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Fistfight. No weapons, at night in the swamps of Dagobah, knee deep in muck.....who wins?

Is there anyone around for Kirk to feel as though he needs to impress?
If not, then i say Solo.

What age group is Kirk in? Is he evenly matched with Han?

I'd say Kirk in the first Star Trek movie.

Han whips his ass.

Not because I'm a die hard Warsie, as opposed to Trekkie, but I just feel that Han has more experience, what with his being in the Imperial Navy, and being a space smuggler. After all, a smuggler has to have some degree of down & dirty skills. Just look what at what Han did to Greedo.

And, yes, Han DID fire first.

No Blasters!!! No Blasters!!! haermm

Yeah, Han takes this one easily.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I'd say Kirk in the first Star Trek movie.

If you have to gimp Kirk with older age, then Han wins/has the definite advantage.

Make them both in their prime, Kirk kicks the shit out of Solo, easily.

Kirk handled his own against Klingons, Vulcans, Gorns and a slew of other more powerful/larger foes. Solo relies on the wookie to fight his hand-to-hand battles.

Originally posted by Robtard
If you have to gimp Kirk with older age, then Han wins/has the definite advantage.

Make them both in their prime, Kirk kicks the shit out of Solo, easily.

Kirk handled his own against Klingons, Vulcans, Gorns and a slew of other more powerful/larger foes. Solo relies on the wookie to fight his hand-to-hand battles. do some research on Solo.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
do some research on Solo.

Has solo fought (and beat) aliens who were 2-4 times more physicaly powerful in a hand to hand duel? Done this consistantly?

Gimmee a sec, looking for it now.

"A sec" has an entirely different meaning to you, obviously.

I had to sleep, man. I forget which novel it is, I think it is the trilogy of "Han Solos adventures", but there is a part where Boba Fett is recalling the first time he saw Solo ever.

Han was a prisoner and was pitted like against three or four beings of varying species, and he won.

i read a comic book where han ran away from a pissed off jedi once, whatever that is worth.

well, it IS a Jedi.....

A smuggler vs. a military soldier.

Kirk takes it.

Han has military training, he was a prosperous officer in the Imp navy, he just couldnt follow orders.

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
A smuggler vs. a military soldier.

Kirk takes it.


Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Han has military training, he was a prosperous officer in the Imp navy, he just couldnt follow orders.



True, but I think Kirk takes by a very slim margin.

Han, in my opinion, has the edge because, as a smuggler, he has to be more ruthless than Kirk, and, most likely, has fewer morals than a "do-gooder" like Kirk. Han would probably fight dirty.

Indeed....the circle that Han runs in, he is by far harder than Kirk.

", fought against three other human fighters much larger than himself. Solo somehow managed to defeat the other gladiators in unarmed combat... "

Wookiepedia.

And that was before he joined the Empire and recieved military combat training. So... yeah.


I know nothing about Kirk though, so I'll withhold judgment.

Kirk would have Spock teach him the Vulcan death grip and win by a super neck pinch

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
", fought against three other human fighters much larger than himself. Solo somehow managed to defeat the other gladiators in unarmed combat... "

Wookiepedia.

And that was before he joined the Empire and recieved military combat training. So... yeah.


I know nothing about Kirk though, so I'll withhold judgment.

Look above, Kirks fights and holds his own against far more physically powerful foes like Vulcans, Klingon, Gorns and several other aliens.

Even when he was an old fat mad and thrown in jail, he beat a 7-1/2 tall hulking alien in a prison fight with no weapons. (ST6)

Edit: Also of note, Kirk is military trained in hand-to-hand also.

In that case I'll give it to Kirk 6/10 in a pure H2H fight.

6 out of 10? You're ****ing insane.

In the original series episode "Space Seed", where Khan is first introduced, Kirk beats him in a fight, barely beats him, but he pulls a win. Khan is about five times stronger than an average human and has greatly increased speed and stamina. WTF has Solo done?

http://www.neutronstar.org/soc/Images/khan.gif

KHANN-NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!

I didn't mean to say 6/10, honestly.. But he wouldn't win 10/10.

One has to consider Solos habit of ALWAYS beating the odds.

I think Kirk's record of besting far more powerful foes would qualify as that too. So that's wash.

Unless of course, you count the time Han was captured like a little *****, frozen and turn into a decoration. Then had to wait for a woman to rescue him, not sure that counts as "always beating the odds".

Kirk: "When Khan is first introduced, I beat him in a fight, barely beat him, but I pulled a win. Khan is about five times stronger than an average human and has greatly increased speed and stamina. But I won."

Han: "Great kid, don't get cocky."

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
A smuggler vs. a military soldier.

Kirk takes it.

Error.


A crafty smuggler vs. a peaceful deep space explorer

Starfleet is at best a Defense force...their primary directive is peaceful space exploration.


Still, I'm undecided....I'm leaning towards Kirk because of his fighting feats/record.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Kirk: "When Khan is first introduced, I beat him in a fight, barely beat him, but I pulled a win. Khan is about five times stronger than an average human and has greatly increased speed and stamina. But I won."

Han: "Great kid, don't get cocky."
I laughed.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Error.

A crafty smuggler vs. a peaceful deep space explorer

Starfleet is at best a Defense force...their primary directive is peaceful space exploration.

Still, I'm undecided....I'm leaning towards Kirk because of his fighting feats/record.
Wrong, Star Fleet isn't "at best a defense force", they're proven their offensive capabilites in all of the varies shows and movies.

Despite the Enterprises' peaceful mission status, the personal are militarily trained, as space exploration in dangerous in the ST universe.

Originally posted by Robtard
Wrong, Star Fleet isn't "at best a defense force", they're proven their offensive capabilites in all of the varies shows and movies.

Despite the Enterprises' peaceful mission status, the personal are militarily trained, as space exploration in dangerous in the ST universe.

You see, we don't disagree on what you said above. You didn't contradict me either. doped *

My statement was in terms as it relates to the word "military". So, from a military perspective, Starfleet is at best a defense force. I stated that to show that it is NOT primarily a military force, but a peaceful organization of science and exploration.


Observe:

"Its principal functions were the advancement of Federation knowledge about the galaxy and its inhabitants, the advancement of Federation knowledge of science and technology, and the military defense of the Federation."

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Starfleet

"Starfleet has been shown to handle diplomatic, scientific, and defense missions, although their main mandate seems to be peaceful exploration in the search of sentient life."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starfleet




Starfleet's military might is NOT intended for offense, but to keep from getting raped.



*I just wanted to use that smilie because I think its funny...that's why it seems out of place. doped




Edit-dude, I'm a Star Trek nerd as well. I get flak from the Star Wars fans. They say its like being a fan of OSU and OU.

Originally posted by Robtard
I think Kirk's record of besting far more powerful foes would qualify as that too. So that's wash.

Unless of course, you count the time Han was captured like a little *****, frozen and turn into a decoration. Then had to wait for a woman to rescue him, not sure that counts as "always beating the odds". He was captured by VADER, man. VADER.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
He was captured by VADER, man. VADER.

That still negates your absolute "Solos habit of ALWAYS beating the odds" ace-in-the-hole.

Face it (and admit) that Kirk has the backing in winning a hand-to-hand here, Kirk could even beat Solo in pulling chicks.

Originally posted by Robtard
Face it (and admit) that Kirk has the backing in winning a hand-to-hand here, Kirk could even beat Solo in pulling chicks.

Kirk ****ed a green-skinned woman.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
He was captured by VADER, man. VADER.

Technically, sir, he was captured by the entire Empire.

Vader was merely the host of events to come.

Not to mention that Lando sold him out.

Han by a nose, and here's why:

Kirk had PIS on his side whenever he needed it. Much like Superman, writers made Kirk as tough, fast, strong and smart as he needed to be to:

A. Get the girl
B. Overshadow Spock
C. Defeat the villain.

Hans had to be tougher to survive in the Star Wars universe. There, everyone dies. Good, evil, or anti-hero (Han).

Also Han was much more ruthless. He"d definitely shoot first. And he'dve violated the Prime Directive countless times just because it benefited him to do so.

Hans toughness outlasts Kirk's aura. Just barely.

Everyone dies in the ST universe too, though I doubt your original point is valid in this fight. It amounts to "Han wins, just cuz".

This is a fist fight, so your "shoot first" is also not valid. Of mention, Kirk is not your standard Star Fleet captain, he's isn't very diplomatic.

How does Han's "toughness outlast Kirk's aura"? I've given several examples of Kirk beating, outlasting and enduring far more powerful foes. Khan being one of them. Aura, wtf?

Originally posted by Impediment




Technically, sir, he was captured by the entire Empire.

Vader was merely the host of events to come.

Not to mention that Lando sold him out. Exactly.

Straight up fight? Han! Han Solo seems to be the one more likely to not fight fair/fight dirty.

Someone said the carbonite freezing contradicts the fact Han Solo always beats the odds? He survived it! He was rescued from it! What are the odds of that?

Originally posted by willofthewisp
Straight up fight? Han! Han Solo seems to be the one more likely to not fight fair/fight dirty.

Someone said the carbonite freezing contradicts the fact Han Solo always beats the odds? He survived it! He was rescued from it! What are the odds of that?

Your "Han solo seems" is no match for what Kirk has done.

It was his prison, he was supposed to survive it as Jabba wanted Solo alive. So there goes that.

Well, I can't believe I'm arguing minor points of Star Wars, but here we go. Han being frozen was just testing it to see if it could be done for Luke. Vader was all set to pay Bobba Fett if Han didn't live through it, so his survival was not a sure thing at all.

Didn't Kirk struggle fighting Spock one time? Spock, the more cerebral character?

Originally posted by willofthewisp
Well, I can't believe I'm arguing minor points of Star Wars, but here we go. Han being frozen was just testing it to see if it could be done for Luke. Vader was all set to pay Bobba Fett if Han didn't live through it, so his survival was not a sure thing at all.

Didn't Kirk struggle fighting Spock one time? Spock, the more cerebral character? Jabba wanted Solo alive. Vader didn't give a shit about Solo, if he lived or died. As you said, he was prepared to compensate Fett if Solo died.

So yeah, what you said.

Originally posted by willofthewisp
Well, I can't believe I'm arguing minor points of Star Wars, but here we go. Han being frozen was just testing it to see if it could be done for Luke. Vader was all set to pay Bobba Fett if Han didn't live through it, so his survival was not a sure thing at all.

Didn't Kirk struggle fighting Spock one time? Spock, the more cerebral character?

Didn't C3PO say he was perfectly safe while frozen? As mentioned before, "beating the odds" is a moot point, as Kirk has pulled out wins even in the most dire of situations.

Yes he did, which only shows Kirk's prowess.

1) Vulcans are about 3 times as strong as humans
2) They were fighting on planet Vulcan, which has a thin oxygen atmosphere compared to Earth.

well C3P0 was a droid, likely it was in his programming to know that.

Originally posted by Robtard
I think Kirk's record of besting far more powerful foes would qualify as that too. So that's wash.

Unless of course, you count the time Han was captured like a little *****, frozen and turn into a decoration. Then had to wait for a woman to rescue him, not sure that counts as "always beating the odds".

The odds of successfully navigating an asteroid field: approximately 3,720 to 1.

The odds of successfully beating up a pretty boy in tights: a lot better.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
The odds of successfully navigating an asteroid field: approximately 3,720 to 1.

The odds of successfully beating up a pretty boy in tights: a lot better.

Not sure how Han's piloting skills will help him in a fist fight.

Not when the "pretty boy" in question has numerous wins against more powerful foes on his side.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
The odds of successfully navigating an asteroid field: approximately 3,720 to 1.

The odds of successfully beating up a pretty boy in tights: a lot better.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi


You'll agree with any irrelevant shit as long as you think it somehow makes the SW character win, seems to be the pattern; it's very strange.

Originally posted by Robtard
You'll agree with any irrelevant shit as long as you think it somehow makes the SW character win, seems to be the pattern; it's very strange. not nearly as strange as your hostility.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
not nearly as strange as your hostility.

Now I'm hostile for making a valid observation?

Originally posted by Robtard
Now I'm hostile for making a valid observation? no, you are hostile on a general basis. You are pretty much a hostile individual.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
no, you are hostile on a general basis. You are pretty much a hostile individual.

You know, slanderous lies can be considered as hostility.

Oh yeah...

SQeMknVWuU0

More Kirk badassery.

XyhhFzE5O5U

Here you see Kirk's unconventional, yet bad ass fight moves. What's Solo going to do when Kirk uses his patented "butt-drop" move (@ 00:19)?

You'll also notice that not even a knife to the kidney if enough to stop Kirk.

LSHCNTELFI8

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Fistfight. No weapons, at night in the swamps of Dagobah, knee deep in muck.....who wins? It wouldn't matter. As soon as Solo is in any kind of danger, Chewbacca would jump in and rip his opponent apart.

I have seen Star Trek fist fighting.

Han takes this easily.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
I have seen Star Trek fist fighting.

Han takes this easily.

DO tell us of the greatness of Han's fist figthing you've seen?

Originally posted by Robtard
You'll agree with any irrelevant shit as long as you think it somehow makes , seems to be the pattern; it's very strange.

Originally posted by Robtard
DO tell us of the greatness of Han's fist figthing you've seen?

That's true. The only fist fights I recall Han getting into was when he was blind on a skiff in the Tatooine desert and half-assed after being tortured and lying in a prison cell on Bespin.

I like Han a lot, but this one (based on character insight alone) has to go to Kirk. Han uses his intelligence and wit to get out of fist fights. Kirk tends to use a fight as a first resort.

Did you quote me right? I could swear I made sense in my reply to RJ.

Exactly, a smuggler's best weapon is avoiding being caught then then escaping if spotted. Solo is crafty, but a runner, besides, he has an eight foot tall Wookie as muscle to rely on.

Kirk fights, it's just what he does. He's the one Starfeelt Captain that would rather fire than try diplimacy more times than not. He could take out Solo with a dramatic Shatner pause.

I still thik Han is the better fighter judging from the canon-ized books. Though Lando VS Han would be good..

Originally posted by Robtard
Exactly, a smuggler's best weapon is avoiding being caught then then escaping if spotted.

Well, he did say in A New Hope that he preferred a straight fight to all the sneaking around they were doing. I take that to mean he has some positive experience in fighting.

Isn't Kirk kind of a peacemaker anyway?

Don't remember that. Was it a space or blaster fight he was referencing?

Depends, regardless of his peacemaking skills though, Kirk has countless hand-2-hand encounters/wins under his belt.

Edit: Feel free to post examples of Han's hand-2-hand fighting prowess, I don't recall seeing anything really impressive in the movies. I'm all ears.

Han fighting the scout trooper on Endor after a twig snaps alerting the scout to his preasense. Just after he says to Luke and Leia: "Hey... Its me!"

Handling your own against another human isn't as impressive as the other guy's feats.

Ummm... Well the other thing is: Its a TV show, you are shown more of what happens while a film just doesnt have the time frames... I could point out Indy as an example of Han especially in the first film..

Ya. That completely works. Bring in an entirely unrelated character's feats because you can't come up with any for Han. Good debating.

Kirk wins. Han is not a hand-to-hand fighter. He is blasters and a pilot. Even if he fought dirty Kirk can probably counter by the fact he's taken down creatures much, much stronger than anything Han has come across.

Read the Star Wars Novels

Originally posted by Jedireaper
Read the Star Wars Novels

Yep. especally he Han Solo Trilogy and i say he is a good hand to hand fighter seriously he was a stormtrooper.

I'm not doubting Solo can fight, but has he consistently taken on more powerful foes and won, like Kirk has?

Are stormtroopers great hand-2-hand fighters? I've only really seen them fire weapons.

Edit: If we bring in the novels, I'm fairly certain Kirk has many fights under his belt against impossible odds.

I have been thinking about this for a while, I watched the vids someone provided (Robtard?) and I gotta admit that I have changed my mind. Judging Kirk from his previous fights, he'll take Solo.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I have been thinking about this for a while, I watched the vids someone provided (Robtard?) and I gotta admit that I have changed my mind. Judging Kirk from his previous fights, he'll take Solo.

Yeah, they were my post. Did you see that butt-slam maneuver? Totally unorthodox.

Originally posted by Robtard
Yeah, they were my post. Did you see that butt-slam maneuver? Totally unorthodox. Yeah yeah, you convinced me. haermm

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Yeah yeah, you convinced me. haermm


See, there's still hope for you yet.

Originally posted by Robtard
See, there's still hope for you yet. Never again may I be called a fanboy. Or that I wont admit when I am wrong.