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If you found out for a fact that some deity were true (any religious creed that you would find disagreement with), would you follow its precepts because it were true even if you disagreed with concepts found therein?

To give an example of the type of concept I am wanting discussed, here is an example:



Now, for you, is there a creed that would cause you to directly oppose deity if you knew for a fact the truth of the claim in a similar manner?

Yeah, there would be. Like if a follower would have to kill or torture people, I don't think I would follow that. It all depends at the situation at hand of course, but I can perceive such scenarios. The Christian God for example, he seems to me to be such a major dick that I can't see myself following his followers teachings.

I would side with truth. Truth is most important in every facet of your life if you want to be healthy emotionally, mentally and physically as well.

Well first off I would need to rethink everything that I believe in and why I believe in it, is it because I was misguided or mislead? This could have profound changes on my values and morals so things that I thought were once one way could change.

Indeed.

But of the current religious/spiritual belief systems, what would it be and why?

Excellent question.

To agree with Pittman, I would have to rethink my conviction concerning whether I exist or not. I'll be back when I've got something better to say.

existance of dieties mean nothing as long as the ideoligies and teaching of a relegion or dogma are bad. i wudnt side with a being who embodied negetive concepts even if it were omnipotent

Originally posted by Regret
But of the current religious/spiritual belief systems, what would it be and why? Which one would I pick? The one that would be the most fun. I don't know which one that is.

well if it was true that a deity created this cesspool we call earth I would oppose it to show what an ass it was for creating it all. If this deity was ok on how its followers act upon set rules, that deity to me would be the bad guy. So yeah the opposition would be heaven to me

I always take the best side.

My side.



You're right.

If I got the social change I wanted, then sure. Otherwise no.
http://www.ovrnite.com/wp-content/uploads/blogpics/alignmen.jpg

Why wouldn't anyone want to follow the truth?

wel, l the truth is out there......... somewhere.......................... Fox

Scully doesn't think so.

If the Christian God existed, I'd definitely be part of the Rebel Alliance against him. Anyone who acts so childish (in the OT), who has such arbitrary absolutist moral laws, and who condemns people to hell, is no God I'd follow, even if he was my creator. So if he was like "Hey guys? I'm real" then I'd believe in him but wouldn't follow him. Same with most deity-centric religions.

But if, say, Taoism was somehow infallibly proven, I'd be on board.

Yes I would.

But none of them are real, NONE!

So it really doesn't matter.

Religion, as a general rule, is not my opposition.

No way! I'm NOT going to argue with some omnipotent God. Not when he could delete me.

if there was an omnipotent god i would been barbecue before I was a sperm, hell my entire line of ancestors would have been, or not have been at all

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Religion, as a general rule, is not my opposition.

Why is there a side?

No, i'd spit in their eye.

This is exactly why I don't believe in any religion.

If you believe in something, you should just believe in it. People do not things on principle. It reminds me of that Santa Claus song:

"He's knows when you are sleeping
He knows you are awake
So you better not be bad
So be good for goodness sake"

You can not be good for "goodness sake" because he is always watching you. The contradiction being that you can do it for "goodness sake" because the whole point of being good is to reap rewards by showing the good behavior that he observes.

No one does "good" based on the principle and that's why a lot of you are saying you would side with the "devil."

Dumb shit.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
existance of dieties mean nothing as long as the ideoligies and teaching of a relegion or dogma are bad. i wudnt side with a being who embodied negetive concepts even if it were omnipotent

But how could you possibly know what "negative" concepts are? The scenario we are considering challenges the basic concept of morality, so even if you decided to do the right thing, you would have a really tough time knowing what the right thing is.

Originally posted by chithappens
This is exactly why I don't believe in any religion.

If you believe in something, you should just believe in it. People do not things on principle. It reminds me of that Santa Claus song:

"He's knows when you are sleeping
He knows you are awake
So you better not be bad
So be good for goodness sake"

You can not be good for "goodness sake" because he is always watching you. The contradiction being that you can do it for "goodness sake" because the whole point of being good is to reap rewards by showing the good behavior that he observes.

No one does "good" based on the principle and that's why a lot of you are saying you would side with the "devil."

Dumb shit.

Hmm, good point. Religion often does set up the idea that morality should be held to for the sake of incentive...as opposed to the sake of goodness. But that isn't everybody's reason for religion. I think some people are religious because it is a source of stability, and others are religious solely because of morality, and still others because of the nature of their belief (ie, some Christians are good Christians because they not only believe in Christ, they care about Christ and respect him...and would strive to follow him regardless of their reward).

To pick sides would be egotistic of god. Does god have an ego?

Originally posted by Deja~vu
To pick sides would be egotistic of god. Does god have an ego?

Ya, why would anyone need to pick sides. There is no war going on in some fictitious heaven, and if there was, I would not have anything to do with it.

Originally posted by Regret
If you found out for a fact that some deity were true (any religious creed that you would find disagreement with), would you follow its precepts because it were true even if you disagreed with concepts found therein?

To give an example of the type of concept I am wanting discussed, here is an example:



Now, for you, is there a creed that would cause you to directly oppose deity if you knew for a fact the truth of the claim in a similar manner?


I think that's a good question, and a Bold one considering it opens challenges towards your own Faith.



I already beleive in "God", but i have my own idea of what God is.


If I discovered that my idea was wrong, and that the Christian-Judeo and/or Muslim version of God actually existed, and that his nature is true to the explanations of the Bible and Quran, then No, I wouldn't adhere.


I can't follow someone whose that immature, cruel, and self-contradictory. I wouldn't openly hate or insult him, I just wouldn't rely on him for anything.

However, I wouldn't side with Satan either. If Satan were real, then he's just as big a villian, and siding with him would be of no good to me or anyone else. It would be a war I'd like to stay out of.



*This reminds me of the Armageddon Saga in Spawn.


God and Satan were both evil, and Heaven and Hell were simply kingdoms at eternal war with one another, using human souls as warriors for thier own personal vendetta.

It's set up as a sales pitch. What would get you at the final sale. They both have advertisements to lure you. Each have propaganda against the other service/product. It's marketing. Of course it's all fictitious.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I think that's a good question, and a Bold one considering it opens challenges towards your own Faith.



I already beleive in "God", but i have my own idea of what God is.


If I discovered that my idea was wrong, and that the Christian-Judeo and/or Muslim version of God actually existed, and that his nature is true to the explanations of the Bible and Quran, then No, I wouldn't adhere.


I can't follow someone whose that immature, cruel, and self-contradictory. I wouldn't openly hate or insult him, I just wouldn't rely on him for anything.

However, I wouldn't side with Satan either. If Satan were real, then he's just as big a villian, and siding with him would be of no good to me or anyone else. It would be a war I'd like to stay out of.



*This reminds me of the Armageddon Saga in Spawn.


God and Satan were both evil, and Heaven and Hell were simply kingdoms at eternal war with one another, using human souls as warriors for thier own personal vendetta.

So how would you act in this scenario? Would you try to resist both sides? Maybe find some people who agree with you? Or maybe you would give up, and set yourself free of moral restraints because you have lost faith in moral consequences. I'm curious to know how everyone would respond in their moral decisions.

Originally posted by Quark_666
So how would you act in this scenario?


Well to be honest, at first I'd be very afraid. There are two nearly omnnipotent beings who can easily destroy me, torment me physically and mentally, and do with me as they wish.

I would silently let both know that I mean neither any offense, but I'd appreciate to live my own life, without either of their influence. I would also promise to stay out of thier affairs (as in not openly speaking out against religion, etc.)

But I wouldn't worship anyone that cruel or stupid. Sorry.



Originally posted by Quark_666
Would you try to resist both sides?


No. I'd just leave them be, and live my own life. I'd also try to find out if Gaia existed. I would rather worship a Goddess who is the mother of Earth, who also is the mediator between life and death and its cycle (as cruel or uncruel as she may be), then two male testosterone filled idiots who make eternal consequences on those they favor or disfavor.

Atleast Gaia's consequences would be temporary, as the Earth is always changing, and nothing on it is eternal.


If she did exist, I would worship her and beg her for protection from God and Satan- lol





Originally posted by Quark_666
Maybe find some people who agree with you?


Definately. There's always power in numbers. Regardless of what side you are on.






Originally posted by Quark_666
Or maybe you would give up, and set yourself free of moral restraints because you have lost faith in moral consequences.



Now you see....

I don't really think morality is about what God or the Devil do to you. To me, morality is only about How you treat other people. (And animals, but that's another argument).

I am sure there are plenty of people who do evil and get away with it. That doesn't make thier actions any less evil.





Originally posted by Quark_666
I'm curious to know how everyone would respond in their moral decisions.



I would be the same. Treat people with Respect, not kill or torture anyone, and just live my life as I do now.

Originally posted by chithappens
This is exactly why I don't believe in any religion.

If you believe in something, you should just believe in it. People do not things on principle. It reminds me of that Santa Claus song:

"He's knows when you are sleeping
He knows you are awake
So you better not be bad
So be good for goodness sake"

You can not be good for "goodness sake" because he is always watching you. The contradiction being that you can do it for "goodness sake" because the whole point of being good is to reap rewards by showing the good behavior that he observes.


I'm almost certain the phrase "goodness sake" is being used idiomatically.

Originally posted by Quark_666
But how could you possibly know what "negative" concepts are? The scenario we are considering challenges the basic concept of morality, so even if you decided to do the right thing, you would have a really tough time knowing what the right thing is.

to me negetivity is a concept which exists in this world in the minds of humans/many other animals, vaguely. it is a product OF sentience. it relies on worldy logic and reasoning. to me , logically, all sentiences of a sepecies are equal. they rely on the concept of existance to be defined. as such, things which threaten this existance are negetive. hence existance is preferrable over non existance. also, all sentiences are equal, and hence it is wrong to end sum1's existance to favour yours. these sentiences have, by their nature, various needs {eg. sex, desire to have their physical and mental functions taken care of, to care and love for others, to have companions, etc etc etc} without which they suffer {which is defined by their nature to not be preferrable} and with which they are happy{which is defined by the nature of these sentiences to be preferrable}. hence to pursue these things is preferrable for all sentiences, as long as thye follow the initial rule and not step on the rights of other sentiences to attain these things and be happy. ofcourse variation among less major things will always exist on what makes who happy, i think that still, this is a great way to logically come up with a morality.

so really, there is no need for an illogical morality defined by sum imaginary or real mystical force or god. this is how i define negetive concepts.

You really thought this through!

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I would silently let both know that I mean neither any offense, but I'd appreciate to live my own life, without either of their influence. I would also promise to stay out of thier affairs (as in not openly speaking out against religion, etc.)

I wish you luck...I hope that in this scenario, the deities would be reasonable enough to listen.

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
But I wouldn't worship anyone that cruel or stupid. Sorry.

Hmm...maybe i'll forgive you

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
Now you see....

I don't really think morality is about what God or the Devil do to you. To me, morality is only about How you treat other people. (And animals, but that's another argument).

Fair enough. But my question had more to it. According to almost every belief involving God, God has loads to do with the consequences of morality...meaning that whether or not your definition of morality changes in this scenario, your ability to get away with anything is dramatically increased. How would that affect your lifestyle?

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I would be the same. Treat people with Respect, not kill or torture anyone, and just live my life as I do now.

thumbsup

Originally posted by Quark_666
Fair enough. But my question had more to it. According to almost every belief involving God, God has loads to do with the consequences of morality...meaning that whether or not your definition of morality changes in this scenario, your ability to get away with anything is dramatically increased. How would that affect your lifestyle?

Oops, sorry, never mind. You already answered. My mistake

Originally posted by SpearofDestiny
I am sure there are plenty of people who do evil and get away with it. That doesn't make thier actions any less evil.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
That is if the Devil is real. Satan is more likely a myth told to people to keep them in line.

Unless he's real. Then you're completely screwed.


As for the topic of the thread I don't think I'd undermine my morals simply because something told me it was god. But then again it's never happened to me.

So then if something said "I am God" after you die then what do you do?

LMAO, religion is so damn silly.

Originally posted by chithappens
So then if something said "I am God" after you die then what do you do?

Stay dead?

But, what if you can't?