Which character can take down the most Hand ninjas?

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.



Etrigan
Which of these characters can take down the most common Hand Ninjas before they go down? All characters have any weapons they would usually have on them. Take into account experience with fighting ninja-like characters as well as fighting skill.

Daredevil, Elektra, Black Widow, Captain America, Wolverine, Black Panther, Moon Knight, Batman, Iron Fist, Midnighter.

Newjak
There isn't enough hand ninjas in the world to take down any of them.

Why cause hand ninjas are the stormtroopers of the comic world. No matter how good their skills are supposed to be the fact is this:

They will always miss with the possible exception of glancing blows to the shoulder.

They will always attack a character one at a time.

They go down by the most minuscule of hits.

Etrigan
I know. But that doesn't really matter; they've killed members of the Caste before by attacking all at once.

Which one could take down the most of their number, assuming that the number of Hand ninjas are unlimited?

Battlehammer
hmmm Logan I would assume. He has killed more hand ninja's then the number 2 and 3 put to gather

Etrigan
What, so he's killed more than 5 hand ninjas?

I don't get your statement.

Lord Feron
Originally posted by Etrigan
What, so he's killed more than 5 hand ninjas?

I don't get your statement.
hehehe laughing

Mindset
Originally posted by Etrigan
What, so he's killed more than 5 hand ninjas?

I don't get your statement. laughing

2nd and 3rd ppl

Etrigan
Ooooh. Haha, I'm an eejit.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
What, so he's killed more than 5 hand ninjas?

I don't get your statement.

Lol.


In wolverine the best there is they state Logan has killed more hand ninjas then any one elses. They said that even the combind kills of the 2nd and 3rd place did not even equal the amount he killed if not mistaken.

Etrigan
Daredevil and Elektra have killed a good number of Hand though. And Cap's SSS would mean that he wouldn't get worn down from fighting so many, and Batman could probably take quite a few, as well as Iron Fist who is a great martial artist and is experienced in fighting other martial artists, and Midnighter too.... Black Panther and Moon Knight both have sufficient equipment and skills to hold off the ninjas for a long time.

I reckon all of them would stand a very good chance of getting a high kill number. Except maybe BW >_>

Battlehammer
DD and elelktra combind kill count for hand ninjas is below Logans.

Logan has killed thousands of them.


also capt SSS grants him superhuman stamina, but he can tirer.

Endrict Nuul
Wolverine
Midnighter
Daredevil
Elektra
Batman
Black Panther
Cap
Iron Fist
Black Widow
Moon Knight



IMO in that order.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Battlehammer
DD and elelktra combind kill count for hand ninjas is below Logans.

Logan has killed thousands of them.

Yeah Wolverine has killed the most, but you don't constantly need to challenge whatever I say about any other character's feats and kill count. I knew that Logan had killed more than Daredevil and Elektra, but I'd say that one of those two is probably second on the list.

Battlehammer
elektra is and I think DD 3rd or vice versa

Etrigan
Yeah, ever since Miller's run on DD they've both been major enemies of the Hand.

Soljer
How exactly are we testing them? Do they just stand in the middle of the arena while ninjas rush them by the dozen?

Or do we put each character in the Marvel world on a 'hunt' for hand ninjas?

Endrict Nuul
THE UNCANNY X-MEN #268 Comes to mind were Logan kicks all of their asses and saves CAP with the Russian dude.

In the first fight back in WWII days, Cap got beat by the hand by getting slashed in the back with a cats claw. The Hand were going to chop his head off but Logan saves the day by only uses two metal pipes and a sword.



http://daveslongbox.blogspot.com/2007/06/uncanny-x-men-268-marvel-comics-1990.html

Etrigan
Originally posted by Soljer
How exactly are we testing them? Do they just stand in the middle of the arena while ninjas rush them by the dozen?

Or do we put each character in the Marvel world on a 'hunt' for hand ninjas?

I was thinking more the first one. A big arena or clearing with unlimited ninjas rushing them in say, groups of ten or fifteen each time?

Endrict Nuul
Originally posted by Endrict Nuul
Wolverine
Midnighter
Daredevil
Elektra
Batman
Black Panther
Cap
Iron Fist
Black Widow
Moon Knight



IMO in that order.


I put Midnighter 2nd because of what he can do. DD and Elek needs 3-4 because of their experience at fighting the Hand. Batman 5th because of the League of assassins kinda like The Hand being ninjas and all. The rest.....meh.

Etrigan
Why Moon Knight last? He's a good martial artist and has plenty of equipment/weaponry to hold them off. And I wouldn't have put Cap lower than Black Panther.

Battlehammer
moon night can barly walk at the moment lol

Etrigan
Yeah, I know, but I'm saying all of the characters at their prime.

Endrict Nuul
Cap got beaten by the Hand in THE UNCANNY X-MEN #268. Black Panther has great MA skills and the EQ, MK is inferior to the others. in everyway

grey fox
Midnighter should be above Wolverine, considering Wolvie has to connect a full slash and then wait for the oppoenet to bleed out. Midnighter just has to punch their heads to mush.

Etrigan
Wolverine's strong enough to kill Hand ninjas with martial arts blows as well. I'd say he could probably get a pretty high number even without his claws, due to his good MA and H2H skills, and strength, and acrobatics.

Master-Borg
Originally posted by Battlehammer
DD and elelktra combind kill count for hand ninjas is below Logans.

Logan has killed thousands of them.
do you have specific onpanel evidence or did you pull that outta your backside as usual? roll eyes (sarcastic)

grey fox
Originally posted by Etrigan
Wolverine's strong enough to kill Hand ninjas with martial arts blows as well. I'd say he could probably get a pretty high number even without his claws, due to his good MA and H2H skills, and strength, and acrobatics.

He doesn't make their heads explode

No 'splodin heads, no number one spot I'm afraid stick out tongue

Etrigan
You must like Cronenberg films. stick out tongue

Master Borg, I dunno if there's specific evidence for what Battlehammer said, but I think he's right in that Wolverine has killed a damn lot of Hand. Maybe not thousands, but more than DD and Elektra.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by grey fox
Midnighter should be above Wolverine, considering Wolvie has to connect a full slash and then wait for the oppoenet to bleed out. Midnighter just has to punch their heads to mush.

was that a real comment?

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Master-Borg
do you have specific onpanel evidence or did you pull that outta your backside as usual? roll eyes (sarcastic)

Lol I talk out of my back side? I always have evidences to back what I say, you on the other hand do not.

Mister "x-men cartoon is as good as cannon"

Wolverine the best there is states he has killed more hand ninjas then any one elses. They also if not mistaken put his kill count at 2000 this is prior to enemy of the state run.

Master-Borg
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Lol I talk out of my back side? I always have evidences to back what I say, you on the other hand do not.

Mister "x-men cartoon is as good as cannon"

Wolverine the best there is states he has killed more hand ninjas then any one elses. They also if not mistaken put his kill count at 2000 this is prior to enemy of the state run.

you love to speculate when it comes to wolverine as usual

why am I not surprised you have no hard evidence to back up your claim that wolverine killed thousands

that would make Logan a mass murderer

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Master-Borg
you love to speculate when it comes to wolverine as usual

why am I not surprised you have no hard evidence to back up your claim that wolverine killed thousands

that would make Logan a mass murderer

Im not speculating anything.

hard evidences? It was stated in "WOLVERINE THE BEST THERE IS" so yes I do have hard evidences.


There already dead. Not to mention Logan has killed more then that lol. And characters such as Punisher believe him to be a mass murderer. In astonishing x-men wolverine states "I killed a city onces"

Endrict Nuul
All together he probably killed over a 1000 Hand ninjas.

Master-Borg
Originally posted by Battlehammer



There already dead. Not to mention Logan has killed more then that lol. And characters such as Punisher believe him to be a mass murderer. In astonishing x-men wolverine states "I killed a city onces"

characters like Punisher are not welcomed on teams because he is a killer

xmen would not condone Logan to kill that many people

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Master-Borg
characters like Punisher are not welcomed on teams because he is a killer

xmen would not condone Logan to kill that many people

actaully currently they would.


also prior to that they never condone it, but it happen on his free time/ past.

Hell He killed 100 men in a single run before lol.

grey fox
Originally posted by Battlehammer
was that a real comment?

Yes, while Wolverine can eviscerate people, in huge waves Midnightsers one shot head punches will give him a faster clean out rate then Wolverines slashes.

Etrigan
So will Iron Fist's charged-up chi punches, and Cap's shield throws/strikes.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by grey fox
Yes, while Wolverine can eviscerate people, in huge waves Midnightsers one shot head punches will give him a faster clean out rate then Wolverines slashes.

no it would not. he with a single slash can take out multiable foes. with one punch MN can only take out a single foe to at best.

also Logan, Capt, IF ect can all easily kill a normal human with a single punch.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Battlehammer
no it would not. he with a single slash can take out multiable foes. with one punch MN can only take out a single foe to at best.

Uh, no. I think you'll find Midnighter can tear people apart with his hands, making him technically quite a bit stronger than Logan, and able to kill more enemies at a time. Also, he's 6 foot 5 which gives him the reach advantage over Logan. So Midnighter can kill more enemies at a time.

I'm still going with Logan for the top though as he has fought the Hand more than Midnighter.

Etrigan
Also, hate to double post, but from what I've seen a common Hand Ninja dissolves (dies, effectively) the moment it's been KO'd, let alone actually slaughtered. Matt took out three or four of them when they attacked him in his apartment without killing any, and I remember him commenting on the smell when they dissolved.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
Uh, no. I think you'll find Midnighter can tear people apart with his hands, making him technically quite a bit stronger than Logan, and able to kill more enemies at a time. Also, he's 6 foot 5 which gives him the reach advantage over Logan. So Midnighter can kill more enemies at a time.
actaully it takes Logan to ripp some one apart and it causes you to focus on one character.

Logan can slash and hit many foes with a single slash taking down many foes while MN is wasting time ripping one in haft.

Actaully MN really not stronger then wolverine. Logan has stated quite a few times he holds back and could kill a man with but a punch.
.

Master-Borg
Originally posted by Battlehammer

Actaully MN really not stronger then wolverine.

how did you arrive at this conclusion? pure speculation again?

Etrigan
Not to mention that Midnighter can move faster than most humans (and superhumans) with what is generally described as a "speed burst".

One of these, combined with a punch, would basically explode a Hand ninja, and probably the bunch around it. Wolverine isn't fast enough swinging about with his claws to chop up that many, but I still reckon he'd kill more before dying due to pure experience. It would just take him longer to achieve that number.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Master-Borg
how did you arrive at this conclusion? pure speculation again?

Nope on the fact that he really does not have the feats nor stated unpannel evidences.

He has really only one feat that could suggest he is, but not another one even closes to it.


Pleases show me 3 feats of strength Logan could not replicate.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
Not to mention that Midnighter can move faster than most humans (and superhumans) with what is generally described as a "speed burst".

One of these, combined with a punch, would basically explode a Hand ninja, and probably the bunch around it. Wolverine isn't fast enough swinging about with his claws to chop up that many, but I still reckon he'd kill more before dying due to pure experience. It would just take him longer to achieve that number.

Lol Logan is a superhuman.



Pleases MN not going tp punch one and kill the ones around it from the forces of the single punch that a rediculous claim with out any evidences to back it.

Master-Borg
Originally posted by Battlehammer


Pleases show me 3 feats of strength Logan could not replicate.

1. kicking back a tank shell

2. kicking people's heads off completely

3. ripping someone's skeleton from their body effortlessly

he does #2 and #3 regularly.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Nope on the fact that he really does not have the feats nor stated unpannel evidences.

He has really only one feat that could suggest he is, but not another one even closes to it.


Pleases show me 3 feats of strength Logan could not replicate.

That's ridiculous because if we come up with feats, you are only going to say that Logan could replicate them, which would cause another argument entirely.

Midnighter is stronger than Wolverine, due to implants, fibre-lined muscle, and things akin to the SSS. It is quite amazing that you can stand by Logan's side no matter what happens in an argument.

Master-Borg
Originally posted by Etrigan
It is quite amazing that you can stand by Logan's side no matter what happens in an argument. he is the biggest Wolverine fanboy on the internet...so it's not that amazing

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
That's ridiculous because if we come up with feats, you are only going to say that Logan could replicate them, which would cause another argument entirely.
No I will post evidences of comparable feats.

Originally posted by Etrigan
Midnighter is stronger than Wolverine, due to implants, fibre-lined muscle, and things akin to the SSS. It is quite amazing that you can stand by Logan's side no matter what happens in an argument.
Actaully If I believe Logan was not I would not defend him ( like I did in wolverine vs mace thread)

SSS equals peak-human logan above peak human.


Logan got impants to my friend. You may wish to read up on him.

He not, not from what ive seen.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Master-Borg
1. kicking back a tank shell

yet he never produces another feat of this strenght level again

Originally posted by Master-Borg
2. kicking people's heads off completely

3. ripping someone's skeleton from their body effortlessly

he does #2 and #3 regularly.

Logan and capt have both been stated to be able to kill a man with with a punch going any were near full strength.

Logan has show to be a great deal stronger then a kid who ripped a mans head off.

Logan has literally punch a hole in a man and shove a granade in.

thadarknite84
I'll give it to the best ninja in the list and that's Batman. Because he'll come up with the best to do so.

Etrigan
I had no idea the human mind could be so incredibly devoted to something so trivial until I met Battlehammer, really.

Can I also say that Midnighter has enhanced senses/reflexes as well, and can predict any fight before it happens? He can plow through Hand ninjas faster than Wolverine can without a doubt.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
I'll give it to the best ninja in the list and that's Batman. Because he'll come up with the best to do so.
.........batmans no the best ninja on the list.........no the most expeirenced

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
I had no idea the human mind could be so incredibly devoted to something so trivial until I met Battlehammer, really.
lol then you have not met haft the board

Originally posted by Etrigan
Can I also say that Midnighter has enhanced senses/reflexes as well, and can predict any fight before it happens? He can plow through Hand ninjas faster than Wolverine can without a doubt.

Logan has both of theses so not sure how this helps your arguement........

no he can run simulations on what could happen, he does not know what will happen.

I don't think he can and nothing he has done suggest this to me.

Master-Borg
Originally posted by Battlehammer
.........batmans no the best ninja on the list.........no the most expeirenced batmans the only ninja

Etrigan
Originally posted by Battlehammer
yet he never produces another feat of this strenght level again

He's done it once, why the hell does that change relevance to anything? He still did it, doesn't that prove he can?

Originally posted by Battlehammer Logan and capt have both been stated to be able to kill a man with with a punch going any were near full strength.

Logan has show to be a great deal stronger then a kid who ripped a mans head off.

Logan has literally punch a hole in a man and shove a granade in.

Exactly, there we go, like I said. Now you say that Midnighter's feats are lower than Logan's in strength and power. Midnighter is more powerful in most aspects, is it not staring you plainly in the face? You don't need evidence, and it's not necessarily because they're on the same tier, to see that Midnighter is way above Logan in power.

And no, Master Borg. Elektra is a ninja.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Master-Borg
batmans the only ninja

and you wonder why I don't think your very knowledgeable

Originally posted by Etrigan


Daredevil, Elektra, Black Widow, Captain America, Wolverine, Black Panther, Moon Knight, Batman, Iron Fist, Midnighter.

4 characters on that list are trained ninja's. One of which was trained as a ninja prior to batman being born. Another is consider the worlds greatest ninja.

Endrict Nuul
Originally posted by Battlehammer
.........batmans no the best ninja on the list.........no the most expeirenced

Holy moly Battle learn to spell/use proper grammer please or pay more attention in school.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Endrict Nuul
Holy moly Battle learn to spell/use proper grammer please or pay more attention in school.
lol I do when I find the people I am debating worth it.

Creshosk
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Lol I talk out of my back side? I always have evidences to back what I say, you on the other hand do not.

Mister "x-men cartoon is as good as cannon"

Wolverine the best there is states he has killed more hand ninjas then any one elses. They also if not mistaken put his kill count at 2000 this is prior to enemy of the state run. Rather than to stooping to his obnoxious level you could just quote this back at him:

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Wolverine Enemy Of The State Part 4 of 6 issue 29: Wolverine fights 15,000 hand ninjas. Logan shows off amazing skills and does not even take a single hit which just shows Logan level of skills when he puts his mind on it.

Add in this:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=4741363

and this:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=4741335

llagrok
Wolverine and Midnighter.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
He's done it once, why the hell does that change relevance to anything? He still did it, doesn't that prove he can?

No on the baords you need 3 showings that roughly equal to be consider a usable feat. Becuases if it only occured onces then it likly just a one time pis showing.



Originally posted by Etrigan
Exactly, there we go, like I said. Now you say that Midnighter's feats are lower than Logan's in strength and power. Midnighter is more powerful in most aspects, is it not staring you plainly in the face? You don't need evidence, and it's not necessarily because they're on the same tier, to see that Midnighter is way above Logan in power.
What are you talking about. I never said they were lower I said they were not better.

No MN not nor has any one shown this to be true.

No I really do need evidences not some ones hairsay who has proven to know little of Logans abilties.

Actaully Logans power level would be above that of MN

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Creshosk
Rather than to stooping to his obnoxious level you could just quote this back at him:



Add in this:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=4741363

and this:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=4741335

Thanks. I know I should have, but he brings the worst out of me.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Battlehammer

No I really do need evidences not some ones hairsay who has proven to know little of Logans abilties.

My hair can't speak.

It's generally common knowledge that Midnighter has a greater range of powers than Logan, and so could smash a great amount of Hand with one blow due to speed bursts and greatly enhanced strength. Logan could kill more, but with only claws it would take more time.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Battlehammer
.........batmans no the best ninja on the list.........no the most expeirenced

What are you talking about. Not only is he the best ninja, he is also the most trained. Who do you known that can sneak up on superman without being heard. And I think Lady Shina and Cain are more of a problem dealing with than The Hand, and Batman has beaten both of them. And on top of that Batman has train with Shiva to rebuilt himself after Bane broke his back. Batman took on and defeated several of Shiva top assassins. Add his genius intellect and top of the line tech. Batman will go through them. You should just stick to Wolverine, I got Batman covered.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
My hair can't speak.

It's generally common knowledge that Midnighter has a greater range of powers than Logan, and so could smash a great amount of Hand with one blow due to speed bursts and greatly enhanced strength. Logan could kill more, but with only claws it would take more time.
lol.

No it not. were do you come to such conclusions. MidNighter does not have great over all power level nor abilites.

you keep saying speed bursts like he the only one that can do it. Logan can mvoe jsut as fast as he can. Logan has enchanced strength as well.

also one blow is not going to causes the other hand to die. It will kill that single hand ninja.

There is no way Logans claws were take more time. One slash cna take out many foes. One punch can take out a foe two at best.

psycho gundam
thedarknite84 forgets that batman doesn't kill

wolverine excels in this type of fight, he is one of the best melee combatants in comics.

+ logan already raped the hand before, he makes this thread possible

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Master-Borg
1. kicking back a tank shell

2. kicking people's heads off completely

3. ripping someone's skeleton from their body effortlessly

he does #2 and #3 regularly.

Wolverine could def do 2 and 3.

Battlehammer

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Wolverine could def do 2 and 3.
so could capt

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Battlehammer
People Logan and so on have superior physicall abilties which would allow them to keep on fighting long after batman stamina gave out or numbers over whealmed him.

Id agree with that if you look at Batman feats he rarely seems to fight lots of people in mass. Usually at most 6 or 5.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
so could capt

Yeah probably.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by psycho gundam
thedarknite84 forgets that batman doesn't kill

wolverine excels in this type of fight, he is one of the best melee combatants in comics.

+ logan already raped the hand before, he makes this thread possible

He will if he has to and in this thread I think that would be the case and if not. Why even put Batman in the line up. And I you're forgetting that if Jim Gordan hadn't fired a shot at Batman in "Hush" Joker would be dead now.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Id agree with that if you look at Batman feats he rarely seems to fight lots of people in mass. Usually at most 6 or 5.



Yeah probably.
also I doubt he the best ninja. I give it to elektra she always consider even by the best as the worls greatest ninja ( not fighter though)

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Battlehammer
also I doubt he the best ninja. I give it to elektra she always consider even by the best as the worls greatest ninja ( not fighter though)

You might be right to be quite frank Batman feats are not as impresive as marvel street levelers in general. I might be ignorant of DC but I do have ALOT of Batman comics.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
You might be right to be quite frank Batman feats are not as impresive as marvel street levelers in general. I might be ignorant of DC but I do have ALOT of Batman comics.
he up and down. His cross over have him doing some retardedly rediculous things, but then in his own series he fighting common thugs lol.

I think his ninja skills are overrated ive never seen him do anything that put him as beeing the 2nd best ninja in this thread let alone the best.

Nor do I even see him comming at the top of the list in this battle.

Etrigan
Originally posted by thadarknite84
What are you talking about. Not only is he the best ninja, he is also the most trained. Who do you known that can sneak up on superman without being heard. And I think Lady Shina and Cain are more of a problem dealing with than The Hand, and Batman has beaten both of them. And on top of that Batman has train with Shiva to rebuilt himself after Bane broke his back. Batman took on and defeated several of Shiva top assassins. Add his genius intellect and top of the line tech. Batman will go through them. You should just stick to Wolverine, I got Batman covered.

No offense, but you only really specify in DC knowledge, don't you?

Batman is equal to Elektra in ninja training and skill, and has less training than Wolverine (skill is debatable). Iron Fist also has extensive training in that sort of thing, probably not as stealth orientated though.

Are you aware of the fact that the Hand employ warriors who are practically invulnerable unless their heads are cut off, and can resurrect people from the dead, even heroes, and then can use that hero as their mind-controlled ally?

Black Panther has high level intellect and top of the line tech, maybe even to rival Batman's.

Batman is not the best trained ninja there, let alone most skilled.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Id agree with that if you look at Batman feats he rarely seems to fight lots of people in mass. Usually at most 6 or 5.



Yeah probably.

I agree. But Batman's a ninja, he doesn't need to take them on all at once. There are other ways, and the art of the ninja, allows one to be able to take on thousands if that ninja is very skilled. And in Batman's case he does have a very good chance. Explosive batarangs can work wonders in the right hands.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Battlehammer
he up and down. His cross over have him doing some retardedly rediculous things, but then in his own series he fighting common thugs lol.

I think his ninja skills are overrated ive never seen him do anything that put him as beeing the 2nd best ninja in this thread let alone the best.

Nor do I even see him comming at the top of the list in this battle.

Im kinda undecided but its not an unreasonable stance I dunno maybe he can draw even with DD and I would like to think he would do better than BW.

No way is he beating Wolverine, MN and the likes.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
I agree. But Batman's a ninja, he doesn't need to take them on all at once. There are other ways, and the art of the ninja, allows one to be able to take on thousands if that ninja is very skilled. And in Batman's case he does have a very good chance. Explosive batarangs can work wonders in the right hands.

better then the others on the list? Not likly.

few of them are as skilled if not more skilled ninjas some have greater ninja training

Others are almost if not as skilled fighter

and on top of that many other are physically superior.

also there only so many batrangs he has.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Im kinda undecided but its not an unreasonable stance I dunno maybe he can draw even with DD and I would like to think he would do better than BW.

No way is he beating Wolverine, MN and the likes.

cosigned.

BW could do pritty well given the equiptment she carring.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by thadarknite84
I agree. But Batman's a ninja, he doesn't need to take them on all at once. There are other ways, and the art of the ninja, allows one to be able to take on thousands if that ninja is very skilled. And in Batman's case he does have a very good chance. Explosive batarangs can work wonders in the right hands.

Yeah and how many of those does he have?

llagrok
I believe the Zombies that Midnighter casually ripped apart were claimed to be 10x regular humans, by the scientist he found in the complex later on.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Etrigan
Which of these characters can take down the most common Hand Ninjas before they go down? All characters have any weapons they would usually have on them. Take into account experience with fighting ninja-like characters as well as fighting skill.

Daredevil, Elektra, Black Widow, Captain America, Wolverine, Black Panther, Moon Knight, Batman, Iron Fist, Midnighter.

My order for kill count would be:

Wolverine (but not that swiftly)
Midnighter (just due to him being very powerful)
Daredevil/Elektra (similar count due to experience and skill)
Batman/Iron Fist (Batman's equipment is useful, and they are both top-tier martial artists)
Black Panther (equipment and skill, not far behind)
Captain America (strong and fast, but I don't think he's really got enough ninja-style combat skill to bring down as many as the above)
Black Widow (she's fought the Hand before alongside DD, and they poisoned and killed her, she got saved by Stone)
Moon Knight (not really on level with the others)

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by llagrok
I believe the Zombies that Midnighter casually ripped apart were claimed to be 10x regular humans, by the scientist he found in the complex later on.

so that would mean they could lift 2 tons?

Etrigan
Apparently, yeah. See, he's pretty damn strong.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Etrigan
Apparently, yeah. See, he's pretty damn strong.

Yeah but in all fairness supersharp adamantuim claws are more lethal. I mean hell Wolverine can cut a Namor and Grey Hulk with that and those people are class 100.

Wolverine could still come top.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by llagrok
I believe the Zombies that Midnighter casually ripped apart were claimed to be 10x regular humans, by the scientist he found in the complex later on.

? I like to see evidences of this if you have it. And 10x what? I mean they could have 10 times speed, strength ect. but be extremely easy to damage due to decomsition.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Yeah but in all fairness supersharp adamantuim claws are more lethal. I mean hell Wolverine can cut a Namor and Grey Hulk with that and those people are class 100.

Wolverine could still come top.

I always maintained that he would come top in numbers. But Midnighter could kill his amount more quickly.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Battlehammer
? I like to see evidences of this if you have it. And 10x what? I mean they could have 10 times speed, strength ect. but be extremely easy to damage due to decomsition.


Even if its true that doesnt mean MN comes out on top. I think he implied 10x strength.

Endrict Nuul
I think Logan and Midnighter are around the same str level. Just because its not in character or it hasn't been done before with a character that doesn't mean it can't happen. Damn right something 2 tons will take off someones head.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Even if its true that doesnt mean MN comes out on top. I think he implied 10x strength.
True.

They are trying to tell me it be faster to take people out via punching then with claws lol.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Endrict Nuul
I think Logan and Midnighter are around the same str level.
cosigned

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Battlehammer
True.

They are trying to tell me it be faster to take people out via punching then with claws lol.

Well maybe in the sense that he has a longer reach but when you think about it.....Wolverine could litrerially just mow them down with his claws even though MN is strong and can take people down with one pucnh it would not be as effective as supersharp weapons at fast speed.

Wolverine could literially be like a lawn mower.


Originally posted by Etrigan
I always maintained that he would come top in numbers. But Midnighter could kill his amount more quickly.

I dunno man....theres also the fcat Wolverien know their fighting style better.

llagrok
Strength, stamina, agility and speed.

No mention of durability, and the scientist noted that the zombies were experiments in an attempt to create soldiers with 10X those stats. So I suppose it's no real feat.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Etrigan
No offense, but you only really specify in DC knowledge, don't you?

Batman is equal to Elektra in ninja training and skill, and has less training than Wolverine (skill is debatable). Iron Fist also has extensive training in that sort of thing, probably not as stealth orientated though.

Are you aware of the fact that the Hand employ warriors who are practically invulnerable unless their heads are cut off, and can resurrect people from the dead, even heroes, and then can use that hero as their mind-controlled ally?

Black Panther has high level intellect and top of the line tech, maybe even to rival Batman's.

Batman is not the best trained ninja there, let alone most skilled.

Wolverine has lived longer than Batman but he wasn't known as the man he is today for a while. It isn't till latter on in his life, Batman started at age 8, what was Wolverine doing a that age not training that's for sure. And most of these people have a real life, relationships and all of that. Batman puts all of his time into being Batman. you could have the same amount of training as Batman, but it doesn't mean you are just as dedicated as he is. And just for the record. Bullseye would never do to Batman as he did to EleKtra. Just as skilled.... I don't think so.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by llagrok
Strength, stamina, agility and speed.

No mention of durability, and the scientist noted that the zombies were experiments in an attempt to create soldiers with 10X those stats. So I suppose it's no real feat.

Hmm I dunno sometimes people say stuff like that then you find otu its hyperbole. I would like to see the evidence, but in all fairness we should let the point stand.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well maybe in the sense that he has a longer reach but when you think about it.....Wolverine could litrerially just mow them down with his claws even though MN is strong and can take people down with one pucnh it would not be as effective as supersharp weapons at fast speed.

Wolverine could literially be like a lawn mower.

I dunno man....theres also the fcat Wolverien know their fighting style better.

Wolverine would need to know their fighting style due to the fact he needs to emply skill to use his claws taking them all down with a mixture of martial arts, and he has short reach. Midnighter's just going to punch his way through the crowd and they'll be splattering everywhere.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well maybe in the sense that he has a longer reach but when you think about it.....Wolverine could litrerially just mow them down with his claws even though MN is strong and can take people down with one pucnh it would not be as effective as supersharp weapons at fast speed.

Wolverine could literially be like a lawn mower.




I dunno man....theres also the fcat Wolverien know their fighting style better.
cosigned

Etrigan
Originally posted by thadarknite84
Wolverine has lived longer than Batman but he wasn't known as the man he is today for a while. It isn't till latter on in his life, Batman started at age 8, what was Wolverine doing a that age not training that's for sure. And most of these people have a real life, relationships and all of that. Batman puts all of his time into being Batman. you could have the same amount of training as Batman, but it doesn't mean you are just as dedicated as he is. And just for the record. Bullseye would never do to Batman as he did to EleKtra. Just as skilled.... I don't think so.

Like Iron Fist, Elektra is more skilled and more of a killing machine now than she was back in the early 80s. And Elektra has more Hand knowledge, giving her more edge.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Etrigan
Wolverine would need to know their fighting style due to the fact he needs to emply skill to use his claws taking them all down with a mixture of martial arts,

Not sure what you're saying here but Wolverine already knows the hands fighting style.

Originally posted by Etrigan

and he has short reach.

Yeah he does but slicing damage is going to be more effective than punching be cause he can not only thrust but swipe as well.


Originally posted by Etrigan

Midnighter's just going to punch his way through the crowd and they'll be splattering everywhere.

Heres the thing I dont think the Hand ninjas will just attack him they will probably use different tactics as well and this is were Wolverines knowledge will come into play.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Battlehammer
better then the others on the list? Not likly.

few of them are as skilled if not more skilled ninjas some have greater ninja training

Others are almost if not as skilled fighter

and on top of that many other are physically superior.

also there only so many batrangs he has.

A better question would be. How many ninjas can one explosive batarang kill.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
Wolverine has lived longer than Batman but he wasn't known as the man he is today for a while. It isn't till latter on in his life, Batman started at age 8, what was Wolverine doing a that age not training that's for sure



wrong. Logan began training at a young age and was a cage fighter. Logan was a master of fighting well before batman was even born. He has also been trained by several MA masters and military unit's before batman was born as well.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
A better question would be. How many ninjas can one explosive batarang kill.

not that many

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by thadarknite84
A better question would be. How many ninjas can one explosive batarang kill.

Yup but Wolverine would still kill more because he would eventually run out. Wolverine would probably still be killing long after that.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
Wolverine would need to know their fighting style due to the fact he needs to emply skill to use his claws taking them all down with a mixture of martial arts, and he has short reach. Midnighter's just going to punch his way through the crowd and they'll be splattering everywhere.
umm..........what.

Logan could litterally slices his way through them.

MN has to punch them all individually to kill them, Logan can slices many with a single attack.

also unlike wolverine MN will be in abd shape if he get caught by one of there attacks.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Battlehammer
umm..........what.

Logan could litterally slices his way through them.

MN has to punch them all individually to kill them, Logan can slices many with a single attack.

also unlike wolverine MN will be in abd shape if he get caught by one of there attacks.

Hmm im thinking MN could swing his arms as well. MN does have a HF as well. I think Wolveriens knowledge could make him edge the distance.

Etrigan
No, I'd say quite a few considering that a KO will dissolve a ninja, let alone a kill.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Hmm im thinking MN could swing his arms as well. MN does have a HF as well. I think Wolveriens knowledge could make him edge the distance.

He could, but glancing blows arnt going to kill a hand ninja. He really only going to be killing/hurting the ones he hits dirrectly. The others at best get sent back a little.


MN healing factor is crap, it won't allow him to withstand a stabb and keep fighting, unphazed.

actaully I pritty sure it not even DS level.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Etrigan
No, I'd say quite a few considering that a KO will dissolve a ninja, let alone a kill.

Hmmm you might be right. The fcat that adamantuim claws are more effective than MNs fist could be redundant because the hand ninjas dont have superhuman durability. You get what im saying?

Originally posted by Battlehammer
He could, but glancing blows arnt going to kill a hand ninja. He really only going to be killing/hurting the ones he hits dirrectly. The others at best get sent back a little.

If he can kill peopel with 10X strength or normal humans then a glancing blow could kill them

Originally posted by Battlehammer


MN healing factor is crap, it won't allow him to withstand a stabb and keep fighting, unphazed.

actaully I pritty sure it not even DS level.

He did get his neck broken and got up in a few panels.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
No, I'd say quite a few considering that a KO will dissolve a ninja, let alone a kill.
sorry, but how do you KO some one who already dead?

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Hmmm you might be right. The fcat that adamantuim claws are more effective than MNs fist could be redundant because the hand ninjas dont have superhuman durability. You get what im saying?
True, but they also can't be killed as easily as a normal human or hurt becuases there already dead.

Also glancing shots won't put them down. Sabertooth was able to send 10 of them flying with an attack, but only one was killed by it.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Battlehammer
True, but they also can't be killed as easily as a normal human or hurt becuases there already dead.

Also glancing shots won't put them down. Sabertooth was able to send 10 of them flying with an attack, but only one was killed by it.

Ok good point there. thumb up Wolverine FTW.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
?



If he can kill peopel with 10X strength or normal humans then a glancing blow could kill them



He did get his neck broken and got up in a few panels.

neck snapped dropped him though.


they were not 10 x normal humans that was what the experiement tried to do but it failed.

thadarknite84
Don't get me wrong, I don't that Batman can kill more than Wolverine or Midnighter. But he's has more of a chance than DD or Elektra. Cap and Iron Fist are also very good candidates. But I think that going into this, Batman would be the most prepared. Why wouldn't he bring everything that he would need to get the job done. That doesn't make any sense at all. It is not in his character to not be prepared for anything.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
Don't get me wrong, I don't that Batman can kill more than Wolverine or Midnighter. But he's has more of a chance than DD or Elektra. Cap and Iron Fist are also very good candidates. But I think that going into this, Batman would be the most prepared. Why wouldn't he bring everything that he would need to get the job done. That doesn't make any sense at all. It is not in his character to not be prepared for anything.

............he does not get prep. He simply thrown into the scenerio.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Battlehammer
wrong. Logan began training at a young age and was a cage fighter. Logan was a master of fighting well before batman was even born. He has also been trained by several MA masters and military unit's before batman was born as well.

Wolverine was a caged fighter at the age of 8?

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by thadarknite84
Don't get me wrong, I don't that Batman can kill more than Wolverine or Midnighter. But he's has more of a chance than DD or Elektra. Cap and Iron Fist are also very good candidates. But I think that going into this, Batman would be the most prepared. Why wouldn't he bring everything that he would need to get the job done. That doesn't make any sense at all. It is not in his character to not be prepared for anything.

I think you might be right with DD and Elektra I think at least he is comparable to DD and does have more weapons.

I dont think Batman ahs prep, im assuming he ahs standard equipment. He does have explosives as standard but not that many. I would think something like 6.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Battlehammer
sorry, but how do you KO some one who already dead?

No, what I mean is that they only have to really be subdued or given a good solid hit to dissolve.

Creshosk
Originally posted by thadarknite84
Wolverine was a caged fighter at the age of 8? Do you think that Wolverine is only 8 years older than Batman? Where did the "age of 8" come from if this was not your conclusion?

Etrigan
There is no prep. They start in the situation with standard gear. What is standard gear for Batman? Explosive batarangs, regular batarangs, gas pellets, things like that, whereas Black Panther is armed with a vibranium suit, anti-matter claws or whatever the hell they're called, an energy dagger and any other standard gear he carries. I'd say T'Challa has the edge on the equipment front; it'll be much more useful when handling undead ninjas, and it doesn't eventually run out.

EDIT: Reading the above conversation about what does and doesn't kill Hand ninjas, I've seen them get hit across the face with billy clubs, sai handles, and even kicked, and they fall to the ground and dissolve. Whether their necks had been broken or something, I dunno. But it means that any bladed object is going to slice 'em like butter, giving Logan advantage.

Creshosk
Originally posted by Etrigan
There is no prep. They start in the situation with standard gear. What is standard gear for Batman? Explosive batarangs, regular batarangs, gas pellets, things like that, whereas Black Panther is armed with a vibranium suit, anti-matter claws or whatever the hell they're called, an energy dagger and any other standard gear he carries. I'd say T'Challa has the edge on the equipment front; it'll be much more useful when handling undead ninjas. Anti-Metal claws.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
Wolverine was a caged fighter at the age of 8?

No he was around 14..........but he also over 50 years older then batman...........

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
No, what I mean is that they only have to really be subdued or given a good solid hit to dissolve.

No they don't........they been hit before with out disolving.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Creshosk
Anti-Metal claws.

which strangly enough don't seem to effect unbreakable material.

Etrigan
But I've seen them get hit once and dissolve, so it's a pointless argument that goes either way. Maybe it depends on how hard the hit is or where it's placed.

I'll try and find some scans to show that they dissolve from one kick to the head/neck.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
But I've seen them get hit once and dissolve, so it's a pointless argument that goes either way. Maybe it depends on how hard the hit is or where it's placed.

I'll try and find some scans to show that they dissolve from one kick to the head/neck.
........ive never seen that unless it was a killing attack ect.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I think you might be right with DD and Elektra I think at least he is comparable to DD and does have more weapons.

I dont think Batman ahs prep, im assuming he ahs standard equipment. He does have explosives as standard but not that many. I would think something like 6.

But I really don't think it would matter to much. Once Batman get a hold of one of the ninja's swords, it could be game over. And Batman stamina is also at the peak of human ability. He can go for hours even more before he gets tired. This he has already proved. But Wolverine does have the most experience fighting them. But I do know that Batman is the most intelligent fighter along with Cap and Iron Fist. I say Wolverine's mutant abilities gave him an edge not his skills. He seems to act out of rage in a lot his fights.

Etrigan
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/158/ddhandor3.jpg

After that, they all dissolved. And DD obviously wasn't intending to kill them because after that he tried to interrogate one, but it died.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
But I really don't think it would matter to much. Once Batman get a hold of one of the ninja's swords, it could be game over. And Batman stamina is also at the peak of human ability He can go for hours even more before he gets tired.
He would get beaten sooner or later.

he also not even the best swordsmen in the thread

and when has he proven to go for "hours" or "even more" before he gets tired?

Originally posted by thadarknite84
But Wolverine does have the most experience fighting them. But I do know that Batman is the most intelligent fighter along with Cap and Iron Fist. I say Wolverine's mutant abilities gave him an edge not his skills. He seems to act out of rage in a lot his fights.

Logans just as smart as them when it comes to fighting.

Logan does not fight out of rage, your not very up to date are you? Also if Logan did get enrage and went berserker he wins this easily.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/158/ddhandor3.jpg

After that, they all dissolved. And DD obviously wasn't intending to kill them because after that he tried to interrogate one, but it died.

That scan does not prove your point. Also they can dissolve at will, which is one of the reasons which makes thme perfect assassins.

They don't dissolve simply from being hit.

Etrigan
Originally posted by thadarknite84
But I really don't think it would matter to much. Once Batman get a hold of one of the ninja's swords, it could be game over.

I'd say that's the same case with DD, who sliced through two other swords with one blow because he could sense the weakness in the blades, and Elektra, who has shown her skill with a sword like that before, and Wolverine, who has massive ninja training.

Also there is no GAME OVER. There are unlimited ninjas. It depends on who goes down first, not who can kill them all.

Originally posted by thadarknite84But I do know that Batman is the most intelligent fighter along with Cap and Iron Fist.

I disagree. Batman and Cap are very intelligent in combat, but so is Black Panther, and so is Daredevil, who always has a very calculated and skilled technique when he fights.

Etrigan
Originally posted by Battlehammer
That scan does not prove your point. Also they can dissolve at will, which is one of the reasons which makes thme perfect assassins.

They don't dissolve simply from being hit.

They die when they dissolve. Their bodies have been shown to dissolve after Elektra impaled them on her sais.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Creshosk
Do you think that Wolverine is only 8 years older than Batman? Where did the "age of 8" come from if this was not your conclusion?

I know that Wolverine is decades older than Batman. I was asking when he was at the age of 8. Was he a caged fighter as Battlehammer stated. But being older and having more experience doesn't always make you more Superior. And Batman proved that against Sensei.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
They die when they dissolve. Their bodies have been shown to dissolve after Elektra impaled them on her sais.

yes after they are killed or at will.

..........not from simply being hit.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
I know that Wolverine is decades older than Batman. I was asking when he was at the age of 8. Was he a caged fighter as Battlehammer stated. But being older and having more experience doesn't always make you more Superior. And Batman proved that against Sensei.

true, but it sure help.

extra 50+ years is a lot of expeirences and training.

Etrigan
Oh, okay. I didn't realise that they dissolved at will because they seemed unconscious when their bodies dissolved after Matt knocked them all down. You win, I interpreted their ability wrongly.

darknite84, are you a raging Batman fanboy or do you just not know your Marvel characters that well? He isn't the best martial artist in this thread. He's damn good. But if this was solely martial arts fighting with the ninjas, no weapons, then he would be further down the list of fighters. I think maybe even BP is stealthier and more ninja-like than he is.

Hehe, I like the way we've sort of left out Black Widow and Moon Knight.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Etrigan
Oh, okay. I didn't realise that they dissolved at will because they seemed unconscious when their bodies dissolved after Matt knocked them all down. You win, I interpreted their ability wrongly.

I assume so, becuases when ever Logan has tried to interigate them they always desolve in his hands lol.

Battlehammer
If it BW from the might avengers she could actually do dam well

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Etrigan
I'd say that's the same case with DD, who sliced through two other swords with one blow because he could sense the weakness in the blades, and Elektra, who has shown her skill with a sword like that before, and Wolverine, who has massive ninja training.

Also there is no GAME OVER. There are unlimited ninjas. It depends on who goes down first, not who can kill them all.



I disagree. Batman and Cap are very intelligent in combat, but so is Black Panther, and so is Daredevil, who always has a very calculated and skilled technique when he fights.

I disagree Batman and Cap are more intelligent over all. Batman's greatest weapon is his mid, the same can't be said about DD or BP.

Etrigan
Yeah, same with DD and 'Lekkie.

By the way, Creshosk mentioned that BP has Anti-Metal claws. DOes that mean they can cut through any metal and any other material? Adamantium, perhaps? Because if so, he would probably have more chance of slicing through the Hand mass even better than Wolverine.

Etrigan
Originally posted by thadarknite84
I disagree Batman and Cap are more intelligent over all. Batman greatest weapon is his mid, the same can't be said about DD or BP.

No, but this isn't really about intelligence unless you're talking about combat technique/formation, and DD knows a lot about that. Hell, the man took down 100 Yakuza in under 3 minutes, and he only had his cane.

And I assure you, T'Challa is pretty clever.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
I disagree Batman and Cap are more intelligent over all. Batman's greatest weapon is his mid, the same can't be said about DD or BP.

Pleases I want you to look at this post of yours and see if you would like to change anything it it before I respond

Etrigan
laughing out loud

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Etrigan
No, but this isn't really about intelligence unless you're talking about combat technique/formation, and DD knows a lot about that. Hell, the man took down 100 Yakuza in under 3 minutes, and he only had his cane.

And I assure you, T'Challa is pretty clever.

DD's technique or formation is not comparable to Batman's. Batman knows more fighting techniques and is just a better fighter all together. DD relies more on his superhuman senses. Place Batman in the same scenario with just his hands and feet. And see just how long the Yakuza's will last.

thadarknite84
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Pleases I want you to look at this post of yours and see if you would like to change anything it it before I respond

It's too late, and You know what I mean anyway. So commenting on that has nothing to do with the matter at hand.

Etrigan
Daredevil is more acrobatic, has his senses, and arguably is also a better martial artist, if not on a very close level, to Batman.

Don't get me wrong, Batman would kick his crimson ass if they fought, because Batman would figure out after a bit of a beating that DD has superhuman senses, and then unlock gas pellets and sonic bombs on him that would basically kill him.

But when it comes to fighting hordes of Hand Ninja, Matt has the advantage because he has experience in that field. He'd get a higher count than Bats.

Etrigan
Originally posted by thadarknite84
It's too late, and You know what I mean anyway. So commenting on that has nothing to do the matter at hand .

Pun intended?

*fails*

Battlehammer
Originally posted by thadarknite84
It's too late, and You know what I mean anyway. So commenting on that has nothing to do with the matter at hand.

what?

Lord Feron
lol

Lord Feron
silly rabbit tricks are for kids!

<< THERE IS MORE FROM THIS THREAD HERE >>