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Luke- just as he falls into his patented hackin technique aboard the Deathstar in ROJ...

Vs Darth Tyranus- apprentice to the most powerful sith lord in history.

1. Lightsabers
2. Force
3. All out

Because Luke's fighting style is so untrained at this point, we will have to assume that they are both cut off from the force for some reason. Luke might not be able to control his usage of the force.

So this is ROTJ luke after dooku says something about his sister. Dooku takes this. His makashi gracefuly glances aside luke's unimpressive skills. At this point vader was bogged down emotionally, and totally surprised by the blind fury that came from luke. Dooku would not have any such quams against fighting luke, as luke is not his son. Dooku would fight to kill, and kill he would.

It is also worth noting Dooku is quite capable of using Force Lightning, the very same attack used against Luke in ROTJ, which he couldn't do anything against but fall to the floor and scream in pain. Even though by ROTJ the Emperor uses this power with far more efficiency, Dooku's version is still enough to bring the Jedi down.

Originally posted by Jbill311
Because Luke's fighting style is so untrained at this point, we will have to assume that they are both cut off from the force for some reason. Luke might not be able to control his usage of the force.

not relevant, leutenant.

Dooku destroys him. He's contended with or defeated opponents far superior to Luke.

no duh (hehe heres the part where i get him to rant again)

hehe heres the part where i get him to 'lie his ass off' and pretend he wuz drinkin. cuz peeple get drunk, then log onto kmc.

no, people dont. I was not drunk, but tipsy. and i logged into kmc for a lack of better things to do, such as google earth your house and target it for my airsoft squad.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
not relevant, leutenant.

Oh. I didn't read those last sentences.

So you got drunk - err, sorry - "tipsy," presumably by yourself, and decided to log on to KMC. Damn; you're cool. I wanna be just like you when I get to seventh grade!

Alright, people, none of that.

Dooku could handle Luke very easily indeed, especially if we've hit the slash-and-hack part.

Originally posted by Faunus
So you got drunk - err, sorry - "tipsy," presumably by yourself, and decided to log on to KMC.

Me, a freind, his woman, and my woman had a few drinks. A woman is something you wouldnt know about from the way they stay clear of you.

A woman is an attractive being that is absolutely necessary in the process of reproduction. Consult your local library for more information.



You're in the sixth grade? That explains alot.

Originally posted by Captain REX
Dooku could handle Luke very easily indeed, especially if we've hit the slash-and-hack part. Agreed, especially since makashi is light fighting meant to wear the opponent out on you.

Why are you so bad at this?Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
Me, a freind, his woman, and my woman had a few drinks. A woman is something you wouldnt know about from the way they stay clear of you.Ah. That explains it. So you and your friend - 'i' before 'e', except after 'c', genius - and respective girlfriends drank alcohol, then they all decided to leave. After drinking.

Spelled out, as you seem to require: Your girlfriend got drunk/tipsy with you, and decided to leave immediately afterwards. Then you decided to log onto KMC.

So basically, your lies make you look like a loser. I pity you.
Not all women are attractive, which you would know if you didn't get your information from Wikipedia and porn.
Gee, I didn't realize there was only one grade before seventh.
Like why I tool you every time you come after me? Yeah.

You need to stop lying. No excuses; just stop. You're only digging yourself deeper, and making this much, much easier for me.

Originally posted by Lt. Valerian
It is also worth noting Dooku is quite capable of using Force Lightning, the very same attack used against Luke in ROTJ, which he couldn't do anything against but fall to the floor and scream in pain. Even though by ROTJ the Emperor uses this power with far more efficiency, Dooku's version is still enough to bring the Jedi down.
You forgot to note that Luke threw his Lightsaber away, before being hit by the Force Lightning from Sidious.

In AOTC, Obi-Wan used his Lightsaber to protect him from the Force Lightning attack by Count Dooku.

So there is a difference in both of these cases. However, Luke was not skilled enough to block the Force Lightning by his bare hands like Master Yoda. Hence, he was highly vulnerable.

It's not the first time someone has claimed to have gotten drunk and logged in on KMC so as to appear somewhat cool.

We don't know for sure it's not true. And since when was getting drunk cool? Anyone who thinks drunk is cool is probably a 7th grader with fantasies regarding beer.

As to this thread... well, Luke would be completely pwned by Dooku in saber skills. Luke's saber skills were formidable, yes, but the only one to overcome Dooku in combat (although I personally think Yoda is stronger than Dooku) was Anakin. Don't compare Anakin's mastery to Luke's. It's been confirmed that Darth Vader was not really trying to kill Luke; and besides, his lack of mobility severely hindered his skills.

Though it won't be necessary. One gout of force lightning, and down goes Luke.

Originally posted by Lt. Valerian
It is also worth noting Dooku is quite capable of using Force Lightning, the very same attack used against Luke in ROTJ, which he couldn't do anything against but fall to the floor and scream in pain.
He threw his lightsaber on the ground, How was he supposed to defend himself?!

Originally posted by Faunus
Why are you so bad at this?Ah. That explains it. So you and your friend - 'i' before 'e', except after 'c', genius - and respective girlfriends drank alcohol, then they all decided to leave. After drinking.

Spelled out, as you seem to require: Your girlfriend got drunk/tipsy with you, and decided to leave immediately afterwards. Then you decided to log onto KMC. not exactly how it happened, it was a dinner double date, and after we all left and dispersed home. Stop jumping to conclusions and STFU



Why, exactly, would i tell a lie that makes me look like a loser? this is what puzzles me. You seem to want me not to be a loser so bad that you accuse me for lying on having a couple drinks on a dinner date, and then being an idiot online for it. I dont get it. Are you trying to make me out not to be a loser by accusing me of lying when i say something that seems to indicate that i am a loser? then thank you!


I was trying to err on the safeside and not insult you to the point of calling you a first grader. Maybe i even complemented you. Idont care. And you have never tooled me.
Why would i lie to appear a drunkard idiot, as i said before?

Originally posted by skywalker833
He threw his lightsaber on the ground, How was he supposed to defend himself?!

Yoda had his lightsaber ripped out of his hand by ROTS Sidious. Yoda >>>>>>>>>> Luke. Luke cannot defend against the force lightning of the most powerful Sith Lord in history with his bare hands, unlike Yoda.

Luke cannot defend against lightning, by ROTJ.

Originally posted by Sidi-Boy
Yoda had his lightsaber ripped out of his hand by ROTS Sidious. Yoda >>>>>>>>>> Luke. Luke cannot defend against the force lightning of the most powerful Sith Lord in history with his bare hands, unlike Yoda.

Luke cannot defend against lightning, by ROTJ.
Yeah, but Luke is physically stronger than Yoda, who was holding his lightsaber in one hand. Whether Luke can block Sidious's lightning or not is debatable, but nay on your logic.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
not exactly how it happened, it was a dinner double date, and after we all left and dispersed home. Stop jumping to conclusions and STFU'Course it was.
I give you Exhibit A:

Which, as you admitted, you lied about. So that you wouldn't look like a sorry ass. Which you now do.

Memory; yours sucks.

is there an ignore list?

Yes.

sweet

Knowing you, you'll probably get lost on the way to finding it. But this just goes to show, you can't outobnoxious Faunus.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Yeah, but Luke is physically stronger than Yoda, who was holding his lightsaber in one hand. Whether Luke can block Sidious's lightning or not is debatable, but nay on your logic.

And since when was physical power beyond the abilities in the force? Darth Sidious was bigger and heavier than Yoda, but Yoda still broke the saberlocks with him. How? Who knows. But my point is, sometimes mastery of the force is sufficient to give one additional strength far, far beyond that of ROTJ Luke.

The only one who was capable of blocking Sidious' lightning with a saber is Windu; this is because of Vaapad's nature and it's superconducting loop feature, but it's also my personal opinion that Sidious stopped the lightning on purpose. The novel stated that Mace says that Sidious is too powerful for him; if that's the truth, then why would Sidious, who can use pain to gain additional dark side power, stop the assault? But this belongs on another thread.

Indeed, one could argue that Dooku's lightning was far less powerful than Sidious', but Luke's experience in dealing with such an attack, in additional to his blind rage, will result in an AOTC Anakin-like situation.

Originally posted by Sidi-Boy
And since when was physical power beyond the abilities in the force? Darth Sidious was bigger and heavier than Yoda, but Yoda still broke the saberlocks with him. How? Who knows. But my point is, sometimes mastery of the force is sufficient to give one additional strength far, far beyond that of ROTJ Luke.

The only one who was capable of blocking Sidious' lightning with a saber is Windu; this is because of Vaapad's nature and it's superconducting loop feature, but it's also my personal opinion that Sidious stopped the lightning on purpose. The novel stated that Mace says that Sidious is too powerful for him; if that's the truth, then why would Sidious, who can use pain to gain additional dark side power, stop the assault? But this belongs on another thread.

Indeed, one could argue that Dooku's lightning was far less powerful than Sidious', but Luke's experience in dealing with such an attack, in additional to his blind rage, will result in an AOTC Anakin-like situation.
1. Yoda's saber was shortr, thus giving him a leverage advantage in the saber-lock. Mace being able to block the lightning with his saber, but not Yoda, shows that physical prowess does help.
2. Why does it matter if you have Vaapad, if you're not strong enough to hold the lightsaber, it will still get ripped out of your hands. Mace was able to block it due to his physical strength, and probably his Force skills did help.
3. Agreed, Luke could block Dooku's lightning but probably won't when he's in a rage.

well lets not forget that Yoda jumped at Sidious when he shot his lightsaber out of his hand.. and weve already seen that when an opponent does a sudden jump or rush forwards is when FL is most effective.

whilst Mace was standing still and holding his ground while getting shot at, but it still looked like he was struggling to hold on to his weapon.

and yeah I find it hard to believe Yodas weaker than Mace or Luke because hes smaller. The Force will temporarily enhance his strength while fighting. Thats why he doesnt need his walking stick while fighting.

Originally posted by Faunus
Knowing you, you'll probably get lost on the way to finding it. But this just goes to show, you can't outobnoxious Faunus. Found it.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
well lets not forget that Yoda jumped at Sidious when he shot his lightsaber out of his hand.. and weve already seen that when an opponent does a sudden jump or rush forwards is when FL is most effective.

whilst Mace was standing still and holding his ground while getting shot at, but it still looked like he was struggling to hold on to his weapon.

and yeah I find it hard to believe Yodas weaker than Mace or Luke because hes smaller. The Force will temporarily enhance his strength while fighting. Thats why he doesnt need his walking stick while fighting.

yoda uses ataru which gives him an agility boost, which is why he doesnt stay in saber locks for long. he has to keep jumping around to get leverage. physical strength is not yoda's forte

yeah but he can carry an X-Wing without much difficulty.. I know thats with the Force, but wnt those same Force powers enhance his strength in a fight??

Anakins sed to be the strongest and fastest jedi from the ROTS novel.. its obviously his natural force ability which enhances his strength and speed.. are u saying yoda cant do the same??

even Obi1 has Force Enhanced Strength. As far as I know its a basic Force Power

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
yeah but he can carry an X-Wing without much difficulty.. I know thats with the Force, but wnt those same Force powers enhance his strength in a fight??

Anakins sed to be the strongest and fastest jedi from the ROTS novel.. its obviously his natural force ability which enhances his strength and speed.. are u saying yoda cant do the same??

even Obi1 has Force Enhanced Strength. As far as I know its a basic Force Power

1) do you have any proof that anything you can do with the force you can do with your hands through the force?
because if thats the case then nilius can carry a star destroyer with his hands.

2) anakin is the son of the force yoda is not. anakin has more midichlorians, yoda has less. its just fact.

3) anakin's focus is physical strength hence djemso. yoda uses ataro which is more acrobatic then strong.

Originally posted by Man of Christ
1) do you have any proof that anything you can do with the force you can do with your hands through the force?
because if thats the case then nilius can carry a star destroyer with his hands.

No, it doesn't work to the same extent; however, force powers, such as Yoda's highly mastered and refined force ability, can also be used to enhance physical attributes. In Anakin's case, it's enhanced strength... in Sidious' and Yoda's case, its enhanced speed... you see, there are many possibilities to use the force to enhance physical attributes.

Originally posted by Man of Christ
2) anakin is the son of the force yoda is not. anakin has more midichlorians, yoda has less. its just fact.

Then, if raw power > refined skill, then Anakin > Star Wars universe. No one can defeat him. Don't be a fool; skill and refinement is just as important, if not more so, than raw power. Remember Obi-Wan's statement from TPM, being shocked about him having more midichlorians than Yoda. By that logic, Yoda should be an extremely powerful Jedi. If you surpass him, people will be all "WTF?!" like in Anakin's case...

Yoda had over 800 years to train his force powers and refinement, while Anakin could only stalemate Obi-Wan- a being who had only average power, and who compesated with high skill and mastery. Now try to think what would happen in a force push contest between Anakin and Yoda. Yeah, you get the picture.

Originally posted by Man of Christ
3) anakin's focus is physical strength hence djemso. yoda uses ataro which is more acrobatic then strong.

But if Sidious shot lightning at Yoda, wouldn't he- logically- attempt to enhance his strength via the force in order to make himself stronger. Please. Use your logic... Yoda was defensing, no attacking. Strength is needed for that. And he already landed by the time Sidious shot the lightning- it wasn't in mid-air...

Originally posted by Sidi-Boy
No, it doesn't work to the same extent; however, force powers, such as Yoda's highly mastered and refined force ability, can also be used to enhance physical attributes. In Anakin's case, it's enhanced strength... in Sidious' and Yoda's case, its enhanced speed... you see, there are many possibilities to use the force to enhance physical attributes.



Then, if raw power > refined skill, then Anakin > Star Wars universe. No one can defeat him. Don't be a fool; skill and refinement is just as important, if not more so, than raw power. Remember Obi-Wan's statement from TPM, being shocked about him having more midichlorians than Yoda. By that logic, Yoda should be an extremely powerful Jedi. If you surpass him, people will be all "WTF?!" like in Anakin's case...

Yoda had over 800 years to train his force powers and refinement, while Anakin could only stalemate Obi-Wan- a being who had only average power, and who compesated with high skill and mastery. Now try to think what would happen in a force push contest between Anakin and Yoda. Yeah, you get the picture.



But if Sidious shot lightning at Yoda, wouldn't he- logically- attempt to enhance his strength via the force in order to make himself stronger. Please. Use your logic... Yoda was defensing, no attacking. Strength is needed for that. And he already landed by the time Sidious shot the lightning- it wasn't in mid-air...

calm down theres no need to insult with statements like "dont be a fool" i assume you are a civilized individual.

now.

1)all i was stating was that what you can do with the force doesnt equal what you can do with force strength through my example.

2) of course yoda has had more training i was strictly speaking from a standpoint of force potetial, please stay on topic

3) yoda isnt that strong which is why he compensated with speed. in terms of physics, yoda is small therefore has less intertia which would mean he needs leverage attained through speed to compete with a juyo user like siddious

Originally posted by Man of Christ
calm down theres no need to insult with statements like "dont be a fool" i assume you are a civilized individual.

now.

1)all i was stating was that what you can do with the force doesnt equal what you can do with force strength through my example.

2) of course yoda has had more training i was strictly speaking from a standpoint of force potetial, please stay on topic

3) yoda isnt that strong which is why he compensated with speed. in terms of physics, yoda is small therefore has less intertia which would mean he needs leverage attained through speed to compete with a juyo user like siddious

I wasn't insulting you, I was merely trying to make a point ^^.

Anyway. Yes, Yoda isn't particularly strong naturally, but due to his immense power in the force, he should be able to make up for it. That's it. Lolz. xD

But anyway, do we at least agree that an enraged Luke won't be able to block a lightning blast from Dooku?

Originally posted by Sidi-Boy
I wasn't insulting you, I was merely trying to make a point ^^.

Anyway. Yes, Yoda isn't particularly strong naturally, but due to his immense power in the force, he should be able to make up for it. That's it. Lolz. xD

But anyway, do we at least agree that an enraged Luke won't be able to block a lightning blast from Dooku?

he probably wont block it but he will survive it, luke had such a higher resistance to lightening than his father

Originally posted by Man of Christ
he probably wont block it but he will survive it, luke had such a higher resistance to lightening than his father

Agreed. He will, indeed survive it, and his resistance is indeed beyond OT Vader (but Anakin as of AOTC? No way. Anakin's physical conditioning and training is faaaar beyond Luke), but he will be knocked out due to the force of the lightning, like Anakin.

But, regardless, Dooku still smashes him to pieces in both Force and Sabers. Smashes him to pieces WITH EASE. Luke, by his first incarnations, is not at all an impressive fighter.

Originally posted by Sidi-Boy
Agreed. He will, indeed survive it, and his resistance is indeed beyond OT Vader (but Anakin as of AOTC? No way. Anakin's physical conditioning and training is faaaar beyond Luke), but he will be knocked out due to the force of the lightning, like Anakin.

But, regardless, Dooku still smashes him to pieces in both Force and Sabers. Smashes him to pieces WITH EASE. Luke, by his first incarnations, is not at all an impressive fighter.

how much of this is due in your opinion to the lack of gci and coreography back then?

Originally posted by Man of Christ
how much of this is due in your opinion to the lack of gci and coreography back then?

The majority of it. Yes, I'll admit my opinions are often pro-PT because the OT fights were weaker, slower, and not choreographed well- but Dooku is simply a FAAAAAR more impressive fighter than Luke- someone who could've had his ass handed to him, by his own admission, by his cripple of a father. Luke had 3 years of training, little mastery of ANY lightsaber form... while Dooku was a Jedi for well over 50 years, with extreme experience, power, and knowledge. Yeah, Dooku is leagues above him.

Oops, typo xD I meant to say that my opinion is mostly not based on CGI and such.

Also, by the way, according to Lucas, fights in the OT were weaker because Vader is a cripple, Obi-Wan's an old man, and Luke's a kid. He didn't say it was because the speciale effects were inferior.

Originally posted by Sidi-Boy
Oops, typo xD I meant to say that my opinion is mostly not based on CGI and such.

Also, by the way, according to Lucas, fights in the OT were weaker because Vader is a cripple, Obi-Wan's an old man, and Luke's a kid. He didn't say it was because the speciale effects were inferior.

lol if that is true then george lucas is pathetically contradicting himself and introducing another plot hole.

becuase grevous was even more crippled than vader and they both pretty much had the same surgery (of course grevous had many more parts replaced)

but grevous had 100X the mobility

dooku was an old man but he was extremely mobile


the padawan that got killed infront of bail organa was a kid was a kid but he was very mobile

so i think its back to cgi and coreography

Since its ROTJ Luke vs. (I'm assuming ROTS) Dooku, I'll say that Dooku wins.
Now if it were Legacy of the Force era Luke, Dooku would be so boned.