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what happens?

Apparently noone knows.

Ulic.

Vader.

Because Tangible God is Canadian.

I may be Canadian, but I voted Republican.

And they will love you for it.

Ulic. Just becuase Vader's slow and Ulic has nice hair.

Ulic wins.

Agreed.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Ulic wins. Quantify and substantiate seeing that you severely underrate and downplay vader.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Ulic. Just becuase Vader's slow and Ulic has nice hair.

I hope your being sarcastic about Vader's speed...

Mabye.

Originally posted by Ivalice
Quantify and substantiate seeing that you severely underrate and downplay vader.
Funny how you quote me when several other people also said Ulic, and merely because I don't drool all over my shirt when I hear Vader's name doesn't mean that I downplay him. Your answer for everything is "you downplay Vader". Seriously man, wipe off your shirt and control your saliva.

Yeah man, wipe off your shirt.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Funny how you quote me when several other people also said Ulic, and merely because I don't drool all over my shirt when I hear Vader's name doesn't mean that I downplay him. Your answer for everything is "you downplay Vader". Seriously man, wipe off your shirt and control your saliva.

Is this really the thing to say to a man who is willing to, at the drop of hat, verbally go off on you?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Is this really the thing to say to a man who is willing to, at the drop of hat, verbally go off on you?
http://images.killermovies.com/forums/customsmilies/srug.gif

I'm just saying. Ivalice isn't known for baking cookies, ya know? Because his cookies suck, yeah?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
I'm just saying. Ivalice isn't known for baking cookies, ya know? Because his cookies suck, yeah?
chef

It has been a while since I read Ulic in the totj comics but he might win a straigh up saber duel by I don't recall him being on Vader's level in the force.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Funny how you quote me when several other people also said Ulic, and merely because I don't drool all over my shirt when I hear Vader's name doesn't mean that I downplay him. Your answer for everything is "you downplay Vader". Seriously man, wipe off your shirt and control your saliva. Funny that they are being sarcastic if you failed to realise save for exodus (whom is possibly more intelligent than you are). And why did i ask you only? Because your an overwhelemed hypocrite whom always barks at others to prove this prove that and when the burden of proof itselfs falls on you, hell even when its proven you STILL bark like a dog begging for more proof when you cannot come into conclusions.

Oh and how exactly did i drool over my shirt when i hear vaders name? OH this is the internet pal so how exactly do i "hear" vaders name when i merely READ IT? Can't you be a little more inelligent DS? And how do i drool over my shirt when my mouth isn't EVEN OPEN?? Take that COCK out of your mouth DS and actually try to be a little more intelligent so that people will take you more seriously.

And you DO downplay vader seeing that to you, NOBODIES like shaak ti could "defeat vader" or crap like "vader doesn't do X in one situation so it means he will never use it!!!!!1!11!oneone!!1one".
Seriously, WHEN have you ever actually argued vader or estimated him? If i recall, you only do so when he is against extremely weak opponents.

Now before you ***** about getting insulted, you should just realised that you attacked, then you got attacked. So don't try to play the victim.

How i chuckle when gideon commented on your debating capabilities. "What Ds?!?! This isn't even coming from nebarus or s_W_legend".

Originally posted by Ivalice
Funny that they are being sarcastic if you failed to realise save for exodus (whom is possibly more intelligent than you are). And why did i ask you only? Because your an overwhelemed hypocrite whom always barks at others to prove this prove that and when the burden of proof itselfs falls on you, hell even when its proven you STILL bark like a dog begging for more proof when you can
not come into conclusions.

Oh and how exactly did i drool over my shirt when i hear vaders name? OH this is the internet pal so how exactly do i "hear" vaders name when i merely READ IT? Can't you be a little more inelligent DS? And how do i drool over my shirt when my mouth isn't EVEN OPEN?? Take that COCK out of your mouth DS and actually try to be a little more intelligent so that people will take you more seriously.

And you DO downplay vader seeing that to you, NOBODIES like shaak ti could "defeat vader" or crap like "vader doesn't do X in one situation so it means he will never use it!!!!!1!11!oneone!!1one".
Seriously, WHEN have you ever actually argued vader or estimated him? If i recall, you only do so when he is against extremely weak opponents.

Now before you ***** about getting insulted, you should just realised that you attacked, then you got attacked. So don't try to play the victim.

How i chuckle when gideon commented on your debating capabilities. "What Ds?!?! This isn't even coming from nebarus or s_W_legend".

yawn

Oh, they were being sarcastic, and I wasn't, huh?


I never said you drool over Vader's name when you read it, did I? I never specified that you drool over Vader on here, or whether you drool when somebody says his name, did I? Lolz. What cock,? You just wish that Vader had a cock, don't you? Don't be jealous that Kenobi cut it off on Mustafar.

And how do I downplay Vader, just because I say Dooku can beat him, because that's not downplaying him, about half the people in this section think so, too. Show me where I said Shaak Ti could beat Vader, because if I remember correctly it was Shaak Ti and Quinlan Vos vs. Vader or something like that which is a huge difference than saying Shaak Ti alone could beat him.

And at least my debating skills have been brought up, and Janus said I am better at debating than I give myself credit for, who has ever said jack about your "skills"?


Is English a second language?

LOL dickshit, THIS is the best comeback you got?

Originally posted by darthsith19
yawn

Oh, they were being sarcastic, and I wasn't, huh? No. Because you actually fail at trying to be sarcastic

Originally posted by darthsith19

I never said you drool over Vader's name when you read it,
But you said when i hear his name when i clearly didn't dumbass seeing that this is an internet forum and no one uploaded sound clips of them saying vaders name, so yea, how am i suppose to hear his name as you implied?. Oh and i merely said i read vaders name on the internet, i never said you said you did. Learn to read.

Seriously DS, even a 12 year old could counter this far better than you can, your comeback is so damn stupid, lame and halfassed that it is not even worth responding to just that i happen to take the initiative to do so.

Now please, don't try to justify your actions.

Originally posted by darthsith19

did I? I never specified that you drool over Vader on here, or whether you drool when somebody says his name, did I? Lolz.
Yes you did, denial is a real ***** up your ass huh? wipe off your shirt and control your saliva.. Implying i drooled.

Originally posted by darthsith19

What cock,? You just wish that Vader had a cock, don't you? Don't be jealous that Kenobi cut it off on Mustafar. Yes i wish and i'd be so happy to suck a fictional characters cock, at least vader would be honored to let me suck his dick whereas you on the other hand get your ass pounded by your father every time you try to even get close to his "down there"
Originally posted by darthsith19

And how do I downplay Vader, just because I say Dooku can beat him, because that's not downplaying him,
Nope, not because of that, read the below posts.
Originally posted by darthsith19

about half the people in this section think so, too.
Nope, DS, gideon and nearly every one agreed vader would win, so its the majority who sided us except for you, ox and maybe one or 2 more.
Originally posted by darthsith19

Show me where I said Shaak Ti could beat Vader, because if I remember correctly it was Shaak Ti and Quinlan Vos vs. Vader or something like that which is a huge difference than saying Shaak Ti alone could beat him. Ok, then what about "bastila beats vader".

But its not important anyways because you just can't justify it.
Originally posted by darthsith19

And at least my debating skills have been brought up, and Janus said I am better at debating than I give myself credit for, who has ever said jack about your "skills"? Gideon? Darth sexy? Nikkolas? Zephiel7? Advent in a PM?(whom said i'm improving by a LARGE margin since the last time), Hell even Elitehunter would bring it up.

I recall gideon and advent downplaying your capabilities to even form a cogent argument.

Originally posted by darthsith19

Is English a second language? No, i was typing in the only language which you clearly understand which is language of the retards.

Alright you got me, I guess you drool when you hear Vader's name and read it, then. http://images.killermovies.com/forums/customsmilies/srug.gif





Vader would be honored to let you suck his cock? Sick dude, you have got a sick mind... sicko.



Since when is gideon everybody? Janus, Faunus, Borbarad, me, Rampant Ox, we all think Dooku would win still. Plus more probably, it's pretty close to 50-50.


2006 much?


Since when does Nikkolas' compliments mean anything? If anything, Nikkolas saying your a good debater brings you down. When did Gideon or Advent say positive things about your debating skills? Post that pm here why don't you?


Gideon misunderstands me, and Advent likes to insult people when she debates against them. So yes of course she said that, as a matter of fact she once sent me a pm apologizing (I'll post it here if you don't believe me).


Which is why I didn't understand it. Nice one, Ivalice.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Alright you got me, I guess you drool when you hear Vader's name and read it, then.
Again quantify how did i "hear" vaders name when this is an internet forum? Oh so its when i "hear AND read" now regardless of weather this is an internet forum with no uploaded clips. Please be more intelligent ok?



Originally posted by darthsith19

Vader would be honored to let you suck his cock? Sick dude, you have got a sick mind... sicko. LOL you seriously don't know sarcasm. Your a joke. Everywhere you go people LAUGH at you, hell every one is laughing at you, even pedophiles looking up kiddie porn pause for a moment JUST to laugh at you.

Your a pathetic little kid DS and you brighten my whole day with laughter.


Originally posted by darthsith19

Since when is gideon everybody? Janus, Faunus, Borbarad, me, Rampant Ox, we all think Dooku would win still. Plus more probably, it's pretty close to 50-50.
My god you seriously need to learn to read.

" Nope, DS, gideon and nearly every one agreed vader would win"
Originally posted by darthsith19

2006 much? Does it matter? You have not changed since then.

Originally posted by darthsith19

Since when does Nikkolas' compliments mean anything?
He did it at lucasmorons.com(lucasforums). And since when do you *think* you know what everyone does? Wow who could be so arrogant to think that they can simply know what people do.
Originally posted by darthsith19

If anything, Nikkolas saying your a good debater brings you down.
lol. Quantify and substantiate.
Originally posted by darthsith19

When did Gideon or Advent say positive things about your debating skills? Post that pm here why don't you?

2006? Remember that individual general kenobi rating the good debator and the bad and every one started doing the same? Thats where, and i'm not going to search through 2 years. Oh and how am i suppose to post messages that he sent me on MSN? I didn't bother to take a screenshot.

But hey it does not matter, i don't have anything to prove to you. Your opinion of me is disregarded and unimportant.

Originally posted by darthsith19

Gideon misunderstands me, and Advent likes to insult people when she debates against them. So yes of course she said that, as a matter of fact she once sent me a pm apologizing (I'll post it here if you don't believe me). Fair enough.

Originally posted by darthsith19

Which is why I didn't understand it. Nice one, Ivalice. I'm not surprised with your level of intelligence

*sighs*

Originally posted by Ivalice
Again quantify how did i "hear" vaders name when this is an internet forum? Oh so its when i "hear AND read" now regardless of weather this is an internet forum with no uploaded clips. Please be more intelligent ok?



LOL you seriously don't know sarcasm. Your a joke. Everywhere you go people LAUGH at you, hell every one is laughing at you, even pedophiles looking up kiddie porn pause for a moment JUST to laugh at you.

Your a pathetic little kid DS and you brighten my whole day with laughter.



My god you seriously need to learn to read.

" Nope, DS, gideon and nearly every one agreed vader would win"
Does it matter? You have not changed since then.

He did it at lucasmorons.com(lucasforums). And since when do you *think* you know what everyone does? Wow who could be so arrogant to think that they can simply know what people do.
lol. Quantify and substantiate.


2006? Remember that individual general kenobi rating the good debator and the bad and every one started doing the same? Thats where, and i'm not going to search through 2 years. Oh and how am i suppose to post messages that he sent me on MSN? I didn't bother to take a screenshot.

But hey it does not matter, i don't have anything to prove to you. Your opinion of me is disregarded and unimportant.

Fair enough.

I'm not surprised with your level of intelligence
Sorry I didn't explain myself good enough the first time. It is hear and read. I don't see any laughter, though this will be funny soon enough. And I am older than you, btw, so watch who you're calling kid. Why should I believe you when you can't post Advent's quote, and I remember that thread ranking people. Too bad it got deleted, but everybody was talking about how Advent and Borbarad werre good debaters, and the antediluvians were usually good but could resort to using to much flaming. Everybody was talking about how Sorgo was so bad so yes I do remember that thread. And if my opinion is so unimportant then why do you keep responding, do you want to get banned? And yes I have changed Vader > Bastilla is what I think now, people change, just because you haven't grown any pubic hair yet... (Noobrais told me in case you're wondering how I know).

Firstly DS the whole damn reason i attacked you was because you behaved in an aggressive manner towards me, yes i did bark back but only because you initiated the whole flaming post. I am not saying this is completely your fault, its mine too and it takes two hands to clap.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Sorry I didn't explain myself good enough the first time. It is hear and read. I don't see any laughter, though this will be funny soon enough.
LOL how do you "see" laughter?
Originally posted by darthsith19

And I am older than you, btw, so watch who you're calling kid.
Then STOP behaving like a kid.
Originally posted by darthsith19

Why should I believe you when you can't post Advent's quote,
Firstly why should i even post it when i already said i disregard your opinion and not give a sh!t what you think of me?
Originally posted by darthsith19

and I remember that thread ranking people. Too bad it got deleted, but everybody was talking about how Advent and Borbarad werre good debaters, and the antediluvians were usually good but could resort to using to much flaming. Everybody was talking about how Sorgo was so bad so yes I do remember that thread.
Ok.
Originally posted by darthsith19

And if my opinion is so unimportant then why do you keep responding, do you want to get banned?
Wait.. so i get banned because i respond to your posts? LOL. And in the name of screaming shit i said i disregard your opinion od me. Learn to read for christ sake Your opinion of me is disregarded and unimportant.

Originally posted by darthsith19

And yes I have changed Vader > Bastilla is what I think now, people change, just because you haven't grown any pubic hair yet... (Noobrais told me in case you're wondering how I know). LOL whos noobrais? You mean nebaris?

Anyways why would i want to get banned? You started the whole thing pal, i'm sure you yourself wouldn't want to get banned either as you barked back. Now ill give you 2 choise
a) we settle this civily
b) lets go on until BOTH of us get banned.

idk why you would want to get banned, but Rex has given you many warnings lately and you still keep flaming so obviously you don't care much. Who is noobrais? Lol, in case you haven't realised yet, nebrais goes by the name noobrais, last time I called him nebrais he got pissed off at me and said his name was noobrais. I don't know how you can't know who noobrais is, I knew you were dumb but sheesh.

You can see humor, when it is typed out, just like you can see anger in posts.



Is that why you asked me for proof that Ulic beats Vader? Is that why you're debating with me in the Grievous vs. Vader thread? Lol.

Is that why you keep responding? Lol.



P.S. shit can be typed out you know, it's not censored.

Originally posted by Ivalice
Funny that they are being sarcastic if you failed to realise save for exodus (whom is possibly more intelligent than you are). And why did i ask you only? Because your an overwhelemed hypocrite whom always barks at others to prove this prove that and when the burden of proof itselfs falls on you, hell even when its proven you STILL bark like a dog begging for more proof when you cannot come into conclusions.

Oh and how exactly did i drool over my shirt when i hear vaders name? OH this is the internet pal so how exactly do i "hear" vaders name when i merely READ IT? Can't you be a little more inelligent DS? And how do i drool over my shirt when my mouth isn't EVEN OPEN?? Take that COCK out of your mouth DS and actually try to be a little more intelligent so that people will take you more seriously.

And you DO downplay vader seeing that to you, NOBODIES like shaak ti could "defeat vader" or crap like "vader doesn't do X in one situation so it means he will never use it!!!!!1!11!oneone!!1one".
Seriously, WHEN have you ever actually argued vader or estimated him? If i recall, you only do so when he is against extremely weak opponents.
reported.
Now before you ***** about getting insulted, you should just realised that you attacked, then you got attacked. So don't try to play the victim.

How i chuckle when gideon commented on your debating capabilities. "What Ds?!?! This isn't even coming from nebarus or s_W_legend".

reported.

Fine DS, seeing that this is going no where, ill stop.

WOO HOOO!!!!!!!!!!


'does some lame chicken dance'

useful thread... whole lot of good debatin' going on.. I pick Vader. Because i don't read comics, and i don't know who Ulic is. (that's my substantiation.)

ulic

Vader smashes him without a doubt.

Ulic smashes him without a doubt.

Logic FTW.

Ulic who defeated Mandalore the Indomitable (i hate that)
and who was dubbed Sith Lord by Ragnos
and given power-increasing tattoo by Ragnos
and who i believe has one of those amulets.
yeah

Originally posted by UltimateStryfe
Ulic who defeated Mandalore the Indomitable (i hate that)
and who was dubbed Sith Lord by Ragnos
and given power-increasing tattoo by Ragnos
and who i believe has one of those amulets.
yeah

i hate to cut down something i haven't read: BUT POWER INCREASING TATTOO!?!?!?! what the HEY? what is this, pokemon? garbage like that makes star wars a lot more juvenile... IMO.

Originally posted by truejedi
i hate to cut down something i haven't read: BUT POWER INCREASING TATTOO!?!?!?! what the HEY? what is this, pokemon? garbage like that makes star wars a lot more juvenile... IMO.


yeah don't criticize what you don't understand and obviously have no knowledge on.

if you haven't read it than you're in no place to make a judgement or form an opinion.

cut down something you know about.

He didn't say it wasn't valid - which it isn't. He called it a stupid idea, which it is.

i'd like to think i could understand comics if i wanted too, but serously, what does power increasung tatoo mean? please tell me thats not what they call it in the text.

Originally posted by truejedi
i'd like to think i could understand comics if i wanted too, but serously, what does power increasung tatoo mean? please tell me thats not what they call it in the text.

We actually had a thread for the tattoos given to Kun and Ulic.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f6/t481163.html

i agree that the idea of a sith tattoo adding to power is retarded. if that was how it was supposed to be darth maul would be a god.

for some reason the spirit of marka ragnos branding exar kun and ulic qel-drom on the forehead with his fingers somehow added to their dark power. (i would assume it's similar to sith's ability to affect others from holocron. like when addedu mutated krayt)
again, there isn't alot about ragnos other than he was the most powerful when he was alive.

i don't personally own that comic. i'm tryin to find a source tho.

Originally posted by Elite Hunter
We actually had a thread for the tattoos given to Kun and Ulic.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f6/t481163.html

thanx

Originally posted by UltimateStryfe
Ulic who defeated Mandalore the Indomitable (i hate that)
and who was dubbed Sith Lord by Ragnos
and given power-increasing tattoo by Ragnos
and who i believe has one of those amulets.
yeah

Mandalore the indomitable? Skillful non force sensitive. That's like bragging "Vader can destroy Jango Fett".
Sidious>>>>>Ragnos
Chosen one>>>Tatoos.
Vader has Sith Alchemical items as well.

Vader>>Ulic

The logic absolutely sucks, but the conclusion's probably right.

vader. vader is 80% of sideous, and sideous is the most powerful sith lord. Ulic was pretty much, a promising jedi with a sad story. nothing to write home about... and yes, i did read ALL of the ulic comics, including redemption, the one where he has the xbox logo on his head :P

Ulic.

His natural grasp of the lightsaber was pretty much as good as it gets, to the point where cut off from the Force, physically past his prime, and almost a decade out of practise, he was able to stalemate a darkside driven and extremely skilled Jedi (to the point where she was capable of slaughtering multiple Massassi Warriors (who were described as being skilled with the dark side) in seconds with her bare hands). In his Force using days where he was in his physical prime, well practised with the lightsaber, and a "master swordsman," it's pretty clear that he would have been a major force to be reckoned with, taking all of the factors into consideration. He did stalemate Exar Kun after all, and while his ribs were broken at that.

As for Force ability, he was capable of blasting two Jedi Knights about 50 meters away from him with one attack, and this before he was branded with Sith tatoos by the Ancient Sith, and growing considerably in power to the point where he was seen to be "rippling" in darkside energies.

I honestly don't see how Vader compares. It was his Force Potential that was described as being around 80% of that of Sidious. In developed power, Force control, and Force knowledge, Sidious still smashes him.

Originally posted by Farfalla
Ulic.

His natural grasp of the lightsaber was pretty much as good as it gets, to the point where cut off from the Force, physically past his prime, and almost a decade out of practise, he was able to stalemate a darkside driven and extremely skilled Jedi (to the point where she was capable of slaughtering multiple Massassi Warriors (who were described as being skilled with the dark side) in seconds with her bare hands). In his Force using days where he was in his physical prime, well practised with the lightsaber, and a "master swordsman," it's pretty clear that he would have been a major force to be reckoned with, taking all of the factors into consideration. He did stalemate Exar Kun after all, and while his ribs were broken at that.

As for Force ability, he was capable of blasting two Jedi Knights about 50 meters away from him with one attack, and this before he was branded with Sith tatoos by the Ancient Sith, and growing considerably in power to the point where he was seen to be "rippling" in darkside energies.

I honestly don't see how Vader compares. It was his Force Potential that was described as being around 80% of that of Sidious. In developed power, Force control, and Force knowledge, Sidious still smashes him. I smell a sock by the name of nebaris.

I smell a native of Thailand by the name of Kadesh.

Originally posted by Farfalla
I smell a native of Thailand by the name of Kadesh. LOL i was never from thailand nor did i ever state i was. Do your homework and pull your head out of your ass before jumping to conclusions mate.

Vader is suseptable to Sith lightning. Plus Ulric has one of those cool amulets, which might be able to sithshit on vader like it did on those 2 jedi. Also, Ulric was able to draw with Exar Kun despite broken ribs and Kun is a much better duelist than Vader in my eye's.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
vader. vader is 80% of sideous, and sideous is the most powerful sith lord. Ulic was pretty much, a promising jedi with a sad story. nothing to write home about... and yes, i did read ALL of the ulic comics, including redemption, the one where he has the xbox logo on his head :P

Pretty much. A talented Jedi that fell to the dark side, he isn't much more than that. Vader outclasses him in every department.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Vader is suseptable to Sith lightning. Plus Ulric has one of those cool amulets, which might be able to sithshit on vader like it did on those 2 jedi. Also, Ulric was able to draw with Exar Kun despite broken ribs and Kun is a much better duelist than Vader in my eye's.

So Ulic had an amulet, Vader had Kaan's in his glove. Ulic never utlized the amulet the way Exar Kun did aka Amulet blasts.

Originally posted by Elite Hunter
So Ulic had an amulet, Vader had Kaan's in his glove. Ulic never utlized the amulet the way Exar Kun did aka Amulet blasts.
Kaan had an amulet? Interesting, what are it's powers?

Originally posted by darthsith19
Kaan had an amulet? Interesting, what are it's powers?

No clue

i am going to get the xbox logo tatooed on my head, or im going to headbang an xbox until it makes a little imprint in my forehead

Personally id say vader wins this. And i will not make any proper arguments till TFU is released.

Then you got a while to go.

Quite. Im waiting because i am sick of people underrating vader and severely underestimating him.

lol vader wins this one by majority vote mate.

Fool!! He used it to blast two jedi.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Fool!! He used it to blast two jedi.

Um if you are referring to the confrontation just prior to his duel with Exar Kun in DLOTS than you are mistaken,he is using the amulets but it is clearly not an amulet blast that we seen Kun use on Nadd.

PWMT! Pregnant Wizards Mayo Tomato

The text say's taht he released a blast from his amulet. It may not be the same as that used by Kun but it still count's as a amulet blast, there's nothing to suggest otherwise.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
The text say's taht he released a blast from his amulet. It may not be the same as that used by Kun but it still count's as a amulet blast, there's nothing to suggest otherwise.

Once again you failed to answer my question, was the scene you are talking about the one with Cay and Nomi trying to convince to leave with them just prior to Kun's arrival? I'm looking at the page in the comic right now and the comic doesn't say anything about an amulet blast. The only thing remotely close to it is what Cay says"Watch it-he's using a sith amulet! They're deadly!" There is not enough evidence to say whether Ulic's amulet could replicate Kun's amulet blast/

Either way, based on existing evidence, Ulic does appear to be the more powerful of the two, as "account restricted" established.

??????????????? HI NEBARIS! hi2

Originally posted by ???????????????
Either way, based on existing evidence, Ulic does appear to be the more powerful of the two, as "account restricted" established.

Ridiculous. Ulic is inferior to Vader.

Originally posted by Farfalla
Ulic.

His natural grasp of the lightsaber was pretty much as good as it gets, to the point where cut off from the Force, physically past his prime, and almost a decade out of practise, he was able to stalemate a darkside driven and extremely skilled Jedi (to the point where she was capable of slaughtering multiple Massassi Warriors (who were described as being skilled with the dark side) in seconds with her bare hands). In his Force using days where he was in his physical prime, well practised with the lightsaber, and a "master swordsman," it's pretty clear that he would have been a major force to be reckoned with, taking all of the factors into consideration. He did stalemate Exar Kun after all, and while his ribs were broken at that.

As for Force ability, he was capable of blasting two Jedi Knights about 50 meters away from him with one attack, and this before he was branded with Sith tatoos by the Ancient Sith, and growing considerably in power to the point where he was seen to be "rippling" in darkside energies.

I honestly don't see how Vader compares. It was his Force Potential that was described as being around 80% of that of Sidious. In developed power, Force control, and Force knowledge, Sidious still smashes him.

Provide a counter argument or go home b1tch

Goddamn, you are an oddly persistent fellow.

Originally posted by Elite Hunter
??????????????? HI NEBARIS! hi2

*looks at edit*

High Elite Hunter.

Originally posted by ???????????????
*looks at edit*

High Elite Hunter.

Which is what I was at the time....... ........................

No, I wasn't. Now that I recall, he might have actually used it twice, once in the scenario that you described and once just after he kill's Satal. His fellow jedi try to get him to come with them and he blast's them with the amulet (as evidenced by the scarlet light it emmits and the way that they cringe away). Then they interrupt him talking to Allema by attacking on the back's of flying beasts and then mhe uses it (apparantly) forcing 3 powerful and experienced jedi to run away.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
No, I wasn't. Now that I recall, he might have actually used it twice, once in the scenario that you described and once just after he kill's Satal. His fellow jedi try to get him to come with them and he blast's them with the amulet (as evidenced by the scarlet light it emmits and the way that they cringe away). Then they interrupt him talking to Allema by attacking on the back's of flying beasts and then mhe uses it (apparantly) forcing 3 powerful and experienced jedi to run away.

Um the blast from his body is due to the sith poison's in him by Satal which multiplied his anger or something of the sort, he never had an amulet at that time and the only time he used the amulet is the scene i described is here http://www.swtimeline.ru/?view=859&size=M&page=141 and you can read the next few pages as to why the left which is on their own accord not because Ulic forced/overpowered them.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
No, I wasn't. Now that I recall, he might have actually used it twice, once in the scenario that you described and once just after he kill's Satal. His fellow jedi try to get him to come with them and he blast's them with the amulet (as evidenced by the scarlet light it emmits and the way that they cringe away). Then they interrupt him talking to Allema by attacking on the back's of flying beasts and then mhe uses it (apparantly) forcing 3 powerful and experienced jedi to run away.

Who cares, Ulic is inferior to Vader.

Exar Kun is better than Vader and Ulric was able to equal him despite having broken ribs.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Exar Kun is better than Vader and Ulric was able to equal him despite having broken ribs.

Um Exar Kun wasn't at his peak yet and Vader does stand a very good chance of killing pre DLOTS of Exar Kun and Ulic was stalemating him in a saber duel, but how about a force duel between them, then Ulic would lose.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Exar Kun is better than Vader and Ulric was able to equal him despite having broken ribs.

Ah! The old Kun argument. What did Exar Kun do prior to his anti-climatic battle with Ulic to make you think he's anywhere above Vader (pre or post suit)?

Vader only became stronger in the force and in the dark side after ROTS, he may not have achieved his full potential but he was easily among the most powerful force users in SW. Ulic has nothing on Vader, it's that simple.

Lightsabers: Vader has faced tougher odds and better fighters than Ulic. And in a force fight, Vader was still an immense presence in the force, I don't why people ignore this. There is enough evidence in the EU to suggest that Vader become stronger in the force: he also adapted his saber style to take advantage of his cybernetically remodeled body, as well as eliminate it's weaknesses.

Wow, what a joke of an argument.

How about destroy two strong jedi knights and his master in quick time, obliterate a giant taranterek with his amulet, enslave a species etc.



You lie.
Quantify and substantiate.

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
How about destroy two strong jedi knights and his master in quick time, obliterate a giant taranterek with his amulet, enslave a species etc.

Two strong Jedi nowhere near the calibre of Ulic let alone Dooku, Obi Wan nor anywhere near as dangerous as Durge or Asajj Ventress. As I said, even before Vader turned into a cyborg he was a far more distinguished force user than the Kun Ulic faced.



Originally posted by Darth Exodus
You lie.
Quantify and substantiate.

Obi Wan Kenobi. Count Dooku. Durge. Do these names ring a bell? Not to mention a coterie of some at least six Jedi he faced off against at one time and survived, in fact he killed most of them.

In the rise of Darth Vader we know that his armor limited his vision, restrained his movement, and caused extreme frustration for Vader (in the early years at least), but he would eventually retool his entire fighting style to make up for the lack of mobility that his armor imposed.

Just one thing Exodus, the taranterek was created by Exar Kun, you are referring to the sith wyrm.

Mabye not but Anakin didn't have to fight any of these directly after one another. And then he went on to beat his master, who knew all his moves, really easily. He wasn't even breating hard by the end either.



Anakin beat those not Vader. And Exar Kun was far superior to all of those bar Dooku whom he merely surpasses.



Those Jedi were shit. One of them actually got slain by a teammate. And the others made the frankly idiotic mistake at coming at him one at a time. And despite this, Vader still lost something like both arms as well as other wounds.



LOL, yeah he did great letting a complete ametuer like Luke hit him and cut off one of his arms once. Plus he only managing to stalemate the withered, not-practised-in-15-years Obi-wan and got beat by Boba Fett. Yaeh, he rocks!!!

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Mabye not but Anakin didn't have to fight any of these directly after one another. And then he went on to beat his master, who knew all his moves, really easily. He wasn't even breating hard by the end either.

Point is no one Kun fought was on the level of Dooku or Obi Wan. Hell before Ulic he hadn't fought anyone on the level of Asajj Ventress.



Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Anakin beat those not Vader. And Exar Kun was far superior to all of those bar Dooku whom he merely surpasses.


Great rebuttal?

I'm hoping that I don't need to tell you that Anakin Sky Walker is Darth Vader. The only difference is Anakin is more mobile, but less patient, less wise, less experienced, less powerful in the dark side.


Originally posted by Darth Exodus
Those Jedi were shit. One of them actually got slain by a teammate. And the others made the frankly idiotic mistake at coming at him one at a time. And despite this, Vader still lost something like both arms as well as other wounds.

Let's not get carried away. 6+ Jedi all gunning for you at the same time are greater odds than facing one Ulic Qel Droma. And unlike the masters in ROTS with Sidious, these guys were actually taken out in a manner that made sense, naturally Vader would get damaged.




Originally posted by Darth Exodus
LOL, yeah he did great letting a complete ametuer like Luke hit him and cut off one of his arms once. Plus he only managing to stalemate the withered, not-practised-in-15-years Obi-wan and got beat by Boba Fett. Yaeh, he rocks!!!

Conveniently forgetting that Vader's resolve in the dark side had been dissolved gradually for years and that he would never kill his son. That he never fully embraced the dark side (at least not to the extent of Sidious) because of how disappointed he was in himself and that Luke's presence made him uncertain in his convictions on top of all the self loathing.

When Vader fought Luke in ROTJ he was spiritually weak; he was there for the taking.

We're talking about Ulic here, Vader wouldn't give a shit about Ulic's life and that would spell destruction for Qel Droma.

think about it. your unneccessary fanboyism towards maul who's only great feats include: whiping out black sun, (seriously, killing a few roomfulls of some skilled non force users is supposed to be amaizing?); and causing an excellent jedi master to think that committing suicide was the safest way to defeat maul.

AND VADER KILLED HIM!!!
This is vader who took out cin drallig, count dooku, mace windu, and the emperor!

from the comic book i read: ulic took out mandalore, (no great feat), got betrayed and captured on coruscaunt, escaped, plundered a dying planet, got stripped of the force by a noob, and then got killed by a jedi on hoth.

Compare the feats. if you=nooblet fanboy; keep arguing for Qel Droma.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
think about it. your unneccessary fanboyism towards maul who's only great feats include: whiping out black sun, (seriously, killing a few roomfulls of some skilled non force users is supposed to be amaizing?); and causing an excellent jedi master to think that committing suicide was the safest way to defeat maul.Kicking the shit out of Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan at once? Outclassing the most skilled duelist in the Jedi Order? Nearly managing to kill Sidious when he got ticked off?

Yeah. Maul sucks.
OH MY GOD!1!

And why, exactly, are you even bringing up Maul?
Cuz of the last two; you're an idiot. And by this logic, Han Solo killed DE Sidious, therefore he stomps Vader's ass.
So... you're a biased idiot?

Mandalore was the single greatest warrior alive in the SW equivalent of Spartan society. Basically, one of the deadliest men in the galaxy. Against Ulic - starting out with a basilisk war droid while Ulic has to run around several hundred feet above the ground on a network of chains - he still lost, and miserably. To call this unimpressive is stupid.
Damn. I guess Dooku and Sidious are just god-awful then, huh?
Nomi Sunrider, one of the most talented Jedi ever? Not to mention the fact that he was sitting there weeping over his brother's dead body when it happened.
Actually, he managed to fend off a pissed off Sylvar - without a Force-connection - for what appeared to be a notable amount of time before refusing to fight any further; he was then shot in the back by a pilot.

Not that I agree with his stance, but you're hardly the person to be telling him this.

Originally posted by Faunus
Kicking the shit out of Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan at once? Outclassing the most skilled duelist in the Jedi Order? Nearly managing to kill Sidious when he got ticked off?

Yeah. Maul sucks.
OH MY GOD!1!

fine, have it your way. VADER KICKED THIS GUY'S ARSE TO heck!!! he outclassed a bum who didn't merit an appearance in the movies, and then got curbstomped by a padawan. HE didn't kill sideous, he didn't even come close, and obi wan kicked his ass. Your right, maul sucks.

because if vader kicked his arse, and he truly did all of the above, this proves vader AMAAAIZZING!!



i dont get it, how did han even come close to killing sideous?


amaizing! Simply amaizing! I dont really give a crap about your spartaan society!! Give me some substance that mandalore is so godly as you say. So, call me a biased idiot, and then just proclaim Mandalore the greatest warior alive! and yes, i read the comic books. he did get to start with a bassilisk, and he is no pushover, but ulic had the force and was gifted. AS far as i can see, this is the only even close to impressive thing ulic did.


what are you rambling about now?


substantiate she is one of the most talented. Alot of people make the OMG MOST TALENTED CUT!! Ulic is probably one of them.


Actually, he managed to fend off a pissed off Sylvar - without a Force-connection - for what appeared to be a notable amount of time before refusing to fight any further; he was then shot in the back by a pilot.
if by pissed off you mean an insane no name?


my point with this was proving that VAder had killed more ULTRA beings in quantity then ulic, not that ulic was a weakling.

like i said, ulic is a talented jedi with a sad story.
Vader is a child generated through the force with more midichlorions then the most powerful jedi.

Originally posted by Faunus


Mandalore was the single greatest warrior alive in the SW equivalent of Spartan society. Basically, one of the deadliest men in the galaxy. Against Ulic - starting out with a basilisk war droid while Ulic has to run around several hundred feet above the ground on a network of chains - he still lost, and miserably. To call this unimpressive is stupid.

You're kidding right? He was on basilisk but how is that impressive? Mandalore is a non force sensitive. Basically a soldier with martial skills, defeating him isn't a big feat especially for a force sensitive with any kind of talent.

And as far as being one of the most deadly mean in the galaxy?... Sure if you've got martial skills, use grenades, high powered projectile weapons and have access to soldiers and vehicles, you're dangerous however, in a one-on-one duel you're nothing compared to a force user the calibre of Asajj Ventress, Obi Wan, Maul and Dooku.

Hell, Asajj Ventress was destroying mobs of big, fast, skillful and dangerous mercenaries on her own.

sorry, did i forget ventress on the list of vader accomplishments?

Originally posted by Allankles
Point is no one Kun fought was on the level of Dooku or Obi Wan. Hell before Ulic he hadn't fought anyone on the level of Asajj Ventress.

Sure thing, if you don't consider century old lightsaber instructors on the level of Asajj Ventress, one of which Exar was capable of competing with when he was a padawan.

Vodo, by that knowledge alone, would logically be at the very least a match for Dooku, let alone Obi-Wan, and Exar, as a padawan, and before gaining his power amplifying Sith amulets and studying Sith Magic, was already able to compete with him, and as I mentioned, Ulic didn't just stalemate him, he did it with an injured body. All this before being branded with Sith tattoos, and skyrocketing in power to the point where he was described as “rippling in dark side energies.”

Then there’s also the fact that when Anakin actually defeated Dooku, Dooku had been instructed to test him, forbidden to mortally harm him, and was working under the knowledge that if Anakin somehow got into a position to kill him, that Palpatine would stop the fight, as explained here:

"Palpatine has told Dooku. 'I have somebody who I think will be a great Sith Lord and I think we can get him to join us. But we need to test him. So we're going to setup a situation where you fight him. If he gets the best of you, then I'll stop the fight and he'll have passed the test. If you get the best of him, then we'll let him go, and we'll let him stew for a few more years until he's ready.' But behind it, obviously, is Palpatine's real intention: If Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku and become Palpatine's new apprentice. But he didn't tell Dooku that."

--George Lucas, The Making Of ROTS; Page 41

In other words, he spent part of the fight testing Anakin’s capabilities rather than trying to actually defeat him, wasn’t fighting with the absolute need of self preservation, and when he actually did fight to win, he was still limiting his options by not going for the kill, and aiming only to disarm or minorly wound.

If he were to have been aiming to kill, fighting for his life, and not have wasted any of his efforts on testing Anakin’s capabilities, and then Anakin defeated him, then the feat would likely be as impressive as you’re trying to make it out to be, but unfortunately for you, Anakin only managed to defeat him under special circumstances that thoroughly undermines its value.



For all intents and purposes, he's not.



He's far more mobile, possesses a far greater connection to the Force, and far better accustomed to combat, via the Clone Wars. From a combat standpoint, they're nothing alike, ergo, you can't use PT Anakin's displays of ability as support for Vader’s level of combat prowess by blindly speculating on how closely they both compare. You’re honouring by association like a moron.



Because you say so? Ulic, both with the Force and lightsaber, has displayed a level of ability that far surpasses the average Jedi, such as knocking two talented Jedi back dozens of feet even before going through a major power transformation where he was seen to be rippling in dark side energies, as well as stalemating a darkside driven and extremely capable Jedi whilst physically past his prime, cut off from the Force, and a decade out of practise. You may find it hard to believe that a single Force User could succeed where multiple others failed, but the fact of the matter is, Ulic isn't just your average Jedi, and has displayed a level of ability that places him a good few notches above the norm. It’s not unheard of for multiple Jedi to be defeated by a single exceptional being. Grievous was able to take out similar numbers of Jedi that Vader did, and unlike him, completely dominated, and wasn’t once harmed. Darth Bane was capable of matching three Jedi of the millennium long Jedi and Sith War, two of them being some of the more powerful Masters of the time, whilst they were having their asses boosted by powerful, concentrated Battle Meditation. Sidious himself slaughtered three powerful Jedi Masters in seconds.

But even then, the fight, in all honesty, proves little.

You had Jedi (with no proven skills, might I add) turning on each other midway through the battle, running at Vader with their lightsabers held high like morons, showing no signs that they were acting as a cohesive Force, and even then, Vader was literally getting his ass kicked throughout the fight, receiving multiple hits, and could have actually been defeated twice during the battle, the first time when he was down and one of the Jedi prevented another from landing a finishing blow, and the second time right at the end of the fight, when the few remaining Jedi had him finished, and the arrival of his troopers saved his ass.



Naturally? If Vader really was the titan you’re trying to make him out to be, he would have been able to perform similarly to the above mentioned beings, and not have been basically kicked all over the place by a relatively unimpressive group of Jedi. And unlike the Masters in RotS with Sidious, they have literally no proven skills, whereas the Masters that Sidious slaughtered were some of the most powerful Jedi of the Order.



Last time I checked, Exodus didn’t say anything to the contrary. His point, irregardless of how badly Vader had been holding back, was that he was still using all of his ability to defend himself, and yet was still incapable of adequately doing so in the situation in question against the extremely poorly trained and unimpressive Luke Skywalker, who, at the time, was attacking him with absolutely no finesse whatsoever.

Originally posted by ??????????????
Sure thing, if you don't consider century old lightsaber instructors on the level of Asajj Ventress, one of which Exar was capable of competing with when he was a padawan.

Vodo, by that knowledge alone, would logically be at the very least a match for Dooku, let alone Obi-Wan, and Exar, as a padawan, and before gaining his power amplifying Sith amulets and studying Sith Magic, was already able to compete with him, and as I mentioned, Ulic didn't just stalemate him, he did it with an injured body. All this before being branded with Sith tattoos, and skyrocketing in power to the point where he was described as “rippling in dark side energies.”

Then there’s also the fact that when Anakin actually defeated Dooku, Dooku had been instructed to test him, forbidden to mortally harm him, and was working under the knowledge that if Anakin somehow got into a position to kill him, that Palpatine would stop the fight, as explained here:

"Palpatine has told Dooku. 'I have somebody who I think will be a great Sith Lord and I think we can get him to join us. But we need to test him. So we're going to setup a situation where you fight him. If he gets the best of you, then I'll stop the fight and he'll have passed the test. If you get the best of him, then we'll let him go, and we'll let him stew for a few more years until he's ready.' But behind it, obviously, is Palpatine's real intention: If Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku and become Palpatine's new apprentice. But he didn't tell Dooku that."

--George Lucas, The Making Of ROTS; Page 41

In other words, he spent part of the fight testing Anakin’s capabilities rather than trying to actually defeat him, wasn’t fighting with the absolute need of self preservation, and when he actually did fight to win, he was still limiting his options by not going for the kill, and aiming only to disarm or minorly wound.

If he were to have been aiming to kill, fighting for his life, and not have wasted any of his efforts on testing Anakin’s capabilities, and then Anakin defeated him, then the feat would likely be as impressive as you’re trying to make it out to be, but unfortunately for you, Anakin only managed to defeat him under special circumstances that thoroughly undermines its value.



For all intents and purposes, he's not.



He's far more mobile, possesses a far greater connection to the Force, and far better accustomed to combat, via the Clone Wars. From a combat standpoint, they're nothing alike, ergo, you can't use PT Anakin's displays of ability as support for Vader’s level of combat prowess by blindly speculating on how closely they both compare. You’re honouring by association like a moron.



Because you say so? Ulic, both with the Force and lightsaber, has displayed a level of ability that far surpasses the average Jedi, such as knocking two talented Jedi back dozens of feet even before going through a major power transformation where he was seen to be rippling in dark side energies, as well as stalemating a darkside driven and extremely capable Jedi whilst physically past his prime, cut off from the Force, and a decade out of practise. You may find it hard to believe that a single Force User could succeed where multiple others failed, but the fact of the matter is, Ulic isn't just your average Jedi, and has displayed a level of ability that places him a good few notches above the norm. It’s not unheard of for multiple Jedi to be defeated by a single exceptional being. Grievous was able to take out similar numbers of Jedi that Vader did, and unlike him, completely dominated, and wasn’t once harmed. Darth Bane was capable of matching three Jedi of the millennium long Jedi and Sith War, two of them being some of the more powerful Masters of the time, whilst they were having their asses boosted by powerful, concentrated Battle Meditation. Sidious himself slaughtered three powerful Jedi Masters in seconds.

But even then, the fight, in all honesty, proves little.

You had Jedi (with no proven skills, might I add) turning on each other midway through the battle, running at Vader with their lightsabers held high like morons, showing no signs that they were acting as a cohesive Force, and even then, Vader was literally getting his ass kicked throughout the fight, receiving multiple hits, and could have actually been defeated twice during the battle, the first time when he was down and one of the Jedi prevented another from landing a finishing blow, and the second time right at the end of the fight, when the few remaining Jedi had him finished, and the arrival of his troopers saved his ass.



Naturally? If Vader really was the titan you’re trying to make him out to be, he would have been able to perform similarly to the above mentioned beings, and not have been basically kicked all over the place by a relatively unimpressive group of Jedi. And unlike the Masters in RotS with Sidious, they have literally no proven skills, whereas the Masters that Sidious slaughtered were some of the most powerful Jedi of the Order.



Last time I checked, Exodus didn’t say anything to the contrary. His point, irregardless of how badly Vader had been holding back, was that he was still using all of his ability to defend himself, and yet was still incapable of adequately doing so in the situation in question against the extremely poorly trained and unimpressive Luke Skywalker, who, at the time, was attacking him with absolutely no finesse whatsoever.

http://www.uranther.com/funnypics/stfu.jpg

She was stated to be able to wield a lightsaber with the prowess of a Master the very first time she picked one up, was capable of applying Battle Meditation in ways never again replicated without any training (manipulating two giant dark side beasts into killing each other by simply visualising it), and was capable of completely and permanently stripping a Force User's powers away from them, when she had only originally been trained in temporarily suppressing a Force Sensitive's powers.

Originally posted by ??????????????


Seriously, I'm with Saxy on this one Nebaris, you're full of bs. To even compare Vodo to Dooku, what did he ever do to give the impression he was on Dooku's level?

Hell, I wouldn't say he was Asajj Ventress' level. A wise Jedi Master with a stick instead of a lightsaber. Sure he might have been knowledgeable in the force but his combat abilities are not impressive.

Originally posted by ??????????????
She was stated to be able to wield a lightsaber with the prowess of a Master the very first time she picked one up, was capable of applying Battle Meditation in ways never again replicated without any training (manipulating two giant dark side beasts into killing each other by simply visualising it), and was capable of completely and permanently stripping a Force User's powers away from them, when she had only originally been trained in temporarily suppressing a Force Sensitive's powers.

Nomi was talented but being talented is a given. There are plenty of talented Jedi in the mythos, several more talented than Nomi.

Originally posted by ??????????????
Sure thing, if you don't consider century old lightsaber instructors on the level of Asajj Ventress, one of which Exar was capable of competing with when he was a padawan.

Asajj would have defeated Vodo. She has shown herself to be far more impressive.




Originally posted by ??????????????
He's far more mobile, possesses a far greater connection to the Force, and far better accustomed to combat, via the Clone Wars.
rom a combat standpoint, they're nothing alike, ergo, you can't use PT Anakin's displays of ability as support for Vader’s level of combat prowess by blindly speculating on how closely they both compare. You’re honouring by association like a moron.

Ignoring canon facts makes you look like a moron. First of all Vader's strength in the dark side increased and his skill in the force grew as well. He didn't remain stagnant in his abilities nor did he detiriorate, he only never tapped into his FULL potential. Secondly, he became more cunning, more patient, more wise i.e. he learned from his mistakes as Anakin and eliminated some his character weaknesses. On top of all this he retooled his fighting techniques to compensate for his large, heavy cyborg frame.

Adding all this, we see capable of defeating Maul in a straight saber duel as well as noted Jedi like the Dark Lady, in fact the suit forced him to be more cunning in his fighting style. Also, we who are rational choose to remember that Vader still had his combat skills, he only added to those skills with a greater knowledge of the dark side, practice with old and new skills and of course experience. We know that he practiced his lightsaber combat religiously.






Originally posted by ??????????????
His point, irregardless of how badly Vader had been holding back, was that he was still using all of his ability to defend himself, and yet was still incapable of adequately doing so in the situation in question against the extremely poorly trained and unimpressive Luke Skywalker, who, at the time, was attacking him with absolutely no finesse whatsoever.

So Vader is incapable of getting surprised? It's pretty much in the canon that Vader got caught off guard, keeping in mind that he wasn't about to unleash the full repertoire of his abilities, getting disarmed was inevitable. All Vader does is keep his defense up against an enraged Skywalker. There are a several things Vader could have done to stop Luke, looking at this in hindsight of Vader's abilities in the EU, but he didn't do anything. Of course, Luke being his son complicated things for Vader.

Originally posted by ??????????????


You had Jedi (with no proven skills, might I add) turning on each other midway through the battle, showing no signs that they were acting as a cohesive Force, and even then, Vader was literally getting his ass kicked throughout the fight, receiving multiple hits, and could have actually been defeated twice during the battle,


This is ridiculous, he faces off against multiple Jedi and gets wounded? omg what a travesty!!!! That's what's supposed to happen when you face multiple Jedi, that's why I said Palpatine's encounter with the Jedi - by contrast - was a farce, from a story telling perspective as well as the basic physics of the whole thing. You're up against 4 supposedly gifted Jedi Masters and none can land a strike on you?

It reflects poorly on the Jedi's skill level more than anything else, given what we actually saw happen. Palpatine wasn't doing anything we haven't seen other Jedi/Sith do. I wasn't comparing Palpatine's feat to Vader's though, all I'm saying is the simple facts: fighting multiple Jedi is greater odds than fighting one Ulic Qel Droma.

heck, sure nomi was talented, im not saying she wasn't, i wasnt saying she was extremely gifted, its just, getting cut off from the force by her isnt exactly the stuff of gods, or the stuff it would take to kill vader.