponents easily.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Also blood scream was trained...........and he no better fighter then rough-house..........

Well obvoulsy he isnt as good as BT then is he? Thats the point im amking you can see the level of training by the resulst if BS doesnt show that much skill then his training isnt that good.


Originally posted by Battlehammer


card. I think.

Thats not H2H!!!!!!!!

see this argument pointless.

You think he has skills I don't. you really have no evidence out side him stating to have been trained and his fight with spiderman..........whichw as simply reflexes, but what ever.



so what does this have to do with the fight? nada.


Since he still vastly inferior to Logan in terms of skill and training and experience.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Look that argument is crap. Lots of people on this forum use the argument that we dont know that its certain and its bullshit. You know why because in the real world people are not certain about lots of things but they use the evidence to indicate what the most likely conclusion is. Programmers implement progarms all the time and they are not entirely sure that it will work but they still use them, if they followed your line of logic nothing woulf get done.

Its not stated explicitly but we can deduce that he probably is an MA expert because he has taken out Spiderman with ease something that Cap and DD have not been able to do and his training has enabled him to beat Delilah who is a trained assasin. So we can conclude that he is an MA expert because his job involves beating people up and he does it very well.

Hell its been said on-panel that Delliah is a skilled assasin you might as well argue that she wasnt trained in MA either when the most likely conclusion is that she is.

Whoa. My argument is crap? You gotta be kidding me. BT has shown NO proof at all of being a MA expert. You say he is because the handbook says so. When fighting Spiderman he showed NO MA skills to say hes an expert or even a master at different forms. There is NO evidence leading to Black Tarantula being a MA expert. You cant prove it.

Because he took out Spidey with minimal effort leads you to believe hes a MA expert? Are you serious? BT fights like a brick/slugger. In their first encounter, he did nothing to show such MA skill you mention him having. He GRABBED Spidey and slammed him against the wall. Nothing there says MA expert at all. It must to you though.

In their second encounter, it was pretty much the same thing. Nothing he displayed said MA expert. Again, he grabbed Spidey and slammed him on the floor.

You make me laugh. You say his training allowed him to beat Delilah. His training in weight lifting did. He caught her while she was taking a bath and was choke-slamming her against a wall. In NO WAY did he defeat her with skill. NONE.

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/998/asm428p18we4.th.jpghttp://img410.imageshack.us/img410/2025/asm428p20uq6.th.jpghttp://img46.imageshack.us/img46/8102/asm428p21oj1.th.jpg

Originally posted by jrodslam
Whoa. My argument is crap? You gotta be kidding me. BT has shown NO proof at all of being a MA expert. You say he is because the handbook says so. When fighting Spiderman he showed NO MA skills to say hes an expert or even a master at different forms. There is NO evidence leading to Black Tarantula being a MA expert. You cant prove it.

Because he took out Spidey with minimal effort leads you to believe hes a MA expert? Are you serious? BT fights like a brick/slugger. In their first encounter, he did nothing to show such MA skill you mention him having. He GRABBED Spidey and slammed him against the wall. Nothing there says MA expert at all. It must to you though.

In their second encounter, it was pretty much the same thing. Nothing he displayed said MA expert. Again, he grabbed Spidey and slammed him on the floor.

You make me laugh. You say his training allowed him to beat Delilah. His training in weight lifting did. He caught her while she was taking a bath and was choke-slamming her against a wall. In NO WAY did he defeat her with skill. NONE.

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/998/asm428p18we4.th.jpghttp://img410.imageshack.us/img410/2025/asm428p20uq6.th.jpghttp://img46.imageshack.us/img46/8102/asm428p21oj1.th.jpg

completely agree.

His arguement is rediculous


but but he a easily caught spiderman well he was speed blizitng that must mean he MA expert

makes me laugh lol .

Originally posted by jrodslam
Whoa. My argument is crap? You gotta be kidding me. BT has shown NO proof at all of being a MA expert. You say he is because the handbook says so. When fighting Spiderman he showed NO MA skills to say hes an expert or even a master at different forms. There is NO evidence leading to Black Tarantula being a MA expert. You cant prove it.

Because he took out Spidey with minimal effort leads you to believe hes a MA expert? Are you serious? BT fights like a brick/slugger. In their first encounter, he did nothing to show such MA skill you mention him having. He GRABBED Spidey and slammed him against the wall. Nothing there says MA expert at all. It must to you though.

In their second encounter, it was pretty much the same thing. Nothing he displayed said MA expert. Again, he grabbed Spidey and slammed him on the floor.

What just because he doesnt use fly kicks and pressure points, why would he do that when he doesnt need to? Just because its not flashy doesnt mean hes not an expert hell all Cap does sometimes is just punch people in the face, in difficult situations he would use more advanced techniques BT hasnt needed to. Obvoulsy though if it states hes been trained AND he can tag Spiderman easily thats due to his training regardles of how flashy it is.

Hell I told you that its said on-panel that Caps trains constanly and your response was.

Originally posted by jrodslam


Its been stated that Cap trains in what? Trains caonstantly in acrobatics? Trains constantly in boxing and judo? Daredevil is also always training constantly.


Hell if its stated on panel that Cap trains constantly what the hell do you think he is most likely trained in.

Originally posted by jrodslam

You make me laugh. You say his training allowed him to beat Delilah. His training in weight lifting did. He caught her while she was taking a bath and was choke-slamming her against a wall. In NO WAY did he defeat her with skill. NONE.

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/998/asm428p18we4.th.jpghttp://img410.imageshack.us/img410/2025/asm428p20uq6.th.jpghttp://img46.imageshack.us/img46/8102/asm428p21oj1.th.jpg

Shes a skilled assasin. I would have thought you would need to have speed and stealth to creep uo on an assasin. Yes? Furthermore after he creeped up on her she wasnt able to fgiht back. BT has 25 ton strength but she was able to take shots from a 15 ton Spiderman with minimal effort, 10 more tons is not gonna be enough for her to get pawned like that dont you think she should have been able to fight back a bit?

Originally posted by Battlehammer
completely agree.

His arguement is rediculous


but but he a easily caught spiderman well he was speed blizitng that must mean he MA expert

makes me laugh lol .

Ok then if it was stated that somebody recieved training and they fought Spiderman what evidence would you need to prove how good their training was?

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
http://img202.imagevenue.com/loc194/th_60658_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0007_122_194lo.jpghttp://img189.imagevenue.com/loc486/th_60665_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0009_122_486lo.jpghttp://img190.imagevenue.com/loc117/th_60672_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0011_122_117lo.jpghttp://img155.imagevenue.com/loc754/th_60684_DD_Ann_1_DCP_0012_122_754lo.jpg

Yeah so he was weakened.

Originally posted by Alfheim
What just because he doesnt use fly kicks and pressure points, why would he do that when he doesnt need to? Just because its not flashy doesnt mean hes not an expert hell all Cap does sometimes is just punch people in the face, in difficult situations he would use more advanced techniques BT hasnt needed to. Obvoulsy though if it states hes been trained AND he can tag Spiderman easily thats due to his training regardles of how flashy it is.

Fly kicks and pressure points? Not at all. His fighting style doesnt say "expert martial artist". He appears to be a boxer brawler. Thats it. He doesnt seem any more impressive in h2h skills than Luke Cage. He doesnt have to be flashy to be an expert martial artist at all. He doesnt seem more impressive h2h wise than Kingpin, and Kingpin isnt an expert either. You say that in a more difficult situation, hed use more advanced techniques, but how do you know? Hes been trained, so that means hes a MA expert in your eyes?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Hell I told you that its said on-panel that Caps trains constanly and your response was.

Hell if its stated on panel that Cap trains constantly what the hell do you think he is most likely trained in.

Umm wasnt the debate with Cap and DD was who knows more styles? Cap is probably the best street lvl'er fighter. It can be debated. Why not? I stated that DD knew more styles overall in MA than Cap. Youre respone was that Cap trains constantly and hes older, so he learned more styles than DD.

You cant compare Cap to BT for the simple fact that Cap has been in much more fights than BT, and has shown much more skills over the years than BT has. True Cap throws the punches like a boxer, but hes also displayed the more technical skills/MA vs BP, DD, IF, Wolvie, Batman, etc.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Shes a skilled assasin. I would have thought you would need to have speed and stealth to creep uo on an assasin. Yes? Furthermore after he creeped up on her she wasnt able to fgiht back. BT has 25 ton strength but she was able to take shots from a 15 ton Spiderman with minimal effort, 10 more tons is not gonna be enough for her to get pawned like that dont you think she should have been able to fight back a bit?

Shes a skilled assasin, ok. Shes taking a bath and she HEARD BT coming. She thought it was someone else. You dont need speed as much as you would need stealth to creep up on someone. He came from out of the darkness. Big whoopie. Shw wasnt able to fight back cause he had her by the throat and hes 15+cl. If Spidey grabbed her from behind like that by her throat, she probably wouldnt have been able to fight back either.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok then if it was stated that somebody recieved training and they fought Spiderman what evidence would you need to prove how good their training was?

Training in what? Agility? Speed? MA's? Boxing?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah so he was weakened.

Yea, he was given pills to surpress his powers. Durability, healing powers, eye beam and strength. He stopped taking them and later in the comic, he mentions that the effects of the drugs are wearing off. The drugs didnt effect his fighting skills however.

Being the "expert MA" that he is, he should have kicked Bullseye's ass. Or at least put up a good fight. Right?

Or did he need the strength, durability and eye beam to beat Bullseye?

Originally posted by Battlehammer
completely agree.

His arguement is rediculous


Let's be very clear, here.

Your argument is that Carlos was taken from his mother as a toddler to begin his training, and his whole life was devoted to it until he took up the mantle of Black Tarantula--but he was never taught how to fight--in spite of combat being a major part of what the Black Tarantula is all about.

Originally posted by KK the Great
Let's be very clear, here.

Your argument is that Carlos was taken from his mother as a toddler to begin his training, and his whole life was devoted to it until he took up the mantle of Black Tarantula--but he was never taught how to fight--in spite of combat being a major part of what the Black Tarantula is all about.

And the champion is supposedly the best fighter in the Universe. .

Where are the feats?

Originally posted by Battlehammer
how it poor writing that wolverien dodged scots blast? it well with his his ability and scots character for somethign like that it happen. Ya scot could have taken off hsi visor and killed his wife, capt and every one else. also scot used his skill with aim, but Logan was to fast to be hit. You can have all the aim in the world, but if the person can dodge your attacks your screwed.

So you argument is that Wolverine can dodge Cyke's blasts when there are a bunch of other people around and he has to use pencil-thin blasts.

Therefore Black Tarantula would only use pencil-thin blasts?

Your line of logic is missing a step or twelve.



Ah, I see your problem.

It's the brain.

Forgot to use it.

Let me help.


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Originally posted by KK the Great
So you argument is that Wolverine can dodge Cyke's blasts when there are a bunch of other people around and he has to use pencil-thin blasts.

Therefore Black Tarantula would only use pencil-thin blasts?


...........BT can't control the size of his eye blasts so yoru intire arguement is point less.


Your actaing like BT has the same ability as scot with his blasts but he doesent

Originally posted by Battlehammer
...........BT can't control the size of his eye blasts so yoru intire arguement is point less.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/8655/spidermanbt4ed2.jpg



You keep talking about this like Scott's aim is what sets him apart. He's good because he has the skill to do crazy bank shots and things like that.

But they're eyeblasts. As far as plain straight-shot aim goes...

THEY'RE EYEBLASTS.

They go where you're looking.

still waiting to see why BT wins. also I not entirly sure that was BT makeing his eye blast bigger or rather the light given off by it impacted.


either way does not really change any thing. since It can and will be dodged. It not very powerful as shown it only destroyed a few bricks at best nothing that would even come close to Koing Logan.


also you keep ignore one of my posts..........over and over

I have three things to say about this thread.

1) What kind of crazyass quizzes someone in PMs?

2) Wolverine has like the least consistent speed and reflexes in all of Marvel. Sometimes he can apparently see bullets in slow motion or block gunfire with his claws and sometimes he can't even avoid getting webbed up, pushed out a window, or kicked in the face by an elk. I know I've brought this up before and I've been told "he wasn't ready" or something to that effect, but that's sort of where those gun blocking reflexes were supposed to show up.

3) Reflecting optic blasts with a katana is one of the dumbest things I've ever seen. I hope that was at least a magic sword.

Originally posted by Doctor-Alvis
I have three things to say about this thread.

1) What kind of crazyass quizzes someone in PMs?

2) Wolverine has like the least consistent speed and reflexes in all of Marvel. Sometimes he can apparently see bullets in slow motion or block gunfire with his claws and sometimes he can't even avoid getting webbed up, pushed out a window, or kicked in the face by an elk. I know I've brought this up before and I've been told "he wasn't ready" or something to that effect, but that's sort of where those gun blocking reflexes were supposed to show up.

3) Reflecting optic blasts with a katana is one of the dumbest things I've ever seen. I hope that was at least a magic sword.
actauly Logan doesent.


avoid being web up? you mean while he talking..........and has his claws in........ya great evidence there.

Thrown out a window? when he laughing and a teammate for no reason goes pycho. Ya Logan going to be ready for that to happen lol.

your examples are rediculous.

As for the elk one was inorder to see how much his student had learned if you read the issue you know that.


It was magical.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Thrown out a window? when he laughing and a teammate for no reason goes pycho. Ya Logan going to be ready for that to happen lol.

If he's a trained warrior with reflexes that allow him to see bullets in flight it shouldn't matter if he ready or not as long as he's facing toward him.