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Anti-Monitor (the one Spectre fought at the dawn of time)
Extant (Worlogog)
Parallax (Zero Hour)
Mxy
Lucifer
Krona (Entropy)
Spectre (Hal Jordan)
Sise-Neg (at the peak of his powers)
Entropy
Living Tribunal
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Eternity (Multiverse)
Wanda (HoM)
Mad Jim Jaspers

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Anti-Monitor (the one Spectre fought at the dawn of time)
Extant (Worlogog)
Parallax (Zero Hour)
Mxy
Lucifer
Krona (Entropy)
Spectre (Hal Jordan)
Sise-Neg (at the peak of his powers)
Entropy
Living Tribunal
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Eternity (Multiverse)
Wanda (HoM)
Mad Jim Jaspers

Too many arguments by adding the two seperate cosmics in one thread

Lucifer-Beyond Omniversal
Spectre-Beyond Omniversal
Mxy of New Earth-Omniversal (5th is greater than 4th and 3rd and so on)
Entropy-It's entropy
Krona-Agent of Entropy
Any other Mxy- Multiversal or Universal Depending on story
Parallax- Beyond Multiversal
Extant-Multiversal

How can something be beyond omniversal? I mean Lucifer's prime feat, where he used Michael's power were Multiversal.

Beyonder omniversal?

The omniverse is a collection of everything that was, is, will be and could have been?

Originally posted by Astner
How can something be beyond omniversal? I mean Lucifer's prime feat, where he used Michael's power were Multiversal.
I thought the feat was in that he took the power of creation to the face and didn't even get singed. It was also lucy's will that fashioned all of creation in the first place. Lucy is nothing but the avatar of God's own will. He's a concept that has always existed as God Has. Beyond omniversal. Above the omniverse. anyone who has the power to totally wipe out the omniverse or sits in rule over it is above the omniverse.

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Anti-Monitor (the one Spectre fought at the dawn of time)
Extant (Worlogog)
Parallax (Zero Hour)
Mxy
Lucifer
Krona (Entropy)
Spectre (Hal Jordan)
Sise-Neg (at the peak of his powers)
Entropy
Living Tribunal
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Eternity (Multiverse)
Wanda (HoM)
Mad Jim Jaspers
DC:

Lucifer
Anti-Monitor
Mxy
Spectre (Hal)
Extant /w/ Worlogog
Krona
Parallax

----

Marvel:

LT
Wanda
IG
MJJ
Entropy
Eternity
Sis-Neg

----

All imo, of course.

Originally posted by fangirl101
I thought the feat was in that he took the power of creation to the face and didn't even get singed. It was also lucy's will that fashioned all of creation in the first place. Lucy is nothing but the avatar of God's own will. He's a concept that has always existed as God Has. Beyond omniversal. Above the omniverse. anyone who has the power to totally wipe out the omniverse or sits in rule over it is above the omniverse.
He took the power of Michael's death (creation.) And formed a universe, which later became a multiverse. That's the feat in a nutshell.
And seeing how Lucifer is a subject to Denstiny, I would say he's Omniversal. YHWH however would be beyond. Unless if you by beyond mean the actual world beyond the fictional one.

By the way G007, didn't Jaspers survive Wanda's Chaos Wave, or rather, he was beyond what returned everything back to normal?

Originally posted by Astner
He took the power of Michael's death (creation.) And formed a universe, which later became a multiverse. That's the feat in a nutshell.
And seeing how Lucifer is a subject to Denstiny, I would say he's Omniversal. YHWH however would be beyond. Unless if you by beyond mean the actual world beyond the fictional one.

By the way G007, didn't Jaspers survive Wanda's Chaos Wave, or rather, he was beyond what returned everything back to normal?

what ever lucifer fashioned, it was still the creation blast. and what ever it became, it still had the power of the multiverse in it, as it BECAME that. marvel and DC both allude that thier universes contain the power of multiverses within them at creation and they spread out. Beyond omniversal meaning that someone is more powerful thant he omniverse in which they reside.

Originally posted by fangirl101
what ever lucifer fashioned, it was still the creation blast. and what ever it became, it still had the power of the multiverse in it, as it BECAME that. marvel and DC both allude that thier universes contain the power of multiverses within them at creation and they spread out. Beyond omniversal meaning that someone is more powerful thant he omniverse in which they reside.
So you'd place Destiny beyond Omniversal aswell?

Originally posted by Astner
By the way G007, didn't Jaspers survive Wanda's Chaos Wave, or rather, he was beyond what returned everything back to normal? The chaos wave is what brought MJJ back in the first place.

Originally posted by Astner
So you'd place Destiny beyond Omniversal aswell?

Of coure. After the omniverse is destroyed, Destiny will still be there. To write another omniverse into existance. To write new concepts and beings into existance.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Of coure. After the omniverse is destroyed, Destiny will still be there. To write another omniverse into existance. To write new concepts and beings into existance. When existance is all gone, Death claims Destiny. His concept is killed, basically.

And he doesn't write the Book, btw.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Of coure. After the omniverse is destroyed, Destiny will still be there. To write another omniverse into existance. To write new concepts and beings into existance.

He's the bookKEEPER

Originally posted by Galan007
When existance is all gone, Death claims Destiny.

And he doesn't write the Book, btw.
Excuse me. I thought Destiny was a girl. Who carried a book. At least in the Wonder Woman books, the fates are, and they work for Destiny. When existance is all gone, then there would be no death either. There would be nothing. And that would be the doing of Destiny.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Of coure. After the omniverse is destroyed, Destiny will still be there. To write another omniverse into existance. To write new concepts and beings into existance.
Funny thing actually, because you're putting him at YHWH's level.
The only one that could create a new Omniverse, if destroyed would be YHWH. And with that Omniverse would come a new Destiny.
Anyhow, I see Lucifer and Michael as part of YHWH's creation (the omniverse), which he's refering him to when he speaks to Spectre. He eats Michael because he's a part of his creation, which he can do whatever he wants with.
Besides, Lucifer and Michael have never been outside creation. YHWH has just visited them some times Within creation.

Originally posted by Astner
Funny thing actually, because you're putting him at YHWH's level.
The only one that could create a new Omniverse, if destroyed would be YHWH. And with that Omniverse would come a new Destiny.
Anyhow, I see Lucifer and Michael as part of YHWH's creation (the omniverse), which he's refering him to when he speaks to Spectre. He eats Michael because he's a part of his creation, which he can do whatever he wants with.
Besides, Lucifer and Michael have never been outside creation. YHWH has just visited them some times Within creation.

Hmm. didn't lucifer and god have a nice long talk outside of creation? where they looked at all that god had created?

Originally posted by fangirl101
Hmm. didn't lucifer and god have a nice long talk outside of creation? where they looked at all that god had created?
God left the place, he left creation. They were in creation, God ditched it.
Unless you're suggesting that he left beyond-creation.

I liked Presence leaving though, Mary Poppins umberella. Cheesy as hell.

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Anti-Monitor (the one Spectre fought at the dawn of time)
Extant (Worlogog)
Parallax (Zero Hour)
Mxy
Lucifer
Krona (Entropy)
Spectre (Hal Jordan)
Sise-Neg (at the peak of his powers)
Entropy
Living Tribunal
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Eternity (Multiverse)
Wanda (HoM)
Mad Jim Jaspers I am shocked Michael didnt make your list.

Originally posted by Astner
God left the place, he left creation. They were in creation, God ditched it.
As long as God has a will and power,then lucifer and mike are part of him. God eating Mike was an oxy as h was realy eating his own power. And God and Lucifer did have a conversation outside of the omniverse. outside o reality.

Originally posted by fangirl101
As long as God has a will and power,then lucifer and mike are part of him. God eating Mike was an oxy as h was realy eating his own power. And God and Lucifer did have a conversation outside of the omniverse. outside o reality.
So he left outside creation and went where? The conversation was held in creation.

Originally posted by Astner
So he left outside creation and went where? The conversation was held in creation.
a void place. a beyond wrealm. places like these have been used in comics for years. a blank page. What ever you want to call it.

Originally posted by fangirl101
a void place. a beyond wrealm. places like these have been used in comics for years. a blank page. What ever you want to call it.
There is no evidence suporting this. He said he'd leave creation. Not the beyond creation.

Which version of Krona, didn't he owned the Worlog on panel during a crossover?

Originally posted by Bentley

Which version of Krona,
didn't he owned the Worlog on panel during a crossover?
In that cross-over Marvel and DC share the same Multiverse.

So that cross-over is null and void concerning true continuity.

And that's just the beginning of the nonsensical crap that took place within the cross-over.

Originally posted by Astner
There is no evidence suporting this. He said he'd leave creation. Not the beyond creation. leaving creation is leaving what? everything right? That is what I thought.

Originally posted by Mr Master
In that cross-over Marvel and DC share the same Multiverse.

So that cross-over is null and void concerning true continuity.

So then why were eternity and Kismet BOTH shown. If there was the same multiverse, then they would not both have been shown. As the story stands, the multiverses didnt' get combined until Krona bound them. That is the crux of the whole story.

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Anti-Monitor (the one Spectre fought at the dawn of time)
Extant (Worlogog)
Parallax (Zero Hour)
Mxy
Lucifer
Krona (Entropy)
Spectre (Hal Jordan)
Sise-Neg (at the peak of his powers)
Entropy
Living Tribunal
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Eternity (Multiverse)
Wanda (HoM)
Mad Jim Jaspers

Marvel:

Living Tribunal
Infinity Gauntlet
Wanda
Mad Jim Jaspers
Sise-Neg
Entropy/Eternity

Originally posted by fangirl101
leaving creation is leaving what? everything right? That is what I thought.
I thought that the creation was ... Well the omniverse. Am I mistaken?

Originally posted by Astner
I thought that the creation was ... Well the omniverse. Am I mistaken?

They were standing OUTSIDE of the creation and Looking at it. How coul they be standing inside and looking at it. Didn't warlock also hide in aplace beyond ethe omnvierse, which is why thanos didn't absorb him?

Originally posted by fangirl101
They were standing OUTSIDE of the creation and Looking at it. How coul they be standing inside and looking at it.
Wherever they were YHWH left creation. Nothing else was stated on panel.


No, Thanos absorbed a Multiverse, that's why Adam survived. Not the Omniverse!

Originally posted by Astner
Wherever they were YHWH left creation. Nothing else was stated on panel.


No, Thanos absorbed a Multiverse, that's why Adam survived. Not the Omniverse! Thanos absorbed a multiverse? Um, No. He destroyed everything. He even said that he would absorb it all lest there be any other who might challenge him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am shocked Michael didnt make your list.

Why would he ?

Originally posted by fangirl101
Thanos absorbed a multiverse? Um, No. He destroyed everything. He even said that he would absorb it all lest there be any other who might challenge him.
Azeala's realm couldn't be outside the Omniverse. The Omniverse is the sum of all realities, there can't be a reality beyond all realities. That would contradict the "all."

Originally posted by fangirl101

So then why were eternity and Kismet BOTH shown. If there was the same multiverse, then they would not both have been shown. As the story stands, the multiverses didnt' get combined until Krona bound them. That is the crux of the whole story.
ka-dur

Anyone is free to check this page where I convincingly proved,
JLA/Avengers cross-over took place withIN a Multiverse both DC and Marvel share.

Correct, a non-existent Multiverse.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=484489&pagenumber=8#post10589610

Please, be my guest.

Originally posted by fangirl101

Lucifer-Beyond Omniversal

Spectre-Beyond Omniversal

Mxy of New Earth-Omniversal (5th is greater than 4th and 3rd and so on)

Originally posted by Astner
Azeala's realm couldn't be outside the Omniverse. The Omniverse is the sum of all realities, there can't be a reality beyond all realities. That would contradict the "all."

Comic Omniverse is different than the real meaning of omniverse. your using the real meaning of omniverse. where all comic and fiction realities are one. comic omniverses simple mean all universes,multiverses, and mega verses.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Comic Omniverse is different than the real meaning of omniverse. your using the real meaning of omniverse. where all comic and fiction realities are one. comic omniverses simple mean all universes,multiverses, and mega verses.
No, you're misunderstanding me. Atzela's realm weren't located outside the Marvel Omniverse.

Originally posted by Astner

Azeala's realm couldn't be outside the Omniverse. The Omniverse is the sum of all realities, there can't be a reality beyond all realities. That would contradict the "all."
You're wasting your time.

It's like trying to teach a gerbil the alphabet, simply ain't gonna work.

Originally posted by Mr Master
ka-dur

Anyone is free to check this page where I convincingly proved,
JLA/Avengers cross-over took place withIN a Multiverse both DC and Marvel share.

Correct, a non-existent Multiverse.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=484489&pagenumber=8#post10589610

Please, be my guest.




Your insults are rediculous.

In the JLA story, There are two multiversal entities bound by multiversal items. They are shown bound. Thus there cannot be one multiverse in the beggining of the story as you suggest, that would contradict the ending of the story, which has the spectre seperating the two realities.

And you are more than welcome to refute my statements about the beings and the titles I gave them. But the insulting needs to stop.

Originally posted by Mr Master You're wasting your time.

It's like trying to teach a gerbil the alphabet, simply ain't gonna work.
I'm begining to notice it.

Did you read the recent PM I sent, btw? I know it was long, but hopefully an enjoying read. I would be greatful for thoughts regarding it, as you're probably the most experienced one when it comes to raising a fanbase with Cosmology.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Your insults are rediculous.

In the JLA story, There are two multiversal entities bound by multiversal items. They are shown bound. Thus there cannot be one multiverse in the beggining of the story as you suggest, that would contradict the ending of the story, which has the spectre seperating the two realities.

And you are more than welcome to refute my statements about the beings and the titles I gave them. But the insulting needs to stop.
Originally posted by Mr Master

durznuts

Anyone is free to check this page where I convincingly proved,
JLA/Avengers cross-over took place withIN a Multiverse both DC and Marvel share.

Correct, a non-existent Multiverse.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=484489&pagenumber=8#post10589610

Please, be my guest.

Originally posted by Bentley
Which version of Krona, didn't he owned the Worlog on panel during a crossover? No.

Originally posted by Astner
I'm begining to notice it.

Did you read the recent PM I sent, btw? I know it was long, but hopefully an enjoying read. I would be greatful for thoughts regarding it, as you're probably the most experienced one when it comes to raising a fanbase with Cosmology.
I haven't read it yet, but I'm definitely going to.

I just been running around here today, it being Friday and all.

Originally posted by Mr Master
I haven't read it yet, but I'm definitely going to.

I just been running around here today, it being Friday and all.
Quite lean back too right now. Just messing around on the boards, listening to some music, a chat over msn in-between, not a care in the world.

No real knowlegde of the DC's

Marvel:
Living Tribunal
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Wanda (HoM)
Mad Jim Jaspers
Entropy
Eternity (multiverse)
Sis-Neg

LT

Originally posted by Utrigita
No real knowlegde of the DC's

Marvel:
Living Tribunal
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Wanda (HoM)
Mad Jim Jaspers
Entropy
Eternity (multiverse)
Sis-Neg
It's Sise-Neg at the hight of his power,
he became God!

He re-created the entire Marvel Universe from scratch.
(definitely above Eternity/Infinity)

Entropy and Eternity are equals.

Eternity dies, so Entropy can become Eternity again. (a repetitive cycle)
(but Eternity is not into suicide so he has to be killed: hence, Genis' involvement)

Originally posted by guy222
LT
I like your list

Thank u friend

I"ll give a thorough list in a bit

Reading a lot of Lucifer recently

Sis didn't seem too confident against Shuma, iirc.

Strongest to weakest:

Living Tribunal
Lucifer
Mxy
Spectre (Hal Jordan)
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Mad Jim Jaspers
Anti-Monitor (the one Spectre fought at the dawn of time)
Wanda (HOM)
Parallax (Zero Hour)
Eternity (Multiverse)
Extant (Worlogog)
Krona (Entropy)
Sise-Neg (at the peak of his powers)
Entropy

Originally posted by guy222
Thank u friend

I"ll give a thorough list in a bit

Reading a lot of Lucifer recently How is that series guy?

Real good

The last issue says alot

Originally posted by Galan007
Sis didn't seem too confident against Shuma, iirc. But Shuma isn't even multiversal or some shit like that.

Could you get any more pis?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Strongest to weakest:

Living Tribunal
Lucifer
Mxy
Spectre (Hal Jordan)
Warlock w/Infinity Gauntlet
Mad Jim Jaspers
Anti-Monitor (the one Spectre fought at the dawn of time)
Wanda (HOM)
Parallax (Zero Hour)
Eternity (Multiverse)
Extant (Worlogog)
Krona (Entropy)
Sise-Neg (at the peak of his powers)
Entropy

Not a bad list.

Originally posted by Galan007
Sis didn't seem too confident against Shuma, iirc.

Didn't he banish him?

Originally posted by Mr Master
It's Sise-Neg at the hight of his power,
he became God!

He re-created the entire Marvel Universe from scratch.
(definitely above Eternity/Infinity)

Entropy and Eternity are equals.

Eternity dies, so Entropy can become Eternity again. (a repetitive cycle)
(but Eternity is not into suicide so he has to be killed: hence, Genis' involvement)

Without a doubt but that was in 1973 a lot have changed since then concerning Eternity and Entropy, also the recreation of the marvel universe have been illustrated a four times now ore what shall we say constantly retconned.

And I would say that Entropy was above multieternity since basically Entropy along with Genis killed him.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Without a doubt but that was in 1973 a lot have changed since then concerning Eternity and Entropy, also the recreation of the marvel universe have been illustrated a four times now ore what shall we say constantly retconned.

And I would say that Entropy was above multieternity since basically Entropy along with Genis killed him.

Genis and Entropy killed 616 Eternity, then Genis 'killed' Entropy and he became 616 Eternity.

There was never anything to suggest they altered the entire Multiverse.

Originally posted by Utrigita

Without a doubt
but that was in 1973 a lot have changed since then concerning Eternity and Entropy
Entropy didn't exist back then, Eternity recycled himself I supposed back then.

Eternity was the embodiment of the Universe until Infinity was introduced,
now they collectively embody all there is in the prime Multiverse.

Originally posted by Utrigita

also the recreation of the marvel universe have been illustrated a four times now ore what shall we say constantly retconned.
It hasn't been retconned,
just that four different times all reality has been re-created from a void.

Infinity Being - Original Big Bang
Sise-Neg - 72'
Genis/Entropy - 02'
Thanos/THOTI - 03'
Aline Entity - 06'

Originally posted by Utrigita

And I would say that Entropy was above multieternity
since basically Entropy along with Genis killed him.
Yea but Eternity allowed himself to be killed,
in fact, Genis said right before he crushed Eternity,
Eternity said, "at last.

Originally posted by Mindset

Genis and Entropy killed 616 Eternity,
then Genis 'killed' Entropy and he became 616 Eternity.

There was never anything to suggest they altered the entire Multiverse.
Actually good friend, they did in fact re-create not only the Prime Multiverse,
but all of Marvel as a consequence.

I have solid proof with scans if you're interested.

But this should be enough:

(excerpt from Captain Marvel #6)

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/1967/cm1ls8.th.jpg

"Entropy is the Son of,

Eternity, the Cosmic Being whose Essence Encompasses the ENTIRETY of the MULTIVERSE ...

Entropy has enlisted Captain Marvel in a Quest to Destroy His Father,

... Eternity and End All Creation"

...................................................................................

All Creation was ended as a consequence because the Prime Multiverse,
just Reality 616 in fact, is the foundation of the Omniverse.

This is why,
if the Prime Reality dies, (616 Universe or the Prime Multiverse)
all other Realities die too.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Entropy didn't exist back then, Eternity recycled himself I supposed back then.

Eternity was the embodiment of the Universe until Infinity was introduced,
now they collectively embody all there is in the prime Multiverse.


It hasn't been retconned,
just that four different times all reality has been re-created from a void.

Infinity Being - Original Big Bang
Sise-Neg - 72'
Genis/Entropy - 02'
Thanos/THOTI - 03'
Aline Entity - 06'


Yea but Eternity allowed himself to be killed,
in fact, Genis said right before he crushed Eternity,
Eternity said, "at last.

Yes they do however that is where I see the difference, Genesis only destroyed a single universe in a time where the ancient at a time could battle eternity, where Entropy succeed in destroying the 616 which contained the power of the Multiverse.

My bad thought it was the times that marvel had changed it own origin.

Likely however if the Entropy was only a part of a larger recycling process, then what stopped Eternity from doing the exact same thing with Genesis. If Eternity both times allowed/wanted himself to be destroyed then I cannot see why either Genesis ore Entropy should be placed above Multiversal Eternity.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Could you get any more pis? Only after I drink coffee. A bunch of coffee. excellent

why do people over rate sis-neg? the guy went back in time and absorbed all the magic in the universe, hes only a sourceror.
odin could go back in time and do the same...

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
why do people over rate sis-neg? the guy went back in time and absorbed all the magic in the universe, hes only a sourceror.
odin could go back in time and do the same...

WHy do people underrate Sise-Neg? You sise-neg haters are irritating.