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Frank Castle vs DCU. Frank Castle gets a GL ring and is taught for 100 years by an experienced (not the very best but a good GL) Green Lantern. He then gets taught by Big G on the construction and maintenance of the punisher robots, Frank then becomes an expert specfically in this area. Frank Castle is then given 10 Punisher robots and GL ring recharger

Frank gets a map of the DCU, the map only gives basic information. He is teleporeted to an isolated area of the DCU (some car factory in the desert) and has two years to construct a plan to conquer the DCU.

DCU is informed 1 day before Frank attacks. Frank has been told if he suceeds he gets his family back.

P.S. Robots are immune to defeat via matter manipluation, or trapster substance in internal circuirty.

P.P.S Assume Frank cant be detected in his base of operation but you have to determine wether Frank can stop himself from being detected while he gathers prep or resources.

This exact same thread has been made before, hasn't it?


Word for word.

No, my bad...last time you just made him find Apokolips

Originally posted by Bardock42
This exact same thread has been made before, hasn't it?


Word for word.

Well for starters he has a GL ring recharger and his base of operation is specified. In this thread we dont assume that he will be undetected before he finishes his prep.

Frank dies a miserable death.

While a singular GL can be considered a (possible) planet buster , a single Gl with Ten robots versus Thousands of Metas, OTHER Gl's , Daxamites, Anti Monitor etc.

Frank will be reduced to atoms and his 'armada' recycled into coke cans.

Originally posted by grey fox
Frank dies a miserable death.

While a singular GL can be considered a (possible) planet buster , a single Gl with Ten robots versus Thousands of Metas, OTHER Gl's , Daxamites, Anti Monitor etc.

Frank will be reduced to atoms and his 'armada' recycled into coke cans.

Sorry its vs DC earth......you know when Frank killed the MU it was just earth and not the actual universe.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Sorry its vs DC earth......you know when Frank killed the MU it was just earth and not the actual universe.

The same still applies. SBP Frank 'aint.

Originally posted by grey fox
The same still applies. SBP Frank 'aint.

Bro he has 100years of training. Frank has one of the strongest willpowers in the MU, that will make him a very powerful GL I dont think sub-skyfather level is absurd. 1 Punisher robot is capable of stomping 1 high herald character. He can even use the ring to replicate more of them........

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Frank Castle vs DCU. Frank Castle gets a GL ring and is taught for 100 years by an experienced (not the very best but a good GL) Green Lantern. He then gets taught by Big G on the construction and maintenance of the punisher robots, Frank then becomes an expert specfically in this area. Frank Castle is then given 10 Punisher robots and GL ring recharger

Frank gets a map of the DCU, the map only gives basic information. He is teleporeted to an isolated area of the DCU (some car factory in the desert) and has two years to construct a plan to conquer the DCU.

DCU is informed 1 day before Frank attacks. Frank has been told if he suceeds he gets his family back.

P.S. Robots are immune to defeat via matter manipluation, or trapster substance in internal circuirty.

P.P.S Assume Frank cant be detected in his base of operation but you have to determine wether Frank can stop himself from being detected while he gathers prep or resources.

dc gets a day's prep?

while i'm not even sure frank could wield the ring effectively (ollie's will, like frank's might be considered cynical), even if he could, he isn't going to beat most of dc when they know he's coming...

jla (the current one) ftw imo...

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Bro he has 100years of training. Frank has one of the strongest willpowers in the MU, that will make him a very powerful GL I dont think sub-skyfather level is absurd. 1 Punisher robot is capable of stomping 1 high herald character. He can even use the ring to replicate more of them........

lol.

Johnny Sorrow can merely just show his face to Frank and that's it. I just don't see how Frank could take over the DC Earth

Originally posted by Raoul
dc gets a day's prep?

while i'm not even sure frank could wield the ring effectively

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Frank Castle vs DCU. Frank Castle gets a GL ring and is taught for 100 years by an experienced (not the very best but a good GL) Green Lantern.


You are also aware that the Silver Surfer, Thing, Human Torch and Mister Fantatic could not put down 1 Punisher robot.....he starts the prep with 10. What happens if he gets 100s?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
You are also aware that the Silver Surfer, Thing, Human Torch and Mister Fantatic could not put down 1 Punisher robot.....he starts the prep with 10. What happens if he gets 100s?

way to miss the point, there...

Frank looses because of all the mystics (Dr. Fate, Zatanna), telepaths (Martian Manhunter, Maxima), energy manipulators (Dr. Light, Green Lantern), Elemantals (Sandman, Red Tornado), Powerhouses (Superman, Shazam), Speedsters (Flash, Jonny Quick), braniacs (Batman, Mr. Terrific) .

with all those people Frank would loose.

Originally posted by Raoul
way to miss the point, there...

He seems to do that often.

.

Frank Castle as a Lantern.

See Green Arrow.

Batman takes his ass down.

Originally posted by grey fox
He seems to do that often.

I didnt miss the point and I dont miss the point often. The point is that Ollie is cynical about the GL ring?

1. Did Ollie have 100 years training?
2. Obvoulsy im assuming that hes not cynical, that why I gave him the ring in the firstplace.

.....and I missed the point.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I didnt miss the point and I dont miss the point often. The point is that Ollie is cynical about the GL ring?

1. Did Ollie have 100 years training?
2. Obvoulsy im assuming that hes not cynical, that why I gave him the ring in the firstplace.

.....and I missed the point.

here's an example: batman had trouble with the ring, while superman used it with little effort... green arrow had trouble, while kyle/hal used it easily... no matter how much training you get, the ring will always respond easier to the likes of clark and hal than it would frank...

frank is cynical, and there is one last point:

even with 100 years training, is he going to be as good as hal? or john? and even those two are beatable by their fellow leaguers...

Originally posted by Raoul
here's an example: batman had trouble with the ring, while superman used it with little effort... green arrow had trouble, while kyle/hal used it easily... no matter how much training you get, the ring will always respond easier to the likes of clark and hal than it would frank...

Ok you can prove this can you? So you're assuming that because Batman had trouble with the ring to start off with, that it would always respond the ring better than it would with Hal? So if two people learn how to drive 1 person picks it up with less skill, we are going to assume that the person who has trouble is always going to be left behind?

Originally posted by Raoul

frank is cynical, and there is one last point:

Cynical of what? In general or the supernatural magic in general? Anyway I stated at the beginning of the thread that if he succeeds his family will be brought back to life and he believes it.

Originally posted by Raoul

even with 100 years training, is he going to be as good as hal? or john? and even those two are beatable by their fellow leaguers...

He has alot of willpower and time. People change over time.

Originally posted by complexbrother
Frank looses because of all the mystics (Dr. Fate, Zatanna), telepaths (Martian Manhunter, Maxima), energy manipulators (Dr. Light, Green Lantern), Elemantals (Sandman, Red Tornado), Powerhouses (Superman, Shazam), Speedsters (Flash, Jonny Quick), braniacs (Batman, Mr. Terrific) .

with all those people Frank would loose.

Exactly!

This truly would not be close. Frank loses hard.

Not even in a 100 years could you turn a rookie into someone comparable to Kyle, Alan or Hal. The closest you'd get would have to be Kilowog, if you're lucky.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Ok you can prove this can you? So you're assuming that because Batman had trouble with the ring to start off with, that it would always respond the ring better than it would with Hal? So if two people learn how to drive 1 person picks it up with less skill, we are going to assume that the person who has trouble is always going to be left behind?



Cynical of what? In general or the supernatural magic in general? Anyway I stated at the beginning of the thread that if he succeeds his family will be brought back to life and he believes it.



He has alot of willpower and time. People change over time.

You didn't answer the question.

Even with a hundred years of training, do you believe that Frank would be anywhere near the prowess of the likes of Hal or Kyle?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Ok you can prove this can you? So you're assuming that because Batman had trouble with the ring to start off with, that it would always respond the ring better than it would with Hal? So if two people learn how to drive 1 person picks it up with less skill, we are going to assume that the person who has trouble is always going to be left behind?

well i did read gl v4 and rebirth, so... ermm

there's a reason mogo picks particular people, because they have imagination, the abilitty to overcome fear, and the right kind of willpower... its not like some gun you can learn how to use... the ring responds better to certain types of people, thats just the way it is...



cynical in general...



thats not the point... even if frank does all you say he does, and trains as much as possible with the ring, is he going to be able to take hal or john?

Originally posted by Soljer
You didn't answer the question.

Even with a hundred years of training, do you believe that Frank would be anywhere near the prowess of the likes of Hal or Kyle?

Yeah I did.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

He has alot of willpower and time. People change over time.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Yeah I did.

Really?

I never saw Paul ask "How much willpower does Frank have?" nor did I see him pose the question "Do peope change?"

I saw him ask "Do you believe the Punisher would be on the level of Hal or John?"

And you've dodged the question several times now. So I'll broaden it.

Do you believe that the Punisher would be on the level of ANY of the four Earth-Lanterns? Hal, Kyle, Guy, or John?

Originally posted by Raoul
well i did read gl v4 and rebirth, so... ermm

there's a reason mogo picks particular people, because they have imagination, the abilitty to overcome fear, and the right kind of willpower... its not like some gun you can learn how to use... the ring responds better to certain types of people, thats just the way it is...

You do realise that still doesnt prove that Hal will always be better than Batman? All that proves is that Hal has more potential it could be argued that after a 100 years Bats could catch up.


Originally posted by Raoul

cynical in general...

1. Im not sure if that matters because he is not cynical when trying to take people out. He demonstrates great willpower in doing what he does and the ring would feed off it.
2. In this thread he is told that if he suceeds he will get his family back, obvoulsy I stated this as an indication that Frank believes this to be possible and would power his ring.


Originally posted by Raoul

thats not the point... even if frank does all you say he does, and trains as much as possible with the ring, is he going to be able to take hal or john?

After 100 years he would be better because:

1. Not the most powerful hero but one of the greatest willpowers in the MU. Im sure there are other aspects that make you a great GL but willpower is the most important aspect. Could Hal do the tings that Frank does without the ring?
2. Even if cyncism affect the power of GL rings he believes its possible to get his family back and this will be a powerul motivating factor.
3. He has lots and lots of time

even IF frank was that level though...

he's not going to match hal AND john...

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
You do realise that still doesnt prove that Hal will always be better than Batman? All that proves is that Hal has more potential it could be argued that after a 100 years Bats could catch up.




1. Im not sure if that matters because he is not cynical when trying to take people out. He demonstrates great willpower in doing what he does and the ring would feed off it.
2. In this thread he is told that if he suceeds he will get his family back, obvoulsy I stated this as an indication that Frank believes this to be possible and would power his ring.

read gl v4 issue #9, and you'll see why what you just said is just plain wrong...



so (SOMEHOW, by some fluke) he's as good as hal... hal couldnt take dc earth by himself with a few robots...

Originally posted by Soljer
Really?

I never saw Paul ask "How much willpower does Frank have?" nor did I see him pose the question "Do peope change?"

I saw him ask "Do you believe the Punisher would be on the level of Hal or John?"

And you've dodged the question several times now. So I'll broaden it.

Do you believe that the Punisher would be on the level of ANY of the four Earth-Lanterns? Hal, Kyle, Guy, or John?

So why did I say he has lots of willpower and time and as response to his question? How many times have you heard that time enables you to gain skills and become better? How many times has somebody stated that willpower enables you to achieve greater things? Right and you cant figure out what I meant?

Any of other posts about the intepretation of what I said will be ignored. Anyway doesnt matter because I answered the question in my previous post.

Originally posted by Raoul
even IF frank was that level though...

he's not going to match hal AND john...



read gl v4 issue #9, and you'll see why what you just said is just plain wrong...

I'll read it when im ready. Since you're the one making the statement you tell me what they said.

edit: no need Soljet explained but that still does not prove that Frank cant reach Hals level.


Originally posted by Raoul

so (SOMEHOW, by some fluke) he's as good as hal... hal couldnt take dc earth by himself with a few robots...

They're not "robots" they're Silver Surfer stomping robots.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

After 100 years he would be better because:

1. Not the most powerful hero but one of the greatest willpowers in the MU. Im sure there are other aspects that make you a great GL but willpower is the most important aspect. Could Hal do the tings that Frank does without the ring?
2. Even if cyncism affect the power of GL rings he believes its possible to get his family back and this will be a powerul motivating factor.
3. He has lots and lots of time

Ahahahahahahahaha!

Jesus Christ, I can't breathe. That's too ****ing funny.



*wipes tears from face*

Okay. Now that I've caught my breath...

Lemme explain something. Lanterns are chosen from the DCU for their great willpower and ability to resist fear. They're chosen as the elites of their race. Paragons, as it were.

Many of the lanterns of a variety of races are quite long lived. To some of these guys, a hundred years is meaningless. They've been at the lantern game for far longer than that.

Guess what? Even being a paragon of their race for willpower and ability to resist fear. Even with a pure, non-cynical will. Even after being a lantern for far longer than a hundred years....

Hal Highball Jordan is still the best lantern in the corps. He's still numero uno. He's still the best of the best.

For you to assert that Frank Castle, a person that'd be lucky to even get the ring to SPARK, would be able to surpass Hal in a millenia of training is moronic - much less a single century.

Frank won't touch Hal. He wouldn't be worthy to clean the Guardian's shit-holes after a century of ring-slinging.

No contest. .

Originally posted by Soljer
Ahahahahahahahaha!

Jesus Christ, I can't breathe. That's too ****ing funny.



*wipes tears from face*

Okay. Now that I've caught my breath...

Lemme explain something. Lanterns are chosen from the DCU for their great willpower and ability to resist fear. They're chosen as the elites of their race. Paragons, as it were.

Many of the lanterns of a variety of races are quite long lived. To some of these guys, a hundred years is meaningless. They've been at the lantern game for far longer than that.

Guess what? Even being a paragon of their race for willpower and ability to resist fear. Even with a pure, non-cynical will. Even after being a lantern for far longer than a hundred years....

Hal Highball Jordan is still the best lantern in the corps. He's still numero uno. He's still the best of the best.

For you to assert that Frank Castle, a person that'd be lucky to even get the ring to SPARK, would be able to surpass Hal in a millenia of training is moronic - much less a single century.

Frank won't touch Hal. He wouldn't be worthy to clean the Guardian's shit-holes after a century of ring-slinging.

No contest. .

That actually doesnt prove that Frank cant reach Hals level all that proves is that 100 years does not neccesarily help. Since Frank is not a memeber of the DCU we dont know but I would still expect 100 years to still be very helpful.

I was also under the impression that Hal is the best because he has the greatest willpower. Obvoulsy the others arent as strong as he is.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
That actually doesnt prove that Frank cant reach Hals level all that proves is that 100 years does not neccesarily help.


Perhaps I missed something.

Is this thread "Can Frank reach or exceed Hal Jordan's ring-slinging prowess given an unlimited amount of time?"

Or is it "Frank Castle fights DC Earth"?

Originally posted by Soljer
Perhaps I missed something.

Is this thread "Can Frank reach or exceed Hal Jordan's ring-slinging prowess given an unlimited amount of time?"

Or is it "Frank Castle fights DC Earth"?

You asked the question about wether Frank could be better than Hal, im just responding to that. You said that he cant touch Hal, not neccesarily.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
You asked the question about wether Frank could be better than Hal, im just responding to that. You said that he cant touch Hal, not neccesarily.

Do not put words into my mouth. I asked whether you believed Frank to be Hal's superior after a century. You responded in the affirmative; that Castle WOULD be better than Jordan after just a hundred years.

I immediately dispelled such a notion for what it was; rubbish.

Further...

Since, as mentioned, after a hundred years Frank wouldn't even be powerful enough to clean the Guardian's latrines, exactly how is he going to take on DC Earth?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I'll read it when im ready. Since you're the one making the statement you tell me what they said.

edit: no need Soljet explained but that still does not prove that Frank cant reach Hals level.




They're not "robots" they're Silver Surfer stomping robots.

ill just post it instead...

http://i108.imagethrust.com/t/784787/untitledscanned20.jpg http://i115.imagethrust.com/t/784788/untitledscanned21.jpg http://i106.imagethrust.com/t/784789/untitledscanned22.jpg http://i115.imagethrust.com/t/784790/untitledscanned23.jpg

if that doesnt illustrate just WHY it would be insanely hard for frank to use the ring, then i give up...

Originally posted by Soljer
Do not put words into my mouth. I asked whether you believed Frank to be Hal's superior after a century. You responded in the affirmative; that Castle WOULD be better than Jordan after just a hundred years.

Oh sorry I forgot to add 100 years in my post but I guess you couldnt figure out thats what I was refering to. I guess I always have to say yes and no I cant find other ways of saying it as well.

Originally posted by Soljer

I immediately dispelled such a notion for what it was; rubbish.

Er you just proved that it may not neccesarily be true.


Originally posted by Soljer

Further...

Since, as mentioned, after a hundred years Frank wouldn't even be powerful enough to clean the Guardian's latrines, exactly how is he going to take on DC Earth?

No you didnt prove it. All you proved is that some Gls are older than 100s and are not better than Hal. That still doesnt change the fact that willpower is an important parts of using the GL ring and after 100 years even if hes not as good as Hal he should at least be average especially if hes getting personal tution.

He should still be at some average skill level with the ring. He still has the Punisher robots he is an expert on building modifying and maintaining them. They are Galactus level tech and should be able to modify them to make them stealthy enough to avoid detection. He also has a map with basic information on every aspect of the DCU, so he knows that certain people have defences in certain places he doesnt know in-depth what they have but will possibly will be able to think of different alternatives of stealth.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

No you didnt prove it. All you proved is that some Gls are older than 100s and are not better than Hal. That still doesnt change the fact that willpower is an important parts of using the GL ring and after 100 years even if hes not as good as Hal he should at least be average especially if hes getting personal tution.

These lanterns that have been at it for over a century have some of the strongest willpower in the universe and have trained with the likes of the Muskateers and Kilowog. .

Originally posted by Raoul
ill just post it instead...

http://i108.imagethrust.com/t/784787/untitledscanned20.jpg http://i115.imagethrust.com/t/784788/untitledscanned21.jpg http://i106.imagethrust.com/t/784789/untitledscanned22.jpg http://i115.imagethrust.com/t/784790/untitledscanned23.jpg

if that doesnt illustrate just WHY it would be insanely hard for frank to use the ring, then i give up...

1. It shows Batman was able to use the ring at his first attempt.
2. In this thread Frank is using the power of the death of his family to power the ring. In the scans you posted the death of his family hindered his power, that is not the case in this thread.

Theres not thing to "I give up" about. Hell it could be argued from that post if it wasnt for the death of his parents that actually after 100 years he could catch up with Hal....possibly. 131

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I didnt miss the point

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
and I dont miss the point often. hysterical

Originally posted by Soljer
These lanterns that have been at it for over a century have some of the strongest willpower in the universe and have trained with the likes of the Muskateers and Kilowog. .


Frank is not a member of the DCU so we dont know how powerful it is. Frank Castle may not be a cosmic being but probably has one of the strongest willpower in marvel comics. Hell even Ulik commented him on his courage and was willing to blow himself up along with Ulik. One of the reason why he has so much damage soak is because of his determination, can Hal do the stuff that Frank does without the ring?

As the scans show bitterness does reduce the power of the ring, that power in this case is going to increase his power instead of hindering. It could be argued that combined with his will would make him a formidable GL.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Frank is not a member of the DCU so we dont know how powerful it is. Frank Castle may not be a cosmic being but probably has one of the strongest willpower in marvel comics. Hell even Ulik commented him on his courage and was willing to blow himself up along with Ulik. One of the reason why he has so much damage soak is because of his determination, can Hal do the stuff that Frank does without the ring?

As the scans show bitterness does reduce the power of the ring, that power in this case is going to increase his power instead of hindering. It could be argued that combined with his will would make him a formidable GL.

Hal's willpower is so strong, that (without the ring) he displayed low-level telekinesis. Not due to magic, cosmic power, or mutation, but sheer will-power.

Meaning, though it was low-level telekinesis, Hal Jordan displayed the ability to warp reality through willpower alone.

Get back to me when Frank Castle has a chance in hell of doing something similar.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Ok you can prove this can you? So you're assuming that because Batman had trouble with the ring to start off with, that it would always respond the ring better than it would with Hal? So if two people learn how to drive 1 person picks it up with less skill, we are going to assume that the person who has trouble is always going to be left behind?



Cynical of what? In general or the supernatural magic in general? Anyway I stated at the beginning of the thread that if he succeeds his family will be brought back to life and he believes it.



He has alot of willpower and time. People change over time.

The rings works off of willpower and emotion. Both Ollie and Batman understand that man is a horrible monstrous creature , but at times can be lead to moral and virtuous situations.

Punisher thinks everyone is a criminal or criminal in waiting. Criminals are 100% evil and deserve to be killed. No mercy.

I'd be incredibly surprised if the ring even gave a slight glow for Punisher.

Originally posted by Soljer
Hal's willpower is so strong, that (without the ring) he displayed low-level telekinesis. Not due to magic, cosmic power, or mutation, but sheer will-power.

Meaning, though it was low-level telekinesis, Hal Jordan displayed the ability to warp reality through willpower alone.

Get back to me when Frank Castle has a chance in hell of doing something similar.

Was that after he had recieved training for using the ring or before?

Originally posted by grey fox
The rings works off of willpower and emotion. Both Ollie and Batman understand that man is a horrible monstrous creature , but at times can be lead to moral and virtuous situations.

Punisher thinks everyone is a criminal or criminal in waiting. Criminals are 100% evil and deserve to be killed. No mercy.

I'd be incredibly surprised if the ring even gave a slight glow for Punisher.


I dont think he thinks that everybody is a criminal but he is merciless. Hell one man saved Franks life from DP because he saved his families life. Hes just extreme.

When Hal went mad the ring, it almost seemed as if he was more powerful.

Hahahaha

Now Alfheim is comparing Frank Castle to ****ing Parallax.

.

I'd expect no less.

Originally posted by Soljer
Hahahaha

Now Alfheim is comparing Frank Castle to ****ing Parallax.

.

I'd expect no less.



Well one incident im thinking of specifically is when Hal recreated star city from his ring, due to the fact that Paralax was controlling him it should have reduced his powers according to the scans that Raoul showed me.

As far as I know Parralax did not make him more powerful Hal draining the abttery did.

Originally posted by Soljer
Hahahaha

Now Alfheim is comparing Frank Castle to ****ing Parallax.

.

I'd expect no less.











God this kids spewin some good stuff out today!

Laugh my ****ing ass off.

I didn't think the acronym would do it justice.

hysterical crylaugh hysterical2 lmao lol

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
1. It shows Batman was able to use the ring at his first attempt.
2. In this thread Frank is using the power of the death of his family to power the ring. In the scans you posted the death of his family hindered his power, that is not the case in this thread.

Theres not thing to "I give up" about. Hell it could be argued from that post if it wasnt for the death of his parents that actually after 100 years he could catch up with Hal....possibly. 131

holy sweet motherf*cking christ.

read it again. and again. and again. until you get it. and once more just to be sure...

Oh for fuc...



Hal runs over and punches Punisher's jaw off. The Punishers are taken out by Spectre.

No wait... Black Adam tears Frank in half... the Punisher's come later.

Originally posted by Raoul
holy sweet motherf*cking christ.

read it again. and again. and again. until you get it. and once more just to be sure...

There is nothing to get. He used the ring for the first time he had some trouble with it but showed some degree of control. So basically you're assuming that because he had trouble with it for the first time that hes going to keep having trouble with it?

Im getting Jesus ****ing christ for that? So basically he had trouble using it the first time so lets just assume that he will always have trouble using it.

punisher dies

you've got the no mercy part right. aside from that i think you're wrong. frank is literally working BECAUSE he doesn't want people to wind up becoming like him. he says that on several occassions.
he gave all the money from a bust (thousands of it, if not millions) to 3 people who just happened to be nice to him. i doubt he'd do something like that if he felt everyone was a crook.

Batman is the "dark one" of the DC guys and the ring was fine for him. the only big difference between him and Frank is that frank kills (and has cooler monologues).

@Raoul, i think you're the one who needs to read what phantom is saying. you're scans aren't helping you either.

~Sado

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
There is nothing to get. He used the ring for the first time he had some trouble with it but showed some degree of control. So basically you're assuming that because he had trouble with it for the first time that hes going to keep having trouble with it?

Im getting Jesus ****ing christ for that? So basically he had trouble using it the first time so lets just assume that he will always have trouble using it.

no. he had trouble with it, and would always have trouble with it, because of the man he is. he's batman as a direct result of what happened to his parents. his FEAR of the same happening to what happened to his parents, and his quest for vengeance means that he puts FEAR into the minds of criminals. he will never be able to be a top class gl until he moves past whats happened to him in his life, to look for a better tomorrow...

see the parallels?

give batman a yellow ring, and he'd pwn, frank would probably be decent with a yellow ring too, but a gl ring is a whole other ball-game...

Originally posted by Sado22
@Raoul, i think you're the one who needs to read what phantom is saying. you're scans aren't helping you either.

~Sado

then you aren't reading them right...

Originally posted by Raoul
no. he had trouble with it,

I would expect anybody to have trouble with something if he used it for the first time.

Originally posted by Raoul

and would always have trouble with it, because of the man he is. he's batman as a direct result of what happened to his parents. his FEAR of the same happening to what happened to his parents, and his quest for vengeance means that he puts FEAR into the minds of criminals. he will never be able to be a top class gl until he moves past whats happened to him in his life, to look for a better tomorrow...

see the parallels?

No because:

1. It could be argued that if Bruce was given a GL ring and told that if you become a GL and do such and such you will get your parents back that he could look to a better tommorrow if he believed this to be true.

I have stated at the beginning of this thread that Frank is told he'll get back his family obvoulsy I stated this to indicate that he would believe this and work for it. The situation in the scans is different because he doesnt believe his parents are coming back so there is no motivation to let go. 131

2. How comes Sinestro and Hal possesed by Parallax were able to use the ring? Most of what they do involves fear.

3. The GLs are allowed to kill now, they didnt suddenly lose the ability to use the rings. Im pretty sure that would instill fear.

Originally posted by Raoul

give batman a yellow ring, and he'd pwn, frank would probably be decent with a yellow ring too, but a gl ring is a whole other ball-game...

True but you still have not proven that he cant use the ring well.

Originally posted by Raoul

then you aren't reading them right...

Seems like he is to me.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I would expect anybody to have trouble with something if he used it for the first time.

but it was harder for him than others...





actually no... gl rings aren't to be used for personal gain... and even if they were, frank isnt overcoming fear by getting his family back, in fact the fear of failure and not getting his family back might prove to hinder him more than anything else...



sinestro was a master green lantern before he turned evil, he'd have no trouble manipulating the ring...

parallax as hal (im not sure if he used the ring, its been a while since i read it), would still be hal, and have all of his knowledge/willpower...



so i have to prove a negative? you have to prove that he can, and yet you haven't imo...

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I would expect anybody to have trouble with something if he used it for the first time. http://img370.imageshack.us/img370/6057/greenlantern19945107jb8.th.jpg

Firstly,the Day prep let's them jizz punisher.


Secondly,hysterical

raoul, i'll openly (and maybe proudly) admit that that i don't read DC cuz i hate DC, except for Batman comics. so my knowledge of the other guys is limited.

that aside, based on the scans your provided it doesn't that frank would be inefficient in handling it because for one both frank and bruce are driven by the same things (personal loss turned to rage and vengeance) and that they both haven't completely forgotten their painful past. hal even mentions how you have to come to terms with it. so i'm sorry but i don't see your point.

~Sado

Originally posted by Raoul
but it was harder for him than others...

1. Do you have scans of other GLs using the ring for the first time?
2. Even if you do its doesnt matter. Its incorrect logic to think because somebody has a better start that they will always be better than a slow beginner.

Originally posted by Raoul

actually no... gl rings aren't to be used for personal gain.


They are in this thread.

Originally posted by Raoul

.. and even if they were, frank isnt overcoming fear by getting his family back, in fact the fear of failure and not getting his family back might prove to hinder him more than anything else...

They keyword there is 'might'. Your assuming that somebody after 100 years with strong willpower cant focus on the possibility of getting his family back instead of the fear of losing them. Hell it could be argued that even if doesnt get his family back he would enjoy killing villains along the way.

Kyles had to deal with bereavment hasnt stopped him from using the ring. Can you prove that Kyle has stronger willpower than Frank...hell when he got chosen he was told "you will have to do".


Originally posted by Raoul

sinestro was a master green lantern before he turned evil, he'd have no trouble manipulating the ring...

He was evil and he used the ring. According to your theory that would have reduced his power. So fear does not neccesarily stop you from using the ring if you have the will.

Originally posted by Raoul

parallax as hal (im not sure if he used the ring, its been a while since i read it), would still be hal, and have all of his knowledge/willpower...


So? Shouldnt his power have reduced? When Star City was destroyed he recreated the whole city with his ring.

What about the GLs killing, was their power reduced?

Originally posted by Raoul

so i have to prove a negative? you have to prove that he can, and yet you haven't imo...

As far as I can see you have not proven anything. Everybody knows that willpower powers the GL ring but you are arguing that Franks fear will hinder him, this is contradicted by:

1. Kyle has had to deal with bereavment and continued being a GL, apparently there is nothing particulary special about him either, sure he has strong willpower but hes not Jesus Christ.
2. Sinestro used the ring while commiting evil acts.
3. Hal still was able to use the riing after Star City was destroyed.
4. Gls can now kill and their power is not reduced.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
http://img370.imageshack.us/img370/6057/greenlantern19945107jb8.th.jpg

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

2. Even if you do its doesnt matter. Its incorrect logic to think because somebody has a better start that they will always be better than a slow beginner.

Originally posted by Sado22
raoul, i'll openly (and maybe proudly) admit that that i don't read DC cuz i hate DC, except for Batman comics. so my knowledge of the other guys is limited.

that aside, based on the scans your provided it doesn't that frank would be inefficient in handling it because for one both frank and bruce are driven by the same things (personal loss turned to rage and vengeance) and that they both haven't completely forgotten their painful past. hal even mentions how you have to come to terms with it. so i'm sorry but i don't see your point.

~Sado The fact that Batman hasn't let go of his past and is driven by that personal loss turned vengeance is why he's ineffective at using the Power Ring.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
The fact that Batman hasn't let go of his past and is driven by that personal loss turned vengeance is why he's ineffective at using the Power Ring.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

I have stated at the beginning of this thread that Frank is told he'll get back his family obvoulsy I stated this to indicate that he would believe this and work for it. The situation in the scans is different because he doesnt believe his parents are coming back so there is no motivation to let go. 131

Also other characters driven by instilling fear in others have been able to use the GL ring.

Who tells Frank he'll get his family back?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Even if you do its doesnt matter. Its incorrect logic to think because somebody has a better start that they will always be better than a slow beginner. What teachers told you in school doesn't necessarily apply to comics.

The ones who are chosen by Mogo are chosen because they're compatible. People who run in shoes that are to large to fill tend to fall over a lot.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
They are in this thread. Let's make shit up to try and give Punisher better chances.

Do you really think a thread like this makes Punisher look good?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Also other characters driven by instilling fear in others have been able to use the GL ring. You're comparing Sinestro and Hal Jordan, being able to effectively wield a weapon they already know very well despite a restrictive factor, to someone who has the restrictive factor in place as they're trying to learn how to use the weapon at all. False analogy.

Also that he's going to try and kill people purely to get his family that were killed that he's still obsessing about doesn't strike me as letting go of his past... ergo the restrictive factor to him wielding the weapon is still in place.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
What teachers told you in school doesn't necessarily apply to comics.


Prove it. If I put one foot in front of the other i'll assume that its the same in comics unless proven otherwise. If somebody jumps in water, they get wet in comics unless proven otherwise. If somebody has trouble learning at his first attempt unless proven otherwise you cant assume that he cant catch up.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

The ones who are chosen by Mogo are chosen because they're compatible.

Right and since Frank isnt a member of the DCU you cant prove that hes not compatible but we do know that he has strong will and that is important to the use of the ring.


Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Let's make shit up to try and give Punisher better chances.

Tough im the threadstarter and I stated that he can use teh ring to conquer earth. Furthermore Sinetsro used his ring to become a dictator anyway. 131

So,specifically,who tells Frank his family will return?I mean,disembodied voice doesn't really inspire confidence.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
You're comparing Sinestro and Hal Jordan, being able to effectively wield a weapon they already know very well despite a restrictive factor, to someone who has the restrictive factor in place as they're trying to learn how to use the weapon at all. False analogy.

First of all its not even a restrictive factor because he can get his family back.

Secondly even if it was a restrictive factor you cant assume he cant get better.

Hal or Sinestros power were not reduced by fear, so if you have willpower that does not neccesarily mean that fear can stop you if you have strong willpower.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Also that he's going to try and kill people purely to get his family that were killed that he's still obsessing about doesn't strike me as letting go of his past... ergo the restrictive factor to him wielding the weapon is still in place.

The reason why its a restrictive factor because you are assuming that
he cant focus on the job. Hell im pretty sure Gls get into battles were they need to save love ones but they still focus their minds.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Prove it. If I put one foot in front of the other i'll assume that its the same in comics unless proven otherwise. If somebody jumps in water, they get wet in comics unless proven otherwise. If somebody has trouble learning at his first attempt unless proven otherwise you cant assume that he cant catch up.

Right and since Frank isnt a member of the DCU you cant prove that hes not compatible but we do know that he has strong will and that is important to the use of the ring. How long do you think some of the other Green Lanterns from other sectors have been Green Lanterns? How long do you think Kilowog has been one to become a trainer of Green Lanterns? People chosen by Mogo because of their attributes making them suitable Green Lanterns. How long has the sentient planet Mogo been one?

How long did it take Kyle Rayner to surpass pretty much all of them because of his innate personality and ability? With the exception of Hal, whom most consider to be equal. You either have it or you don't, and Punisher like Batman doesn't.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Tough im the threadstarter and I stated that he can use teh ring to conquer earth. Furthermore Sinetsro used his ring to become a dictator anyway. 131 The Word destroys Punisher and his stupid robots.

Conquering Earth won't be quite as easy as conquering Korugar though. And Sinestro did that under the guise of protecting, upholding good, and the green lantern code. He just went too far with it eventually. That was why it was allowed for the time, because it was within the rings parameters.

Check out what happened when Hal misused the ring in Emerald Twilight.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
How long do you think some of the other Green Lanterns from other sectors have been Green Lanterns? How long do you think Kilowog has been one to become a trainer of Green Lanterns? People chosen by Mogo because of their attributes making them suitable Green Lanterns. How long has the sentient planet Mogo been one?

How long did it take Kyle Rayner to surpass pretty much all of them because of his innate personality and ability? With the exception of Hal, whom most consider to be equal.


There two things that need to be considered:
1. Can Frank become a decent GL
2. Can Frank be as good as Hal

The fact that others have been doing it for ages implies there is a strong possibility that Frank will not be on the level of Hal or Kyle but that does not prove that he cant be a good GL.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

You either have it or you don't, and Punisher like Batman doesn't.
The Word destroys Punisher and his stupid robots.

Really? Thats not what you said when I created the Frank Castle vs Thing thread. Hell Frank only had 1 years prep here he gets 100.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

The GL ring can do anything that the user can imagine and will. One could argue that the Punisher may not have sufficient imagination or willpower, but frankly I don't think it would require that much to take out poor Benji.

131

Theres a good case for Frank not being as good as Hal but theres also a good case for him being a good GL.

Originally posted by Juntai
Conquering Earth won't be quite as easy as conquering Korugar though. And Sinestro did that under the guise of protecting, upholding good, and the green lantern code. He just went too far with it eventually. That was why it was allowed for the time, because it was within the rings parameters.

He could conquer the earth within GL parameters he could argue that hes doing it for the good of the people as well.

Originally posted by Juntai

Check out what happened when Hal misused the ring in Emerald Twilight.

Ok but why didnt he ring backfire on him when he was Parallax? Bro all that happened was that he got a holographic porjection from Oa saying he cnat use the ring and that happened when the power of the ring ran out. I also stated at the beginning of the thread that Frank has his own battery so they cant cut off his supply even if they wanted to.

Batman with a GL ring would be able to beat Thing. That doesn't mean he'd be a good GL. Even with a century. It certainly doesn't mean being anywhere near as good as Hal or Kyle.

Thing = DCU? 100 Things = DCU?

If you realize that there's no chance in hell that he'd be as good as Hal or Kyle, or even Guy or John, or Kilowog or Salaak, (because he wouldn't) then what on Earth makes you think that adding some robots that Zatanna can turn into butterflies (not matter manipulation, magic) can manage to take out the entirety of DC Earth, which would include the likes of some of the above? As well as a fifth dimensional imp, several pantheons of Skyfathers, people who can easily stop him dead in his tracks like Johnny Sorrow, Saint of Killers, Jesse Custer (technically Vertigo but they still interact with main DC on occasion)?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
He could conquer the earth within GL parameters he could argue that hes doing it for the good of the people as well. It's not something to debate, it just is or isn't.

But the point was Korugar didn't have superheros like Earth does, they only had Sinestro.

Hal Jordan was still pure of heart and intention, regardless of Parallax's involvement.

Originally posted by Sado22
raoul, i'll openly (and maybe proudly) admit that that i don't read DC cuz i hate DC, except for Batman comics. so my knowledge of the other guys is limited.

that aside, based on the scans your provided it doesn't that frank would be inefficient in handling it because for one both frank and bruce are driven by the same things (personal loss turned to rage and vengeance) and that they both haven't completely forgotten their painful past. hal even mentions how you have to come to terms with it. so i'm sorry but i don't see your point.

~Sado

i know... they have to come to terms with it to use the gl ring effectively, thats how it works... batman wont ever be a great gl until he deals with that loss...

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
1. Do you have scans of other GLs using the ring for the first time?
2. Even if you do its doesnt matter. Its incorrect logic to think because somebody has a better start that they will always be better than a slow beginner.

actually, no, that's not what i'm saying at all...




which just illustrates how little you know of gl, then...



no it can't...



kyle doesnt let his pain define who he is...



being evil is not equal to having fear. ALL green lantern's have to overcome great fear, its pretty much a requirement of getting the ring... and sinestro isn't evil... he's a villain yes, but only because his views are misguided... he's like magneto in his own way...




COAST CITY. COAST. CITY.



up until about three issues ago, GL rings couldnt kill. at ALL. it was hardwired into them by the guardians. this lethal force thing is brand new.



and you have? i don't have to prove he can't, you have to prove he CAN. which you haven't done...



Its not the same. Kyle has gone through bereavement, yes, but it didnt define him the way bruce or frank let their own pain define them...



there's nothing that says the ring can't be used for evil, if used with the skill of a master, which sinestro us...



because he's HAL FRICKIN JORDAN. THE GREATEST GREEN LANTERN WHO EVER LIVED.



why would it be? the guardians said it can be used for that... but everyone using the rings now was still recruited the exact same way... they all had the ability to overcome great fear, they were all chosen by mogo... they were GL's before the change, and they'll be GL's if it changes back...

okay but the scenario for Frank says that he gets his family back. that's a hellova motivation right there. also frank has ignored the whole family plead thing in the past when Micro kidnapped him in MAX. he also ignored it all when the angels showed him paradise and his family after Punisher: purgatory.....he was able to live with it even then.

~Sado

Originally posted by Raoul
i know... they have to come to terms with it to use the gl ring effectively, thats how it works... batman wont ever be a great gl until he deals with that loss...



actually, no, that's not what i'm saying at all...




which just illustrates how little you know of gl, then...



no it can't...



kyle doesnt let his pain define who he is...



being evil is not equal to having fear. ALL green lantern's have to overcome great fear, its pretty much a requirement of getting the ring... and sinestro isn't evil... he's a villain yes, but only because his views are misguided... he's like magneto in his own way...




COAST CITY. COAST. CITY.



up until about three issues ago, GL rings couldnt kill. at ALL. it was hardwired into them by the guardians. this lethal force thing is brand new.



and you have? i don't have to prove he can't, you have to prove he CAN. which you haven't done...



Its not the same. Kyle has gone through bereavement, yes, but it didnt define him the way bruce or frank let their own pain define them...



there's nothing that says the ring can't be used for evil, if used with the skill of a master, which sinestro us...



because he's HAL FRICKIN JORDAN. THE GREATEST GREEN LANTERN WHO EVER LIVED.



why would it be? the guardians said it can be used for that... but everyone using the rings now was still recruited the exact same way... they all had the ability to overcome great fear, they were all chosen by mogo... they were GL's before the change, and they'll be GL's if it changes back...

Reported 313

Originally posted by Sado22
okay but the scenario for Frank says that he gets his family back. that's a hellova motivation right there. also frank has ignored the whole family plead thing in the past when Micro kidnapped him in MAX. he also ignored it all when the angels showed him paradise and his family after Punisher: purgatory.....he was able to live with it even then.

~Sado

it goes deeper than that though... why is he the punisher? what drove him to be that guy? hal lost his father, but he still became a pilot, kyle lost his girlfriends, but he didnt let it stop him being who he was, guy gardner, john stewart, kilowog lost his entire planet, alot of gl's have experienced loss, but they didnt let it take over their lives...

Originally posted by llagrok
Reported 313

ha-son

Originally posted by Raoul
it goes deeper than that though... why is he the punisher? what drove him to be that guy? hal lost his father, but he still became a pilot, kyle lost his girlfriends, but he didnt let it stop him being who he was, guy gardner, john stewart, kilowog lost his entire planet, alot of gl's have experienced loss, but they didnt let it take over their lives...



I'll respond to the rest of the post later.

Even in the scans you provided showed that Batman had limited control (got rid of the bats that were driving him nuts) He doesnt even need to let go of it it would just take him longer. It could dman well be argued that he could use the fear to work for him. Hell the reason why the image stopped projecting was because Batman didnt want to see it anymore. "I dont want to".

Furthermore why are these people GLs in the firstplace? You dont think that the fact that Kilowog lost his planet and stopping that from happening again is part of what motivates him?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I would expect anybody to have trouble with something if he used it for the first time.




Superman didn't have any trouble. Guess why.

Originally posted by Sado22
raoul, i'll openly (and maybe proudly) admit that that i don't read DC cuz i hate DC


Thanks for admitting that you're a biased moron. Your opinion bears no weight in this thread.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Right and since Frank isnt a member of the DCU you cant prove that hes not compatible but we do know that he has strong will and that is important to the use of the ring.

We also know that a strong will isn't nearly enough. Ollie has a strong will. Batman has a far stronger will than the Punisher. Neither'd make very good lanterns.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
There two things that need to be considered:
1. Can Frank become a decent GL
2. Can Frank be as good as Hal


1. Define decent. Would he, eventually, be a low-mid-tier? Sure. He'd never even have the likes of Hal or Kyle in his sights.

2. See above. He'd never be a quarter as formidable as Jordan.
Originally posted by Raoul



COAST CITY. COAST. CITY.



Originally posted by Raoul


because he's HAL FRICKIN JORDAN. THE GREATEST GREEN LANTERN WHO EVER LIVED.

Originally posted by Sado22
raoul, i'll openly (and maybe proudly) admit that that i don't read DC cuz i hate DC, except for Batman comics.
~Sado

Have you at least read the ****ing Sandman or Watchmen?

Franks with GL ring vs Thing

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Punisher has had a years prep in using the ring he fights the Thing in the black forest in Germany.

Originally posted by Soljer
.....

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
C'mon man, whats up?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot


Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Ok could somebody explains whats wrong with my thread?

Originally posted by AQUA-MARINER
ibeileve this is one of those spite treads that ppl do on accident....

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Ok he gets a years prep?????? I dont read DC, I thought those Glers were bad ass?

I have changed my prep, to a years in the first post.

Originally posted by Badabing
eek2 eer shocking













Thing loses, BADLY!

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
You're interpreting people wrong.
I just felt like using that smiley in lieu of an actual response.

The GL ring can do anything that the user can imagine and will. One could argue that the Punisher may not have sufficient imagination or willpower, but frankly I don't think it would require that much to take out poor Benji.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I thought people were gonna say Franks loses badly. Well if it was a month who would win?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well obvoulsy if you dont say anything, im going to misinterpret you.


Ok frank gets one years prep and faces.....Gladiator!!!!

Originally posted by Badabing
Frank has a strong will. He has to in order to endure physical pain. I'm not sure how much imagination Frank has but I believe he could think of a large, powerful weapon that could take out Ben within a month. This is purely speculation on my part since I don't have much of a reference.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well ok one years prep vs gladiator then?

Originally posted by Tassadar
Thing loses. In a horrible curbstomping. Not sure about Gladiator.

Originally posted by Stupid Rookie
Punisher could easily do whatver he want to thing

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
the thread is no longer Frank vs Thing. its Frank vs Gladiator. Frank gets one years prep with GL ring.

Originally posted by Zeitgeist
Frank takes him. All Frank has to do is raise a SHIELD in time for Glads to hit him, then taunt Glads. Suddenly Glads, seeing he didn't even make a scratch, loses all his confidence.

Frank is a pro at targeting his enemies' weak points, and Gladiator has a huge weak point.

Frank takes both of these fights.

Note: Notice how xmarksthespot and Soljer agree that Frank can use the ring to beat Thing in 1 year but now all of a sudden want to argue that he cant use the ring effectively. Obvoulsy Soljer is going to say "Oh well I didnt say anything dont put words in my mouth", when its obvious that he like the rest of the others agree that Frank can use the ring in 1 year.

I might respond to posts later but im just sick of the double standards. Hell I should have posted that thread and watch you guys argue you how he cant beat Thing.

i'm sorry but whats your point?
we're talking about Frank and Bruce as people who have lost people and have hence used that to fuel their desire for vengeance. and the point was that bruce couldn't let go (as he said himself) but clearly could if he wanted to or forced himself to. your scans clearly show that. despite his initial lack of control he manages to get it under control. in the end he just didn't because he wasn't ready to let go of his parents' memory and all the other soap opera stuff.

in comparison here, not only does Frank have a direct motivation to do it (pretty sure, Bats would let go of his memory if hal told him he'd get his family back) but he has HUNDRED YEARS to prepare for it.

as to why he's Punisher:
well here is the thing, bats is vengeance and rage for losing his family. he's gotten obsessed and hence wants to purge all that evil away

Frank is PUNISHMENT. he saw a system that failed him horribly and decided that there is only one thing he could do: punish those who took advantage of the system. he says that repeatedly that he is what any normal man with a spine would do, any husband, any father. that's what he said to spiderman to shut him up: you guys have webs, and super healing. you guys can fly, can lift tons and dodge bullets. but what can the average person do? when it comes down to it, i'm about the only thing an average person can become when tragedy hits.

~Sado

Originally posted by Sado22
TWO HUNDRED YEARS to prepare for it.

~Sado

Sorry mate 100 years with the GL ring.

i don't know what you talking about shifty

Originally posted by Sado22
i don't know what you talking about shifty

mmm

Originally posted by Raoul

which just illustrates how little you know of gl, then...

Still doesnt matter I dont seem to be doing that bad especially when most people think that Frank Castle can use the ring in 1 year to beat Thing. 131

Furthermore I stated at the beginning of this thread that Frank gets his own personal battery recharger, so if he uses the ring for personal gain he wont get any messages from Oa because its not hardwired to the central battery.


Originally posted by Raoul

no it can't...

Because you said so, brilliant.


Originally posted by Raoul

kyle doesnt let his pain define who he is...

Yeah so? You keep making this statement that if somebody allows pain to define who they are they cant use the ring. You showed Batman having some trouble with the ring for the first time and actually managed to get it under control, notice how the bats disappeared? Hell the image of his parents disappeared, why did it disappear since Batman said "I dont want to", im assuming thats because he didnt want to project the image anymore.

Originally posted by Raoul


being evil is not equal to having fear. ALL green lantern's have to overcome great fear, its pretty much a requirement of getting the ring... and sinestro isn't evil... he's a villain yes, but only because his views are misguided... he's like magneto in his own way...

Yes but you also stated that using the ring to instill fear in others will hinder his performance. Sinestro did this and it didnt stop him from using the GL ring.


Originally posted by Raoul


COAST CITY. COAST. CITY.

Irrelevant you know what im talking about. Stop shouting your a mod.


Originally posted by Raoul

up until about three issues ago, GL rings couldnt kill. at ALL. it was hardwired into them by the guardians. this lethal force thing is brand new.

How does that change my point? killing people instills fear, nobody had any trouble with the ring when they started doing it. Intilling fear in others doesnt hinder the performance of the ring...you see the response of one of the sinestro corps members?

Anyway its his own personal ring he can do what he wants. I stated at the beginning of the thread.

Originally posted by Raoul

and you have? i don't have to prove he can't, you have to prove he CAN. which you haven't done...

Er you keep making this unfounded statement that if somebody is defined by loss they cant use the ring. Batman used the ring he had trouble but he got it under control. Even if he cant get over his loss with enough willpower he can still use the ring. The point is that in the real world people get better over time, unless you can prove that this is not the case in the comic world we can assume that with enough willpower he can still use the ring.

Chuck water over somebody in the real world they get wet, its the same in the comic world unless evidence is given.


Originally posted by Raoul

Its not the same. Kyle has gone through bereavement, yes, but it didnt define him the way bruce or frank let their own pain define them...

So why cant he put it behind him for the purposes of this thread? Hell even if he cant you havent proven that he cant use it.



Originally posted by Raoul

there's nothing that says the ring can't be used for evil, if used with the skill of a master, which sinestro us...

Anyway doesnt matter because his ring isnt connected to the central battery its his own personal GL ring, stated at the beginning of the thread.

Originally posted by Raoul

because he's HAL FRICKIN JORDAN. THE GREATEST GREEN LANTERN WHO EVER LIVED.


Stop shouting and swearing your a mod. You missed the point. Hal is the greatest Gl that lived but he is still subject to limitations like other GLs but because he is better he is less limited. YOU said that fear hinders the ability to use the ring, if that were true then when Coast city got destroyed his power should have been reduced. Hal does have great feats when his power starts to run it but the fact he is the greatest GL doesnt mean that this reduces his potential.

Originally posted by Raoul

why would it be? the guardians said it can be used for that... but everyone using the rings now was still recruited the exact same way... they all had the ability to overcome great fear, they were all chosen by mogo... they were GL's before the change, and they'll be GL's if it changes back...

Anyway it doesnt matter because its his own personal ring. I stated this at the beginning of the thread.

even if frank somehow becomes more powerful than hal (which is impossible) he still can't touch dc earth.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Note: Notice how xmarksthespot and Soljer agree that Frank can use the ring to beat Thing in 1 year but now all of a sudden want to argue that he cant use the ring effectively. Obvoulsy Soljer is going to say "Oh well I didnt say anything dont put words in my mouth", when its obvious that he like the rest of the others agree that Frank can use the ring in 1 year.

I might respond to posts later but im just sick of the double standards. Hell I should have posted that thread and watch you guys argue you how he cant beat Thing. Elaborate on how being able to beat a low cl100 not particularly versatile brick extrapolates to being able to beat all of DC Earth including a 5th dimensional imp. You currently remind me of those Bible-thumping creationist quote-miners.

Do you think the effectiveness of a GL ring increases exponentially over time? In a linear direct correlation? Logarithmically?

And frick isn't a swear word... it's barely a word. You put **** in half your posts these days.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Batman with a GL ring would be able to beat Thing. That doesn't mean he'd be a good GL. Even with a century. It certainly doesn't mean being anywhere near as good as Hal or Kyle.

I already admitted it would be unlikley for him to be as good as Kyle I however think he could become a good GL. Hell you said he wouldnt be effective at using the ring, if he can beat Thing in 1 year obvoulsy he will be pawning herald in 100 years if thats not effective I dont know what is.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Thing = DCU? 100 Things = DCU?

Were the hell did I say that stop putting word into my mouth for godsake. So he can beat Thing that means he can pawn DC earth? All we are discussing here is how good he'll be. Furthermore I havnet even decided wether Frank beats DC earth the whole bloody point of this thread was a bit of fun you decided to intepret it as Frank pawns DC earth because he cant beat Thing.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

If you realize that there's no chance in hell that he'd be as good as Hal or Kyle, or even Guy or John, or Kilowog or Salaak, (because he wouldn't)

Dont know who the others are but as far as im concerned I think he would be one of the best. Hes displayed more willpower than alot of heroes and aliens included so im gonna assume that hes got one of the strongest wills in the universe.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

then what on Earth makes you think that adding some robots that Zatanna can turn into butterflies (not matter manipulation, magic) can manage to take out the entirety of DC Earth, which would include the likes of some of the above? As well as a fifth dimensional imp, several pantheons of Skyfathers, people who can easily stop him dead in his tracks like Johnny Sorrow, Saint of Killers, Jesse Custer (technically Vertigo but they still interact with main DC on occasion)?

Dont IMPS live in the fith dimension and not on DC earth?
Dont the Gods live in another dimension and not on earth.
Hell last time I checked Sain of Killers wasnt on earth either he was in heaven.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Elaborate on how being able to beat a low cl100 not particularly versatile brick extrapolates to being able to beat all of DC Earth including a 5th dimensional imp. You currently remind me of those Bible-thumping creationist quote-miners.

IT DOESNT AND I NEVER SAID IT DID!!!!!!!! I NEVER SAID THAT BEING ABLE TO BEAT THING MAKES HIM ABLE TO BEAT DC EARTH SO WHY ARE YOU MAKING THAT ASSUMPTION????

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Do you think the effectiveness of a GL ring increases exponentially over time? In a linear direct correlation? Logarithmically?

Prove that it doesnt.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

And frick isn't a swear word... it's barely a word. You put **** in half your posts these days.

That is.

Originally posted by Raoul
holy sweet motherf*cking christ.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I already admitted it would be unlikley for him to be as good as Kyle I however think he could become a good GL. Hell you said he wouldnt be effective at using the ring, if he can beat Thing in 1 year obvoulsy he will be pawning herald in 100 years if thats not effective I dont know what is. Based on what? Even Kyle Rayner or Hal Jordan would at best stalemate Surfer.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Were the hell did I say that stop putting word into my mouth for godsake. So he can beat Thing that means he can pawn DC earth? All we are discussing here is how good he'll be. Furthermore I havnet even decided wether Frank beats DC earth the whole bloody point of this thread was a bit of fun you decided to intepret it as Frank pawns DC earth because he cant beat Thing.Exaggeration for emphasis. Also trying to determine how you think time actually correlates to effectiveness from your above statement you're under the impression there's some exponential relationship.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Dont know who the others are but as far as im concerned I think he would be one of the best. Hes displayed more willpower than alot of heroes and aliens included so im gonna assume that hes got one of the strongest wills in the universe. Pray tell, which ones do you actually know at all. Also lulz at that last statement.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Dont IMPS live in the fith dimension and not on DC earth?
Dont the Gods live in another dimension and not on earth.
Hell last time I checked Sain of Killers wasnt on earth either he was in heaven. Thunderbolt.
The Pantheons are still on DC Earth afai'm aware.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
IT DOESNT AND I NEVER SAID IT DID!!!!!!!! I NEVER SAID THAT BEING ABLE TO BEAT THING MAKES HIM ABLE TO BEAT DC EARTH SO WHY ARE YOU MAKING THAT ASSUMPTION???? Well based on foolish argument in favor of Punisher. Is this another case of you toning down your responses towards "he'll go very far, blahdeeblahblah"
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Prove that it doesnt.Negative proof. Logical fallacy.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Based on what? Even Kyle Rayner or Hal Jordan would at best stalemate Surfer.

Well for starters SS is high herald anyway. I said herald so that can include low level and mid. Again people get better over time. You need to prove that he cant otherwise.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Exaggeration for emphasis. Also trying to determine how you think


Bullocks.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

time actually correlates to effectiveness from your above statement you're under the impression there's some exponential relationship.


People tend to get better the more they do something, you need to prove otherwise that it doesnt.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Pray tell, which ones do you actually know at all.

Hal, Kyle, John Stewart, Killowog, Guy Gardener.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Also lulz at that last statement.

The reason being is that eventhough some aliens have more powers than he has if they had the same powerset they would not have the willpower to take the damage he can. Also not all heroes aliens are willing to kill themselves so eagerly to destroy their enemy as Frank is.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Thunderbolt.
The Pantheons are still on DC Earth.

Ok which ones? For starters the new gods live on New Genesis thats not on earth.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Well based on foolish argument in favor of Punisher. Is this another case of you toning down your responses towards "he'll go very far, blahdeeblahblah"

That is nonsense. Thing cant even beat Flash or Superman how the hell does that equate to him beating DC earth?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Negative proof. Logical fallacy.


People tend to get better the more they do something, you need to prove otherwise that it doesnt.

Spectre.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Spectre.

Spectre is abstract. Thats not Dc earth.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
People tend to get better the more they do something, you need to prove otherwise that it doesnt. Generalities aren't proof. Prove that this particular something - wielding a GL ring - increases in a linear rate or an exponential rate, the same for everyone. Prove that it increases and doesn't plateau. Prove that if it does plateau that the level of the plateau is the same for everyone. These are claims you're making, provide proof positive.

It clearly doesn't increase the same for everyone. Kyle cf. generic Lanterns.
It clearly does plateau.
It clearly does plateau at different levels. Kyle/Hal cf. generic Lanterns.

Lack of value for one's life doesn't imply willpower. Unless you think suicide bombers are incredibly strong willed people, and not just stupid desperate gullible kids.

Also when I said "know" I should have written "know well" not "know of"

Johnny Sorrow

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
if he can beat Thing in 1 year obvoulsy he will be pawning herald in 100 years

Prove it.

There are limits to these sort of things. The Punisher does not have infinite potential, so to speak.

J'onn mindrapes Frank.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Generalities aren't proof. Prove that this particular something - wielding a GL ring - increases in a linear rate or an exponential rate, the same for everyone. Prove that it increases and doesn't plateau. Prove that if it does plateau that the level of the plateau is the same for everyone. These are claims you're making, provide proof positive.



Rubbish. Next time time a character gets water thrown other him im going to have to prove that he would get wet?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Spectre is abstract. Thats not Dc earth. Spectre is DC Earth... he's been there more often than he's been anywhere else... combined...
He's currently on Earth I believe as well.

Anyway, Black Adam runs in and rips Frank in half.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Rubbish. Next time time a character gets water thrown other him im going to have to prove that he would get wet?

Strawman fallacy. We know for certain that all GLs are not created equal.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Rubbish. Next time time a character gets water thrown other him im going to have to prove that he would get wet? You're stating that Punisher with a hundred years time will become a top ten GL.

You have nothing to base this upon except a false premise that there's some sort of exponential correlation to time with effectiveness of GL rings for anyone and everyone who gets one, and that there's no plateau or that the plateau is equally high for all GLs.

You've already been made aware that there are GLs who have been at it a lot longer than Hal, Kyle, Guy and John, yet have been surpassed. As stated above GLs are not created equal, and they do not develop equally.

Kyle Rayner's very existence disproves that. Rookie Kyle faced off against Parallax Hal Jordan.

You're the one making the claim that goes against the observed.
You're the one that needs to provide proof positive for your claim.

Punisher is not a Kyle. He is not a Hal. He is not a Guy. He is not a John.

But regardless of what anyone tells you, people who know the GLs better than you, people who know the GLs better than me, you will keep arguing and arguing and arguing for Punisher. And then say that you don't think he will win but "will go very far."

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Spectre is DC Earth... he's been there more often than he's been anywhere else... combined...
He's currently on Earth I believe as well.

Anyway, Black Adam runs in and rips Frank in half.

Chocolate Egg Creams > Frank Castle.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Strawman fallacy. We know for certain that all GLs are not created equal.

Rubbish. The fact that GLS are not equal doesnt mean that people cant get better over time with practice. Apparently though im supposed to beleive that Xmarksthespot could beat the Thing in 1 year or 1 day.




Originally posted by xmarksthespot
You're stating that Punisher with a hundred years time will become a top ten GL.

You have nothing to base this upon except a false premise that there's some sort of exponential correlation to time with effectiveness of GL rings for anyone and everyone who gets one, and that there's no plateau or that the plateau is equally high for all GLs.

You've already been made aware that there are GLs who have been at it a lot longer than Hal, Kyle, Guy and John, yet have been surpassed. As stated above GLs are not created equal, and they do not develop equally.

Kyle Rayner's very existence disproves that. Rookie Kyle faced off against Parallax Hal Jordan.

You're the one making the claim that goes against the observed.
You're the one that needs to provide proof positive for your claim.

Punisher is not a Kyle. He is not a Hal. He is not a Guy. He is not a John.

Ok let me be specific. I am going to stcik my neck out and think that he could become one of the best im not sure if thats top ten but lets put it this way if GLs were MA he could be second tier or third tier. I can settle for at least mid-tier

The fact that some GLs cant reach Kyle level does not prove anything because for starters I stated that I think it would be unlikely to reach Kyle level so we can forget about Kyle. However that doesnt mean that they have not been other GLS that get better over time they just didnt reach Kyle level. Hell im sure there are some rookie Gls that got better and didnt remain at that level. Furthermore as far as im concerned he has one of the best willpowers in the universe because more powerful characters have displayed less willpower. I dont think that somehow the aliens in the DCU are especially righteous so im assuming that he would be one of the best.

You are also claiming that you can beat Thing with a GL ring in 1 year and not providing any evidence. You hypocrite.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Rubbish. The fact that GLS are not equal doesnt mean that people cant get better over time with practice.

Sinestro had the ring for decades longer than Hal did but they still ended up as roughly equals. Inherent talent is much more important than practice. You have no way of proving that Frank has such inborn talent.

I didn't say that GLs can't improve.

That doesn't mean that all of them rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That doesn't mean Punisher will rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That certainly doesn't mean he'll become anywhere near the likes of the major Lanterns. You've yet to even show that Punisher has all the requisite innate qualities to even wield the ring. And you've shown nothing to imply he'd improve sufficiently to rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder.

Also lulz at taking my claim of being able to beat the Thing (with a year was what was referred to actually) so seriously. I can kick Batman's ass too. What evidence do you want me to provide? Construct making via teh interwebs?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I didn't say that GLs can't improve.

That doesn't mean that all of them rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That doesn't mean Punisher will rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That certainly doesn't mean he'll become anywhere near the likes of the major Lanterns. You've yet to even show that Punisher has all the requisite innate qualities to even wield the ring.

Also lulz at taking my claim of being able to beat the Thing (with a year was what was referred to actually) so seriously. I can kick Batman's ass too.
You hypocrite.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I didn't say that GLs can't improve.

That doesn't mean that all of them rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That doesn't mean Punisher will rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That certainly doesn't mean he'll become anywhere near the likes of the major Lanterns. You've yet to even show that Punisher has all the requisite innate qualities to even wield the ring. And you've shown nothing to imply he'd improve sufficiently to rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder.

Also lulz at taking my claim of being able to beat the Thing (with a year was what was referred to actually) so seriously. I can kick Batman's ass too. What evidence do you want me to provide? Construct making via teh interwebs?

Do it.

Make a construct travel along mai intahweb connection and hit me in the face.

I dare you.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Sinestro had the ring for decades longer than Hal did but they still ended up as roughly equals. Inherent talent is much more important than practice. You have no way of proving that Frank has such inborn talent.

1. The fact that some people have inborn talent, still does not prove that some people can cath up to a certain level. As I stated I dont think he will be as good as Kyle but I think he can be one of the best and at least mid-tier.

2. My proof is that he has one of the best willpowers in the MU. In the fcat that alot of heroes and aliens cant take the stuff he has to deal with. Since I dont think DC characters are especillay rightoeous im going to assume that this is the case in the DCU. to. 131



Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I didn't say that GLs can't improve.

That doesn't mean that all of them rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That doesn't mean Punisher will rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder. That certainly doesn't mean he'll become anywhere near the likes of the major Lanterns. You've yet to even show that Punisher has all the requisite innate qualities to even wield the ring. And you've shown nothing to imply he'd improve sufficiently to rise above the level of Superboy-Prime fodder.

I already explained that he has one of the best willpowers in the MU and I dont see how DCu is different.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Also lulz at taking my claim of being able to beat the Thing (with a year was what was referred to actually) so seriously. I can kick Batman's ass too. What evidence do you want me to provide? Construct making via teh interwebs?

You were implying that being able to use the ring is relatively easy and were comparing your willpower to Franks. Yeah you could actually you could be describing your pain threshold for starters but obvoulsy it would be nothing like Franks. I do have proof that Frank has will power neccesary.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

2. My proof is that he has one of the best willpowers in the MU.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Lack of value for one's life doesn't imply willpower. Unless you think suicide bombers are incredibly strong willed people, and not just stupid desperate gullible kids.

Don't sweat it, he's a hypocrite and a hypochondriac, he's just trying to hypnotize you.

Originally posted by Soljer


1. Its not just about killing yourself its his pain threshold so thats one part of the argument.

2. your assuming that all people that kill themselves arent doing it because they believe they are doing the right thing and it takes alot of guts to do it. you might not value your life but that doesnt mean you gut the guts to blow yuourself up and put yourself through intense pain.

So the post doesnt neccesarily prove anything.

Having a high pain threshold has nothing to do with willpower.

I've fought with intense bouts of masochism on several occasions. Doesn't mean I'm gonna be creating oblivion anytime soon.

Can we go back to franks will power is one of the best in marvel based on what?

Originally posted by Soljer
Having a high pain threshold has nothing to do with willpower.

I've fought with intense bouts of masochism on several occasions. Doesn't mean I'm gonna be creating oblivion anytime soon.

It has nothing to do with willpower if you're a masocist, that example does not apply to Frank, terrible reasoning he does what he does because he thinks it right not because its "fun". Eating shit doesnt take willpower if you already like it.

Im bettng you dont do surgery on yourself on a regular basis.

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
Can we go back to franks will power is one of the best in marvel based on what?


Based on the fcat that if characters with superpowers has the same powerset is Frank that would not be able to do what he does (savage beating does surgery on himself regularly).

Originally posted by Soljer
Do it.

Make a construct travel along mai intahweb connection and hit me in the face.

I dare you. SHAZAM! Did you feel it? I just Oan right-clicked you.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
It has nothing to do with willpower if you're a masocist, that example does not apply to Frank, terrible reasoning he does what he does because he thinks it right not because its "fun". Eating shit doesnt take willpower if you already like it.

Im bettng you dont do surgery on yourself on a regular basis.




Based on the fcat that if characters with superpowers has the same powerset is Frank that would not be able to do what he does.


You gonna give me some example's of these feat's of will power I honestly want to know.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
It has nothing to do with willpower if you're a masocist, that example does not apply to Frank, terrible reasoning he does what he does because he thinks it right not because its "fun". Eating shit doesnt take willpower if you already like it.

Im bettng you dont do surgery on yourself on a regular basis.




Based on the fcat that if characters with superpowers has the same powerset is Frank that would not be able to do what he does (savage beating does surgery on himself regularly).

The fact of the matter isn't whether Frank is a masochist or not, it's that willpower and pain threshold are not necessarily related.

Plenty of people can take a punch to the face much more easily than they can go a day without a cigarette. The former is pain threshold. The latter is willpower.

Two distinct attributes.

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
You gonna give me some example's of these feat's of will power I honestly want to know.

Well his bio states that he does surgery on himself on a regular basis.

You seen where he gets the crap beaten out of him by the Russian but still kept going. Alot of other heroes eventhough they have superhuman durability couldnt take that crap.

Im giving the example as well that he has no qualms in taking his life to destroy his enemy, alot of other characters would be hesistant about this, but he would feel no way about it.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
You seen where he gets the crap beaten out of him by the Russian but still kept going. Alot of other heroes eventhough they have superhuman durability couldnt take that crap.
Pain Threshold != Willpower.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

Im giving the example as well that he has no qualms in taking his life to destroy his enemy, alot of other characters would be hesistant about this, but he would feel no way about it.

Originally posted by Soljer
The fact of the matter isn't whether Frank is a masochist or not, it's that willpower and pain threshold are not necessarily related.

That depends.

Originally posted by Soljer

Plenty of people can take a punch to the face much more easily than they can go a day without a cigarette. The former is pain threshold. The latter is willpower.

Two distinct attributes.

Originally posted by Soljer
Pain Threshold != Willpower.

That does not apply to doing surgery on yourself. Alot of people could not do this because of the pain, so in this case it takes willpower.

again...

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

2. your assuming that all people that kill themselves arent doing it because they believe they are doing the right thing and it takes alot of guts to do it. you might not value your life but that doesnt mean you gut the guts to blow yuourself up and put yourself through intense pain.

So the post doesnt neccesarily prove anything.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

Alot of people could not do this because of the pain.

Are you illiterate?

Pain Threshold != Willpower.

Originally posted by Soljer
Are you illiterate?

Pain Threshold != Willpower.

Does doing surgery on yourself acquire alot of willpower of it hurts....ALOT?

Im not sure what != means anyway.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
doing surgery on yourself hurts....ALOT?

Originally posted by Soljer
Are you illiterate?

Pain Threshold != Willpower.

Answer the question.


Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Does doing surgery on yourself acquire alot of willpower of it hurts....ALOT?

Im not sure what != means anyway.

Thanos has better willpower than Frank by infinite fold... so I can't see why we're attributing Frank as having one of the greatest willpowers eva!

Cap... has willpower. Magneto has willpower. Doom has willpower. Surfer has willpower.

Frank does teh sergery on himself!!!! he awsome! He weigh better than the resters!

1. What question?

How would performing surgery acquire any amount of willpower?

2. Answer my question.

Originally posted by Soljer
Are you illiterate?

Pain Threshold != Willpower.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Thanos has better willpower than Frank by infinite fold... so I can't see why we're attributing Frank as having one of the greatest willpowers eva!

Cap... has willpower. Magneto has willpower. Doom has willpower. Surfer has willpower.

Frank does teh sergery on himself!!!! he awsome! He weigh better than the resters!

Those guys have powers Frank hasnt you missed the point...again. Cap has SSS that can help him with his pain threshold Frank doesnt. dur

Originally posted by Soljer
1. What question?

How would performing surgery acquire any amount of willpower?

2. Answer my question.

Anyway im off and im not responding to your post until you answer my question.

Powers have nothing to do with willpower. And these guys actually have feats that say "Through force of will, Magneto fights through X's attacks.".

---

Emo's have amazing willpower as well then.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Thanos has better willpower than Frank by infinite fold... so I can't see why we're attributing Frank as having one of the greatest willpowers eva!

Cap... has willpower. Magneto has willpower. Doom has willpower. Surfer has willpower.

Frank does teh sergery on himself!!!! he awsome! He weigh better than the resters!

Lets list the people with more willpower than Frank!

Captain America
Batman
Superman
Silver Surfer
Thanos
Doom
Magneto
Hal
Kyle
Guy
John
Kilowog
Sodam Yat (Even if Bran hates him. )
Deadpool
Cable
Wolverine
Black Adam
Doc Strange
Colossus
Thing
Mon-El
Peter Parker
Namor
Wally West
Ray Palmer


And guess what? Despite all of these characters having more willpower than "TEH FRANK CASTLE DAT DUZ TEH SURGRIEZ!" half of them would ALSO make piss-poor lanterns.

Originally posted by Soljer
Lets list the people with more willpower than Frank!

Captain America
Batman
Superman
Silver Surfer
Thanos
Doom
Magneto
Hal
Kyle
Guy
John
Kilowog
Sodam Yat (Even if Bran hates him. )
Deadpool
Cable
Wolverine
Black Adam
Doc Strange
Colossus
Thing
Mon-El
Peter Parker
Namor
Wally West
Ray Palmer


And guess what? Despite all of these characters having more willpower than "TEH FRANK CASTLE DAT DUZ TEH SURGRIEZ!" half of them would ALSO make piss-poor lanterns.


you missed the point alot of those poeple have superhuman powers Frank doesnt. If they didnt have powers would they be able to do what he does...get it?

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Powers have nothing to do with willpower. And these guys actually have feats that say "Through force of will, Magneto fights through X's attacks.".

---

Emo's have amazing willpower as well then.

That could be explaine by the fcat that he can use magnetism to affect telepathy.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
you missed the point alot of those poeple have superhuman powers Frank doesnt. If they didnt have powers would they be able to do what he does...get it?

What he does? What? Shoot people? Sure.

Take a hit? Sure.

Collect lots of ignorant fanboys?

Well...you might just have me there. I dunno if they'd manage.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
That could be explaine by the fcat that he can use magnetism to affect telepathy.

Except it isn't.

It's explained via willpower.

.

Originally posted by Soljer
I cant make a rebutt so i'll just troll instead

Originally posted by Soljer
Except it isn't.

It's explained via willpower.

.

Prove it show me the scan. Hell even if it is thats doesnt mean that they're arent people with stronger will power than him I dindt say he has the best will power I said he has one of the best, they're are alot of superheroes and hes at the top.

I don't see where I posted that. *looks*

Nope, nowhere.

You asked a question, and I answered it. Would the people I mentioned be able to do what Frank does?

As far as willpower goes? Without a seconds doubt.

Frank does have a lot of willpower, read the first fight between him and Barracuda in MAX Punisher.

Originally posted by Mindset
Frank does have a lot of willpower, read the first fight between him and Barracuda in MAX Punisher.

Punisher MAX isn't canon. Find a better example.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
That could be explaine by the fcat that he can use magnetism to affect telepathy. Ah... that explains this:
http://img490.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thought2xs0.jpg

Originally posted by Soljer

You asked a question, and I answered it.

Theres also the other question and actually other questions you have ignored.

Originally posted by Soljer

Would the people I mentioned be able to do what Frank does?

As far as willpower goes? Without a seconds doubt.

Ok then make a case for every single one on that list. Even if they all did as far as im concerned thats still doesnt prove that he doesnt have one of the best there are alot of superheroes you know.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Theres also the other question and actually other questions you have ignored.



Ok then make a case for every single one on that list. Even if they all did as far as im concerned thats still doesnt prove that he doesnt have one of the best there are alot of superheroes you know.

You're a complete moron. This thread isn't about ANY of them. This thread is about the Punisher. And there have been SEVERAL people to already prove that as a Lantern, Frank'd be ineffective.

Further, what questions? Feel free to ask anything. .

Either way... I've yet to see Frank's willpower proven... let alone proven to be among the best in Marvel...



Black Adam comes in, and takes Frank's heart.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Either way... I've yet to see Frank's willpower proven... let alone proven to be among the best in Marvel...



Black Adam comes in, and takes Frank's heart.

Bran....

He did SURGERY on himself.

Come on, it doesn't get any better than that.

Originally posted by Soljer
You're a complete moron. This thread isn't about ANY of them. This thread is about the Punisher.

Absolute nonsense. You said they have greater willpower than Frank you cant prove that they have more willpower so now your coping out and trying to turn the argument around.


Originally posted by Soljer

And there have been SEVERAL people to already prove that as a Lantern, Frank'd be ineffective.

No they have not. Thats complete nonsense as well, what you proved is that he wont be at Kyles level.

Originally posted by Soljer

Further, what questions? Feel free to ask anything. .

Im not gonna ask you again, sine you've been point dodging and twisting shit around since the very beginning.



Originally posted by Soljer
Punisher MAX isn't canon. Find a better example.

Or taking physical punishment doesnt indicate willpower.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Ah... that explains this:
http://img490.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thought2xs0.jpg

His magnetsim affects telepathy hes suing it in the scans. It could damn well be argued that is one of the reason why was able to resist.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Absolute nonsense. You said they have greater willpower than Frank you cant prove that they have more willpower so now your coping out and trying to turn the argument around.




No they have not. Thats complete nonsense as well, what you proved is that he wont be at Kyles level.



Im not gonna ask you again, sine you've been point dodging and twisting shit around since the very beginning.





Or taking physical punishment doesnt indicate willpower.



His magnetsim affects telepathy hes suing it in the scans. It could damn well be argued that is one of the reason why was able to resist.

Fair enough. You've discovered that you can't actually beat myself, X, Paul, or Bran in a debate. Just avoid us, then. Maybe you'll, eventually, find someone who's a bigger dumbshit than you.

Don't hold your breath, though.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
His magnetsim affects telepathy hes suing it in the scans. It could damn well be argued that is one of the reason why was able to resist. Proof? The only possible reasoning you could have, is that he used it to fight Xavier... and that's not exactly affecting it.
Even though we are lead to believe it was his will doing it.

He's using magnetism in the scans because he's using it to unscrew X's chair.

And in that scan:
"Charles Xavier is the strongest mutant mind on Earth. But although Magneto has no psionic talents, his will is second to none -- And he, like Xavier is fighting for a cause he fervently believes in, a goal he will pay any price to achieve."

Which, is by the way, talking about his will...

---

This thread is still hilarious. Frank dies in the first minute. Every Punisher lasts longer than him.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Proof? The only possible reasoning you could have, is that he used it to fight Xavier... and that's not exactly affecting it.
Even though we are lead to believe it was his will doing it.

He's using magnetism in the scans because he's using it to unscrew X's chair.

And in that scan:
"Charles Xavier is the strongest mutant mind on Earth. But although Magneto has no psionic talents, his will is second to none -- And he, like Xavier is fighting for a cause he fervently believes in, a goal he will pay any price to achieve."

Which, is by the way, talking about his will...

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This thread is still hilarious. Punisher dies in the first minute. Every Punisher lasts longer than him.

But....

Has he ever performed surgery on himself?