Ganon vs. Okami

Dark-Jaxx

Originally posted by General Kaliero
Meh, don't think so. Ammy's kinda, y'know, a goddess and all? And she's beaten down beasts that would make ol' Ganny think twice about taking on.

And as before, the whole "freezing time" thing when she attacks with the Celestial Brush. 1. Last I checked Ganon was a God. Ganon has created beasts that would make Ammy pee herself.

2. Time? Pfft...Ganon has warped an entire dimension under his own power.

General Kaliero

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Last I checked Ganon was a God. Ganon has created beasts that would make Ammy pee herself.

2. Time? Pfft...Ganon has warped an entire dimension under his own power.
Ammy pees on such beasts just to add insult to injury. And I'm not kidding on this.

And corrupting a realm has... what relevance to Ammy attacking literally instantly? ermm

Also, Ganon is not a god. He lied to Zant about being one, but in no way is he a god of any sort. Just a very powerful mage.

Peach

...since when is Ganon a god?

His own claims of (or lies about) being one do not count.

Dark-Jaxx

Originally posted by General Kaliero
Ammy pees on such beasts just to add insult to injury. And I'm not kidding on this.

And corrupting a realm has... what relevance to Ammy attacking literally instantly? ermm 1. I know lol.

2. IT has reference to planetary reality warping powers. But other than that, Ganon has power over souls(t3h Twilight magic), has teleportation, has great physical strength and speed, and has ridiculous endurance even without the ToP. He destroyed his castle within an inch from death. He disintegrated a Sage with but a punch. He dodges and blocks light arrows effortlessly, even jumping 30 feet in the air to do so sometimes. He can blot out the sun through the planet as well(not a combat feat...But still cool). He can warp beings to make them powerless, be it to a rabbit, to an imp, or sumthin else. Ganon by all rights is a God.

General Kaliero

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. I know lol.

2. IT has reference to planetary reality warping powers. But other than that, Ganon has power over souls(t3h Twilight magic), has teleportation, has great physical strength and speed, and has ridiculous endurance even without the ToP. He destroyed his castle within an inch from death. He disintegrated a Sage with but a punch. He dodges and blocks light arrows effortlessly, even jumping 30 feet in the air to do so sometimes. He can blot out the sun through the planet as well(not a combat feat...But still cool). He can warp beings to make them powerless, be it to a rabbit, to an imp, or sumthin else. Ganon by all rights is a God.
What the hell? Ganon had no power over souls in the Twilight Realm.

Also, punching out a Sage? It's not much of a feat. They may be powerful magically, but they're very much the "weak old man" cliche. Most decently fit men could probably do the same thing.

WW Ganondorf dodges Light Arrows (sort of... wonder why he can't do the same when they're bounced off Link's shield...), but I don't recall TP Ganondorf doing the same. Which Ganon are we dealing with, here?

Changing Link into a bunny was an effect of the corrupted Dark World, not Ganon's personal power. Otherwise he would do such a thing in battle.

Dark-Jaxx

Originally posted by General Kaliero
What the hell? Ganon had no power over souls in the Twilight Realm.

Also, punching out a Sage? It's not much of a feat. They may be powerful magically, but they're very much the "weak old man" cliche. Most decently fit men could probably do the same thing.

WW Ganondorf dodges Light Arrows (sort of... wonder why he can't do the same when they're bounced off Link's shield...), but I don't recall TP Ganondorf doing the same. Which Ganon are we dealing with, here?

Changing Link into a bunny was an effect of the corrupted Dark World, not Ganon's personal power. Otherwise he would do such a thing in battle. 1. Zant could turn beings into lost souls, ALL of Zant's power is from Ganon.

2. So any normal human can disintegrate a Sage with a punch? And prove they have incredibly low endurance like you say.

3. Because it was such an unexpected and indirect attack. He did not expect it(which is kinda stupid). TP Ganon was on a horse...Did you really expect a 9 foot tall man to jump up and land back on the horse to dodge arrows? Also, every Ganon is the same Ganon.

4. The World he warped and created under his own power. It was his power.

General Kaliero

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Zant could turn beings into lost souls, ALL of Zant's power is from Ganon.

2. So any normal human can disintegrate a Sage with a punch? And prove they have incredibly low endurance like you say.

3. Because it was such an unexpected and indirect attack. He did not expect it(which is kinda stupid). TP Ganon was on a horse...Did you really expect a 9 foot tall man to jump up and land back on the horse to dodge arrows? Also, every Ganon is the same Ganon.

4. The World he warped and created under his own power. It was his power.
The Twilight Realm reduced Hylians to lost souls, but Ganon has no personal power over them. That's just how they exist in the Twilight.

Can you prove a Sage is physically strong? To the point that Ganondorf's punch is worth any special consideration?

WW Ganondorf did not physically change into Ganon, he used a puppet. And he's the one with the lightning-fast reflexes, and seems to have trained extensively in Gerudo dual sword fighting. TP Ganondorf has apparently trained in single straight sword fighting, and his reflex feats are relatively simple parries. He also uses magic attacks. There is one Ganon (in two timelines), but his skills vary depending.

Then why not alter someone's form in battle?

Dark-Jaxx

Originally posted by General Kaliero
The Twilight Realm reduced Hylians to lost souls, but Ganon has no personal power over them. That's just how they exist in the Twilight.

Can you prove a Sage is physically strong? To the point that Ganondorf's punch is worth any special consideration?

WW Ganondorf did not physically change into Ganon, he used a puppet. And he's the one with the lightning-fast reflexes, and seems to have trained extensively in Gerudo dual sword fighting. TP Ganondorf has apparently trained in single straight sword fighting, and his reflex feats are relatively simple parries. He also uses magic attacks. There is one Ganon (in two timelines), but his skills vary depending.

Then why not alter someone's form in battle? 1. Right. But he can warp the dimension into the Twilight Realm.

2. Nope. You can't prove they are weak either. So they must be assumed to be average.

3. He chose not to change into Ganon. Or maybe Ganon knows both dual and single sword skills? Also, Ganon in TP, while holding his sword pointing outward to the side, could bring in the blade to easily block Link's direct attacks, he even in TP has good reflexes. Ganon in TP had no time to get in extra training, and in WW he may of...But train with who? He honed his skills as a Magician and Swordsman when he was King of the Gerudo.

4. Well PIS for one, cause Link beating Ganon, who is stronger, faster, more durable, more powerful, more skilled, and smarter, reeks of it. But, the Master Sword in A Link to the Past guarded the effects of the warp if you remember.

ESB -1138

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Right. But he can warp the dimension into the Twilight Realm.

2. Nope. You can't prove they are weak either. So they must be assumed to be average.

3. He chose not to change into Ganon. Or maybe Ganon knows both dual and single sword skills? Also, Ganon in TP, while holding his sword pointing outward to the side, could bring in the blade to easily block Link's direct attacks, he even in TP has good reflexes. Ganon in TP had no time to get in extra training, and in WW he may of...But train with who? He honed his skills as a Magician and Swordsman when he was King of the Gerudo.

4. Well PIS for one, cause Link beating Ganon, who is stronger, faster, more durable, more powerful, more skilled, and smarter, reeks of it. But, the Master Sword in A Link to the Past guarded the effects of the warp if you remember.

1. No, that was a result on sealing/KOing the light spirits that guarded over areas of Hyrule

2. True

3. Alright I'm lost with this one.

4. Link overpowered Ganondorf in a swordlock in TP. Heck Link was able to throw around that giant 50 ton Goron around like it was nothing. That Link was no push over. And the Maste Sword had nothing to do with Link not becoming a bunny in a Link to the Past; it was that crystal orb thingie (I forget the name) because Link can go to the Dark Realm without the Master Sword (when you're getting it up graded by the smiths).

Dark-Jaxx

Originally posted by ESB -1138
1. No, that was a result on sealing/KOing the light spirits that guarded over areas of Hyrule

2. True

3. Alright I'm lost with this one.

4. Link overpowered Ganondorf in a swordlock in TP. Heck Link was able to throw around that giant 50 ton Goron around like it was nothing. That Link was no push over. And the Maste Sword had nothing to do with Link not becoming a bunny in a Link to the Past; it was that crystal orb thingie (I forget the name) because Link can go to the Dark Realm without the Master Sword (when you're getting it up graded by the smiths). 1. No, they were preventing Zant from doing it, but Zant when he defeated that one spirit clearly made the effect happen on his own.

2. Basically he is reasoning that the Ganon in WW and TP have different skills and abilities.

3. That Link had exceptional physical strength, I give you that. But that does not excuse the other attributes that Ganon has far above Link. Also, Ganon SHOULD be able to amp his strength higher, so that was bullcrap.

The MS did nothing? Really? Haven't played the game in ages. Well, then I call PIS.

ESB -1138

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. No, they were preventing Zant from doing it, but Zant when he defeated that one spirit clearly made the effect happen on his own.

2. Basically he is reasoning that the Ganon in WW and TP have different skills and abilities.

3. That Link had exceptional physical strength, I give you that. But that does not excuse the other attributes that Ganon has far above Link. Also, Ganon SHOULD be able to amp his strength higher, so that was bullcrap.

The MS did nothing? Really? Haven't played the game in ages. Well, then I call PIS.

1. No, it was the effect of the light spirit no longer being there because to return the realm to the light Zant brought it back and not just did so by his own will.

2. Well they kind of do. I mean TP and WW takes place in the different timelines and where WW Ganon has faced the OoT Link before TP Ganon never had the chance so that alone would change them.

3. Link also had Midna's and Zelda's assistance in many games...well Midna's just in one. And in WW the king made that wish for the kids to basically win so Ganon was fighting a losing battle.

4. ALttP Link had magical abilities, the Golden Master Sword, Silver Arrows, and went through a ton of dungeons (most in any Zelda games I believe) so he had a while to get better.

Dark-Jaxx

Originally posted by ESB -1138
1. No, it was the effect of the light spirit no longer being there because to return the realm to the light Zant brought it back and not just did so by his own will.

2. Well they kind of do. I mean TP and WW takes place in the different timelines and where WW Ganon has faced the OoT Link before TP Ganon never had the chance so that alone would change them.

3. Link also had Midna's and Zelda's assistance in many games...well Midna's just in one. And in WW the king made that wish for the kids to basically win so Ganon was fighting a losing battle.

4. ALttP Link had magical abilities, the Golden Master Sword, Silver Arrows, and went through a ton of dungeons (most in any Zelda games I believe) so he had a while to get better. 1. Well...Now that I think of it, do either of us have proofs?

2. It wouldn't change his whole arsenal, or change whether or not he used one of two swords. Also, that timeline is still not official, it is highly accepted, not official.

3. Which is still PIS. In OoT though, there could have been some CIS. Powerful villains usually do suffer from PIS.

4. True. Also, ALttP was a prequel to OoT, right?

First_Tsurugi06

I can't really imagine this fight involving any form of Ganon(dorf) other than his "Dark Beast" form (the TP one).

General Kaliero

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Well...Now that I think of it, do either of us have proofs?

2. It wouldn't change his whole arsenal, or change whether or not he used one of two swords. Also, that timeline is still not official, it is highly accepted, not official.

3. Which is still PIS. In OoT though, there could have been some CIS. Powerful villains usually do suffer from PIS.

4. True. Also, ALttP was a prequel to OoT, right?
Ganon couldn't cast Hyrule into the Twilight on his own, which is why he needed Zant at all.

It is accepted as canon, as stated by Aonuma, that WW and TP take place in alternate timelines. While it doesn't change that Ganondorf is a powerful sorcerer with knowledge of swordplay, the two versions obviously have chosen different styles of operation.

OoT is the first game of the main series. ALttP was a prequel to LoZ.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
I can't really imagine this fight involving any form of Ganon(dorf) other than his "Dark Beast" form (the TP one).
Exactly which Ganon(dorf) did you intend to fight the goddess Amaterasu, Dark-Jaxx?

Dark-Jaxx

Originally posted by General Kaliero
Ganon couldn't cast Hyrule into the Twilight on his own, which is why he needed Zant at all.

It is accepted as canon, as stated by Aonuma, that WW and TP take place in alternate timelines. While it doesn't change that Ganondorf is a powerful sorcerer with knowledge of swordplay, the two versions obviously have chosen different styles of operation.

OoT is the first game of the main series. ALttP was a prequel to LoZ.

Exactly which Ganon(dorf) did you intend to fight the goddess Amaterasu, Dark-Jaxx? 1. He needed Zant to mantain his physical form. All of Zant's power is just power Ganon lent to him.

2. Really? Obviously? Because one used two swords and the other used one? Also, in TP, he is still shown to be quite the agile jumper.

3. Ohz. Well I am pretty sure Aonuma said that the Four Swords series comes before OoT, or comes first.

Human, though if I have to choose one particular, TP I suppose.

ESB -1138

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. He needed Zant to mantain his physical form. All of Zant's power is just power Ganon lent to him.

2. Really? Obviously? Because one used two swords and the other used one? Also, in TP, he is still shown to be quite the agile jumper.

3. Ohz. Well I am pretty sure Aonuma said that the Four Swords series comes before OoT, or comes first.

1. Zant was dead when Ganondorf returned to his physical form. Zant needed Ganondorf to come back to life.

3. Can you show proof on that? Because I never seen Aonuma state that.

And Dark Beast Ganon (TP form) would be the perfect match for this just because that fight would look cool.