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I know there have been several battles featuring these two characters but they have all decended into fanboy gibberish with the likes of "immortality" and "returning from Hades" have seemed to be be teh deciding factors. Therefore, I would like to put forward a few rules.

In this battle, a win counts as a KO. Yes Kain may be immortal, regardless of his destiny or his powers, but if he is forced to retreat via batform, this does count as a KO.
Same with Kratos, he may have proven that he can cheat death by returning from Hades, but he got the poop kicked out of him to send him there, counting as a KO.

Also, some favour Kain as an all out winner by using the Spirit Reaver at the end of Defiance. This is downright cheap. It is impossible to clarify just how powerful the Spirit Reaver is, so I will not include it this in this battle. Kain possesses all his powers at the beginning of Defiance, along with the abilities he accquired throughout it.
Also, Kratos will not have his God Form, since he lost this ability at the beginning of GOW2. He will possess all the powers/magic/weapons he acquired throughtout GOW2 though.

As you can see, i want this battle to come down to physical skill and strength, experience, cunning and ability, the way it should be settled!

Now that I have clarfied these points, happy debating!

So whats imporant in this battle for me is ime guessing Kain cannot use his extremely cheap powers? such as Blood shower, Incapacitate, Stun, Spirit death/wrack? does he get his repel shield yes or no?

Second thing i would like to make clear is what weapons are they using? i mean technically i think Kratos if he is holding the blade of Olympus he regains his godlike power, does Kain get the soul reaver? or the blood reaver? it doesnt have to be the purified spirit Kain to hold the reaver in its soul form, for example the form he has in BO an BO2

Originally posted by Burning thought
So whats imporant in this battle for me is ime guessing Kain cannot use his extremely cheap powers? such as Blood shower, Incapacitate, Stun, Spirit death/wrack? does he get his repel shield yes or no?

Second thing i would like to make clear is what weapons are they using? i mean technically i think Kratos if he is holding the blade of Olympus he regains his godlike power, does Kain get the soul reaver? or the blood reaver? it doesnt have to be the purified spirit Kain to hold the reaver in its soul form, for example the form he has in BO an BO2

No No, Kain is indeed able to use all of his aformentioned abilities, its just the Spirit Reaver thats not permitted, but all other Reaver incarnations are.

But Kratos doesnt regain his God abilities when he uses the Blade of Olympus against Zeus at the end of GOW2. He isnt able to grow to God size and the likes of Poseidons Rage etc are still lost to him. The Blade of Olympus can still be used, but the likes of "This Blade pwned Zeus" isnt a viable arguement. Im sure you understand me clearly

well ofc that would be A>B logic but when Kratos holds the blade, although he cannot grow to God size, he gains the strength and power through the blade, thats why when Kratos gets knocked down by the Colossus of rhodes at the end of the battle, he is mortal because all his power is in the blade and he has to reclaim the blade to regain it.

But if Kain is allowed all his abilities then Kain wins with the greatest ease

Originally posted by Burning thought
well ofc that would be A>B logic but when Kratos holds the blade, although he cannot grow to God size, he gains the strength and power through the blade, thats why when Kratos gets knocked down by the Colossus of rhodes at the end of the battle, he is mortal because all his power is in the blade and he has to reclaim the blade to regain it.

But if Kain is allowed all his abilities then Kain wins with the greatest ease

Well i wasnt denying that Kratos lost his powers to the blade at the beginning of GOW2 but I think that his new found Titan powers combined with the Blade of Olympus allowed him to triumph over Zeus.

Anyway, I would agree that Kain wins this battle but I disagree on easily. Kratos is highly durable, he could withstand an absolute thrashing from Kain and his Reaver, and Kain's TK would do little more than fuel his anger. Kinetic Shackles would be Kains preferred move, immobilising Kratos while he slashes him up good. However, Kratos does possess powerful weapons himself with a far greater reach than that of the Reaver. I wouldnt be surprised if Kratos got the upperhand on Kain in pure hand to hand combat.
But it Kain takes a beating, he will then resort to his most powerful Dark Gifts, those being soul rip and immolate, destroying Kratos on the spot. I believe Kain would cherish in melee combat with a foe as powerful as Kratos initially, only utilising his lethally powerful techniques if things turned in Kratos favour. There is a hint of a chivalarous side in Kain.
Kratos could use his more powerful abilities (Rage of the Titans, Crono's Rage) in an attempt to defeat Kain quickly, but Kain's speed and his Mist ability would minimalise the damage caused.

It would be a tough fight, but Kain would triumph in the end.

Originally posted by Papa Borzarou
Well i wasnt denying that Kratos lost his powers to the blade at the beginning of GOW2 but I think that his new found Titan powers combined with the Blade of Olympus allowed him to triumph over Zeus.

Anyway, I would agree that Kain wins this battle but I disagree on easily. Kratos is highly durable, he could withstand an absolute thrashing from Kain and his Reaver, and Kain's TK would do little more than fuel his anger. Kinetic Shackles would be Kains preferred move, immobilising Kratos while he slashes him up good. However, Kratos does possess powerful weapons himself with a far greater reach than that of the Reaver. I wouldnt be surprised if Kratos got the upperhand on Kain in pure hand to hand combat.
But it Kain takes a beating, he will then resort to his most powerful Dark Gifts, those being soul rip and immolate, destroying Kratos on the spot. I believe Kain would cherish in melee combat with a foe as powerful as Kratos initially, only utilising his lethally powerful techniques if things turned in Kratos favour. There is a hint of a chivalarous side in Kain.
Kratos could use his more powerful abilities (Rage of the Titans, Crono's Rage) in an attempt to defeat Kain quickly, but Kain's speed and his Mist ability would minimalise the damage caused.

It would be a tough fight, but Kain would triumph in the end.


Indeed but the tough part would only be if Kain as he probably would doesnt just use Soul rip,wrack.blood shower, incapaicate etc etc his super moves

I think if this was just a sword fight for Kain but give Kratos everything, then this could be an interesting fight, because Kains speed, mist abilities etc allow him to dodge and escape most weapons/projectiles as would his speed, I agree Kratos reach is long but Kain is just too fast, his jump skill would allow him to clear the gap in no time and his mist will allow him to do it without Kratos being able to harm Kain AND the likeliness he wont be able to even find Kain so Kain will be able to surprise Kratos from the mist with a reaver slash. I think Kratos tho will take a good few reaver slashes to kill, the blast of the blade as it hits can rip a normal man into a pieces with one strike but Kratos is no normal man. in melee his strength surpasses Kain so Kain will have to use a combination of his speed and mist to move around Kratos and attacking his exposed points, the guy wouldnt be able ot defend himself so much against Kains assault. And as you said before, TK shackles would do him a lot of good, one of them and kratos is almost incapaciated, not able to move so Kain puts the sword into him and takes his soul.

Hmm, yes i would agree Kain is faster but Kratos is no slouch himself, his dodging ability is impressive, being able to barrel roll and backlfip great distances out of harms way. Unless incapacitated by Kinetic shackles, Kratos could easily roll out of the way of Kains attacks. Yes Kain can use his jump ability, but in both BO2 and Defiance, this technique has always taken a short time to be used, showing that Kain has to focus his energies into his legs briefly before he can jump long distances, id say Kratos would be fast enough to halt this process if he was close enough. If Kratos was to knock Kain into the air with Olympic Ascension, i doubt there would be much Kain could do to defend agaisnt the airbourne onslaught.
Kratos physical strength would be useless in this battle, as if he ever managed to grab the ancient, I think Kain would do to Kratos as he did to Raziel in the SR2 opening
Kain still wins but i still dont think he would win easily on a swordfight, Kratos has proven himself to be a quality melee combat fighter

Problem is Kain could escape any of Kratos' attacks through mist forming instantly fast in and out of the attacks Kratos uses, and he could with ease move to a diffrrent location and ime not sure this would be fair unless this is God Kratos only the small one without the size ofc, then he could survive a few slashes of the reaver

you guys crazzy?? kratos takes this, easily. he has golden fleece, which he uses to repel ANY attack. also. id say kratos is more aggressive, has rage of the titans and can use his magic to kill kain easily. Head of euryale will turn him to stone, he has long range with typhons bane. and has automatic damage with cronos' rage. and his strenght is craaaazy, he lifted atlas' hand ( a ver big 4 armed titan ) which the wieght he probably put on kratos was MASSIVE. and ( i dont know if this is legal ) kratos has the power to control time( mother gaia even said so ). so, even without the time control, kratos pretty much dominates this fight.

Originally posted by Papa Borzarou
I know there have been several battles featuring these two characters but they have all decended into fanboy gibberish with the likes of "immortality" and "returning from Hades" have seemed to be be teh deciding factors. Therefore, I would like to put forward a few rules.

In this battle, a win counts as a KO. Yes Kain may be immortal, regardless of his destiny or his powers, but if he is forced to retreat via batform, this does count as a KO.
Same with Kratos, he may have proven that he can cheat death by returning from Hades, but he got the poop kicked out of him to send him there, counting as a KO.

Also, some favour Kain as an all out winner by using the Spirit Reaver at the end of Defiance. This is downright cheap. It is impossible to clarify just how powerful the Spirit Reaver is, so I will not include it this in this battle. Kain possesses all his powers at the beginning of Defiance, along with the abilities he accquired throughout it.
Also, Kratos will not have his God Form, since he lost this ability at the beginning of GOW2. He will possess all the powers/magic/weapons he acquired throughtout GOW2 though.

As you can see, i want this battle to come down to physical skill and strength, experience, cunning and ability, the way it should be settled!

Now that I have clarfied these points, happy debating!

Physically, Kratos wins hands down.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
you guys crazzy?? kratos takes this, easily. he has golden fleece, which he uses to repel ANY attack. also. id say kratos is more aggressive, has rage of the titans and can use his magic to kill kain easily. Head of euryale will turn him to stone, he has long range with typhons bane. and has automatic damage with cronos' rage. and his strenght is craaaazy, he lifted atlas' hand ( a ver big 4 armed titan ) which the wieght he probably put on kratos was MASSIVE. and ( i dont know if this is legal ) kratos has the power to control time( mother gaia even said so ). so, even without the time control, kratos pretty much dominates this fight.

Kratos has no chance, strength is his only bonus, apart from that, Kain dominates every other area

everyone can spam a move list but Kain can easily either escape everything Kratos can do, his powers are too slow and his attacks although good reach in melee, Kain doesnt have to fight melee and Kratos only real long range moves are slow or weak, Kain dismantles Kratos with likely any power at his disposal.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Kratos has no chance, strength is his only bonus, apart from that, Kain dominates every other area

everyone can spam a move list but Kain can easily either escape everything Kratos can do, his powers are too slow and his attacks although good reach in melee, Kain doesnt have to fight melee and Kratos only real long range moves are slow or weak, Kain dismantles Kratos with likely any power at his disposal.

So kain can control time also? can he stop time? i didnt think so. and i seriously doubt he can get a hit on kratos because he has the golden fleece. kratos wins this fight hands down.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
So kain can control time also? can he stop time? i didnt think so. Actually...He can control time. haermm

Not likie it matters though, whatwith Kratos having the power of the Sisters of Fate.

No Kain can't control time..

He can slow it, not totally control it.

Though Kratos could just warp to when Kain had no vampire powers and kill him.

He can slow only nearby opponents, and thats after his reaver has enough blood/souls

I know.

But he can control time to an extent.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
So kain can control time also? can he stop time? i didnt think so. and i seriously doubt he can get a hit on kratos because he has the golden fleece. kratos wins this fight hands down.

Sure he can control time and when has kratos stopped time, i dont remember that one?

golden fleece? what nonsense, the golden fleece is like an armlet shield in GOW that blocks projectiles, its not an impssible unstoppable forcefield....

Kain could elimnate Kratos with one blood gout or shower

Only Kratos could just teleport to when Kain was human and pwn him.

no he couldnt, Kratos does not have the threads of fate, the knowledge of Kains timeline, Kain would not even have the correct objects Kratos needs, i.e the thread of Kains timeline to be albe to travel there.

that would be like me saying Kain could just use the chronoplast to go back to when Kratos was a spartan child

When he took the Titan's back to the present in GOW2, he did not need the Loom.

A rule in vs. matches is each character gets knowledge of the opponent.

There were unkown implications behind that, nothing states Kratos can teleport through time at will afaik, hell how do you know he didnt just already set the loom chamber to send them to the present, timelines are still completly diffrent in LOK, if Kratos tries to enter Kains timeline, the immutable timeline of LOK will delete kratos thus Kain is the winner anyway.

having knowledge of the opponent would not give him knowledge of an opponents entire timeline and technically this would break the thread because it would not be Kratos vs the Kain specified in the rules.

Originally posted by Burning thought
There were unkown implications behind that, nothing states Kratos can teleport through time at will afaik, hell how do you know he didnt just already set the loom chamber to send them to the present, timelines are still completly diffrent in LOK, if Kratos tries to enter Kains timeline, the immutable timeline of LOK will delete kratos thus Kain is the winner anyway.

having knowledge of the opponent would not give him knowledge of an opponents entire timeline and technically this would break the thread because it would not be Kratos vs the Kain specified in the rules. Nothing states it, it just happened.

How in the FVCK could Kratos have gone back to the Loom Chamber? ONE Titan is bigger than the whole place, let alone the whole race.

PROVE Kratos used the Loom Chamber.

Fights take place in a neutral ground where all powers will work, the LOK immutable timeline has no effect on this thread.

It would give him knowledge of wqhere Kain came from and how old he is.

anjd it would by extension kill the Kain Kratos is fighting, thus makiing Kratos winner.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Actually...He can control time. haermm

Not likie it matters though, whatwith Kratos having the power of the Sisters of Fate.

So he can barely control time.... so kratos doesn win. and yes, he could just warp to when kain had no good powers and kill him.

Originally posted by Burning thought
There were unkown implications behind that, nothing states Kratos can teleport through time at will afaik, hell how do you know he didnt just already set the loom chamber to send them to the present, timelines are still completly diffrent in LOK, if Kratos tries to enter Kains timeline, the immutable timeline of LOK will delete kratos thus Kain is the winner anyway.

having knowledge of the opponent would not give him knowledge of an opponents entire timeline and technically this would break the thread because it would not be Kratos vs the Kain specified in the rules.

Half the stuff your saying makes no sense...... and the only reason your going for kain is because you WAAAAYYYY to biased. im mean, look at your picture you have in your replies. ive played both games, so i would know who would win. and dark jaxx you make a very solid statement

Why would you make this battle? Why.......

All you're gonna get is Kain can go back in time.
Kain can steal souls by blinking.
Kain can swim faster than Usein Bolt running.

Kratos takes it. He's the god of war.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Nothing states it, it just happened.

How in the FVCK could Kratos have gone back to the Loom Chamber? ONE Titan is bigger than the whole place, let alone the whole race.

PROVE Kratos used the Loom Chamber.

Fights take place in a neutral ground where all powers will work, the LOK immutable timeline has no effect on this thread.

It would give him knowledge of wqhere Kain came from and how old he is.

anjd it would by extension kill the Kain Kratos is fighting, thus makiing Kratos winner.

I dont have to prove anything, I simply made a statement just as good as yours, which cancels it out since neither have proof

yes it does because you said hes going into the LOK time stream, thatds Kratos choice...so he would be doomed.



Originally posted by k1Lla441
Half the stuff your saying makes no sense...... and the only reason your going for kain is because you WAAAAYYYY to biased. im mean, look at your picture you have in your replies. ive played both games, so i would know who would win. and dark jaxx you make a very solid statement

Ime not biased at all, not over anyway, hell id give kain more cheese than some characters but I love the GOW series as well, having completed all the games and almost got a PS3 just to get the next game so dont give all this "ive played the games" nonsense.

Throw down your points, Kain could easily destroy Kratos with a simple blood shower, easily.

Originally posted by Burning thought
I dont have to prove anything, I simply made a statement just as good as yours, which cancels it out since neither have proof

yes it does because you said hes going into the LOK time stream, thatds Kratos choice...so he would be doomed.
Nope, thing is, we did not see Kratos use the Loom Chamber, the Titans could not even realistically fit in the Loom chamber, so logic contradicts your point, and Kratos can't preset the Loom Chamber to take them back anywhere(and it's not like the Titans would even be able to fit in the portal anyway).

I guess you did not hear me.

In vs. matches all characters are set in a neutral ground where the characters fight to the best of their abilities.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Nope, thing is, we did not see Kratos use the Loom Chamber, the Titans could not even realistically fit in the Loom chamber, so logic contradicts your point, and Kratos can't preset the Loom Chamber to take them back anywhere(and it's not like the Titans would even be able to fit in the portal anyway).

I guess you did not hear me.

In vs. matches all characters are set in a neutral ground where the characters fight to the best of their abilities.

He uses the loom chamber to get back and it doesnt say anywhere that someone has to be in the chamber to use its power, Kratos certainly doesnt according to you so your point also powers mine, either way your simply guessing at whats happening, you neither know if Kratos can do it without the power of the chamber or not, nothing says he can and the storyline at the end doesnt say he wasnt still using the power of the chamber.

and he can be on Neutral gound, however if hes going into the timestream of the LOK verse then hes no longer on the battleground they started on, therefore abject to the rules of the timestream LOK is in.

Originally posted by Burning thought
He uses the loom chamber to get back and it doesnt say anywhere that someone has to be in the chamber to use its power, Kratos certainly doesnt according to you so your point also powers mine, either way your simply guessing at whats happening, you neither know if Kratos can do it without the power of the chamber or not, nothing says he can and the storyline at the end doesnt say he wasnt still using the power of the chamber.

and he can be on Neutral gound, however if hes going into the timestream of the LOK verse then hes no longer on the battleground they started on, therefore abject to the rules of the timestream LOK is in. See, this is the crucial flaw of your argument, you are expecting me to prove the negative that he did not use the Loom chamber, he never was shown to, you have to prove he did. Besides...A Titan as I said could not fit in the Loom chamber if he wanted to.

Can I see this excerpt where it says LOK time is immutable?

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
See, this is the crucial flaw of your argument, you are expecting me to prove the negative that he did not use the Loom chamber, he never was shown to, you have to prove he did. Besides...A Titan as I said could not fit in the Loom chamber if he wanted to.

Can I see this excerpt where it says LOK time is immutable?

It shows you dont have to be in the loom chamber to use it when Kratos just touches the titans and makes them all disapear, yet that does not dissolve the chance that he may have already readied the loom chamber and either way, as i said, nothing there shows he can move through time on a whim anyway, not definatley.

sure: http://www.thelostworlds.net/Defiance/Question_and_Answer_with_Jen,_Richard,_and_Kyle.html



besides Kratos hardly does it instantly, he glows blue for about 5 seconds or so, Kain wouldnt need half that time to turn him into a white, bloodless wreck on the ground.

Originally posted by Burning thought
It shows you dont have to be in the loom chamber to use it when Kratos just touches the titans and makes them all disapear, yet that does not dissolve the chance that he may have already readied the loom chamber and either way, as i said, nothing there shows he can move through time on a whim anyway, not definatley.

sure: http://www.thelostworlds.net/Defiance/Question_and_Answer_with_Jen,_Richard,_and_Kyle.html



besides Kratos hardly does it instantly, he glows blue for about 5 seconds or so, Kain wouldnt need half that time to turn him into a white, bloodless wreck on the ground. 1. ...Umm, actually, that DOES show he can move through time on his own accord.

Kratos would only need an instant to freeze Kain to stone, go figure.

2. See, but that doesn't apply to Kratos in a vs. thread. All that bullshit is saying is that there is a pre-determined fate for LOK, which is present in ALOT of fictions. But Kratos is not a part of the LOK timeline at all, so he is not restricted by that rule.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. ...Umm, actually, that DOES show he can move through time on his own accord.

Kratos would only need an instant to freeze Kain to stone, go figure.

2. See, but that doesn't apply to Kratos in a vs. thread. All that bullshit is saying is that there is a pre-determined fate for LOK, which is present in ALOT of fictions. But Kratos is not a part of the LOK timeline at all, so he is not restricted by that rule.

1. You can break from stone, anything can including Kratos and not really an instant, first he would have to get out the head, then aim it, then if he does the charge attack and theres a short range on that head anyway so if we assumed they started right next to eachother then Kratos has a cat in hells chance of winning, a chance, but not much....but I doubt they start next to eachother.

2. He is because he would be entering the timeline, thus, Kratos entering the timeline at that stage would be tried to write in the Nosgoth timeline, which ofc is immutable so it would cough him out and delete him, either way Kratos going back in time will do nothing anyway.

Originally posted by Burning thought
It shows you dont have to be in the loom chamber to use it when Kratos just touches the titans and makes them all disapear, yet that does not dissolve the chance that he may have already readied the loom chamber and either way, as i said, nothing there shows he can move through time on a whim anyway, not definatley.





besides Kratos hardly does it instantly, he glows blue for about 5 seconds or so, Kain wouldnt need half that time to turn him into a white, bloodless wreck on the ground.

Kratos can control time instantly but it took a couple of seconds to use it because he had to get all the titans. if it was just himself, i think it would be a lot easier because, remember, the titans are pretty big. also, you have played all the games right? so you should know what the golden fleece does.

yeh, it reflects projectiles thats it, it doesnt make him invulerable, you just hold it down and you can reflect projectiles like the fates magic for example but it would be useless to half of Kains powers.

yea also, since he has the blade of olympus, the very same blade the killed ALL the titans and ended the great war, im pretty sure it can kill 1 guy. and since he does control time, im pretty sure with his whole arsenal he would win.

He doesnt control time, at max he controls fate, the fate of all those greeks, not Kain, furthermore he cannot do anything else with that fate, he couldnt affect Kains fate since its immutable even if Kain had a connection to the fate that Kratos controls.

The blade of Olympus is nothing, the Reaver killed a Godlike entity which could annhilate all the Titans and Olympians without being seen or damaged, also you seem to be mistaken, the blade did not kill all the Titans, it imprisoned them...and thats when it was first created with all the powers of the Olmypian gods, in the hands of Zeus, Kratos has no real feats with the blade, Kains arsenal far outweighs Kratos'.

overall you could do this simply with:

Weapons: Kain, Reaver>BoO especially in Kratos hands anyway

Magic: Kain by miles

Endurance: Kain could survive most things Kratos has, Kratos would die from most of Kains attacks.

Speed:Kain

Kratos has no chance

Originally posted by Burning thought
He doesnt control time, at max he controls fate, the fate of all those greeks, not Kain, furthermore he cannot do anything else with that fate, he couldnt affect Kains fate since its immutable even if Kain had a connection to the fate that Kratos controls.

overall you could do this simply with:

Weapons: Kain, Reaver>BoO especially in Kratos hands anyway

Magic: Kain by miles

Endurance: Kain could survive most things Kratos has, Kratos would die from most of Kains attacks.

Speed:Kain

Kratos has no chance

Your very mistaken to, because kain isnt aloud to use the reaver in this fight, and kratos can still use the blade. and since he doesnt have the reaver, the first fight kratos then wins. you act like the blade sucks in all, but it killed the spartan army in on swipe. and dont say "well the reaver could do that" because he aint aloud to use it. and agian, you are being waaayyyy to biased, because your forgetting the magic he got was given to him by the titans, and kains magic cant match his. and endurance, c'mon, kratos is a spartan! he aint never gonna slow down. and with speed, your also forgetting rage of the titans, when his combo attacks are too beastly. face it, your to biased, and kratos takes this. your the only person in this thread who thinks kain would win.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
Your very mistaken to, because kain isnt aloud to use the reaver in this fight, and kratos can still use the blade. and since he doesnt have the reaver, the first fight kratos then wins. you act like the blade sucks in all, but it killed the spartan army in on swipe. and dont say "well the reaver could do that" because he aint aloud to use it. and agian, you are being waaayyyy to biased, because your forgetting the magic he got was given to him by the titans, and kains magic cant match his. and endurance, c'mon, kratos is a spartan! he aint never gonna slow down. and with speed, your also forgetting rage of the titans, when his combo attacks are too beastly. face it, your to biased, and kratos takes this. your the only person in this thread who thinks kain would win.

false, the thread starter said Kain cannot use the spirit reaver at the end of Defiance, thus Kain can still use the Blood reaver which is nearly as good. The blade doesnt suck but its not comparable to the reaver since its power feats are all done by Zeus, kratos has not shown being able to use the power of the blade to wipe out armies so what the swords done in Zeus' hands cannot be used for Kratos. As i said, Kain can use the blood reaver.

The magic he got was given by the Titans so Kains magic is not as good? where is the logic in that? there is none thats why, Kratos magic is not only weak but its simple, both Atlas quake and Cronos rage require Kain to be close which he doesnt have to be and tbh kain could just turn into mist to escape both even if he was in close range, other powers include the head which is more useful to kratos yet short range and cumbersome and the Typhons bane bow similiary useless since its power is low.

Endurancewise Kain doesnt ever slow down since hes undead, his body will not be fatigued since his body is dead, and by Endurance i probably meant durability, Kain would survive far longer under any of Kratos powers than Kratos could of kains, Kratos wouldnt survive a single strike from most.

also who thinks Kratos wins is irrelvent if they dont debate it, since no one has won the debate as of yet, nobody is an overall winner, and your claim is false, the thread starter thought kain would win.

possible battle scenes from my point of view

Close range

Lets supposing through some queer reason Kain and Kratos start within reach, before Kratos could really do much of anything, Kain could eliminate the gap by turning to mist and moving away, Kratos doesnt move like the wind, hes a slow guy, so hes got no chance from the beginning, then Kain has so many choices, he could slow time and decapitate the oaf, he could blast him with lightning, he could rip out his soul, he could use blood shower and turn Kratos into a lifeless corpse, he could do so many things....

The only moves Kratos could do are not fast enough to stop Kain from going into mist which is near instant wheras even the fast "triangle" blast from the head of Euryale takes near a second to fire as the eyes flash, then youve got the fact the head is a cumbersome lump to aim/get out, his other moves are worthless here and trying to attack kain with blades is pointless since thats just as slow.

inescapable close range

lets say Kain has to fight in close range with his sword, in an instant Kain could have his repel shield up and be invuleralbe hten just slice Kratos into chunks of meat. Simple fact here, once Kain has the repel shield up which is done instantly, youve not got much chance. Even without the shield Kain can use a combination of fast attacks and mist dodges to dominate in close range.

long range

Similiar to the second part of "close range" simply put, Kain has so many long range attacks he could be using it would alone make Kratos no better than a small lamb for all the good it would do.

Originally posted by Burning thought
false, the thread starter said Kain cannot use the spirit reaver at the end of Defiance, thus Kain can still use the Blood reaver which is nearly as good. The blade doesnt suck but its not comparable to the reaver since its power feats are all done by Zeus, kratos has not shown being able to use the power of the blade to wipe out armies so what the swords done in Zeus' hands cannot be used for Kratos. As i said, Kain can use the blood reaver.

The magic he got was given by the Titans so Kains magic is not as good? where is the logic in that? there is none thats why, Kratos magic is not only weak but its simple, both Atlas quake and Cronos rage require Kain to be close which he doesnt have to be and tbh kain could just turn into mist to escape both even if he was in close range, other powers include the head which is more useful to kratos yet short range and cumbersome and the Typhons bane bow similiary useless since its power is low.


The only reason it hasnt shown kratos destroying many,many armies is because since he got it, he hasnt FACED any armies. i bet u if he ran into and army while he had it, they would die just as fast. and it makes no sense that a sword works in zeus' hands but not kratos'. its a sword, it works the same no matter who wields it. also, you say that kratos' time controlling abilities arent true, and if they werent, why would mother gaia say he has the power to control time? and dont tell me " he cant control kains life because hes not in lok ". you automatically asume that kratos and kain will be fighting in lok. the thread starter said kratos has all his powers, except go form, and he gets to use them, which IS THE POWER TO CONTROL TIME. so right when the fight starts, kain is pretty much dead because kratos has already deemed his fate as a loss.

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. You can break from stone, anything can including Kratos and not really an instant, first he would have to get out the head, then aim it, then if he does the charge attack and theres a short range on that head anyway so if we assumed they started right next to eachother then Kratos has a cat in hells chance of winning, a chance, but not much....but I doubt they start next to eachother.

2. He is because he would be entering the timeline, thus, Kratos entering the timeline at that stage would be tried to write in the Nosgoth timeline, which ofc is immutable so it would cough him out and delete him, either way Kratos going back in time will do nothing anyway. 1. No, Kratos can break from stone, Kratos is strong enough to physically overpower Kain with one hand if he wanted to. And even Kratos has some trouble breaking from it. He would have to pull it out, and barring gameplay it would turn him to stone instantly the moment Kain looked at it. If they start right next to eachother...Well Kratos has too many options.

2. Only Kratos is not part of LOK at all so he is not bound by their rules, he is a time God now.

Strength: Kratos without a single friggin doubt. This cannot be argued.

Speed: Well let's see, Kratos can block and reflect lightning. Kain...Well he can't.

Durability: Since Kain has a bit of a healing factor, Kain. Although Kain can be knocked out, and too much damage can harm him, hence why he has to turn to bats and run away when damaged too much.

Power: Kratos easily has more raw power in the Blade of Olympus alone. When Zeus used it, it only had a portion of Zeus' power, now it has the power of Kratos when he was a God. It is over twice as strong, why couldn't Kratos replicate Zeus' feat? He did fight Zeus while he was using the Blade of Olympus afterall.

Reach: Kratos in melee has much more reach, that goes without saying.

Range: Equal.

Versatility: Equal. Kratos can manipulate time, summon the undead with a Hammer, fire blasts from a sword and cause epic tornadoes, can cause mini quakes, can manipulate lightning in the form of traps, fire blasts of wind from a bow and cause little tornadoes, has a spear that can extend and fire blasts, and has the head of a Gorgon which can turn people to stone and shit. He can also increase his power by drawing on the power of the Titans.

Skill: Kratos with ease...Lol

Experience: Well Kain is thousands of years older.

Brutality: ...Yeah. Duh.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. No, Kratos can break from stone, Kratos is strong enough to physically overpower Kain with one hand if he wanted to. And even Kratos has some trouble breaking from it. He would have to pull it out, and barring gameplay it would turn him to stone instantly the moment Kain looked at it. If they start right next to eachother...Well Kratos has too many options.

2. Only Kratos is not part of LOK at all so he is not bound by their rules, he is a time God now.

Strength: Kratos without a single friggin doubt. This cannot be argued.

Speed: Well let's see, Kratos can block and reflect lightning. Kain...Well he can't.

Durability: Since Kain has a bit of a healing factor, Kain. Although Kain can be knocked out, and too much damage can harm him, hence why he has to turn to bats and run away when damaged too much.

Power: Kratos easily has more raw power in the Blade of Olympus alone. When Zeus used it, it only had a portion of Zeus' power, now it has the power of Kratos when he was a God. It is over twice as strong, why couldn't Kratos replicate Zeus' feat? He did fight Zeus while he was using the Blade of Olympus afterall.

Reach: Kratos in melee has much more reach, that goes without saying.

Range: Equal.

Versatility: Equal. Kratos can manipulate time, summon the undead with a Hammer, fire blasts from a sword and cause epic tornadoes, can cause mini quakes, can manipulate lightning in the form of traps, fire blasts of wind from a bow and cause little tornadoes, has a spear that can extend and fire blasts, and has the head of a Gorgon which can turn people to stone and shit. He can also increase his power by drawing on the power of the Titans.

Skill: Kratos with ease...Lol

Experience: Well Kain is thousands of years older.

Brutality: ...Yeah. Duh.

1. He couldnt overpower Kain with one hand, hell I wouldnt be surprised if Kain could replicate some of the feats Kratos does with ease since this is non god form Kratos as well. No thats the Medusas head that turns people to stone instantly in lore, ive not seen any mention of Euryales being the same. Name some of those options, since more than half if not all will be ineffective.

2. Hes not a time god, he simply has some of the fate powers and from whats shown can teleport through time using unknown means, either way, as soon as he enters LOK, him entering LOK unvierse iwll be part of that timestream, but since its immutable he will be deleted, what part of that dont you understand? Still as I said, he couldnt do anythng even if he did go back since Kain is still under LOK time rules and Kain cannot be killed.

Strength: Not at all, the guy has strength in his arms but whats he really shown? he throws pillars and things but Kain and Raziel do every other level, remember this is non god kratos.

Speed: Kain, hes far too fast for Kratos to do much of anything.

Durability: still, Kains healing factor combined with the fact youd need to completly brutalise and turn him to mush to get rid of him.

Power: because hes never done any of these feats and we dont know the implications behind it either, Zeus had a lot of things under his control like the sword having the power of the olympians and himself at their prime it seemed, and not to mention, its his sword, he created it, so it makes sense he can use it, either way, kratos has never done anything great with the sword, and nonsense, Kain has far more power, he could just go invulerable and then choose from his bazillions of spells to turn Kratos into food.

Reach: sure

Range: not really, if you take into account their range may be the same overall, Kain has far more ranged attacks to use so Kain.

Versatility: half of them pale in comparison not only in number but also power, Kain wins this easily and Versatility means diffrent things, since half of the attacks you mentioned do similiar styles of combat to eachother then its pointless.

Skill: both the same

the last ones are pointless.

At the end of the day were also forgetting TK. on a whim Kain could just have Kratos floating about the place.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
The only reason it hasnt shown kratos destroying many,many armies is because since he got it, he hasnt FACED any armies. i bet u if he ran into and army while he had it, they would die just as fast. and it makes no sense that a sword works in zeus' hands but not kratos'. its a sword, it works the same no matter who wields it. also, you say that kratos' time controlling abilities arent true, and if they werent, why would mother gaia say he has the power to control time? and dont tell me " he cant control kains life because hes not in lok ". you automatically asume that kratos and kain will be fighting in lok. the thread starter said kratos has all his powers, except go form, and he gets to use them, which IS THE POWER TO CONTROL TIME. so right when the fight starts, kain is pretty much dead because kratos has already deemed his fate as a loss.

As I said to Jaxx, you cant just guess about at the drop of a hat that Kratos can do everything with a weapon created, formed, powered and overall used by Zeus and lets not forget Zeus' relevence as King of the gods means he has diffrent powers to Kratos, Zeus "made" the sword, he would logically be able to use it better than some guy who just picks it up recently.

Having the power to control time could mean a hundred hyperbolic things, the only thing weve seen and actually been told he has is the ability to move through it, thats about it, and thats useless tbh. No you dont automatically assume he starts in LOK, they start on a neutral battlefield but if Kratos wants to enter a timestream of Kains he may go ahead and be dissintegrated.

As i said, Kratos never has the full power of time, he has the power of time travel which is a form of time control, but he cant just freeze time and other made up stuff. Deeming something is pointless, since if you claim youve played GOW 2, the sisters deemed Kratos fate a loss, but we all know what happened there dont we.

Originally posted by Burning thought



Having the power to control time could mean a hundred hyperbolic things, the only thing weve seen and actually been told he has is the ability to move through it, thats about it, and thats useless tbh. No you dont automatically assume he starts in LOK, they start on a neutral battlefield but if Kratos wants to enter a timestream of Kains he may go ahead and be dissintegrated.

As i said, Kratos never has the full power of time, he has the power of time travel which is a form of time control, but he cant just freeze time and other made up stuff. Deeming something is pointless, since if you claim youve played GOW 2, the sisters deemed Kratos fate a loss, but we all know what happened there dont we.

1. when i said that someguy could just pick it up and use it, i was just using and example, but kratos had used it in the beginning so he would have some idea of how to use it.

2. To use its all-godly power, it doesnt take a genius. all zeus did was swing the sword. since when doesnt a person know how to swing a sword?

3. timelines dont count in games vs. because the creator of the thread said he gets all his powers except god powers right? so that means he gets to move through time right? even you said so yourself. so right before kratos loses, he can just go back in time, and start the fight over again. and, you said yourself, that kratos DOES have a chance, so itll only be a matter of time until kratos does win. even if its a small chance, kratos will just keep restarting the fight until he wins. dont tell me "it takes too long for kratos to activate it" because it only took a long time before, because, he was taking MASSIVE TITANS with him, and i think that'll take a little more time.

Burning thought- Everything you said is a lie. Kratos, in a blowout.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
1. when i said that someguy could just pick it up and use it, i was just using and example, but kratos had used it in the beginning so he would have some idea of how to use it.

2. To use its all-godly power, it doesnt take a genius. all zeus did was swing the sword. since when doesnt a person know how to swing a sword?

3. timelines dont count in games vs. because the creator of the thread said he gets all his powers except god powers right? so that means he gets to move through time right? even you said so yourself. so right before kratos loses, he can just go back in time, and start the fight over again. and, you said yourself, that kratos DOES have a chance, so itll only be a matter of time until kratos does win. even if its a small chance, kratos will just keep restarting the fight until he wins. dont tell me "it takes too long for kratos to activate it" because it only took a long time before, because, he was taking MASSIVE TITANS with him, and i think that'll take a little more time.

1. some idea, great, so your basing Kratos being able to do everything Zeus does with the sword on "he must have some idea how to use it"....thats not a strong debating point.

2. ok so you think an ordinairy tramp off of the streets of greece could pick up the sword and destroy armies using its full power? nonsense and theres nothing to back that up either, a bad debating point again.

3. yes he can move through time as much as he damn well pleases, but if he moves into the LOK unvierse, there is no rule in this thread saving Kratos from being deleted, so he cant just go and find kain as a youngster, and even if he wasnt deleted, he could not do anything because Kain in that time period is subject by those rules.

Problem is, losing doesnt mean he will be alive, Kain could kill him in one shot from most of his attacks like the soul ripping ones, Kratos will be dead in a shot and wouldnt be able to do anything at all.

It took long for the titans, as I said before, you cant just guess "it will take less time if hes not got the titans with him" since thats not necesserily going to be true and its a guess/assumtion.



Originally posted by Wil7
Burning thought- Everything you said is a lie. Kratos, in a blowout.

you should use your main account, it would be worth more if you were going to try and bother me, if your new and not a sock however, i think there are rules on debates in the forum, however if your new this is not a good starting point. Calling someone a lier without even any points or reason.

Originally posted by Wil7
Burning thought- Everything you said is a lie. Kratos, in a blowout.

Either you have not read any of Burning Thought's posts, or you know nothing about Kain.

I agree with k1Lla441, Kratos is just too good. He would cut Kain into 10,000 pieces. You must be stupid to think Kain actually has a chance. No challenge.

Originally posted by Burning thought
2. ok so you think an ordinairy tramp off of the streets of greece could pick up the sword and destroy armies using its full power? nonsense and theres nothing to back that up either, a bad debating point again.

3. yes he can move through time as much as he damn well pleases, but if he moves into the LOK unvierse, there is no rule in this thread saving Kratos from being deleted, so he cant just go and find kain as a youngster, and even if he wasnt deleted, he could not do anything because Kain in that time period is subject by those rules.

Problem is, losing doesnt mean he will be alive, Kain could kill him in one shot from most of his attacks like the soul ripping ones, Kratos will be dead in a shot and wouldnt be able to do anything at all.


1. you keep saying "if he goes to the lok universe" when he is not. nobody is going to anyones universe, just an equal playing field, so that negates that theory.

2.it doesnt take somebody with 200 i.q. to know to swing the sword at there enemy. thats all it takes to unleash its power, so if kratos had the sword, all he has to do its think " ok, hes my enemy, and i need to swing this sword at him" wow real hard.

3. yes, even tho it doesnt show him doing it, mother gaia says herself that kratos now has the power to control time.

Dude, i respect you in all, and thers no reason for me not to, but ive been pm certian people and they said that all you do is go for kain to win against any body. face it KAIN IS GONNA LOSE TO KRATOS. somebody who has the sword of the gods, has the power to conrtol time, is way more aggressive,stronger, and has better magics is gonna win.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
1. you keep saying "if he goes to the lok universe" when he is not. nobody is going to anyones universe, just an equal playing field, so that negates that theory.

2.it doesnt take somebody with 200 i.q. to know to swing the sword at there enemy. thats all it takes to unleash its power, so if kratos had the sword, all he has to do its think " ok, hes my enemy, and i need to swing this sword at him" wow real hard.

3. yes, even tho it doesnt show him doing it, mother gaia says herself that kratos now has the power to control time.

Dude, i respect you in all, and thers no reason for me not to, but ive been pm certian people and they said that all you do is go for kain to win against any body. face it KAIN IS GONNA LOSE TO KRATOS. somebody who has the sword of the gods, has the power to conrtol time, is way more aggressive,stronger, and has better magics is gonna win.

1. I was simply addressing Dark Jaxx' idea of Kratos going back in time to kill Kain in his universe.

2. But thats not true, both Zeus and Kratos swing the sword in combat, and it does not create that effect, theres nothing backing you up here either since theres no definite answer on whether all it takes is a swing and its proven it doesnt because both of them swing, it obviously takes more power usage.

3. yeh, which includes simple things such as moving through it, thats controlling time, also Mother gaia saying so is not the end all on the subject, kratos has to show some of his powers as well, since lal hes shown is a fairly slow time travel which is worthless when Kain will be moving contantly to stop him theres no reason to move through time.

Who are thse certain people? I go for Kain because i know he will win, and because I cant defeat almost anyone in a debate who thinks otherwise, thus, so far Kain has so many ways to defeat Kratos its unbearable, Kratos could end up losing all his items as kain uses TK to take them all himself, he could just steal the Blade of olympus and use it, duel wielding the blade and the reaver....

Kratos has zero chance, he could be choked to death force choke darthvader style with TK or simply be relieved of his weapons, hell Kain could just shackle Kratos in place and laugh at the fool for even trying to defeat him for a while before decapitating him.

also remember Kain only has to win once, as the thread starter says, "a win counts for a KO", the first time Kratos loses, he cant just go back in time to try again.

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. He couldnt overpower Kain with one hand, hell I wouldnt be surprised if Kain could replicate some of the feats Kratos does with ease since this is non god form Kratos as well. No thats the Medusas head that turns people to stone instantly in lore, ive not seen any mention of Euryales being the same. Name some of those options, since more than half if not all will be ineffective.

2. Hes not a time god, he simply has some of the fate powers and from whats shown can teleport through time using unknown means, either way, as soon as he enters LOK, him entering LOK unvierse iwll be part of that timestream, but since its immutable he will be deleted, what part of that dont you understand? Still as I said, he couldnt do anythng even if he did go back since Kain is still under LOK time rules and Kain cannot be killed.

Strength: Not at all, the guy has strength in his arms but whats he really shown? he throws pillars and things but Kain and Raziel do every other level, remember this is non god kratos.

Speed: Kain, hes far too fast for Kratos to do much of anything.

Durability: still, Kains healing factor combined with the fact youd need to completly brutalise and turn him to mush to get rid of him.

Power: because hes never done any of these feats and we dont know the implications behind it either, Zeus had a lot of things under his control like the sword having the power of the olympians and himself at their prime it seemed, and not to mention, its his sword, he created it, so it makes sense he can use it, either way, kratos has never done anything great with the sword, and nonsense, Kain has far more power, he could just go invulerable and then choose from his bazillions of spells to turn Kratos into food.

Reach: sure

Range: not really, if you take into account their range may be the same overall, Kain has far more ranged attacks to use so Kain.

Versatility: half of them pale in comparison not only in number but also power, Kain wins this easily and Versatility means diffrent things, since half of the attacks you mentioned do similiar styles of combat to eachother then its pointless.

Skill: both the same

the last ones are pointless.

At the end of the day were also forgetting TK. on a whim Kain could just have Kratos floating about the place. 1. Yeah, he could overpower Kain with one hand. Kain's best friggin strength feat is pushing blocks. Kain could not resist being crushed by Atlas. He could not overpower the Hydra. He could not toss the Collossus of Rhodes like a rag doll. The only difference between Medusa and the other Gorgon's is that Medusa is beatiful, whereas the others are ugly. Hell, Euryale is even more powerful than Medusa if memory serves me right, I think it was stated in the tale of when Perseus took Medusa's head to kill the Kraken. Let's see, Kratos could grab Kain and rip him in half. He could wrap him with his chains and rip him to pieces. He could use Atlas Quake. He could use Euryale's Blast.

2. He IS a time God, he took the Fate's power, who are by definition the Goddess' of Fate and Time. He can teleport through time at will from what we see. Kain is NOT under LOK rules in a vs. match, he isn't unkillable through that stupid BS destiny bullshit, if human Kain is killed by Kratos, he dies. All vs. matches take place in a neutral ground where ALL COMBATANTS CAN USE THEIR POWERS TO THE BEST OF THEIR ABILITIES.

Strength: ...Lol wut? He showed strength in his legs when he resisted being crushed by the Collossus of Rhodes. In fact, lifting in general takes more strength from your legs than your arms. Kratos overpowered the Hydra, who is probably like 100 tons, and impaled it. He overpowers Cyclope with one hand when he stabs them in the head with the chain and slams them to the ground. A single Cyclops is probably 30 tons.

Speed: Bullshit. Kain is not that fast at all, and Kratos can easily block and deflect lightning, and Kain is not lightning fast.

Durability: Turn him to mush? All it took was ripping his heart out to KO him. And Kratos has good durability too, he was thrown hundreds of feet through a stone ceiling and got back up completely fine.

Power: Zeus forged the Blade of Olympus with his own power, then Kratos' was added to it making it stronger. And you forget, Kratos fought and won against Zeus wielding the Blade of Olympus. And Kratos can just pull out a head and turn Kain to stone. Or quake the ground, knocking Kain in the air, and be pelted by Wind Arrows and Tornadoes. Kratos can just time kill ftw.

Range: Range just means who can attack from what range.

Skill: Kain has never shown or even been implied to be skilled with a sword. He just swings it wildly. Wow.

TK? Sheeit, Ares had TK and was pwned by Kratos, Kratos now has Ares' power(actually more). And Kratos can physically break it.

Why wouldnt you go for Kratos? Kratos is the god of war who defeated a god. He uses the Blades of Chaos. They have the longest reach of a sword, besides Sephiroth's sword. If Kratos can kill a god, he would easily kill Kain.

What I just read was "title", "title", "title", "title", "title", "bullshit", "title"

You are a stupid ass. The only one who can match Sephiroth's skills are Kratos. What kind of weapon do these people have.

Originally posted by Burning thought


also remember Kain only has to win once, as the thread starter says, "a win counts for a KO", the first time Kratos loses, he cant just go back in time to try again.

Wrong, i said BEFORE kratos loses, he should go back in time. there fore giving him infintie chances to beat kain. and, you said yourself at the start of this argument, kratos has a little chance too win. well, with infinite trys at killing kain, eventually hes gonna succeed, right? There, fight won, no flaw in that.

Originally posted by Wil7
You are a stupid ass. The only one who can match Sephiroth's skills are Kratos. What kind of weapon do these people have.

Reported to moderators for insulting. If you could report someone for lousy comebacks, I would do that as well. So what you basically are saying is that the only one on par with Sephiroth in the fictional world is Kratos?

...Lol, I think that is what he said.

Yes

Oh please. I could easily list at least 20 VIDEO GAME characters that could defeat Sephiroth. And that is only Video Game characters. Then we have the rest of the fictional universe.

The character in my sig alone could solo not only the entire Final Fantasy VII universe including Sephiroth, but most of the gaming world in its entirety.

beyonder's dick cud solo sephiroth. but then again, who has the better hairstyle huh?!?!?!

and kratos for this. they both jave similar feats but krato's opponents seem to have greater manifestations of their powers. and kratos has much greater time manipulation powers than kain.

Beyonder's dick is indeed legendary, it's length and girth are unimaginable.

I will admit there are some like Pyron who could stand up to Sephiroth, but in my opinion, he is the best, to me though.

Some? You are giving Sephiroth waaaay too much credit.

No I am not, if you have played Kingdom Hearts 2, then you know what I am talking about.

Sephiroth's appearance in KH2 is noncanon.

And not impressive to be honest.

Originally posted by Wil7
No I am not, if you have played Kingdom Hearts 2, then you know what I am talking about.

Game mechanics is an illegit way of debate. Not to mention that KH2 Sephiroth is still not even in the top 50 gaming characters when it comes to either power or combat or both at the same time. In the eyes of many characters, he is barely a bug.

In the eyes of characters like Pyron, he would be more like a single celled paramecium.

Originally posted by Wil7
I will admit there are some like Pyron who could stand up to Sephiroth, but in my opinion, he is the best, to me though.

http://images.killermovies.com/forums/icons/v2/icon2.gif

I'm reminded of Dark-Jaxx's "boloni-poni" logic...

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
http://images.killermovies.com/forums/icons/v2/icon2.gif

I'm reminded of Dark-Jaxx's "boloni-poni" logic... ...

I can't believe you remembered that. haermm

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Yeah, he could overpower Kain with one hand. Kain's best friggin strength feat is pushing blocks. Kain could not resist being crushed by Atlas. He could not overpower the Hydra. He could not toss the Collossus of Rhodes like a rag doll. The only difference between Medusa and the other Gorgon's is that Medusa is beatiful, whereas the others are ugly. Hell, Euryale is even more powerful than Medusa if memory serves me right, I think it was stated in the tale of when Perseus took Medusa's head to kill the Kraken. Let's see, Kratos could grab Kain and rip him in half. He could wrap him with his chains and rip him to pieces. He could use Atlas Quake. He could use Euryale's Blast.

2. He IS a time God, he took the Fate's power, who are by definition the Goddess' of Fate and Time. He can teleport through time at will from what we see. Kain is NOT under LOK rules in a vs. match, he isn't unkillable through that stupid BS destiny bullshit, if human Kain is killed by Kratos, he dies. All vs. matches take place in a neutral ground where ALL COMBATANTS CAN USE THEIR POWERS TO THE BEST OF THEIR ABILITIES.

Strength: ...Lol wut? He showed strength in his legs when he resisted being crushed by the Collossus of Rhodes. In fact, lifting in general takes more strength from your legs than your arms. Kratos overpowered the Hydra, who is probably like 100 tons, and impaled it. He overpowers Cyclope with one hand when he stabs them in the head with the chain and slams them to the ground. A single Cyclops is probably 30 tons.

Speed: Bullshit. Kain is not that fast at all, and Kratos can easily block and deflect lightning, and Kain is not lightning fast.

Durability: Turn him to mush? All it took was ripping his heart out to KO him. And Kratos has good durability too, he was thrown hundreds of feet through a stone ceiling and got back up completely fine.

Power: Zeus forged the Blade of Olympus with his own power, then Kratos' was added to it making it stronger. And you forget, Kratos fought and won against Zeus wielding the Blade of Olympus. And Kratos can just pull out a head and turn Kain to stone. Or quake the ground, knocking Kain in the air, and be pelted by Wind Arrows and Tornadoes. Kratos can just time kill ftw.

Range: Range just means who can attack from what range.

Skill: Kain has never shown or even been implied to be skilled with a sword. He just swings it wildly. Wow.

TK? Sheeit, Ares had TK and was pwned by Kratos, Kratos now has Ares' power(actually more). And Kratos can physically break it.

1. Blocks that weigh more than most of Kratos' opponents. Couldnt resist Atlas? ofc he could since Kratos can and we know Kratos struggles to push up metal gates and sometimes even small pillars take a lot of effort that not even Kain even notices. The colossus although made out of bronze which is a fairly light and non dense metal is also hollow, so first find me the weight of the colossus of rhodes, the real weight. Then take into account thats Godly Kratos, this one in the battle is after he is drained. Find me the legend please.

If you think Kraots is going to be able to grab kain, begin ripping him in half, forget it....thats the most terrible idea ive ever heard since thats consuming kain isnt just instantly turning to mist to escape any of this. The chains are just as impossible. Both Quake and the blast are short range, and quake? whats Kain going to do? flee from the terrible power of the small rocks kratos lets loose, Atlas quake would be the death of Kratos, its a slow and overall worthless move. I wouldnt even be surprised if half of the weapons failed to pierce kain.

2. nope, hes not, he tooks the power of fate, thats it, timelines...simple as that although show me your source that states he is a full time god?

False, Kain in the battle is not under the destiny thing, but if kartos CHOOSES to leave the battlefield, enter the timestream of lOK to find young kain, he will be deleted, there is nothing clearer.

Strength: so now were guessing, hes probably a 100 tonnes, the hydra was not that large and he overpowered just its head which is not the weight of the entire thing itself and hes weakened it several times by then as well so its not at its prime.

Speed: yes he is, he would seem like a blur to Kratos, what are you talking about? hell kratos is barely as fast as a normal human, infact slower, and what are you getting he can block lightning from? I dont remember a non in-game moment of this?

Power: Pull out a head and hope kains in its pathetic range, the pulling out however is when hell be dead, kains not going to let Kratos pull it out unless he was toying. Kain breaks the first combo by jsut becoming mist in an instant, coming behind kratos while hes quaking and impaling the fool.

Skill: swings widly? he has a number of techniques, he swings just as wildly as Kratos, hell Kratos is far worse, when hes got a real sword like BoO his combos are simply "slash left, slash right, slash down" etc etc, hes terrible.

nonsense, Kain would just hold Kratos in TK shackles, Kratos would lose most of his weapons if not all to TK powers from range so hell basically be just a normal human by the end....you cant win this debate, theres 1000 ways Kain could destroy Kratos completly with barely trying wheras to even have any attempt at making Kain more than laugh would take major effort.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
Wrong, i said BEFORE kratos loses, he should go back in time. there fore giving him infintie chances to beat kain. and, you said yourself at the start of this argument, kratos has a little chance too win. well, with infinite trys at killing kain, eventually hes gonna succeed, right? There, fight won, no flaw in that.

Theres hundreds of flaws in that, first your guessing Kraots would know when hes going to lose, then your guessing hes even got time, he would be dead in a single strike from half of Kains powers so going abck in time is impossible if your dead, etc etc and having a tiny chance was simply aguess on my part, its more likely he has no chance since it would take kain a major flaw in performance to be taken by surprised at close range from that head which would take long to get out anyway....the fat, cumbersome head would also be the death of Kratos

Then you must have never fought Sephiroth in Kingdom Hearts 2. He is not even the final boss, and he is the hardest boss in the game. The ending boss has 6 bars of health, he has 16 bars of health.

this forum is usually the real characters, this is not just the gameplay versions