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The Rhino may be I believe 8 - 9 times Spidey's strength, but is also the biggest loser in the MU. Spider-man has a great edge in speed and agility, and even if O'Hirn got some respect then it's not like we'd be talking about the Hulk here. So who comes out on top?

Been done use the search.

I did use the search but I never saw this one on it.

Oh well, Rhino for the win then.

Originally posted by Faceman
Oh well, Rhino for the win then.

Originally posted by UKR
I did use the search but I never saw this one on it.

Look what I found..
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=472219

Originally posted by Scoobless

You'll be alright. Just lighten up a bit..

Rhino should win

Parker wins in the comics

Originally posted by Faceman
You'll be alright. Just lighten up a bit..
NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Say it aloud, dudes, say it aloud:

RHINO 9/10 !!

And it's not 10/10 cause Rhino is a moron, that's the only reason.

Originally posted by Scoobless
NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




hoover

Almost anyone can beat Rhino....

Rhino should win this fight 10/10. But, he won't.

rhino loses because he lacks fighting skills and always resorts to his horn instead of his fists.

If Rhino had a brain then he would kick ass.

'Flowers for Rhino' Rhino > Spiderman with ease.

He actually beat Spidey for once, took over half of the city's criminal operations, rewrote Hamlet, and won a restraining order against Peter.
He also deduced Spidey's secret identity.

Originally posted by Jugglenaut
'Flowers for Rhino' Rhino > Spiderman with ease.

He actually beat Spidey for once, took over half of the city's criminal operations, rewrote Hamlet, and won a restraining order against Peter.
He also deduced Spidey's secret identity.

Using math.

Originally posted by Jugglenaut


He actually beat Spidey for once

Actually, he has beaten Spidey more than once, spared his life too. And this kinda things tends to leave Spidey rather traumatized, for whatever the reasons:

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/6791/spidey1gl7.jpg

Dude, you should be really, really GLAD that the Rhino doesn't trounce you every time you fight him, thanks to your Jobber Aura.

Spider-Man with a jobber aura. That's funny.

Fact is, the times when Pete has been touched by Rhino there's been some sort of plot device involved. We know Pete can hurt Rhino, because he's done it numerous times. And without some sort of building falling, innocent to save, or other distractions, Rhino should never lay a hand on Spidey.

Also, CIS isn't thrown out the door in forum battles, so that needs to be taken into consideration.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Spider-Man with a jobber aura. That's funny.

Spider-man is an odd case, sometimes he has a Jobber Aura that defeats guys like Electro, Sandman or Rhino (who are WAY out of his league) and sometimes he jobs to people like Dr. Octopus.

Originally posted by DigiMark007

Fact is, the times when Pete has been touched by Rhino there's been some sort of plot device involved.

Rhino has some degree of superspeed, y'know? He's faster than he looks, even Spidey himself says so.

Originally posted by DigiMark007

We know Pete can hurt Rhino, because he's done it numerous times.

Yeah, for the same reason Captain America can KO Hulk in 2 punches: PIS of the worst kind.

Originally posted by DigiMark007


Also, CIS isn't thrown out the door in forum battles, so that needs to be taken into consideration.

Not even CIS is enough to justify Rhino's loserdom, it has more to do with PIS.

Originally posted by Premutos
Dude, you should be really, really GLAD that the Rhino doesn't trounce you every time you fight him, thanks to your Jobber Aura.

Jobber Aura?

Spider-Man constantly beats Rhino because he's a hell of a lot faster and smarter than him, he uses his own abilities and the environment and puts him down almost every time.

Rhino getting one win out of god knows how many was bound to happen at some point. The smart Rhino story was different as Rhino was virtually a completely different person.

Yeah, I like how a scan of Pete with a broken arm (with no explanation of how it happened) makes up for the countless trouncings Pete has given Rhino. At least be fair folks. If something happens numerous times, it ceases to be PIS and just becomes accepted canon for the characters.

Originally posted by Premutos
Spider-man is an odd case, sometimes he has a Jobber Aura that defeats guys like Electro, Sandman or Rhino (who are WAY out of his league) and sometimes he jobs to people like Dr. Octopus.

He needs a jobber aura to defeat people in his rogues gallery?! That doesn't even make sense. Sandman he beats with his brain. Rhino can simply be pummeled into submission, which is usually what happens.

Originally posted by Premutos
Rhino has some degree of superspeed, y'know? He's faster than he looks, even Spidey himself says so.

Of course he does. He's a comic book character with class 80-ish strength. But Spider-Man can be reasonably depicted as running circles around a ton of villains, many faster than Rhino.

Originally posted by Premutos
Yeah, for the same reason Captain America can KO Hulk in 2 punches: PIS of the worst kind.

Not even CIS is enough to justify Rhino's loserdom, it has more to do with PIS.

We're not talking about Cap. Also, Hulk >>>>>> Rhino in every physical attribute. Rhino is about equal with Hulk's base level and/or Grey Hulk. Any normal version of Hulk is so far beyond Rhino it's not even humorous.

Rhino has the powers required to win...But he is a complete idiot.

Spidey wins more times than not.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Rhino has the powers required to win...But he is a complete idiot.

Spidey wins more times than not.

Anyone with Class 80 strength could win. But that's the point. Sans a plot device, he doesn't touch Spidey.

And Premutos' "Cap beat Hulk in 2 punches" PIS example isn't analogous to this. Spidey's lots stronger than Cap, Rhino's much less durable than Hulk, and Pete doesn't put him down in two punches. It takes time, like it should. But he can, and does, put him down often.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Yeah, I like how a scan of Pete with a broken arm (with no explanation of how it happened) makes up for the countless trouncings Pete has given Rhino. At least be fair folks. If something happens numerous times, it ceases to be PIS and just becomes accepted canon for the characters.

Even if it makes no sense in the 1st place? Then Batman must be top-tier at DC and Squirrel Girl at Marvel, right?

Oh, and Rhino has fought Hulk numerous times (and beaten him at least twice), how come Rhino is supposed to be outta Hulk's league then?

Originally posted by DigiMark007


Rhino can simply be pummeled into submission, which is usually what happens.

I know people around here don't like it much, but I'm gonna point this out once again:

Rhino ---> Class 85
Spider-man ---> Class 25

Originally posted by Premutos
I know people around here don't like it much, but I'm gonna point this out once again:

Rhino ---> Class 85
Spider-man ---> Class 25

So you think that because one guy is stronger than the other he should automatically win?

Originally posted by Premutos
I know people around here don't like it much, but I'm gonna point this out once again:

Rhino ---> Class 85
Spider-man ---> Class 25

Right. That's actually being a bit generous to Spidey.

But you're missing the point. Strength is FAR from the only gauge of power. Let's use this ratio and plug it into a different scenario....take a person who can lift 3.5 times as much as I can (not outlandish...it would need to be a body-builder of some sort but they exist) and has durability to match. Now give me enough speed to dodge him till my heart's content.

Could I beat him? Absolutely. Would it take time, and would he still have a chance of beating me? Sure. But I'd win more often than not, because he wouldn't touch me and I'd have the strength to eventually put him down.

Now give me, say, a baseball bat and it becomes even more lopsided (for Spidey, cars, lampposts, mailboxes, etc. would be the equivalent). Now give me webs that he could break out of, but that would slow him up, and there's yet another advantage.

You made my point. Spidey 8/10, and I feel like that's generous to Rhino.

Originally posted by Scoobless
So you think that because one guy is stronger than the other he should automatically win?

Nope, but it should help. A lot.

I don't think good guys starring in comics named after them should automatically win every fight either, but this happens in DC and Marvel all the time.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Right. That's actually being a bit generous to Spidey.

But you're missing the point. Strength is FAR from the only gauge of power. Let's use this ratio and plug it into a different scenario....take a person who can lift 3.5 times as much as I can (not outlandish...it would need to be a body-builder of some sort but they exist) and has durability to match. Now give me enough speed to dodge him till my heart's content.

Could I beat him? Absolutely. Would it take time, and would he still have a chance of beating me? Sure. But I'd win more often than not, because he wouldn't touch me and I'd have the strength to eventually put him down.

Now give me, say, a baseball bat and it becomes even more lopsided (for Spidey, cars, lampposts, mailboxes, etc. would be the equivalent). Now give me webs that he could break out of, but that would slow him up, and there's yet another advantage.



Yeah, ever wonder why urban utilities all over NY are always EXACTLY where Spidey needs 'em too be? That's called PIS too

But anyway, a guy like the Rhino, who can trade punches with Hulk and resist attacks from the Silver Surfer and cross bigass minefields as if they were nothing is gonna be taken down by a puny class 25? Does that sound any realistic to you? Even if Rhino couldn't touch Spidey (and he can. It has happened numerous times already and according to you then it's not PIS) there it wouldn't be nothing that Spidey could do to hurt the Rhino, would it? Cause Rhino's durability >>> Spidey's strength, by far.

urban utilities are over abundant in new york city......
spidey should have a hard time not finding any.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
urban utilities are over abundant in new york city......
spidey should have a hard time not finding any.

Thing is, he always finds the one he needs placed in the very exact point he needed it to be. I don't live in NYC but that sounds weird to me.

Originally posted by Premutos
Thing is, he always finds the one he needs placed in the very exact point he needed it to be. I don't live in NYC but that sounds weird to me.

Actually it's usually the other way around, he'll see something then come up with a way to use it. Not hope to find something then just stumble into it.

I don't live in NYC either, but seeing as there's more people in that one city than in my entire country I don't doubt that there's a lot of that sort of stuff all over the place.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Actually it's usually the other way around, he'll see something then come up with a way to use it. Not hope to find something then just stumble into it.

I don't live in NYC either, but seeing as there's more people in that one city than in my entire country I don't doubt that there's a lot of that sort of stuff all over the place.

They should give Spidey as a new power total control over cities, to make him more like this other other hero he inspired. Namely, Jack Hawksmoor.

Originally posted by Premutos
Even if it makes no sense in the 1st place? Then Batman must be top-tier at DC and Squirrel Girl at Marvel, right?

Oh, and Rhino has fought Hulk numerous times (and beaten him at least twice), how come Rhino is supposed to be outta Hulk's league then?



I know people around here don't like it much, but I'm gonna point this out once again:

Rhino ---> Class 85
Spider-man ---> Class 25

What a moron....You are totally missing the point.

Originally posted by Endrict Nuul
What a moron....You are totally missing the point.

Enlighten me then, genius.

Originally posted by Premutos
Enlighten me then, genius.



Just read what everyone else has pointed out to you. You're just going on my ignore list for being a moron and other reasons.

Originally posted by Endrict Nuul
Just read what everyone else has pointed out to you.

So you ain't able to come up with reasons by your own, huh?

Originally posted by Endrict Nuul

You're just going on my ignore list for being a moron and other reasons.

Yeah yeah yeah, cry me a river, ok?

Originally posted by Premutos
Yeah, ever wonder why urban utilities all over NY are always EXACTLY where Spidey needs 'em too be? That's called PIS too

It's a city. This argument is stupid. It's like saying you must be telepathic to have found so many toys while walking through a toy store.

Originally posted by Premutos
But anyway, a guy like the Rhino, who can trade punches with Hulk and resist attacks from the Silver Surfer and cross bigass minefields as if they were nothing is gonna be taken down by a puny class 25? Does that sound any realistic to you? Even if Rhino couldn't touch Spidey (and he can. It has happened numerous times already and according to you then it's not PIS) there it wouldn't be nothing that Spidey could do to hurt the Rhino, would it? Cause Rhino's durability >>> Spidey's strength, by far.

...none of which does anything to counter the mathematical model I set up in my earlier analogy, and how it shows that not only can Spidey win but should be the favorite.

....


To everyone else:

He's beginning to resort to insults and sarcasm. Either it's troll tactics, self-delusion, or simple immaturity. At this point, it's everyone else arguing to ourselves while Premutos ignores us. So until he shows a modicum of respect, or the ability to actually address others' points, I'd suggest ignoring him. Not necessarily with the ignore button, just in general.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
I'd suggest ignoring him. Not necessarily with the ignore button, just in general.

Or we could just get torches an' pitchforks an' burn 'im an' stuff .... worked on Frankenstein's monster ... sort of.

shrug

Originally posted by Scoobless
Or we could just get torches an' pitchforks an' burn 'im an' stuff .... worked on Frankenstein's monster ... sort of.

shrug

Whatever works.

Er, who have I insulted?

Or which point have I ignored, for that matter? You want me to jump on the bangwagon and stop going against the general consensus, cause this is the wisest thing to do on comic-releated boards? Fine, Spidey wins. Whatever.

Ok

Originally posted by Premutos
You want me to jump on the bangwagon and stop going against the general consensus, cause this is the wisest thing to do on comic-releated boards?

Erm, no. That's not what I was saying at all. Though this is how to change someone's words around to suit your purposes and obscure the original meaning.

You're not ignoring people, you're ignoring arguments and making the same points without addressings the points of others. It's pointless to debate against such people. Thus, my suggestion to ignore you. And sarcasm ("enlighten me, genius" can be just as insulting. Don't try to wiggle out of showing respect for others by changing the definition of bad behavior to include only things you haven't done.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Erm, no. That's not what I was saying at all. Though this is how to change someone's words around to suit your purposes and obscure the original meaning.

No, that's how a lot of message boards (especially if they're comic-related) work. I should know already, sometimes I've been banned for less.

Originally posted by DigiMark007


You're not ignoring people, you're ignoring arguments and making the same points without addressings the points of others. It's pointless to debate against such people. Thus, my suggestion to ignore you. And sarcasm ("enlighten me, genius" can be just as insulting.

And you're ignoring that the guy I was replying that called me a moron first, but ok. BTW, 'mathematical model'??

I gotta agree with Premutos on one thing. He flamed him first and wasn't even mentioned, why is that?

Originally posted by Premutos
No, that's how a lot of message boards (especially if they're comic-related) work. I should know already, sometimes I've been banned for less.

So message boards work by taking others' quotes out of context? Is that really what you're saying here? You might want to re-think that, or at least rise above it rather than taking part in it yourself.

Originally posted by Premutos
And you're ignoring that the guy I was replying that called me a moron first, but ok. BTW, 'mathematical model'??

Actually, "moron" came after the comment I quoted of yours that was an implied insult. It doesn't excuse his words, but neither does finger-pointing absolve you of blame.

And yeah, the little analogy I set up with the strength classes. You read it, right?

Originally posted by Premutos
Er, who have I insulted?

Or which point have I ignored, for that matter? You want me to jump on the bangwagon and stop going against the general consensus, cause this is the wisest thing to do on comic-releated boards? Fine, Spidey wins. Whatever.

Sorry, but Digi said we're not supposed to talk to you.

Originally posted by Faceman
Sorry, but Digi said we're not supposed to talk to you.

Damnit faceman ... you're not even supposed to talk to him to tell him you're not supposed to talk to him ... how difficult is that to understand?



Go sit in the corner!

Ironically I'm already sitting on a corner. I'll just put a dunce cap on...

Stop talking to me, I'm a Rhino apologist

Originally posted by DigiMark007
So message boards work by taking others' quotes out of context? Is that really what you're saying here? You might want to re-think that, or at least rise above it rather than taking part in it yourself.

Yep, that's also true. But I was talking of how not arguing against the general consensus is the the best thing to do on message boards to avoid getting banned.

So if I ever start being sarcastic and/or pointing that Rhino should be able to win some fights again just let me know, ok? And I'll stop right then, this is an intorerably disruptive behaviour and I'd hate to end up breaking the Internet.

Originally posted by DigiMark007

Actually, "moron" came after the comment I quoted of yours that was an implied insult. It doesn't excuse his words, but neither does finger-pointing absolve you of blame.

Actually, it did not, but who cares?


Originally posted by DigiMark007

And yeah, the little analogy I set up with the strength classes. You read it, right?

Yep, but I wouldn't call that a 'mathematical model' by any stench of the imagination, y'know? That's why I was asking.

What the hell? Premutos didn't insult anyone. And for being called a moron, his response "enlighten me then, genius" was a rather polite one.

Anyways, Spider-Man wins, every time.

...never said you did anything bannable there, Pre. We're not that harsh around here. Just that there's better ways to debate.

Originally posted by Premutos
Yeah, ever wonder why urban utilities all over NY are always EXACTLY where Spidey needs 'em too be? That's called PIS too

But anyway, a guy like the Rhino, who can trade punches with Hulk and resist attacks from the Silver Surfer and cross bigass minefields as if they were nothing is gonna be taken down by a puny class 25? Does that sound any realistic to you? Even if Rhino couldn't touch Spidey (and he can. It has happened numerous times already and according to you then it's not PIS) there it wouldn't be nothing that Spidey could do to hurt the Rhino, would it? Cause Rhino's durability >>> Spidey's strength, by far.

You should know that weaker characters like batman, CA, etc. have been hurting super strong guys since before we were born. Should it be done? Maybe (depends on whether a character is human or not).

There are high end feats and low ones. So if you take Rhino's high end durability feats then you must take spidey's high end strength feats too. Spidey has many class 50 and above feats for him to say that his strength should be higher than class 25. Hell he has multiple class 100 feats as well.

Also I saw a little 7 year old boy serious hurt a man who can lift more than 200lbs over his head with a sharp kick to the shin (he had on boots) while he was sitting down. And the boy can't even lift 50lbs over his head. Thus the man is more than 4x stronger. Rhino is less than 4x stronger than Spidey (based off many feats).

Plus you forget than Spidey can and will use lamposts, cars, etc. like a weaker person would use a bat against someone stronger.

And I caught you in a double standard. You are saying that Spidey shouldn't hurt Rhino because of the things Rhino endured. But you also say that Spidey should get hit since he has been hit numerous times. This is a double standard. If you say that Spidey shouldn't hurt Rhino then you should accept that he won't get hit either.

Originally posted by h1a8
Spidey has many class 50 and above feats

Hell he has multiple class 100 feats as well.

No he doesn't.

Originally posted by Scoobless
No he doesn't.

lol

Originally posted by h1a8
Spidey has many class 50 and above feats for him to say that his strength should be higher than class 25. Hell he has multiple class 100 feats as well.



Sure.........

Originally posted by Scoobless
No he doesn't.

Oh yes he does.

Rule #1
Never say it isn't true if you truly don't know.
For it would be lying. (You are saying you know when you don't).

He has lifted or supported multistory buildings thrice.

He has lifted a tank.

He alone has lifted a huge stone plug that him and she-hulk struggled lifting before.

Caught a 10ton helicopter from a 200-300ft fall in about a 1.5ft or less stopping distance (this feat is way over 100 tons).

Lifted a huge water tower that not only weighs a lot but has thousands of gallons of water in it.

Easily catches a car thrown by Hulk (has to match the strength of the throw to catch it).

There's more.

Ok, so if there no problem with me arguing in favour of Rhino again...

Originally posted by h1a8
You should know that weaker characters like batman, CA, etc. have been hurting super strong guys since before we were born. Should it be done? Maybe (depends on whether a character is human or not).


True dat, in fact we have a thread going about all this:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f77/t485393.html

Originally posted by h1a8

There are high end feats and low ones. So if you take Rhino's high end durability feats then you must take spidey's high end strength feats too. Spidey has many class 50 and above feats for him to say that his strength should be higher than class 25. Hell he has multiple class 100 feats as well.

Wait, are you telling me that Spidey should be treated or is supposed to be in the Class 100 range? If so he'd be seen trading punches with the likes of classic Hulk, Thing, Colossus, Juggernaut, etc and I don't think I've ever seen such a thing happens. If in some comics he appears performing Class 100 or 50 feats this is more likely a f*uck-up from some writers that never cared to do the math. Now, in Rhino's case, he's supposed to have insane durability and strenght, otherwise what would be the point of this character in the 1st place?

Originally posted by h1a8


Also I saw a little 7 year old boy serious hurt a man who can lift more than 200lbs over his head with a sharp kick to the shin (he had on boots) while he was sitting down. And the boy can't even lift 50lbs over his head.

Ok but I wonder what would have happened in case the grown-up dude decided to fight back

Originally posted by h1a8

Plus you forget than Spidey can and will use lamposts, cars, etc. like a weaker person would use a bat against someone stronger.

Yep, just like Rhino could start tossing cars arond and putting innocent bystanders at risk just to distract Spidey's attention.

Originally posted by h1a8

If you say that Spidey shouldn't hurt Rhino then you should accept that he won't get hit either.

Actually it was Digi who said that if something happens numerous times then it ceases being PIS, I was just following his logic but I don't quite agree with that. Anyways, it's been stablished since his 1st appearance that Rhino SHOULD be able to hit Spidey:

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/9117/rhin10zc6.jpg

Otherwise what would be the point of creating a villain like that?

1960's Spidey that underestimates every opponent ftw!

Actually, if we took Pete's first 50 issues or so, we'd have him lower than many street levelers, and certainly benath any of his rogues, who almost always punked him during their first meeting. It wasn't a good time for him. I can dig that issue that you ripped the scan out of if you want...I'm guessing Spidey wins eventually. Heck, the punch didn't even seem to hurt him much.

Once again, though, you're engaging in confirmation bias and showing only panels that support your cause.

And you conceded that the little kid (Spidey) could hurt the much larger man (Rhino). Good job. What you overlooked in the analogy is that the kid would be many times faster than the man in order to make it true to the comics. He'd also have weapons. Could the man still win, and could he occasionally hit the kid? Absolutely. But when you can run circles around a character, it changes the element. And make no mistake, Spidey can and has done it multiple times.

Fight any villain enough and both sides will get wins. No one's saying Rhino is so far from Spidey that he doesn't have a chance. But he'd clearly lose the majority, because that's what always happens.

Originally posted by UKR
The Rhino may be I believe 8 - 9 times Spidey's strength, but is also the biggest loser in the MU. Spider-man has a great edge in speed and agility, and even if O'Hirn got some respect then it's not like we'd be talking about the Hulk here. So who comes out on top?


Spidey...



Spidey has bested the Rhino many times,


he is simply too smart and fast for Rhino

Originally posted by DigiMark007
I can dig that issue that you ripped the scan out of if you want...I'm guessing Spidey wins eventually.

Man, OF COURSE Spidey wins in the end. Not only comic books are all about good guys always winning in the end, but in the Comics Code Authority era it was MANDATORY as well.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Once again, though, you're engaging in confirmation bias and showing only panels that support your cause.

I don't quite understand your point here, should I start showing panels that support yours instead? I'm not used to debate like that, I thought that providing evidence to support my oppinions was enough

Originally posted by DigiMark007
But when you can run circles around a character, it changes the element. And make no mistake, Spidey can and has done it multiple times.

Just like Rhino has proved that he can hit Spidey multiple times as well. Not to mention that just the expansive wave produced by Rhino stomping on the floor could probably toss Spidey all the way to New Jersey, so he wouldn't even have to hit him to win this fight.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
But he'd clearly lose the majority, because that's what always happens.

Big deal when all their fights take place in comic books named 'The Amazing/Spectacular Spider-man' instead of 'The Rampaging Rhino' or something along those lines.

So you concede that Spider-Man usually wins, and your defense is that he's in his own title, rather than Rhino's? Doesn't change the events.

Also, stomp him to New Jersey? Embellishment. To an absurd degree, in this case.

Damn bottom of page.


Originally posted by ScarletSpeed
Spidey...



Spidey has bested the Rhino many times,


he is simply too smart and fast for Rhino

Originally posted by Premutos
Even if it makes no sense in the 1st place? Then Batman must be top-tier at DC and Squirrel Girl at Marvel, right?

Oh, and Rhino has fought Hulk numerous times (and beaten him at least twice), how come Rhino is supposed to be outta Hulk's league then?



I know people around here don't like it much, but I'm gonna point this out once again:

Rhino ---> Class 85
Spider-man ---> Class 25

spidey is class 10 again ! lol marvel screwed up his upgraded powers ...

and spidey should win , if cap gut punch ko hulk why cant spidey do the same to rhino

BTW I wonder how many times Spidey has punked classic Hulk in the last 40+ years. Cause, y'know, classic Hulk when not enraged was in the same strenght range than Rhino (probably weaker) but w/o superspeed and (just like Rhino) wasn't exactly a tactical genius either.

I'm sure that if this thread was Spidey vs classic Hulk/Colossus/Thing the general consensus would be very different, but since Rhino apparently deserves no respect...

Originally posted by Premutos
BTW I wonder how many times Spidey has punked classic Hulk in the last 40+ years. Cause, y'know, classic Hulk when not enraged was in the same strenght range than Rhino (probably weaker) but w/o superspeed and (just like Rhino) wasn't exactly a tactical genius either.

I'm sure that if this thread was Spidey vs classic Hulk/Colossus/Thing the general consensus would be very different, but since Rhino apparently deserves no respect...

actually hulk calm starts out as class 90 and increases strength whereas rhino is class 80 ,period

Originally posted by DigiMark007
So you concede that Spider-Man usually wins, and your defense is that he's in his own title, rather than Rhino's? Doesn't change the events.

Actually, that's pretty much the only reason why Spidey happens to win fights against some guys from his Rogues Gallery he has no bussiness fighting in the 1st place. And not that I have anything against Spidey but yes, he does have a Jobber Aura indeed. Otherwise how do you explain that Electro, being able to do this all the time and therefore being capable of winning any fight against Spidey at the speed of thought

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/1913/el1fn3.jpg

Just keeps FORGETTING that he can do such a thing? For the same reason Darkseid forgets all about the Omega Effect when fighting Batman perhaps?

Thing is, Spidey's Jobber Aura is not as massive as other big name's and a lot of times he ends up getting punked by weaker opponents, so one thing compensates the other.

Originally posted by ankur29
actually hulk calm starts out as class 90 and increases strength whereas rhino is class 80 ,period

I may be wrong on this, but AFAIK classic Hulk started out as Class 70.

Originally posted by h1a8
Rule #1
Never say it isn't true if you truly don't know.
For it would be lying. (You are saying you know when you don't).

Nope, it's only lying if you know what you're saying is false.

Originally posted by h1a8
He has lifted or supported multistory buildings thrice.

He has braced support beams while webbing holds stuff together a couple of times, he's never, ever, lifted a building.

Originally posted by h1a8
He has lifted a tank.

Don't know about this, when did this happen?

Originally posted by h1a8
He alone has lifted a huge stone plug that him and she-hulk struggled lifting before.

That was explained during the story ... did you even read it?

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/5818/90613992lz7.th.jpg http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/6362/69365807my2.th.jpg

Originally posted by h1a8
Caught a 10ton helicopter from a 200-300ft fall in about a 1.5ft or less stopping distance (this feat is way over 100 tons).

Was the weight of the helicopter ever stated? or the speed at which it was falling? or the actual distance it fell? (or are you just guessing?)

Originally posted by h1a8
Lifted a huge water tower that not only weighs a lot but has thousands of gallons of water in it.

When? where?

Originally posted by h1a8
Easily catches a car thrown by Hulk (has to match the strength of the throw to catch it).

When? where?

___________________


Spider-Man has no class 100 feats.

Originally posted by Premutos
how do you explain that Electro, being able to do this all the time and therefore being capable of winning any fight against Spidey at the speed of thought

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/1913/el1fn3.jpg

Just keeps FORGETTING that he can do such a thing? For the same reason Darkseid forgets all about the Omega Effect when fighting Batman perhaps?

Did you not read this story either? This happened during a one time power up of Electro. Electro risked dying by absorbing a stupid amount of electrical energy, I doubt he plans on doing that every time he leaves the house.

In fact that story ended with Electro exploding due to him trying to contain too much energy.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Did you not read this story either? This happened during a one time power up of Electro. Electro risked dying by absorbing a stupid amount of electrical energy, I doubt he plans on doing that every time he leaves the house.

Nope, it's you who didn't read the story. He only had to do it ONCE and the power-up was supposed to be permanent.

Originally posted by Scoobless

In fact that story ended with Electro exploding due to him trying to contain too much energy.

Didn't happen like that either, he exploded cause he dropped himself into the Hudson river. Go read the stroy arc, it happened in ASM #422-425.

Originally posted by Premutos
I may be wrong on this, but AFAIK classic Hulk started out as Class 70.

Grey Hulk (the weakest incarnation) starts out at 70-75 tons. Savage starts at 90tons. the thing is, its not PIS for Rhino to feel even Classic 10ton Spidey's punches as Rhino is about 8 x stronger, and Spiderman is shown to be hurt by punches from Daredevil and Captain America who Spidey is over 20 times stronger than. So if SM goes ultimate Spider on Rhino, he will be hitting him with 10 ton punches/kicks repeatedly and get worn down. If Rhino gets his hands on Spidey, though, its game over for Mr.Parker
I give it 7/10 to Spiderman

Originally posted by Premutos
Nope, it's you who didn't read the story. He only had to do it ONCE and the power-up was supposed to be permanent.

Maybe it was "supposed to be" permanent, but it didn't turn out that way, after he exploded his next appearance was back to regular levels.

Originally posted by Premutos
Didn't happen like that either, he exploded cause he dropped himself into the Hudson river. Go read the stroy arc, it happened in ASM #422-425.

He was about to explode either way, the river had nothing to do with it.

Originally posted by BUSTER1
So if SM goes ultimate Spider on Rhino, he will be hitting him with 10 ton punches/kicks repeatedly and get worn down.

Dunno, here he doesn't seem to be KO-ing Rhino at all:

http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/8264/rhin11yo3.jpg

Originally posted by Scoobless
Maybe it was "supposed to be" permanent, but it didn't turn out that way, after he exploded his next appearance was back to regular levels.

Yeah, but only cause the next writer probably didn't know about the power-up. Where has it been stablished that he's back to regular levels? I haven't read any issue that says that.

Originally posted by Scoobless

He was about to explode either way, the river had nothing to do with it.

Yep, cause he overloaded himself voluntarily to produce some bigass explosion, that's right.

Kind of a weird post. The forums is usually used to pit people who havent fought a thousand times against each other. Rhino is a regular in Spidey's rogue gallery. This is like a "Who'd win, Wolverine or Sabretooth?" post. Thats said, Rhino is just too 1 dimensional.

Originally posted by Premutos
Dunno, here he doesn't seem to be KO-ing Rhino at all:

http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/8264/rhin11yo3.jpg

Well check these scans then Premutos.

Originally posted by BUSTER1
Well check these scans then Premutos.

unfortunately I can't get the scans to work-but they're from the
'Brand New Spiderman Respect Thread' and show Spidey beating Rhino unconscious, even though he is in a weakened state

Originally posted by ankur29
actually hulk calm starts out as class 90 and increases strength whereas rhino is class 80 ,period Originally posted by Premutos
I may be wrong on this, but AFAIK classic Hulk started out as Class 70.

In recent times (Planet Sakar) it was stated that the Huk started out more powerful than ever. In an issue of the Fantastic 4, Bruce is seen grey once again after he is upgraded by having yet another gamma bomb blew up in his face.

He goes to Sakar and soaks up the energy of another nuke which kills his wife Caiera. Rides back to earth on top of the stone ship soaking up yet more rads from space. Technically he should be far above 90 tons.

Oh and Spider-Man is simply too fast for the lumbering brute named Rhino, the only way I see Rhino ever winning is through a freak environmental attack.

Spidey 8/10

I thought Spider-man was class 10?

Originally posted by UKR
I thought Spider-man was class 10?

He had a couple of upgrades which resulted in his strength being 20tons-
After recent events his power was downgraded to his classic levels. In this Thread however those upgrades are still in effect.

Originally posted by BUSTER1
In this Thread however those upgrades are still in effect.

So you're going to tell the creator of this thread what the details of his thread are?

Originally posted by batdude123
So you're going to tell the creator of this thread what the details of his thread are?

oops I messed up- i was thinking about the Ult.captain America vs 616Spiderman thread-where Spdey still has all his upgrades

Premutos, regardless of whether or not you like Rhino, the appropriate way to debate isn't to decide who you want to win, then only focus on those arguments that seem to favor him. It's not about who "wins" the argument, but determining who would actually win by rationally acknowledging both sides. I and others have conceded that Spidey would need a lot of time to put down Rhino, and that Rhino could take a few. We're not irrationally throwing ourselves toward Spidey just because we favor him in this fight. It's that sort of mindlessly competitive debating that is the bane of legitimately constructive discussion.

Also, Spidey punching Rhino and not knocking him out means nothing. Of course a few punches wouldn't KO him. He has put him down, though I realize you like posting only individual panels that support your argument (not even pages, but just 1-2 panels). Second, bringing up Electro fights in a thread that has nothing to do with him...doesn't really count for anything toward Rhino. Maybe you're right and Spidey only wins via PIS (also untrue), but even if you're right, it's about Electro, not Rhino.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
We're not irrationally throwing ourselves toward Spidey just because we favor him in this fight.

We're not? .... you have to tell me these things before they become an issue, damnit, now I'm going to have to actually think about who might win this fight.

i'd go spidey with the slight 6/10 edge
only because of his agility and rhino's stupidity

Originally posted by Premutos



Wait, are you telling me that Spidey should be treated or is supposed to be in the Class 100 range? If so he'd be seen trading punches with the likes of classic Hulk, Thing, Colossus, Juggernaut, etc and I don't think I've ever seen such a thing happens. If in some comics he appears performing Class 100 or 50 feats this is more likely a f*uck-up from some writers that never cared to do the math. Now, in Rhino's case, he's supposed to have insane durability and strenght, otherwise what would be the point of this character in the 1st place?

What? Do you know the point I was trying to make? My point is that you were using Rhino's high end durability feats and Spidey's non high strength feats to show that Spidey can't hurt Rhino. I was merely pointing out the double standard. In no way am I arguing that Spidey should be stronger than class 10.

It is a fact that a weaker being can hurt a stronger being. Based off Spidey's history Rhino is no more than 4x stronger than Spidey.

Originally posted by Scoobless
We're not? .... you have to tell me these things before they become an issue, damnit, now I'm going to have to actually think about who might win this fight.



You must have not gotten the memo.

Originally posted by Premutos
Ok but I wonder what would have happened in case the grown-up dude decided to fight back



Yep, just like Rhino could start tossing cars arond and putting innocent bystanders at risk just to distract Spidey's attention.



Actually it was Digi who said that if something happens numerous times then it ceases being PIS, I was just following his logic but I don't quite agree with that. Anyways, it's been stablished since his 1st appearance that Rhino SHOULD be able to hit Spidey:

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/9117/rhin10zc6.jpg

Otherwise what would be the point of creating a villain like that?

PIS has something to do with statistics as well as logic (not to be mistaken for science). Many think PIS only just deals with statistics alone.

That fact that SM has SS says that he never should get hit. Doesn't matter if he got hit 999/1000 times. This is logic. Also using statistics, the ratio that Spidey has dodged super fast attacks to getting hit is greater than 10:1. So both logic and statistics point out that Rhino shouldn't hit Spidey.

Originally posted by BUSTER1
unfortunately I can't get the scans to work-but they're from the
'Brand New Spiderman Respect Thread' and show Spidey beating Rhino unconscious, even though he is in a weakened state

You mean this one?

http://img510.imageshack.us/my.php?image=28112qy.gif

Man, that makes as much sense as Captain America KO-ing the Hulk. The day Spidey starts beating up people in the 85 class range DIFFERENT THAN RHINO or other jobbers alike and on a regular basis I'll take that one as valid proof but meanwhile as far as I'm concerned that's PIS of the worst kind.

It's not the character's fault that Marvel has decided long ago and for some unknown reason that him, Mr. Hyde, the Wrecking Crew, Absorbing Man, Whirlwind, Graviton etc deserve no respect and must be treated as jobbers in any occasion, despite their power levels and stats and regardless of if it makes sense or not. Don't take lazy writing as proof of anything.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Premutos, regardless of whether or not you like Rhino, the appropriate way to debate isn't to decide who you want to win, then only focus on those arguments that seem to favor him. It's not about who "wins" the argument, but determining who would actually win by rationally acknowledging both sides. I and others have conceded that Spidey would need a lot of time to put down Rhino, and that Rhino could take a few. We're not irrationally throwing ourselves toward Spidey just because we favor him in this fight. It's that sort of mindlessly competitive debating that is the bane of legitimately constructive discussion.

And you think that I'm irrationally throwing myself toward Rhino or that I don't sincerely believe that he'd win? Even when I was a kid and saw superheroes beating up far superior opponents in comics (just like it happens with Spidey and Rhino) I used to think to myself "BOLLOCKS! This is pretty much like the Roadrunner show, where Wile E. Coyote always loses simply cause he's not allowed to win". And know what? Nowadays, 20+ years later, I still think this kinda stuff is bollocks.

Originally posted by DigiMark007

Also, Spidey punching Rhino and not knocking him out means nothing. Of course a few punches wouldn't KO him. He has put him down, though I realize you like posting only individual panels that support your argument (not even pages, but just 1-2 panels).

Well, I used to be on a 56K connection when I uploaded most of my scans and ImageShack worked funny for me when trying to upload images larger than 200 or 300k. As for bringing up Electro I was trying to prove that Spidey indeed does have a Jobber Aura (and which superhero doesn't?), which is easier to demonstrate using that example.

Originally posted by Premutos
You mean this one?

http://img510.imageshack.us/my.php?image=28112qy.gif

Man, that makes as much sense as Captain America KO-ing the Hulk. The day Spidey starts beating up people in the 85 class range DIFFERENT THAN RHINO or other jobbers alike and on a regular basis I'll take that one as valid proof but meanwhile as far as I'm concerned that's PIS of the worst kind.

It's not the character's fault that Marvel has decided long ago and for some unknown reason that him, Mr. Hyde, the Wrecking Crew, Absorbing Man, Whirlwind, Graviton etc deserve no respect and must be treated as jobbers in any occasion, despite their power levels and stats and regardless of if it makes sense or not. Don't take lazy writing as proof of anything.

That is very different to Cap knocking out Hulk. Cap is peak human listed as being able to lift 800 lbs -Hulk is class 100. Cap was shown to knock out Hulk with about 3 punches. Also this was shown to be a memory of a grieving Spiderman (upset over his idol Cap's death) so it probably wasn't wholly accurate.
Spiderman is stronnger than Cap 25x as he is 10ton strength. And he was hitting Rhino multiple times. As tough as Rhino is he isn't really in the Hulk's league, and doesn't have the Hulk's healing factor. So the cumulative effect of rapid fire punches from someone weaker than him will affect him in a way it wouldn't affect Hulk.

Originally posted by h1a8
What? Do you know the point I was trying to make?

Yes, I know the point you were trying to make: To dimiss Rhino's high-end showings as PIS based on the fact that Spidey has some high-end showings that don't make any sense to begin with. The difference is that Rhino shows insane strenght and durability ON A REGULAR BASIS whereas Spidey has only had a few (if any) class 50 or 100 feats in his 40+ years of history.

Originally posted by h1a8

Based off Spidey's history Rhino is no more than 4x stronger than Spidey.

Before being told on this thread that Spidey is now Class 10 I used to believe that he was still Class 25, so if you wanna consider that Rhino is no more than 4x stronger than him that's ok to me.

Originally posted by h1a8
Also using statistics, the ratio that Spidey has dodged super fast attacks to getting hit is greater than 10:1. So both logic and statistics point out that Rhino shouldn't hit Spidey.

Statistics based of feats like Spidey dodging attacks at lightspeed from Cyclops and stuff? That's bollocks too, in comics Spidey dodges a ton of attacks he shouldn't be able to.

Originally posted by Premutos
.



Statistics based of feats like Spidey dodging attacks at lightspeed from Cyclops and stuff? That's bollocks too, in comics Spidey dodges a ton of attacks he shouldn't be able to.

What does Spidey dodge, that he shouldn't be able to?

Originally posted by BUSTER1
That is very different to Cap knocking out Hulk. Cap is peak human listed as being able to lift 800 lbs -Hulk is class 100. Cap was shown to knock out Hulk with about 3 punches. Also this was shown to be a memory of a grieving Spiderman (upset over his idol Cap's death) so it probably wasn't wholly accurate.
Spiderman is stronnger than Cap 25x as he is 10ton strength. And he was hitting Rhino multiple times. As tough as Rhino is he isn't really in the Hulk's league, and doesn't have the Hulk's healing factor. So the cumulative effect of rapid fire punches from someone weaker than him will affect him in a way it wouldn't affect Hulk.

Ok, if you want me to admit that Cap KO-ing Hulk makes EVEN LESS SENSE it's all right. But I still wanna see proof of Spidey beating up guys in the 80+ class range in H2H combat, and I mean more or less respected characters (ala Colossus, Thing, classic Hulk, Juggernaut, etc) and not the usual jobbers. Oh, and on a regular basis.

Hulk has had a coupla power-ups in these years and I concede that Rhino ain't in his league anymore. But then again, who is? Apparently Hulk now can make short work of guys like Dr. Strange and Sentry so I think current Hulk is probably on a league of his own.

Originally posted by BUSTER1
What does Spidey dodge, that he shouldn't be able to?

Ufff, lotsa things! I've seen Spidey dodging stuff launched at him at lightspeed or at the speed of thought and Spidey's body simply doesn't move that fast, no matter if his Spider-sense warns him or not.

Originally posted by Premutos
Ok, if you want me to admit that Cap KO-ing Hulk makes EVEN LESS SENSE it's all right. But I still wanna see proof of Spidey beating up guys in the 80+ class range in H2H combat, and I mean more or less respected characters (ala Colossus, Thing, classic Hulk, Juggernaut, etc) and not the usual jobbers. Oh, and on a regular basis.

Hulk has had a coupla power-ups in these years and I concede that Rhino ain't in his league anymore. But then again, who is? Apparently Hulk now can make short work of guys like Dr. Strange and Sentry so I think current Hulk is probably on a league of his own.



Ufff, lotsa things! I've seen Spidey dodging stuff launched at him at lightspeed or at the speed of thought and Spidey's body simply doesn't move that fast, no matter if his Spider-sense warns him or not.

Rhino isn't really in Classic Savage Hulk's league. HUlk's ability to get stronger with anger means he quickly reaches a level that is too high for Rhino to be a real threat-BUT for the purpose of the stories where Rhino fights Hulk he is shown to give Hulk a good fight.
As for the others you mentioned, Juggernaut is way out of Rhino's league, as he is on par strength wise with an enraged Hulk and completely invulnerable to physical attack (in a correctly written story even WWH shouyldn't be able to hurt him) Colossus and Thing are heroes who Spiderman hasn't had reason to go all out maximum Spider on and they're both stronger and more durable than Mr.O'Hirn
And who are you to say how quick Spiderman's body can move.

Originally posted by Premutos
Yes, I know the point you were trying to make: To dimiss Rhino's high-end showings as PIS based on the fact that Spidey has some high-end showings that don't make any sense to begin with. The difference is that Rhino shows insane strenght and durability ON A REGULAR BASIS whereas Spidey has only had a few (if any) class 50 or 100 feats in his 40+ years of history. No! That is not the point I'm trying to make. What I'm saying is that Spidey can indeed hurt Rhino. This is because if we take his high end durability feats as valid then we have to take Spidey's high end strength feats as valid too. Only fair. And Rhino doesn't ever show insane strength and durability on a regular basis. What are you smoking? Do you know what insane strength and durability in comics is? It's certainly nothing Rhino has ever done. Rhino has never shown strength over 100tons and never has shown more durability than Thing, Colossus, Namor, or any class 100 being period. Spidey and other weaker than Rhino beings hurt Rhino ON A REGULAR BASIS. CA hurt him by hitting him in the face. Remember?


The bios say classic Spidey is class 10 but many here don't go on bios alone but on panel evidence. And on panel evidence says that classic Spidey is class 25 on average (class 10 at weakest and class 90-100 at strongest).


He has SS silly. It tells him to dodge before the attack is launch. Thus he can potentially dodge anything that's not mega in area.

Originally posted by BUSTER1
Rhino isn't really in Classic Savage Hulk's league. HUlk's ability to get stronger with anger means he quickly reaches a level that is too high for Rhino to be a real threat-BUT for the purpose of the stories where Rhino fights Hulk he is shown to give Hulk a good fight.
As for the others you mentioned, Juggernaut is way out of Rhino's league, as he is on par strength wise with an enraged Hulk and completely invulnerable to physical attack (in a correctly written story even WWH shouyldn't be able to hurt him) Colossus and Thing are heroes who Spiderman hasn't had reason to go all out maximum Spider on and they're both stronger and more durable than Mr.O'Hirn

So to make a long story short, no proof of Spidey beating up dudes in the 80+ ton range and H2H if they're not well-known jobbers, hmm? BTW, Rhino has fought all these guys except Colossus (oh well, and Juggernaut was sorta depowered when he fought him, truth be told). What about the 70+ ton range? Ares, Blob, Doc Samson, etc?

Originally posted by BUSTER1

And who are you to say how quick Spiderman's body can move.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I never expected Spidey to be on a level with the Flash. Has Spidey gained insane superspeed somehow and no one told me?

Originally posted by Premutos
So to make a long story short, no proof of Spidey beating up dudes in the 80+ ton range and H2H if they're not well-known jobbers, hmm? BTW, Rhino has fought all these guys except Colossus (oh well, and Juggernaut was sorta depowered when he fought him, truth be told). What about the 70+ ton range? Ares, Blob, Doc Samson, etc?

What are you not getting. When he fought Rhino he went all out. He never did against Colossus or Thing. When Rhino gave Hulk etc.. a run for their money it was a very high showing for him. One thing that Spiderman has over Rhino is intelligence. Rhino is basically an idiot. The Thing, who is similar level strength wise (but more durable ) is more formidable than Rhino, as he is a lot more intelligent. Due to being thick Rhino doesn't try to alter his strategy against Spidey and so leaves himself open to the maximum spider attack

Maybe I'm wrong, but I never expected Spidey to be on a level with the Flash. Has Spidey gained insane superspeed somehow and no one told me?

Scans please

Like I said

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/7751/pwj2rm6.th.jpg





That great "durability and strength" of his didn't help much here....So once again Rhino gets beaten by someone with brains.

Originally posted by Endrict Nuul
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/7751/pwj2rm6.th.jpg





That great "durability and strength" of his didn't help much here....So once again Rhino gets beaten by someone with brains.

Dude, thanks A LOT for bringing up the Punisher to this discussion. And to think I was starting to believe you were gonna put me on your ignore list for real...

Looky here:

http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/2581/punisher2qj0.jpg

Dude, where is the agility? The Spider-sense? The brains? Anything? Don't tell me a guy like The Russian (who doesn't even have superspeed or enhanced reflexes) just nailed Spidey like that!

And just for kicks here is another scan from Punisher - War Journal, the series you got that one from:

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/3103/punisher3db8.jpg

Tiger Shark ---> Class 75 (when in water)
Punisher ---> 50+years old peak human (?)

Originally posted by BUSTER1
Scans please

Like I said

How do you like this one, it's Spidey dodging LIGHT:

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/6760/002wg4.jpg

Originally posted by h1a8
No! That is not the point I'm trying to make. What I'm saying is that Spidey can indeed hurt Rhino. This is because if we take his high end durability feats as valid then we have to take Spidey's high end strength feats as valid too. Only fair.

True, this board has a rule about people always fighting at their maximun potential. The problem is that it also has a rule forbidding PIS.

Originally posted by h1a8

And Rhino doesn't ever show insane strength and durability on a regular basis. What are you smoking? Do you know what insane strength and durability in comics is? It's certainly nothing Rhino has ever done. Rhino has never shown strength over 100tons and never has shown more durability than Thing, Colossus, Namor, or any class 100 being period. Spidey and other weaker than Rhino beings hurt Rhino ON A REGULAR BASIS.

Huh? Since when 'insane strength and durability' necesarily means 'class 100+ feats'? I'm confussed.

Originally posted by h1a8


CA hurt him by hitting him in the face. Remember?


So? Apparently he can hurt Hulk by hitting him in the face as well.

Originally posted by Premutos
True, this board has a rule about people always fighting at their maximun potential. The problem is that it also has a rule forbidding PIS.
Spidey has more feats that prove he can hurt Rhino than Rhino has more feats that say Spidey can't. I wonder where the PIS lies.


How many times do someone has to prove something is not PIS anyway? Two, three, four, what? Give me an estimate.
Always has and always will. Do you know what insane implies? Superman is barely insane to us comic fans.


Just shows you that the face is weak indeed.

Originally posted by Premutos
How do you like this one, it's Spidey dodging LIGHT:

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/6760/002wg4.jpg

You didn't respond to my comment on the SS helping SM dodge before the attack is launched. In no way Spidey was shown to dodge light after the beam enter the air.

Originally posted by h1a8
Spidey has more feats that prove he can hurt Rhino than Rhino has more feats that say Spidey can't. I wonder where the PIS lies.


Do you realize that you Spidey fans are more convinced of him being able to hurt Rhino in a H2H fight than Spidey himself sometimes?

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/1/rhino7rr3.th.jpg

Originally posted by h1a8

How many times do someone has to prove something is not PIS anyway? Two, three, four, what? Give me an estimate.

Tell you what, better yet could you show me what I asked for a coupla pages ago? Scans of Spidey beating up non-jobbers in the 70 or 80+ class range. C'mon, we're talking the MU, where superheroes fight each other all the time. This shouldn't be that hard.

And when I say 'non-jobbers' I mean 'anyone but Rhino, Mr. Hyde, Sandman or Tiger Shark'. Hell, I'll even accept Terrax as a non-jobber if you want me to.

Originally posted by h1a8

Always has and always will. Do you know what insane implies? Superman is barely insane to us comic fans.

Ok, if you say so. But in the scan above Spidey himself refers to Rhino's durability as 'insane', must be that he's not a comic fan.

Originally posted by h1a8
You didn't respond to my comment on the SS helping SM dodge before the attack is launched. In no way Spidey was shown to dodge light after the beam enter the air.

Do you know what this implies, don't you? That Spidey knew that Cyclops was gonna shoot at him (and in which direction) before Cyclops himself ever thought of doing such a thing.

So according to this logic, Spidey == Madam Web lite.

Originally posted by Premutos
Do you know what this implies, don't you? That Spidey knew that Cyclops was gonna shoot at him (and in which direction) before Cyclops himself ever thought of doing such a thing.

So according to this logic, Spidey == Madam Web lite.

Well tell me sir, what does SS actually do then?

my grandma can beat the rhino.


Rhino looses to everyone =(


Rhino suffers from poor writing unfortunatly

Originally posted by h1a8
He has SS silly. It tells him to dodge before the attack is launch. Thus he can potentially dodge anything that's not mega in area.



Also, Spidey hasn't had only class 10 strength since the 60s. Even with the recent downgrade, we don't know where he is strength-wise. Sure, he won't be at the class 20-25 range, but I don't think he's gonna be all the way back down to 10. Before his "The Other" upgrade, he was already around class 15 anyway.

Originally posted by h1a8
Well tell me sir, what does SS actually do then?

According to marvel.com, it's "an early warning detection system linked with his superhuman kinesthetics", only that in order to perform that feat above he would have to be a full-fledged clairvoyant.

Which he's not.

Originally posted by Premutos
According to marvel.com, it's "an early warning detection system linked with his superhuman kinesthetics", only that in order to perform that feat above he would have to be a full-fledged clairvoyant.

Which he's not.

early warning means precog.
SM used that early warning to get the hell out of the way. I don't understand what you are not seeing.