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ROTJ Luke and Darth Vader
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TPM Qui-Gon and Obi-WAN
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well, if you just use the clips as evidence, obi and qui gonn win easily. They look more skilled, more athletic, and definitly more team oriented (than vader and luke who are trying to kill each other)
but if you look at the power levels involved, i think you have to give it to luke and vader.

Originally posted by truejedi
well, if you just use the clips as evidence, obi and qui gonn win easily. They look more skilled, more athletic, and definitly more team oriented (than vader and luke who are trying to kill each other)
but if you look at the power levels involved, i think you have to give it to luke and vader.
I agree with the above gentleman. You see they didnt have cgi or nick gilliard durring the Ot so GL wasnt able to make the OT lightsaber duels as impressive as he wanted to.

but i say this:

vader chokes obi wan,

while luke beats quigon in a lightsaber duel.

Woah!

Nah.

Obi-Wan beats Luke in seconds then runs to Qui-Gon's aid against Vader. The duo defeat him after a hardfight, imo.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Woah!

Nah.

Obi-Wan beats Luke in seconds then runs to Qui-Gon's aid against Vader. The duo defeat him after a hardfight, imo.

so vader's force mastery means nothing to you?

As much as I do not want to say it, I say Vader and Luke only because of their insane, combined power levels.

TPM Obi got caught off-guard by an effin' Force Push. What if that had been a choke or something?

Luke would get utterly manhandled by either of his opponents, but Vader is decidedly powerful enough to take down Qui-Gon and the young Obi-Wan by himself.

The Skywalkers win, no thanks to Luke.

I am not sure if Luke would get manhandled per se but he is practically a spectator at this point.

Originally posted by Neo_Version 7
I am not sure if Luke would get manhandled per se but he is practically a spectator at this point.

what eveidence do those who claim luke is a bad lighstsaber duelist have?

Obi-Wan, the weaker of his duo, has about two decades of Jedi training and experience on Luke, and is obviously remarkably skilled as a combatant himself. Now, for the scarce training he recieved, Luke is pretty good, but he really wouldn't last long against a serious Kenobi. Qui-Gon would make even shorter work of him.

This, of course, assumes that the Jedi manage to engage their enemies before Vader kills them with the Force.

Originally posted by Faunus
Obi-Wan, the weaker of his duo, has about two decades of Jedi training and experience on Luke, and is obviously remarkably skilled as a combatant himself. Now, for the scarce training he recieved, Luke is pretty good, but he really wouldn't last long against a serious Kenobi. Qui-Gon would make even shorter work of him.

This, of course, assumes that the Jedi manage to engage their enemies before Vader kills them with the Force.

1) does training always equal winning though. because given age, you could say dooku had 2 to 3 times as much training as anakin but anakin still managed to pull it off?

3) do you consider all the self training luke had between episodes 5 and 6?

2) does that mean that you also think that tpm oi wan could beat esb vader?

Originally posted by Man of Christ
1) does training always equal winning though. because given age, you could say dooku had 2 to 3 times as much training as anakin but anakin still managed to pull it off?Anakin's thirteen years of constant formal training and frontline combat experience, often against other Force-users, compared to the few hours Luke spent with Obi-Wan and the mere days he had with Yoda. The comparatively small amounts of time Luke had to train on his own were definitely fruitful relative to his skill level at the time, but it's not until the post-RotJ periods that he really comes into his own.

Also, keep in mind that while Anakin bested Dooku, the Sith Lord's 70+ year advantage in terms of training, on top of his own considerable potential, meant that he still controlled more active power than Anakin did at the time. He was also probably a more technically skilled duelist. Anakin beat him in a sudden rush, and ended the fight with one good move; he didn't "out-duel" him in a show of superior swordsmanship.

There was a time span of about 6 - 12 months between the episodes; hardly enough for any substantial training. He improved considerably from one to the next, yes, but not enough to put him on Obi-Wan's level in terms of acquired skill and Force control.

I already stated that Vader would win this duel by himself. Read.

Originally posted by Faunus
Also, keep in mind that while Anakin bested Dooku, the Sith Lord's 70+ year advantage in terms of training, on top of his own considerable potential, meant that he still controlled more active power than Anakin did at the time. He was also probably a more technically skilled duelist. Anakin beat him in a sudden rush, and ended the fight with one good move; he didn't "out-duel" him in a show of superior swordsmanship. Read.

+1

Whenever I watch that duel I always sort of laugh because Anakin pulled that trick. It was a sweet move yes, but does it actually fall into any saber forms? And the look on Christopher Lee's face. He knew he got WTFPWNED!!!1

1) No, not the way you put it. But in Luke's case, yes. Dooku and Anakin both have had at least a decade of training, while Luke hasn't even fully completed the basics. Of course Dooku would own Anakin had he received the same amount of training as Luke at the time of their ROTS fight. It has to do with potential, as well. Even though Anakin had far less training, his FP was higher than Dooku's. In Luke's case, that is the reason why he is pretty good for a newbie.

2) Uh... I don't think he ever said he would...

3) As effective as it could be, it is not the same as having a proper master. And, you have to take on account it was only between episodes five and six, which is, again, not enough to engage someone as skilled as Obi-Wan was in a duel and emerge victorious.

Luke and Vader win. Vader himself might be able to do it.

I've always hated that cheap move Obi pulled... Maul should have cut him in half.

And why the f*ck did Vader fall before he got his hand cut off?